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Just curious to see what people have to say.

I'm just disappointed that they dropped the 40k rpg over this crap. Seriously no one plays this game. I know GW feels obligated since they probably sold their first born to get the license, bu enough is enough.

The stats for the next Baltimore GT say it all.

130 tourny spots for 40k
100 spots for WH
20 for LoTR

It's officially dead weight.

I think it is time it went to the specialty games selection. I would much rather they promote a game like Blood Bowl, or Necromunda than this.

2 More Hobbit films are in the works. I'm guessing they are keeping LOTR alive expecting a big burst in sales once the Hobbit movies hit.

What is amusing is that there is no option for "No, but..."

Because I'd check that bos, too.

KiMonarrez wrote:The stats for the next Baltimore GT say it all.

130 tourny spots for 40k
100 spots for WH
20 for LoTR

It's officially dead weight.

Or perhaps LotR is actually a highly-profitable franchise that isn't dominated by WAAC players who need to stroke their egos by "winning" a meaningless tournament?

I mean, it's possible...

I think the poll should have just been Yes or No and you'd
have more of a balanced vote.

Gag me with a spoon. LOTR is not my cup of tea at all. In fact, bamboo shoots under the fingernails is more fun.
Get real GW. If you think 'The Battle of the 5 Armies' is going to boost this lame game- I have a set of Emporer's Clothes to sell you....

Seriously folks, can we please get back to the 'Good ol days when there was more than 10% of WD articles on 40k Fluff/models/rules?

Who cares if there is a new Aragorn fig?
Or a 'clear' Frodo.

Who cares? Not me at least. I stopped buying WD after the release of LOTR. Less than 20% of a 'Fanzine' dedicated to my hobby.

Sorry Akira, but the release of Harad got me...

@Malfred-lol, fair enough, there are a few good ones. The Balrog is by far and away the best one of the bunch.

Assuming the Hobbit films don't implode (which they're looking to do already - more lawsuits are headed New Line's way it seems, this time from Tolkien's Estate!), they should keep it. Reap the benefits it gives them for a couple of years, and then they can spend the next six blambing another LotR 'bubble burst' for their inability to manage a company.

If the Hobbit films do die, then they should drop LotR as soon as they can. Dead weight.

BYE

I think there's an irony to GW and LOTR. The minis are top shelf, those that play the game love it, the rules are quick, elegant, and properly fit the scale of the game, the plastics are generally very cheap, the box sets were great value long before Skull Pass.... and I couldn't care less.

I want to get into it, but I don't know anyboy that plays. NObody I know knows anyone that plays. The FLGS's near me don't stock it. The folks on the major GW boards universally disdain it.

Why did it tank? I tried it when it came out, it was scenario based but the box set came with legions style minis (elves and goblins, when all the scenarios needed the fellowship). Was the distaste for that, coupled with the sucking up of GW's resources enough to totally put everybody off the game?

I can't vote in this poll. There is no option that says they shouldn't drop the game, but I don't play it.

From what I've heard from reliable sources (as opposed to disgruntled Warhammer players) is that the game and the figures are selling fine. LotR players do not, by and large, hang out with Warhammer players. I've heard that this is because Warhammer players constantly hurl abuse at LotR, but this is merely anecdotal.

If the game is good, the figures are good, and people are buying it (maybe not "Our People," but people nonetheless) then why drop the game?

PS: Akira, I can't imagine that BoFA, a 15mm scale game, was intended to "boost" the 25mm LotR game.

PPS: Brightside, what the hell does LotR have to do with the 40K RPG? Nothing at friggin' all.

The models are freakin nice! Maybe it's just jealousy?
Seriously, I don't know anything about this game, but it seems like it's milked. All the fractions they are publishing are bloodless and stale I don't even know where those guys come from...

Greets
Schepp himself

I think the main problem with the LOTR game is that what enthusiasm it garnered in its initial release has long since subsided since the movies passed. I remember when it first came out, some people (including myself) got into it at the FLGS. It's not a bad game, but it also wasn't nearly as much fun as 40k or Fantasy. Really I think that the problem is the fluff. 40K and Fantasy both have more open ended universes, while LOTR was marketed as a re-enactment type game. It was fun re-fighting the battle for helm's deep once or twice, but the pitched battle system was a lot less interesting than 40k/Fantasy. The replay value just isn't there in my opinion. After the movies stopped GW kept throwing up lamer and lamer supplements (Fall of the Necromancer, Ruin of Arnor) and most of these armies didn't seem significantly different enough to actually merit buying them. I seriously doubt that that many people bought into these later releases.

I was looking around at the Last Alliance forum and it seems like there are still people who are passionate about the game, just not that many. I agree that it is a perfect candidate for a specialist game. Tolkien fans could still pursue their interest and if something like a living rulebook came to pass it would probably spur interest in the game. If GW is in financial trouble, rather than cutting their bits service, Black Industries, and cutting corners with White Dwarf they should work on improving standards, making damn sure that 5th edition is a solid improvement over 4th edition and assure gamers like us that it is actually safe to start buying models again.

i tickes "tired of it taking up space in WD" But if they dropped it people would complain about that. Maybe they should drop it so people could complain about something new for once rather than the same old drivle like oh my ~LATD is now useless

BUT IT IS SO UNFAIR!!! WHY? OH WHY DID THEY KICK MY BELOVED LatD???

ehem....I think the hype has passed. I still see a bunch of kids at our FLGS, but I really think they would be better of with fantasy. I think LotR is so damn boring. It's not nearly as creative as 40k or fantasy can be, hell it isn't even encouraged.

granted, the harad look cool, but most of the stuff I see, is really boring, like Fall of the Necromancer: yay, we play another 1000 years beforethe actual events of the movie. (which is btw. the same reason I never really got into KotoR).

and the fact tat the minis are smaller then everything else also sucks. I mean, how many HE players ou there would have loved to use some of those really cool sword elves in their army? I know I would try it (if I cared for high elves, that is).

I play it and have 3 armies. It's a great little game, where every faction gets something new every so often, unlike 40K or fantasy's bloated rules system. It seems to me that they got the game bang on the button right. The models are great (well, there are a couple of turkeys, but they'd be considered above par in any other game), the rules are fluid, flexible and fun, and the factions are tactically interesting and internally balanced. What more do you want out of a game? And since they used the money they earned from it to hire new staff to work on it, it's not taking anything away from fantasy or 40K.
Keep it!

Get rid of it!
I dont see how they could expand this game much more, seeing is how it is based on fluff not of GW's own. I second the idea of moving it to the specialist game genre.

GW's own background story doesn't really change either.
They've even said, "Why should we change our story?"

At some point, however, they're going to have to sell more
of a "what-if" factor to the game than currently exists. Some
of the enthusiasts collect to the scenarios, but a lot of us
like having customizability.

You may or may not like it, so much is personal taste. But there is no rational business argument to say it should be dropped. Sales of LotR are in many cases more healthy than for WFB, so if LotR is dropped for "only" contributing around 10% of sales, then WFB will not be far behind. Lets face it, it MUST be making decent sales still or it WOULD have gone the way of BI ages ago! GW may be fools, but they won't keep a non-profit-making line going for longer than they have to, and with LotR the licence fee was paid off over 5 years back.

To imply anything else is sheer bigotry.

And to chip my twa 'penneth into the slanging match, LotR as a game system whups 40k's bloated, elderly ass! Its tight and well thought through with balanced armies and a distinct lack of the cheesy aroma that permeates the latter game. Plus it is a lot cheaper to buy for! And of course Tolkien is a heck of a load better author than Gav Thorpe!

If you haven't tried the game and appreciate the fluff then do yourselves a favour and give it a whirl.

For an unbiased review by a couple of 40k/WFB players listen to this:

http://www.tabletopbattlefield.com/podcast/podcastfiles/TabletopBattlefieldxS02xE03.mp3

Or watch this:

http://www.tabletopbattlefield.com/podcast/podcastfiles/TabletopBattlefieldxS02xE03.mp4

Believe me, when it stops being profitable, it will disappear as if it never existed. Until such time though, it is not going to be dropped any time soon.

I wish it could be evicted from White Dwarf though. It wasn't so bad when it was given a bit of space at the back of the magazine (when it was more popular to boot!) but now it is getting ridiculous. Plainly LOTR players are to a great extent a different demographic to those who play Warhammer. I just can't imagine them being that interested in buying WHite Dwarf anyway.

Tetchy wrote:You may or may not like it, so much is personal taste. But there is no rational business argument to say it should be dropped. Sales of LotR are in many cases more healthy than for WFB, so if LotR is dropped for "only" contributing around 10% of sales, then WFB will not be far behind.

To imply anything else is sheer bigotry.

Love the game. Structuraly it's a better game then either 40K or Fantasy. It may not be to your tastes, but ask yourself, How many LotR serious rules discussions do you see? The worst problems were addressed by the release of the Retuirn of the King, and remaining ones by the One Rulebook to rule them all.

The minatures are better then any of the other lines for scale and style. And purchased by collectors from outside of the hobby.

It's worst failing in the Fellowship box was that the early scenarios were far too limiited and not built for the box contents. (I've collected for years now and still can't play all of the scenarios from that box)

Demogorgon wrote:I wish it could be evicted from White Dwarf though. It wasn't so bad when it was given a bit of space at the back of the magazine (when it was more popular to boot!) but now it is getting ridiculous. Plainly LOTR players are to a great extent a different demographic to those who play Warhammer. I just can't imagine them being that interested in buying WHite Dwarf anyway.

Why is it getting "ridiculous", LotR gets no more, and often a good deal less coverage in WD than the other 2 core systems? Flick back through a few issues and count the pages yourself if you don't believe me! Or did you just make that "fact" up ...?

The truth is that WD is LotR-heavy in a month that contains LotR releases like February when the new Harad came out. But in 40k- or WFB-release months there's often nary an article to be found. For instance there's unlikely to be any real coverage of the game in the March issue as it'll be all Vampire Counts and possibly some residual Orks I guess. In months where there is no big release then we'll be lucky to get a single article.

As a LotR player who has long since given up on 40k and WFB I really don't know why I bother to keep my WD sub running any more!

I do agree though that 40k/WFB players and LotR players seem to have little crossover. Maybe that's because LotR players have been treated like crap for much of the game's life by many (not all) GW store staff who tend to be ignorant 40k-bigots who know nothing about any other game?

Away from long-established 40k enclaves where freedom of thought prospers, LotR is highly regarded as a well thought out game, and has been widely accepted in its LotR form and other black-powder adaptations such as "Legends of the Old West" and the forthcoming "Legends of the High Seas" from Warhammer Historical.

LOTR has never struck me as a 'main gaming system', really. I think that may be where the problem lies.

I think it looks quite cool, and I'd probably have a little contingent of Dwarves or Rohirrim, if it weren't utterly insane to do so. That'd be a third gaming system I'd be into, and I barely have time to concentrate on ONE at a time, as it is.

That being said it appears LOTR is doing rather well for itself around my locale. I see tournaments and mega-battles (such an idea being utterly foreign to me, wasn't LOTR supposed to be story-driven, small scale games?) all the time, and GW stores will usually have at least someone playing it at any given time.

But it really does take up space in WD that I'd like to see devoted to something else. Hell, even specialist games. Man I'd love to see another BFG battle-report.

Well, I too would love to see SG make a comeback - I'm a fan of Epic and BFG and have large forces for both games. But that is an entirely unrelated issue. The decision to nerf SG coverage was taken totally independently of that to promote and run with LotR. Believe me, GW would have been entirely happy to cover Epic as a core system if the support from punters had been there. But after the Epic 40000 fiasco it never reestablished itself. GW (rightly or wrongly) see pumping money into supporting SG as simply throwing good money after bad, as while there are some real dedicated players of these games, there just aren't enough of them and they don't buy enough new models to satisfy GW's criteria. The recent release of Adeptus Mechanicus battleships is a case in point. They were "fully supported" in WD to the same extent pretty much any new release is - with big adverts, fluff and rules etc. Yet they have only sold in penny numbers, so my sources tell me.

All the players of SG games lumped together probably only come to 1/10th of LotR or less in terms of the amount of money they spend on new models (which is all GW really care about).

Polonius wrote:I think there's an irony to GW and LOTR. The minis are top shelf, those that play the game love it, the rules are quick, elegant, and properly fit the scale of the game, the plastics are generally very cheap, the box sets were great value long before Skull Pass.... and I couldn't care less.

Isn't that the thing! In many ways it does everything people would like to see out of a GW game. But there just isn't enough interest.

I think for many players, it goes to a question of time. I know my time is extremely limited now, and just getting my GCult painted is a herculean effort. I'd love to build an Easterling force, but sadly I just don't see myself fitting it in.

Moving slightly off topic, I think this points to a flaw in how GW handles release schedules. Most players, even if they play more than one "core" GW game, are only fully engaged in one of those games at any given time. Most don't have the time to be engaged in two or three. While I fully understand why GW doesn't want to cannibalize their own sales, it can seem like a ponderously long time between releases when you're only currently playing one of their core games.

The more I think about it, the more I believe it's a major problem for GW. Maybe it's just my marketing/advertising background, but when you look beyond just a sales standpoint, I think they lose a lot of momentum with the slow releases. Imagine if they followed up the Ork codex with Daemons in March (as much as I dislike the army concept) and then DE in May. It'd seem like a lot more exciting, dynamic time for the hobby.

Instead we have cryptic comments about possible Legions codices in 2010 or beyond? That'll sure fire the troops up.

gorgon wrote: In many ways it does everything people would like to see out of a GW game. But there just isn't enough interest.

Well, I beg to differ. If you pop over to www.thelastalliance.com you will find an online community, larger than Dakka, fully involved with the game. It's just there is very little crossover between the sytems, and people who play both 40k AND LotR are in the minority as players of both systems. But, just because 40k was here first, doesn't give its players any moral right to crap all over the game. If you don't like it, shut up and shove off, basically. Its sticking around as long as it sells. "So there!"

*blows raspberry*

Personally I think 40k is a whole heap of dog droppings...

Tetchy wrote:

Personally I think 40k is a whole heap of dog droppings...

“As a dog returns to his vomit, so a fool repeats his folly.” Proverbs 26:11 (NKJV)

Call me a fool. And maybe a dog.

At least I don't actually PLAY with my droppings.

Wait, what?