Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

(I posted this over in Warseer, and just found this forum so I thought Id say HI! and post something of mine. )

Well, not quite a year, but Ill get into that later.

This is an actual personal army of mine. I had all but the sentinel left today, so I decided to go ahead and knock it out. I’m working on some Beta Dark Angels right now and all those bright green lines over super dark green are killer, so the break was needed.

This army is very special to me because it is the first fully painted army Ive had *for myself* in eight years. And lord you don’t want to see the last one. Ive finished many armies since then but none of my own. Ill get to more of this later too.

The army is themed on three and a half things:

Empire
WW2 Germany
Thor
Awesomeness

The whole Idea is that they are an underground sort of cult group like the masons that fight to defend Terra if that ever happens. The group is more of an honor than a hardcore military group, but they train and maintain their weapons well and are always at their peak. Also the group is fairly small; it can muster about four companies of troops and two full armored companies with some limited artillery support. When they are used, they are an elite strike force.

Behind the meanings and beliefs of the group: they are, like I said, a bunch of quiet old farts who can trace their bloodline back to Thor himself. Hey, marines get primarchs don’t they? Thor would win.

The Thor theme is played off of the feathers on their helms and the fact that they all have blonde hair (as did Thor…I met him did I tell you? : D) He did in all the pics I saw of him at least, and I had never painted blonde hair AFAIK, so it was a good opportunity.

The blood red capes represent the blood bond flowing in their veins. Only full fledged members get to wear the capes, and each one is a family heirloom. Especially tough and high ranking members get black capes, representing said qualities.

The army uses all black powder, save for lascannons and plasma on tanks, which are old and holy relics still working from back when they were gifted to them by the Emporer. Tank heavy weapons that wear out are often replaced by heavy bolters. These guys also love their stubbers!


Lets get to some pics already!

Here is the army deployed in its mighty blurriness:



Here is the main command tank. It is a Land Raider turned backwards and then jerry rigged to have a Russ hull. Lots of card later and some spare bits and I had this thing. The dozer is converted. You know what, the whole thing is converted, lets just leave it at that to keep it simple. Oh, for those thinking of doing this, a Russ hull is the exact same width as a Land raider hull. The cannon is card and metal pipe, by the way.








Here is the second in command tank. All second in command tanks have banners. This one is an eagle standing over a globe, with an iron cross over the Emporers palace. I forgot to fix his nameplate, correct is either Nachtmar or mahr. Cant remember but I did it wrong.

Banner is a huge friggin piece of card and brass rod. Radar from land raider. I think the rest is easy to figure out.






Third in command of first unit. Not too heavy duty conversion wise. Sandbags are the metal ones from the old Russ kit.


First command, second squad, commissar. This one is painted differently as Commies often get black or red tanks. The turret is two heavy weapon autocannons, a few Dark Angel bits, and the rest is the usual empire stuff, but the box middle left on the hull is from the Hellblaster kit. It’s the rifle case middle part turned over.

His name is the Hangman in German. You cant really see it. He has a noose hanging from his stubber.







Second in command, second squad. This is one of my favorite tanks. The banner is one of the soldiers carrying the war banner, and it says brotherhood of blood in German. I love how the art on the side turned out, but you cant really see it. Its so plain and simple, but its came out nice and creepy. It is a horse skull wheezing out “Fallen” in German.

The rockets are HK missles : D
The little reaper guy is from the necromancer blister back when he was packed with it. A friend got him at a garage sale.






Third in command. His nose art says Righteous Fist in German and its…a fist holding blowing cloth. First appearance by Thor on the dozer on this tank.


First Demolisher. His side armor says Shake and Bake in German. Back when I started this army I told a friend I would have one tank say that, in honor of the terrible Ricky Bobby movie. Bad movie, awesome line. It fits well here too.




Second and third Demolishers. The first is the banner bearer and his side art is a robed figure over a blood red moon, and it says Albtraum (nightmare).

The other is led by a sister from mordheim. Shes the only sister in the brotherhood : D her side art is a banshee over a full moon.

These pics didn’t get the art on the turrets well, Im sorry.



Hellhound. Tanks are from some random Tamiya kit. Turret is two Sentinel flamers converted up. Made from a Chimera in case you were wondering. He is carrying the spare rockets from the hellblaster kit in case you can see that. He says Kuss des Todes (kiss of death)





Chimera, nothing too fancy here.


Storm troopers with grenade and missle launcher. These pics really tick me off as I spent a whole day on these guys way back and they are awesome. The robes are seriously “eavy metal smooth. I dread having to do it again!





Dear sweet Jesus I love this tank soooo much. Id get two or three if you could take more than one in the FW rules. Im so tempted to get a medusa…

Battle flag over the front to ward off friendly fliers. Baneblade body for the commander, Krieg heavy weapon crew trigger hand. Baneblade shells. A bit too big, but better than nothing.

She says “low bridge” in german on the other side. Didn’t get a pic.









And my little Sentinel buddy. Made after the conversion on the GW site, but tweaked. That is a kid manning it. Hes jealous that the grown ups get capes, so hes playing superman with a battle flag. The head is Frodo, body is pure green stuff, so is the cape.

The little girl holding the bomb is some propaganda poster I found online. In case I didn’t mention, I love propaganda posters, whether German, Russian, or of the Allies. Theres just something about them that is so interesting in their looks. I wanted to do something with Russian ones, but they didn’t really fit.




So yeah, that’s it for now. In case you are wondering here is a timeline of how it happened.

June 2007: Decided to start AC. This army really is nothing more than one of my crazy ideas that actually stuck and snowballed. At first I just knew they were going to be catachan to camo green. No Empire, no art, nothing.

July 2007: At this point I have a few Russes and Ive started, and partially finished one tank. I say partially because it had no freehand, commander, dozer or stripes.

August: I think I have two of the demolishers and four russes now. No painting.

October: I make the Land Raider thing. No painting.

November: I paint a demolisher and decide on the Empire theme.

December: I paint the hellhound. School sucked for painting. Add on top of that I was painting for the studio too.

January: I buckle down and have the whole thing assembled and primed. I decide to add a little freehand based on old propaganda posters I like. The German theme comes in somewhere here.

February: I have lots of periods where I have a day or so where its quiet and I paint a tank. Id say 7 of them are done this month (as in total finished, not how many I did in Feb)

March: Make and finish the Sentinel, squeeze the army out in a quiet few days.

If it weren’t for being so busy with school last semester and being full time now, It wouldn’t have taken nearly as long. I think I spent 1-2 days per tank total. Some more some less. Im kinda glad it did take so long as its molded into something I probably couldn’t have sat down and figured up and finished in a week or two like some other armies Ive done to sell.

It feels SO good to finally have a fully painted army. Like I said before this is the first time in eight years ive had a fully painted army. Its so surreal. A month ago I got goosebumps thinking about being at this point, and now I don’t think it has even set in. I dunno, I guess to me it might be more important to be fully painted than others….

Now to get a game in! Im using FW rules and I made a 2k on the nose list the other night. When I will get to play is the question!

wow....

your paiting skills are Awsome.. but ... why do i keep thinking about nazi's? lame dude... no good...

FishMonk, your posts destroy my will to live.

Anyways, these are just amazing. Jaw-dropping conversion and paint jobs here. Do you plan on adding to the army?

I hope syr doesn't see this.

But uh, nicely painted nazis.

yeah...

This army looks awesome! and its theme kicks ass!
I think a few more foot sloggers wouldn't hurt, their capes are cool, but shouldn't only the elite get capes?!
the blitz bulldozer blades look cool.

stonefox wrote:I hope syr doesn't see this.

But uh, nicely painted nazis.

why?
I'm sure Syr has nothing against with WW2 german themed armys?

i'm planning on one that's all german greys and nazi reds and It'll have a banner that has a swastika look to it.
although i'm making it a black 'Z' in white circle on a red flag...

yeah...

This is just amazing beyond what words can descibe. Too bad they are modeled after the garbage of the earth (Nazis)

Simply beautiful work. Flat out amazing. Nice conversions that don't overpower, solid and well-executed theme, and absolutely incredible brushwork, from the weathering to the red cloth to the jaw-dropping freehands. Just...wow.

Bravo!

I'm not sure what to say...

awesome paint jobs, and ignore the nay sayers here. I see plenty non-nazi influences here, definitely some kaiser-esque theme is going on. everyone is so melodramatic here, the IG and imperium basically are nazis, so it makes sense that the IG would have similar iconography to the nazi regime.

stonefox wrote:I hope syr doesn't see this.

But uh, nicely painted nazis.

They arent Nazis at all. If the redone propoganda posters were reworked art from Bolshevic Russia posters, would you call them communists?

Panic wrote: This army looks awesome! and its theme kicks ass!
I think a few more foot sloggers wouldn't hurt, their capes are cool, but shouldn't only the elite get capes?!
the blitz bulldozer blades look cool.

Yeah I am going to add a unit or two more of foot guys.

Getting a cape in this army isnt a matter of status, color is. Getting a cape is a matter of manhood and age. Check the sentinel, the kid is jealous of the older folks so he is playing "cape" with the battle banner.

Stormtrooper x wrote: Anyways, these are just amazing. Jaw-dropping conversion and paint jobs here. Do you plan on adding to the army?

Thanks! Yes I do. There is a project log in the science fiction section of Warseer. Check that. I dont get to work on this army often so I thoguht it would be good to keep me motivated.

Things I plan on adding to it:
Vulcan Mecharius
Thunderbolt (I have it now, Tamiya kit proxy)
Possibly another Vanqusher
Maybe a few other IA things for giggles, like an Atlas and a Bombard, but that will be down the road. Id like to have an Atlas just for fun.

Sometime I also plan on making a compliment 2k in regular guard, that will be a pain though as those capes are hard to get ahold of.

Thanks again all for the compliments!!

Bastirous666 wrote:awesome paint jobs, and ignore the nay sayers here. I see plenty non-nazi influences here, definitely some kaiser-esque theme is going on. everyone is so melodramatic here, the IG and imperium basically are nazis, so it makes sense that the IG would have similar iconography to the nazi regime.

Oh it's fine. The non German ww2 aspects are heavily outweighed by other themes and reworked propoganda from other countries, so I feel I have done nothing wrong, and I think that is what matters. Now if I had left those posters as is, well, there is no way I would feel right doing that so that is out of the question. I got a really good reception at Warseer, so I dunno why so many people here feel it is off.

Just played against this army last night at the FLGS with my armored company. We each dished out quite a lot of punishment, with my vanquisher claiming quite a few kills. Anyway, just wanted to say that it looks even better up close, and a pure pleasure to play against.


-pirateskot

pirateskot wrote:Just played against this army last night at the FLGS with my armored company. We each dished out quite a lot of punishment, with my vanquisher claiming quite a few kills. Anyway, just wanted to say that it looks even better up close, and a pure pleasure to play against.


-pirateskot

Oh hey man!

Yeah that was an awesome game. Much more movement than you would think for two armored companies in a pitched battle.

Rematch next week if you dont want to play Apoc!

Brandon

GMMStudios wrote:

Bastirous666 wrote:awesome paint jobs, and ignore the nay sayers here. I see plenty non-nazi influences here, definitely some kaiser-esque theme is going on. everyone is so melodramatic here, the IG and imperium basically are nazis, so it makes sense that the IG would have similar iconography to the nazi regime.

Oh it's fine. The non German ww2 aspects are heavily outweighed by other themes and reworked propoganda from other countries, so I feel I have done nothing wrong, and I think that is what matters. Now if I had left those posters as is, well, there is no way I would feel right doing that so that is out of the question. I got a really good reception at Warseer, so I dunno why so many people here feel it is off.

exactly i was just emphasizing to these very sensitive people that not all things that look like german WWI propagand is, some comes from earlier periods, and even some naz propoganda was stolen from other nations, so some of the nay sayers just needed a history lesson before they jump the "lookout nazis!" gun

Damn man!
the entire army looks amazing, but holy crap those dozer blades are sweet!

Not sensitivity - I'm just calling you out by saying "Yes this is a Nazi army." Hey you can deny it if you want or you can accept it. It's your army. But please don't dance around the issue and say "Oh it's really not nazi at all" when it looks like it clearly is.

hey arent Nazis at all. If the redone propoganda posters were reworked art from Bolshevic Russia posters, would you call them communists?

Yep. I can make a tau army just like that and I'm sure other people will think, "that dude plays space stalins/lenins/marxists." And yeah I'm sure that most people would really be convinced if you had to make a longwinded explanation as to why your army isn't a space commie army.

awesome paint jobs, and ignore the nay sayers here. I see plenty non-nazi influences here, definitely some kaiser-esque theme is going on. everyone is so melodramatic here, the IG and imperium basically are nazis, so it makes sense that the IG would have similar iconography to the nazi regime.

That's fine. But at least man up and say "hey guys check out my nazi army" instead of "hey guys these are my guys that may have nazi influences but they're really not nazis I swear. They're really just a bunch of white guys carrying a bunch of red flags draped over their tanks."

why?
I'm sure Syr has nothing against with WW2 german themed armys?

i'm planning on one that's all german greys and nazi reds and It'll have a banner that has a swastika look to it.
although i'm making it a black 'Z' in white circle on a red flag...

yeah...

Dunno. I'm just waiting to see if he responds, if at all. Oh and is that black Z of yours this symbol? Just wondering.

exactly i was just emphasizing to these very sensitive people that not all things that look like german WWI propagand is, some comes from earlier periods, and even some naz propoganda was stolen from other nations, so some of the nay sayers just needed a history lesson before they jump the "lookout nazis!" gun

Ah, so let's see what this really is then. A tank company with red flags draped over them, a bunch of flags and figures all painted as white dudes, have air raid bulldozers, has a flag with an eagle on a map that looks like Europe with a cross that looks similar, has pseudo-German words and phrases... Maybe they aren't much when separate but let's think for a moment that they might be when put together. Hmm...

Damned nice freehand and well executed theme and paint job, awesome!

It's a bit too nazi-like for my taste. I'm form germany and I don't know if you know, but the whole thor and wiking stuff is often used by nazi groups today. The Eagles, Sayings and Propaganda (wherever it derived from) just adds to it.
But it doesn't make the army looks less beautifully done, just personal style.

Greets
Schepp himself

P.S. The Death korps of krieg are also clearly nazi-like, so it's not too far fetched.

It's stunning stuff, of course, but I do wish you had at least refrained from using the black cross on a field of red. I'm not saying "OMFG you Nazi get out," just that some of the symbolism is a little unfortunate. I'm not saying that it's "wrong" to play a "Nazi army" either--where would WW2 games be without them?--but it is somewhat disturbing when the imagery is cast in what seems to be a sincerely positive light.

Beware of the red flags!!
Seriously man, there is a MASSIVE difference between red flags, and red flags with white circles and a black emblem.
Also, the cross looks nothing like a Nazi symbol. Looks more like the cross used by the german military NOWADAYS
klick


I do however agree with Schepp and Stonefox: All put together it does look much like a nazi/neo-nazi theme.

Still, i say exalt. The paintjob blew me off my chair.

Flachzange, as I'm sure you're aware, the iron cross continued to be used as a symbol of the Wehrmacht during the Nazi period. And yes, it is still used today, but it's no accident that deep red no longer features. Deep red + iron cross evokes certain specific ideas.

tegeus-Cromis wrote:Flachzange, as I'm sure you're aware, the iron cross continued to be used as a symbol of the Wehrmacht during the Nazi period. And yes, it is still used today, but it's no accident that deep red no longer features. Deep red + iron cross evokes certain specific ideas.

You are correct sir. i do know that.
Then again the iron cross, much like the swastika has been around for ages and like so many other symbols, has been abused by the nazis.
If you really want to, you can relate a whole lot of symbols to nazis, fashism and such. Its like the hair in the soup thing. If you search long enough youll find one.

Still, if this guy is happy with displaying a wild mix of symbols, several of them clearly going into nazi symbolism, fine, let him.
(I dont mean anybody in particular, in general)

You know when I first looked at these, I thought they looked Nazi-ish. But as I checked out all the detail, I realised it's a brilliant collaboration of all the army themes around during that era. I must say, bravo my friend. These are spectacular and gorgeous, and me being the Jewish guy, would love to play against them! *laughs* Again, great job!

P.S.: Best part I like about these guys is theme of the end of the Prussian time, and beginning with the expansion of German ideals look. Marvelous.

Stonefox - You realize the Emporer's Palace is in Europe? And fluffwise is right under the cross?

Fluffwise they charge themselves with the defense of Terra, whether their small numbers can truly influence such a battle or not.

Like I said before, think what you want. I *really* don't care. If appropriation from German WW2 propoganda *among others* is a crime then take me away. I like armies that feel historical and at the same time over the top.

Trust me, if I wanted to make a nazi army I would have made them black with red sleeves and swastikas all over them. I think that is very different from *appropriation* (not straight up copying) of German art. Edit: Among MANY other references and themes among the army.

Also, the basalisk flag isnt for *OMG LETS PUT A BANNERZ THERE* its to ward off friendly fliers from bombing their own side during an advance. Its been done lots of times throughout war. Its based on history, not just looks.

Therefore, your point has been made, and it has been considered, if you have nothing else constructive to say then please refrain from posting.

megamarines wrote:You know when I first looked at these, I thought they looked Nazi-ish. But as I checked out all the detail, I realised it's a brilliant collaboration of all the army themes around during that era. I must say, bravo my friend. These are spectacular and gorgeous, and me being the Jewish guy, would love to play against them! *laughs* Again, great job!

P.S.: Best part I like about these guys is theme of the end of the Prussian time, and beginning with the expansion of German ideals look. Marvelous.

Thank you for reading my thread, and then carefully looking at the pictures, not just assume based on a quick glance

...Oh, wow.

I play Guard, too. Not Armoured Company, but I have a fair amount of vehicles. I used to be proud of my vehicles, too.

May as well hang up the brushes.

Seriously, though. This is easily one of the best painted armies I've ever seen. Good job!

H.F., check your Personal Messages (upper-right corner of the page).

Thank you.

I'll preface this by saying you clearly are a very talented artists and there is no question as to your skills in that department.

That being said, jesus christ you couldn't have picked worse subject matter.

From a very basic standpoint WW2 German armored companys are hilarious cliches, go over to Work In Progress and you can probably see three logs on the first page of the IG section.

Getting into the moralistic side of things - ok lets see you have taken some very emotive imagery and modified it very slightly and then expect people to be okay with it? Sorry chuck, no dice.

The nazi banner which you have changed ever so slightly was the symbol of over 30 million people killed, its not cool, no matter how many emo kids these days think it is.

You like historics? Okay, when were SS recruitment posters scrawled on the side of tanks? oh wait they werent. Also the single headed eagle in that format wasn't a very good idea either.

The whole thor odin thing is a classic symbol of the modern Neo Nazi movement, who are by all accounts, even more bigoted than their german brethren. Hell even the themes of your army, blood bonds, is a strong symbol of the Nazi movement.

So hey, make up all the apologist fluff you want, but theres no denying you've pretty much taken a look at the Nazi movement, gone "Coooooool man" and applied it to your AC.


To whoever is comparing Krieg to the second world war, please read a history book and get back to me

This thread has been reopened to allow the original poster to continue to post updates on his army and get feedback from the community.

It is important to note that previously in another thread a user intentionally created a profile for the specific intent of confusing others and inciting hostility. All of that user's posts have been deleted, that account and IP have been banned from this site. Please do not confuse the trolling from this dummy account with the original poster of this thread.


Anytime you find a someone's army in poor taste in your opinion it behooves you to let them know exactly why as they will obviously encounter exactly the same reactions in the real-world when they use their army.

But as with everything we try to promote in this forum, make your objections known with politeness and civility.


If you would like to further discuss (in a calm and thoughtful manner) the appropriateness of real-world iconography in miniature gaming, please visit THIS thread.



Thanks.

Personally, I think it's a great army. Well painted, well done, and honestly, I don't see any inappropriateness to the paint scheme or theme.

Just my $0.02.