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Based on previous campaigns they'll either say that a model may not take Relics from different lists or that all characters in a detachment must only select items from the one list.

Cadian Detachments can select from both the Cadian Supplement and the regular Guard codex for both Relics and Warlord traits, so its not everything is an either/or.

Praying that the Paradox has a bubble range.. c'mon Ahriman

Probably not.

Anyway, I am anxiously awaiting the Grimoire edition being sold out. I mean, getting it.

I mean, watching it be sold out.

The model can't mix and match and take 2 relics from different lists though, right? (which I did also mention)

 Matt.Kingsley wrote:
The model can't mix and match and take 2 relics from different lists though, right? (which I did also mention)

Correct, one or the other, not both.

Am I the only one that is disappointed to see that they didn't buff Be'lakor in some way or reduce his points?

Be'lakor is a level 5 now, I think.

 Brometheus wrote:
Be'lakor is a level 5 now, I think.

No, still 3.

Oh, ok. Sorry, looks like a 5 to me in that low-res pic I saw. Still wouldn't take him..

 casvalremdeikun wrote:

 Matt.Kingsley wrote:
The model can't mix and match and take 2 relics from different lists though, right? (which I did also mention)

Correct, one or the other, not both.

Wait, are we still talking about Cadian Detachments? Because Guard in a Cadian Detachment (which would include their new 'decurion-style' detachment) can mix and match relics from both the Cadian Supplement and Guard codex as they see fit. Whether they'll allow Demons to do the same I don't know, but there is precedence.

So the Scions of the Warp booklet... That's just an excerpt from the Wulfen campaign book, right?

I havent checked the name but the contents of the limited editions are from the Wulfen campaign and in case of the Daemon one the original Daemon Codex. They have just seperated the Wulfen content into booklets. If you have Codex CD and the standard edition of the Wulfen Campaign the only thing you might also want to buy are the CD Datacards. The Mission markers are exclusively available in the limited editions.

There could be another campaign book - focusing on Space Wolves again - in the not so far future.

Automatically Appended Next Post:

Am I correct in understanding that the only ways to get these new rules are a $90 campaign book, or a $190 limited edition codex? There's no new standalone Daemons codex like Tau got?

 Kanluwen wrote:

Experiment 626 wrote:

 Swampmist wrote:
Dat 6 though. Infinite D shots.

How is it infinite Str.D shots? It's a paltry 18", and likely will be at least WC2, if not even WC3.
Tzeentch is still the most useless God, and likely will still have the crappiest lore of the 3.

The Daemon Prince formation is complete garbage... Spend the better part of 1000-1200pts for +1T/+1S? Seriously, that's hilariously bad!

The effects are cumulative. If you have all 4 DPs alive at once, they get all the benefits.

Additionally if your Warlord is in the formation, all the Daemon Princes gain the Warlord's trait from what luchiban was saying.

Spending 1000-1200pts minimum for +1S/+1T until two of those ultra expensive targets get shot to bits is laughably awful. The problem with DP's is that they simply cost too much for a 4W/5++ platform.
If they were to get a 50pts drop, they'd suddenly become useable beyond the flying Nurgle Circus. As is, you only ever take one because you love the fluff/look of them. Khorne & Tzeentch ones especially actually make your army worse when you take them.

And no one in their right mind is going to make a DP their Warlord, especially when you can have either an extremely cheap Herald, or a Greater Daemon who actually costs less than the freaking Prince! (yes, that's how genuinely awful DP's are - worse stats, but higher cost than a bloody Greater Daemon!)

 Red Corsair wrote:

Seriously? Are you sure? The paradox literally lets you auto cast WC 1 powers and using 3 dice auto casts wc2 and with 5 dice you auto succeed WC3 powers. That's insanely useful, instead of rolling for powers with that psycher you essentially are just allocating dice to powers you won't to go off. If you don't think thats amazing I don't think there is a relic that could help you.

The 25 pt relic is also insane, it basically auto grimoires the bearer, letting you grim something else as well. Your rerolling 1's, oh and with the paradox your auto casting cursed earth btw.

Edit, I see others have also noticed well before me, glad to see most people get it. That thing is gross.

I apologise. My poor little concussed brain was confused by the thing as presented and kept thinking of impossible scenarios. (I've had 8 concussions, my mind is a feeble pile of goo at the best of times )

I might try it out on my Exalt Locus Tzherald, as he can suddenly typically get Prescience on 3 dice, and then he can 5 dice a maxed-out Flickering Fire for 5 dice instead of the current requirement of 6-7+ dice.
Leaves the Horrors to (hopefully) roll a shooting power, unless they get unlucky and roll up the almost useless new summon power. (I don't have any more spare Exalted Flamers, as they got chopped up and turned into 'counts as' Beasts/Firewyrms of Tzeentch)


Still, my beloved Tzeentch won't be fixed until we get a way to cast Tzeentch powers easier, or else Horrors get a fix to always allow them to attempt/cast Flickering Fire...

The biggest problem I have is that mono Tzeentch just doesn't have the volume of fire anymore. Not unless I spam the living hell out of Chariots & Exalted Flamers, while basically going only min Horrors and ignoring Flamers altogether.
It sucks because what always drew me Tzeentch was the ranks upon ranks of Horrors & Flamers burning everything in their path with magical flames, supported by the big guys, with Screamers & Furies playing hit-and-run based tactics.

Has anyone managed to get Grimoire yet? I am going to try. No clue when it is avail in US.. I bet as soon as I refresh it will be sold out.

 Brometheus wrote:
Has anyone managed to get Grimoire yet? I am going to try. No clue when it is avail in US.. I bet as soon as I refresh it will be sold out.

I thought that the pre-orders ten to go up around 1:30 - 2:00pm local time?

I'm picking up the novel today but this is the first release in a while where I'm just not a fan of the models at all. I don't feel so bad about selling the SW army now, although the campaign book might have great stuff independent of Wulfen.. Oh well.

Iuchiban back in the Wulfen thread answering questions.

Man those Daemonic Incursion formation traits are awesome.

1. Daemonic corruption great power for a daemon bomb or rush list.

2. Warp Unleased: now I'm not suffering a penalty when not taking Karios for re-rolls.

3. Daemonic power basically neuters the Warp Storm table:

- Roll 2 = must take and Daemonic Instability test, with re-roll.
- Roll 3 = either re-roll for the character, or (-1) roll DI on all units w/ a re-roll.
- Roll 4 = (+1) S4/AP5/Large Blast/Barrage/Ignore Cover hits for each enemy unit/vehicle.
- Roll 4, 5, or 6 = S4/AP5/Large Blast/Barrage/Ignore Cover hits for each enemy unit/vehicle.
- Roll 5, 6, or 7 = D6/S4/AP3/Poison 4+/Ignore Cover hits for each enemy unit/vehicle.
- Roll 6, 7, or 8 = No effects.
- Roll 7, 8, or 9 = D6/S6/AP-/Rending/Ignore Cover hits for each enemy unit/vehicle.
- Roll 8, 9, or 10 = S8/AP3/Blast/Barrage hits for each enemy unit/vehicle.
- Roll 9, 10, or 11 = +1 invulnerable saves.
- Roll 10, 11, or 12 = Turn and enemy Psyker into a Daemonic Herald.
- Roll 11 or 12 = Gain 2D6+ Free Daemons.

Your only really stuck if you roll a 2, but then your get to re-roll it anyway.

 Brometheus wrote:
Has anyone managed to get Grimoire yet? I am going to try. No clue when it is avail in US.. I bet as soon as I refresh it will be sold out.

I was able to order mine a few minutes ago

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ETz_CwqJpKU

Slow the video down to 0.25 and you can pause and see 8 out of 10 of the formations.

Khorne
1 Herald
8 units of either Bloodletters, Bloodcrushers or Fleshhounds

All units gain +1 attack while within 6" of one another.

All units benefit from the Heralds loci if they are within 12" of him.

Another formation:
3 Skull Cannons, squadron, may fire as one with an Apocolyptic Blast with AP3 and still Ignores cover, ouch.

Tzeentch
Herald
9 units of either Pink Horrors, Flamers or Exalted Flamers.

+1 Strength to all Warpflame attacks.

All units within 12" of the Herald benefit from his Loci.

Another formation:
1 Herald
9 units of either Screamers of Tzeentch or Burning Chariots

Chariots can do Slash attacks, inflicting D6 str 5 ap 4 hits on a unit they move over. Screamers get +1 hit.

All units within 12" of the Herald gain his Loci.

Nurgle
1 Herald
7 units of either Plaguebearers or Nurglings.

Enemies may not fire overwatch at units from this formation.

All units gain the Heralds Loci while within 12".

Another formation:
1 Herald
7 units of either Plague Drones or Beasts

All units gain Hammer of Wrath with poison 4+

1 unit within 12" of the herald may take a leadership test if they pass they can reroll failed charges and gain +3 attacks. If failed they must attempt to charge the nearest enemy.

Slaanesh

1 Herald
6 units of either Fiends of Slaanesh or Daemonettes.

Any enemy units in combat suffer -1 WS and -1I

All units within 12" of the herald benefit from its loci.

Another formation:
1 Herald
6 units from either Seekers, Hellflayer, Seeker Calvacade.

All units move 6" when running or moving flat out.

Thanks XT!!!

A lot of spam of units...

Ouch, gotta buy so many models just to be able to use either of/both of the Tzeentch formations. Are they even worth it?

Experiment 626 wrote:

 Brometheus wrote:
Has anyone managed to get Grimoire yet? I am going to try. No clue when it is avail in US.. I bet as soon as I refresh it will be sold out.

I thought that the pre-orders ten to go up around 1:30 - 2:00pm local time?

12:30-1pm EST.

 Brometheus wrote:
Are they even worth it?

Not at first glance.

Source: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ETz_CwqJpKU

Man, if that Tallyho(rde) can survive long enough to charge Tau--it's pretty much over.

Thanks for that, man

 Kanluwen wrote:
Man, if that Tallyho(rde) can survive long enough to charge Tau--it's pretty much over.

Unless those Plague Swords are AP2 or 3 nothing will die, but it will definitely keep them in place for a while.

Ok...so basically all formations suck ?

I am really interested in the new army organisation to get all the benefits...

The ones we can see the rules for are mostly terrible. 9 units of horrors plus a herald would be over or around 1000 points, especially if you're putting 11 horrors per unit to get two WC per.