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Apologies for dredging this thing up again, but apparently someone over at Warseer got hold of the latest White Dwarf and noticed something relevant on the back cover -

http://www.warseer.com/forums/showthread.php?t=306309&page=5

Second post down, by Mi'chal. Click the thumbnail and check the lower left-hand corner of it.

The text (bestiary!?) is somewhat... odd... which would ordinarily be a flag for a possible fake. But Mi'chal also provided four pictures from inside the magazine that he posted over in the Storm of Magic thread on Warseer. So the general concensus is that this is almost certainly legit, and the weird phrasing is the product of extremely laziness on GW's part.


If true, well...

Can't say I'm happy about it. I think it's a bad move on GW's part (then again, they've been seemingly making a lot of those lately...), and I also think that it doesn't fit with the established pattern that they've been following over the past couple of years.

Hmmm I smell +10 more pages of posts soon. This will be interesting

I zoomed in quite a bit on PS---either that entire page is legit or the entire page is a fake----as it looks seamless *. I'm going with legit.

As far as bestiary goes----the old Heresy Sisters of Silence had several pieces of art showing hounds (for witch hunting you see). Perhaps they are bringing back some of that old school fluff---as that's been their MO lately.

*I can tell by the pixels

First: I'm horribly disappointed.

Second: I'm not angry per say... I just don't know what to think about this info... I mean... is it in addition to the current dex? Is it showing us what is to come, but they don't have the printed book finalized? I mean, I know the Black Library is still cranking out fluff due in October, and the original James Swallow book has gone to reprint... but they wouldn't go through the trouble to put them to a WD with new models, only to Squat the whole army, would they?

Third: If they would go through all that - why? It makes no sense... but GW had stopped making sense a while back.

Depending on how this goes: While I won't quit the game, I may stop buying new stuff from GW... Still voting with my wallet... as I tend to buy a shat-ton new from them.

**ADDENDUM** The other option is that if this is a preview: Then they really need to express that early on in that magazine article. Playing sisters is the most fun I've had in this game cept for a few Necron games here or there... I'm just so damned conflicted, lol.

it looks legit, but it feels wrong somehow... I've seen that exact artwork on the back end of WD before, maybe thats why it feels wrong to me...

Revarien wrote:First: I'm horribly disappointed.

Second: I'm not angry per say... I just don't know what to think about this info... I mean... is it in addition to the current dex? Is it showing us what is to come, but they don't have the printed book finalized? I mean, I know the Black Library is still cranking out fluff due in October, and the original James Swallow book has gone to reprint... but they wouldn't go through the trouble to put them to a WD with new models, only to Squat the whole army, would they?

No. Blood Angels got a WD dex before they got their full dex.

Third: If they would go through all that - why? It makes no sense... but GW had stopped making sense a while back.

Depending on how this goes: While I won't quit the game, I may stop buying new stuff from GW... Still voting with my wallet... as I tend to buy a shat-ton new from them.

Putting it bluntly: if we really are as close as keeps getting hinted at for 6th edition, and we really are going to see the fabled Sisters v. CSM starter box--it might simply be that we're seeing the WD codex which will have a large 'preview' of units to come.

Kanluwen wrote:Putting it bluntly: if we really are as close as keeps getting hinted at for 6th edition, and we really are going to see the fabled Sisters v. CSM starter box--it might simply be that we're seeing the WD codex which will have a large 'preview' of units to come.

Yeah, you got this in before my edit... I'm more conflicted then anything: I don't want to wait the 'however many years' it took the Blood Angels to get their dex after the WD dex... not to mention that makes my tourny army less likely to be playable (most tournies around here don't allow 'pdf's or WD or Citadel Journals).

Revarien wrote:I'm more conflicted then anything.

I know the feeling, and I'm feeling somewhat the same. I like the Sisters and want more stuff. But at the same time, not like this.

Unfortunately, I'm also having to deal with Battlefront's "will they/won't they" approach to the FoW Bulge release that was (and hopefully still is...) scheduled for late this year. I don't need more army release uncertainty right now...

(amusingly enough, on the official Flames of War forums, whenever someone posts a rumor about Bulge being delayed *again*, one of the first things that pops up is a post from someone stating, "I wonder what Eumerin's going to say when he sees this?" )

i call shenanigans. sisters need new models. its still the most expensive army, all f'ing metal. they didnt even finecast em.

kenzosan wrote:i call shenanigans. sisters need new models. its still the most expensive army, all f'ing metal. they didnt even finecast em.

Like I said, the guy also posted a lot of pages from inside the magazine for Storm of Magic (it's in Warseers Storm of Magic thread in their Fantasy Rumors section). And AgeofEgos noted that the thumbnail is all one image (i.e. there's no cut and paste involved). If this is a fake, then he's gone to a LOT of effort. That's not to say that someone might not do such a thing. But it does make it more likely that he's legit.

One theory that's been suggested over there is that new figures will appear along with the WD codex, and it'll be GW's way of testing the viability of the new box of plastics. Why they'd feel a need to test that after DE and GK I don't know. But it's one theory.

....And suddenly a mighty ray of light broke through the clouds...Thunder filled the skies and a myriad of cherubs chanted : "The Cleansing is upon us! The Cleansing is upon us!"

Just gonna slip this in right here...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pwLzuOMpkFw

Carry on.

bhsman wrote:Just gonna slip this in right here...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pwLzuOMpkFw

Carry on.

I always thought it sounded completely plausible, and I still don't understand the anger towards this at all (despite people explaining it to me).

There is no reason to assume the army is getting 'squatted' by this move, and in fact the opposite is true. If it were getting 'squatted' you wouldn't see any updates to the army list as well. Not to mention the fact that GW has said publicly that they are no longer 'squatting' any armies and since that time they haven't.

As I said before, this fits very similarly with what happened with the Blood Angels/Dark Angels. They were two army types that, at the time, were very similar to it made sense that the design work that went into writing the Dark Angels army list would allow a 'get you by' Blood Angels army list to be developed alongside it. In this case, there are likely to be a lot of similarities between how the Grey Knights and Sisters of Battle army lists are structured (including sharing Inquisitorial units & character rules), so it makes sense that the design work that went into the Grey Knights army list can be similarly applied without too much effort into putting out a 'get you by' Sisters of Battle army list.

People seem to be assuming that a 'get you by' Sisters of Battle army list will naturally be less powerful than the existing codex, when you don't know that for sure. For example, the 'get you by' Blood Angels White Dwarf list was much better than the existing Blood Angels codex at the time, so there's no reason the same can't hold true here.

Most importantly, people are acting as though the publishing of this army list via White Dwarf suddenly changes when a new Sisters of Battle codex will be released. The fact is, GW releases new codexes to promote their new miniatures line. If they had a new line of SoB models to release, then they would be releasing the codex, simple as that. Regardless of whether or not this WD update is published, if the model line isn't ready for release, then it isn't ready for release. As I mentioned before, the SoB range is almost completely metal currently and besides the inquisitorial units and the Rhino/Immolator, it doesn't share models with any other current range. That means any redo of their miniature line was always going to be a huge undertaking...not quite on par with the complete reboot of the Dark Eldar range, but not too far behind. I know with good authority that it took over 3 years of work to design and sculpt the new Dark Eldar line, so if its going to take a while to get the SoB range done, then that's what its going to take. Whether or not the codex should be next means nothing compared to whether or not the miniature line is ready or not. If the time required to finish the miniature line means the release is still more than a year away, why not put out a 'get you by' army list so that you don't have two identical types of units in the game (Inquisitorial units) behaving completely differently depending on whether they came from the Grey Knights or Witch Hunters codex?

No offense meant to you, Yak. I just wonder how long until people claim in the future that Blood of Kittens was just copying info about a Sisters White Dwarf Codex that was already being discussed here or some other malarkey.

EDIT: And agreed on all counts.

Agree with the Yak. They did WD lists for BA and for Warriors of Chaos not too long before both of those got updated books. This is a good sign for the Sisters.

The thing is, there's a perfectly good "get you by" codex out already. It's an independent codex in a book that doesn't include any other armies (unlike Angels of Death, which had two armies in one book). And if GW had thought that there were "terrabul! terrabul!" conflicts between WH and GK that needed to be corrected, then they should have issued the new WD codex the month after GK came out instead of waiting around. If the old WH codex causes some terrible crisis because it doesn't exactly match Matt Ward's latest masterpiece, then why didn't GW act like it and hurry it up? In short, if this is some "desperately needed" attempt to bring GK and WH models into line, why the leisurely amble toward the goal line of getting the thing published?

Finally, while Blood Angels may have been a good WD Codex (I have no idea if it was or not), Warriors of Chaos was another matter entirely.

I'm leaning more toward "Sisters test run", myself, despite how absurd the idea is.

But then again, every other idea that I've heard strikes me as even more so.

my only complaint has and will remain to be that sisters are all metal and are the most expensive army to build. a wd codex only keeps this complaint alive.

Eumerin wrote:The thing is, there's a perfectly good "get you by" codex out already. It's an independent codex in a book that doesn't include any other armies (unlike Angels of Death, which had two armies in one book). And if GW had thought that there were "terrabul! terrabul!" conflicts between WH and GK that needed to be corrected, then they should have issued the new WD codex the month after GK came out instead of waiting around. If the old WH codex causes some terrible crisis because it doesn't exactly match Matt Ward's latest masterpiece, then why didn't GW act like it and hurry it up? In short, if this is some "desperately needed" attempt to bring GK and WH models into line, why the leisurely amble toward the goal line of getting the thing published?

Finally, while Blood Angels may have been a good WD Codex (I have no idea if it was or not), Warriors of Chaos was another matter entirely.

I'm leaning more toward "Sisters test run", myself, despite how absurd the idea is.

But then again, every other idea that I've heard strikes me as even more so.

I think you're a bit off on your editions. Blood Angels and Dark Angles did not share a codex when the Blood Angels 'get you by' army list was released in WD. The codex (like the Space Wolves) referenced back to the basic Space Marine codex (which by that point had actually been updated once already).

The point is Witch Hunters is not a perfectly good stand alone codex. It has a bunch of wonky 3rd edition rules in it, it has ally rules that are completely outdated and confusing to anyone not familiar with what's going on with the 40K scene, and they contain units that have exactly the same name as those in the Grey Knights codex, but with wildly different rules and abilities.

So regardless of how well the codex currently plays it is not a perfectly good stand-alone codex because it fails in all those areas of clarity and accessibility.

kenzosan wrote:my only complaint has and will remain to be that sisters are all metal and are the most expensive army to build. a wd codex only keeps this complaint alive.

And the release of the army list in White Dwarf neither helps nor hurts that problem...it is completely independent of it. Do you think for a second GW has a heap of plastic SoB models ready to release but instead has decided to shelve them so they can put out a 'get you by' White Dwarf army list?

Of course not. In fact, if anything, a White Dwarf army list shows that they ARE working on the army, and based on recent history that means a TON of new plastic models. Unfortunately, sculpting a bunch of new plastic models (along with all the other plastic models that every other release gets) obviously takes a long time, which is why an interim codex bringing some of the rules up to date with those in the Grey Knights codex makes a heck of a lot of sense.

I prefer the metal (hopefully soon to be finecast?) miniatures. The plastic ones are bound to be more heroic scale garbage rather than the well proportioned beauties they are now.

Wow this sucks

chaos0xomega wrote:I prefer the metal (hopefully soon to be finecast?) miniatures. The plastic ones are bound to be more heroic scale garbage rather than the well proportioned beauties they are now.

I take it you've never seen Plastic Warhammer Fantasy models? I have some wood elves and they are proportionally smaller than a Guardsman, SM, and even a SoB.

I would prefer plastic over metal any day, its a lot easier to work with. Anyways this also brings up the question as may have already stated, "Will the WD article bring new plastic boxed sets with it? and will it be with the first half with the fluff or the second half with the rules?"

Either way I do hope it dose bring new plastic boxed sets regardless.

Eumerin wrote:

Revarien wrote:I'm more conflicted then anything.

I know the feeling, and I'm feeling somewhat the same. I like the Sisters and want more stuff. But at the same time, not like this.

Same here, I still hoping it will be a book codex and not a WD codex.

The lack of Finecast SoB recasts is surely also an indication that plastics (and new Finecast models) are being worked on - GW will only go to the bother of FineCasting existing stuff they expect to stay as is for the forseeable future.

I agree with Yak - this will be a temp codex designed to work with the existing model line and to remove post-GK confusion with the old codex. Good news, Sisters - a real codex is coming. But don't hold your breath, could stilll be a year or so away...

OK, hold on. Someone clear this up for me: If they release this WD codex, will they release plastic models with it? Or will we have to wait a couple of years until the real codex comes out? Or will the real codex come out just a few months later, begging the question as to why bother putting out a WD one in the first place. As an interim thing I can understand, but only if models are released with it and if the actual codex wasn't going to come out for a while. None of these scenarios make me particularly happy, but.

Scarey Nerd wrote:OK, hold on. Someone clear this up for me: If they release this WD codex, will they release plastic models with it? Or will we have to wait a couple of years until the real codex comes out? If the latter... I'm not best pleased.

They release codexes to support their model releases. If they have models to release then there would be a proper codex. Since they're releasing the codex in White Dwarf you can safely assume that new models are still being worked on.

Again, the models are what drives GW's new releases, not codexes. So when they've got the model line ready to go they will release a proper codex. Until that time, they appear to be putting out a 'get you by' WD codex to bring the existing 3rd edition rules more into the existing current 5th edition game.


While I can certainly understand people being unhappy at having to wait for new models to be finished, again, a new army list in White Dwarf would have absolutely no bearing on when those models would be released. As always, they will be released when the line is actually finished and ready for release.

All the rumours were pointing towards a November-ish release, perhaps early 2012. Assuming this kind of date for the codex remains unchanged, I still don't really get why we players need a WD update. I thought they'd be too busy pushing their FOTM army etc to devote space to an army that isn't actually getting a codex yet. Although, the use of the words "Part 1" might indicate that we won't get a new codex at all, they'll just do 2 parts in WD and then release models with the second, and then perhaps a year later they'll make those 2 articles into a codex to extort maximum cash from us. Hey ho.

I am very happy with this.
This way I don´t "have" to buy a lot of new miniatures yet, (assuming we only get the codex and no new minis)
and can field my SoB again in a competitive way now, and not just in 1,5 years.

Cautious thumbs up to this news - let's wait and see what the "codex" looks like.

Of course, this will be the final death knell for allies, so my combined IG/Sisters army will have to split into 2, with painful results for my wallet...

I sincerely hope that this release not going to be a big stampede for the sisters ...

I am very curious about how many pages of these WDs will be for sistas.

Scarey Nerd wrote:All the rumours were pointing towards a November-ish release,

I would politely suggest that is a better candidate for the Necrons to get a codex, giving them a nice chance to preview them at GD UK.. much like they did with the successful Dark Eldar launch.

A full on SoB codex -- with new plastic and finecast models -- is still very much on the cards, indeed possibly even for next year IMO -- but I am dubious in the extreme about the idea of them being in any starter box set for any new edition.

Oh, and for the benefit of those work blocked/similar :

Disappointed. It's as if that army is for second class customers.

If anything, Grey Knights are the ones that should have had a WD dex, since they were a half baked force before. Same with the Blood Angels, as the only thing separating them now over the WD dex did is piles of junk concepts.