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hi, i am starting a painting service and currently i have one (somewhat unreliable) client. and as i have a week of fairly free time, i am looking for a project to start on. my turn around times are pretty darn good, and my quality is above tabletop. so if anyone needs a quick, good paintjob on a unit or army (i could get one done in a week if you stretched me) just send me an email at the address in my sig, or drop me a pm

anyone? if you need to know what the prices are gonna be like, check out my site

You may want to post pics up of your work. It sounds dumb but people are too lazy to click links

Hm, quick word of advise:

If you showcase you quality levels you should use compareable miniatures.

Your Gallery shows humans as Level 1 but a Vehicle as Level 2. Since you can´t directly compare those two you can´t really compare the quality levels.

Edit: You might as well show bigger/zoomeable pictures. Small or blurry pictures don´t help your cause since you can´t show details or how clean your work is.

I second KingCracker and Vimes comments.

i know but as i haven't really got any work to show, then that is all i have. also my website provider does not allow zoomable pictures, only the bare bones.

The majority of your work in the gallery are lvl 1 ( by your own rating system ) . If you want more customers , then you need to convince them you can also do the lvls 3 you advertised.

Paint more samples the customers can look at.
Most of us can tell a painter's lvl by looking at their brush strokes , how they high light. It doesnt matter if the things they paint are lvl 1 , or lvl 10 , the skill displayed is still the same.
For example , a GD winner's lvl 1 will never ever look as bad as my lvl 1 or even 2 and 3 i paint. Because they are that good and experienced and talented.

WAAAAGGHH-god wrote:i know but as i haven't really got any work to show, then that is all i have. also my website provider does not allow zoomable pictures, only the bare bones.

You might want to switch providers then.
Unless people can actually take a closer look at your work, don´t expect too many clients. People don´t like to buy the cat in the bag, and especially not when they pay you for a qualitiy level they expected differently due to bad pictures.

Starting on "Website" scale might not be the best way, anyway. Try to find customers on a local scale. My FLGS has a shelf dedicated to local painters of offer commissions with examples of their work and their contact infos. Maybe ask you FLGS if that would be possible. The direct website approach might put people off. Very few people would trust a business (and nothing else is a painting service) that has to rely on a free, ad overloaded provider to host their website. Or offer your work here on Dakka in the Swap Shop. You can host better pictures in the Gallery, and you have a whole board of potential customers.

A way to better show your different quality levels would be buying a number of similar minis and painting them to the individual levels. Doesn´t have to be expensive ones, but they should be compareable.

Looking at the Khorne symbol on one of those vehicles, I think maybe you should practice freehanding before accepting jobs?

Not trying to be offensive or anything, but that's my honest opinion.

The stuff you're showing simply isn't good enough to get commissions, and expecting to get them is just setting yourself up for disappointment. There's the brutal truth.

First, get practice in with the camera. You need good lighting, a tripod and a neat backdrop (plain piece of paper is fine). Once you get decent photos, you'll notice flaws in your work more (photos do help - really!). This will help improve your work.

Start posting on CMON if you don't already. Once you're getting consistent scoring of 6+ you're 'better than tabletop'. Until then, the chance of getting work is very low. You don't need to be a demon winner or finalist, but your work needs to be of a professional quality. This means neat, not necessarily multi-highlighted masterworks. CMON is flighty, and ratings there are certainly best taken with a hefty pinch of salt, but as a guide it does help.

Site wise: Don't make people download or click to see stuff. Prices should be clear - downloading an excel spreadsheet is not fun, can spread macro viruses etc. Put the prices where they can be seen.

Google's blogger service is ideal for commission sites - it's free, very little effort to set up, looks professional (if you post properly) and provides a certain amount of free storage. If you get/have a domain name you can point it at the blogger site, which makes things a bit more professional.

WAAAAGGHH-god wrote:i know but as i haven't really got any work to show, then that is all i have. also my website provider does not allow zoomable pictures, only the bare bones.

The problem Im seeing now is your attitude about it. I dont mean to sound insulting or anything. If your really wanting to be a professional painter you simply cannot have excuses for potential customers. You cant say well I cant get better pics, its my website providers fault, the aliens made me do it. Those are unacceptable. You asked for our help, so listen to our advice, there have been plenty of people on DAKKA over the years that have posted their work, looking for work. And the ones that made it and ended up making some money, where the ones that listened and did whatever they could to keep business.

fair point, and i am taking it to heart. i shall go and paint up some level examples tonight, then post them here for people to see. i also might as well take down the website link until i can get everything running smoothly.

@bok_choy17 - i get what you mean, but that was a stencil job, not freehand. i try not to do freehand on my stuff if i can avoid it as it is not something i am particularly good at.

@Vimes - unfortunately my only FLGS is the local GW shop, and while they are great, it is against company policy to let people advertise paining services in the shops

@winterdyne - how else would you sugest i do it? there are to many catagories for me to put all on one page, and the other painting companies i have looked at (BlueTablePainting in particular) have had it as an excel download

I found BTP's site to be rather confusing with regard to pricing, when at the end of the day the thing with commissions is each one's different. You just need to put guideline prices up, and give a proper quote for each enquiry.

GW's do let you put your name next to display models though. From then all a client should need to do is google your name and 'painting service'.

WAAAAGGHH-god wrote:...my website provider does not allow zoomable pictures, only the bare bones.

That is inconsequential. If the website provider accepts html, which it does, then you can make zoomable pictures via thumbnails. Here's how.

1) Save your picture in a smaller size, say 150x250 (or whatever. thumbnail size may vary pic to pic) and upload to your server.

2) Save a larger image for "zoom". This should be big enough to see clear detail and work quality. This should be your original picture. Do NOT blow up the thumb pic (above) to this size or pic quality will be destroyed. Up load this pic to your site, too.

3) In the html code on the site, have the thumbnail image display oon the page, but have it link to the larger picture. The code basic html code is fairly straight forward.
<a href="http://www.url_to_large_image.com"><img src="http://www.url_to_thumb_image.com"></a href>
When the thumbnail image is clicked, it will open the large image on a new page. The viewer will need to hit the back button on the browser to get back to the other page. You can also add sme very minor javascript to the document to make the larger images just open in a popup window so they don't need to back-button.


Whatever the case, if you really want to get your commission painting off the ground, you will HAVE to improve your pic quality. You should take a couple models for each category of mini, preferably from multiple game systems. Using some neutral background so there's no distraction in the pic is advisable, too.



Ghidorah

ok, thanks a load Ghidorah, i will need to do some major painting when i get the time

Time is also a large factor.

Half of commissioned gone wrong is painter not able to deliver the service after been paid.

Golden rule - *never* make a promise you can't keep. If a deadline has to be met (eg for a tourney) you can't slip and expect the customer to pay like a happy camper. If you think you may slip timewise (let's face it we all do) make sure your customers are aware of this and happy to proceed with that understanding.

Edit: Actually that promises thing holds true for pretty much everything. Don't tell the client they'll get Golden Demon competition level stuff if they won't (for example they're not paying enough!). Don't tell them they'll get a 'high end' paintjob if they won't. Don't promise excellent communications then go on holiday without touching base with everyone first. You get the idea. Behave professionally (even if your paintwork is at the lower end of the scale) and you'll get customers that have a positive experience and come back.

I've heard people slag off BTP's (just as an example) low end paintjobs, but from what I hear, they're cheap, fast, communicative and deliver just what they promise, when they promise it. There's a lot to be learned from that.

I will echo the similar comments.

You need more pics of your work, and a variety for us all to see of each level, preferable 10+ different models per tier, and that doesn't include 10 different Goliaths, 10 very different models.

You also need better pictures for everything.

Finally, it is probably hurting your reputation and future sales to keep the website as it is. I'd take it down until you are ready to give good pics and models, as it stands, more people will likely see them and avoid the service entirely.

Hope to see a new and better effort in the near future!

Our aim is to provide a cost-effective and easy solution to people who either don't have enough time or want to get a high quality of painting that they can't yet achieve.

Pic from your gallery on site


Actual none shrunk pic:


Im really not trying to be rude but , unless you hide all the pics to be thumbnail sized , the quality will really scare off any customers.
Perhaps the first step of having more clients starts with improving your own paint skills first. Instead of using customer's mini + money as a method to practice.

This might be a horrible thing to say, but I won't trust anyone with anything of mine unless they have proper grammar. It's an attention to detail thing.
This may be wild speculation, but the OP comes off as a person of limited age, wildly enthusiastic, but also very young. The appellation at the end of the handle is a very telling sign. If I'm to trust anyone with any sort of contract labor, I'd at least also want them to be contractually liable; i.e, minors are not.
I'd also delete any gallery pics that have crooked freehand, unfinished models, or models of the quality Lunahound posted.

Winterdyne has posted sage advice on improving your craft and client base.

@Lunahound - that is an example of my level 1 work, the work that is designed to be the fasted, cheapest option. unfortunately i haven't got round to painting up some example models of the higher levels because i would think they should all be fairly similar models for the sake of comparison. so in the time-being i decided to take some pictures of my own stuff that is roughly at the level advertised, probably lower due to my lack of care with my own stuff. i assure you that i take much more care and attention with other peoples models.

@Doomthumbs - i get where you're coming from, but i can't see where my grammar has gone wrong in my posts, capitalisation maybe, but otherwise feel free to point it out to me. also, you seem to vastly underestimate how important enthusiasm is for this kind of work. While I am a minor, I am also quite able to hold my own in the hobby scene; and as for the matter of legality, any problem that would arise I am more than happy to resolve myself. After all, not all kids are trying to run off with your money

Sorry man, but you really need to improve your skills if you want to gain clients. You just said you don't care for your own models; very unprofessional. How can anyone trust you to take care of theirs if you can't even care for your own?

Your level 1 work is really bad, no offense, but it is far from even table top quality.

It's good that your enthusiastic though, if you really want to succeed as a commission painter, I think you can do it.

You asked for it, so time to grade your response. Lemme find Ol' Red....

WAAAAGGHH-god wrote:@Doomthumbs - I get where you're coming from, but I can't see where my grammar has gone wrong in my posts. C apitalization maybe, but otherwise feel free to point it out to me. Also, you seem to vastly underestimate how important enthusiasm is for this kind of work. While I am a minor, I am also quite able to hold my own in the hobby scene; and as for the matter of legality, any problem that would arise I am more than happy to resolve myself. After all, not all kids are trying to run off with your money.

Ok, so again I feel that the attention to detail needs work. This goes for every aspect of someone I would trust my models with, not just painting.
I do not doubt that you are enthusiastic, you seem to have it by the bucketload. I too am wildly enthusiastic about getting money. Love that stuff.
Whether or not you can hold your own in the hobby scene is determined by volume of work, references, and the quality of both of these.
You are UNABLE to resolve legal issues yourself as you are a MINOR. By definition, unable to enter legally binding contracts or be held accountable for the ones that you do enter into. If you were to abscond with my models and money, my only recourse would be to go through your parents, as you are unable to be sued. Because, again, you are a minor. If you were driving a car, and plowed it into mine, the process is the same. If you were to engage in petty theft, lets just say of models/money, you would again be unable to be tried as an adult.

As is, your system is based on our being willing to trust you implicitly based on the fact that you say you are trustworthy.
I have a fire breathing dragon that lives in my garage.

Neither of us can prove that or be held accountable.

Doomthumbs, i am glad to hear that you too are an owner of a fire-breathing, garage-dwelling dragon, maybe we should get them together sometime. However i would like to point out two things to you; first, is that my not adding a capital 'I' instead of the normal 'i' is purely a time saving basis, and i hope that i have not deeply offended you in some way. second, in the UK we are legally accountable from the age of about 12, and seeing as i am throughly over that age, i think your argument is invalid.

@Skelly - i get what you mean, but my response would be that i paint my own stuff for one purpose, to get it on the tabletop. so unless i have a particular love of a certain figure, i am quite likely to paint it to a basic level and improve on it when i see fit. obviously clients of mine are looking for more than that, and i am much more inclined to treat their models like liquid diamond. also, i have since reviewed my level system and i plan to update the pictures in the coming weeks ( i would do it sooner, but i have no idea how to update my site, and my friend who helps me out is back home in Gibraltar for the rest of this week )

If anyone wants an idea of my new levels, please check my gallery

WAAAAGGHH-god wrote:in the UK we are legally accountable from the age of about 12, and seeing as i am throughly over that age, i think your argument is invalid.

I believe that you need to be over the age of 18 to enter into a contract though.

http://www.gillhams.com/dictionary/444.cfm

No Offence too you but I wouldn't pay for a level 1 Quality.

People are trusting you with a model that they've worked hard too afford. Then they give you money for a paint job that's not up too grade. You won't get any customers even people who are top painters like Nucleosaur struggle sometimes too get clients (Even though in his case it's probably his location)

Its not that I mind the lower case, really. You just asked me to point it out, so I did. Also, you seem to mix and match with it, and I wonder if that carries over to your painting.

I mean, if you're saving time by not capitalizing, spelling, or punctuating words so that you can look professional, why would you possibly care about my models?

My dragon is not actually real. Its a Carl Sagan thing, some brainy blah blah blah I'm sure you have no time for.

A huge "Oh Snap" in response to SilverMk2's linkage.

while i may not be able to enter into a contract, i am still liable if i commit a criminal act, eg: theft. and to be perfectly honest, i doubt anyone but you thinks less of a person who tries to save time while typing.

@InquisitorVaron - understood, which is why i have just upgraded the quality of my level one, seeing as community feedback is quite important. please check out my gallery examples marked levels 1-2 and tell me if they are of an acceptable standard.

WAAAAGGHH-god wrote:i am much more inclined to treat their models like liquid diamond.

Soooo.... like they don't exist? Why would the models be liquidated? Are you using that as a sly metaphor for sold as quickly as possible once you get them?

I'd advise not trying to run a legitimate business as a minor. I hear that just takes time though. Maybe use this time to get several years of painting experience?

i was actually referring to the care one would use when handling something so rare as liquid diamond (and FYI, you can melt carbon). but i am willing to bet that you don't like people under the age of 18 having anything to with this hobby, and god forbid they try and take on some kind of responsibility.