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I managed to pick up the following from an old friend who has given up playing 40k:

Cadian Command Squad.

40 Cadian Infantry.

3 Heavy Weapon Teams.

Leman Russ Battle Tank.

(All still boxed)

The last time I collected IG was back in 2nd Ed and I was about 13.

I've read the codex and I can't make out what would be a good build from what I have.

Is what I have only good for a starting point or could it stand on it's own?

We have no IG player in my Meta and it is full of MEQ and the odd Xenos player here and there.

Any advice would be great.

Thanks.

Its a solid start and would probably come in at about 750-1000 points. You get your command squad and an infantry platoon, maybe with a couple of options on special weapons. The 3 Russes back this up nicely for a stereotypical Guard starter army. You would need to get some more infantry to make alegal list, however as the infantry platoon only counts as 1 troops choice. The options would be lots more line infantry with more platoons, a veteran squad or a penal battallion squad to make up the choice numbers. Chimeras can be applied as preferred.

In terms of the heavy weapons the general consensus appears to be put the teams in the infantry squads. Heavy Weapon squads are just too fragile and can't make best use of Orders. For the Russes there is a wide range of opinion on what is best to field, but it really depends on what else you have in your force to fill gaps. Leman Russes are more effective as anti-infantry platforms than dedicated anti-tank and you need to take into account the changes to how Ordnance armed Russes work.

Well, you have enough to do a foot list.

Start by putting together the heavy weapons. I'd make them interchangable in one way or another, but if you HAVE to glue them down, I'd make them lascannons as everything else has a more niche role.

Once you've got that done, you're going to be able to make four infantry squads pretty easily. Get your hands on some meltagun or plasma gun bitz if you can, but if you can't, just make the troopers as sergeants and dudes with lasguns. No point wasting good plastic on crappy special weapons like grenade launchers.

This will give you two infantry squads with a lascannon, two infantry squads with nothing, and four models left over.

Then go to your command squad and make yourself a senior officer, and make good use out of those plasma and meltagun bitz. You should probably make a standard as well.

Take the melta and plasma guns out of the command squad and give them to the infantry, and replace the guys with your third lascannon.

You've now got two extra infantry, for a total of six. Use the command squad box to make a couple of junior officers, and you have the dudes left over to give one of them a retinue.

Either go to a bitz site and get yourself some more legs, or get one of those 5-man click together cadian infantry squads, and you'll have a legal guard army.

The best you can do is probably something like...

CCS - plasma pistol, power weapon, sniper, standard, lascannon

PCS - 3x flamers
PIS - plasma gun
PIS - melta gun

PCS
PIS - lascannon
PIS - lascannon

From there, you buy more bitz and stuff required for every PIS to have both a special and a heavy weapon, and some extra guns for that unarmed PCS.

As for the russ, once again you're going to want to make it interchangable, which is easy given that the hull weapons all just fit into their mountings without the need to glue them in. As for which russ to make, stay away from the ordinance guns, as sponsons are the name of the game now that lumbering behemoth has been replaced by heavy (see the FAQ).

If you've got the regular russ kit, the exterminator is the best all-arounder, while the vanquisher is best if you expect your opponents to bring things like vehicles of AV12+ or better or terminators, or other hard targets. The eradicator can be good, but it IS a little situational, and the LRBT is just junk nowadays - anything you want the battlecannon for, just take the exterminator cannon. If you've got the demolisher kit, then take a punisher. It's the best of the three options by a fair bit.

Throw that into the list above, and you're looking at a 500+ point list straight out of the box with just what you have. Get yourself some more guns, and you can start to reasonably stretch towards 750.

Where you go from there will depend a lot on your local meta and your play style. Just play some lower points games for awhile, and get used to how your guard army plays. Add more stuff based on your experiences with how your guard have played out. Perhaps you'll think your infantry are doing fine, but you just need more of them. Perhaps you'll think your infantry weak and disgraceful, and so will want to hide them in chimeras. Perhaps you'll want more russes, or perhaps you'll think they're overkill, and will move to lighter vehicles that put out more firepower for their cost. It will really be up to you at that point.

Good luck, and welcome back to the guard.

Thanks for the advice.

I just found out that my local GW store will be running a campaign soon starting at 500 points.

I just found a sick 500 point list which I could easily field in the meantime:

CCS

2x Veteran Squads.

2x Leman Russ Battle Tanks.

These are barebones and apparently there is enough points left over for options.

You say the basic LRBT is junk? I've read the opposite for this tank and that the Exterminator is junk.

My issue is that the LRBT is the early version that was included in the old battleforce, but I can easily convert an Exterminator Turret.

I'm not an imperial guard player. But I know from IG players in my area that they like their Vendettas....

There's not enough models to play a legal list with infantry platoons. Minimum per platoon is 25 guardsmen (PCC & 2 IS) so 50 troops plus the CCS. So you need to buy at least one more box of guardsmen to make up the two PCS. Then you're good to go. In fact if you split up the HWTs into the squads, you only need an extra four models so you could just buy another command squad box instead. This might be a good idea anyway so as to get more plasma & melta guns. Then you could have something like:

CCS + Lascannon + 2 x Plasma (100)
PCS + 4 x Grenades Launchers (50)
IS + Lascannon + Grenade Launchers (75)
IS + Lascannon + Grenade Launchers (75)
PCS + 4 x Flamers (50)
IS + Melta (60)
IS + Melta (60)
Leman Russ Battle Tank (150)

620 points total and reasonably competitive at this points level with just the purchase of a second command box. You'd even have one spare Guardsman model that you could convert into Marbo giving you 685 points.

The other option is to use your guardsmen as veterans. Then you 'd have a legal list without having to buy more models. But if you're going to pay the extra points for vets over infantry squads, you really need lots more special weapons (plasma & melta) to make use of the expensive BS4 upgrade they get. Problem is, as I mentioned earlier they only come in the command box and that only provides one of each. You could also get the individual bits from third party bits sellers or convert up from the finecast melta & plasma sets that GW sell. however making your vets useful in this way puts a big target on them, so then you need some transports to keep them safe and buying another 4-5 Chimeras might not be in your budget.

Considering I paid £50 for that lot, I want to keep the force as cheap as possible while having the ability to kick ass.

Mech is not something I fancy, but I do like the battle tanks and the idea of drowning my opponent in battle tanks. My family have a history of being Tank drivers since WW1 and Tanks have always appealed to me.

I also like the idea of Valkyries and a Starship Trooper style force of flyers and infantry.

I'd love to see a smaller attack flyer in 6th for IG. Something like an Apache.

If you want to run an apache then Forgeworld is what you want. They do a modified version of the valkyrie, the Vulture gunship, which drops the transport capacity and is a dedicated weapons platform. It is also one of the most maneuverable aircraft in the game with Vector Dancer. I think the most recent rules are in Imperial Aeronautica.

Puscifer wrote:CCS

2x Veteran Squads.

2x Leman Russ Battle Tanks.

That's a fine start to a guard list. Won't use many of the models you have, and you'll have to buy a bunch of new ones, but you can certainly run a mech list if you want.

Puscifer wrote:You say the basic LRBT is junk? I've read the opposite for this tank and that the Exterminator is junk.

Name one target type (other than bunched up marines out in the open) that the LRBT is both good against AND better than the exterminator against.

The exterminator beats the LRBT at AV10-13, and is better against monstrous creatures, hordes and terminators due to weight of fire. And you can shoot the exterminator cannon and fire sponson weapons at full-BS, and let me tell you, a pair of multimeltas and a lascannon can do some pretty serious damage.

Paired MM with Lascannon on an Exterminator?

Now that sounds pricey and the ranges are all over the place. Sounds funky though.

It can handle any target in the game at any range on a durable platform for only 195 points.

Not too shabby.

There's not much point in spending 150 points on a single gun when you can spend only 33% more and quadruple its killing power.

Just picked up the models.

The CCS is the old metal type. Not bothered by that, kinda looking fwd to painting them.

I also got a old blister pack containing, in metal...

Jerran Kell and Creeeeeeeeeed.

Sorry for the thread necro...

I've finally got some time off to put my new IG together and my total list of stuff is:

Creed.
Kell.
45 infantry.
Metal CCS.
HW Squad.
Old Leman Russ - to be converted into an Exterminator.
Leman Russ Demolisher kit - I'm thinking that an executioner would be good here.

I think out of that little list, I could make:

CCS with Creed and a heavy weapon.

PCS.
2 Platoon Squads.
2 HW Squads - one with 3 LC and one with 3 ML.

Veteran Squad with a Harker conversion and Autocannon team.

Leman Russ Exterminator with Pask, Lascannon and HB Sponsons.

Leman Russ Executioner with Lascannon and Plasma Cannons.

Does that seem ok?

I've sort of gone for what I think will work and what I like.

In other words... I haven't got the foggiest, please help.

If you wanted to get some chimeras you could make a fairly decent Armored Fist list. Just use lotsa Vets in Chimeras with heavy and special weapons in their squads

I'm not a fan of Mech lists. I like to try and have a bit of a mix where I can in all the armies I collect.

It's the expense more than fielding such a list.

Out of all the tank variants, if you can only take one tank (numbers wise) Executioners will get you the most bang for your buck. Most other leman Russ variants shine because you can take a ton of them for stupidly cheap. A single Executioner can do absolutely disgusting amounts of damage, especially in small games. Just remember to keep an eye on those plasma cannons so it doesn't blow itself up.

 MrMoustaffa wrote:
Out of all the tank variants, if you can only take one tank (numbers wise) Executioners will get you the most bang for your buck. Most other leman Russ variants shine because you can take a ton of them for stupidly cheap. A single Executioner can do absolutely disgusting amounts of damage, especially in small games. Just remember to keep an eye on those plasma cannons so it doesn't blow itself up.

Or field it with 3x bolters and not worry

I tried the Exterminator and Executioner to great effect, but I found that my infantry suck.

I have no idea how to use them. Keep them back and take long range shots with Lascannons or take Vets and march them up the board with Carapace Armour?

I can see the strengths of Guard - Tanks, Heavy Firepower... Tanks with Heavy Firepower, but how do I use my infantry?

It just seems that I can only go Blob or Mech.

Puscifer wrote:

I have no idea how to use them. Keep them back and take long range shots with Lascannons

Yes!

or take Vets and march them up the board with Carapace Armour?

No!

Vets on foot are never the answer

-TheCaptain

So if I do sit them back, with a Lascannon/Missile Launcher, what goes up to take objectives or do I play to table my opponent?

If the latter is the case, I'm thinking my army might benefit from more LRBT or Manticores.

"Vets on foot are never the answer"
Now that's not entirely true. Foot vets can work but you have to
A; keep them in cover with the Forward Sentry Doctrine or
B; have them march right behind the LRBT using it as mobile cover as they would have done back in WW2.
Foot vets are hard to use because you rely can't afford the loses and stay an affective fighting force, but when you do it right, the look on the Cron's players face is priceless

 Ribon Fox wrote:
"Vets on foot are never the answer"
Now that's not entirely true. Foot vets can work but you have to
A; keep them in cover with the Forward Sentry Doctrine or
B; have them march right behind the LRBT using it as mobile cover as they would have done back in WW2.
Foot vets are hard to use because you rely can't afford the loses and stay an affective fighting force, but when you do it right, the look on the Cron's players face is priceless

Now THIS is how I want to play Guard.

When my Dad (who was a tank driver) was in the army he always said that infantry always moved up with the tanks.

I didn't think this sort of build was all that viable.

Puscifer wrote:

 Ribon Fox wrote:
"Vets on foot are never the answer"
Now that's not entirely true. Foot vets can work but you have to
A; keep them in cover with the Forward Sentry Doctrine or
B; have them march right behind the LRBT using it as mobile cover as they would have done back in WW2.
Foot vets are hard to use because you rely can't afford the loses and stay an affective fighting force, but when you do it right, the look on the Cron's players face is priceless

Now THIS is how I want to play Guard.

When my Dad (who was a tank driver) was in the army he always said that infantry always moved up with the tanks.

I didn't think this sort of build was all that viable.

If you're going for a highland charge, I'd recommend Platoons. With vets, you tend to have too few scoring bodies that you're paying a premium for, when ultimately they still die like guardsmen.

If you have 8-10 Infantry squads walking up the field behind tanks behind a wall of conscripts (for mobile 5+ cover) you will achieve the desired WWII feel, and not be totally objective-crippled when your opponent kills 20 guardsmen (which is the case with vet squads).

Puscifer wrote:Now THIS is how I want to play Guard.

So, it's possible to run foot vets like this. In my case, I used 6 units of carapace vets and 3 full units of stormtroopers to make the 100-man carapace guard army of hell. You can see an example of how it plays out here.

If you want to run it with tanks, perhaps try something like...

CCS - lascannon, standard

Vets - lascannon, 3x melta, grenadiers
Vets - lascannon, 3x melta, grenadiers
Vets - lascannon, 3x melta, grenadiers
Vets - lascannon, 3x melta, grenadiers
Vets - lascannon, 3x melta, grenadiers
Vets - lascannon, 3x melta, grenadiers

Exterminator - lascannon, pask

Vanquisher - lascannon, multimeltas
Vanquisher - lascannon, multimeltas

Vanquisher - lascannon, multimeltas
Vanquisher - lascannon, multimeltas


At 1850 points you've got a decent amount of infantry that has armor which is proof against small arms and has a withering amount of firepower. Plus, five friggin russes.

I used to run a list smiler to what Ailaros has posted. It can work well (if you have all those meltaguns ). Its a good solid list.

 Ailaros wrote:

Puscifer wrote:Now THIS is how I want to play Guard.

So, it's possible to run foot vets like this. In my case, I used 6 units of carapace vets and 3 full units of stormtroopers to make the 100-man carapace guard army of hell. You can see an example of how it plays out here.

If you want to run it with tanks, perhaps try something like...

CCS - lascannon, standard

Vets - lascannon, 3x melta, grenadiers
Vets - lascannon, 3x melta, grenadiers
Vets - lascannon, 3x melta, grenadiers
Vets - lascannon, 3x melta, grenadiers
Vets - lascannon, 3x melta, grenadiers
Vets - lascannon, 3x melta, grenadiers

Exterminator - lascannon, pask

Vanquisher - lascannon, multimeltas
Vanquisher - lascannon, multimeltas

Vanquisher - lascannon, multimeltas
Vanquisher - lascannon, multimeltas


At 1850 points you've got a decent amount of infantry that has armor which is proof against small arms and has a withering amount of firepower. Plus, five friggin russes.

This... 40,000 times THIS!!!

This is the army I was looking for.

I might have to tweak it slightly, but this is what I want.

Cheers Bud.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Ribon Fox wrote:
I used to run a list smiler to what Ailaros has posted. It can work well (if you have all those meltaguns ). Its a good solid list.

I'll be converting a load to look like Heat Lances from the Flamers in the Infantry Squads.

Thank to everyone for the help.

I should have an army list up later.

I can't wait to try and build this.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Is it a common tactic with IG to try to table the opponent rather than go for objectives?

Generally no.

Guard can put down a lot of killing power, but it also usually has problems concentrating it, what with it being spread across so many units. I've only ever tabled my opponent a handful of times with guard. On the plus side, you've got so many units (many of which are scoring), that it's easier than most armies to play to the objectives.

As for infantry and tank guard armies, I'll whet your appetite with what I've got going on:





Good luck!

 Ailaros wrote:
Generally no.

Guard can put down a lot of killing power, but it also usually has problems concentrating it, what with it being spread across so many units. I've only ever tabled my opponent a handful of times with guard.

With respect, I disagree.

IG can bring more big guns than anyone, and our big guns, unlike Tau or C:SM, are incredibly durable, because glass cannons+Heavy Troops isn't the IG, we're glass troops+Heavy Cannons.

The fact that you bring 5 AV14 tanks to the field is a testament to that. Except you use Leman Russ Vanquishers; more of a scalpel for cutting at your problems, rather than hammering them and everything around them.

IG is, in my opinion, best used as a blunt instrument precisely for smashing your opponent with enough shooting to wipe them off the table. 2/3 of my tourney-round wins this past week were tablings.

Though I applaud you for attempting to use IG as a finesse-army, and I look on interestedly.

-TheCaptain

 TheCaptain wrote:

 Ailaros wrote:
Generally no.

Guard can put down a lot of killing power, but it also usually has problems concentrating it, what with it being spread across so many units. I've only ever tabled my opponent a handful of times with guard.

With respect, I disagree.

IG can bring more big guns than anyone, and our big guns, unlike Tau or C:SM, are incredibly durable, because glass cannons+Heavy Troops isn't the IG, we're glass troops+Heavy Cannons.

The fact that you bring 5 AV14 tanks to the field is a testament to that. Except you use Leman Russ Vanquishers; more of a scalpel for cutting at your problems, rather than hammering them and everything around them.

IG is, in my opinion, best used as a blunt instrument precisely for smashing your opponent with enough shooting to wipe them off the table. 2/3 of my tourney-round wins this past week were tablings.

Though I applaud you for attempting to use IG as a finesse-army, and I look on interestedly.

-TheCaptain

He never really said that. He just said that he has only tabled his opponent a few times, and it's still a good idea to go for objectives.

The original question was if it was a common strategy for the IG to try and table rather than objectives, and he said "generally no" which is the correct response. We commonly can table armies, but it's shouldn't be the primary focus just in case you aren't able to do it. You might have killed majority of his army, but if he just barely holds the objectives you have lost. I have tabled many Space Marine armies and things, but I find it difficult to fully table a Green Tide for instance. If you have read some of Ailaros bat-reps you can tell he doesn't play the "finesse" game too often. My usual strategy is to rush and hold the easily take-able objectives and then unless the horde of guns on my enemy to ensure I keep said objectives. I have a good chance of tabling him, and I assure an objective win.

EDIT: Although, the thing I like about the IG is that we can play finesse surprisingly well despite the typical sledgehammer approach...