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2015/02/18 20:19:31
Subject: Imperial Armour – The Siege of Vraks updated for 7th ed.
Curious if there are any inquisition based formations? I'm trying real hard to dig my codex inquisition out of the gutter and into a competitive environment.
+ Thought of the day + Not even in death does duty end.
2015/02/19 07:49:19
Subject: Imperial Armour – The Siege of Vraks updated for 7th ed.
sudojoe wrote: Curious if there are any inquisition based formations? I'm trying real hard to dig my codex inquisition out of the gutter and into a competitive environment.
No.
I will try and get round to everyone's questions, in addition to my normal job I also have two others that I do for my own amusement/out of the goodness of my heart, I'm just a bit pressed for time right now (and also the baby is teething so "sleep" is currently just a word in the dictionary). #firstworldproblems
Ex-Mantic Rules Committees: Kings of War, Warpath
"The Emperor is obviously not a dictator, he's a couch." Starbuck: "Why can't we use the starboard launch bays?"
Engineer: "Because it's a gift shop!"
2015/02/19 09:30:50
Subject: Imperial Armour – The Siege of Vraks updated for 7th ed.
sudojoe wrote: Curious if there are any inquisition based formations? I'm trying real hard to dig my codex inquisition out of the gutter and into a competitive environment.
No.
I will try and get round to everyone's questions, in addition to my normal job I also have two others that I do for my own amusement/out of the goodness of my heart, I'm just a bit pressed for time right now (and also the baby is teething so "sleep" is currently just a word in the dictionary). #firstworldproblems
Hah, don't worry. We're just eager to know if our favourite armies have been improved or nerfed. I'm sure we'll get more info from less reputable sources in the coming weeks anyway, so don't stress yourself out. I won't buy it until I know more about the Siege Regiment anyway.
I'm also curious why Hector Rex still has WS4. I figure that a great hero of the imperium would have WS5, especially considering that plenty of other humans with WS5 exists.
~5000 points of IG and DKoK
I'm awful at reading private messages, so just reply to the threads I'm visiting.
2015/02/19 09:54:33
Subject: Imperial Armour – The Siege of Vraks updated for 7th ed.
Someone over at 4chan answered a few questions, so I'll just paste them here. I also included a few notes of my own, which the author confirmed (e.g. the Conqueror Cannon, Hydra targeting system).
Spoiler:
ALLIES FOR DEATH KORPS: Battle Brothers: Imp Guard Elysian D-99 Space Marines, Space Wolves Sisters of Battle Imperial Knights Inquisition Allies of Convenience: Grey Knights Blood Angels, Dark Angels All others: Come the Apocolypse
WARGEAR: Acid Gas Bombs: Unusual, Range 8", StrX, AP6, Poisoned 4+, Ignores Covers, Assault 1, Blast
Battle Scope: Night Vision for unit
Mole Launcher: 8-24" Range, Str5, AP5, Heavy 1, Blade, Subterranean Barrage (Indirect only, lowest AV always), Strikedown
Vox is same as IG dex
Vehicle gear is Vehicle Gear
Death Korps: WS 4 Goodness, Immune to Fear, don't take Morale check for 25% casualties in Shooting/Movement phases.
Iron Discipline: Officers only, any unit within 6" of any Krieg Officer can regroup at unmodified Leadership.
NEW ORDERS (or old ones) SENIOR OFFICER ORDERS: Duty unto Death: Reroll failed Leadership checks until next controlling player Shooting Phase, if you get double 1's the unit is Fearless instead.
Bring it Down, Get Back into the Fight.
JUNIOR OFFICER ORDERS: Dig In: +1 Cover save granted by terrain until next turn (not fortification), minimum 6+, can't run or charge.
First Rank Fire, Second Rank Fire
Clear the Trenches: Lasguns are Assault 2, Range 12". Unit also gets Move Through Cover.
WARLORD TRAITS:
1. UNFLINCHING DEFENSE: +1 to Combat Resolution for Assaults in their own Deployment Zone 2. SHATTERING BOMBARDMENT: Select a weapon with 6" of the Warlord each shooting phase that has Ordnance. It's Twin-Linked. 3. VICTORY OR DEATH: Feel no Pain 6+ and Fearless while in cover in Fortifications or a Defense Line for Warlord and Unit. 4. SMOKE BARRAGE: Night Fighting if the Krieg Player wishes. 5. MARTYR'S DEFENSE: Warlord and Death Korps units within 6" get PE (Infantry) while in friendly deployment zone. 6. SIEGE MASTER: Select a piece of terrain in the enemy deployment zone (not fortification). It's cover save is at -1.
Master of Ordnance and Officer of the Fleet same as IG book, as far as abilities go. They are BS4 and 20 Points each, though. I don't recall if they are BS4 in the IG book.
Commisar-general has same Summary Execution as IG Commisars now.
Also of note: NO Astropath available to DK Command Squads.
Commisar-general and DK Quartermaster both have Chain of Command, can't be Warlord if you have a model with the Senior Officer rule.
Hydra lost Auto-targeting. [NOTE: SECOND TO LAST LINE]
Move Through Cover Extremely Bulky Hammer of Wrath Tunneling (If at least one model has this rule, the unit may chose move through the ground in the Movement or Assault Phase. If not, move/charge as normal.) -TUNNELING: MOVEMENT PHASE: Unit may move up to 12" in any direction, ignoring terrain or models it would pass though during that move. Final position cannot be within impassible terrain or 2" of an enemy model. The unit gains a 4+ invul save until the Controlling Player's next Movement Phase, and may not charge or run that turn. -TUNNELING: ASSAULT PHASE: When charging a unit with Tunelling, roll an additional d6 but use the lowest dice to determine final result. Over-watch may not be fired and the unit ignores all terrain/battlefield effects and counts as having Assault Grenades. The Hades Breaching Drill also makes d6+2 HoW hits using the Melta-cutter profile if it used the Tunneling Assault move. If the drill charges a building/fortification, roll a d6 for each enemy model in the building. On a 4+. they take a Str 4 AP2 Hit. - Subterranean Assault (Must Start in reserves, is attached to unit who bought it I think, deploys via Deep Strike. On turn it Deep Strikes, gains a 4+ invul save) Specialist Equipment (Attached to DK Engineer unit, counts as casualty but not additional VP, if all the Engineers die it goes too.)
Minor changes: Vehicles that got prices lowered in the IG book also got them lowered here.
The Conqueror is 115 points. Fast AV14? Jesus Christ how Horrifying. [NOTE: S8 AP3 heavy 1, small blast], also has Co-axial Storm Bolter
The Siege List lost the Navy Squadrons. Feels bad.
OTHER WEAPON CHANGES (because they got removed from the main IG dex, forgeworld said feth it apparently)
COLOSSUS: STRENGTH 8, AP 3, LARGE BLAST, IGNORES COVER, PINNING
WAIT I LIED, THE HYDRA STILL HAS AUTO-TARGETING. Goodbye Jink Saves.
APPARENTLY THE MELTA-CUTTER is Str: User, AP 1, Melee, Shred, Armourbane. So those Hammer of Wrath Hits reroll.
So, since his "minor changes" does not include points drop for anything else, it seems that we're stuck with 7 points guardsmen and 12 points grenadiers, but this is only me guessing. Sigh, the Renegades list looks so much more appealing, especially considering all their fancy tactics and detachments. And what we do we get? A fluffy but pretty bad Death Rider one and another one which basically forces you to use Gorgons. Hooray.
This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2015/02/19 15:15:31
~5000 points of IG and DKoK
I'm awful at reading private messages, so just reply to the threads I'm visiting.
2015/02/19 15:22:03
Subject: Re:Imperial Armour – The Siege of Vraks updated for 7th ed.
Aenarian wrote: Sigh, the Renegades list looks so much more appealing, especially considering all their fancy tactics and detachments.
Personally, as the owner of a small/medium Renegade force, the Purge formation is pretty much the only thing I find appealing about the book!
Ex-Mantic Rules Committees: Kings of War, Warpath
"The Emperor is obviously not a dictator, he's a couch." Starbuck: "Why can't we use the starboard launch bays?"
Engineer: "Because it's a gift shop!"
2015/02/19 15:41:56
Subject: Re:Imperial Armour – The Siege of Vraks updated for 7th ed.
I guess the Unending Host requires a large amount of infantry, so it would be unfeasible for anyone without a large collection of renegades, but it still has a neat special rule. The same goes with The Purge. I personally probably wouldn't use Unending Host due to the slot limitations, but the other one looks cool.
Don't misinterpret my whining, I like the fluffiness of both Krieg formations as well as the army itself, but it's simply not enough. The Death Riders Formation are nice if you wanted to have a mounted CCS, but the Gorgon one? Gorgons are already weak, especially for DKoK as we lack Combined Squads, but they are far too expensive for a hard to destroy transport without any firepower of note when you consider what kind of units will ride in them. Renegades get cool new Demagogues and is from what I've seen a decent list, but Krieg still suffers from basic infantry that is overcosted by 10-20 points, boring warlord traits and perhaps most of all, no way to build a competitive army that adheres to its own lore. Yes, you can spam artillery and they would probably win the fight for you, but massed infantry will become a liability. As someone said, the attrition focused army simply cannot win a battle of attrition because they are so few in numbers.
But hey, maybe the Heavy Weapons in troops aren't paying a fething tax for being troops anymore. The Emperor knows that the unit needs it since nobody will ever take HWT in a HS when they can get Earthshaker Carriages.
This message was edited 4 times. Last update was at 2015/02/19 15:44:32
~5000 points of IG and DKoK
I'm awful at reading private messages, so just reply to the threads I'm visiting.
2015/02/19 17:26:50
Subject: Re:Imperial Armour – The Siege of Vraks updated for 7th ed.
The rules for the new Hades breaching drill sound kinda strong. I guess it makes the engineers a powerful assault unit. And the 4++ is nice as well.
Are you sure btw the conqueror is a fast tank now? Dropping the lumbering behemoth rule was one thing, but being a fast vehicle type would make it a nice unit.
The Conqueror is fast in IA13, so I don't see why it wouldn't be in Vraks. I wonder if the Drill is all that good though, as it suffers from certain rules. You roll against majority weapon skill, so it'll be able to defend itself, but you also roll against majority toughness, so in reality it would be T3 during combat. It'll probably mash a few enemies with S8, Ap1 and shred, but can the unit last?
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2015/02/19 18:35:49
~5000 points of IG and DKoK
I'm awful at reading private messages, so just reply to the threads I'm visiting.
2015/02/19 20:27:56
Subject: Re:Imperial Armour – The Siege of Vraks updated for 7th ed.
The drill is only good if you get the charge against small elite units and vehicles. But against those the thing is brutal, its HoW attacks decimating most of the things in this game on average.
2015/02/19 21:14:27
Subject: Imperial Armour – The Siege of Vraks updated for 7th ed.
I've spent the last few months compiling rules questions to email Forgeworld regarding IA13 (and now the Vraks book). I am up to 13 questions already. If anyone has any questions to add before I send the email off tonight, feel free to add them here.
Yes. 12 points per model, same rules as the update pdf.
There is no such thing as a hobby without politics. "Leave politics at the door" is itself a political statement, an endorsement of the status quo and an attempt to silence dissenting voices.
2015/02/20 15:59:59
Subject: Imperial Armour – The Siege of Vraks updated for 7th ed.
I had a realization today; people have mentioned Conquerers being 115 points and fast, with their improved main gun (hallelujeah) but what about the Leman Russ Annihilator? It was the first "budget" russ, but now it's actually more expensive than several,better variants. I'm curious to see if it's been changed in Vraks.
Therefore, I conclude, Valve should announce Half Life 2: Episode 3.
2015/02/20 18:22:29
Subject: Imperial Armour – The Siege of Vraks updated for 7th ed.
Well compared to the Siege Army list you can still download from the site, there aren't a lot of changes really. I suppose we should expect the Siege Army list PDF to be taken down pretty soon.
Heavy Weapon Squads as tropps are now 60 pts each.
They've completely rewritten the Hades Breaching Drill. It's now Infantry with 3 wounds, toughness 7 and 3+ save. It's also a lot more reliable when it Deep Strikes and it may continue to tunnel after it has been deployed from reserves. I think it has been improved considerably, mostly because it appears to have been made more reliable (and less likely to get lost). The Hades no longer arrive by template and doesn't tankshock or displace enemy models, and when it assaults, the Hades makes D6+2 Hammer of Wrath attacks.
They've included a list of Lords of War tanks and aircraft available to a Siege army, and reprinted the profiles for the various versions of the Macharius heavy tank for some reason. The rules for the Gorgon are not included, even though it's used in the "Krieg Gorgon Assault Squadron - Battle-Forged Detachment".
The "Imperial Navy Air Support Squadron" is absent. Which means you will need IA-Aeronautica I suppose.
You also have access to two battle-forged detachments, the "Krieg Death Rider Squadron" and "Krieg Gorgon Assault Squadron". I think they've already been described fairly accurately in this forum. The Gorgon Assault Squadron lets you have 1-3 Lords of War, all of which need to be Gorgons.
Overall the Warlord traits and the orders are neat, maybe a little underwhelming. FW has adjusted the costs of Battletanks according to the changes introduced by AMIG last year, but commissars are still 30 pts.
Many of the options available in the Assault Brigade list, were not carried over to the Siege Regiment list. Assault Brigade has access to a variety of regimental standards, which I was hoping they would include in the Siege list. The Carcass Munitions from IA12 weren't reused either. In short, Carcass shots made shotguns and heavy mortars Shred and Gets Hot.
2015/02/20 18:25:51
Subject: Re:Imperial Armour – The Siege of Vraks updated for 7th ed.
Have the heavy weapons/power weapons (incl. power fists) upgrade costs been increased?
What are the stats of the Death Rider Company Commander, and is he a X points mandatory upgrade required for the Death Rider Detachment, or simply a bonus?
Appreciate all your help!
~5000 points of IG and DKoK
I'm awful at reading private messages, so just reply to the threads I'm visiting.
2015/02/20 18:31:00
Subject: Re:Imperial Armour – The Siege of Vraks updated for 7th ed.
MajorStoffer wrote: I had a realization today; people have mentioned Conquerers being 115 points and fast, with their improved main gun (hallelujeah) but what about the Leman Russ Annihilator? It was the first "budget" russ, but now it's actually more expensive than several,better variants. I'm curious to see if it's been changed in Vraks.
The Annihilator is still 150. The Conqueror is 115 as you said. In the new Vraks book, there's no mentioning of Executioner Plasma Cannon getting hot. At 170 pts, the Demolisher is now the most expensive battletank. The Vanquisher is only 135 (the co-axial heavy stubber is still +15 pts).
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Aenarian wrote: Have the heavy weapons/power weapons (incl. power fists) upgrade costs been increased?
What are the stats of the Death Rider Company Commander, and is he a X points mandatory upgrade required for the Death Rider Detachment, or simply a bonus?
Appreciate all your help!
Compared to the Siege List PDF, the cost of heavy weapon squads as part of platoons have been reduced to 60 pts (in the PDF they're listed at 75 pts.).
All other costs are the same as in the downloadable Siege list. Heavy weapons are only available for the Company Command Squad (heavy bolter, autocannon, twin-linked heavy stubber), Grenadiers (heavy flamer), Engineers (heavy flamer, mole launcher), Heavy Weapons Sqd. The Heavy Weapons Sqd can be picked as either Troops or Heavy Support.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/02/20 18:45:11
2015/02/20 19:04:05
Subject: Re:Imperial Armour – The Siege of Vraks updated for 7th ed.
MajorStoffer wrote: I had a realization today; people have mentioned Conquerers being 115 points and fast, with their improved main gun (hallelujeah) but what about the Leman Russ Annihilator? It was the first "budget" russ, but now it's actually more expensive than several,better variants. I'm curious to see if it's been changed in Vraks.
They've seemed intent on messing the Annihilator up for years. They initially debuted it at 130pts, but in every list they made it available in they printed it at 150pts, reprinted it again at 130pts in its own entry, then kept making it 150pts in every list they made it available in.
I think there's a good amount of laziness going on there with bad copy-pasitng. Much like with the Rapier Laser Destroyer, I emailed them about if it should be AP1 or AP2 as it appears as AP1 in some books and AP2 in other books, and they're response was "well....we don't really have a clarification, we just use whatever the book says in the office". I'm sitting here thinking "...didn't your office *write* this stuff?"
IRON WITHIN, IRON WITHOUT.
New Heavy Gear Log! Also...Grey Knights! The correct pronunciation is Imperial Guard and Stormtroopers, "Astra Militarum" and "Tempestus Scions" are something you'll find at Hogwarts.
2015/02/20 19:10:10
Subject: Imperial Armour – The Siege of Vraks updated for 7th ed.
Opera wrote: They don't even sell the Conqueror turret anymore but have released two books recently with updated rules...
They've stopped selling Hydras (both tanks and platforms) as well, but they're still included in the new Vraks book. Which is great for the people who bought them while they were still around, and not so great for the rest of us. If I want to use a Hydra platform, how am I supposed to represent it on the battlefield?
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/02/20 19:21:24
2015/02/20 19:22:23
Subject: Re:Imperial Armour – The Siege of Vraks updated for 7th ed.
It's a pity really, it would be great if they had some consistency, especially considering that the last book is only a few months old and had the Annihilator at 130 (with BS3).
I hope that the stats are consistent within the book at least, so we don't have DKoK Rapiers with AP2 and Heretic Rapiers with AP1.
Anyway, to venture a little off topic, I have ~£250 to spend on new units for my DKoK army. Any recommendations on what I should buy?
~5000 points of IG and DKoK
I'm awful at reading private messages, so just reply to the threads I'm visiting.
2015/02/20 20:37:12
Subject: Imperial Armour – The Siege of Vraks updated for 7th ed.
If this has already been answered, sorry, a search didn't find it for me. Do the Red Scorpions get anything in this book?
"Through the darkness of future past, the magician longs to see.
One chants out between two worlds: Fire, walk with me." - Twin Peaks
"You listen to me. While I will admit to a certain cynicism, the fact is that I am a naysayer and hatchetman in the fight against violence. I pride myself in taking a punch and I'll gladly take another because I choose to live my life in the company of Gandhi and King. My concerns are global. I reject absolutely revenge, aggression, and retaliation. The foundation of such a method... is love. I love you Sheriff Truman." - Twin Peaks
2015/02/20 20:48:05
Subject: Imperial Armour – The Siege of Vraks updated for 7th ed.
Member of 
DKoK Blog:
Have a look, I guarantee you will not see greyer armies, EVER! Now with at least 4 shades of grey
~5000 points of IG and DKoK 
3000
4000 
