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Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut






New Orleans, LA

 Frankenberry wrote:
How is this even still a discussion? The OP clearly states that the store he can get the discount from DOESNT HAVE A PLACE TO PLAY - there isn't a moral grey area here, it's a non-issue because both stores aren't equal in that regard.

If they were, 'play where you pay' would actually be applicable.


And then he plays at the other place. Did you miss that. He is not paying where he plays.


DA:70S+G+M+B++I++Pw40k08+D++A++/fWD-R+T(M)DM+
 
   
Made in us
Boosting Space Marine Biker





Independence MO

 Frankenberry wrote:
How is this even still a discussion? The OP clearly states that the store he can get the discount from DOESNT HAVE A PLACE TO PLAY - there isn't a moral grey area here, it's a non-issue because both stores aren't equal in that regard.

If they were, 'play where you pay' would actually be applicable.


Thing is he implicitly said it wasn't about a place to play. I see buying the stuff upstairs and going into GW to play as no different than getting stuff online and going in to play. That's perfectly reasonable, otherwise ForgeWorld and online only stuff you ordered to your house should likewise not be allowed.

However this is about buying stuff one place and then going elsewhere to open it, assemble it and paint it. That's a slap in the face to the gw manager who can blatantly see you come in with product bought elsewhere, and taking up his guaranteed limited space.

It's rude to the store staff and it's rude to the customers who choose to buy their stuff there if you're giving literally nothing back to the store.

If you bought the stuff online or elsewhere build/paint it at home, or at least buy the supplies (glue etc.) From the place who's space you're taking up.


Armies:
32,000 points (Blood Ravens) 2500 (and growing) 1850
 drunken0elf wrote:

PPl who optimise their list as if they're heading to a tournament when in reality you're just gonna play a game for fun at your FLGS are bascially the Kanye West equivalent or 40K.
 
   
Made in us
Douglas Bader






 Chapter Master Angelos wrote:
It's rude to the store staff and it's rude to the customers who choose to buy their stuff there if you're giving literally nothing back to the store.


Except the store in this case isn't a separate entity, it's part of GW. Talking about it as an individual store is like saying how, when you're at the grocery store, there's a moral difference between going to cash register #2 and cash register #7.

There is no such thing as a hobby without politics. "Leave politics at the door" is itself a political statement, an endorsement of the status quo and an attempt to silence dissenting voices. 
   
Made in au
Lady of the Lake






 chromedog wrote:
 n0t_u wrote:
If this is good games sydney they were there before the gw moved into the basement like space under them if I remember right so don't feel bad. That being said I don't play in either, the GW isn't local enough for me to play in thus I haven't really set foot in it, but I have been to that GG to pick up stuff a couple of times like dice or deck boxes.


Um, other way around, dude. The GW moved their store into that downstairs location when upstairs was a SF bookshop called "Galaxy" (I was there for the opening of both - GW moved across from the Hilton basement arcade because they were redeveloping the hotel site). It was where their FIRST "Battle bunker" in the country was located back in the late 90s. It also picked up the crowd from another store when the Matraville store closed (just prior to Apocalypse first coming out).

After Galaxy relocated, it became a music store, and after THAT closed down, GG started up in that venue as an expansion from their only other CBD store (railway square). Marty from that store got his start up here as a local boy. Props to Marty for building that crowd up.


Shows how often I go out there then, my bad.

   
Made in au
Anti-Armour Swiss Guard






Newcastle, OZ

 Frankenberry wrote:
How is this even still a discussion? The OP clearly states that the store he can get the discount from DOESNT HAVE A PLACE TO PLAY - there isn't a moral grey area here, it's a non-issue because both stores aren't equal in that regard.



If it was the Sydney CBD GW and the Good Games upstairs, then that GG store DOES have gaming space - miniature games have specific days when they get priority - tables, Boards, terrain, the works. If GW stopped doing the Battle bunker thing, I think it might even have MORE playing space (they've had at least 5 games of infinity going at once on days that I've been in (thursdays) and that uses about 2-3 times as much terrain as 40k or AoS, and it still doesn't use ALL of it).
Sure, weekends are going to be full of magic:the cash cow players, but that's pretty much how games stores stay afloat these days. They tend to have friday/saturdays for those (release days tend to be then at least).

I'm OVER 50 (and so far over everyone's BS, too).
Old enough to know better, young enough to not give a ****.

That is not dead which can eternal lie ...

... and yet, with strange aeons, even death may die.
 
   
Made in au
Speed Drybrushing





Newcastle NSW

Notice how its the same people saying its fine to buy your stuff elsewhere and then put them together in GW that are saying GW hasn't gotten better in the last year in the other post.

Not a GW apologist  
   
Made in nl
Dakka Veteran





 Yodhrin wrote:
terry wrote:
 Yodhrin wrote:
 Inquisitor Gideon wrote:
 Yodhrin wrote:
"Low thing to do" - horse manure.

If GW choose to offer access to their painting or gaming tables without restriction, that's their choice, nobody is obligated to give them money if they also choose not to compete on price. If they want people to pay/buy something to use them, make that the policy and enforce it, otherwise both they and the rest of us should have nothing to say on the matter.


Of course it's the low thing to do. You don't buy a product from a store and then walk into a competing store and use their facilities to use the product. You should be kicked out for that. And as far as I was aware, it was there policy barring manager discretion. It's because of situations like this we lost the ability to use store supplied paints and materials.


Is it allowed? Then it's not a low thing to do, it's allowed. Is it not allowed? The issue is moot since it's not allowed and so won't happen.

There is no rational way to argue the OP's scenario would somehow be immoral because the scenario can only occur if his actions are considered permissable by the "competing store", and if they're fine with it what's it to do with you?

just because something is allowed, doesn't mean it isn't low


What?

This literally isn't even arguable, so I can't fathom how some of you have managed to convince yourself that it is.

If a store doesn't want people to use their tables, painting or gaming, with product purchased elsewhere they are entirely free and within their rights to make table use conditional on whatever terms they choose. They are entirely in control of the situation. So how on earth do you twist that so it's a customer's fault if they choose not to impose any conditions?

Particularly given we're talking about a GW store here, which are ostensibly supposed to be more than mere retail outlets, places designed to encourage and develop people's involvement with the hobby. I mean crikey, you guys realise that if we follow your hilarious "logic", then someone who gets GW models as a Christmas present that their family/friends bought from GW's own webstore online, they would be being "low" if they went in to a GW store for some painting lessons? That it would mean a regular GW customer who spends a fortune on the hobby would be being "low" if they went to the local GW's game night with their Death Korps of Krieg army from Forgeworld?

Get a haud o' yersels.

I never said you should buy everything at the place where you play/hobby, I just said that just because something is allowed, it doesn't mean its not low. So in other words, as far as I know, its not illegal to fart in someones face, but that doesn't mean its ok to do it. But if you play at a store I think you should support it, because even a GW store needs to make money if it wants to stay.

 
   
Made in gb
Longtime Dakkanaut





Nottingham

 Deathklaat wrote:
It is your hobby and your money, you are not obligated to buy where you play. I find it really strange that GW both distributes and sell their own product in their own store. The FLGS has to buy their product from GW at a discount and then resells it to cover their costs and overhead, whereas the GW store makes a much larger profit that goes straight to them. Yes they have overhead costs for the store but in the end they make a greater profit than your FLGS.


That's actually not true. In traditional retail chains you'd be right, but the turnover in gw stores is so low that they are better off selling at a discount and not incurring the overheads. I worked in one of the busier uk stores, (multi man, 7 day opening) and we couldn't take in a week what I used to turn over in a day when I managed a shoe shop. The only reason they haven't closed them all together is because they are very good for recruitment, which leads to tables...

I'd just be aware that no one has an entitlement to anything beyond what their money has purchased, so if you do go and use the tables, it's only an issue if you make one should they ask you not too.

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Made in gb
Major




London

 Rolsheen wrote:
Notice how its the same people saying its fine to buy your stuff elsewhere and then put them together in GW that are saying GW hasn't gotten better in the last year in the other post.


Notice how people who say it's immoral and wrong all say that GW has improved and is the bestest now?

I never play or have ever played in a GW, but buy where you like. GW want people buying direct they should work for it and not rely on guilt tripping.
   
Made in gb
Stone Bonkers Fabricator General




We'll find out soon enough eh.

 kronk wrote:
 Frankenberry wrote:
How is this even still a discussion? The OP clearly states that the store he can get the discount from DOESNT HAVE A PLACE TO PLAY - there isn't a moral grey area here, it's a non-issue because both stores aren't equal in that regard.

If they were, 'play where you pay' would actually be applicable.


And then he plays at the other place. Did you miss that. He is not paying where he plays.



And that's only possible because the place where he plays allows that. Did you miss that? Because it seems everyone still seems to be sailing calmly past that one rather significant point - GW are the ones who control this situation, so if they're OK with it, what bloody right do any of you lot think you have to try and shame someone for going along with them to save themselves a bit of money?

Seriously, that's an actual question, I want a logical, rational explanation for why a customer is at fault for doing something that a store doesn't prevent them from doing. Not appeals to emotion about the poor, suffering GW staff member, not constantly restating the limitations you choose to impose on yourselves as if it makes you morally superior: explain how it is objectively wrong to take a GW product to a GW store to model, paint, and play with irrespective of where the product was bought, given it is evidently not GW company policy to prevent such behaviour.

Then explain how any such argument would not also apply to people who buy from the GW webstore rather than the local GW store, or from FW rather than the local GW store, or who get given models as gifts by people who didn't buy at the local GW store, and given that it would necessarily apply to all those, explain why you're still desperately clinging to this fallacious nonsense of an idea.

EDIT: And that was a general "you", it's not aimed at kronk specifically.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2016/11/26 10:01:15


I need to acquire plastic Skavenslaves, can you help?
I have a blog now, evidently. Featuring the Alternative Mordheim Model Megalist.

"Your society's broken, so who should we blame? Should we blame the rich, powerful people who caused it? No, lets blame the people with no power and no money and those immigrants who don't even have the vote. Yea, it must be their fething fault." - Iain M Banks
-----
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Made in de
Primus





Palmerston North

 Fenrir Kitsune wrote:
 Rolsheen wrote:
Notice how its the same people saying its fine to buy your stuff elsewhere and then put them together in GW that are saying GW hasn't gotten better in the last year in the other post.


Notice how people who say it's immoral and wrong all say that GW has improved and is the bestest now?


Why add on 'is the bestest now'?

Claiming that GW have improved and GW are the bestest are very different things.

In regards to the OP, I think it just depend on what you want. If you like having gaming and/or building space, then they should support the shop that offers that.

I like having a local place that offers gaming space, so I try to get what I want from them first before looking elsewhere.
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut





USA

 kronk wrote:
 Frankenberry wrote:
How is this even still a discussion? The OP clearly states that the store he can get the discount from DOESNT HAVE A PLACE TO PLAY - there isn't a moral grey area here, it's a non-issue because both stores aren't equal in that regard.

If they were, 'play where you pay' would actually be applicable.


And then he plays at the other place. Did you miss that. He is not paying where he plays.



Maybe I wrote that wrong, what I was trying to say was:

They said they 'pay' at the store with the discount
Said store doesn't have a place to 'play'
Other store has an area to play but no discount
So making the argument they should 'play where they plays' doesn't make sense because they can't

What I'm trying to say I guess is that there isn't a moral aspect to this dilemma because both stores aren't equal in their ability to provide a gaming area. If they were, I could at least understand the need for the discussion.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2016/11/26 10:29:40


Shadowkeepers (4000 points)
3rd Company (3000 points) 
   
Made in us
Regular Dakkanaut




I think Pay where you Play and this is a little different, if only because the product you are purchasing in that one store is still supporting the company that owns the other! Compare situations.

FLGS 1: You play here.

FLGS 2 : You pay here.

You play with your GW products at 1 but you spend your money at 2. You support 1 in no way.

GW Store: You play here.

FLGS: You pay here.

You may be spending your money at the FLGS, but it is a GW product, and thus you are supporting the company that runs the GW Store. Doesn't really help that store as much, but a healthy company is good for the retail locations.

The real head-scratcher is how the FLGS is able to offer a discount when the GW Store is right below them. If anything you'd normally expect something as direct as a GW store to be the one with the big discounts.

So I guess I am saying is that Pay Where You Play is a wonderful rule but especially in this circumstance it is a lot more grey. I'd just as the manager. If the place above has been around for a while with that discount, no doubt the GW Store Manager has been asked before.

For those who reply: I have never been to a GW Store, so I apologize if my ignorance is showing.

   
Made in gb
Arch Magos w/ 4 Meg of RAM





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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/01/15 02:21:04


Bye bye Dakkadakka, happy hobbying! I really enjoyed my time on here. Opinions were always my own :-) 
   
Made in gb
Stern Iron Priest with Thrall Bodyguard



UK

 Rolsheen wrote:
Notice how its the same people saying its fine to buy your stuff elsewhere and then put them together in GW that are saying GW hasn't gotten better in the last year in the other post.


GW gets the money either way it's not like he's buying 2nd hand then taking it to an independent store, neither option the OP presents harm's GW because they are still making 700% profit given it costs them pennies per sprue.

It's actually immoral to pay more than you have to in this case as your inflicting harm on yourself by paying retail and not getting the discount, the faceless corporation gets its money either way.
   
Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut





Hyperspace

 Peregrine wrote:
 Chapter Master Angelos wrote:
It's rude to the store staff and it's rude to the customers who choose to buy their stuff there if you're giving literally nothing back to the store.


Except the store in this case isn't a separate entity, it's part of GW. Talking about it as an individual store is like saying how, when you're at the grocery store, there's a moral difference between going to cash register #2 and cash register #7.

Presumably he's referring to the fact that he likes his manager and wants him to keep his job, rather than being worried that he's not giving GW as a whole his money.

Directed to people with similar posts:
It is not "bad" to buy things from stores other than your local GW. I try to save money wherever possible, but still buy paint, the occasional box set and direct only stuff from there because the community and my manager are pleasant (other than his FW Policy, which is understandable but annoying), and I view buying stuff from him as directly supporting him and his store.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2016/11/26 13:42:10




Peregrine - If you like the army buy it, and don't worry about what one random person on the internet thinks.
 
   
Made in au
Unstoppable Bloodthirster of Khorne





Melbourne .au

 Deathklaat wrote:
I find it really strange that GW both distributes and sell their own product in their own store.


You mean really strange like Apple, Microsoft, Sony, Disney and any number of other "branded" stores?

As for the OP - buy what you want from where you want. But honestly, pay where you play and perhaps buy the bigger kits from upstairs but assemble them at home. Despite the pile of internet tough guy/contrarians/Cartman "I do what I want" types here, you clearly feel that it's the wrong thing to do or you wouldn't have posted the question here.



 Deathklaat wrote:
i think spikey bits did a review on paintbrushes and the W+N are fairly equal to GW's one line of brushes. If someone gives you flack over that tell them to go pound sand.


If you're essentially in their house and you tell them or anyone else there to "pound sand" then they have every right to tell you to feth right off out of there.

Having said that, a few points:
W&N gak all over GW's brushes which are merely decent. Regardless of what some reviewer says. Internet reviews said that Army Painter brushes were good as well and they're hot garbage.
You can probably get away with non-GW brushes, though.

However.
Remember you're in a GW retail environment. I personally wouldn't bring non-GW paints in with the exceptions of, say, older GW paints and perhaps a small supplement of some odd homebrew paints/mixes and mediums.

I personally use way more Vallejo than GW these days, though I do still use GW, AP, Warpaints, Reaper, P3, etc, etc. But if in a GW store it's a dickish move to bring in your Vallejo or Army Painter sets. If you want more freedom to paint and build anything you like, set up a painting day with some guys at your place. It can actually be quite a lot of fun, and you're free to watch/listen to/use/drink/eat anything you like.

OTOH, If you want the companionship of working in a GW store, then respect it as you would anyone else's house. When I had a local GW, I'd buy paint and WD there as needed, as well as the odd blister or box, but it wasn't my main go-to for GW shopping. But then it was a tangential space in my hobby existence at best. I never went in there to play or paint, but would sometimes meet my wife at that mall after we both finished work to do some shopping, and as I worked much closer to the mall would kill time in there, and often enjoyed using my waiting time to chat and help people out with their painting and modelling. Always wished I had my own brushes with me (and clean water!) instead of other people's messed-up brushes but hey! So I do understand the enjoyment of painting in a store with others.

Just remember that the managers of those GW stores are under a lot of pressure to meet sales targets, and their jobs are pretty much always on the line. You don't sound like a FTW (in either sense) guy, so just respect the little community that you seem to have there.



 TheAuldGrump wrote:
Hmmm, I have an odd question to add - why paint at the GW?
Me, I paint all sorts of places, including fast food restaurants. (And run games in the food court at the mall.)
I am generally of the 'Pay Where You Play' mindset - and that includes eating at the place where I am painting.


I'm going to say that the GW has the community and other people that share the hobby. Also, I've read quite a few times that you paint at your local Burger King (or White Castle? one of those) - which is cool that you have that thing going locally - but you also have to recognise that it's far from usual right to the point of weirdness and likely to attract unwanted attention of the especially unpleasant sort in a lot of places around.



 Yodhrin wrote:

Seriously, that's an actual question, I want a logical, rational explanation for why a customer is at fault for doing something that a store doesn't prevent them from doing. Not appeals to emotion about the poor, suffering GW staff member, not constantly restating the limitations you choose to impose on yourselves as if it makes you morally superior: explain how it is objectively wrong to take a GW product to a GW store to model, paint, and play with irrespective of where the product was bought, given it is evidently not GW company policy to prevent such behaviour.


Put aside your righteous internet hate of GW as a corporation for a moment. Then look up affective empathy and imagine the full application of it in relation to the humans in the store, particularly the manager, who he has specifically said he likes and is a nice guy. Use your skills at cognitive empathy to do so.

If that fails and you can only think in terms of direct benefit to yourself and no-one else, than use Bottle's logic of wanting to keep the venue open and available as written above.



 Frankenberry wrote:

Maybe I wrote that wrong, what I was trying to say was:

They said they 'pay' at the store with the discount
Said store doesn't have a place to 'play'
Other store has an area to play but no discount
So making the argument they should 'play where they plays' doesn't make sense because they can't

What I'm trying to say I guess is that there isn't a moral aspect to this dilemma because both stores aren't equal in their ability to provide a gaming area. If they were, I could at least understand the need for the discussion.


You're being deliberately obtuse. Despite the two stores "inequality", he absolutely can "pay where he plays" (which is the more common phraseology). He just needs to change where he pays.

"pay where you play" = "play where you pay". Having a discount or table space is very specifically not a part of that equation, especially as it's the usual argument used between online shopping at a larger discount than a FLGS.

This message was edited 5 times. Last update was at 2016/11/26 22:41:20


   
Made in ru
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Long story short, whatever you do with your money, as long as you don't break any laws, is not wrong.

Progress is like a herd of pigs: everybody is interested in the produced benefits, but nobody wants to deal with all the resulting gak.

GW customers deserve every bit of outrageous princing they get. 
   
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Fixture of Dakka




 Korinov wrote:
Long story short, whatever you do with your money, as long as you don't break any laws, is not wrong.


You are correct. It doesn't make it wrong. Thing is, it doesn't make it right either. In the end what makes it right or wrong is the person who this applies to. If the original poster thinks it's ok, then it's ok,. If he/she thinks it wrong, then it's wrong. Him/her even asking if it's ok answers it right there. He/she thinks it's wrong otherwise he/she wouldn't be asking.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2016/11/27 00:08:50


Agies Grimm:The "Learn to play, bro" mentality is mostly just a way for someone to try to shame you by implying that their metaphorical nerd-wiener is bigger than yours. Which, ironically, I think nerds do even more vehemently than jocks.

Everything is made up and the points don't matter. 40K or Who's Line is it Anyway?

Auticus wrote: Or in summation: its ok to exploit shoddy points because those are rules and gamers exist to find rules loopholes (they are still "legal"), but if the same force can be composed without structure, it emotionally feels "wrong".  
   
Made in au
Unstoppable Bloodthirster of Khorne





Melbourne .au

 Korinov wrote:
Long story short, whatever you do with your money, as long as you don't break any laws, is not wrong.


Something can be legal but still wrong, and vice-versa. There are plenty of examples of unjust and "wrong" laws from all eras right up to today, but I'll just say "Godwin" and end that little tangential argument before it goes any further.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2016/11/27 00:20:28


   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut





USA

 Azazelx wrote:
 Frankenberry wrote:

Maybe I wrote that wrong, what I was trying to say was:

They said they 'pay' at the store with the discount
Said store doesn't have a place to 'play'
Other store has an area to play but no discount
So making the argument they should 'play where they plays' doesn't make sense because they can't

What I'm trying to say I guess is that there isn't a moral aspect to this dilemma because both stores aren't equal in their ability to provide a gaming area. If they were, I could at least understand the need for the discussion.


You're being deliberately obtuse. Despite the two stores "inequality", he absolutely can "pay where he plays" (which is the more common phraseology). He just needs to change where he pays.

"pay where you play" = "play where you pay". Having a discount or table space is very specifically not a part of that equation, especially as it's the usual argument used between online shopping at a larger discount than a FLGS.


I'm not being deliberately anything, thank you.

I was looking at this backwards and you just clarified it - no reason to assume how I'm understanding something.

Shadowkeepers (4000 points)
3rd Company (3000 points) 
   
Made in de
Witch Hunter in the Shadows



Aachen

 Fenrir Kitsune wrote:
Free market, buy where you get the best deal. GW'll have to compete like any other company would.


They're competing by providing a better store experience - and that's paid for by the higher price per box. They could just go "yeah, you're only allowed to sit down here with boxes that you bought here" (see: any restaurant), but they're being nice about it. If you only care about the pricepoint thats fine, but don't complain once your local GW shuts down and your hobby space is gone. It was your choice after all.
That being said I mostly buy my stuff at 3rd party webstores at ~20% off, but I never stay at my local GW since we have an independent wargaming club where I play (and pay for membership) and I strongly prefer to paint/assemble at home. But I'll make sure to actually drive to the local GW and order there if i need GW webstore exclusive stuff.
   
Made in us
Douglas Bader






nekooni wrote:
They're competing by providing a better store experience - and that's paid for by the higher price per box.


Maybe in rare cases where the independent stores in the area don't support GW games, but not as a general rule. The GW store experience is worse in every way compared to a decent independent store. Higher prices, less gaming space, limited product selection, and ridiculous hours. Their only "advantage" is the artificial scarcity where they don't let independent stores sell some of their products, take away that and there's no reason to ever go into a GW store.

There is no such thing as a hobby without politics. "Leave politics at the door" is itself a political statement, an endorsement of the status quo and an attempt to silence dissenting voices. 
   
Made in au
Unstoppable Bloodthirster of Khorne





Melbourne .au

 Frankenberry wrote:
 Azazelx wrote:

You're being deliberately obtuse. Despite the two stores "inequality", he absolutely can "pay where he plays" (which is the more common phraseology). He just needs to change where he pays.
"pay where you play" = "play where you pay". Having a discount or table space is very specifically not a part of that equation, especially as it's the usual argument used between online shopping at a larger discount than a FLGS.


I'm not being deliberately anything, thank you.

I was looking at this backwards and you just clarified it - no reason to assume how I'm understanding something.


Fair enough - the way you'd written it appeared completely as though you were being deliberately obtuse in the typical way that people are in these arguments - and indeed are being so in this thread. As it appears that was not the case, I apologise.
And here's an example of the very same:


 Peregrine wrote:
nekooni wrote:
They're competing by providing a better store experience - and that's paid for by the higher price per box.


Maybe in rare cases where the independent stores in the area don't support GW games, but not as a general rule. The GW store experience is worse in every way compared to a decent independent store. Higher prices, less gaming space, limited product selection, and ridiculous hours. Their only "advantage" is the artificial scarcity where they don't let independent stores sell some of their products, take away that and there's no reason to ever go into a GW store.


We're not talking about a "generalised GW vs FLGS that supports the hobby" here. We're talking specifically about the two stores in the OP's experience. The LGS that sells GW with 10% off, but does not support gaming or playing, and the GW store next to it with friendly staff and a community that the OP enjoys spending time with to the point of preferring to assemble and paint in store. The advantages in this specific case are clear. Your generalised dislike of GW stores is misplaced and useless in this thread as the LGS offers none of the "added value" that you're going on about. By your own words, this is one of those "rare cases" and there doesn't seem to be a "maybe" involved.


   
Made in us
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USA

*snip*
Spoiler:
 Azazelx wrote:
 Frankenberry wrote:
 Azazelx wrote:

You're being deliberately obtuse. Despite the two stores "inequality", he absolutely can "pay where he plays" (which is the more common phraseology). He just needs to change where he pays.
"pay where you play" = "play where you pay". Having a discount or table space is very specifically not a part of that equation, especially as it's the usual argument used between online shopping at a larger discount than a FLGS.


I'm not being deliberately anything, thank you.

I was looking at this backwards and you just clarified it - no reason to assume how I'm understanding something.


Fair enough - the way you'd written it appeared completely as though you were being deliberately obtuse in the typical way that people are in these arguments - and indeed are being so in this thread. As it appears that was not the case, I apologise.
And here's an example of the very same:


 Peregrine wrote:
nekooni wrote:
They're competing by providing a better store experience - and that's paid for by the higher price per box.


Maybe in rare cases where the independent stores in the area don't support GW games, but not as a general rule. The GW store experience is worse in every way compared to a decent independent store. Higher prices, less gaming space, limited product selection, and ridiculous hours. Their only "advantage" is the artificial scarcity where they don't let independent stores sell some of their products, take away that and there's no reason to ever go into a GW store.


We're not talking about a "generalised GW vs FLGS that supports the hobby" here. We're talking specifically about the two stores in the OP's experience. The LGS that sells GW with 10% off, but does not support gaming or playing, and the GW store next to it with friendly staff and a community that the OP enjoys spending time with to the point of preferring to assemble and paint in store. The advantages in this specific case are clear. Your generalised dislike of GW stores is misplaced and useless in this thread as the LGS offers none of the "added value" that you're going on about. By your own words, this is one of those "rare cases" and there doesn't seem to be a "maybe" involved.



Confusion was entirely on my side of things, thanks for clearing things up.

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Overdose wrote:
So currently I have a small dilemma.
I've recently returned to the hobby and was able to find a local GW store nearby with great staff and nice atmosphere.

In the same building one floor up there is a hobby store focused mainly on TCG like MTG but also have the GW products except at a cheaper price (10%).

Now I haven't actually been to the other hobby store but I've heard that it doesn't support the tabletop hobby that much(meaning no paint tables etc.).

IF I was to buy products from upstairs and take them downstairs to paint and assemble etc etc, would this be considered 'wrong'?

I mean 10% on small stuff ain't a lot but with the bigger boxed products 10% discount seems too good to not consider.

What do you guys think?
Any opinions?


So, you've "heard" (you haven't actually asked?) that they don't support the tabletop hobby ?
If it IS the Good Games upstairs from GW town Hall, then they not only DO allow people to paint models in there (I've seen several miniature painters working on their stuff IN the store, at one of the rear tables. Marty, the manager should be able to set you straight.) they also have boards AND terrain for playing the games.
Miniatures have specific gaming days, though (40k has one, infinity has one, etc). You will have to supply your own paints and glue/tools, but you have to do that for GW anyway (GW stopped doing it because people were abusing the "privilege" and taking pots of paint - and also the tools home ).

I'm OVER 50 (and so far over everyone's BS, too).
Old enough to know better, young enough to not give a ****.

That is not dead which can eternal lie ...

... and yet, with strange aeons, even death may die.
 
   
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Japan

Lots of bickering, again, i saw only one good post, ask the manager otherwise don't.

Squidbot;
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 Yodhrin wrote:

Is it allowed? Then it's not a low thing to do, it's allowed. Is it not allowed? The issue is moot since it's not allowed and so won't happen.

There is no rational way to argue the OP's scenario would somehow be immoral because the scenario can only occur if his actions are considered permissable by the "competing store", and if they're fine with it what's it to do with you?


You do know rules and laws in general don't deal with morals and ethics? So "just because it's allowed by law means it's ethical" doesn't fly.

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 Azazelx wrote:
We're not talking about a "generalised GW vs FLGS that supports the hobby" here. We're talking specifically about the two stores in the OP's experience. The LGS that sells GW with 10% off, but does not support gaming or playing, and the GW store next to it with friendly staff and a community that the OP enjoys spending time with to the point of preferring to assemble and paint in store. The advantages in this specific case are clear. Your generalised dislike of GW stores is misplaced and useless in this thread as the LGS offers none of the "added value" that you're going on about. By your own words, this is one of those "rare cases" and there doesn't seem to be a "maybe" involved.


But we are talking about the general case, at least in the post I responded to. Saying "GW competes by offering a better experience to justify higher prices" presents it as a case of GW deliberately using that strategy and having a successful business plan. In reality GW's strategy is to provide a terrible experience and high prices, they just happened to have the sheer luck to be in a situation where their closest competition doesn't provide a great experience either. And, based on chromedog's comment, it seems like GW isn't even doing that much, the OP is just mistaken about the state of the independent store.

There is no such thing as a hobby without politics. "Leave politics at the door" is itself a political statement, an endorsement of the status quo and an attempt to silence dissenting voices. 
   
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Let's not forget GW goes out of their way to destroy independent stores by deliberately delaying deliveries while their own stores have the item day one.
   
 
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