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Wow one troll got 3 pages of reaction....
People paint all parts of the model whatever colour they want so it doesn't matter
To everyone getting worked up about skin tones in 38,000 years time well calm down our race will more than likely be extinct long before that happens but if I'm still around I'll email you some pics

Whenever I paint troopers that could believably include a mix of skin colors, I make sure to paint them up with some variety. My Necromunda gangs all had a couple of black members, for example.

My current IG project doesn't afford me the chance to do that without breaking theme (since we're freakin Space Germans), but once it comes time to raise to another regiment or add some Stormtroopers to the mix, I'm sure that I'll include some black soldiers as well.

SPace marines CAN get darker skin due to the Melanochrome organ they have implanted - which responds to increasing UV levels to offer some kind of protection from it.

It's just kind of hard for it to trigger the presto-changeo-colour change when they are ALWAYS wearing armour.

Pedro Kantor and the Crimson Fists are latino... Captain 'Cortez'? Thats about it I think...

Mr. DK wrote:Pedro Kantor and the Crimson Fists are latino... Captain 'Cortez'? Thats about it I think...

That and Kantor's name loosley translates as "Peter Singer".

BTW, why does your avatar look like a young Peter Kay?

The Inqusition guy from DoW the first game, was black!
Black Rage!!!

Because 38,000 years from now, Terra, and the IoM, is one big civilization, you can't be African-American as the concepts of Africa and America no longer exist. Also, millennia of living on planets with different climates and suns will alter your pigmentation, to the point that on some planets, paler skin is more prevalent, while on others, it's darker skin that's more common.

As for Space Marines, they share the same genetic structure as their primarch, if their primarch was Caucasian, they likely are as well, despite their original skin tone, which is why Space Wolves are largely Caucasian with Viking-esque beards/hair and wolfish teeth, because of Leman Russ, or how Blood Angels are brought into the Chapter scarred by radiation and leave as blond caucasians with sharper canines....they now have the genes of Sanguinius.

Also, 1,000 marines of the Salamanders Chapter are of a darker skin tone, because their planet's cause them to evolve that way

Elector wrote:Because 38,000 years from now, Terra, and the IoM, is one big civilization, you can't be African-American as the concepts of Africa and America no longer exist. Also, millennia of living on planets with different climates and suns will alter your pigmentation, to the point that on some planets, paler skin is more prevalent, while on others, it's darker skin that's more common.

As for Space Marines, they share the same genetic structure as their primarch, if their primarch was Caucasian, they likely are as well, despite their original skin tone, which is why Space Wolves are largely Caucasian with Viking-esque beards/hair and wolfish teeth, because of Leman Russ, or how Blood Angels are brought into the Chapter scarred by radiation and leave as blond caucasians with sharper canines....they now have the genes of Sanguinius.

Also, 1,000 marines of the Salamanders Chapter are of a darker skin tone, because their planet's cause them to evolve that way

Pretty much the best answer to the question.

Because in the year 32,456, the Emperor, being the genocide sort of loving fellow he is, declared black people to all be mutant Xenos and purged them.

On a more serious note, this:-

ChrisWW2 wrote:
I personally pain my models as caucasian just cause it's easier to do, and I see no reason why little plastic men trying to kill each other need to be 'racially diverse' or 'politically correct'.

Elector wrote:Because 38,000 years from now, Terra, and the IoM, is one big civilization, you can't be African-American as the concepts of Africa and America no longer exist. Also, millennia of living on planets with different climates and suns will alter your pigmentation, to the point that on some planets, paler skin is more prevalent, while on others, it's darker skin that's more common.

One planet, Earth, has produced people of all the diversity we see. I don't see why other worlds wouldn't have similar variance.

Even if that were true, you haven't explained why white men don't paint their models black if there are entire worlds of black people. There are still white players, and there are still black people in the Imperium, so there are still white players not painting their models black. It's still racism.

Elector wrote:As for Space Marines, they share the same genetic structure as their primarch, if their primarch was Caucasian, they likely are as well, despite their original skin tone, which is why Space Wolves are largely Caucasian with Viking-esque beards/hair and wolfish teeth, because of Leman Russ, or how Blood Angels are brought into the Chapter scarred by radiation and leave as blond caucasians with sharper canines....they now have the genes of Sanguinius.

Lolno. Genetics does not work that way. If you change the DNA of a person who has developed beyond an embyro they will die.

There has never been a clear explanation of exactly how geneseed works. It clearly doesn't work to the extent you're saying though. Most Space Marines look the same because they recruit from the same planet, but you still get variances (the black Blood Raven Librarian from DoW2, about a million examples from the HH books - it's a plot point in the original trilogy that some of the Luna Wolves look too similiar).

Rube wrote:Even if that were true, you haven't explained why white men don't paint their models black if there are entire worlds of black people. There are still white players, and there are still black people in the Imperium, so there are still white players not painting their models black. It's still racism.

No. It's not.

RACISM:-
1. The belief that race accounts for differences in human character or ability and that a particular race is superior to others.
2. Discrimination or prejudice based on race.

By painting my little men white, I am not implying superiority of the white race. As they are toy soldiers, and belong to me, I am not discriminating against black people, any more than I am discriminating against Arabic people, Hispanic people, or Asian people. There is nothing to discriminate against. It;'s not like where you give jobs to white people and not black people. There is no competition here, they are my miniatures, and I can paint them whatever way I like. I am not discriminating against the colour brown any more than I am the colour green or blue.

Racism does not enter into the equation. Please stop your overly sensitive PC mudslinging comments before this thread dissolves into flaming.

So...now it's racism if I don't go out of my way to try and include other races? No. That's not racism. It's racism (maybe) if GW sold me models painted black or Hispanic, and I repainted them Caucasian because I think white people are better. Hell, even if I did repaint them white, but it's because in the fluff my planet has a very thick ozone layer, so most of the population doesn't have a lot of melanin, it's still not racism.

As ketara said, racism is a very defined term, and very charged one at that. Me being lazy is not racism, it's me being lazy and realizing that since I have a pot of Tallarn flesh paint, I'm going to use it, and not go through the trouble of making a nice black skin color. If that makes me racist, then fine. I'm racist. But somehow, I hightly doubt any one would look at my army, and say: "OMG! You have no black people! You racist b*****!!"

Rube wrote:

Elector wrote:Because 38,000 years from now, Terra, and the IoM, is one big civilization, you can't be African-American as the concepts of Africa and America no longer exist. Also, millennia of living on planets with different climates and suns will alter your pigmentation, to the point that on some planets, paler skin is more prevalent, while on others, it's darker skin that's more common.

One planet, Earth, has produced people of all the diversity we see. I don't see why other worlds wouldn't have similar variance.

He just said that diversity exists, please actually read the post you quoted, as all the world in the IoM do not have the same atmosphere, distance to the sun, sun type and that worlds do not have the same restricted movement of the population as humans did during the birth of our species races, the skin colour of a particular world and the levels of distribution would be different on each world.

there are also many worlds where the main population body hasn't seen the world's sun in thousands of years where having skn pigment (used to protect against uv light) has no use.

Calling a person racist cos they only want to buy one colour of paint for flesh is ridiculous.

Because in approximately 1000 years from now we all turn into goobacks, a combination of all races in 1 all mighty goobacky race!

In all honesty though it would probably be harder to paint and highlight darker colour faces and lets face it faces can give people some trouble.

Ketara wrote:

Rube wrote:Even if that were true, you haven't explained why white men don't paint their models black if there are entire worlds of black people. There are still white players, and there are still black people in the Imperium, so there are still white players not painting their models black. It's still racism.

No. It's not.

Ketara, don't feed the trolls, man. The only way anyone would say something like that is if:

1. They're trolling.
2. A moron.

Either way, Rube should be ignored.

yournamehere wrote:Because in approximately 1000 years from now we all turn into goobacks, a combination of all races in 1 all mighty goobacky race!

In all honesty though it would probably be harder to paint and highlight darker colour faces and lets face it faces can give people some trouble.

HHAHAHAHA

I am going to paint an all Gooback army...

Rube wrote:Even if that were true, you haven't explained why white men don't paint their models black if there are entire worlds of black people. There are still white players, and there are still black people in the Imperium, so there are still white players not painting their models black. It's still racism.

With the current Space marine Codex, one of the strongest builds is taking Vulkan and the Salamanders, all black and quite popular among "white players".

If you want to troll, at least pretend to base your argumentation on facts. Now go back to your beloved Xenophopic Imperium army, while I paint my blue skinned xeno-friendly Tau

Rube wrote:

Elector wrote:As for Space Marines, they share the same genetic structure as their primarch, if their primarch was Caucasian, they likely are as well, despite their original skin tone, which is why Space Wolves are largely Caucasian with Viking-esque beards/hair and wolfish teeth, because of Leman Russ, or how Blood Angels are brought into the Chapter scarred by radiation and leave as blond caucasians with sharper canines....they now have the genes of Sanguinius.

Lolno. Genetics does not work that way. If you change the DNA of a person who has developed beyond an embyro they will die.

There has never been a clear explanation of exactly how geneseed works. It clearly doesn't work to the extent you're saying though. Most Space Marines look the same because they recruit from the same planet, but you still get variances (the black Blood Raven Librarian from DoW2, about a million examples from the HH books - it's a plot point in the original trilogy that some of the Luna Wolves look too similiar).

Though the Blood Angels codex is regarded by some as poor fluff, it does describe the drastic genetic transformation:

Genetics SHOULDN'T work that way, but like the laws of physics, genetics has been sacrificed mind, body, and soul to 'Rule of Cool' in the 40k universe. Does it make scientific sense that implanting a bunch of random crap into a guy will turn him into a tall, blonde, vampire bishonen? No. Is it awesome? .....Debatable, but you get the idea.

It could be that the Emperium has bred out black(ness?). Therefore no more black people, aside from some situational genetic mutation (salamanders). In the current meta, Salamanders actually have pitch black skin, as opposed to a shade of brown. Hence all of my sallies exposed skin is chaos black (makes painting super easy).

One argument I have heard for salamanders having such dark skin is that because the entire emperium is white, they exaggerate the darkness of their skin.

ChrisWWII wrote:Genetics SHOULDN'T work that way, but like the laws of physics, genetics has been sacrificed mind, body, and soul to 'Rule of Cool' in the 40k universe. Does it make scientific sense that implanting a bunch of random crap into a guy will turn him into a tall, blonde, vampire bishonen? No. Is it awesome? .....Debatable, but you get the idea.

Oh, I never said that's how they actually work, I was just using the setting's canon to support my arguments.

Remember, in the Grim Darkness of the 41st Millennium, there is no feasible science....but since we are discussing a fictional setting, we are going to use that setting's fundamental "rules" (one of which is apparently: genetics+implants=awesome) to explain the OP's question.

Absolutionis wrote:My Craftworld Eldar are all black. You just can't see because they prefer to wear their Frownyface Helmets.

You mean their cone-head stormtrooper hats?

Salamanders are black. Sort of.

It's because in the 41'st millennium sunscreen is soo good, that their skin has just gotten fairer over generations.

Rube wrote:It's the same reason so few models are women - because the majority of the players are white and male, so of course they want white male characters in their army! Statistically, white men are the most racist, sexist people on the planet.

melta madness wrote:some of the scaryest warriors in history have been black the zulus mr t etc

7/10

purplefood wrote:

chromedog wrote:Because the vast majority of miniatures gamers are white and for most of them, painting them anything but "Caucasian" is going to actually require conscious thought.

It's not a conscious decision to paint them not-black. It just does not occur to them to paint them any other colour.

Really says something about society doesn't it? That's post-colonialism for you.

Rube wrote:I like the justifications in this thread. "I'm not racist, it's just hard to paint somebody black!"

I'll give you a free painting masterclass. How to paint a black person - prime with chaos black, done.

Is that enough ignorance to declare this thread locked?

Negator80 wrote:Is that enough ignorance to declare this thread locked?

Actually, taken out of context, yes, those quotes can seem ignorant, but over all, this entire thread has been handled with a far amount of maturity.

Try posting this on Warsewer and see what happens. Wait, I got banned from Warsewer for being part of this very same topic because I said black skin is hard to paint for me. True story, I was there.

The only thing negative I see in this thread is the amount of 'smart' people claiming trolls or calling for this thread to be locked.

Why?

Lack of black warriors in 40k is a serious question, and even IF it is a troll, the 30+ replies in this thread are very informative and adult.

I applaud the people in this thread for being mature about a topic that can easily devolve into a flame fest.

- on topic -

As for painting skin on a model to represent a black person, does anyone have any suggestions for full color pallets, including highlights and washes, if any? I just can't seem to get it right.

So what context were they meant in?

a comment implying GW and it's player base are racist, a second implying negativity to non uber PC actions, and a third which is wildly, well, ignorant.

Negator80 wrote:So what context were they meant in?

a comment implying GW and it's player base are racist, a second implying negativity to non uber PC actions, and a third which is wildly, well, ignorant.

Look, I'm sorry if my comments derailed the thread. Obviously I hit a little too close to home for some people and made them angry.

Here's an example of how to paint darker skin, BuFFo. WARNING - a little light nudity on the model, but I chose it because it's a good example and it's using GW paints which people are probably more familiar with.

To be honest it has never really occured to me to paint dark skin because I don't really see any need to make any sort of point about racial inclusivity. Fair skin is simply "normal" to me, as I am white, as are my family and many of the people I intereact with on a personal level.

To paint darker skin would require me to actively think about doing so (I've had to restrain myself from painting black squad leaders for my IG to pay hommage to Halo, simply because my IG are WWI British themed, which was relatively light in dark skinned troops in most regiments).

Ketara wrote:

Rube wrote:Even if that were true, you haven't explained why white men don't paint their models black if there are entire worlds of black people. There are still white players, and there are still black people in the Imperium, so there are still white players not painting their models black. It's still racism.

No. It's not.

RACISM:-
1. The belief that race accounts for differences in human character or ability and that a particular race is superior to others.
2. Discrimination or prejudice based on race.

By painting my little men white, I am not implying superiority of the white race. As they are toy soldiers, and belong to me, I am not discriminating against black people, any more than I am discriminating against Arabic people, Hispanic people, or Asian people. There is nothing to discriminate against. It;'s not like where you give jobs to white people and not black people. There is no competition here, they are my miniatures, and I can paint them whatever way I like. I am not discriminating against the colour brown any more than I am the colour green or blue.

Racism does not enter into the equation. Please stop your overly sensitive PC mudslinging comments before this thread dissolves into flaming.

But..theres no competition here either...white people are better at jo-TOTALLY RACIST IM KIDDING!

I think this thread might need locking...

Negator80 wrote:So what context were they meant in?

a comment implying GW and it's player base are racist, a second implying negativity to non uber PC actions, and a third which is wildly, well, ignorant.

Hey.
I'm studying post-colonialism in college right now so i sort of see it everywhere.
I'm not saying it is racist.
I agree that it is harder to paint and that it isn't racist.
But saying my comment was implying negativity to non-uver pc action is wrong because i wasn't.