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Funny. I can find absolutely nothing about this company other than what they have published (online not in bookstores), or what has been published about them in the 2 kickstarters.

You would think that a company with as many years of experience as they have would have something out there.

I find it disturbing that they are keeping all their "talented" artists names from being public. Seems to me, someone with that much talent would want to have their names everywhere.

 inquisitorlewis wrote:
Funny. I can find absolutely nothing about this company other than what they have published (online not in bookstores), or what has been published about them in the 2 kickstarters.

You would think that a company with as many years of experience as they have would have something out there.

I find it disturbing that they are keeping all their "talented" artists names from being public. Seems to me, someone with that much talent would want to have their names everywhere.

Don't forget their comment in the reaper thread that they were "shocked" that no one in the miniature gaming world had ever heard of them and bragging out how apparently they would with many different companies internationally in the past. Never said who these companies were or even what industry they were even working in....

As far as I can tell their is at least 2 people we can confirm are in this "company". Dina Andrews Walker, and who ever this Lars/Doggerland "gentleman" is. Their is a Facebook profile attached to the kickstarter/Dina Andrews Walker with posts to friends/family actively being made. Unless Lars/Doggerland is actually Dina?

Other then that, I doubt they have any "employees" like they claim to have.

I found this quote amusing:
"If you fail at delivering 2,000 minis in 75 calendar days, you are a fraud. there is a work ethic problem, or there is a intent to deceive. It is not the complexity of the process. I have sourced manufacturing and publishing services from vendors all over the world durin my professional life and I never saw excuses like I have seem on KS re: minis and game publishing. It jsut does not happen outside of games for some reason. And, not until the excuses we have all seen on KS Campaigns."

When is their 75 days up?


I find the amount of misspellings from this "high level executive" disturbing... and somehow so so familiar.

 inquisitorlewis wrote:
I found this quote amusing:
"If you fail at delivering 2,000 minis in 75 calendar days, you are a fraud. there is a work ethic problem, or there is a intent to deceive. It is not the complexity of the process. I have sourced manufacturing and publishing services from vendors all over the world durin my professional life and I never saw excuses like I have seem on KS re: minis and game publishing. It jsut does not happen outside of games for some reason. And, not until the excuses we have all seen on KS Campaigns."

When is their 75 days up?


I find the amount of misspellings from this "high level executive" disturbing... and somehow so so familiar.

I just did the math. Apparently today.
XD

lmao, that's just perfect. lol

I'd love to see a bunch of people send this quote to them today.

 inquisitorlewis wrote:
I

I find the amount of misspellings from this "high level executive" disturbing... and somehow so so familiar.

I surely cannot be the only one thinking this has Mandlebaum written all over it! From the mis-spellings through to avoidance, the circular double talk and the persecution claims.

 Lockark wrote:

 inquisitorlewis wrote:
I found this quote amusing:
"If you fail at delivering 2,000 minis in 75 calendar days, you are a fraud. there is a work ethic problem, or there is a intent to deceive. It is not the complexity of the process. I have sourced manufacturing and publishing services from vendors all over the world durin my professional life and I never saw excuses like I have seem on KS re: minis and game publishing. It jsut does not happen outside of games for some reason. And, not until the excuses we have all seen on KS Campaigns."

When is their 75 days up?


I find the amount of misspellings from this "high level executive" disturbing... and somehow so so familiar.

I just did the math. Apparently today.
XD

lmao, that's just perfect. lol

I'd love to see a bunch of people send this quote to them today.

Straight from the horses mouth.

 Lockark wrote:

 inquisitorlewis wrote:
I found this quote amusing:
"If you fail at delivering 2,000 minis in 75 calendar days, you are a fraud. there is a work ethic problem, or there is a intent to deceive. It is not the complexity of the process. I have sourced manufacturing and publishing services from vendors all over the world durin my professional life and I never saw excuses like I have seem on KS re: minis and game publishing. It jsut does not happen outside of games for some reason. And, not until the excuses we have all seen on KS Campaigns."

When is their 75 days up?


I find the amount of misspellings from this "high level executive" disturbing... and somehow so so familiar.

I just did the math. Apparently today.
XD

lmao, that's just perfect. lol

I'd love to see a bunch of people send this quote to them today.

LOL!

That's awesome...

 Alex C wrote:

 Lockark wrote:

 inquisitorlewis wrote:
I found this quote amusing:
"If you fail at delivering 2,000 minis in 75 calendar days, you are a fraud. there is a work ethic problem, or there is a intent to deceive. It is not the complexity of the process. I have sourced manufacturing and publishing services from vendors all over the world durin my professional life and I never saw excuses like I have seem on KS re: minis and game publishing. It jsut does not happen outside of games for some reason. And, not until the excuses we have all seen on KS Campaigns."

When is their 75 days up?


I find the amount of misspellings from this "high level executive" disturbing... and somehow so so familiar.

I just did the math. Apparently today.
XD

lmao, that's just perfect. lol

I'd love to see a bunch of people send this quote to them today.

LOL!

That's awesome...

I am curious how long it is going to take "Lars"to show up here on Dakka with a furious rant. Seems as though they have stepped away from making any comments.

I am going to NYC next week. I am thinking of stopping by the CBS building and checking to see if this company actually exists.

 fullheadofhair wrote:

 inquisitorlewis wrote:
I

I find the amount of misspellings from this "high level executive" disturbing... and somehow so so familiar.

I surely cannot be the only one thinking this has Mandlebaum written all over it! From the mis-spellings through to avoidance, the circular double talk and the persecution claims.

Is the implication then that Daniel Mandelbaum basically scammed Dina Andrews Walker into being the face for his front?

 inquisitorlewis wrote:


I am going to NYC next week. I am thinking of stopping by the CBS building and checking to see if this company actually exists.

please do!

 Lockark wrote:

 fullheadofhair wrote:

 inquisitorlewis wrote:
I

I find the amount of misspellings from this "high level executive" disturbing... and somehow so so familiar.

I surely cannot be the only one thinking this has Mandlebaum written all over it! From the mis-spellings through to avoidance, the circular double talk and the persecution claims.

Is the implication then that Daniel Mandelbaum basically scammed Dina Andrews Walker into being the face for his front?

Did I say Mandlebaum???

Is there any actual proof that this woman is actually involved with this company? I can't even find any information on this company. If I missed something, please be sure to point it out to me.

 inquisitorlewis wrote:

 Lockark wrote:

 fullheadofhair wrote:

 inquisitorlewis wrote:
I

I find the amount of misspellings from this "high level executive" disturbing... and somehow so so familiar.

I surely cannot be the only one thinking this has Mandlebaum written all over it! From the mis-spellings through to avoidance, the circular double talk and the persecution claims.

Is the implication then that Daniel Mandelbaum basically scammed Dina Andrews Walker into being the face for his front?

Did I say Mandlebaum???

Is there any actual proof that this woman is actually involved with this company? I can't even find any information on this company. If I missed something, please be sure to point it out to me.

She made a post thanking "crittohit.com" for spreading the word of her kickstarter on June 11.


Edit: I noticed thow that as you go father back, the posts start repeating on her face book page. This may be a glitch thow with face book. Other wise her time line appears to be going back to 2010.

 Lockark wrote:

 inquisitorlewis wrote:

 Lockark wrote:

 fullheadofhair wrote:

 inquisitorlewis wrote:
I

I find the amount of misspellings from this "high level executive" disturbing... and somehow so so familiar.

I surely cannot be the only one thinking this has Mandlebaum written all over it! From the mis-spellings through to avoidance, the circular double talk and the persecution claims.

Is the implication then that Daniel Mandelbaum basically scammed Dina Andrews Walker into being the face for his front?

Did I say Mandlebaum???

Is there any actual proof that this woman is actually involved with this company? I can't even find any information on this company. If I missed something, please be sure to point it out to me.

She made a post thanking "crittohit.com" for spreading the word of her kickstarter on June 11.

Couldn't anyone do that, using any name they wanted?

I am not trying to be a smartass. I just think a lot of people take things at face value, even after numerous red flags pop up everywhere.

 inquisitorlewis wrote:

 Lockark wrote:

 inquisitorlewis wrote:

 Lockark wrote:

 fullheadofhair wrote:

 inquisitorlewis wrote:
I

I find the amount of misspellings from this "high level executive" disturbing... and somehow so so familiar.

I surely cannot be the only one thinking this has Mandlebaum written all over it! From the mis-spellings through to avoidance, the circular double talk and the persecution claims.

Is the implication then that Daniel Mandelbaum basically scammed Dina Andrews Walker into being the face for his front?

Did I say Mandlebaum???

Is there any actual proof that this woman is actually involved with this company? I can't even find any information on this company. If I missed something, please be sure to point it out to me.

She made a post thanking "crittohit.com" for spreading the word of her kickstarter on June 11.

Couldn't anyone do that, using any name they wanted?

I am not trying to be a smartass. I just think a lot of people take things at face value, even after numerous red flags pop up everywhere.

Her time line goes back to 2010, so unless it's a stolen face book account, she dose seem to be a real person.

I'm not taking anything at face value mind you. I'm just saying to me it looks like as far as we have seen ADW games is at most only two people.

 Lockark wrote:

 inquisitorlewis wrote:

 Lockark wrote:

 inquisitorlewis wrote:

 Lockark wrote:

 fullheadofhair wrote:

 inquisitorlewis wrote:
I

I find the amount of misspellings from this "high level executive" disturbing... and somehow so so familiar.

I surely cannot be the only one thinking this has Mandlebaum written all over it! From the mis-spellings through to avoidance, the circular double talk and the persecution claims.

Is the implication then that Daniel Mandelbaum basically scammed Dina Andrews Walker into being the face for his front?

Did I say Mandlebaum???

Is there any actual proof that this woman is actually involved with this company? I can't even find any information on this company. If I missed something, please be sure to point it out to me.

She made a post thanking "crittohit.com" for spreading the word of her kickstarter on June 11.

Couldn't anyone do that, using any name they wanted?

I am not trying to be a smartass. I just think a lot of people take things at face value, even after numerous red flags pop up everywhere.

Her time line goes back to 2010, so unless it's a stolen face book account, she dose seem to be a real person.

I'm not taking anything at face value mind you. I'm just saying to me it looks like as far as we have seen ADW games is at most only two people.

I guess time will tell. No matter what, it's another name about to be ruined in the gaming industry.

This was comedy gold...

Backer comment on Ice Age Mammals:

"If you fail at delivering 2,000 minis in 75 calendar days, you are a fraud. there is a work ethic problem, or there is a intent to deceive."
Those are your own words. It's been 75 days since this was funded. Just saying.

Response from the Dina Andrews Walker account, not sure of author:

I 100% agree. the freelancers we hired, who handed in wrong scale minis, or failed to hand in minis at all, did defraud us. We are still moving forward with new investment and new talent. Have to be careful out there.

I agree completely that the parallels with Mandlbehavior are quite interesting. Specifically, the wording, phasing, and tone of "Lars", "Dina" and "Scott" are all very similar and use very similar deflection techniques. I believe this sort of blame shifting, non-answer, confuse the issue response to questions is a very common tactic for people running a scam. However, this is also similar to the behavior shown by the owners of the previously mentioned Amy's Baking Company, which was not a scam, just very insecure people (likely to the point of pathology), taking any question, no matter how benign, as an all out assault personal attack.

So, I am not a sure this project is a scam quite yet, as in deliberately deceptive from the beginning. At this point, I believe this will be dragged out forever, with ADW never actually admitting lack of delivery. I highly doubt we'll see any minis because the project creators are not acknowledging their own arrogance is their biggest shortcoming. You can't fix a problem that doesn't exist!

"If you fail at delivering 2,000 minis in 75 calendar days, you are a fraud. there is a work ethic problem, or there is a intent to deceive."
Those are your own words. It's been 75 days since this was funded. Just saying.

Response from the Dina Andrews Walker account, not sure of author:

I don't think it's a scam. If you look at their previous activities, they've been in book publishing, furniture design, reality shows, acting... not exactly overlapping areas of expertise. Their attitude towards making miniatures as "trivial" and calling them "toys" show me that they don't know what they're doing before they do it. Dilettantish dabblers, if you will. They certainly have the spirit of entrepreneurship, but you need more than that to run a successful business.

I don't think KS needs to vet for scams, because it's not the scams which cause backers to be upset, it's mismanaged expectations and inability to satisfactorily manage a project. KS is not a store, except everyone treats it like one.

 inquisitorlewis wrote:
Funny. I can find absolutely nothing about this company other than what they have published (online not in bookstores), or what has been published about them in the 2 kickstarters.

You would think that a company with as many years of experience as they have would have something out there.

I find it disturbing that they are keeping all their "talented" artists names from being public. Seems to me, someone with that much talent would want to have their names everywhere.

Just to summarize what others have skillfully dug up on the Reaper thread and in the other Dakka thread...

The money pledged on the Kickstarter evidently goes to a company named Evergreen Entertainment Group LLC, and they have confirmed in the comments that this is the parent company of ADW Games. According to this page it was founded in 2009 and is based in LA (that page also lists a Dina Walker as a member of the company). I'm not sure what they have done, although I found this that links them to a TV company called AQUA+, which is based in NY. They seemed to have been involved in some kind of musical competition show that was supposed to film in Toronto in 2012.

Then there's the link to Food for Thought Productions, who seem to have been involved in some kind of scam in Vancouver back in 2009 (executive producer is a Dina Walker, producer is a Henry Kipling). This article also lists the people involved in Food for Thought. A link between Evergreen Entertainment and Food for Thought can be found through the Resonate Guitar Story Movie (screenplay by Henry Kipling). This page shows PBS warning people for scams, and lists both Evergreen Entertainment and Food for Thought.

The guy posting in the older Reaper thread and calling himself Scott Lantry claimed that ADW Games is a subsidiary of Weaver, Chester & Tweed LLC, a book publishing company. Their website is here and this page lists Dina Andrews Walker as the contact person. They are based in NY, and seem to have been founded in 2013. I'm really not sure what they have done, they say on their webpage that their books "can be found in academic, university, museum bookstores, as well as independent fine art and design book shops worldwide". It does look like there is a Scott Lantry working for Weaver, Chester & Tweed.

I really don't know. If these are outright scam artists, they seem to be reusing their names quite a lot and not hiding their tracks all that skillfully.

So, they're IDs created for laundering mob money, then?

From what I see they are 4 hours from funding their sea monsters,dungeon furniture, big beasts, lollipops and anything that might grab your attention and convince you to put money on these people, lol!
I can't realise how all these good people backing this haven't read/heard/sniffed anything strange in this affair! It's been going on for some days, right?

The more I read about this stuff the more I'm getting convinced more and more people will eventually only back KSs from established companies who know their business, maybe to the point that being a total stranger will be meaningless if you ever want to run a succesful campaign.

I mean, if you actually want to raise more than a couple of grand...

Some of their most vocal supporters are prominent and experienced KS backers too. It's baffling. Maybe they have blinders on over their rose-tinted spectacles?

Only backing established companies will certainly be my rule of thumb going forward. I know it's "not what KS is for" but I'm getting less inclined to roll the dice (excuse the pun) on newbies to the industry, either because of fulfillment problems or doubt as to if fulfillment will happen at all.

And yes, KS is a risk, and it is one that I'm feeling less enthusiastic about with every passing day.

Well, I just backed the "formerly known as MegaMiniatures" KS, so I guess there are projects from established companies (or at least casters!) that are certainly projects that wouldn't have been made without backer support (the guy is semi-retired from miniature making, but wants to put out these specific mini's).

From seeing the Zombicide 3 KS, it's apparent to me that new backers are coming to KS all the time. Meanwhile, if someone is unwilling or unable to do a something as simple as a search on a creator or read the hard work others are willing to do for them, it's "out of the gene pool" time. I mean, someone posted a video rant quitting KS because of the Palladium project, which means he somehow missed Palladium's history and/or convinced himself that Ninja Division would be in charge (yeah, like Kevin Siembda would let that happen). No sure what to make of experienced backers funding the ADW folks.

Only irritation I have with KS are the "potato salad" backers, who fund a project fully or reasonably knowing that their funding only encourages projects like these to exist, when more deserving projects (or, gasp, charities) are out there. Of course, some people think our want for more man-dollies which will never be painted is a waste of money. Thankfully, I'm single.

With Stonehaven Miniatures, Impact Miniatures, Stonemaier Games, and now MegaMiniatures, I often rekindle my enthusiasm. Then ADW comes along.

 Gymnogyps wrote:
However, this is also similar to the behavior shown by the owners of the previously mentioned Amy's Baking Company, which was not a scam, just very insecure people (likely to the point of pathology), taking any question, no matter how benign, as an all out assault personal attack.

The implication with Amy's Baking company, is that it may actually a money laundering scheme. (Not proved, just suspected mind you)

 Trodax wrote:

 inquisitorlewis wrote:
Funny. I can find absolutely nothing about this company other than what they have published (online not in bookstores), or what has been published about them in the 2 kickstarters.

You would think that a company with as many years of experience as they have would have something out there.

I find it disturbing that they are keeping all their "talented" artists names from being public. Seems to me, someone with that much talent would want to have their names everywhere.

Just to summarize what others have skillfully dug up on the Reaper thread and in the other Dakka thread...

The money pledged on the Kickstarter evidently goes to a company named Evergreen Entertainment Group LLC, and they have confirmed in the comments that this is the parent company of ADW Games. According to this page it was founded in 2009 and is based in LA (that page also lists a Dina Walker as a member of the company). I'm not sure what they have done, although I found this that links them to a TV company called AQUA+, which is based in NY. They seemed to have been involved in some kind of musical competition show that was supposed to film in Toronto in 2012.

Then there's the link to Food for Thought Productions, who seem to have been involved in some kind of scam in Vancouver back in 2009 (executive producer is a Dina Walker, producer is a Henry Kipling). This article also lists the people involved in Food for Thought. A link between Evergreen Entertainment and Food for Thought can be found through the Resonate Guitar Story Movie (screenplay by Henry Kipling). This page shows PBS warning people for scams, and lists both Evergreen Entertainment and Food for Thought.

The guy posting in the older Reaper thread and calling himself Scott Lantry claimed that ADW Games is a subsidiary of Weaver, Chester & Tweed LLC, a book publishing company. Their website is here and this page lists Dina Andrews Walker as the contact person. They are based in NY, and seem to have been founded in 2013. I'm really not sure what they have done, they say on their webpage that their books "can be found in academic, university, museum bookstores, as well as independent fine art and design book shops worldwide". It does look like there is a Scott Lantry working for Weaver, Chester & Tweed.

I really don't know. If these are outright scam artists, they seem to be reusing their names quite a lot and not hiding their tracks all that skillfully.

Thanks for summing everything up so well. I eventually stumbled on all these things last evening as I read further.

Gymnogyps wrote:
Off the top of my head, I'm wondering...

- What was it about the miniatures that made them unacceptable?

The sculpting...?

Alex C wrote:Gymnogyps, thank you for mentioning Amy's Baking Company, I was trying to figure out who Dina from ADW reminded me of and you hit the nail on the head!

I had to google that. Yikes.

And I don't mean that to sound like some sort of anti-women hate-speech

No... she's not a flaky nut because she's a woman, she's a flaky nut because she's a flaky nut. (Or a scammer, as the case might be)

highlord tamburlaine wrote:I always thought most mini sculpts were done in Sculpey.

As mentioned, most are done in putty or some stronger polymer clay. Super Sculpey (the translucent pink stuff they used) is widely known and widely available, but it's notoriously brittle after baking. That was one of the first warning signs I saw as to the inexperience of these people. (besides the gak-awful sculpts and designs) That they were given 'bad advice' about it (implying they knew nothing about it) and switched to castilene only confirms that. Though... while castilene is a pro-quality product, and used by FW among others, I'm not entirely sure if it'd solve most of their inexperience problems. Being a kind of hardened wax consistency, I'd guess it needs it's own learning curve.

I'd love to know just what set of circumstances led them to the conclusion that sculpey was 'bad advice'.

Alex C wrote:
Oh, it keeps getting better. Now they're saying several of the minis shown on the front page were sculpted in the "wrong scale", so Lord knows what you'll end up with if they actually deliver...

Strewth.

Alex C wrote:Some of their most vocal supporters are prominent and experienced KS backers too. It's baffling.

Given how much money individual and collective gamers regularly fling at Kickstarters, including Defiance, I'm gonna say that 'experienced KS backer' implies no more nous and insight than 'experienced rube' or 'experienced village idiot'.

The rest of this topic causes me to shoot back and forth between astonishment* and schadenfreude. Now, I'm off to look at some Reaper forum topics.

*Though not so much surprise that this thing would collapse so readily. I got an inkling of that at the start.

 Trodax wrote:
The money pledged on the Kickstarter evidently goes to a company named Evergreen Entertainment Group LLC, and they have confirmed in the comments that this is the parent company of ADW Games.

...

Then there's the link to Food for Thought Productions, who seem to have been involved in some kind of scam in Vancouver back in 2009 (executive producer is a Dina Walker, producer is a Henry Kipling). This article also lists the people involved in Food for Thought. A link between Evergreen Entertainment and Food for Thought can be found through the Resonate Guitar Story Movie (screenplay by Henry Kipling). This page shows PBS warning people for scams, and lists both Evergreen Entertainment and Food for Thought.

Whoa. That's pretty damning, isn't it? If two companies you are connected to are listed by PBS are being scams... that's pretty blatant... and it seems the main company had a similar MO of trying to restore their credibility rather than going away / hiding who they were.

If anyone backs these guys they're just crazy


-------------




I just reported the project to Kickstarter with this text- if others want to do so, there is only 100 minutes left to try to catch it before it funds!

You can report it with the link at the very bottom of the project page that says "Report this project to Kickstarter":
https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/dinaandrewswalker/28mm-miniature-sea-monsters-dungeon-terrain-and-bi?ref=users

Feel free to copy and paste my text below!

This is a scam!

See this forum post for a summary:
http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/90/598995.page#7189778

In particular, see this direct link to a scam they did in Toronto listing Dina Walker and a company called Food For Thought:
http://www.b-roll.net/forum/showthread.php?t=24207

And see this post where PBS listed both Evergreen Entertainment (the company where the funds from this campaign go to) and Food For Thought as scams:
https://www.techdirt.com/articles/20100924/12150911158/world-progress-report-promotes-program-about-scams-helps-hide-all-the-complaints-that-it-s-a-scam.shtml

You only have about 100 minutes to cancel or at least put on hold this project before they scam more funds... please act quickly!

Sincerely,
Steve Garber / RiTides

The train wreck races on.

Dina Andrews Walker wrote:Hello Gentlemen
The timeline has been given several times.
As mentioned at least ten times, we rejected some bad sculpts, we had some bad hires, we rehired and are "fixing" sculpts with Casteline. The Casteline has not arrived in the studio. Once it does, we are maybe 40-60 hours away from completion of the sculpts. This has been explained several times. There is only one source for the wax. So, we wait until it arrives and set to work.
If you would like to see the 30+ sculpy armatures that are waiting, I can do that. However, everytime I do show a piece that is not finished there is an uproar. And, I would prefer not to show the pieces I rejected from freelancers, because there will be uproar.
I called about the wax yesterday and could only leave a message.
So the reiterate: 40-60 hours after the wax has been delivered for sculpting fixes. Not a single thing has changed re: to that.
If you are looking for sculpy armatures and ugly pieces that require fixing, please get a consensus from the 239 Pledgers that that is what you need to feel comfortable, because I have 30-40 emails saying "don't show works in progress!!!!!" And, they are all very adamant in their statements re: same.
Finally, try to email me directly or call me if you are feeling panic, or want to compare my efforts or story to some person unknown to me. I am a responsible professional adult and am happy to communicate in direct, responsible and mature business email or phone call at any regular business hour.

So there are 30+ sculpts now that's too hideous to show. But as soon as the Casteline arrives, these 30+ sculpts will go from too bad to be shown to fully finished in 40-60 hours; less than 2 hours per miniature. That's an impressive time frame to go from "unshowable" to fully finished.

Again this insistence of direct communication opposed to public. I suppose in order to have as little criticism as possible be showing so people don't get scared away from the sea monsters at the last moment.

If possible, try to report the new project to kickstarter at the link I posted above. They might not need to catch it before it funds- they might be able to refund the backers in the 2-week period before the funds get transferred from them to the creator. But, I think it'd be best if they caught it before it funds, which is in under 1.5 hours...

 RiTides wrote:
If possible, try to report the new project to kickstarter at the link I posted above. They might not need to catch it before it funds- they might be able to refund the backers in the 2-week period before the funds get transferred from them to the creator. But, I think it'd be best if they caught it before it funds, which is in under 1.5 hours...

Eh, I've yet to see that actually work when it comes to obvious scams on Kickstarter.

You need to start a crusade against a project to get it closed.

A main obstacle to having KS take action here is that ADW don't really obviously break any rules for the sea monsters KS.

For the Ica Age Mammals you could argue that they have been misleading people and misrepresenting facts by lying about freelancers and by not being able to provide the few good sculpts that they showed in the beginning (since they alledgedly haven't paid the sculptor and will have to let Lars ham out something hideous instead).

For the Sea Monsters KS, they haven't really made any promises to produce anything that doesn't look like crap. People has just pledged anyway for some reason (probably lured by promises of piles upon piles of miniatures).


Automatically Appended Next Post:
O well, the Sea Monsters kickstarter is finished. May god have mercy on the backers...

I read through the comments on the Sea monster campain and apparently some time in the middle people got tired of them never showing any scuplts and being silent for over a week.

Then ADW come back and start posting other peoples 2d pictures and a blob of tinfoil, and people start funding again!

They haven't shown a single finished sculpt apart from those models from the Ice Age campaign (like the terrorbird) which seems to be sculpted by someone not on board on the project and people just kept on funding!

It's disturbing and amazing that the Sea Monster campaign got funded, and at 4500$ none the less!