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Motograter wrote:
Even more funny the wg reply mentioned a new website that fixes stock issues etc. That's been the wg reply for a few years now and nothing changes. Lol they even blocked me making comments on their facebook at one stage. Truly laughable horrendous company. Avoid at all costs

Too early to call Waylands "new website" "Maelstroms Warehouse" yet? Always coming, always gonna be the thing that improves it all, never actually seems to arrive......

I've done a few orders through Wayland Games. On the whole the price is reasonable, at least on par with other retailers although I would not rate their service. I seem to have problems everytime I order something, usually the item appears to not be in stock even though it shows it as being in stock on the website. The longest I've waited is for some paints I ordered on the 15th April which did not dispatch until the 17th May, they were in stock (but I assume weren't). Items out of a large order seem to randomly get refunded for being out of stock, I can't remember what it was but a common Citadel blue paint was 'out of stock' but was 'in stock' on the website before ordering and still showed 'in stock' after getting the e-mail.

My last order was actually one my girlfriend did for some Christmas presents for me. Again everything was in stock and she ordered at the beginning of December. They didn't come before Christmas and she had to contact them. She ended up paying to upgrade the shipping and Christmas Day rolled around and they still hadn't shipped it. They held the entire order for one item which yet again was 'out of stock' but still showed 'in stock' on their website. I wasn't that annoyed because I've had experience with them before, but I felt bad for her because she was upset they didn't arrive on time and she'd ordered almost a month before hand.

I tend to order elsewhere now even if it's slightly more expensive.

 Stuart-Wayland wrote:

 TheSecretSquig wrote:
I currently have reported WG to UK Trading Standards for investigation. I’ve reached the final straw. I placed an order on the 3rd Dec to get some items in before Christmas. All were listed on their website as ‘In Stock’ with the Green coloured box. I’ve still not received anything because they do not have the items in stock. I’ve confirmed this with them via email. I’ve also asked as to why the same items are still listed as ‘In Stock’ on their webstore, when clearly they are not. No reply given.

It is for this reason I’ve reported them to Trading Standards together will all my email correspondence and screenshots of their webstore. This isn’t the first time I’ve had this issue with them, advertising items as in stock when in reality they are not.

Hi Squig, Really surprised by this - I can't find a green box for things being In Stock anywhere on the site. We haven't used a traffic light style system for stock levels in a couple of years. Now we just say " In Stock (52 Ready to Ship!)" or similar. We shouldn't have anything listed as In Stock when it isn't. It might say "Available" or Special Order Item or Pre-Order and that will all indicate items that we expect to receive in within an approximate timescale. But In Stock should absolutely be for items that are In Stock. I've messaged you with my contact email for you to pass me your evidence so I can get it properly investigated.

We are a popular store to visit for thousands of customers each week and have a new site on the way which will make things even better including more detailed stock information, a great Pre-Order system and an excellent loyalty points scheme (and lots more besides)!

Sorry for the confusion on this. By Green Box In Stock I mean Green Text ‘In Stock’ I work away from home during the week and due to restrictions at work I can’t log onto the Wayland Games site to check things. The order was for a couple of Army Painter Dry Brushes and some Secret Weapon Esper Crystals for basing. When this order was placed, all items were listed as ‘In Stock’, not listed as ‘Available in 3-9 days’. I’ve received your dakka message, but physically I cannot access your website during the week to get my order details.

At last check at the weekend, the Esper Crystals are still listed as ‘In Stock’ for most colours, the other coloured ones are ‘Available in 3-9 Days, I didn’t check the Brushes. I can’t remember which colours I ordered, but at the time of ordering 6.5 weeks ago, they were all listed as ‘In Stock’. Let’s give Wayland the benefit of doubt here, let’s assume I misread it and it stated ‘Available (typically ships in 6-9 days)’. As a customer, I read this quite clearly as after 9 days have passed, they will be shipped out to me. After 9 days have passed, if Wayland are unable to receive the items from their Supplier, Wayland now know that this statement of ‘Typically ships in 3-9 days’ is incorrect, yet it still remains on their webstore. In my opinion, this is false advertising. The order was made by my Wife for some small Christmas presents. Even if any of the items were listed as ‘Available’ rather than ‘In Stock’, the false impression from your webstore is that they will be shipped at the latest, 9 days.

As we know, this statement of ‘Typically ships in 3-9 days’ is a complete fabrication in some cases (items on my order being one). It is for this reason I’ve raised the issue with UK Trading Standards. To be fair to Wayland, I’ve always found their Customer Services to be excellent in the rare cases I’ve had an issue, but I’ve come foul of this ‘Available’ issue before, and now after 6.5 weeks of waiting for items that at the very worst case are advertised as being able to be shipped in 9 days.

Like I said, I cannot check the exact wording on these items as I’m unable to log on Waylands site from work, so I’ve made an assumption based on the examples above that it states 3-9 working days to ship. I do work in Contracts so I also know your get out of Jail free card is the word, ‘Typically’. But even so I believe this practise is wrong.

If you do not have the item In Stock then it should be clear on the webstore. The wording ‘Typically Available in 3-9 working days’ is extremely misleading, even more so because (as raised by another dakka member) the text is in Green. Green means ‘Go’. If you know that an item cannot be shipped within the stated timeframe, then in red text it should state that you are out of stock, and do not know when you will be receiving more stock. You’ve taken (please correct me if I’m wrong) full payment for items you do not physically have to send out to me.

I used to place all my orders through Maelstrom. I know the background, but I personally never had any issues. Their online stock indication was always accurate (for me anyway). When they demised, I started to use Wayland. But after falling foul of the ‘In Stock’ and ‘Available’ issues I’ve mentioned above too many times, I’ve stopped using them. My Wife searched for the Secret Weapon bases and placed the order online with yourselves.

Maelstrom only bungled it for me once and sold me something they didn't have in stock, and I eneded up waiting for a month before complaining. As soon as I did, they forwarded the item from a different retailer to me as this was quicker than getting it from their distributor, and they sent me 40 quid worth of free stuff as an apology.

 TheSecretSquig wrote:
At last check at the weekend, the Esper Crystals are still listed as ‘In Stock’ for most colours, the other coloured ones are ‘Available in 3-9 Days, I didn’t check the Brushes. I can’t remember which colours I ordered, but at the time of ordering 6.5 weeks ago, they were all listed as ‘In Stock’. Let’s give Wayland the benefit of doubt here, let’s assume I misread it and it stated ‘Available (typically ships in 6-9 days)’. As a customer, I read this quite clearly as after 9 days have passed, they will be shipped out to me. After 9 days have passed, if Wayland are unable to receive the items from their Supplier, Wayland now know that this statement of ‘Typically ships in 3-9 days’ is incorrect, yet it still remains on their webstore. In my opinion, this is false advertising. The order was made by my Wife for some small Christmas presents. Even if any of the items were listed as ‘Available’ rather than ‘In Stock’, the false impression from your webstore is that they will be shipped at the latest, 9 days.

As we know, this statement of ‘Typically ships in 3-9 days’ is a complete fabrication in some cases (items on my order being one). It is for this reason I’ve raised the issue with UK Trading Standards. To be fair to Wayland, I’ve always found their Customer Services to be excellent in the rare cases I’ve had an issue, but I’ve come foul of this ‘Available’ issue before, and now after 6.5 weeks of waiting for items that at the very worst case are advertised as being able to be shipped in 9 days.

Like I said, I cannot check the exact wording on these items as I’m unable to log on Waylands site from work, so I’ve made an assumption based on the examples above that it states 3-9 working days to ship. I do work in Contracts so I also know your get out of Jail free card is the word, ‘Typically’. But even so I believe this practise is wrong.

If you do not have the item In Stock then it should be clear on the webstore. The wording ‘Typically Available in 3-9 working days’ is extremely misleading, even more so because (as raised by another dakka member) the text is in Green. Green means ‘Go’. If you know that an item cannot be shipped within the stated timeframe, then in red text it should state that you are out of stock, and do not know when you will be receiving more stock. You’ve taken (please correct me if I’m wrong) full payment for items you do not physically have to send out to me.

Thank you for proving what I've said every time this comes up.

"Typically ships in 3-9 days" is so misleading as to be useless as a statement. All it means is that their distributor carries it in their catalog - so Wayland offers it on their site as if they have it, and order from their distributor when they get your money (more likely, the next time they order from that distributor). So the distributor has to actually have the item (and not playing the same game Wayland is), ship it, have it arrive, have Wayland unpack and repack it, then ship it to you.

I have been looking at getting a Mirco Art Studio District 5 Playmat. At the time it was out of stock everywhere including MAS website. Someone said they ordered it from Wayland. I saw the green, assumed Available meant that it 'really was available'. I made the order and 2 months later received an email that it was delayed because they couldn't get it from the manufacturer. That was when I saw Available meant 'they could order it'. I knew MAS was doing a reprint, so no worries I decided to wait since they had the best prices. Since then MAS has got them back in stock, it has been another 2 months but it still hasn't shipped. I messaged earlier and was told that it has just arrived and is shipping (yet my order doesn't reflect that online). So I'm still waiting. That same playmat still shows "Available" to this day, despite knowing they've had issues with it.

In my experience, whenever buying items actually in Stock, Wayland delivers just fine.

As for the "Available" being misleading, I disagree. If you only look at the colour and don't bother reading the text accompying it, I say the fault is yours.

I mean, the "typically ships in X days" has been used to tell "We need to buy it from distributor" for at least ten years in web shops, if not longer, and even the Wayland FAQ explicitly says this.

Similarly, other shops are just as badly on the mercy of their suppliers: I've had to wait on orders on Firestorm Games because they were waiting for stock to arrive.

I do agree that they should set up some sort of automated system regarding orders that have items on backorder in them, if they don't have one already.

Luide wrote:
As for the "Available" being misleading, I disagree. If you only look at the colour and don't bother reading the text accompying it, I say the fault is yours.

I mean, the "typically ships in X days" has been used to tell "We need to buy it from distributor" for at least ten years in web shops, if not longer, and even the Wayland FAQ explicitly says this.

Similarly, other shops are just as badly on the mercy of their suppliers: I've had to wait on orders on Firestorm Games because they were waiting for stock to arrive.

I do agree that they should set up some sort of automated system regarding orders that have items on backorder in them, if they don't have one already.

And that's exactly why it's misleading. All that means is that they have to order it. They don't adjust it for orders that take more than 9 days, as evidenced by this thread.

The Red, Yellow, and Blue Esper Crystals show Available (3-9 days). Assuming Squig ordered one of those (and not one of the In Stock ones) approximately 7 weeks ago that means the "3-9 days" is at best significantly incorrect, and Wayland knows it.
When I've asked in the past, I was told that no one actively goes through and makes sure the 3-9 days is correct unless a specific item is noted that way from their distributor.

Luide wrote:
As for the "Available" being misleading, I disagree. If you only look at the colour and don't bother reading the text accompying it, I say the fault is yours.

I'm actually ok waiting, so it isn't so much that there is a delay. I was perfectly fine waiting a few extra days, even a couple weeks for them to order and get the item available. I knew it wasn't available from the manufacturer at the time because they were doing a second print run.

Here is the thing though... when I ordered it shows "In Stock" just like it does right now currently... that was why I initially made the purchase.


When I ordered it and then a couple months later received notification that it hadn't shipped because they couldn't get it. That was when I noticed it showed "Available". Keep in mind at the time it was still not even available from the manufacturer. No worries, I knew that and figured someone must of beat me to it. I can understand with warehousing sometimes numbers don't mesh up properly, although they should with todays technology. I would be fine waiting until they got it back in, MAS said they should be receiving the second batch soon. 2 months later it still wasn't shipped and on the website it still showed "Available". At the point they knew it wasn't available it should have been changed to "Out of Stock but Arriving Soon" but it wasn't. Once MAS got their product back in stock, I created a ticket. I was told it was coming soon so I waited some more. The website was still showing "Available". A month or so later still no update so I made another ticket and they said that it has shipped. I do hope that now it shows "In Stock" that means my order was shipped, even though my status shows "Awaiting Stock" and Customer Service told me it was shipped out.

So yes it is misleading when they know something isn't available at all but it is still marked as "Available", even if they put 'Typically ships 3-9 Working Days'. At the very least when something hasn't been available for multiple months, it should of been changed to "Out of Stock" but it wasn't, that is the misleading part.

Despite the experience I'm not in the "Don't ever use them camp", was just giving information on my experience with them. I am saying there are definitely some things that should be improved. I don't have to deal with them much since I'm not in the EU/UK area so for me there are usually better options to choose from.

As my own update:

My order from Dark Sphere turned up today. Same order as the one I did with wayland, cost me about £1.50 less (so marginal different, price-wise), and had the same stock level (both companies had the items "in stock" (allegedly)).

Dark Sphere turnaround - 48hours from order to delivery at my door.

Wayland turnaround - 14 days plus. Who know how long I would actually have waited.

 Muddypaw wrote:
I use Wayland once every couple of months. Usually for Knight Models Batman and Marvel stuff for me or Games Workshop stuff for my son. The KM stuff I only order if they have tons in stock (at least 5 or so) and so far they have been fairly reliable.

The GW stuff I usually order WAY ahead of time and only if I dont mind waiting a month or more, and never with newly released products just older stuff. So far the system seems to work but I'd be very wary of ordering anything out of stock that I needed sooner than 2 to 4 weeks.

Overall a bit ropey but worthwhile for cost for those with patience. The two times I've needed to contact them with a problem its been resolved pretty quickly and without fuss.

Are they cheaper than the alternatives for GW stuff? Otherwise I can't see why anyone would bother with ordering and giving "a month or more" as a reasonable timeframe for delivery.

 Azazelx wrote:


Are they cheaper than the alternatives for GW stuff? Otherwise I can't see why anyone would bother with ordering and giving "a month or more" as a reasonable timeframe for delivery.

Depends where you live. For all EU outside of the UK, I would say they are. Within the UK, Darksphere has the same or better prices. (Reason: Wayland offers free worldwide shipping over 40 GBP).
I guess the US have their own budget shops.

Only ever ordered from WG twice - both times took upwards of a month to arrive (this was 12 months ago). Both orders were £150+, both times I had to threaten Trading Standards to even get a direct reply, which wasn't through a forum.. Then got blocked on their FB page for leaving negative feedback.

I won't say they're another Maelstrom, but they are incompetent at worst, useless at best. The use of the same colour typeface for both 'in stock' and 'available' IS misleading, they've been told about it on several occasions but refuse to change it - why? because it gets more sales. Whether it's buyer beware or not is moot point - they're using a system that can be easily confused.

But still, whilst they offer deep discounts, the gamer with a tight budget will use them - I'm lucky enough that I have several LGS's nearby who will price match and don't need to worry about that extra few % anyway.

Will I use them again? Definitely not. Would I recommend them? Certainly not.

I use Wayland all the time and have never had an issue, If I order something that's not in stock I don't mind waiting.

If I'm ever concerned I have a chat with the live support guys and they are always very helpful at saying where the hold up is.

I find they offer the best selection of models all in one place in the UK, which makes life so much more easier for me.

If people are concerned with orders that haven't turned up try the live chat guys or try calling them.

I've used them a few times wi no issues. Total wargamer were the worst

A quick update... I complained on page two about my Order with COD buildings.
Wayland answered in this thread and i replied to him via PM with my Order Details.
I havent got an answer in the Last few days and my Order still says " awaiting stock". Mr wayland told me in this thread that the buildings are always on stock... Very unsatisfying.
But it seems to Look Good in this thread when they answer here.. But Nothing Happens!!!

James811 wrote:
I've used them a few times wi no issues. Total wargamer were the worst

Oddly my best experiences were with Total, although a friend who lives about half a mile away had nothing but BAD experiences with Total.
Maelstrom were reliable until the end neared.
Wayland as I have said I don't trust to have the item in stock even if they say they do, so they're a no go. I'd rather spend an extra couple of quid and get it sooner rather than "its in stock oh no it isnt actually can you wait 3 months better make it 6"

Exactly the same. Everytime I order from Wayland it takes forever even the stuff 'in stock'. And I was offered vouchers. Customer service was not great. This is the fifth order I have done with them and it's ALWAYS bad.
This wasn't Christmas. And I never got my money back because I couldn't be damned to continuously email.
Disgraceful.

Yeah, I switched over to element games recently and havent looked back.

 Hyglar's Hellraiser wrote:
Exactly the same. Everytime I order from Wayland it takes forever even the stuff 'in stock'. And I was offered vouchers. Customer service was not great. This is the fifth order I have done with them and it's ALWAYS bad.
This wasn't Christmas. And I never got my money back because I couldn't be damned to continuously email.
Disgraceful.

And yet you keep ordering from them. That'll teach them! :(

I haven't ordered from them in years so I won't comment on their current state of order fulfillment but if you're unhappy REPEATEDLY then you're in luck... you're in the best spot possible to better your situation. Stop giving them money and find another retailer. If you keep ordering from them to save a few bucks at the cost of your peace of mind, the only message you're sending is that those few bucks are worth it and that they should keep doing whatever it is that they're doing. Whining on a forum while doing the same ol' thing over and over doesn't make a difference.

If it comes across as whining sorry to offend your sensibilities.
Rather I wanted to frame my experience as a reference to someone else. Perhaps then it might do something?
As for repeatedly buying the service for me had gotten worse. I've always expected delays ect with UK miniature buying but it's now at the point where I stop.

I'm glad to hear it. If you're unhappy, that is the only thing that will effect a real change. I don't have a bone to pick with Wayland (my one order from them years had an issue but it was eventually resolved) but I'm simply a proponent for speaking with your wallet. Too few gamers do that in reality.

I have not replied via PM as you asked (Stuart-Wayland) as my WIfe has already emailed you about the order she made back on the 3rd Dec. I don't want to confuse things. At the moment, your westore is saying that all the items on the order are 'In Stock' except one, the Blue Esper Crystal Pack. This is saying 'Available 6-9 days'. Your email response to my Wife was that these same Crystals are 'expected' to be in stock with the supplier in approximtely 10-12 days. They then need shipping to the UK for you to distribute.

Please can you explain WHY your webstore state they are 'Available in 6-9 days' when you know this not to be true. They have had this same status for several weeks now. This is false advertising. This is the reason I have pushed my findings to UK Trading Standards. For a professional company to knowingly state false information is wrong.

At the time of ordering, seven weeks ago, all items on the order were listed as 'In Stock'. Even if seven weeks ago, an item stated 'Available in 6-9 days', it would have arrived before Christmas Day! Your webstore is false advertising, your webstore is very misleading. I myself stopped ordering from you as I've come accross this issue before, I can assure you that it will be the last order my Wife makes from you.

Another example of where it can be misleading or confusing to customers. Eisenkern Keilerkopf APC by Dreamforge Games currently shows it is "Available (Typically ships in 3-0 working days)". However even at Dreamforge Games this item is Sold Out and unavailable for purchase. Now its possible they received some as backer but then you'd think it would say 'In Stock' and maybe they have a supplier who has some available, I don't know. However someone who doesn't follow Dreamforge Games, was just browsing and saw it and ordered it... they would probably be in for a surprise. You would think it should instead be red text, the one they label 'Out of Stock but Arriving Soon'.

I'd like to add that I would love to get one but given my experience, still waiting on my item to arrive, I wouldn't be placing the order with them at this time.

Wow I came to make this thread, good to see my recent experiences with Wayland are not out of the norm.

I used to stand up for them, and look the other way when they took a bit longer than everyone else, but this is now beyond my tolerance.

Ordered some flames of war gear. All listed as "Available"
3 Days pass. No dispatch. Gear "Awaiting Stock" (As an aside, has anyone ever received a dispatch notification from Wayland on Available stock at the 3 day lower end?)
9 days pass. No dispatch. Gear "Awaiting Stock"
Day 12. Get an apology email. Apparently 21cm Nebelwerfers cannot be found anywhere. This despite listing the item as available. I Complain about the label "available", and receive the FAQ page as a copy paste response. I advise they can trade the 21cm Nebelwerfers for the 15cm version.
(As of this post, 21CM NW42 is still listed as "Available" on the website. Despite claiming to me that they cannot order any, they continue to lie to everyone that they can get them in)
Day 15 Without reaching out to me for any sort of clarification, I get a dispatch notification with a 15cm sIG33 gun (Gebirgsjager) instead of the nebelwerfers, which happens to be the first 15cm artillery piece they have listed in that section (lazy)

I complained, and was sent another copy of their FAQ, and told that I can post them back the wrong item at my own expense, and they will replace it. Lol.

Luckily for me, Paypal claim is open, and am contesting this. But this has gone way downhill. Found a slightly more expensive place to get my nebelwerfers, and as long as they don't lie to me, they will continue to get my custom.

 Dark Severance wrote:
Despite the experience I'm not in the "Don't ever use them camp", was just giving information on my experience with them. I am saying there are definitely some things that should be improved.

I change my mind, I am now completely in the "Don't ever use them" camp now. I'm a fairly easy going and understanding person. I submitted a ticket to check on the status and was told it was restocked and shipping out. I even checked on the website (good thing I took the screen capture) and it was no longer showing "Available" but instead showed "In Stock". Today I just received an email stating:

we regret to inform you that we have been notified by our suppliers that the product:

'MICRO-X00001 - War Game Mat 48x48inch District 5'

is currently out of stock and we are currently awaiting a date when we can expect a re-stock to arrive with us.

We sincerely apologise for any inconvenience caused and please rest assured that we are doing everything we can to ship your order as soon as possible

Best Regards,

I noticed now it actually shows "Out of Stock", so apparently they are watching this thread :p I have submitted another ticket because on 1/16 it actually showed "In Stock" and at this point there most likely isn't anything that can be done other than a refund. I know having worked in customer service previously that companies have their good and bad experiences. That is usually why I am fairly easy going and patient but also why I quit doing customer service long ago. However given the circumstances, there just isn't any excuses for it, I've now officially cross over to the "Would not order from again" which is unfortunate because it means I have to pay more usually from other sites but the savings doesn't justify the hassle anymore.

I've placed quite a few orders with them, and never had any problems what so ever, for a range of stuff from several companies.

Wayland isn't going to continue responding, despite the fact that it's been shown their "In Stock" totally-not-stoplight-even-though-its-green has been shown to be a useless metric.

If you can't advertise correct stock levels, or even stock levels that are close to accurate, how do you expect people to take you seriously?

The online discounters are all the same and all suffer from the same issues - I have ordered from all the major players over the years and suffered problems and delays with all of them. I'm currently waiting on a single TIE Defender from Element Games that was ordered back at the beginning of December.

Discounters are at the mercy of their suppliers. The problem is exacerbated in Wayland's case as they are the largest, have the largest turnover of stock and the largest range. They are a victim of their own success, to re-use a hackneyed cliché. That being said the website is not good - the stock system thing is misleading at best. For instance, in the same TIE Defender example given above, Wayland claim to have 54 in stock. Given that Element Games have been unable to get me one for 2 months now, I find it hard to believe Wayland are sitting on a pile of them.

 filbert wrote:
The online discounters are all the same and all suffer from the same issues - I have ordered from all the major players over the years and suffered problems and delays with all of them. I'm currently waiting on a single TIE Defender from Element Games that was ordered back at the beginning of December.

Discounters are at the mercy of their suppliers. The problem is exacerbated in Wayland's case as they are the largest, have the largest turnover of stock and the largest range. They are a victim of their own success, to re-use a hackneyed cliché. That being said the website is not good - the stock system thing is misleading at best. For instance, in the same TIE Defender example given above, Wayland claim to have 54 in stock. Given that Element Games have been unable to get me one for 2 months now, I find it hard to believe Wayland are sitting on a pile of them.

Call me when you're making a reasonable comparison; X-Wing is notorious for being virtually impossible to get hold of in the EU, so using that as an example is hardly fair. Wayland have repeatedly failed to obtain stuff from suppliers even when we're talking about readily available product like GW.