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Post by: caylentor
 His Master's Voice wrote:So what's the pre-order date for this release? I need two Carnosaurs.
Actually, maybe three - one wyvern, one dragon, one carnosaur.
Looks like 27/07 for preorders - Looks like I also need more dinosaurs :(
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Post by: mixer86
I think my lizards will come back to the field with this release.
Think i prefer the trog to the carnosaur. like the bastil, wanna see rules for the variants.
Also interested in how slaan disciplines now work as the bat rep mentioned becalming cogitation.
hopefully the slaan won't get raped too badly.
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Post by: Warboss Imbad Ironskull
Ok after seeing some clearer pics I am taking back my comment about the Bastilodon, my problem was the head and now that I can see it in better detail it's actually a pretty decent model.
I absolutly love the Troglodon especially now that I've seen it's head at another angle but I'm still not sure about the Carnosaur. To me it looks like the Thanator from Avatar and with the length of its forearms it looks like it would be a quadraped instead of the bipedal predator that the current fluff (and every bit of artwork) portrays it as, I wish they would have just gone back to the original sculpt and tweaked it to work better as a plastic miniature. I'm also not a fan of the head so I may just try putting the old Carnosaur head on the model and see if that improves it as right now it looks more like this
than this
I'm really not a fan of the underbite birds or the tweezer heads. To me it seems like every time GW tries to make a new Terradon model they just get uglier and uglier, I wish they would have done something more like these.
And I'm still sad we didn't get one of these
Or these
Or something like this
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Post by: Manchu
I'm not sad about missing any of those -- especially the hybrid (what to call it? Skinknight? and isn't that rejected concept art from a failed Jurassic Park sequel?) and the T-Rex. Don't get me wrong, I think the T-Rex is a fascinating and awesome-looking animal. But I prefer things a little more fantastical in my fantasy.
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Post by: Warboss Imbad Ironskull
The Hybrid is scrapped concept art for a Jurassic Park movie. The T-rex is a comparison for what the Carnosaur should look like versus what it does look like.
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Post by: Saphos
I flicked through the WD today. The models are really cool imho. Lizardmen now have the most consistent modelline in WH Fantasy imho. Luckily I don´t have the money as otherwise I´d start collecting them. I especially like the Teradons. Very characterful models.
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Post by: Manchu
Yeah, that's where we disagree. Even the old Carnosaur does not look like a T-Rex.
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Post by: Warboss Imbad Ironskull
 Manchu wrote:Yeah, that's where we disagree. Even the old Carnosaur does not look like a T-Rex.
Never said it looked like a t-rex, I said that it should look more like a T-rex (or for that matter any Theropod) then it currently does. It should have a blockier more powerfull head and at least slightly smaller fore limbs as that is closer to the description that the Carnosaur has always had versus it's current appearance which is closer to the first picture I posted. I could change the picture to be that of a carnosaur, allosaur, albertosaur, charcarodontosaur, gigantosaur or any number of Theropods and my point would still be the same.
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Post by: ceorron
 Warboss Imbad Ironskull wrote: Never said it looked like a t-rex, I said that it should look more like a T-rex (or for that matter any Theropod) then it currently does. It should have a blockier more powerfull head and at least slightly smaller fore limbs as that is closer to the description that the Carnosaur has always had versus it's current appearance which is closer to the first picture I posted. I could change the picture to be that of a carnosaur, allosaur, albertosaur, charcarodontosaur, gigantosaur or any number of Theropods and my point would still be the same.
I really have to agree with this, it is the front arms that are a bit wrong really. The head too, which is surprising seen as it clearly has a alternate head from the troglodon. The front arms are unfortunate, all these seem to be compromises to make it a dual kit bar the head which must simple be a design change. Sometime it might be good for GW to follow the mantra of 'if it ain't broke don't fix it' but like I said earlier their rampant creativity must have got the better of them this time. Shame the same can't be said of the naming team.  Anyway solid release. The Ripperdactyls are really growing on me too.
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Post by: Manchu
For what reason "should" a carnosaur look like a T-Rex?
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Post by: ceorron
Manchu wrote:For what reason "should" a carnosaur look like a T-Rex?
It doesn't but people expected it to look more like the older one with shorter forarms and more supporting rear legs with most of the "weight" at the rear like a T-Rex. No reason other than that. I think it will definitely grow on people.
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Post by: Kroothawk
In German, the Ripperdactyl is called Raptodaktylus, a slight improvement.
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Post by: Manchu
To me, the old Carnosaur model does not look like T-Rex or an animal that is balanced to walk exclusively on two legs.
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Post by: ceorron
I just has a good look at the model in unconverted form and to me it does seem to be walking only on two legs but that may just be how I imagine it moves. Automatically Appended Next Post: Actually proof straight from the GW site that the original design was a T-Rex alike.  http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/catalog/productDetail.jsp?prodId=prod1130146&setLocale=en_AU&_requestid=1377637 The original for reference. 
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Post by: AHReese
I know this has been asked often but I've yet to see a response as of yet.
For those that have the White Dwarf - are there any signs that current plastic kits are being increased in price or reduced in model number?
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Post by: Manchu
There is a lot of weight on the front end of that animal and not much in the way of tail thickness to counter balance it. The structure and pose indicate to me that it has reared/drawn up and is about to lunge.
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Post by: Warboss Imbad Ironskull
Manchu wrote:
There is a lot of weight on the front end of that animal and not much in the way of tail thickness to counter balance it. The structure and pose indicate to me that it has reared/drawn up and is about to lunge.
You're really hung up on the whole t-rex thing aren't you
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Post by: Manchu
I'm not the one who says a fantasy model "should" look like a real animal.
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Post by: CthuluIsSpy
The carnosaur looks more like a cat to me than a T-Rex.
Well, its overall posture that it.
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Post by: Manchu
I agree, it does have a feline quality -- maybe because it's kind of skulky-looking? To me, the new model looks more like a dinosaur.
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Post by: ceorron
Looking at it it does seem to have a long body with a lot of weight over the front. Must be we just imagined it more like a T-Rex and assumed the old interpretation as a bit off compared to the original Warmaster model which is clearly a T-Rex.
We will just have to agree to disagree.
Though you are right certainly has a lot of weight over the front and not much to counter balance with with that tail.
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Post by: Warboss Imbad Ironskull
Manchu wrote:I'm not the one who says a fantasy model "should" look like a real animal.
Manchu wrote:To me, the new model looks more like a dinosaur.
So instead of saying it "should" look like a real animal you're saying it "does" look like a real animal
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Post by: NAVARRO
Well I even like these more now with the clearer pictures.
I can see so many uses for these because lizards can fit so many different settings and games.
Really good stuff.
Only thing left to do is some really small lizards 15mm sized, like the nurglings kits, now that would be the cherry on top of this good release.
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Post by: Manchu
 ceorron wrote:Must be we just imagined it more like a T-Rex and assumed the old interpretation as a bit off compared to the original Warmaster model which is clearly a T-Rex.
Yeah, if you think the Carnosaur should be more like a T-Rex then the current and new models are definitely off. But the current Carnosaur has been around for a while now. Um yeah. "Should" means you know what the Carnosaur is supposed to look like. I don't know how you can back that claim up. When I say the new Carnosaur looks more like a dinosaur than a cat, I'm not asserting any authority over what this fictional animal is supposed to look like. To me, I like that the new Carnosaur looks more like a dinosaur than a cat. Maybe you would like it if the new Carnosaur looked more like a T-Rex than what it does but you are in no position to say what it should look like. I get it, you'd like the fantasy animal to look more like a real animal. That's why I said to you, I prefer fantasy animals to look somewhat fantastical.
 NAVARRO wrote:I can see so many uses for these because lizards can fit so many different settings and games.
I've been wondering where the Exodite fans are.
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Post by: RiTides
NAVARRO wrote:Well I even like these more now with the clearer pictures.
I can see so many uses for these because lizards can fit so many different settings and games.
Really good stuff.
Only thing left to do is some really small lizards 15mm sized, like the nurglings kits, now that would be the cherry on top of this good release.
Agreed with all of the above! Especially the really small lizards... I've actually been looking for some cthulhu type of that size. Anyone have ideas / products that are available that might fill that niche?
I love the skink with a mask on the new terradon kit, and the masked bloodbowl skinks, but the normal skink models are not really my cup of tea and I've been searching for alternates.
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Post by: Warboss Imbad Ironskull
Manchu wrote: ceorron wrote:Must be we just imagined it more like a T-Rex and assumed the old interpretation as a bit off compared to the original Warmaster model which is clearly a T-Rex.
Yeah, if you think the Carnosaur should be more like a T-Rex then the current and models are definitely off. But the current Carnosaur has been around for a while now. Um yeah. "Should" means you know what the Carnosaur is supposed to look like. I don't know how you can back that claim up. When I say the new Carnosaur looks more like a dinosaur than a cat, I'm not asserting any authority over what this fictional animal is supposed to look like. To me, I like that the new Carnosaur looks more like a dinosaur than a cat. Maybe you would like it if the new Carnosaur looked more like a T-Rex than what it does but you are in no position to say what it should look like. I get it, you'd like the fantasy animal to look more like a real animal. That's why I said to you, I prefer fantasy animals to look somewhat fantastical.
I find it funny you're giving me grief for saying it should look like a real animal and then you turn around and say it does look like a real animal. And you may like to have your fantasy animals be more fantastical but that does not change the fact that they are inspired and based off of real world examples.
So how about this, it is my opinion that the new Carnosaur should look more like the previous Carnosaur which is arguably based off of Theropod Dinosaurs such as the T-rex.
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Post by: RiTides
Probably best to agree to disagree guys... you're kind of dragging the thread OT.
Folks can have different preferences- some people like more realistic looking monsters, some crazier ones. No reason to look down on either's argument, imo... both are completely valid and simply a matter of taste!
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Post by: NAVARRO
 RiTides wrote: NAVARRO wrote:Well I even like these more now with the clearer pictures.
I can see so many uses for these because lizards can fit so many different settings and games.
Really good stuff.
Only thing left to do is some really small lizards 15mm sized, like the nurglings kits, now that would be the cherry on top of this good release.
Agreed with all of the above! Especially the really small lizards... I've actually been looking for some cthulhu type of that size. Anyone have ideas / products that are available that might fill that niche?
I love the skink with a mask on the new terradon kit, and the masked bloodbowl skinks, but the normal skink models are not really my cup of tea and I've been searching for alternates.
Khurasan miniatures has some small lizards, but I don't think those fill the bill.
I would buy plenty of small lizards if I could find some cool ones.
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Post by: Warboss Imbad Ironskull
RiTides wrote:Probably best to agree to disagree guys... you're kind of dragging the thread OT.
Folks can have different preferences- some people like more realistic looking monsters, some crazier ones. No reason to look down on either's argument, imo... both are completely valid and simply a matter of taste!
Ok ok, apologies to the thread as well as Manchu for the misunderstanding. Back on topic
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Post by: Manchu
Warboss Imbad Ironskull wrote:I find it funny you're giving me grief for saying it should look like a real animal and then you turn around and say it does look like a real animal.
"Should" versus "does" -- the difference is pretty obvious. I don't know what a Carnosaur should look like. But I can tell you what it does look like from seeing a picture of it. Warboss Imbad Ironskull wrote:So how about this, it is my opinion that the new Carnosaur should look more like the previous Carnosaur which is arguably based off of Theropod Dinosaurs such as the T-rex.
If by previous, you mean this one then I definitely disagree. The old Warmaster one looks a lot more like a T-Rex and the new Carnosaur looks much more like the current one than the Warmaster one. No need to apologize -- this is a discussion forum and you and I are discussing the new Lizardmen models, which is the topic of this thread. I mean, just because we have different opinions doesn't mean we can't talk about it. No doubt you are not alone in preferring a more T-Rex-like Carnosaur. As ceorron pointed out, apparently GW apparently wanted that back in the day, too! It looks a lot more like a theropod than either of the more recent Carnosaur models.
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Post by: RiTides
NAVARRO wrote:Khurasan miniatures has some small lizards, but I don't think those fill the bill.
I would buy plenty of small lizards if I could find some cool ones.
Argh, their site never seems to work for me. Do you have the model / line name or a link to a pic?
I'll be looking for some other possibilities, too, and will post up any I find 
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Post by: Alpharius
LOVING the one on the left - the Spinosaurus looking beast! Now I'm hoping allies show up in the next WFB edition, because I need an excuse to buy, paint and field one! And no, starting a new WFB Army (Lizardmen) is NOT the excuse I'm looking for!
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Post by: Manchu
Spinosaurus with catfish barbs -- looks crazy cool to these eyes.
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Post by: Kanluwen
Troglodon!
I want to paint one too.
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Post by: Lord Scythican
What is the model on the right side of this picture?
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Post by: Scrub
That would be one of these:- http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/catalog/productDetail.jsp?catId=cat440111a&prodId=prod1870062a
Warriors of Chaos mutalith vortex beast, hilariously ugly model with a ridiculous price tag as far as I'm concerned but a friend utterly adores his... xD
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Post by: nels1031
Slaughterbrute. Came out a few months ago for Chaos Warriors
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Post by: Juicifer
I'm loving the diversity in these designs!
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Post by: Lord Scythican
Thanks for letting me know you all. Somehow I missed that model coming out...
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Post by: RiTides
 Alpharius wrote:
LOVING the one on the left - the Spinosaurus looking beast! Now I'm hoping allies show up in the next WFB edition, because I need an excuse to buy, paint and field one! And no, starting a new WFB Army (Lizardmen) is NOT the excuse I'm looking for!
Yeah, I really like that variant! If I were running lizardmen I'd field that alongside the old carnosaur (also to have different poses- otherwise all the big beasties would share the same stance / pose).
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Post by: Warboss Imbad Ironskull
Apart of me wonders if the Troglodon name is a reference to back when the Slaan and the Lizardmen had nothing to do with eachother. In the older fluff the Slann where their own race while the Lizardmen lived underground, at the time the Lizardmen equivalent of a Kroxigor was called a Troglodyte (though they weren't allies of the Lizardmen).
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Post by: CthuluIsSpy
Slaughterbrute, actually. I prefer the mutalith, though that one arm sticking out is a bit silly.
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Post by: jonolikespie
Anyone else noticing that all the different coloured carnosaus we are seeing are in the exact same pose?
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Post by: Dr. Cheesesteak
yeah, I uhh,...I really need some more money.
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Post by: Altruizine
 jonolikespie wrote:Anyone else noticing that all the different coloured carnosaus we are seeing are in the exact same pose?
Is that a surprise? Most big monster kits sacrifice poseability for dynamism/realism. Heck, everything from infantry on up has been trending that way since around 3rd/4th edition.
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Post by: jonolikespie
Altruizine wrote: jonolikespie wrote:Anyone else noticing that all the different coloured carnosaus we are seeing are in the exact same pose?
Is that a surprise? Most big monster kits sacrifice poseability for dynamism/realism. Heck, everything from infantry on up has been trending that way since around 3rd/4th edition.
And that is a very bad thing if you want more than one
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Post by: Chaplain Pallantide
Is it just me or do the skinks look like they got the better end of the deal sculpt wise? I am not a fan of the Saurus warriors at all. If I were to ever go for lizardmen again, I would try to build a mostly skink army if at all viable.
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Post by: Altruizine
jonolikespie wrote:Altruizine wrote: jonolikespie wrote:Anyone else noticing that all the different coloured carnosaus we are seeing are in the exact same pose?
Is that a surprise? Most big monster kits sacrifice poseability for dynamism/realism. Heck, everything from infantry on up has been trending that way since around 3rd/4th edition.
And that is a very bad thing if you want more than one
Go forth and convert, my son!
I like the current paradigm. It means that someone who doesn't have the time/ability/inclination to tackle a conversion can still have a really nice looking model that is elaborately posed and not just standing straight with flat/ball jointed limb attachments (which is generally the stance you have to accept in exchange for poseability). Anybody who wants multiples of a single unit should either be happy with monoposes, or willing to customize their second+ copies of the model.
It's almost impossible to reconcile dynamism with poseability, particularly in WHFB where most creatures are organic. It's a little easier to pull off with things like giant robots on the 40K side.
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Post by: Kanluwen
I just want to point out that with some of these "big monster kits", even just swapping some of the components from the different monster types can give you something far better.
The Zombie Dragon/Terrorgheist are one such example where if you use the Terrorgheist's wing assembly it gives you a more dynamic looking Zombie Dragon without interfering with the Zombie Dragon or rider builds.
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Post by: highlord tamburlaine
Can anyone tell if the various carnosaur riders have different parts (aside from their heads)?
I hope to cobble together an assortment of new champions and old bloods, especially since gor-rok or whatever his name is wasn't quite as impressive as I'd hope.
I like my lizards looking blinged out, as they should be. I need a few more torsos to choose from before I succumb to having to try sculpting them some extra details out of green stuff.
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Post by: unmercifulconker
I imagine there will be a range of parts for the riders and I also hope itll leave one to be made on to a normal base.
Well find out tonight and I cant wait.
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Post by: Rippy
These are some of the coolest models I have seen from GW in ages! It is seriously making me consider starting a WHFB / Lizardmen army!
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Post by: RiTides
What's the usual time between preorder and release? If preorder is this Saturday (July 27th) does that mean the release should be 2 weeks later (August 10th)?
I'm very interested in picking up the book, at least... hopefully a much greater variety of army builds are viable than with the current book.
Edit: For those who want big dinos posed differently, just use the new kit as a Troglodon, and the old kit as a Carnosaur
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Post by: Snrub
Mmmm they are some nice looking dinosaurs.
I think it's about time to start a Lizardman army.
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Post by: HoverBoy
RiTides wrote:What's the usual time between preorder and release? If preorder is this Saturday (July 27th) does that mean the release should be 2 weeks later (August 10th)?
It was 1 week for Tau which is the last time i pre-ordered GW things.
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Post by: Kroothawk
RiTides wrote:What's the usual time between preorder and release? If preorder is this Saturday (July 27th) does that mean the release should be 2 weeks later (August 10th)?
Preorders up in about 4 hours, release 3rd August.
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Post by: RiTides
Excellent, thanks!
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Post by: airmang
$1600 one-click bundle!!! Holy cow!!
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Post by: gilljoy
Anyone know the cheapest retailer in the UK to pre-order these?
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Post by: Brother SRM
I'm happy to see GW put out a big monster kit that actually looks solid. After all the ugly ones that came with Storm of Magic and Chaos and all that, it's a relief to see these. I'm sincerely impressed with these models, and I'm happy that Fantasy is getting such a good looking release. Seriously good looking stuff here.
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Post by: AHReese
gilljoy wrote:Anyone know the cheapest retailer in the UK to pre-order these?
Probably Wayland Games.
A good chuckle at the 1 click dollections. But its really nice to see everything in detail now. Happy that it doesn't appear that any of the current range is being increased in price or reduced in model count.
I also really like the look of the Oldblood on the Carnosaur. Hopefully it's pretty straight forward to detach/reattach him for on foot duty.
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Post by: gilljoy
AHReese wrote:gilljoy wrote:Anyone know the cheapest retailer in the UK to pre-order these?
Probably Wayland Games.
A good chuckle at the 1 click dollections. But its really nice to see everything in detail now. Happy that it doesn't appear that any of the current range is being increased in price or reduced in model count.
I also really like the look of the Oldblood on the Carnosaur. Hopefully it's pretty straight forward to detach/reattach him for on foot duty.
It even says in the description there's extra bits to have them on foot if they're not used, I think this is pretty sweet
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Post by: Necros
I preordered the limited army book and cards. I'll wait till the models are at the FLGS and get them there I hate how ya gotta buy limited stuff right from GW if you want any hope of getting it :(
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Post by: jah-joshua
just downloaded the new WD mag...
the pics look so good, and the Terradon kit comes with a Mexican Staring Frog!!!
i'm liking the look of the plastics...
GD Marco Columbo looks really good...
a cool alternative to the original...
i hope they can actually cast him well...
i didn't hear many reviews of last year's casting quality, so that could be a good sign after the fiasco of the 25th anniversary Crimson Fist...
looks like a good issue this month...
i'm looking forward to the battle report to see the Lizards in action...
cheers
jah
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Post by: Ferrum_Sanguinis
And absolutely no savings on it of course...
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Post by: RiTides
I only see an $800-some dollar one?
Regardless, looks like (finally!) a fantastic fantasy release on GW's part. Credit where credit is due
I'll probably pick up the book in a week to read through and pretend I could/would spend all that money (or more like, to consider running some other models I'm waiting on for a count-as LM force).
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Post by: Bolognesus
http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/catalog/productDetail.jsp?catId=cat440004a&prodId=prod2180004a
€1313,50, should be 1600ish bucks.
To be fair that thing is two or three armies' worth of minis, in all likelyhood.
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Post by: Zappit
So...weird thing. Just opened my White Dwarf app, and the new one started downloading, no purchase made. Were they giving this one away?
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Post by: Ecarhil
You can check the models on the gw site btw. They are up now.
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Post by: Sigvatr
How stupid is GW please? Who is going to buy a "1 click deal" for 1300€? Just wow.
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Post by: DarkStarSabre
The bundles are hilariously bad. The Temple Guard one made me wince and then I realised they now charge about £30 a box for them - so very glad I got my Temple Guard back when they were £15 for a box.
But Credit where due. The Carnosaur however seems to be now mounted on a Chariot base. Still going to stick with the 50x50 mm ones I got with them. Too much effort to frankenstein a new base for them.
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Post by: Olly
I love the 1 click deals, they save you like a whole 30 seconds  my time is valuable!
On a serious note I love the carnasour kit now, looks muuuuch more predatory. Not a fan of the other big monster, the characters all look really solid as well
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Post by: AlmightyWalrus
Games Workshop wrote:Warhammer Battle Magic: Lizardmen contains 8 spells from the Lore of High Magic as described in Warhammer: Lizardmen. They are printed on individual cards as a handy reference for use in your battles.
Each full-colour card describes one spell, and all the information you need to use it on the battlefield, including spell type, casting value and range. As well as the 6 spells from the Lore of High Magic, this set also includes the 2 signature spells for the Lizardmen: Drain Magic, and Soul Quench. Not only are the spell cards a great, tactile way of representing magic in your games but on a practical level they make selecting spells easy and speed up play in the heat of battle.
Emphasis mine. That should settle that question about Lizardmen magic, right?
As a side-note, I kinda like that the Troglodon, true to it's name, doesn't have any eyes.
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Post by: Backfire
 Brother SRM wrote:I'm happy to see GW put out a big monster kit that actually looks solid. After all the ugly ones that came with Storm of Magic and Chaos and all that, it's a relief to see these. I'm sincerely impressed with these models, and I'm happy that Fantasy is getting such a good looking release. Seriously good looking stuff here.
Yeah, amazing how the monsters start to look good when they don't have hugely exaggarated proportions. This is best Fantasy stuff since Tomb Kings.
The pic where Carnosaur and Slaughterbrute are next to each other is telling, the models are so visually apart they don't look like they belong to same gaming system.
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Post by: Zond
These minis look fantastic. I can easily see me picking up all of them just for something to paint, however if anyone has any ideas on what else to use them for I'm all ears.
Tempted to use the new Tomorrows War rules to essentially do Avatar now that I think about it actually.
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Post by: OrlandotheTechnicoloured
gilljoy wrote:Anyone know the cheapest retailer in the UK to pre-order these?
Dark Sphere has some pretty good discounts, and is reliable (though 3rd party retailers and GW new releases may always be tricky)
http://www.darksphere.co.uk/pgc.php?c=125
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Post by: RiTides
I'm just glad GW didn't continue their obssession with the HUGE 100mm x 150mm base. A chariot base is not bad by comparison (50mm x 100mm).
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Post by: Fezman
Agreed, I posted something similar earlier in this thread...I'm sure the pterodactyl thingies could make a decent jet bike count-as, if they weren't too hard to convert.
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Post by: sing your life
Those miniatures look great. I espically like the Skink priest.
Oh and is anyone else noticing the lack of Updated metal models?
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Post by: CthuluIsSpy
 sing your life wrote:Those miniatures look great. I espically like the Skink priest.
Oh and is anyone else noticing the lack of Updated metal models?
Yeah, you'd think they would finally release a plastic krox kit at this point, or a resin Tehenehuin.
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Post by: Saldiven
 Sigvatr wrote:How stupid is GW please? Who is going to buy a "1 click deal" for 1300€? Just wow.
Especially when the total price is the exact same thing as buying each item individually. There's no incentive for anyone to make that purchase.
GW has to be the only retailer in the world that doesn't understand the concept of a bulk purchase discount.
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Post by: Charles Rampant
Zappit wrote:So...weird thing. Just opened my White Dwarf app, and the new one started downloading, no purchase made. Were they giving this one away?
I had the exact same thing. I wasn't complaining, but it is kinda odd.
Love the new models. Can I justify one, when I only play TK in fantasy? 
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Post by: Sheep
Wholesalers get a discount from GW for bulk orders, so its strange that they havent grasped the concept for retail.
Oh well, there were online retailers that matched the contents of the eldar one click deals with a discount, maybe they'll do so again.
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Post by: RiTides
sing your life wrote:Those miniatures look great. I espically like the Skink priest.
Oh and is anyone else noticing the lack of Updated metal models?
Are kroxigor not offered in finecast?
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Post by: CthuluIsSpy
RiTides wrote: sing your life wrote:Those miniatures look great. I espically like the Skink priest. Oh and is anyone else noticing the lack of Updated metal models?
Are kroxigor not offered in finecast?
They are, but that was way back when Finecast was introduced. You'd expect that they would make them plastic for the this update so that people would actually get them. I have never seen krox on the field, which is a pity because they are pretty cool.
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Post by: Flashman
Design wise, this is arguably the best Fantasy release of the year.
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Post by: CthuluIsSpy
 Flashman wrote:Design wise, this is arguably the best Fantasy release of the year.
Yes. So much better than the derpy Chaos Warriors release and the bland high elves.
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Post by: adhuin
 Bolognesus wrote:http://www.games-workshop.com/ gws/catalog/productDetail.jsp?catId=cat440004a&prodId=prod2180004a
€1313,50, should be 1600ish bucks.
To be fair that thing is two or three armies' worth of minis, in all likelyhood.
Funny part: This is the Most humongous war party that is lead by a Slann Mage Priest and they decide to protect him with full elite cadre of ten (10) Temple Guards!
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Post by: Schmapdi
 adhuin wrote:
Funny part: This is the Most humongous war party that is lead by a Slann Mage Priest and they decide to protect him with full elite cadre of ten (10) Temple Guards!
Yes - that army deal seems to be a ploy to try to unload excess cold one cavalry.
It seems weird to me they stuck everything in special too.
The carnosaur made it rare - so there must be some sort of variant that is a rare choice (which is weird - since all variants have a character riding them). But both Bastilidons, both Terradon variants are packed into the already crowded special.
Worse still they moved Jungle Swarms from core to special too! It'll be like having a High Elves army, lore and all.
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Post by: The Shadow
I'm actually not a big fan of the Carnosaur, I just don't like it's face, too piggish. I honestly think the old Carnosaur is better. If you blow that up to a bigger size, it'd be better, imo.
Other than that, the other models look really good. Another good-looking release for Fantasy, which is great to see. It's sad that they didn't redo the Cold One Cavalry though, they're in serious need of a new kit.
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Post by: kronicpsycho
O god no... I must finish my high elf army! I MUST STAY FOCUSED! I must burn my computer now, so I don't have to look at the awesomeness anymore!
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Post by: AegisGrimm
I have not read this entire thread, but is there a reason the Troglodon doesn't have eyes? I can't see any on the model?
As for Eldar Exodites......that would be pretty cool!
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Post by: jah-joshua
 AegisGrimm wrote:I have not read this entire thread, but is there a reason the Troglodon doesn't have eyes? I can't see any on the model?
As for Eldar Exodites......that would be pretty cool!
i would assume, from the name, that it is a cave dwelling dino...
no need for eyes in the dark, but those feelers would do the trick instead...
EDIT: i just read the design article in WD for the Troglodon, and it is indeed a blind cave dweller...
i just downloaded the sample of the new Army Book...
man, it looks good...
the art is sick!!!
release date is Aug. 3rd...
cheers
jah
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Post by: DukeRustfield
 CthuluIsSpy wrote:Yeah, you'd think they would finally release a plastic krox kit at this point, or a resin Tehenehuin.
They only offer stuff in plastic or resin or metal. They offered Krox in resin a while ago. While you might not like resin, they're unlikely to release everything in multi-format. They haven't that I've seen yet. At least not the same sculpts.
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Post by: sockwithaticket
Has anyone else noticed that they seem to have shunted the eyes further forward on the Saurus characters that come with the Carnosaur. Looked weird at first, but I really kind of like it.
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Post by: Rippy
Great models, I am think I am going to have to start WHFB and lizardmen. Damn you GW, damn youuuuuu!!!!
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Post by: AlmightyWalrus
So, how is High Magic going to work with the Lizardmen? Both Hand of Glory and Walk Between Worlds seem much better for them than for High Elves, for example.
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Post by: timetowaste85
Saldiven wrote: Sigvatr wrote:How stupid is GW please? Who is going to buy a "1 click deal" for 1300€? Just wow.
Especially when the total price is the exact same thing as buying each item individually. There's no incentive for anyone to make that purchase.
GW has to be the only retailer in the world that doesn't understand the concept of a bulk purchase discount.
Actually, I just took the time to go through based on their description, not based on the picture, and the cost is HIGHER than what they claim you get. Based on the listed models, the American cost should ring in at 1592.25. They are charging 1601.25. Now, I realize the picture could be the correct version, and the price may be correct for that, but going by the models listed, they are charging MORE for a 1-click bundle. Don't believe me, check for yourself. Again, going by the numbers listed in the description, not the picture.
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Post by: DarkStarSabre
 AlmightyWalrus wrote:So, how is High Magic going to work with the Lizardmen? Both Hand of Glory and Walk Between Worlds seem much better for them than for High Elves, for example.
All I'm going to say is Becalming Cogitation + Drain Magic.
Enjoy your magic phase. You aren't getting one.
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Post by: AlmightyWalrus
 DarkStarSabre wrote: AlmightyWalrus wrote:So, how is High Magic going to work with the Lizardmen? Both Hand of Glory and Walk Between Worlds seem much better for them than for High Elves, for example.
All I'm going to say is Becalming Cogitation + Drain Magic.
Enjoy your magic phase. You aren't getting one.
I'm assuming that Becalming Cogitation isn't going to be around in the 7th edition incarnation in the new book, because (as you say) that'd be silly.
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Post by: TheAvengingKnee
I am really looking forward to the new codex, The new bastilidon looks great and I definitely want one, I wish they gave some kind of hint what the version with the ark does, but it looks like a great creature to add to my lists.
Any idea what slot it will take up or any idea points wise what it will run?
I am hoping some stuff gets a bit cheaper, like Chakax because I love the model but he is not nearly worth his current points.
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Post by: Kanluwen
I do not know if it was noticed earlier or not, but apparently the Troglodon is actually blind.
There are no eyes at all.
What looked at first to be 'antlers' on the front are seemingly feelers/antennae similar to those on a catfish.
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Post by: HoverBoy
AlmightyWalrus wrote: DarkStarSabre wrote: AlmightyWalrus wrote:So, how is High Magic going to work with the Lizardmen? Both Hand of Glory and Walk Between Worlds seem much better for them than for High Elves, for example.
All I'm going to say is Becalming Cogitation + Drain Magic.
Enjoy your magic phase. You aren't getting one.
I'm assuming that Becalming Cogitation isn't going to be around in the 7th edition incarnation in the new book, because (as you say) that'd be silly.
Becalming was used in the WD battle so yea...
TheAvengingKnee wrote:I am really looking forward to the new codex, The new bastilidon looks great and I definitely want one, I wish they gave some kind of hint what the version with the ark does, but it looks like a great creature to add to my lists.
Any idea what slot it will take up or any idea points wise what it will run?
I am hoping some stuff gets a bit cheaper, like Chakax because I love the model but he is not nearly worth his current points.
The preview pages from WD put it in rare.
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Post by: ThouShallNotHeal
Not a fan of the new carnosaur.
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Post by: unmercifulconker
I am sure the battle report listed the Bastiladons as special. I also though the Troglodon would be a Lord or hero but is a rare.
Absoloutely love the carnosaur kit, the SC variant in particular is just menacing.
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Post by: TheAvengingKnee
HoverBoy wrote:AlmightyWalrus wrote: DarkStarSabre wrote: AlmightyWalrus wrote:So, how is High Magic going to work with the Lizardmen? Both Hand of Glory and Walk Between Worlds seem much better for them than for High Elves, for example.
All I'm going to say is Becalming Cogitation + Drain Magic.
Enjoy your magic phase. You aren't getting one.
I'm assuming that Becalming Cogitation isn't going to be around in the 7th edition incarnation in the new book, because (as you say) that'd be silly.
Becalming was used in the WD battle so yea...
TheAvengingKnee wrote:I am really looking forward to the new codex, The new bastilidon looks great and I definitely want one, I wish they gave some kind of hint what the version with the ark does, but it looks like a great creature to add to my lists.
Any idea what slot it will take up or any idea points wise what it will run?
I am hoping some stuff gets a bit cheaper, like Chakax because I love the model but he is not nearly worth his current points.
The preview pages from WD put it in rare.
Awesome, if temple guard stay as Special then I will definitely be using one, it will bring something to my lists that they are currently lacking. Have there been any hints as to what the ark might do?
ThouShallNotHeal wrote:Not a fan of the new carnosaur.
Same here, also not a fan of the new carnosaur price at $85($11 more than a land raider) it is not something that I will probably want to add to my lists.
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Post by: ThouShallNotHeal
IIRC it's over 100$ here.
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Post by: TheAvengingKnee
That is even worse, at $60(here) the Bastiladon is not cheap but looks amazing and I think would make a great addition to my army(and makes me want to get the book just to see what it does).
The carnosaur at it's price point just doesn't seem like something I really want bad enough.
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Post by: ThouShallNotHeal
Thankfully, Bitzbarn delivers here so we CAN get the discount. But at a 3+ week wait.
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Post by: TheAvengingKnee
Ouch, that's a long time to wait, at least it will give you time to decide what build you want it to be. I was happy that at least you can turn the spare parts into other models so there is at least some added value from that, though it still isn't cheap.
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Post by: The Division Of Joy
One thing is for certain, you'll need to have some painting skills to do these models justice
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Post by: TheAvengingKnee
I can say for certain, I will not
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Post by: HoverBoy
Me too
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Post by: d-usa
$1600, book to use the models not included!
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Post by: TheAvengingKnee
Yeah, I wonder how many people bought it.
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Post by: nathan2004
Went to gamesday yesterday met Mr Vetock (really cool dude BTW) saw the Lizardmen book. Saurus are the same but gained PF, Templars went down in points by the cost of a Slave, Skinks stay the same from what i saw and the slann goes up by 12 and a half slaves. Becalming just let's you reroll your first failed dispel attempt IIRC. Those are the things that stood out to me. Overall from what i saw looked to be a solid release, he told me he had written the book a year and a half ago and Robin Cruddance helped him with the design. He's worked on it and play tested it in that time.
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Post by: highlord tamburlaine
I'm going to have to see a built carnosaur in person before I can bring myself to plunk down the money for something that (relatively) expensive.
I know my kids want me to get one, but once again we have a model that suffers from the "giant monster on one leg syndrome." Those don't do well with my enthusiastic kids. Stability is a big concern for me.
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Post by: RiTides
 nathan2004 wrote:Went to gamesday yesterday met Mr Vetock (really cool dude BTW) saw the Lizardmen book. Saurus are the same but gained PF, Templars went down in points by the cost of a Slave, Skinks stay the same from what i saw and the slann goes up by 12 and a half slaves. Becalming just let's you reroll your first failed dispel attempt IIRC. Those are the things that stood out to me. Overall from what i saw looked to be a solid release, he told me he had written the book a year and a half ago and Robin Cruddance helped him with the design. He's worked on it and play tested it in that time.
Thanks for passing this on it is appreciated!
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Post by: Aerethan
Having looked in the back of the BRB, what is "PF"?
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Post by: ThouShallNotHeal
Powerfist or Pathfinder? Lol.
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Post by: Cryptek of Awesome
Clearly Saurus warriors get power fists now!
or maybe Power Faces...
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Post by: ThouShallNotHeal
or the samurai power force.
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Post by: HoverBoy
A new lizardmen thing called primal fighter, apparently.
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Post by: kronicpsycho
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Post by: nathan2004
A new ability called Predatory fighter which means for any roll of a 6 to hit they get an extra attack. Kroxigor have it too and they cost 25 slaves. Salamanders breath weapon is str 4 and slow to fire. Oh and lastly Slann can't be loremaster of any lore anymore just high magic and it's one of the disciplines. Some of the magic items i noticed were the Piranha blade, Blade of realities, and swiftstride banner. He told me his approach to writing the book was not to nerf them but to balance and take away things that were OP like cupped hands was the example he gave me. I'm not even a LM player and i was pleased to hear that! I hope that trend continues. Oh and i couldn't resist the temptation to complain about 8th edition DoC and how random they are and he agreed with me lol.
*edited to add info.
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Post by: Aerethan
Ah, that rule makes Saurus far more worthwhile in combat, without being as OP as Poison would be for them. Also nice to hear that salamanders and Slann have been tamed down a bit.
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Post by: Sigvatr
No Cheesed Hands anymore?
YEAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAH!
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Post by: Sigvatr
They were just incredibly lame. Uncounterable and extremely powerful - they had to go.
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Post by: Alpharius
I think that as long as it isn't wholesale copy-pasting and/or pictures of the rulebooks, we can just put the points costs in there, and not do the "142 Search Lights" thing anymore!
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Post by: RiTides
Slaves are 2 points, afaik, so it's not a straight-up search light level of silly as it takes a little bit of math... but agreed.
Predatory fighter sounds characterful and not overpowered... very nice.
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Post by: Micky
That sounds pretty excellent, kinda ties in nicely with the schtick that the different lizard types have going for them.
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Post by: DarkStarSabre
I will admit that PF helps Saurus a lot. They were pretty heavily costed before and needed something to make them at least a threat as S4 and T4 mean squat with WS3 and I1 where everything can drag you down before you cause pain. But PF? Saurus hordes are going to be monstrous. Spear blocks also monstrous.
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Post by: baltak
The new release looks like it will be ablast for lizardmen but I got a bone to pick with the naming. The big carnosaur named Grymloq. Seems I heard that name in Gen 1 Transformers with a dinobot named Grimlock (I am geeky enough to still have it) and I just wonder why they couldn't give a great looking model like that a unique name... or at least something less cheesy ::sighs::
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Post by: Warboss Imbad Ironskull
Speaking of Saurus I do like the direction that the sculptors have taken with the Old Bloods/Scar Veteran on the Carnosaur, I'm looking forward to converting some. They look like they have alot more brute power it's almost as if "I'm savage enough I'll just force this club like sword through you". I always liked the idea that the Saurus are savagely brutal and I think the models portray that pretty well. Automatically Appended Next Post: baltak wrote:The new release looks like it will be ablast for lizardmen but I got a bone to pick with the naming. The big carnosaur named Grymloq. Seems I heard that name in Gen 1 Transformers with a dinobot named Grimlock (I am geeky enough to still have it) and I just wonder why they couldn't give a great looking model like that a unique name... or at least something less cheesy ::sighs::
That's been the name of his Carnosaur for at least the last two LM army books.
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Post by: baltak
Possible I missed that since I don't play LM but I still think it could have gotten a more unique name.
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Post by: Cirronimbus
It's specifically an homage to Transformers. All the SC mounts are named after Transformers, and they talked about that in the White Dwarf from last time the book was updated in 2009. It's TikTaqTo's Terradon and Mazdamundi's Stegadon, as well as Kroq-gar's Carnosaur (can't recall their names atm, besides Grymloc). They all have a "lizardmen-ish" twist to the spelling though.
I like the sound of Predatory Fighter for the Saurus units, and it definitely helps them out being WS3. Also glad Cupped Hands is gone. That thing was just ridiculous.
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Post by: Micky
Grymloq the carnisaur, Zlaaq the stegadon, Zwup the terradon..... aka. Grimlock (t-rex), Slag (triceratops), and Swoop (pteradactyl).
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Post by: Baron Butcher
nathan2004 wrote:Went to gamesday yesterday met Mr Vetock (really cool dude BTW) saw the Lizardmen book. Saurus are the same but gained PF, Templars went down in points by the cost of a Slave, Skinks stay the same from what i saw and the slann goes up by 12 and a half slaves. Becalming just let's you reroll your first failed dispel attempt IIRC. Those are the things that stood out to me. Overall from what i saw looked to be a solid release, he told me he had written the book a year and a half ago and Robin Cruddance helped him with the design. He's worked on it and play tested it in that time.
Forgive my ignorance, but what is this "Slave" riddle you speak of.
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Post by: Aerethan
Skaven Slaves cost 2 points each. It's a common tactic that some forums use to mask points values when posting army lists or discussing things.
As I mentioned, points values are trivial out of the context of the game mechanics, and are not a protected aspect of the game, or the army book. Same with stat lines.
So Temple Guard dropped 2 points in cost, Slann went up 25 points.
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Post by: Baron Butcher
Aaah thank you, clears it up.
Happy about dem Guard ;D
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Post by: CthuluIsSpy
Are Guard better? They were a bit lackluster in the previous book imo (a pity though, because they are one of my favorite units).
Also, are razordons better, and do sallies still have the -3 to armor modifier?
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Post by: RiTides
We'll all know in a few days, guys
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Post by: Red Viper
Looks like a decent release for LM players. Sorry they didn't get new krox or cold ones, but there's no stinkers at least.
I'm glad that the the Saurus box set isn't getting a price hike.
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Post by: Baron Butcher
CthuluIsSpy wrote:Are Guard better? They were a bit lackluster in the previous book imo (a pity though, because they are one of my favorite units).
Also, are razordons better, and do sallies still have the -3 to armor modifier?
I think they're good, and all they ever needed was the points reduction they are now getting. They've got better WS and armour compared to a normal Saurus, along with extra weapons and some cool choices in terms of upgrades.
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Post by: CthuluIsSpy
 Baron Butcher wrote: CthuluIsSpy wrote:Are Guard better? They were a bit lackluster in the previous book imo (a pity though, because they are one of my favorite units).
Also, are razordons better, and do sallies still have the -3 to armor modifier?
I think they're good, and all they ever needed was the points reduction they are now getting. They've got better WS and armour compared to a normal Saurus, along with extra weapons and some cool choices in terms of upgrades.
They also get PF, which should give them an offensive boost.
The thing that always bothered me about Saurus type units is that they never quite felt as killy as they should be. This new rule should change that.
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Post by: Scrub
New fantasy player and all round Games Workshop newb here... I wonder if the "Lizardmen Amaxon River Patrol" as found 'ere on the website will be a legal list? Or is it merely a 'theme' for an excuse to buy a collection of models?
It looks pretty fun and not too much of an intensive project not to mention I really like the idea of a skirmishing Skink patrol force, (that I think the models are gorgeous helps too!) It's really made me sit up and take notice of Warhammer fantasy. I'd be picking up the models from elsewhere for sure, all the same.
I guess we'll have to wait for the book to be certain? What are people's other prior experiences with this sort of thing when it comes to past 'one click' bundles?
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Post by: Baron Butcher
What is this "PF" everyone keeps mentioning? Guessing we're not about to get Powerfists, sooo...
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Post by: Scrub
Baron Butcher wrote:What is this " PF" everyone keeps mentioning? Guessing we're not about to get Powerfists, sooo...
A new rule called ' Primal Fighter' to spice up Sauruses as an attacking force, on a roll of a 6 to hit they receive an extra attack as I understand it!
edit:- Credit for that info goes to nathan2004 on this very same page, I knew I'd read it somewhere on Dakka!
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Post by: Baron Butcher
 Scrub wrote: Baron Butcher wrote:What is this " PF" everyone keeps mentioning? Guessing we're not about to get Powerfists, sooo...
A new rule called ' Primal Fighter' to spice up Sauruses as an attacking force, on a roll of a 6 to hit they receive an extra attack as I understand it!
edit:- Credit for that info goes to nathan2004 on this very same page, I knew I'd read it somewhere on Dakka!
Oh.
My.
God.
9808
Post by: HoverBoy
Should be provided you make some sort of character out of those models to lead.
Still since that "bundle" saves you nothing you might as well just buy the stuff separately.
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Post by: Bellygrub
 HoverBoy wrote:
Still since that "bundle" saves you nothing you might as well just buy the stuff separately.
If you're going to buy it all from GW at full price anyway you might as well just click the bundle
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Post by: Scrub
I certainly plan to... not buy from GW direct, I'll be getting everything from discounters or ebay because, as you suggest, the saving is just too big to ignore. I doubt I'd be as interested otherwise! That's good to know on the probability of it being legal though, my one chum who adores fantasy will be pleased to hear he'll have a new opponent soon! Cheers! 
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Post by: HoverBoy
I really all hinges on the points value of the Troglodon, and how much of a Core the bundle provides to balance it out as a rare which it's rumored to be.
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Post by: Sigvatr
 Aerethan wrote:
So Temple Guard dropped 2 points in cost, Slann went up 25 points.
Ermagerd, so reported for posting exact points cost! Enjoy your ban lolololol!!!!11
Interested in the rules of the new LM...will happily any nerf to the Slann, glad to see that Saurus got some lovin'. If it's a good army book, comp will see some very sudden changes. Hopefully.
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Post by: Scrub
HoverBoy wrote:I really all hinges on the points value of the Troglodon, and how much of a Core the bundle provides to balance it out as a rare which it's rumored to be.
Either way I'll be following this thread closely so that I get a better understanding of how the new models and army in general pans out, cheers for the tips so far.
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Post by: HoverBoy
But he didn't you still need the old book to get the "exact point cost".
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Post by: Mattlov
I think it is odd that the big old army of dinosaurs is the one army that DOESN'T get any Monstrous Cavalry.
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Post by: Baron Butcher
 Mattlov wrote:I think it is odd that the big old army of dinosaurs is the one army that DOESN'T get any Monstrous Cavalry.
It's kinda soul-crushing. Was really hyped to see a group of 3 PROPER Carnosaurs charging forward, not one big ugly plastic bastardisation of one.
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Post by: nathan2004
CthuluIsSpy wrote:Are Guard better? They were a bit lackluster in the previous book imo (a pity though, because they are one of my favorite units).
Also, are razordons better, and do sallies still have the -3 to armor modifier?
Sallies don't have the -3 anymore but they did increase the str of the flame attack to 4. Templars and Razordons both saw a drop in pt cost and Razordons picked up a special rule but i can't remember what it is. I've drank since then lol.
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Post by: HoverBoy
Baron Butcher wrote: Mattlov wrote:I think it is odd that the big old army of dinosaurs is the one army that DOESN'T get any Monstrous Cavalry.
It's kinda soul-crushing. Was really hyped to see a group of 3 PROPER Carnosaurs charging forward, not one big ugly plastic bastardisation of one.
We had one before (terradons) and now have a second (sillynamedactils).
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Post by: cincydooley
I was just talking about the Lizzies with my buddy, and we decided that GW really missed a huge opportunity in a plastic Kroxigor Monstrous Infantry kit.
Would have really played up the Lizard's ability to do a mixed unit. Would have been a prime kit to get the plastic treatment.
Dropped ball there, me thinks.
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Post by: ThouShallNotHeal
 cincydooley wrote:I was just talking about the Lizzies with my buddy, and we decided that GW really missed a huge opportunity in a plastic Kroxigor Monstrous Infantry kit.
Would have really played up the Lizard's ability to do a mixed unit. Would have been a prime kit to get the plastic treatment.
Dropped ball there, me thinks.
Damn...That's a good idea.
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Post by: CthuluIsSpy
Scrub wrote: Baron Butcher wrote:What is this " PF" everyone keeps mentioning? Guessing we're not about to get Powerfists, sooo...
A new rule called ' Primal Fighter' to spice up Sauruses as an attacking force, on a roll of a 6 to hit they receive an extra attack as I understand it!
edit:- Credit for that info goes to nathan2004 on this very same page, I knew I'd read it somewhere on Dakka!
Yep. It's like a weaker version of tesla
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Post by: Alpharius
I can't believe it but... I'm tempted to start a Lizard Man army!
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Post by: decker_cky
I wonder if predatory fighter works on back rank models. Definitely should from a mechanics point of view, but depending on wording could be an issue. Certainly hope that was thought of and that the rules are clear on how it works so you don't have to split your attacks between front rank and back rank.
Horde of saurus with spears will be a nasty unit - 5 attacks per file, averaging almost an extra attack per file too (a little over 8 extra attacks for a horde getting full attacks). Then again...a horde of spear saurus will be a lot of points, and all at I1.
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Post by: Mattlov
HoverBoy wrote: Baron Butcher wrote: Mattlov wrote:I think it is odd that the big old army of dinosaurs is the one army that DOESN'T get any Monstrous Cavalry.
It's kinda soul-crushing. Was really hyped to see a group of 3 PROPER Carnosaurs charging forward, not one big ugly plastic bastardisation of one.
We had one before (terradons) and now have a second (sillynamedactils).
Terradons were definitely NOT MC. Anything with a SKINK on it is not going to be a "tough" unit.
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Post by: Carthuun
Mattlov wrote: HoverBoy wrote: Baron Butcher wrote: Mattlov wrote:I think it is odd that the big old army of dinosaurs is the one army that DOESN'T get any Monstrous Cavalry.
It's kinda soul-crushing. Was really hyped to see a group of 3 PROPER Carnosaurs charging forward, not one big ugly plastic bastardisation of one.
We had one before (terradons) and now have a second (sillynamedactils).
Terradons were definitely NOT MC. Anything with a SKINK on it is not going to be a "tough" unit.
Umm, perhaps you should check the BRB, Terradon Riders ARE MC. Unless you just mean that they were easily killed for a MC unit.
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Post by: Mattlov
Yeah. I expect a MC unit to be tough, hit ridiculously hard, and be worth their points. Not die to a little bit of arrow fire.
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Post by: decker_cky
The ripperdactyls have a 3+ armour according to this site (scaly skin, light armour, shield, mounted):
http://raffazza.blogspot.co.uk/
For a flying unit with a strong damage output, that's pretty good (particularly at 40 pts apparently).
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Post by: RiTides
Alpharius wrote:I can't believe it but... I'm tempted to start a Lizard Man army!
I know right
And agreed about the monstrous cavalry, and monstrous infantry possibilities that GW didn't take on... those would've been sweet. But what they did make is really good!
decker_cky wrote:The ripperdactyls have a 3+ armour according to this site (scaly skin, light armour, shield, mounted):
http://raffazza.blogspot.co.uk/
For a flying unit with a strong damage output, that's pretty good (particularly at 40 pts apparently).
Whoa . Yeah, it is! New fancy kit being overpowered, I'm shocked
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Post by: CthuluIsSpy
Eh, not really. 3+ isn't that powerful in WHFB as it is in 40k.
S4 and S5 makes 3+ saves a sad panda.
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Post by: RiTides
S4 makes 3+ saves a 4+... still pretty good! After fielding monstrous infantry with little to not save for a long time, I've been really happy to be getting ready to field bull centaurs with my chaos dwarfs and their 3+ save, and if these super-terradons are indeed 40 points with that save and obviously fly... makes them pretty scary for a lot of roles.
For example, most warmachine hunters are super fragile. 3 of those at 40 points would be 120, and much more durable... and able to go after the things that would make the big lizards very unhappy (cannons and the like). And probably take them out in one round, and then overrun off the board.
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Post by: CthuluIsSpy
Maybe, we'll see in the coming months. It depends on how many wounds they'll have I guess. Still, that's a crazy amount of special rules they have there O_0 Maybe GW realized what a crappy model it is, so they gave it a power boost I will still choose the terradons over the rippers; I've been meaning to get them for a while, but they were pretty expensive before (1 terra a blister, for about $20 USD iirc. You need 3 of them for a legal regiment).
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Post by: Morathi's Darkest Sin
My middle lad is slightly stoked for this release. We've been slowly pooling (groan) a skink heavy army for him as he likes them in particular. With the new Trog being a rare option and not a hero mount, he's going to be bouncing on Saturday as I can justify getting one for his 2000pt army that is forming up. Probably be picking up two boxes of birdies and might get a Bastidon.
Although I agree its a pity instead of the odd extra Stegadon like dino, we didn't get plastic kroxigors, Would have got him two or three boxes of those to round off his Skinks, but with them still being silly price finecast, he'll have none.
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Post by: TheAvengingKnee
Aaprently the ark on the back of the bastiladon will add bases to existing jungle swarm squads, as well as a low strength shooting attack.
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Post by: Vasarto
NEED ADVICE
While I do not play Fantasy I do know a little bit how too and I DO have a lizardmen army AND I am getting the collectors edition Book!
So what is going to be really good in this book? Will Lizardmen be weaker or stronger than they were before?
Do you think they will be that ultra tough, Not the best army in the world but dependable and always there for you army they were before?
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Post by: RiTides
Vasarto, a whole lot more of us will be able to give you well-thought out responses on that in just... oh, about a day and a half 
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Post by: silent25
Well LM players are freaking out over at Warseer. The primal fury rule has a downside. Units must pursue unless they are within 6" of skink character. The Slann doesn't count towards this.
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Post by: Scrub
When are people not aggressively freaking out over the tiniest detail at Warseer?
It's the reason I've since ditched that site in favour of this one, far more reasonable cast of characters.
Can't wait for this latest release, I've loved the look of all of the models so far. Just hope a Skink force is viable, fingers crossed!
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Post by: CthuluIsSpy
silent25 wrote:Well LM players are freaking out over at Warseer. The primal fury rule has a downside. Units must pursue unless they are within 6" of skink character. The Slann doesn't count towards this.
Wait what? I understand that GW wants to give skink characters a bigger role in LM armies, but that's just heavy handed. Actually, now that I think of it, it does make sense. Saurus are basically predators; they should want to chase their "prey"
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Post by: Micky
The Skinks are the ones who order the Saurus around, thats how it works.
....which makes it odd that skinks have such pathetically bad leadership.
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Post by: RiTides
Wow, that's an interesting development! Sucks for cold one cavalry, though
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Post by: Micky
RiTides wrote:Wow, that's an interesting development! Sucks for cold one cavalry, though
Especially if they got rid of the Horned One from the magic items and it isnt available as a mount either =/
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Post by: TheAvengingKnee
I was amazed at how few points(about the equivalent of 2 current packs of salamanders) the Bastiladons are(apparently you never get a bonus for flank charge or rear charge against them, and the tail hits for a very strong attack on anything in the rear), and Jungle swarms will be really useful now(make all attacks in assault even other squads poisoned). The slann seems to over all be weaker than they used to be(and has had a point increase), Chakax is better(better abilities, lower cost). Blowpipes on the Stegadon have better range. The Bastiladon that shoot is a bound spell magic missile that has a varying strength and number of shots.
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Post by: Dr. Cheesesteak
 Micky wrote:The Skinks are the ones who order the Saurus around, thats how it works.
....which makes it odd that skinks have such pathetically bad leadership.
I think GW justifies it, fluff-wise, by saying the "bad leadership" is just the skinks knowing when to retreat. They are tiny, fragile things after all and are smart enough to know when they'll get wrecked.
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Post by: HoverBoy
LD isn't intelligence or authority, it's bravery and guts, skinks are short on those.
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Post by: Aerethan
LM fluff for years has been that Saurus are base creatures. They are soldiers and laborers. They rely on the skinks for direction and orders. Saurus only know basic military commands and responses.
Think of them as reptilian Hodors(Hodii?).
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Post by: TheAvengingKnee
I actually want to run more Saurus units, I like them a lot and I really do not like skinks at all, so far I have really enjoyed running a brute force army, I need to add some utility to the list but I am waiting till the new rulebook is out. I will defiantly be adding the bastiladon that I have to my lists(especially because it takes up next to no points).
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Post by: HoverBoy
Aerethan wrote:LM fluff for years has been that Saurus are base creatures. They are soldiers and laborers. They rely on the skinks for direction and orders. Saurus only know basic military commands and responses.
Think of them as reptilian Hodors(Hodii?).
Actually they are not laborers that's the kroxigors thing, saurus are pretty much engineered to be soldiers and aren't good for anything else.
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Post by: CthuluIsSpy
HoverBoy wrote: Aerethan wrote:LM fluff for years has been that Saurus are base creatures. They are soldiers and laborers. They rely on the skinks for direction and orders. Saurus only know basic military commands and responses.
Think of them as reptilian Hodors(Hodii?).
Actually they are not laborers that's the kroxigors thing, saurus are pretty much engineered to be soldiers and aren't good for anything else.
So Unsullied then?
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Post by: boyd
HoverBoy wrote: Aerethan wrote:LM fluff for years has been that Saurus are base creatures. They are soldiers and laborers. They rely on the skinks for direction and orders. Saurus only know basic military commands and responses.
Think of them as reptilian Hodors(Hodii?).
Actually they are not laborers that's the kroxigors thing, saurus are pretty much engineered to be soldiers and aren't good for anything else.
That's why you can have a combined unit.
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Post by: schadenfreude
boyd wrote: HoverBoy wrote: Aerethan wrote:LM fluff for years has been that Saurus are base creatures. They are soldiers and laborers. They rely on the skinks for direction and orders. Saurus only know basic military commands and responses.
Think of them as reptilian Hodors(Hodii?).
Actually they are not laborers that's the kroxigors thing, saurus are pretty much engineered to be soldiers and aren't good for anything else.
That's why you can have a combined unit.
Going to play devils advocate for predatory instincts.
It's easy to picture Saurus as knowing what they are doing when it comes to killing, but also knowing their own weaknesses, and knowing they often fall victem to target fixation. Skinks are paranoid and twitchy, and thus the perfect lookout to watch your back. When a skink yells/blows a whitle/uses it's special rule I picture it as a lookout reminding Saurus to check their 6 and re assess the situation. Saurus know what they are doing, easily fall victem to target fixation because of their aggressive instincts, know their weaknesses, and know skinks make good look outs.
As far as rules balance goes skink characters are cheap.
Question: Does venom from jungle swarms work on Saurus? If so poison + pred instincts sounds like a good combination.
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Post by: DarkStarSabre
If jungle swarms have become that much more useful then I suddenly feel that much happier.
Still, will know hard truth in about 30 minutes. Off I go to pick the order up.
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Post by: CthuluIsSpy
DarkStarSabre wrote:If jungle swarms have become that much more useful then I suddenly feel that much happier.
Still, will know hard truth in about 30 minutes. Off I go to pick the order up.
It's a pity they are still metal and worth a fortune for what it gives you.
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Post by: Sigvatr
CthuluIsSpy wrote: DarkStarSabre wrote:If jungle swarms have become that much more useful then I suddenly feel that much happier.
Still, will know hard truth in about 30 minutes. Off I go to pick the order up.
It's a pity they are still metal and worth a fortune for what it gives you.
They are extremely easy to scratch-built, you just need the spare bases. Hey, even my 6 years-old nephew can make snakes out of dough
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Post by: DarkStarSabre
CthuluIsSpy wrote: DarkStarSabre wrote:If jungle swarms have become that much more useful then I suddenly feel that much happier.
Still, will know hard truth in about 30 minutes. Off I go to pick the order up.
It's a pity they are still metal and worth a fortune for what it gives you.
Someone's not been a Lizardman player for any length of time.
I still have 5 or so bases from way back when.
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Post by: Vasarto
So how good is the new codex? I hear some people already picked thiers up. I gotta wait for GW to mail me mine.
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Post by: DarkStarSabre
Quick summary time.
PF is as people have said. Extra attack on a 6, can't chain it off itself though. Can't restrain overrun unless a skink is nearby. Comes on Saurus of all varieties and Kroxigor. Considering that Saurus units on a whole got cheaper this is fantastic.
Skinks now have scaly skin. Yes, that's right. SKINKS GET SAVES. Even the Shamans!
Jungle Swarms are hilarious and much cheaper now.
Stegadons and Kroxigor are also cheaper. Kroxigor are once against S5. Rejoice!
Lizard SCs mostly cheaper across the board - Chakax is potentially silly now.
Overall there is a lot of magic item destruction on SCs.
Now some bad news.
Slann went up in points, don't get a free discipline and Disciplines are unique - so one model with X per army. However they did get the old 5th edition spell swap with other Slann rule. Useful for larger games I suppose.
Carnosaurs went up in points by a tiny amount. Salamanders went up and lost their -3 save modifier.
Magic items got thorough gutted but there are some gems - Piranha Blade and Stegadon Helms are the real winners here.
Oh and Oxyotl got a slight buff. Banshees and Cairn Wraiths better watch out, as should any wizards trying sneaky Ethereal tricks!
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Post by: boyd
Sigvatr wrote: CthuluIsSpy wrote: DarkStarSabre wrote:If jungle swarms have become that much more useful then I suddenly feel that much happier.
Still, will know hard truth in about 30 minutes. Off I go to pick the order up.
It's a pity they are still metal and worth a fortune for what it gives you.
They are extremely easy to scratch-built, you just need the spare bases. Hey, even my 6 years-old nephew can make snakes out of dough
Why scratch build - you get a couple of snake models on the Cold One Saurus riders..
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Post by: Kanluwen
boyd wrote: Sigvatr wrote: CthuluIsSpy wrote: DarkStarSabre wrote:If jungle swarms have become that much more useful then I suddenly feel that much happier.
Still, will know hard truth in about 30 minutes. Off I go to pick the order up.
It's a pity they are still metal and worth a fortune for what it gives you.
They are extremely easy to scratch-built, you just need the spare bases. Hey, even my 6 years-old nephew can make snakes out of dough
Why scratch build - you get a couple of snake models on the Cold One Saurus riders..
I think that just adding some jungle ferns to a base would be a good swarm.
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Post by: CthuluIsSpy
Sigvatr wrote: CthuluIsSpy wrote: DarkStarSabre wrote:If jungle swarms have become that much more useful then I suddenly feel that much happier. Still, will know hard truth in about 30 minutes. Off I go to pick the order up.
It's a pity they are still metal and worth a fortune for what it gives you.
They are extremely easy to scratch-built, you just need the spare bases. Hey, even my 6 years-old nephew can make snakes out of dough
My greenstuff skills are horrible. Whenever I try to make a snake I end up making it a little too thick. It then looks like something that belongs to a slaaneshi army :( Automatically Appended Next Post: boyd wrote: Sigvatr wrote: CthuluIsSpy wrote: DarkStarSabre wrote:If jungle swarms have become that much more useful then I suddenly feel that much happier.
Still, will know hard truth in about 30 minutes. Off I go to pick the order up.
It's a pity they are still metal and worth a fortune for what it gives you.
They are extremely easy to scratch-built, you just need the spare bases. Hey, even my 6 years-old nephew can make snakes out of dough
Why scratch build - you get a couple of snake models on the Cold One Saurus riders..
Yep, but I don't have enough. With that spare Tehehuin base and the CoC snakes I think I can make 2 at most. Automatically Appended Next Post: DarkStarSabre wrote: CthuluIsSpy wrote: DarkStarSabre wrote:If jungle swarms have become that much more useful then I suddenly feel that much happier.
Still, will know hard truth in about 30 minutes. Off I go to pick the order up.
It's a pity they are still metal and worth a fortune for what it gives you.
Someone's not been a Lizardman player for any length of time.
I still have 5 or so bases from way back when.
Yeah, I think I started back in 2005 and 6. The metal swarms didn't seem to be worth it. Same reason why I didn't get terradons, even though I really liked the models and concept.
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Post by: RiTides
Having picked up the book, a couple of really cool things:
-Slann using high magic, after a successful cast, can choose to "forget" that spell... and then generate a spell from any other lore they can normally access (in the normal way, so you could swap it for the signature spell of that lore, too)
-A discipline letting a Slann take the 8 signature spells from the rulebook instead of any one discipline. A nice touch
-A horn (one use at the start of a movement phase) that makes all mounts and monsters frenzied within 12". Could be very useful with a unit of cold ones... now you've got a mount with 3 attacks! If they're going to overrun due to PF anyway, they might as well be frenzied for a turn . Could make for a very powerful initial strike if building a list around it.
-An enchanted item egg that can be cracked open at the start of a single close combat phase. With lower results on a 3 or worse, but on a 4+... causes a whopping 2D6 S5 hits! For just 5 points more than a dispel scroll. Wow . AND they count towards combat resolution!
So far, I think it's a very interesting and well done book. One bummer is that kroxigor can now be attacked if they are touching the skink in front of them in a mixed unit... I'm really having trouble seeing why you would take a mixed unit now! Also, the poison special rule for skinks is hidden on the army special rules page (for their blowpipes and javelins).
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Post by: silent25
RiTides wrote:
So far, I think it's a very interesting and well done book. One bummer is that kroxigor can now be attacked if they are touching the skink in front of them in a mixed unit... I'm really having trouble seeing why you would take a mixed unit now! Also, the poison special rule for skinks is hidden on the army special rules page (for their blowpipes and javelins).
Multipurpose unit. Krox can deal with heavy armor troops, skinks w/ poison can deal with low armor troops. Skinks can generate actual combat res while the krox smack any combat characters in the unit.
The PF disadvantage isn't that big. With skink priests being able to take beasts, you will very likely have him near the sarus units due to short range of most beast spells.
Side note, reading on some forums, people really liking the limited edition book and saying it is the first one where the high quality cover makes it feel it is worth it. Faux leather with padding to make it feel like lizard skin. Very nice touch.
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Post by: RiTides
Does poison apply to close combat attacks with skinks?
It's still much less useful if the krox can be hit in combat. If something wants combat res, it can just kill skinks (although if you take a ton, they may be steadfast). But if it hits hard, it can take out the krox just as if they were in base contact, ignoring the skinks.
I'm not seeing it...
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Post by: jonolikespie
Apparently 'jungle poisons' has been replaced with poison javelins and blowpipes so no, no poison in combat unless there are jungle swarms in the same combat.
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Post by: DarkStarSabre
jonolikespie wrote:
Apparently 'jungle poisons' has been replaced with poison javelins and blowpipes so no, no poison in combat unless there are jungle swarms in the same combat.
Incorrect.
Cohorts can upgrade to Poisoned Attacks - it doesn't specify ranged only - that's already included on Lustrian Javelins.
So yes, your combat skinks can all have poisoned attacks.
Particular note on Stegadon upgrades - one of them causes the impact hits to do D3 wounds each.
This is how you deal with Ogres. D6+1 S5/6 impact hits doing D3 wounds apiece!
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Post by: RiTides
"Incorrect" is pushing it a bit, DarkStar. You have to upgrade and pay 2 points a model on your 5 point skinks for them to get close combat poison... they don't come with it base. That takes the minimum amount of points you're putting into skinks, if you want to field 3 kroxigor, up to 168 instead of 120... for a total of a 318 point unit. Without any command, etc.
That's a heck of a lot of points for a unit that's not putting out much more damage than just the 3 kroxigors by themselves! Certainly not over double the damage output... I'm sure this will end up belonging more in WHFB tactics, but I don't see much use for that mixed unit... was hoping they'd rescue it. But I love a lot of other things in the book
Good spot on the D3 wounds upgrade for the impact hits... that could be scary!
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Post by: HoverBoy
Since it takes a week for stuff to get all the way to Bulgaria – is it true an EOTG can be carried by a regular ancient rather than one ridden by a priest.
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Post by: NinthMusketeer
Yeah, no priest required.
Something I don't see mentioned is lord Kroak, he makes a temple guard unit he joins unbreakable and any unit he joins -1 to hit with shooting and melee. Still only has one repeatable direct damage spell but comes at a reasonable points value.
Other things I noticed:
-Can put Scar-Vets on Carnosaurs.
-Carnosaurs are d3 wounds on everything, can be upgraded to have swiftstride.
-Tetto'Ekko is quite good. Gives d3 units vanguard, each magic phase roll a d6 on a 1 friendly wizards re-roll 6s when casting, on a 2+ they re-roll 1s. Lvl 2 loremaster of heavens.
-Ripperdactyls are glass cannons, tough 3 with a 4+ save and 2 wounds, and only initiative 3. Yet with toad rage and frenzy they get 2+d3+1 attacks...
-Troglodon has a one use str5 d3 wound shooting attack.
-Krox and skink cohorts seem underwhelming compared to base saurus, who got primal fighter with no points increase and can take spears for free.
-Above mentioned spears is a great option since EotG gives a 6" bubble of units getting a 6+ ward.
-Slann can swap spells with any friendly wizard, no restriction to other slann.
-Bastiladon stat line meh, but durable thanks to 2+ save and very cheap for a monster. Snake spitter version does 2d6 str2 on all enemies within d6" as a shooting attack, usable in close combat. Also adds a jungle swarm base to a unit within 6" on a 4+, can take it above starting size.
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Post by: silent25
Got a look over the book tonight. Will have to see how things pan out. Not a LM player, so can't make the call if they are good or bad. Only glad to see the most abusive elements of Slann are gone.
Think you will see a bunch of monster mash lists come out. Will be able to filed 7 Stegs for around 1600 pts. Not sure if you will actually see bastiladons that much. They only have 4 S4 attacks with the option of making one of them S10. Even with the solar gun, they are not that amazing.
The LM seem to be able to field a lot of multi-wound causing attacks with the Piranha Bldae, upgraded stegs, and the trog spit attack. Think you will see a change from the current monstrous cav builds currently out there.
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Post by: DarkStarSabre
You can also give Carnosaurs a sort of reverse Cold Blooded effect for Fear and Terror tests (3 dice, take the highest). This could prove hilarious against low LD armies. Carnosaurs will literally become linebreakers.
-Slann can swap spells with any friendly wizard, no restriction to other slann.
The spell swap is actually with two wizards that share that special rule. Only Slann have it unfortunately  That makes it very situational for its use. You can however still cast magic missiles and direct damage spells through Skink Priests, Oracles and a few SCs as with the old book.
Hilariously Lord Kroak's spell bomb is a direct damage spell. Which can be cast as many times as he pleases. And it can never be stolen, lost or forgotten. Iirc aren't there some magic items that literally steal a spell and replace once of the caster's with the stolen spell? Kroak is a mean counter to that. They steal the spell, lose one of their own and immediately forget his spell which he immediately remembers.
I picture lots of Skink priests coming out. Moving forward around an enemy line and then Kroak just mass spellbombs.
Also, scaly skin on skinks! Even priests!
There's a lot of 5th edition Lizard references...ok, one of two. Including the old Egg of Quango.
Other oddities and quirks to mention - Magic Items.
Blade of Realities got shafted hard. Lost its amazing special rule and went up by as many points as the Slann.
Piranha Blade is decent. Price went up but got a lot better.
Stegadon Helm is ridiculous now. It gives impact hits!
Skavenpelt Banner is no longer Skinks only but went up a bit in points - still, with Predatory Fighters I predict we're going to see people trying to build two Frenzy Hordes of Saurus with banners (using the BSB for one and putting one of the Temple Guard). Probably also throwing the Horn of Kygor in to make mounts and the like go nuts too.
Plaque of Dominion got a bit better - no longer an auto but a bound spell cheap enough to put on a Skink Priest.
Oh yeah, fun stuff with the units as they are.
Skinks got Scaly Skin again. That makes me so happy.
Kroxigor are S5 again and cheaper. More happy abounds.
Cold Ones have 2 attacks again!
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Post by: RiTides
Hmm, so with 6+ scaly skin, a skink cohort with javelin, shield, and the lore of metal spell for +2 AS gets a 3+ armor save and becomes a viable possibility . Tie things up for saurus to smash! (or other various monsters). I might take back my thoughts on the mixed unit... at least for a few situations
So far, looks like a really well done book. Doesn't look like primal fighter works for supporting attacks, but saurus with free spears would be Really insane if it did (or if it gets FAQ'd to).
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Post by: Cirronimbus
Unfortunately the lore of metal spell grants a 5+ Scaly Skin save, so on Skinks it only helps their save by 1 (improving their 6+ to a 5+) and on Saurus it doesn't do anything. I wish it was worded as "increases armour save by 2". At least my understanding is that Scaly Skins don't stack with each other. Like putting light armour on something wearing heavy armour.
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Post by: RiTides
Ah, darn you're right. Oh well, it was a nice thought
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Post by: NinthMusketeer
DarkStarSabre wrote:The spell swap is actually with two wizards that share that special rule. Only Slann have it unfortunately That makes it very situational for its use.
Ah, missed that part. Very situational in that case, though could be fun if you had two lizardmen players on the same side in a team game...
On a separate note I could see Kroak in with 30+ temple guard as a formidable fighting unit. Unbreakable and -1 hit... if you threw in a bsb with frenzy banner and gave the unit bearer the swiftstride banner it would be devastating, though certainly a lot of points in one basket.
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Post by: Arch-Fiend
The Ripperdactyls remind of the Tapejara from Walking With Dinosaurs. Also, I always thought the Carnosaur to be more like Postosuchus than an oversized raptor/t-rex thing. Still, the models are impressive, wish I started a Lizardmen army earlier.
1
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Post by: silent25
DarkStarSabre wrote:
Other oddities and quirks to mention - Magic Items.
Blade of Realities got shafted hard. Lost its amazing special rule and went up by as many points as the Slann.
Piranha Blade is decent. Price went up but got a lot better.
Stegadon Helm is ridiculous now. It gives impact hits!
Skavenpelt Banner is no longer Skinks only but went up a bit in points - still, with Predatory Fighters I predict we're going to see people trying to build two Frenzy Hordes of Saurus with banners (using the BSB for one and putting one of the Temple Guard). Probably also throwing the Horn of Kygor in to make mounts and the like go nuts too.
Plaque of Dominion got a bit better - no longer an auto but a bound spell cheap enough to put on a Skink Priest.
You are likely going to see a lot of Old Blood w/ Piranha Blade, Stegadon Helm, and OTS (100 pts for all three), on a cold one. The Piranha Blade specifically states "wielder" and not "attacks made" so the impact hits from the Steg Helm are multi-wound on a T6 model with a 1+ save. That is quite a hard nut to break. Will see him going into a lot of monstrous cav/inf. Personally think ogres are going to be scarce for a while as everyone ramps up the mutli-wound.
With the exception of the BoR, the magic item list is pretty good for LM. Even the new version of the Cube is good as a second dispel scroll.
From games I saw this weekend, multi-wound stegs are good, Bastilidons are too squishy, and Trogs are good. People haven't tried the rippers much yet to make a call.
As a beastman player, I was mainly busy in a corner crying
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Post by: RiTides
Proxy your beastmen as lizardmen . Actually could be a decent fit...
Thanks for the thoughts, and that is indeed a nice combo for an Old Blood. If it gets more Old Bloods on the field and less Slanns, so much the better!
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Post by: Ehsteve
silent25 wrote: DarkStarSabre wrote:
Other oddities and quirks to mention - Magic Items.
Blade of Realities got shafted hard. Lost its amazing special rule and went up by as many points as the Slann.
Piranha Blade is decent. Price went up but got a lot better.
Stegadon Helm is ridiculous now. It gives impact hits!
Skavenpelt Banner is no longer Skinks only but went up a bit in points - still, with Predatory Fighters I predict we're going to see people trying to build two Frenzy Hordes of Saurus with banners (using the BSB for one and putting one of the Temple Guard). Probably also throwing the Horn of Kygor in to make mounts and the like go nuts too.
Plaque of Dominion got a bit better - no longer an auto but a bound spell cheap enough to put on a Skink Priest.
You are likely going to see a lot of Old Blood w/ Piranha Blade, Stegadon Helm, and OTS (100 pts for all three), on a cold one. The Piranha Blade specifically states "wielder" and not "attacks made" so the impact hits from the Steg Helm are multi-wound on a T6 model with a 1+ save. That is quite a hard nut to break. Will see him going into a lot of monstrous cav/inf. Personally think ogres are going to be scarce for a while as everyone ramps up the mutli-wound.
With the exception of the BoR, the magic item list is pretty good for LM. Even the new version of the Cube is good as a second dispel scroll.
From games I saw this weekend, multi-wound stegs are good, Bastilidons are too squishy, and Trogs are good. People haven't tried the rippers much yet to make a call.
As a beastman player, I was mainly busy in a corner crying
A CC character with a 1+ Armour Save doesn't help against a lucky cannonball. You need to find a more foolproof manner to keep him alive until he makes it into the front lines. Since they are still Ld8/9 (due to cold blooded) death magic still has the advantage over them so it can be sniped.
CC character are still not dominating the non-comped scene. It looks like scroll caddy skink priests just aren't going to cut it, you need to make sure you actually get spell/dispel or otherwise you're sacrificing a phase you desperately need to contest in order to ensure your CC is its most effective (rather than getting hexed or your enemy getting too well buffed).
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Post by: Therion
CC character are still not dominating the non-comped scene
Nurgle DPs dominate pretty hard and the BSB with a 1+ save and 3+ re-rollable ward is no slouch either.
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Post by: Necros
My limited ed army book came yesterday. Have to admit it's pretty nice. I really do like how they do those uber versions of the books, I just wish they would let FLGSes get em.
The lizard skin cover is pretty cool, and poofy. It's got a funky smell, not that "new game book" smell. The slip cover looks nice too, but I don't know what to do with it. It will get messed up easy if I keep it on the book. Guess I could just use it when it's on the shelf and take it off when I play...
No new models yet, but I'll probably get a bastilidon. Hoping I can do some magnetizing for the stuff on top so I can do 1 model with both versions. But since I have a metal carnosaur I'd prolly do that other thing if I get the new kit.
I kinda wish they would have done a plastic salamader / razordon kit.
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Post by: RiTides
Is the GW Newsletter regarding the new Lizardmen and Warhammer fantasy digital products being discussed separately anywhere? Feel free to link me there if so...
Here it is from my inbox:
Games Workshop Newsletter wrote:The Games Workshop Newsletter 06.08.2013
In this issue: Exclusive Lizardmen products for your iPad
To complement the new range of Lizardmen releases this month, we've got a great selection of new Warhammer Digital Editions for your iPad.
Warhammer: Lizardmen
First up, is the Lizardmen army book. It has all the content of the hardback edition, plus all the features you've come to expect from our iPad Editions. Quick-links embedded throughout the book make it a convenient aid to gaming. There's an interactive miniatures gallery showing off the Lizardmen range, including 360 rotating images of its monsters and character models. Warhammer: Lizardmen will also be automatically updated with any new additions or amendments to the rules including new FAQ's.
How To Paint Citadel Miniatures: Lizardmen
Next up, How to Paint Citadel Miniatures: Lizardmen presents detailed stage-by-stage guides on painting the reptilian children of the Old Ones. It includes guides for all the new plastic kits, as well as Skinks, Saurus, Kroxigor, Slann Mage Priests and more, as well as top-tips from 'Eavy Metal painters.
Warhammer Battlefields
We're excited to announce a completely new type of product this month and a new series - Warhammer Battlefields. These are two player campaign systems, allowing you and your opponent to wage wars across various settings within the Warhammer World.
Not only will you need to outplay your opponent on the battlefield, you'll need to out think, and outwit them in the grand strategy of the campaign. Each campaign includes brand new scenarios that can also be used on their own for one-off games. Every time you play though a campaign, the scenarios change depending on your choices, and the outcomes of earlier battles making for great replayability.
Warhammer Battlefields contains an interactive campaign-tracker, to help keep a record of your victories (and defeats) as well as any special bonuses your army has acquired. All these new campaigns can be used with any Warhammer army.
The series kicks off with two titles:
Warhammer Battlefields: Border Wars sees two mighty empires battle for supremacy over a contested region of the Warhammer world, great for representing the warring factions of the Old World.
In Warhammer Battlefields Lustria, your army braves the unforgiving jungles of this deadly continent, a great setting for battles with a Lizardmen army, or any other general seeking adventure in the New World.
Link to iPad version of army book:
https://itunes.apple.com/gb/book/warhammer-lizardmen/id679778930?mt=11
Link to the two Battlefields scenario books:
https://itunes.apple.com/gb/book/warhammer-battlefields-border/id679123525?mt=11
https://itunes.apple.com/gb/book/warhammer-battlefields-lustria/id679150344?mt=11
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Post by: jah-joshua
i was having another look through this issue of WD this morning, and noticed that Kroq-Gar has a Necron symbol on his gauntlet...
seems like an interesting fluff tie-in...
the Old Ones were fighting the Necrons, got their butts kicked, and that's why they had to split before they could finish their plans, thus allowing Chaos to enter the Old World...
i will definitely have to give this Army Book a read, and see what kind of new Old Ones fluff we get, especially after they shook up the Necron background, which i enjoyed...
cheers
jah
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