Nice Kharadron model.

They're also fighting bats, I wonder if this Battletome cover art will somehow match with the Soulblight Gravelords Battletome art somehow. Would be something kinda neat.

Between this and the store-birthday model with the little ship in the KO model's hand, KO eating pretty good of single foot characters.

Looks about like what you’d need to play a typical game of 40k anymore.

Its a nice model- I agree the paint scheme throws it off a bit. I initially found it a bit jarring after painting up Votann which are much more utilitarian. I like both though- nice to the variety of Dwarf looks - Steam Punk, Nasa Punk and I still have my WFB dwarf army. All good to me. This guy I might get two of - one to build and one to convert. Kharadrons are such a cool culture I really hope they get a proper wave of models tp expand the range out a bit.

I wonder how much the Regiments of Renown will cost? The dispossessed one seems like it'll go great with the start collecting set (which I think would also give you every dispossessed model GW has left). Plus, every model in Norgrim's Rune Throng has multiple build options, giving you access to ironbreakers or irondrakes, and longbeards or hammerers. Even the runesmith has options for different heads, right and left hands, and the tactical oathstone is optional

The Dispossessed one is even better if you have access to a 3d printer, as I know for a fact there are Ironbreaker body STLs out there to make use of the fact that the only bit the 2 units share *is* the body.

This was a huge missed opportunity to inject a little bit of life into the ranges that got gutted when Cities of Sigmar got dropped.

Plastic Prince Maesa with Wild Riders, anyone?

Also, the two new Warbands from WarCry have their generic AoS rules now. They're under the downloads section on the Community page.

Looking forward to the Hargax's Pit-Beasts box!

I'm guessing these are AoS offerings similar to the boarding patrol sets for 40K, so if the WC Monsters are 82.50 individually then £65 sounds about right.

Hope it's not too bad. I was already tempted by the zombies but now I get a cheaper corpse cart to go with them? Yeah, might grab that when it comes out.

Also, warscrolls for the Vampires and Khorne guys from Warcry are up on the Downloads section of Warcom, and an update to the GHB FAQ is up too.

Those vampires are nice monster hunters, and there's some hints to what might be coming in the SBGL book.

"The Hunger" is changed to heal wounds based on how many wounds *and mortal wounds* that the unit does to the enemy, and in the base warscroll there's no way to do mortal wounds, so I wonder if that's so that vampires can do mortal wounds with spells or other traits and heal off of it? Will be interesting to see.

The Vampires are going to be absolutely disgusting, given you get 40 healing wounds with a 4+ save and a 2+ Fights Last for 360pts (reinforced unit). God forbid you're playing Kastelai like me and their monster hunting ability starts stacking up!

Oh, and the Fights Last currently triggers at the end of any charge phase, not just your own. I kinda expect that to get FAQ'd, but hoo boy that is gonna be fun while it lasts.

Laughing Man wrote:
The Vampires are going to be absolutely disgusting, given you get 40 healing wounds with a 4+ save and a 2+ Fights Last for 360pts (reinforced unit). God forbid you're playing Kastelai like me and their monster hunting ability starts stacking up!

Oh, and the Fights Last currently triggers at the end of any charge phase, not just your own. I kinda expect that to get FAQ'd, but hoo boy that is gonna be fun while it lasts.

The healing wounds part is really underwhelming actually. You can't bring back slain models with it, so at best you're healing 1 wound off of an ablative guy, or if you're very clever and brave, healing 3 wounds up on one of your cursebloods.

You'd also need to sink 360 points into the squad to get the 2+ fights last, which is... a lot.

I'm mostly interested in how the change to the Hunger will apply to future vampire lords and such. It's nice to be able to heal on doing any wounds, not just killing models.

Mind you there's lumineth unit that has reference to doing mortal wounds(wards can't be made against wounds and mortal wounds caused by this unit) without single way to add mortal wounds in the book to that unit.

Could be future proofing plus copy&paste standard phrase.

drbored wrote:

Laughing Man wrote:
The Vampires are going to be absolutely disgusting, given you get 40 healing wounds with a 4+ save and a 2+ Fights Last for 360pts (reinforced unit). God forbid you're playing Kastelai like me and their monster hunting ability starts stacking up!

Oh, and the Fights Last currently triggers at the end of any charge phase, not just your own. I kinda expect that to get FAQ'd, but hoo boy that is gonna be fun while it lasts.

The healing wounds part is really underwhelming actually. You can't bring back slain models with it, so at best you're healing 1 wound off of an ablative guy, or if you're very clever and brave, healing 3 wounds up on one of your cursebloods.

You'd also need to sink 360 points into the squad to get the 2+ fights last, which is... a lot.

I'm mostly interested in how the change to the Hunger will apply to future vampire lords and such. It's nice to be able to heal on doing any wounds, not just killing models.

Yeah, didn't catch the timing change on The Hunger. It would be a lot easier to get it to work on the Cursebloods if it still happened at the end of the combat phase, so you can allocate wounds to get them down to 1 or 2 pretty easily without actually killing them. Still some utility during the opponent's turn, where they might not be fighting first.

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2023/02/17/black-library-celebration-2023-armies-step-from-the-page-to-the-painting-handle/

Anyone know what model the Maleneth conversion is based on?

I think the body(with different arms) is from the Underworlds DoK sorceress, but I can't place the cape or head. Arms look like they are from any Witch Elf kit.

 nels1031 wrote:
https://www.warhammer-community.com/2023/02/17/black-library-celebration-2023-armies-step-from-the-page-to-the-painting-handle/

Anyone know what model the Maleneth conversion is based on?

I think the body(with different arms) is from the Underworlds DoK sorceress, but I can't place the cape or head. Arms look like they are from any Witch Elf kit.

Arms and body are from the same Underworlds model:

tneva82 wrote:
Mind you there's lumineth unit that has reference to doing mortal wounds(wards can't be made against wounds and mortal wounds caused by this unit) without single way to add mortal wounds in the book to that unit.

Could be future proofing plus copy&paste standard phrase.

Allied into an army using Curse.

Salamanders!

That's a fantastic update.

Absolutely adore those little axolotl frills

Unique handlers are great too

Only one pose with a two head options by the look of it, but still a significant improvement over the current situation, so I'm happy

Fingers crossed for Razordons too

SING HOSANNAS!

Not only a popular request, but a popular request well realised.

So two head options for the Salamander and two staff options for the priest of Chotec. That's awesome.

I wonder why these skinks have different crests? I thought it would be something to match the creature, but generic skinks would actually be a better match. Maybe since they worship a sun god, the crests sort of resemble the sun? Also, these skinks lack the ear holes that all the newer skinks have.

Just that. Their crests show their spawning purpose.

If I may quote the article, GaroRobe...

"The Sun Acolytes who handle these sour-tempered salamanders are marked for their duty from birth. When the stars flare and the spawning pools boil, the skinks who emerge are blessed with incredible resistance to heat, as well as frills that resemble Chotec’s own sunburst. "

Another great addition to Lizardmen. Keep it coming GW!

 Dysartes wrote:
If I may quote the article, GaroRobe...

"The Sun Acolytes who handle these sour-tempered salamanders are marked for their duty from birth. When the stars flare and the spawning pools boil, the skinks who emerge are blessed with incredible resistance to heat, as well as frills that resemble Chotec’s own sunburst. "

Ah, that'll do it

The Salamander is ace, but I don’t care for those Skink frills.

 Shadow Walker wrote:
Another great addition to Lizardmen. Keep it coming GW!

Yeah these have been absolutely on point so far, well worth the wait!

I hope they fully show off Coalesced paint schemes soon. They've only teased the paint scheme so far, and although I'm sticking with the OG lizardmen colorscheme, I'm curious to see what an entire Coalesced army looks like

That's really good. Seriously amazing model.
A nice headswap as well (jaws and frill).

There are two problems with it, though:

The left legs look fused onto the body, without a decent undercut (whereas the right legs look like separate bits).

That fething rock. While not as bad as the beast of nurgle, that rock is going to dominate every instance of the model without a fair amount of work.


The fluff is amusing as well. From the cyber skull implant to directing the things with a laser pointer, like a semi-feral cat.

And remember.

It’s not sighing.

It’s merely idly collecting phlegm at the back of its throat. And when it’s got enough?

It’s going to gob at you.

I love it!! A little homage to old lore and the old dimetrodon-looking salamander while also being unique from the Total War: Warhammer salamanders and having some nice new details to match it into the AoS setting!

The laser pointer + fitted cyber enhancement is a little goofy but I dig it! I can't wait to see how people paint this guy up, and I can't wait to get my own!

drbored wrote:
The laser pointer + fitted cyber enhancement is a little goofy but I dig it! I

Echoes of Jurassic World, there!

These are going to be such a joy to paint for painters. Could be a real riot of colours.

Beast_of_Guanyin wrote:
These are going to be such a joy to paint for painters. Could be a real riot of colours.

I could very much see a Golden Daemon winner being chosen on this model. A diorama incorporating the skinks and some OSL around the mouth to show some flame about to be HORFED up would be really cool!

Ooh, lovely. Just the thing for menacing James Mason and Arlene Dahl.

Wonderage….

Lizardmen clearly getting a long needed substantial update.

Their traditional nemesis, the Skaven, also need a substantial update and indeed Aosification.

Dare we hope-pray?

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
Wonderage….

Lizardmen clearly getting a long needed substantial update.

Their traditional nemesis, the Skaven, also need a substantial update and indeed Aosification.

Dare we hope-pray?

My major hope is that they're the major enemy in 4th edition for the launch box.

Imagine that it's new Dawnbringers versus Skaven instead of typical Stormcast. Dawnbringers vs Skaven would give them a chance to show how nefarious the Skaven are, while fleshing out the brand new faction and giving the Skaven some much-needed love.

drbored wrote:

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
Wonderage….

Lizardmen clearly getting a long needed substantial update.

Their traditional nemesis, the Skaven, also need a substantial update and indeed Aosification.

Dare we hope-pray?

My major hope is that they're the major enemy in 4th edition for the launch box.

Imagine that it's new Dawnbringers versus Skaven instead of typical Stormcast. Dawnbringers vs Skaven would give them a chance to show how nefarious the Skaven are, while fleshing out the brand new faction and giving the Skaven some much-needed love.

Nothing says nefarious like a race of creatures who after thousands of years, the destruction of the universe and pacts with a chaos god like smelly hairy infighting creatures that live in the sewers under grandmothers basement. (Picturing my kids as Skaven now)

As paleontologist, I find lovely that they gave the new salamander (that is, indeed, a salamander, but the whole unit with handlers is now "Spawn of Chotec", so I don't know if this is a full on replacement or vanilla sallies will still remain) a kinda paleo accurate Dimetrodon sail, and overall body plan, I remember that WD article when they said this are fantasy creatures and not precisely actual dinosaurs or animals.

The amphibian gills are just adorable.

Marked skink spawning are a great touch too.

Rules are kinda bad, but this are just a teaser.

They again showed the Starborne colour scheme. This makes me want to have another army just for the sake of painting them all like they're Godzillas charging up their Atomic Breaths.

Finally, I want to assume this salamander has been bumped up on scale and leaving behind the 75 mm base, but I can't really tell for sure.

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
Their traditional nemesis, the Skaven, also need a substantial update and indeed Aosification.

Dare we hope-pray?

If you're going to tease me with the concept of updated poisoned wind globadiers then I think I'm just going to cry.

Haha, what 'AoSification' could be applied to Skaven? I mean they are so bland and lacking in unique identity, it feels like they aren't suited for the setting at all! /s

Skaven need AoSification?



People people the AoS setting was BUILT so that everyone else could get on Skaven's level!

Oh but think-ponder what wonder kill-weapons Clever Skaven can do-create now!

GW: "You asked for more Seraphon, and we finally got around to update the faction with lots of new stuff! So, what do you think, guys?
Dakka: "Where the heck are my new skaven at?!"

Skaven had their AoSification during the end times.

JSG wrote:
Skaven had their AoSification during the end times.

Hell Pit Abomination and especially Doomwheel predate end times by years...

 NinthMusketeer wrote:

JSG wrote:
Skaven had their AoSification during the end times.

Hell Pit Abomination and especially Doomwheel predate end times by years...

Yeah, the Doomwheel was about during WFB 4th edition.

Only Endtimes things were Big Thanquol and the Cyborg Ratogre things.

 Fayric wrote:
GW: "You asked for more Seraphon, and we finally got around to update the faction with lots of new stuff! So, what do you think, guys?
Dakka: "Where the heck are my new skaven at?!"

I think for me these new models are so great that Skaven are the main faction that comes to mind being comparable XD

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
Only Endtimes things were Big Thanquol and the Cyborg Ratogre things.

And the Verminlord variants.

True! Still not a full AoSification.

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
True! Still not a full AoSification.

But what would be? It's a pretty vague term often used by those who have an axe to grind (not saying you, just in general) based on some very subjective perceptions. Outside of more 'open' model designs being free from the constraints of ranking up many AoS releases have been very in line with what WHFB was.

Honestly almost everything in AoS would fit into Old World.


Death Grand Alliance is basically just the Vampire army split into 3 parts.

Destruction is almost entirely Old World models with a few updates here and there

Chaos is the same, updates and mostly Old World stuff

The brand new armies that are totally new like fish elves would have easily fit into Old World since the sea would have given them room to grow as a force, change the lore around of course.


The Sylvaneth are just an offshoot of the Wood Elves without the Elves; etc..


Basically almost all the models would fit in the Old World setting. Ironically the Stormcast would likely be the ones with the biggest lore shift to justify in the setting. Otherwise pretty much every other faction fits.

 NinthMusketeer wrote:

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
True! Still not a full AoSification.

But what would be? It's a pretty vague term often used by those who have an axe to grind (not saying you, just in general) based on some very subjective perceptions. Outside of more 'open' model designs being free from the constraints of ranking up many AoS releases have been very in line with what WHFB was.

It’s a removal of certain design restraints. Tech wise it’s true Skaven have always pushed it, almost pushing from Napoleonic to Victoriana/WW1 (gas masks, gas weapons etc). But with Kharadron kicking about and the general tech becoming more fantastical, there’s plenty room for Skaven tech to get even more hilarious.

Moulder and Pestilens in particular could really lean into fresh horrors.

Right now the most striking are the Khadorans who are honestly just Dwarves using technology which they had to their fullest in the Old World. Granted some elements have shifted, eg they use fancy engine machines instead of pure inflated zepplins because otherwise their models would be fast at 28mm scale.

But in the end they still rocked around with helicopters and other stuff in the Old World. Gotrek and Felix hitch a ride on a mega-airship several times before its downed.


Cities of Sigmar going for more steam punk is a shift, but then again give a generation of two of the Dwarves releasing their restraint on technology and I'd wager their human allies would pick up a lot of it, start tinkering and be following behind them with their own take on it.






The real "Aosification" is in the lore and stories. It's how the narrative is no longer mortals but gods who advance the main story; whilst mortals are left behind. Heck the lack of a proper dating system means we don't even really know who is alive when and I've got a feeling if we worked it all out there's a few humans running around between the various stories who are impossibly old; or interacting with big key events in the narrative that are too far apart to make sense. Whilst in other areas there are things that don't make sense the other way - Cities of Sigmar that have been founded, risen and people who have had generations of growing up without the taint of Chaos being anything more than a threat on the front lines; yet at the same tim also still nestled within stories of Sigmar advancing against a powerful headway.

Part of this is the sheer scale of the setting being mindboggling. Each Realm being larger than our own world (heck originally they were almost infinite) etc..

Plus some realms - like Metal - being almost a front cover for a Heavy Metal album.



So I'd say that the models are fine, the models would fit into Old World; the lore is where the real "aosification" is and honestly GW have still yet to polish and perfect that. We need WAY more standard artwork; way more stories (not of gods); way more structure (freaking heck give us DATES) etc

 Overread wrote:
Ironically the Stormcast would likely be the ones with the biggest lore shift to justify in the setting. Otherwise pretty much every other faction fits.

Just make them divine soldiers of Solkan, Law Soldiers to counter the Chaos Warriors. The gods of Law really got sidelined outside of WFRP.

So, we're way off topic talking about Old World stuff... again...

all I'm gunna say is that anyone with any high hopes of being able to use AoS stuff smoothly in Old World games is gunna have a bad time.

People need to check their hype for a game we know next to nothing about, that's likely to be FW resin, and goes back to square bases. All they've said is that you'll be able to use all those old models that have been sitting in a closet for 10+ years.

It would be incredibly unwise to have system cross overs. Let fantasy get its own junk. And i do think it's a severe reach to claim all the models and ranges could be cross compatible.

It is hard to imagine how there would not be crossovers considering there are entire AoS armies made near-exclusively of kits from WHFB.

 NinthMusketeer wrote:
It is hard to imagine how there would not be crossovers considering there are entire AoS armies made near-exclusively of kits from WHFB.

There's two design philosophies of GW at war with each other.

On the one hand, GW tends to make rules and games that let you play with more of your toys than less. They let you use Underworlds and Warcry units in AoS, they bridge the gap often for 30k and 40k units (to a degree) and Kill Team units are given rules for 40k.

So, it would make sense if there were rules for TOW stuff in AoS and vice versus if this was the case, right?

But then there's the idea that GW is pushing AoS to update all of those old kits that would normally be cross-compatible, or that are hold-overs from WHFB. The new Chaos Warriors and Saurus are bigger, wider, and wouldn't fit easily on the old square bases that are much smaller than their new circular ones.

If they want AoS to have its own identity from TOW, they'd keep them separate, to avoid customer confusion, right?

Time will tell, but I think the further along we get to TOW, the more we're going to see proof that the miniatures will not be cross compatible, much in the same way that there's no support for the new Primaris units in 30k. Setting aside arguments of 'counts as' or 'conversions', the fact remains that the Repulsor tank does not have rules in 30k, because it's from a totally different time.

What I think WILL happen, is GW may create ways to use TOW models in AoS instead. I could see Cathay and Kislev units being comparable to upcoming Dawnbringer Crusades stuff, but not the other way around.

Of course base sizes aren't immutable(if they were 25mm square wouldnjt exist). 25mm square too small? Make it 30-35mm instead

Problem is that they are if gw stick to what they said originally about all old armies being playable immediately. Can't do that if they screw with the base sizes.

 Inquisitor Gideon wrote:
Problem is that they are if gw stick to what they said originally about all old armies being playable immediately. Can't do that if they screw with the base sizes.

Depends on if they standardise what size bases models have - a la AoS - or say use whatever you want, like 40k.

Well it will be standardized because it's ranked. Also that doesn't address the problem if they suddenly decide to adjust base sizes and screw over anybody who had an old army and now can't play because they have to rebase their old models.

I assume they’ll make trays that hold round bases.

 Inquisitor Gideon wrote:
Problem is that they are if gw stick to what they said originally about all old armies being playable immediately. Can't do that if they screw with the base sizes.

They are happy to sell you new bases.

They didn't say your 2k list gets to play as it is. Points etc change. Rebasing is norm for GW.

And they can of course go for use what you had like elsewhere. New models with new base sizes, old with old.

Did they ever say you don't have to rebase models? That doesnt' invalidate your old armies. Just make bit extra work. Or they go with your models are usable with this legends army list with your old base. Then here's new models used in this army list with different base size. They didn't say anything about mixing old and new models either.

 Overread wrote:
Honestly almost everything in AoS would fit into Old World.


Death Grand Alliance is basically just the Vampire army split into 3 parts.

Destruction is almost entirely Old World models with a few updates here and there

Chaos is the same, updates and mostly Old World stuff

The brand new armies that are totally new like fish elves would have easily fit into Old World since the sea would have given them room to grow as a force, change the lore around of course.


The Sylvaneth are just an offshoot of the Wood Elves without the Elves; etc..


Basically almost all the models would fit in the Old World setting. Ironically the Stormcast would likely be the ones with the biggest lore shift to justify in the setting. Otherwise pretty much every other faction fits.

For me, it's more about the aesthetic and the tone over what could feasibly appear in The Old World. Fyreslayers are, broadly, just slayers with some extra monsters but the models themselves would look bizarre in an Old World setting with all the bling thrown on them. Lumineth are far too many design steps away from High Elves to transfer over comfortably (if at all). Ossiarchs would struggle to transfer over at all; there's nothing 'Khemri' about them. Stormcast are obvious 'No-Nos'. Chaos, Lizardmen, Skaven, most Greenskins; grand. They've retained a lot of their identity from previous incarnations. Kharadon... eh. Even if the technology theoretically existed (or its equivalent) in The Old World, the whole steampunk look is a massive aesthetic shift.

I think it's a stretch to say that every faction fits. Some do. Others are too far gone into AoS design to port backwards without a dramatic re-evaluation of what Warhammer Fantasy looks like. Which isn't me negging on AoS designs; just acknowledging that they're sometimes very different in tone (and other times, they're not).

The increase in "bling" is less of a design change and more of a materials change. Don't forget old world hero models in metal had plenty of over the top bling and design on them. The plastics were simpler because it was party a function of the material and GW's skill at working with it.
Lumineth would have just been the next upgrade for the High Elves. Or perhaps they'd be a coven of elves from the far eastern regions when GW opened up to releasing Nippon and Cathay onto the table as part of expanding the game. So you'd have the traditional haughty High Elves and then their more Eastern/Australian cousins come to join the fight.

As for Ossiarchs they'd easily fit too.

Just have Nagash arise again and then have the Tomb Kings throw off the shackles of his control over them. An enraged Nagash cursing them and with the Vampires always fickle and likely eager to learn the secret from the Tomb Kings, Nagash might well throw his great powers into crafting the Ossiarchs in the Old World.

Remember Ossiarchs aren't "replacing" Tomb Kings, they are a different take on the concept of skeleton/bone warriors.

 Overread wrote:
The increase in "bling" is less of a design change and more of a materials change. Don't forget old world hero models in metal had plenty of over the top bling and design on them. The plastics were simpler because it was party a function of the material and GW's skill at working with it.
Lumineth would have just been the next upgrade for the High Elves. Or perhaps they'd be a coven of elves from the far eastern regions when GW opened up to releasing Nippon and Cathay onto the table as part of expanding the game. So you'd have the traditional haughty High Elves and then their more Eastern/Australian cousins come to join the fight.

As for Ossiarchs they'd easily fit too.

Just have Nagash arise again and then have the Tomb Kings throw off the shackles of his control over them. An enraged Nagash cursing them and with the Vampires always fickle and likely eager to learn the secret from the Tomb Kings, Nagash might well throw his great powers into crafting the Ossiarchs in the Old World.

Remember Ossiarchs aren't "replacing" Tomb Kings, they are a different take on the concept of skeleton/bone warriors.

What you say is true, but sadly it's not the way GW have chosen. They're deliberately going back in time in the Old World, so stuff like Cathay arriving on the scene, Nagash reawakening and so on can't happen, or at least can't happen until the next timeshift or retcon. The big story beats are set in stone by word of the authors, you're only 'allowed' small, human scale stories and events against a backdrop of 'this is what happens at the large scale'. Of course, all of that is bunk and you can do whatever you want, and some sort of fan edition will probably appear, but that's how GW intends it to go down.

Oh I agree, I meant that AoS would work in Old World in terms of if they'd advanced past the End Times with the ET failing to happen etc...

That said I fully expect to see AoS models as counts-as or whatever in Old World. Functionallty we'll have to see how they handle it and my biggest worry is that one game will eclipse the other in sales. That said GW has done well balancing 40K and 30K and 30K only leans on Marine design ethos so a really limited creative pool visually - though marines are a bit of an enigma in how well they sell .

I don't think we'll see anything official but we will see a lot of people trying to cram 40mm models onto 25mm square bases. Other than that it's a side game so if you thought GW treated WFB poorly before...

 Overread wrote:
The increase in "bling" is less of a design change and more of a materials change. Don't forget old world hero models in metal had plenty of over the top bling and design on them. The plastics were simpler because it was party a function of the material and GW's skill at working with it.
Lumineth would have just been the next upgrade for the High Elves. Or perhaps they'd be a coven of elves from the far eastern regions when GW opened up to releasing Nippon and Cathay onto the table as part of expanding the game. So you'd have the traditional haughty High Elves and then their more Eastern/Australian cousins come to join the fight.

As for Ossiarchs they'd easily fit too.

Just have Nagash arise again and then have the Tomb Kings throw off the shackles of his control over them. An enraged Nagash cursing them and with the Vampires always fickle and likely eager to learn the secret from the Tomb Kings, Nagash might well throw his great powers into crafting the Ossiarchs in the Old World.

Remember Ossiarchs aren't "replacing" Tomb Kings, they are a different take on the concept of skeleton/bone warriors.

I still can't agree with this sentiment; my point on the 'bling' was more to illustrate that there's not that much difference between Slayers and Fyreslayers in terms of the core design, but the latter would still look out of place (material change is naff-all to do with it on that one; those Fyreslayer plastics are, themselves, very basic). It wasn't necessarily a commentary on the general level of 'bling' between WHFB and AoS.

Ossiarchs, to me, just don't look like a faction that would pop up in the Old World, irrespective of any lore shifts (which, I appreciate is somewhat contrary given the very clear design cues they took from the End Times undead releases). Ditto for Lumineth. The lore certainly bends to service any potential changes; it's fantasy, you can adapt it to justify whatever you want, but that doesn't mean that those changes necessarily fit the tone of the setting.

It's fairly redundant anyway as they're, pretty clearly, not incorporating any of the AoS-specific factions into The Old World when it appears based on what we've seen so far.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Tsagualsa wrote:


What you say is true, but sadly it's not the way GW have chosen. They're deliberately going back in time in the Old World, so stuff like Cathay arriving on the scene, Nagash reawakening and so on can't happen, or at least can't happen until the next timeshift or retcon. The big story beats are set in stone by word of the authors, you're only 'allowed' small, human scale stories and events against a backdrop of 'this is what happens at the large scale'. Of course, all of that is bunk and you can do whatever you want, and some sort of fan edition will probably appear, but that's how GW intends it to go down.

Cathay (and Kislev) are nigh on confirmed as coming. Very much a personal take but I'm actually glad the emphasis looks to be more on the smaller scale stuff (though I think it's more than a little disingenuous to suggest that there's been any sort of comment from the developers on what's 'allowed'; where does that notion even come from?). I've seen what happens when GW attempt world-encompassing narrative shifts in the Warhammer World. A few times.

JimmyWolf87 wrote:


Cathay (and Kislev) are nigh on confirmed as coming. Very much a personal take but I'm actually glad the emphasis looks to be more on the smaller scale stuff (though I think it's more than a little disingenuous to suggest that there's been any sort of comment from the developers on what's 'allowed'; where does that notion even come from?). I've seen what happens when GW attempt world-encompassing narrative shifts in the Warhammer World. A few times.

Well, that one community article where they reminded the reader several times that the End Times totally did happen, the Old World, sorry, World That Was, is very much dead and gone and that's a fact, comes to mind, but then who gives a crap what GW 'allows' anyway - their 'official' turn of events and stories is just one of many, sensible players have always mixed and matched official and homebrew stuff, as well as the results of their own campaigns or roleplaying stories.

I just think players should not set themselves up for dissappointment by expecting too much from this 'The Old World' project - we still don't know much else besides their confirmations of having square bases, the possibility to use old models and the general setting. Until we know more it'd be foolish the speculate on cross-setting compatibility and new armies.

Tsagualsa wrote:

JimmyWolf87 wrote:


Cathay (and Kislev) are nigh on confirmed as coming. Very much a personal take but I'm actually glad the emphasis looks to be more on the smaller scale stuff (though I think it's more than a little disingenuous to suggest that there's been any sort of comment from the developers on what's 'allowed'; where does that notion even come from?). I've seen what happens when GW attempt world-encompassing narrative shifts in the Warhammer World. A few times.

Well, that one community article where they reminded the reader several times that the End Times totally did happen, the Old World, sorry, World That Was, is very much dead and gone and that's a fact, comes to mind, but then who gives a crap what GW 'allows' anyway - their 'official' turn of events and stories is just one of many, sensible players have always mixed and matched official and homebrew stuff, as well as the results of their own campaigns or roleplaying stories.

I just think players should not set themselves up for dissappointment by expecting too much from this 'The Old World' project - we still don't know much else besides their confirmations of having square bases, the possibility to use old models and the general setting. Until we know more it'd be foolish the speculate on cross-setting compatibility and new armies.

Sure, that was egregious and annoying but there's a gulf of context between that and the idea that they've been suggesting players can't create their own narratives (of whatever scale).

Tsagualsa wrote:

What you say is true, but sadly it's not the way GW have chosen. They're deliberately going back in time in the Old World, so stuff like Cathay arriving on the scene, Nagash reawakening and so on can't happen, or at least can't happen until the next timeshift or retcon. The big story beats are set in stone by word of the authors, you're only 'allowed' small, human scale stories and events against a backdrop of 'this is what happens at the large scale'. Of course, all of that is bunk and you can do whatever you want, and some sort of fan edition will probably appear, but that's how GW intends it to go down.

Ofcourse, the whole Old World project is based on nostalgia and predictability (in the setting) as opposed to AoS "anything goes" pilosophy where every new faction can invent brand new lore and worlds to justify a cool design they just came up with.
I think there is room for both styles -either you make up lore around the models you build, like in AoS, or you build models around the lore, like The Old World (or Horus Heresy, for that matter). I think both styles can be equally satisfying if you have the possibility to play multiple armies/game systems.

 Fayric wrote:

Tsagualsa wrote:

What you say is true, but sadly it's not the way GW have chosen. They're deliberately going back in time in the Old World, so stuff like Cathay arriving on the scene, Nagash reawakening and so on can't happen, or at least can't happen until the next timeshift or retcon. The big story beats are set in stone by word of the authors, you're only 'allowed' small, human scale stories and events against a backdrop of 'this is what happens at the large scale'. Of course, all of that is bunk and you can do whatever you want, and some sort of fan edition will probably appear, but that's how GW intends it to go down.

Ofcourse, the whole Old World project is based on nostalgia and predictability (in the setting) as opposed to AoS "anything goes" pilosophy where every new faction can invent brand new lore and worlds to justify a cool design they just came up with.
I think there is room for both styles -either you make up lore around the models you build, like in AoS, or you build models around the lore, like The Old World (or Horus Heresy, for that matter). I think both styles can be equally satisfying if you have the possibility to play multiple armies/game systems.

I'm personally happy with the Old World as a backdrop mainly for RPGs and skirmish gaming / Oldhammer, so the direction they're going in suits me just fine.

JSG wrote:
I don't think we'll see anything official but we will see a lot of people trying to cram 40mm models onto 25mm square bases. Other than that it's a side game so if you thought GW treated WFB poorly before...

We already have seen. Not pretty.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Tsagualsa wrote:

JimmyWolf87 wrote:


Cathay (and Kislev) are nigh on confirmed as coming. Very much a personal take but I'm actually glad the emphasis looks to be more on the smaller scale stuff (though I think it's more than a little disingenuous to suggest that there's been any sort of comment from the developers on what's 'allowed'; where does that notion even come from?). I've seen what happens when GW attempt world-encompassing narrative shifts in the Warhammer World. A few times.

Well, that one community article where they reminded the reader several times that the End Times totally did happen, the Old World, sorry, World That Was, is very much dead and gone and that's a fact, comes to mind, but then who gives a crap what GW 'allows' anyway - their 'official' turn of events and stories is just one of many, sensible players have always mixed and matched official and homebrew stuff, as well as the results of their own campaigns or roleplaying stories.

I just think players should not set themselves up for dissappointment by expecting too much from this 'The Old World' project - we still don't know much else besides their confirmations of having square bases, the possibility to use old models and the general setting. Until we know more it'd be foolish the speculate on cross-setting compatibility and new armies.

Sure. And that just means game will have room for thousands of years poorly explored area.

The entire appeal of TOW is that it isn't AOS

Even if the rules suck, which is highly likely because it's GW we're talking about, everyone can just go back to playing older editions as long as they put the old model ranges back into production and maybe release some new ones. Ebay prices are joke for some of this stuff.

Goose LeChance wrote:
everyone can just go back to playing older editions as long as they put the old model ranges back into production and maybe release some new ones. Ebay prices are joke for some of this stuff.

I'm not sure what GW/forgeworld prices for that stuff are going to be, but i'm confident that it won't be pretty.

Goose LeChance wrote:
The entire appeal of TOW is that it isn't AOS

Even if the rules suck, which is highly likely because it's GW we're talking about, everyone can just go back to playing older editions as long as they put the old model ranges back into production and maybe release some new ones. Ebay prices are joke for some of this stuff.

I wonder, if TOW turns out to be a lemon, will ex-WFB players who've been hanging on finally acknowledge the existence of other, minis-agnostic rank 'n' flank games...?

Naaah, easier to just give up altogether if daddy GW isn't the one to give up the bling.

Anyway, agreed with the wait and see approach. TOW may or may not be all our favourite parts of WFB, back from the dead and ready to whisk us away on a comet, but even if it has a veneer of familiarity, I think it's likely to be something new and unexpected.

 Vermis wrote:

Goose LeChance wrote:
The entire appeal of TOW is that it isn't AOS

Even if the rules suck, which is highly likely because it's GW we're talking about, everyone can just go back to playing older editions as long as they put the old model ranges back into production and maybe release some new ones. Ebay prices are joke for some of this stuff.

I wonder, if TOW turns out to be a lemon, will ex-WFB players who've been hanging on finally acknowledge the existence of other, minis-agnostic rank 'n' flank games...?

Naaah, easier to just give up altogether if daddy GW isn't the one to give up the bling.

Anyway, agreed with the wait and see approach. TOW may or may not be all our favourite parts of WFB, back from the dead and ready to whisk us away on a comet, but even if it has a veneer of familiarity, I think it's likely to be something new and unexpected.

I have Oathmark and Asoiaf (even though I hate GoT) because I like the models and games. But I can't really blame people for wanting GW models when the alternatives are Mantic or 3d printers.

Rules are just paper, they can go back to old editions, try 9th or whatever. Some game systems are too different and don't capture the feel of WHFB if that's what they're after.

Goose LeChance wrote:
The entire appeal of TOW is that it isn't AOS

Even if the rules suck, which is highly likely because it's GW we're talking about, everyone can just go back to playing older editions as long as they put the old model ranges back into production and maybe release some new ones. Ebay prices are joke for some of this stuff.

I've just started looking at 6th edition WHFB with some friends, and yeah you're not kidding. Ridiculous prices. The old Empire battalion (not army, the battalion) is going for like $400+. Mounted wizard is $75, it's worse than regular GW prices lol

Goose LeChance wrote:
The entire appeal of TOW is that it isn't AOS

Then maybe people interested in TOW can take the TOW discussion back to the TOW thread, rather than cluttering up the AoS thread?

Voss wrote:

Goose LeChance wrote:
The entire appeal of TOW is that it isn't AOS

Then maybe people interested in TOW can take the TOW discussion back to the TOW thread, rather than cluttering up the AoS thread?

Yeah probably but I didn't start it

JSG wrote:
I don't think we'll see anything official but we will see a lot of people trying to cram 40mm models onto 25mm square bases. Other than that it's a side game so if you thought GW treated WFB poorly before...

i feel like this is an attack at me and the new saurus ... id be interested in the Old World if it has army building rules like before. lots of items and options to choose, large groups of models, using the big monsters (including maybe new ones that got added since Age of Sigmar) but the new saurus, as an example, look so much better.

SF

Dropped this on the 40k rumour thread too, no idea what system it might be for:

Dudeface wrote:
Dropped this on the 40k rumour thread too, no idea what system it might be for:

Spoiler:

That looks familiar *badum-tish*

Dudeface wrote:
Dropped this on the 40k rumour thread too, no idea what system it might be for:

Spoiler:

I don't know exactly what it is, but I love it!
New Herald or just something fun?

 KidCthulhu wrote:

Dudeface wrote:
Dropped this on the 40k rumour thread too, no idea what system it might be for:

Spoiler:

I don't know exactly what it is, but I love it!
New Herald or just something fun?

I think it's something like a Sorceror's familiar, it looks to weedy to be a proper demon.

Unlikely to be aos release though could get rules. Kt etc would be more likely.

Or it's just art/kitbash and not preview

tneva82 wrote:
Unlikely to be aos release though could get rules. Kt etc would be more likely.

Or it's just art/kitbash and not preview

It can also always be some random event/anniversary/warhammer+ miniature without any relation to any larger release.

True. Then it would be just alternative herald

I'm betting it is atleast something for the smaller games. Either Underworlds or Kill Team.

It being an anniversary mini is also possible.

It looks very small. Also, it has a scenic base so that makes me think Underworlds. Kill Team models don't have those kind of bases, nor do warcry. Even exclusive models typically don't, except for that sister of battle one.

It does look fun, I like the character of it!

Could Underworlds be heading into a Silver Tower?

A Silver Tower would be the perfect setting for Underworlds. It would make more sense for bands of explorers to be there than Harrowdeep and its random whirlpools sucking warbands down to its depths.

Where are we with Underworlds anyway? New season around April or May and no current warbands left to reveal/release?

Like others I could see that being it. Eyes of the Nine is old by now and Tzeentch surely has plenty of stuff left that could be stuffed into a warband. It might even be part of a Chaos all stars warband, where the sorcerer of the group has a Tzeentchian familiar.

 KidCthulhu wrote:

Dudeface wrote:
Dropped this on the 40k rumour thread too, no idea what system it might be for:

Spoiler:

I don't know exactly what it is, but I love it!
New Herald or just something fun?

It's a daemon starfish. All fun, all games. Just don't let it get too close to clown she-elves with pointy sticks. It's not going to end well.

 Geifer wrote:
Where are we with Underworlds anyway? New season around April or May and no current warbands left to reveal/release?

Yeah, the current roadmap goes to February and is completed, the next thing on it is a new season at an unspecified date:



If we're optimistic, that means that the next season is going to be previewed either at Warhammer World Open Day or Adepticon, basically around the corner. If we're slightly less optimistic, they'll wait for Warhammer Fest, but that is very probably where they'll preview WH40k 10th edition, so they'll avoid other stuff hogging too much of the spotlight.

My bet is on Adepticon in march.

Thanks.

Adepticon is probably a good guess. Last year they had something for most (possibly all) specialist games. Even if they spread out announcements, they'll probably save one of the warbands in the versus box for the event.

 Geifer wrote:
Thanks.

Adepticon is probably a good guess. Last year they had something for most (possibly all) specialist games. Even if they spread out announcements, they'll probably save one of the warbands in the versus box for the event.

Today's community article previews the last missing thing from the roadmap: the 'Beastbound Assault' card deck:

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2023/02/24/discover-a-love-for-wildlife-with-the-beastbound-assault-rivals-deck-for-warhammer-underworlds/

Kharadron and Regiments of Renown next week

Do we have any prices on the regiments of renown? Birthdays coming up but I don't want to add the Throng to my list if it costs more than $60 (it'll probably be $80 since the two core units alone cost $55 each)

Obligatory "we won't have prices until Monday at the earliest, and then they'll be in British and European monies" post.

Because we won't have prices until the independents get their sheets, and that's Mondays.

Took quite a while to get all three of the monsters from that 3 pack they're about to put out.

Can't want to see the discount...

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Took quite a while to get all three of the monsters from that 3 pack they're about to put out.

Can't want to see the discount...

Patience is a virtue.

Unless GW randomly decides to pull the product for no reason and with no warning, in which case it's a curse.

Unless they suddenly bring things back in new weird box sets that are impossible to predict, in which case it's a virtue again.

Unless those box sets are limited and sell out before payday, in which case it's a curse again.

Bit of variation on the RoR prices. At least WHU isn’t getting even more expensive.

Norgrimms's Rune Throng combines perfectly with Start Collecting! Greywater Fastness. If you get one of each, you end up with 20 Longbeards/Hammerers, 10 Irondrakes/Ironbreakers, one Gyrocopter/Gyrobomber and three different Characters. Only duplicate unit is the one that you want to duplicate anyway.

Have to get the Soulblight Regiment of Renown. Getting a Corpse Cart for just 7.5 pounds extra is such a steal.

Oh! These are New RoRs. I’d missed the announcement and have been just assuming it was a made to order of old stuff. Then I saw the list there and had to Google up Elthwin’s because I was curious what old thing they were shoving into Sylvaneth. Are these getting special character type rules or just new boxed sets?

Rules that allow them to be included beside own army(they are mercenaries).

RoR rules are out

https://www.warhammer-community.com/wp-content/uploads/2023/02/dqR6hMfMiAmIFz6n.pdf

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2023/03/01/download-rules-for-regiments-of-renown-and-bring-spicy-abilities-to-liven-up-your-army/

 DaveC wrote:
RoR rules are out

https://www.warhammer-community.com/wp-content/uploads/2023/02/dqR6hMfMiAmIFz6n.pdf

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2023/03/01/download-rules-for-regiments-of-renown-and-bring-spicy-abilities-to-liven-up-your-army/

I think we may have found a new champion in the ongoing search for the most deliberatly opaque rules writing. Fittingly, it's the Tzeentch dude:

Sparks of Profane Potential:

Thryx is adept at harnessing the mutagenic essence of
slain daemons, using them to enhance his conjured sorcerous manifestations.

Once per turn, at the end of a phase in which a Horror model in this regiment
of renown was slain while its unit was wholly within 12" of the Magister in
this regiment of renown, you can pick 1 endless spell on the battlefield that was
summoned by that Magister and remove that endless spell from play. If you
do so, that Magister can immediately automatically cast a spell they know that
summons a Disciples of Tzeentch endless spell that is different to the one removed
from play (do not make a casting roll). That spell cannot be unbound. Set up the
endless spell as described in its Summoning rules. Depending on the type of endless
spell you set up, you can immediately do one of the following:

• Burning Sigil of Tzeentch: Resolve the effect of the Radiant Transmogrification
ability as if it were the end of the movement phase.

• Tome of Eyes: Attempt to cast The Parchment Curse with the Magister in this
regiment of renown as if it were your hero phase.

• Daemonic Simulacrum: Resolve the effect of the Snapping Jaws ability as if the
endless spell had just moved.

In plain language:

Your plain language leaves out multiple parts of the rule.

 AduroT wrote:
Your plain language leaves out multiple parts of the rule.

Yeah i know, it left out a lot of the conditionals and the limiting in what effects of the endless spells you could use. It was not actually meant to accurately represent that... thing. It is not a good rule.

So once per turn if pink horror dies you get to replace your endless spell. Seen worse.

Ko book leaked up. Seems less of skew army which sounds promising. Reading tomorrow.

For 180 points the soulblight zombies + cart regiment seems decent. -1 to ward saves within 12" of the cart could wreck some armies.

Khorne and slaanesh getting revealed saturday. As khorne player curious about hero

tneva82 wrote:
Khorne and slaanesh getting revealed saturday. As khorne player curious about hero

Not trying to pick on you, but where did a teaser/hint of that drop?

 Kanluwen wrote:

tneva82 wrote:
Khorne and slaanesh getting revealed saturday. As khorne player curious about hero

Not trying to pick on you, but where did a teaser/hint of that drop?

The paragraph at the bottom of the Metawatch article today said two faction tomes revealed on Saturday. The road map shows the next 2 factions are chaos. There are only 2 chaos factions left without 3rd ed. books.

Aces, thanks!

Yep. Okay technically there's theoretical possibility nurgle/skavee redo or out of left field brand new faction but that's pushing. Especially as word article said was "hen we’ll reveal the next two factions to be updated for the latest edition of Warhammer Age of Sigmar.". That doesn't sound new faction

Hoping for good dual discount box though after lumineth/tzeentch those been missing. And good hero for khorne though probably just beefier melee guy with big axe.

A new priest for Khorne would be swell ! As far as unique characters, I don't know what Slannesh would need though !

Zombie dragon no longer available on GW US.

Good. It was awful.

New Zombie Dragon means Flesheaters would get an entirely new army basically because that's the backbone of their getting started set so I'd really hope it would mean new varghiests and ghoul models.


Unless its just a repack of course

Sc will be getting redone anyway. Something like archregent, 6 horror/flayer, 20 ghouls.

 Overread wrote:
New Zombie Dragon means Flesheaters would get an entirely new army basically because that's the backbone of their getting started set so I'd really hope it would mean new varghiests and ghoul models.


Unless its just a repack of course

To be fair "entirely new army" means they just need to replace 2 kits. FEC only have the Horrors/Flayers and ghouls boxes.

I'm fully expecting rebox of a lot of things, so don't get too excited about certain things going 'no longer available'.

I'd guess that it's more a hint that SBGL are going to be one of the books revealed tomorrow, as we've already seen new box art for Blood Knights and a few other things.

Ehhh...

There's a better than zero chance that they might reveal a shiny new Zombie Dragon and/or Terrorgheist kit. Now that there exists the option for unridden zombie dragons+terrorgheists, they might pull a fast one and use this as an option for making the mounted versions look more dynamic and adding an "on foot" version for the Vampire Lord as well.

Watch it come back at a higher price point while they retire the FEC SC.

I think it's about GW missing out on some $.

Was it not a better value just to spend the extra $15 and get the entire FEC SC box from a third party?

It's still available on other sites...

drbored wrote:
I'm fully expecting rebox of a lot of things, so don't get too excited about certain things going 'no longer available'.

I'd guess that it's more a hint that SBGL are going to be one of the books revealed tomorrow, as we've already seen new box art for Blood Knights and a few other things.

'hat was never realistic cards as we knew next 2 were chaos(gw told thjt long time ago).


And as predicted it was just khorne and slaanesh books. Getting 3 revealed at once too much to ask.

The new ghoul things in Soul Blight were awful, guess I need another SC box before it's too late.

 Vermis wrote:
Good. It was awful.

I am trying to think of a GW Dragon model I liked.

 Mr Morden wrote:

 Vermis wrote:
Good. It was awful.

I am trying to think of a GW Dragon model I liked.

The scaly worms with teeth have some charm even if the sculpts are dated. They're still better than the pixar dragons from Stormcast. The problem is it costs 300$ in GWs monopoly money world to create a decent dragon.

You can get a Wizkids PVC dragon bigger and cheaper. Or a million other options.

Nah, the "S" dragons always looked horrid. Both in terms of looks and to build. Stormdrakes, Karazai and such at least actually look like dragons.

They're way too cutesy for Warhammer, even though the "S" dragons aren't very good I'd still take an ugly dragon over a plushy.

Goose LeChance wrote:
They're way too cutesy for Warhammer, even though the "S" dragons aren't very good I'd still take an ugly dragon over a plushy.

The original S-Dragon is almost 30 years old by now, don't judge it too harshly... other stuff from around that time has aged much worse.

The serpentine dragons were also a product of the fact that all metal and no plastic made them insanely expensive if they'd gone for heavier builds. But yeah they are very much sculpts of their time and age.

This


Was their best for a very long time. Honestly still a good kit though still leans on that whole "high backed armchair" saddle that I've never liked on dragons (seriously what person puts a high backed chair on a flying creature - its like putting a huge brake sail in the way)

Mr Morden wrote:

 Vermis wrote:
Good. It was awful.

I am trying to think of a GW Dragon model I liked.

I think some of the newer dragons (by Seb Perbett?) are better, but some have some serious overchonk going on, especially in the limbs. (I would like this better if it didn't look like it was screaming with the pain of elephantiasis) For some of the best GW dragons I'd probably have to think back to over a decade before I even heard of Games Workshop; before Nick Bibby's greenstuff allergy made him ascend into godmode* and left Trish Carden to crib (poorly) off his style for years and years.

Case in point, that last high elf dragon? A copy of Nick Bibby and Jes Goodwin's Dragon Masters dragon from 1987:


https://collecting-citadel-miniatures.com/wiki/index.php/FileRAG7_Dragon_Masters.jpg

... but with Trish's typical 'crumpled brown paper wrinkles, Barney Gumble lips, and broken jaw' S-dragon head glued on.

I liked the older model. As soon as I saw it I thought 'I must own this someday', and I did. I saw the HE dragon and thought 'meh'. The older model has a much better sense of weight (despite being a much smaller mini) and motion; lithe and swooping. YMMV on the enormous fangs, I don't care for them much myself, but they're about the only con I have with the design.

* SERIOUSLY

And then there's Archon putting out proper HIPS dragons on a regular basis for peanuts.

Dark Elf black dragon was amazing. Seeing it in real like 3D its really one of GWs coolest and best balanced models, IMO.

Also the new Stormdrakes are really great sculpts. Its strange you dont see more of them in P&M threads.

I do like the big Stormcast character dragons.

Mini, cover and vanguard reveal for Khorne and Slaanesh:

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2023/03/04/the-realmgore-ritualist-empowers-the-khornate-faithful-by-showering-them-in-the-blood-of-the-land/


https://www.warhammer-community.com/2023/03/04/the-lord-of-hubris-punishes-foes-who-fall-for-his-perniciously-peacocking-provocations/


Imo both minis are pretty nice. Filling up niche both army didn't really have.
More importantly, both Vanguards are real good. You'd definitely want to buy at least two of those. Especially the Khorne one.

 Mr Morden wrote:

 Vermis wrote:
Good. It was awful.

I am trying to think of a GW Dragon model I liked.

Thoughts on Smaug?

Love that slaanesh champion, definite must-buy for me.

 Dysartes wrote:

 Mr Morden wrote:

 Vermis wrote:
Good. It was awful.

I am trying to think of a GW Dragon model I liked.

Thoughts on Smaug?

Wasn't really GW's design though.

Forge World made a few neat dragon sculpts IMO during the period when they were supporting WHF.

Krondys and Karazai are the first dragons I've liked from GW. They look like dragons, rather than anemic serpents with dental issues.

But, good for Khorne and Slaanesh to get their books soon, lords know they need it.

Dysartes wrote:Thoughts on Smaug?

Baragash wrote:
Wasn't really GW's design though.

Took the words out of my mouth. That was Weta's baby, GW just made the 3D printers go brrrr. Otherwise, that Smaug is pretty nice. Avoids the 'coated in mediterranean roof tiles' look that seems to be in vogue with mini sculptors, and the sweep of his jaws reminds me of Qianzhousaurus.

Still liking that Slaanesh champion better. Love the 'come at me bro' energy.

New Starseer

Think I prefer the Palantir on the plinth.

As far as I can see between the two Skinks they use different arms (and staff), legs and heads so as long as there are also two torsos inside you could build a Starseer with the seated Skink and use the standing version as a Skink Priest on foot

One sat peering into the palantir looks like he’s on the bog, reading something whilst he drops the kids off at the pool.

Almost looks like if you build the "Ponder the orb" pose, you have enough alternative parts to assemble the other one as a Starpriest?

Probably not lucky enough to have a second torso, but it looks like everything else about it is unique.

EDIT: Not ninja'd, just slow

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
One sat peering into the palantir looks like he’s on the bog, reading something whilst he drops the kids off at the pool.

You could probably convert one of the floaty-cylindry-things on the bottom of the palanquin into a TP holder without much effort

Starpriest Bok'rol

Beautiful model! I think that I like the standing one more.

Multiple head and pose options? The new seraphon update will be incredible. Glad there’s no clear plastic stand though I wish the palaquin was a bit higher up

Looking good. What's the total number of kits shown now Vs what's left in resin/old to be updated?

Kroxigors, Eternity Warden, Saurus Oldblood (still on the site, while a plastic Saurus Oldblood exists, though its derpy), and Razordons(assuming no dual kit with the Salamander)

Man, that Lizardmen range is really getting cooler and cooler!

Am I right in thinking all the Seraphon reveals for this wave have been resculpts from Finecast (or older plastic kits), but we have yet to see any new unit choices?

Nope. We have seen new unit(or two. Don't recall every release as i don't play seraphons)

He's neat, and looks like if you build the sitting one you can also build a whole other standing model to put on its own base.

Not bad. Not exciting, either.

Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:One sat peering into the palantir looks like he’s on the bog, reading something whilst he drops the kids off at the pool.

It adds to the awkwardness of that scrying rule. "Guys, I know you're being stabbed to death by dirty rat men, but indoor voice, hey? I'm trying to contemplate my ball here. I'll let you know what all signs point to in a minute."

Dammit, now I have to get one just to paint the Orb up as a magic 8-ball.

 Mr_Rose wrote:
Dammit, now I have to get one just to paint the Orb up as a magic 8-ball.

Its beyond my ability, but I'm going to have a commission painter paint it like Ernie Mccracken(Bill Murray)'s ball from the end of Kingpin.

 nels1031 wrote:

 Mr_Rose wrote:
Dammit, now I have to get one just to paint the Orb up as a magic 8-ball.

Its beyond my ability, but I'm going to have a commission painter paint it like Ernie Mccracken(Bill Murray)'s ball from the end of Kingpin.

One of the better micro-modellers needs to give it light and sound effects:

tneva82 wrote:
Nope. We have seen new unit(or two. Don't recall every release as i don't play seraphons)

I was bored enough to go back through WHC and have a look. Looks like one new unit, though you could stretch it to be a re-imagining of an old OOP unit.

Skink Starseers
Spawn of Chotec (or Salamander, to you or me)
Saurus Astrolith Bearer
Slann Starmaster
Raptadon Chargers (new)
Saurus Warriors

Very nice!

Expectation is that we'll still likely see new Kroxigor and Cold One Riders, and everything other than that is a surprise.

This was a surprise, so much so that yesterday I even bought the resin starseer thinking 'no way this will be updated' and lo and behold!

Kroxigor is my big hope at this point. They've languished for a long, long time. The last metals (turned resin) weren't even all that great at the time.
GW has a bad habit of skipping a really needed kit in these big updates.

Lizardmen refresh just goes from strength to strength.

Let's hope they nail the new Kroxigor minis.

Obr and soulblight battletomes dissapeared from the shop. While not conclusive does suggest them being spring death tomes.

Hopefully fec at least gets something more than just a hero then.

I’m still holding out hope for an updated Skinks unit…

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Lizardmen refresh just goes from strength to strength.

Let's hope they nail the new Kroxigor minis.

Not 100% reliable, but they’re sold out at least in the U.K., so hopefully we’re getting plakky ones.

It's a nice model. But I'm not sure what to make of the sitting variant, especially the head.

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Lizardmen refresh just goes from strength to strength.

Let's hope they nail the new Kroxigor minis.

Not 100% reliable, but they’re sold out at least in the U.K., so hopefully we’re getting plakky ones.

Thing is when armies get attention like this, the current stock can do a nosedive because people get enthusiastic for the army again and the potential for updates causes those who have existing models to rush out and complete sets/collections/units. Even if the models get replaced with generally agreed upon, better versions, many people still like having complete units of the same appearance/design.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Lizardmen refresh just goes from strength to strength.

Let's hope they nail the new Kroxigor minis.

They'll have the McDonalds crew that did the Minotaurs handle them. After all if they can design big models they should be able to do big lizard dudes.

tneva82 wrote:
Obr and soulblight battletomes dissapeared from the shop. While not conclusive does suggest them being spring death tomes.

Hopefully fec at least gets something more than just a hero then.

Given their popularity I suspect they will. Even at the least a new varghulf would be far more substantial than some rando on foot.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Dysartes wrote:
Am I right in thinking all the Seraphon reveals for this wave have been resculpts from Finecast (or older plastic kits), but we have yet to see any new unit choices?

Mostly resculpts, and I suspect they'll sell better than any new units would. Quality resculpts of classic units have been very popular in my experience. I think the 'forgotten factor' is people get hyped for some cool new unit, then unhyped when they look at 10-20+ year old sculpts for core troops.

At any rate, there is one new unit of Skink cavalry, though as others have mentioned it is a spiritual successor to units which existed in the past. Technically split into two units but they look to be the standard division of weapon options rather than distinct.

Saurus knights also sold out online. Maybe sign of plastic version coming, maybe store bugging again. We'll see.

(could also be sign of reboxing)

Slaanesh and Khorne on preorder next week...


https://www.warhammer-community.com/2023/03/12/sunday-preview-khorne-and-slaanesh-unleash-an-excess-of-idiosyncratic-violence-upon-the-mortal-realms/


As it is often the case,
Japanese users get screwed on the release schedule for unknown reason...

Khorne and Slaanesh really needed this update, so I'm glad to see it.

I'll be much more excited to see new Kroxigor and Cold One Riders. Doubt we'll see it tomorrow as they've been going by every-other-week but who knows!

If not tomorrow, then I'm sure we'll see the rest of the Lizardman line at Adepticon.

I just hope Skarbrand still makes opponent go "do I want to risk attacking him if I can't kill it?" feature that is so hilarious

Albeit exact feature can change but I want to see my opponent go pale when he tries but fails to kill him. (I literally won game that I was about to lose solidly when opponent charged into skarbrand with zombie dragon, failed to kill and Skarbrand became so angry that he basically ran through half the enemy army single handedly. One of the craziest in game reversals I have done. I was totally busted before that)

Preview for the Khorne book is up:

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2023/03/13/rip-open-reality-and-bestow-brutish-blessings-upon-your-followers-in-battletome-blades-of-khorne

'Make a murder roll' is somehow just deeply funny to me

You'd think a "murder roll" would be a type of bread bun, really, that the Blades of Khorne have for lunch.

Worried blood tithe loses some of more tactical usages(move, charge etc) if it goes to end of game bonuses. Just variations of "hit harder" would be boring and losing above tricks would leave huge gap to fill

Warhammer Community preview article for the Slaanesh battletome:

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2023/03/14/use-guaranteed-sixes-to-tempt-your-foes-with-battletome-hedonites-of-slaanesh/

 Geifer wrote:
Warhammer Community preview article for the Slaanesh battletome:

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2023/03/14/use-guaranteed-sixes-to-tempt-your-foes-with-battletome-hedonites-of-slaanesh/

I hope that they do the Administratum as a faction one time and give them Bookkeeping dice as a feature...

Not to say anything against these Temptation dice, they're far from the worst offender, but they seem so convoluted. You can give an enemy a six or he takes D3 mortal wounds, and if she takes the 6 you get D6 of yet another type of point, and these unlock abilities or can be spend on summoning. Just rolls and dice and points and yet more rolls, and barely any of it goes anywhere.

Unless depravity scale changes dramatically up to 6d6 deprarity is huge. Almost 2tt kos level huge

Edit yea changes

tneva82 wrote:
Unless depravity scale changes dramatically up to 6d6 deprarity is huge. Almost 2tt kos level huge

Edit yea changes

yeah, there's big changes to the system. You get some mediocre benefits from leveling up your depravity points but then also must spend those points to summon things, thereby losing out on the bonuses.

There's also mind-games and a bit of counter-play. You're not going to give a bloodthirster a free 6 to hit or wound when it could mean 3+ damage coming your way and wiping out a unit. On the flip side, a squad of skeletons doesn't give a crap about d3 mortal wounds, so they'll take it just to deny you the depravity points.

-1 to hit army wide is big. Even at worst that's 20% decrease in enemy output. Add ward forcing opponent to make 50% more damage and it makes slaanesh surprisingly durable. And mw's in addition on to hit is pretty good generally.

Effects are good. Question is does slaanesh get them fast enough to make impact.

tneva82 wrote:
-1 to hit army wide is big. Even at worst that's 20% decrease in enemy output. Add ward forcing opponent to make 50% more damage and it makes slaanesh surprisingly durable. And mw's in addition on to hit is pretty good generally.

Effects are good. Question is does slaanesh get them fast enough to make impact.

I'd say "probably yes." You get points for dealing damage in melee, which Slaanesh is pretty darn good at. Yeeting Sigvald at something will net around 10 depravity points on average, for instance.

My problem with depravity has always been how swingy it can be. I recall the first incarnation where you only got it when leaders caused wounds (not kills). Fight a Skaven army with mostly 1 wound models and you'd get nothing like as much when you fight a Stormcast or other multiwound army.

It's long been my issue with how GW has handled it as a mechanic. Even on paper its very swingy. Plus its one of those snowball mechanics - the more you kill (ergo the better you are doing) the more points you get to do even better etc....

I like the idea of summoning, but sometimes I really do feel like the best way to balance it is either everyone gets it or you just build an army as normal and summoning is simply a delayed deployment option.

Laughing Man wrote:

tneva82 wrote:
-1 to hit army wide is big. Even at worst that's 20% decrease in enemy output. Add ward forcing opponent to make 50% more damage and it makes slaanesh surprisingly durable. And mw's in addition on to hit is pretty good generally.

Effects are good. Question is does slaanesh get them fast enough to make impact.

I'd say "probably yes." You get points for dealing damage in melee, which Slaanesh is pretty darn good at. Yeeting Sigvald at something will net around 10 depravity points on average, for instance.

Well 1 unit causes. So sigvald needs 4 charges to haul to 36 on his own.

tneva82 wrote:

Laughing Man wrote:

tneva82 wrote:
-1 to hit army wide is big. Even at worst that's 20% decrease in enemy output. Add ward forcing opponent to make 50% more damage and it makes slaanesh surprisingly durable. And mw's in addition on to hit is pretty good generally.

Effects are good. Question is does slaanesh get them fast enough to make impact.

I'd say "probably yes." You get points for dealing damage in melee, which Slaanesh is pretty darn good at. Yeeting Sigvald at something will net around 10 depravity points on average, for instance.

Well 1 unit causes. So sigvald needs 4 charges to haul to 36 on his own.

Sure, but between that, temptation dice, and other sources (Pretenders have a spell to gain up to 6 depravity) it should be pretty easy to get to that point by the top of 3.

New meta-watch:

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2023/03/16/warhammer-age-of-sigmar-metawatch-galletian-champions-establish-themselves-in-the-meta/

Also apparently a new roadmap next week. Not entirely sure what's left to roadmap at this point.

Khorne and Slaanesh preorders this Saturday.
That leaves the 2 Death books to be seen, plus whatever else comes this summer.

 Inquisitor Gideon wrote:
New meta-watch:

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2023/03/16/warhammer-age-of-sigmar-metawatch-galletian-champions-establish-themselves-in-the-meta/

Also apparently a new roadmap next week. Not entirely sure what's left to roadmap at this point.

When cos and fec comes out. Last 2 books without idea when they are coming. Then it's redo's or completeiy new factions.


Wijh bad luck it just confirms next 2 tomes as obr and sbgl.

 Inquisitor Gideon wrote:
New meta-watch:

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2023/03/16/warhammer-age-of-sigmar-metawatch-galletian-champions-establish-themselves-in-the-meta/

Also apparently a new roadmap next week. Not entirely sure what's left to roadmap at this point.

And for what seems like 2 years Kruleboyz continue in the low red zone.

The latest update has really hit Orruks hard, but without a complete overhaul or further across the board drop in points by 10% there is no helping Kruleboyz.

Warhammer twitter teaser for Adepticon: https://twitter.com/warhammer/status/1638148700630310912



Cities of Sigmar, right?

With that font? Surely the big reveal is a Diablo IV crossover

Well, looks like Dawnbringers are finally stepping out from behind the curtain.

Lets hope for dawnbringers already!
And lets hope they are bigger than the guy held by the mega gargant

It'll probably be for Underworlds.

 Fayric wrote:
Lets hope for dawnbringers already!
And lets hope they are bigger than the guy held by the mega gargant

For what it's worth, 40k rumour-dude Valrak got passed a bunch of Adepticon infos and said that Cities of Sigmar will get a 'box reveal', so it's probably an Underworlds box as a sort of teaser

Or launch box with rest later. Like sob or votann.

It’s got it’s own thread, but since the units can be used in AOS, there’s been some warcry leaks. FEC vs SCE and then a mini set that recycled some old underworld teams

So obr&soulblight revealed, seraphon got new knights and krox but not temple guard, cos got 1st unit previewed and revealed to be fall. And 2 mystery books starting from summer. Proxy art not battletome but oddly early for pre-new edition book series.

So dem Seraphon eh? New Saurus cav and Kroxigors look every bit as awesome as I'd hoped. Massive refresh to the army range, I imagine it will be hugely popular given the already existing hype for big dinos. While not a Seraphon player myself I am very happy for my friends who are, and happy for AoS in general to see such a beautiful (and complete) refresh of the line.

On the other hand, OBR really need new units, fingers crossed that a new hero isn't all they're getting. Though not expecting it at this point. Re-release of Mortek Guard with a bow option at LEAST! The new SGL character looks fantastic but did she have to be Vyrkos AND named? Vyrkos have five named characters and zero unnamed ones as it stands...

Hard to stay mad about anything with how fantastic all the new models look. Seriously that is some really nice gak and man am I glad it'll be in plastic rather than resin.

Loved everything that was shown. I do have to wonder, is that it for the Seraphon now? So no re-done Temple Guard, cut Razordon and so on?

Also, one of the books is obviously FEC, but what the hell is the other one?

 Inquisitor Gideon wrote:
but what the hell is the other one?

I’d like it to be a glow-up for the underwhelming Orruk Warclans Battletome.

Most likely, a new Daughters of Khaine book! (Sarcasm)

Also, the new Cities of Sigmar mini’s previewed were kind of divisive on the two youtube channels that I watched. I like them for the possibilities that they represent, but I think they should have led with something a touch more epic, like a character or warmachine of some sort.

Shouldn't it be the Flesheaster Courts? Theirs is still a 2nd edition book, isn't it?

 Scottywan82 wrote:
Shouldn't it be the Flesheaster Courts? Theirs is still a 2nd edition book, isn't it?

One of the unrevealed ones is but there is two of them

 nels1031 wrote:

 Inquisitor Gideon wrote:
but what the hell is the other one?

I’d like it to be a glow-up for the underwhelming Orruk Warclans Battletome.

Most likely, a new Daughters of Khaine book! (Sarcasm)

Also, the new Cities of Sigmar mini’s previewed were kind of divisive on the two youtube channels that I watched. I like them for the possibilities that they represent, but I think they should have led with something a touch more epic, like a character or warmachine of some sort.

Divisive seems about right from what I've seen. For my taste they're... fine? Like, the helmets and ornamentation mean they don't quite scratch that 'gritty' Old World feel but then they're also really basic and down to earth compared to the bulk of the AoS range. The result is just a bit of a bland schmoz. Would like to see them with a different paintjob (and different helmets...). There's certainly potential, if nothing else.

Division seems to come from people expecting the empire and shock horror, it's not actually the empire.

 Inquisitor Gideon wrote:
Division seems to come from people expecting the empire and shock horror, it's not actually the empire.

I could easily see people using these an empire army and most people not caring.

The bibs, pots and belts rather than pants are just a little funny looking, and the models are overall a little busy for basic troops.



---
Overall I'm very, very pleased with the lizards (plastic Krox, with good saurus cav as a bonus!), sad for Ossiarch players (vampires have a lot and got a lot last time, so they're fine) and indifferent to the Cities rework. It just isn't much of anything.

Voss wrote:

 Inquisitor Gideon wrote:
Division seems to come from people expecting the empire and shock horror, it's not actually the empire.

I could easily see people using these an empire army and most people not caring.

The bibs, pots and belts rather than pants are just a little funny looking, and the models are overall a little busy for basic troops.

The rule of thumb for GW previews should always be 'wait until you have seen them in another paintjob' - these are busy models, but not unnaturally so - a paintjob that does not emphasize that but melds the layers more naturally might do wonders.

So...the Seraphon.

Derposaurs everywhere. The "Aggradons" have terrible heads, which is a pity as their Saurus riders (and the white Jem Ha'Dar character) are all awesome.

All the new Kroxigors are a solid win. Going to need to get several units of them.

I will probably get one of the Army sets, as I have yet to get the new Starmaster...but I still feel that Lost Kingdom's Ometotl is a superior design for a Slaan.

Just noticed the two breeds of Kroxigor have different Bonces.

That’s quite nice.

Tsagualsa wrote:

Voss wrote:

 Inquisitor Gideon wrote:
Division seems to come from people expecting the empire and shock horror, it's not actually the empire.

I could easily see people using these an empire army and most people not caring.

The bibs, pots and belts rather than pants are just a little funny looking, and the models are overall a little busy for basic troops.

The rule of thumb for GW previews should always be 'wait until you have seen them in another paintjob' - these are busy models, but not unnaturally so - a paintjob that does not emphasize that but melds the layers more naturally might do wonders.

It isn't the paint (though, they sell models primarily through photographs. If the pics don't sell the models, they really need to do a better job at that).
Its the sheer number and types of surfaces on each model, and how often they bump into each other. Chain, plate, leather, more chain, face squeezed in a hood and high collar (like a pimple) with a pot on top, cloth bib over the upper chest armor types, etc.

The fething shields are a flat surface AND rough wood AND lots of metal filigree AND rims AND studs AND dents. At the very least they could have toned down the filigree and picked either rough or flat. All three is a bit excessive and just busy.

Voss wrote:

Tsagualsa wrote:

Voss wrote:

 Inquisitor Gideon wrote:
Division seems to come from people expecting the empire and shock horror, it's not actually the empire.

I could easily see people using these an empire army and most people not caring.

The bibs, pots and belts rather than pants are just a little funny looking, and the models are overall a little busy for basic troops.

The rule of thumb for GW previews should always be 'wait until you have seen them in another paintjob' - these are busy models, but not unnaturally so - a paintjob that does not emphasize that but melds the layers more naturally might do wonders.

It isn't the paint (though, they sell models primarily through photographs. If the pics don't sell the models, they really need to do a better job at that).
Its the sheer number and types of surfaces on each model, and how often they bump into each other. Chain, plate, leather, more chain, face squeezed in a hood and high collar (like a pimple) with a pot on top, cloth bib over the upper chest armor types, etc.

The fething shields are a flat surface AND rough wood AND lots of metal filigree AND rims AND studs AND dents. At the very least they could have toned down the filigree and picked either rough or flat. All three is a bit excessive and just busy.

I still think it would look much better if they did the bib in either the color of the shield background or the leather stuff, and picked one metal colour less for the details on e.g. the bib or the shield. Or dropped either the red or the orange completely. And removed the additional cream background for the emblem on the shield.

All of what you said is true, too - they're equipped in a realistic way, but that sort of realism is not 'typically warhammer', and so they stick out in a bad fashion.

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
Just noticed the two breeds of Kroxigor have different Bonces.

That’s quite nice.

The Crocodillian ones win hands down for me.

Previously I was a Southlands Lizardmen player, but after seeing the new knights and no new Skinks, I’m sorely tempted to go for an all cav list…

I hope the Krox kit is as customizable as the Rockgut Troggoths kit. Looks like it is, but the longer heads of the Krox could be a problem.

The croc heads are clearly the winners there.

One thing: They talked up Dawnbringer Crusades, and now the book is Cities of Sigmar.

I thought the new army book would be "Dawnbringer Crusades". Did they change the name, or was it always going to be Cities of Sigmar?

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
The croc heads are clearly the winners there.

One thing: They talked up Dawnbringer Crusades, and now the book is Cities of Sigmar.

I thought the new army book would be "Dawnbringer Crusades". Did they change the name, or was it always going to be Cities of Sigmar?

As i read it, Dawnbringer Crusades are a specific sub-group of the Cities of Sigmar, or has that changed too?

I’m not 100% sure. But background wise the Dawnbringer Crusades are drawn from the Cities of Sigmar.

So when on campaign and not just defending their walls, they’re Dawnbringer is my guess?

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
One thing: They talked up Dawnbringer Crusades, and now the book is Cities of Sigmar.

I thought the new army book would be "Dawnbringer Crusades". Did they change the name, or was it always going to be Cities of Sigmar?

Yeah, I was surprised to see the Cities of Sigmar book title as well.

I guess the Dawnbringer Crusade will be an additional subfaction for the cities?

Kind of happy that they aren't discarding the Cities of Sigmar title, personally.

My guess : You select your city as normal, then in the Path to Glory section you'll be able to launch a Dawnbringer Crusade and that's where the narrative focus will take over.

 nels1031 wrote:

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
One thing: They talked up Dawnbringer Crusades, and now the book is Cities of Sigmar.

I thought the new army book would be "Dawnbringer Crusades". Did they change the name, or was it always going to be Cities of Sigmar?

Yeah, I was surprised to see the Cities of Sigmar book title as well.

I guess the Dawnbringer Crusade will be an additional subfaction for the cities?

Kind of happy that they aren't discarding the Cities of Sigmar title, personally.

It may be as simple as wanting to avoid having the word 'Crusade' displayed prominently on a book cover.

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
So when on campaign and not just defending their walls, they’re Dawnbringer is my guess?

Dawnbringer Crusades are specific groups drawn from the citizenry of a city(who are given a single coin and forgiven of any crimes and/or sins they may have committed) sent out into the wilderness to found an entirely new City of Sigmar using magic floating islands of supplies. The vast majority of them fail.

The dawnbringer crusades describe what the people do not who they are. It’s just like the Indomitus Crusade in 40k except it’s lots of small independent expeditions rather than one massive one. Each crusade is launched from a particular city and the army will be made up of citizens of that city.

Still hoping for some more exotic stuff for Cities of Sigmar, but the basic troopers are looking pretty good.

New vampire lady is rather nifty too!

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
The croc heads are clearly the winners there.

One thing: They talked up Dawnbringer Crusades, and now the book is Cities of Sigmar.

I thought the new army book would be "Dawnbringer Crusades". Did they change the name, or was it always going to be Cities of Sigmar?

Its been shifting over the course of the periodic previews. It started as 'dawnbringer crusades,' then they started using both terms interchangeably, and then sort of settled on CoS.

The september article tied it more to CoS
https://www.warhammer-community.com/2022/09/16/dawnbringer-previews-your-first-look-at-the-arsenal-of-the-cities-of-sigmar/

where the original stuff suggested the cities were simply the departure point for the crusades to go found new cities.
https://www.warhammer-community.com/2021/06/09/fancy-a-new-life-bringing-order-to-the-mortal-realms-join-a-dawnbringer-crusade-today/

So if a change happened it was between June of 2021 and September of 2022

Calling the new book "Dawnbringer Crusades" was an assumption made by the community based on a rumor from several years ago, afaik GW never referred to the tome by that name. Also figure that the 10+ established Cities of Sigmar need a way to field armies!

My guess is it will be a subdivision of allegiance abilities, like how Seraphon have Starborne-Coalesced.

A good day for AoS.

I like the new Soulblight hero, and looking forward to picking up their warscrolls pack a little later on...

New terrain?



https://www.warhammer-community.com/2023/03/23/new-ossiarch-bonereapers-and-soulblight-gravelords-heroes-rise-from-their-graves

Nah, it's made by the studio. It was in the original reveal trailers for OBR.

 Scottywan82 wrote:
Shouldn't it be the Flesheaster Courts? Theirs is still a 2nd edition book, isn't it?

The temporal cover isn't what they have been using for battle tomes and there's 2 when there's 1 left. Unless GW decided to change proxy cover just for fun of it and there's another brand new army revealed it isn't battle tomes.

Yep and it was popular and theorised it might be faction terrain back then too. It's in one of those things that one day if GW were to do castles/forts for factions, I'd really expect something very similar to make an appearance.

And it would be cool to get some terrain like that for siege/raiding games and also to have some "its not a ruin" terrain for the setting!

Tsagualsa wrote:
New terrain?

Are you talking about the big skull and the walls? Unfortunately, no.

Its a one-off build for the OBR displays. From what I remember, Warcomm’s twitter or someone in the studio had to come out and say it was built from scratch.

 nels1031 wrote:

Tsagualsa wrote:
New terrain?

Are you talking about the big skull and the walls? Unfortunately, no.

Its a one-off build for the OBR displays. From what I remember, Warcomm’s twitter or someone in the studio had to come out and say it was built from scratch.

Okay, sorry for kicking up a fuzz Did not see it before, and it looks very well made.

Tsagualsa wrote:

Okay, sorry for kicking up a fuzz

No one had responded when I started typing and then when I post I had been ninja'd by 3 folks I did take my sweet time though.

Tsagualsa wrote:
Did not see it before, and it looks very well made.

Yeah, its all pretty awesome stuff. Really wish it had been terrain that could be sold. I'd have bought an undead army of some sort just to go with the crazy amount of terrain I'd get.

A. Seraphon won this set of reveals for me, once again.

Yeah, yeah, Lion, 10th ed, blah blah, it all just melts into '6 more months of space marines' to me. Tyranids are cool though.

B. Dawnbringer Crusades are likely to be similar to how the Stormcast Eternals have two ways to build the army: the deep strikey kind, or the defend-the-line kind. The latter get to ally with CoS stuff.

So in this case, Dawnbringer Crusades will be the guys that head out to claim new land and the other kind will be the dudes defending the cities that already exist.

C. Seraphon, holy crap are they awesome. I'm sure that in 4th edition they'll get a basic foot hero as a filler, but then the NEXT update I'd expect new skink troops. If GW can update termagants, they can update the skinks.

The new Lizardmen have me torn. I’ve always been a Southlands guy, the old Oops All Skinks subfaction. It saddens me a little to see so little new stuff for them, while those new Saurus cav look Amazing. Do I stubbornly stick to my ways, or cave and go all cav? I wonder if they’ll have an option to make the cav Battleline…

drbored wrote:

B. Dawnbringer Crusades are likely to be similar to how the Stormcast Eternals have two ways to build the army: the deep strikey kind, or the defend-the-line kind. The latter get to ally with CoS stuff. .

The book is called Cities of Sigmar. Is there army that allies with itself?

tneva82 wrote:

drbored wrote:

B. Dawnbringer Crusades are likely to be similar to how the Stormcast Eternals have two ways to build the army: the deep strikey kind, or the defend-the-line kind. The latter get to ally with CoS stuff. .

The book is called Cities of Sigmar. Is there army that allies with itself?

I think you missed my point.

Book Title: Stormcast Eternals

Allegiance Abilities - Battle Traits:
1. Scions of the Storm - bunch of deep strike stuff
2. Stormkeep - ally with CoS and stuff

Now apply that to Cities of Sigmar:

Book Title: Cities of Sigmar

Allegiance Abilities - Battle Traits:
1. Dawnbringer Crusades - reclaim land, march out to war
2. City Defenders - hold the walls, defend the civilians


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 AduroT wrote:
The new Lizardmen have me torn. I’ve always been a Southlands guy, the old Oops All Skinks subfaction. It saddens me a little to see so little new stuff for them, while those new Saurus cav look Amazing. Do I stubbornly stick to my ways, or cave and go all cav? I wonder if they’ll have an option to make the cav Battleline…

The skinks are in an interesting spot.
On the one hand, Terradons, Ripperdactyls, and the Bastilodon are all really good sculpts. The Stegadon is showing its age. The Skinks are definitely suffering.

On the other hand, we have 2 builds for the new Raptadons, new Skink Starseer, and the recently released Chameleon Skinks.

So there's definitely ways to have plenty of modern skinks in your army, the main thing is the base skink unit. Much like the Dryads for Sylvaneth, it's the one thing that'll hold the faction back for a while longer.

And like Dryads, they’re not a Bad kit, still perfectly serviceable, just not as modern and cool as the newer stuff.

drbored wrote:

tneva82 wrote:

drbored wrote:

B. Dawnbringer Crusades are likely to be similar to how the Stormcast Eternals have two ways to build the army: the deep strikey kind, or the defend-the-line kind. The latter get to ally with CoS stuff. .

The book is called Cities of Sigmar. Is there army that allies with itself?

I think you missed my point.

Book Title: Stormcast Eternals

Allegiance Abilities - Battle Traits:
1. Scions of the Storm - bunch of deep strike stuff
2. Stormkeep - ally with CoS and stuff

Now apply that to Cities of Sigmar:

Book Title: Cities of Sigmar

Allegiance Abilities - Battle Traits:
1. Dawnbringer Crusades - reclaim land, march out to war
2. City Defenders - hold the walls, defend the civilians

Yes that's possible.

There's still no allying cos. Allying is very specific feature. Again: what other book gives negative features? The ally cos wouldn't get for example cos enchantments...no cos spell for cos unit? Don' be silly.

Looks like someone finished building those domicile shells. Picture via TGA from the Khorne book - now it might just be a non-release internal kit but it looks very modular - hopefully full cities will be a thing soon.

I think you're right, those look like stairs under skarbrands wing. I hope so, i'd love a full building kit in the style of the Osgilliath mansion.

So, a minor thing.

But Whitefang has been sure to clarify that Thunderstrike armor is just a new armor mark. The implication of a line of posts is that we may eventually see things like Liberators, Judicators, and other 1st edition Stormcast remade into the Thunderstrike armor...

drbored wrote:
So, a minor thing.

But Whitefang has been sure to clarify that Thunderstrike armor is just a new armor mark. The implication of a line of posts is that we may eventually see things like Liberators, Judicators, and other 1st edition Stormcast remade into the Thunderstrike armor...

Judicators in Thunderstrike would be pretty baller

 Inquisitor Gideon wrote:
I think you're right, those look like stairs under skarbrands wing. I hope so, i'd love a full building kit in the style of the Osgilliath mansion.

2 sets, one under each wing actually. One perpendicular to the walls, one parallel to them.

It would make sense to release new city terrain around the time of new city units.

Death's up, including the mounted wight king out on his own:

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2023/04/02/sunday-preview-death-conquers-the-mortal-realms/?utm_source=facebook&utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=sunday-preview&utm_content=sundaypreview02042023&fbclid=IwAR1YgLzC9JtM94Y8NqqgB58ntVHyLfpZuh5_lOMAl-vN4PY1xU35eP9ORmI

And is it just me, or are those Vanguard boxes very good?

Bit of a shame the Vargheists are in the Vangaurd boxed set for Vampires. If just because that means that there's likely no update for them on the horizon.
Still kinda holding out hope that Flesheaters get an update and some of their core stuff gets a new version. I'd love to see GW do a new zombiedragon. I'd even accept if the Zombiedragon and Terrorgast were split into separate kits to really focus on the different themes and designs.

That said the Grave Guard no longer being in the starter frees them up and arguably they are the worst looking Vampire models left now. Or at least if not bad looking they are out of date, esp when compared to the regular Deathrattles.


Also for some reason GW UK still shows the Cairn Wraith in the army page


Also are those dragons on the Soulblight dice? Kinda like those dice

The Ossiarch Vanguard is very tempting.

Nice to see that Wight finally get a separate release, wanted one for a while.

Prices

 Overread wrote:
Bit of a shame the Vargheists are in the Vangaurd boxed set for Vampires. If just because that means that there's likely no update for them on the horizon.
Still kinda holding out hope that Flesheaters get an update and some of their core stuff gets a new version. I'd love to see GW do a new zombiedragon. I'd even accept if the Zombiedragon and Terrorgast were split into separate kits to really focus on the different themes and designs.

That said the Grave Guard no longer being in the starter frees them up and arguably they are the worst looking Vampire models left now. Or at least if not bad looking they are out of date, esp when compared to the regular Deathrattles.


Also for some reason GW UK still shows the Cairn Wraith in the army page


Also are those dragons on the Soulblight dice? Kinda like those dice

There have been rumours from HonestWargamer of a FULL Flesh Eater Court remake...

Odds which decrease as 1 key kit(flayer/horror) is uniikely to be updated. Or gw alters vanquard later to have new kit? Replace vanquard in few months? Have options on kit left unused?

Umbros wrote:

 Overread wrote:
Bit of a shame the Vargheists are in the Vangaurd boxed set for Vampires. If just because that means that there's likely no update for them on the horizon.
Still kinda holding out hope that Flesheaters get an update and some of their core stuff gets a new version. I'd love to see GW do a new zombiedragon. I'd even accept if the Zombiedragon and Terrorgast were split into separate kits to really focus on the different themes and designs.

That said the Grave Guard no longer being in the starter frees them up and arguably they are the worst looking Vampire models left now. Or at least if not bad looking they are out of date, esp when compared to the regular Deathrattles.


Also for some reason GW UK still shows the Cairn Wraith in the army page


Also are those dragons on the Soulblight dice? Kinda like those dice

There have been rumours from HonestWargamer of a FULL Flesh Eater Court remake...

I could see it, but again Beasts and Skaven need it far more right now.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 DaveC wrote:
Prices

It always amuses me when the big old mounted hero is only £2.50 more expensive than the infantry sized character.

 Inquisitor Gideon wrote:

Umbros wrote:

 Overread wrote:
Bit of a shame the Vargheists are in the Vangaurd boxed set for Vampires. If just because that means that there's likely no update for them on the horizon.
Still kinda holding out hope that Flesheaters get an update and some of their core stuff gets a new version. I'd love to see GW do a new zombiedragon. I'd even accept if the Zombiedragon and Terrorgast were split into separate kits to really focus on the different themes and designs.

That said the Grave Guard no longer being in the starter frees them up and arguably they are the worst looking Vampire models left now. Or at least if not bad looking they are out of date, esp when compared to the regular Deathrattles.


Also for some reason GW UK still shows the Cairn Wraith in the army page


Also are those dragons on the Soulblight dice? Kinda like those dice

There have been rumours from HonestWargamer of a FULL Flesh Eater Court remake...

I could see it, but again Beasts and Skaven need it far more right now.

Actually whilst Skaven and Beasts both need a range refresh, they at least have much larger and more diverse model ranges. Flesheaters are literally all in one getting started boxed set plus one finecast model and one plastic leader (and one exclusive limited sale leader). Right now I'd say Flesheaters are the worst army for having had support in AoS and the most dire in need of an update. Even Fyreslayers have had more models added and a wider range.

Flesheaters would also fit well with how GW has focused a lot on Death as a faction.
Ossiarchs and Nighthaunt are all new (or majority so); meanwhile Soulblight has had almost an entire line update with the major part of their core having been updated.

Plus a few things, like the Terrorgast and Zombie dragon builds would upgrade both FE and Soulblight with updated models.

Heck if GW makes a Vanguard boxed set for FE it really would contain the entire army minus the 1 finecast model and their endless spells/terrain.

 Overread wrote:
Bit of a shame the Vargheists are in the Vangaurd boxed set for Vampires. If just because that means that there's likely no update for them on the horizon.

I doubt we’ll get an update on vargheists for a long time. Despite coming out at the end of warhammer fantasy, I still consider them fairly new models and too integral with FEC to get remade without a whole wave of new models. Which is a shame because I think more dynamic models would be great, since these were designed to fit side by side on square bases. Plus, more bat like heads (like in total war) would do wonders for them

Honestly Flesheaters need a range update - they are perhaps the worst off of all the AoS armies to date in terms of model diversity. Even Fyreslayers have it better than them (though there isn't much to it).




Also was grabbing one of the last Start Collecting sets for Soulblight off Wayland games a smart move? I dunno but at least I'll get a mounted king and Black Knights and some (basically) free old-school Grave Guard .
Honestly I was tempted to grab two sets, but held off.

 Overread wrote:
Also was grabbing one of the last Start Collecting sets for Soulblight off Wayland games a smart move? I dunno but at least I'll get a mounted king and Black Knights and some (basically) free old-school Grave Guard .
Honestly I was tempted to grab two sets, but held off.

Maybe? It's a good value for your money, but without seeing the new book god only knows if it'll be any good.

 Overread wrote:
Also was grabbing one of the last Start Collecting sets for Soulblight off Wayland games a smart move? I dunno but at least I'll get a mounted king and Black Knights and some (basically) free old-school Grave Guard .
Honestly I was tempted to grab two sets, but held off.

Well it saves money for sure. Gloomspite gits was the meh one as your only saving is loonboss. But soulblight saves money and goes away so in long run you save money if you were going to add those models anyway.

In terms of rules? New book soon so who knows. Whatabout AOS4? That's out next year. Maybe these models are bad in AOS3 tome but rocks in AOS4 tome? No idea.

If you buy based on rules you are always gambling. They might be OP as hell in AOS3 book and get nerfed month later to death...No way to tell.

So it comes down to do you want to save cash now by buying them

 Overread wrote:


Also was grabbing one of the last Start Collecting sets for Soulblight off Wayland games a smart move? I dunno but at least I'll get a mounted king and Black Knights and some (basically) free old-school Grave Guard .
Honestly I was tempted to grab two sets, but held off.

Judging by how expensive OOP start collecting sets can become, even if they don't contains exclusive models, I don't think you'll regret picking it up

Cursed City scenario https://www.warhammer-community.com/2023/04/04/cursed-city-scenario-take-on-all-of-ulfenkarn-with-one-immeasurably-mighty-hero/

Hmmm, with that nice little download showing a little bit of support, hopefully a Cursed City stat sheet and scenario for the new hero will appear in a WD soon!

That's cute, i'll have to give it a try. Also rather liking the new Soulblight character being a monster debuffer. She'll be an interesting one to experiment with.

I just hope we get more werewolf vampires and perhaps even some full on werewolves!

 Overread wrote:
perhaps even some full on werewolves!

https://ageofsigmar.lexicanum.com/wiki/Skin_Wolf

Yeah but for Death not chaos - and actually being sold (cause there aren't any AoS/Old World FW models left :()

 Inquisitor Gideon wrote:
That's cute, i'll have to give it a try. Also rather liking the new Soulblight character being a monster debuffer. She'll be an interesting one to experiment with.

Irrritating how she totally stops stuff too hard. Gargants going to find her silly tough to remove(not as bad as gotrek at least. Gotrek solmes 2k gargants even before they got nerfed vs gotrek>

Yeah that's going to be tricky to overcome. Of course sometimes models, esp Gotrek because he's slow and high priced in points, are best ignored and not removed. You just skirt around them or stall them rather than go for the kill.

If she secures an objective on her own with a few units against Gargants then she's done her work for the player taking her and the Gargant player has put their entire army elsewhere on the table. So pushing things away like that can work for you and against you

I'm a bit frustrated that it is ANOTHER named character for Vyrkos--they have eight already, more options in named heroes than some entire factions have for any sort of hero. But I love the model and those rules seem very interesting.

Heck she could have just been another Cursed City model. Blackstone got multiple expansions over time and CC was a total mess of releases. So you could well see that she might originally have been part of another expansion. Heck perhaps the free campaign GW has also released was also once going to be a paid one for CC

I was worried at first, till I realised as a named character I can just drop her with ranged fire before she can reach my big flying monsters as an on foot hero.

Does have some real strength in Ogres though.

 Overread wrote:
Yeah but for Death not chaos - and actually being sold (cause there aren't any AoS/Old World FW models left :()

But werewoofs aren't dead? They have no business being in Death. You might expect them in Vampire Counts because that has a more traditional foundation in classic horror, but in AoS there's no good reason to have (live) werewoofs in Death.

Maybe a compromise? Bring back Chaos Undead and all of a sudden you have both in the same Grand Alliance.

 Overread wrote:
Heck she could have just been another Cursed City model. Blackstone got multiple expansions over time and CC was a total mess of releases. So you could well see that she might originally have been part of another expansion. Heck perhaps the free campaign GW has also released was also once going to be a paid one for CC

It's a bit of a shame that we'll likely never know if vampires with unshaved legs are just a fetish of one of the sculptors like how we're overflowing with Death Guard characters, or if Cursed City actually was supposed to be that big thing with plenty of expansions and tie-ins before disaster struck. Both options are plausible and not even mutually exclusive.

Neither are ghouls. But they've been in linked with death for decades. Everyone associates werewolves with vampires these days.

Pretty well established trope that vampires can control wolves or turn into wolves too.

That's what I mean. Ghouls are in because they were lifted straight from classic horror and got integrated in the Undead army at a time when it didn't bother GW to have units with different basic mechanics in the same army. That mentality fell victim to the streamlining of the Aughts and onward, and no matter how alive Ghouls are in the background, in rules terms they've effectively been dead like anyone else ever since.

GW could do that with werewolves, but from just as early on GW put werestuff with Chaos. Warhammer werewolves are firmly established as Chaos creatures regardless of what popular culture suggests. Shifting them over to Death is like shifting Fimir over to Destruction. Sure, it's theoretically possible, but it would take a company that delights in blowing up a beloved setting to replace it with a ridiculous new setting just because they want to sell shiny golden Chaos Warriors in Space on the Ground but not Chaos. I mean, what are the odds of that?

I don't think anyone would care. It always stuck out more that werewolves were part of chaos anyway. The wolf and vampire association has been well established since Dracula.

Vampires devolving into monstrous bat-humanoids has been a thing since way back in WHFB, I imagine a Vyrkos devolving similarly could definitely end up looking a lot like a werewolf.

It's already happened really. The Askurgan have that monster unit that's a werewolf in all but name and a vampire who's basically a half transformed one.

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2023/04/06/warhammer-age-of-sigmar-metawatch-whats-in-the-new-battlescroll/

New battlescore out. Rally change limits a bit against the 4+ rally things. No more khorne wizard kruleboys got some help, gits got some nerF

tneva82 wrote:
https://www.warhammer-community.com/2023/04/06/warhammer-age-of-sigmar-metawatch-whats-in-the-new-battlescroll/

New battlescore out. Rally change limits a bit against the 4+ rally things. No more khorne wizard kruleboys got some help, gits got some nerF

Appreciate the simplification of Scare Taktikz and an additional dirty trick but I don't think its going to be enough to move the needle for KB either way.

I am happy to see these changes, Arcane Tome just needs a couple more limits for races that can't cast magic (Duardin, Saurus) and it'll be perfect in my eyes. Rally update was incredibly needed and puts a lot of recent releases into context IMO. Good point changes overall, too.

Kruleboyz are going to get a nice boost from this I think, but it leaves their core, fundamental problem of 6s-do-mortals as an army mechanic. Everything else is (and has been) very good for ensuring the icing is excellent, but when the cake underneath is a mess it will always leave the army feeling bad.

Kruelboyz at the bottom again and still unable to lift into the target range.

Then we are told that the kruelboyz and slaves to darkness get targeted buffs and points changes, then no points changes for kruelboyz.

Just drop their points by 10% and be done with it. They have never been good. No adjustments previously have helped. Drastic action is well overdue.