Just ran into this little thing!

Apparently some upcoming 28mm miniature wargame

http://www.thonthegame.com/






Holy crap...

Damn indeed, that suit of armour!

Wow. Some of that concept art alone is beautiful.
Can't wait for a price point and maybe even a scale on these.

Premise seems a bit cliche with the Rough faction vs Tech faction vs Stealth faction.

Amazing find!

I don't think that's armor... It looks like a robot tore off Vin Diesel's head to wear as a hat.

That first guy reminds me of Obi-wan

 BobtheInquisitor wrote:
I don't think that's armor... It looks like a robot tore off Vin Diesel's head to wear as a hat.

That is a robot you do not want to mess with.

Does not look very 28mm scale to me?

The suit would be absolutely bad-ass with some sort of robot-head in place of the human one. Must be some sort of robot body, as there is no way a person could fit inside there.

 Grimtuff wrote:

 BobtheInquisitor wrote:
I don't think that's armor... It looks like a robot tore off Vin Diesel's head to wear as a hat.

That is a robot you do not want to mess with.

[C3P0] I suggest a new strategy...let the robot win; shoes on the other foot furball!

Wow. That is some awesome concept work!

Edit: I just went to the website, and holy gak does this universe look amazing!

The proportions look screwy to me. The Fireborn is passable since it looks like it's already a cyborg, but Obiwan-guy's head is too small for his body.

http://www.beastsofwar.com/thon/thons-fireborn-helmets-battlefield/

http://www.facebook.com/ThonTheGame

So more links for you. Kickstarter in 2013.

It's nice to see miniatures that have more realistic proportions!

Thanks all for the kind words, we are continuing to tune the models. They are based on 28mm, but the Fireborn is a big one, closer to 48mm and based on a 40mm in the picture.

For some reason the Thonians are kinda giving me that Asgardian feel from Thor and the Avengers...mainly the "Obi Wan" guy, but the weapons and that concept art of what appears to be a city, too. I'm watching this with a lot of interest, the minis look amazing so far.

I can see the passion and love being poured into the game. Definitely the next big thing if you have the tenacity and grit to pull it off.

Good luck!

BTW, please succeed cos I need to have it!

:: )

If there are specific backer rewards you would like to see please dont hesitate to msg on FB or post in the forum. We have a pretty awesome lineup planned but it can't hurt to have more input before it gets going.

Looks almost like a very high def 3D printer did those.

Agreed, the pics show some suspicious 3D print-like gradations, but possibly that's just how this outfit design their master models.

The designs do look good.

I think those were prototypes, with master models getting 3D printed at higher resolutions once the kickstarter gets enough money to make masters

It's a good company, a friend of a friend, and some really talented artists behind it.

Ah, I was going to say that they looked a little rough from the printer but if they are going to be refined further I can see myself getting a few of these beauties!

Absolutely spectacular. Can't wait to see more.

And interesting how these guys, with more naturalistic poses, look far more CINEMATIC!! than the "this is what's in my right hand, this is what's in my left hand" poses of a certain other company.

Unfortunately I just imagined that Mr. Big Stompy Suit is seconds away from tripping over a lose floor tile, and I can't unsee it.

I'm loving the concept art, especially the bald woman. I'm looking forward for more!

My new Inquisitor with Daemonhammer checking in...

Interesting art and minis, Ill have to keep an eye on this.

Those are some high quality 3D prints. wow

I think many people missed that the Thon owner posted in this thread.

 Vladsimpaler wrote:
My new Inquisitor with Daemonhammer checking in...

TRU DAT!

O_O

 Absolutionis wrote:
I think many people missed that the Thon owner posted in this thread.

Oh I noticed. I was pleasantly surprised.

I am definately going to watch this and hopefully be able to pitch somehting in for the kickstarter next year.

Well I am totally into it now. Call me a fan, these designs are extremely refreshing.

Thank you for waiting till 2013 so I can jump in on this kick starter because Iam kick started out for 2012. I see this one being successful.

AMEN to that, inqscott

Some new concepts up on both FB and the main site.

 ChiliPowderKeg wrote:
That first guy reminds me of Obi-wan

What makes you say that?!




Edit: Updated Image

Dentry wrote:

 ChiliPowderKeg wrote:
That first guy reminds me of Obi-wan

What makes you say that?!

Better comparison pictures.

Looks kind of like Jor'El to me.

 ChiliPowderKeg wrote:
That first guy reminds me of Obi-wan

First thing I thought too, I was expecting him to be holding a light saber.

Also those hammers are the sex.

 AegisGrimm wrote:
Must be some sort of robot body, as there is no way a person could fit inside there.

Just like Terminators then

They certainly look to be high quality and I particullary like the robot designs.

The big guy might be just the incentive I need to get back to 40k! A squad of those would look the nuts as a bunch of Termies!

looks interesting, i hope that it will be a boxed set

nice looking stuff

Amazing stuff.

That armor, yeah, thats epic.
What a crisis suit SHOULD look like stylistically....

Their Thonian Automated Defense Unit (ADU) looks pretty neat. Though I do admit the legs look a tad long

TheShellCase.co.uk: THON the Game - An Interview

ah, I was coming to post the TSC link as well, beat me to it!

Some new info up.

New Havok model render, still tuning some details.

I'm still eager to see more, but I'm not sure if I like the style or not. There are things I like about both of these bots and things I don't.

Narrative Play - Thonian Core Keepers serve to decontaminate and maintain a Starlight’s Soul Core. They are virtual mechanics and real world medics. In the absence of an Advocate, they can direct Orbital Support, Orbital Drops and Close Support AI Grid Divers.

Dotn know what that entails in the actual game, but art looks neat

Just ran across this on Beast of War.

Thonian Honour Guard:

“Few Thonians excel to the rank of Honor Guard; those trusted and elite warriors that serve as a Commander’s protectors and advisers. They lead armies, spearhead attacks or fight effectively on their own. Honor Guard mark themselves with facial rune-scarring to remember fallen allies.”

Very nice design made even better by the fact its not bikini-armour for once, although personally I would prefer a tad more hair on her head.

eagerly awaiting this ks eventhough I think I be all over the ord forces when they release. I have big plans for them.

The Thonian ADU boasts an upgraded shield suite as well as twin lances and scatterguns. It offers substantial firepower at range.

DRX and Fireborn for scale comparison. DRX and Fireborn are pictured on 28mm bases. The ADU and Fireborn will come with 40mm custom bases.

So DRX the small thing, Fireborn the medium thing, ADU the tall thing

Atera Drop Cannon Model

Ooooohhh!

Magnificent minis!

What I like is a lack of clean edges to some of the tech. It has a very gritty, hard-edged look to it that really appeals to me if not for the game itself, for an RPG setting I have been piecing together.

The ADU, I think, looks to have more then one joint mechanism in the knee. That could explain why it is so tall?

Wonder when they are planning the KS for this?

Fenrir Kitsune wrote:
Wonder when they are planning the KS for this?

Shooting for Mar1 =)
Wrapping up details now.

In time for my birthday? The sly dogs! I really like the look of these minis though, really reminiscent of a videogame "Quake II" that terrified me when I was too young to really comprehend what was going on!

The top guy looks like Arcturus Mensk!

These designs look very detailed and well made to me so far, but I am not feeling a strong consistent stylistic vibe from any of the pieces. I think that may become more clear as more models are released.

More concept art from Beast of War:




Enjoy

New stuff via Beast of War

Security Drone:

“These security drones were the first line of defense against the Ordhren onslaught. When networked together they form a Starlight-wide information and
security grid. Individually they are not much of a threat, but when they counter-attack in unison they can be quite formidable.”

Enjoy

Troops look cool! Guns... well they seem to have forgotten a barrel. The landscape has a very Avatar-type tone to it, me likey.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Oh and the drone is great! Maybe a bit indecisive on whether it should be sleek and rounded or square and bulky though. Once again they seem to fail in the gun dept imo, looks very un-drone like.

Kickstarter's up: http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/178087494/thon

And I'm a backer.

Good to hear!

Thanks for the update!

I will support this also the Ord figures really hit the mark for me.

Ok this looks fantastic, colour me interested!

Great minis, vision, and design! I just backed the project on kickstarter

It looks very neat, although unfortunately the drones don't have quite the sexiness of the suits.

Thon really needs to clarify what the exclusives are, though, it's already generating a lot of questions and they have yet to be shown, yet people need to pledge for levels containing them.

Overall, I will be watching this with a ton of interest!

RiTides - that's what I'm waiting to see too!

Oh gosh darn it I think this weekend is going to be a flood of new KS

What am I going to do!!!!!!!!!!

Wonder what level stretch goals (assuming there are strechties) are going to affect

Also someone should edit the title to note that its a KS now

Edit

I know that they cater to different groups (board game vs wargame), but anyone feel a little sad that this just had to launch the same day Zombicide season 2 launched? People who might want both but can only afford one might have diverted funds to zombiecide

The kickstarter looks good, I think a few more pledge options would be great, but unlike some other recent efforts, I really like that the campaign has already been updated with a "what's in the box" image.



Nice. I always like it when a campaign makes it clear what you are actually getting.

Edit: seriously, check out that Havok...

That graphic is great! But what I think people really need to know is what the exclusives are, as they take up a large amount of the higher pledges, and are completely unknown at this point.

But a graphic for base box contents is indeed appreciated

I feel a bit sad Zombicide 2 started today, not just for Thon, but also for the closing of Godslayer.

With Godslayer over all I can think is "Highborn, Highborn, Highborn!"


Automatically Appended Next Post:
For the exclusives I'm hoping for the vehicles.

But does exclusive mean "Kickstarter exclusive" or just like a hard to get model... one that is rare in the game world, or the like? Like an "elite" model...

I can't imagine vehicles could affordably be made as Kickstarter exclusives, so I'm guessing the latter...

Looking good so far, the two-player starter set seems worth the money in my humble opinion, I'll take the Thonian Alliance give the Ord guys to a friend. Although I would like to see more of these Highborn guys, the female ranger is pretty cool looking.

Highborn Ranger (?): The Highborn faction are going to be a stretch goal.


Don't know if anyone else noticed this:

Multiplayer is called S.CO.M.A. (Self-Contained Mobile Armor) and is the most casual of all. It is a design-your-own free-for-all. Players decide on an experience pool and build a character using those points.
Players battle it out in a player vs. player arena. Players can easily convert their miniatures from hundreds of parts included in the Core Set.

I wonder how many spare conversion parts there will be overall, if it is "hundreds" then that really adds to the value of the stater box.

Aaand, I just backed at the $150 level. We'll see where it goes from here.

Yeah, I did notice that. The spare parts and "exclusives" are something I'm also interested in, especially since at the moment I'm supposed to be getting two of them.

I'm not sure if I'll be able to afford to actually stick with my pledge, I got some big bills coming up a month from now and there's also Warzone which I'm really interested in (but having the same problems I had with another UK-based KS and can't actually get a pledge through), but we'll see I guess. Warzone I'm less worried about anyway since we know that one will hit retail for sure, so if I can't pledge I can still get it later. Anyway, for some reason when I first saw the models for this game it really grabbed me and I couldn't help but pledge immediately when I noticed it went up. I'll admit the drones are kinda "meh" though, and I'm not entirely sure I like the design of the robots on the Thon side either, but on the whole I really like the look of this stuff and I have a feeling there will be some more good things coming later down the road.

Curious. I would need to have some idea of these exclusives before I jump in (so far it is just something I would happily wait to see how the product turns out). I am still not a fan of some of the models/renders. Hopefully they will put a pledge up to just get a single force rather than the whole box set.

The first update is up, asking a question;

1 and 1?
Update #1 · Mar. 02, 2013 · 1 comment

I've seen a number of requests for 1 Core Set and 1 Exclusive. Let me know if you want this and I will add a M.I.T.E. level for 100$

Personally I think that level of pledge would be a good idea, but it depends on what the exclusives actually are.

First Stretch Goal is mentioned on the front page:

MAR 3 - Stretch Goal 1 - **New Model // New Highborn Unit**

It was the Highborn Rangers that first trakked Ordhren Movements away from the Eastern Armada Coreward, towards Thon. Nobody could have predicted what would come next. A Highborn Ranger is a Multipurpose Unit for both the Highborn and the Thonian Alliance. If this stretch goal is reached each Core Set will be upgraded with *2* Highborn Rangers.

Help us reach this goal! Increase your bid by 15$

@kilcin: I'm not sure if that's meant to be an answer to the question of what the Exclusives are going to be, as that is an upgrade to the core box.

Little update, I didn't see this as part of the information before, but the creator clarified in the comments that the models will be "Plastic Injection Molds on sprue, some assembly required."

@buzzsaw Sorry, I didn't mean my post to be in response to your exclusives questions, more of something that I saw changed on the front page from earlier today.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Also he added the plastic injection to the front page as per your suggestion.

Hmm so you add $15 you get 2, and then another 2 will also be added into the core set when 50k is reached?

 kilcin wrote:
@buzzsaw Sorry, I didn't mean my post to be in response to your exclusives questions, more of something that I saw changed on the front page from earlier today.

No problem, just being clear.

It's slightly odd to ask people to increase the pledges arbitrarily when there are going to be additional items (the Exclusives). My feeling is, don't ask for $15 more, offer something cool for $15, you'll probably get people increasing pledges, but also recruit new backers.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 kenshin620 wrote:
Hmm so you add $15 you get 2, and then another 2 will also be added into the core set when 50k is reached?

I don't think that's what he means, I think he means if everyone increased by $15 they could help get there. I think.

Now that I look again, I'm more confused by that. I am honestly not sure what's being said there.

 Buzzsaw wrote:

 kenshin620 wrote:
Hmm so you add $15 you get 2, and then another 2 will also be added into the core set when 50k is reached?

I don't think that's what he means, I think he means if everyone increased by $15 they could help get there. I think.

Thats an....odd request

The wording is a bit odd; the communication over all isn't the best but at least the guy is willing to listen and adjust as needed. Just doesn't feel like some of the communication in regards to what's in the pipeline after the initial offerings was thought out.

 kenshin620 wrote:

 Buzzsaw wrote:

 kenshin620 wrote:
Hmm so you add $15 you get 2, and then another 2 will also be added into the core set when 50k is reached?

I don't think that's what he means, I think he means if everyone increased by $15 they could help get there. I think.

Thats an....odd request

I'm just confused: if $15 adds a pair to your pledge, then at $50k another pair is added to the box? I honestly don't know.

 Buzzsaw wrote:


I'm just confused: if $15 adds a pair to your pledge, then at $50k another pair is added to the box? I honestly don't know.

I asked for clarification in the comments about this.

Kinda depressing, reading the comments...again there are people complaining about lack of "value", and one guy in particular is upset because he wants more pin-up girls like in Kingdom Death, and I guess the bald-headed honor guard and the ranger concept just isn't doing it for him.

Anyway, I'm also confused about the stretch goal, hopefully it'll get cleared up soon.

I think this campaign has the potential to really do some impressive stuff (I was honestly surprised to learn it was going to be hard plastic, that's impressive), but I think he does need to think a tad about the organization of information. For example, there is a $15 pledge level which is basically the "catchall" option for people to buy things ala-carte, as it were. The problem is that, as of right now, there simply aren't a prices listed for things.

The way the pledge levels jump around is kinda odd too. All of the levels with exclusives also contain the hardback (as of now, anyway), which strikes me as odd, since the hardback is completely redundant with the rulebook in the core set.

 Buzzsaw wrote:
since the hardback is completely redundant with the rulebook in the core set.

I think the core set only contains some form of a quick start rulebook (it says pocket rulebook)? Kind or like warhammer. So there might be more fluff and stuff in the hardback

This kickstarter is exactly what Gates of Antares should have been. That's the feeling I get from it.

 kenshin620 wrote:

 Buzzsaw wrote:
since the hardback is completely redundant with the rulebook in the core set.

I think the core set only contains some form of a quick start rulebook (it says pocket rulebook)? Kind or like warhammer. So there might be more fluff and stuff in the hardback

If anything, it will be a difference in fluff, at the bottom of the main page in the FAQ the description is "The Pocket Rule Book is the same as the Hardback, only smaller, pocket-sized."

Honestly, the art is very good in this project so far, but I'm not really sue how much I would value that at. That's one reason I hope the $100 pledge level floated comes in, I'd rather have the option to purchase the hardback then need to do so.

> Will the minis be mono-pose or will the have different poses?
> Can we replace the head of the Havoc, it looks absolutly ridiculous on a machine that is else mighty find?

I've added the new 100$ level.

The Havok head is not final and there will be variants.

The models will be able to be assembled however you like.

I noticed this in the comments:

Creator J.R.Vosovic about 5 hours ago

The 15$ for the Rangers is for extras or if you wanted just the models.

So that kinda clears that up.

BobtheInquisitor wrote:This kickstarter is exactly what Gates of Antares should have been. That's the feeling I get from it.

Yea I get that vibe too

Expect the weird communication

Sidstyler wrote:I noticed this in the comments:

Creator J.R.Vosovic about 5 hours ago

The 15$ for the Rangers is for extras or if you wanted just the models.

So that kinda clears that up.

So they are not added to the core box set and are a $15 add on?

 kenshin620 wrote:

BobtheInquisitor wrote:This kickstarter is exactly what Gates of Antares should have been. That's the feeling I get from it.

Yea I get that vibe too

Expect the weird communication

Sidstyler wrote:I noticed this in the comments:

Creator J.R.Vosovic about 5 hours ago

The 15$ for the Rangers is for extras or if you wanted just the models.

So that kinda clears that up.

So they are not added to the core box set and are a $15 add on?

The way I interpret the Ranger bit is that they are added to the core set (that's explicit "If this stretch goal is reached each Core Set will be upgraded with *2* Highborn Rangers.") and you can buy them (at say the going rogue level) as additions.

Ok so add $15, get 2 rangers. Hit 50k, get 2 more rangers

Not to make "assumptions", but do some of the people behind this not speak english? That could explain all this language weirdness (though then again that doesnt make sense since they are obviously translating this on a decent level if so)

 kenshin620 wrote:
Ok so add $15, get 2 rangers. Hit 50k, get 2 more rangers

Not to make "assumptions", but do some of the people behind this not speak english? That could explain all this language weirdness (though then again that doesnt make sense since they are obviously translating this on a decent level if so)

ken
I'm sorry if something was unclear. I am trying to keep it in simplest terms so that anyone could read the image and understand it, but that often cuts out some necessary information.
I'm not ESL ::]

And no offense taken, I get that a lot lol.

Aaaaaaaaaaand, Funded!



(Pretend that chart was updated properly )

Congratulations JR!

<3 Thanks all. Still more coming.

That was quick, and alongside the Zombicide juggernaut, too! Congratulations

Well I'm so far in for an early bird core set, not really into big rulebooks

I'm in for the core and big rulebook, I'm generally not a fan of big rulebooks either, but the fluff sounds good, and the artwork is phenomenal from what I've seen so far

Update:

Thank you all who have backed THON and made it a reality. Our first stretch goal is near; adding Highborn Rangers to the Core Sets. If you want to add additional Rangers (set of 2) add 15$ to your pledge.
I will be adding gameplay vids, images of the first two Exclusives and some images for scale reference within the next day. If there is something you'd like to see, post a comment and I will add it.
Plenty more to come; specifically adding Models of the Narrative Classes to the Core Game, additional quantities of existing units for use in all game types as well as entirely new units.

Thanks again!

Enjoy

 kenshin620 wrote:
Well I'm so far in for an early bird core set, not really into big rulebooks

This is pretty much where I sit. I'm not sure I'll stay in, depending on personal finances, but I do want to support such original models (in plastic!) and background. If the background isn't in the paperback core box book, then I'll just get the hardcover at retail.

I'm only interested in the Apostate Daughter and the Havok, and nothing else. There's no prices up on individual figs at the moment, which is making it difficult in persuading me to back this Kickstarter.

It's a toss-up between this one and the other, Cthulhu, Kickstarter. At least this one has minis to show for it.

So,is this all gonna be hard plastic then?

Very cool if so, not many companies taking the plunge to give us what we want at the moment.

I'm backing this because it looks gorgeous.

gohkm wrote:
I'm only interested in the Apostate Daughter and the Havok, and nothing else. There's no prices up on individual figs at the moment, which is making it difficult in persuading me to back this Kickstarter.

It's a toss-up between this one and the other, Cthulhu, Kickstarter. At least this one has minis to show for it.

gohkm,
Make me a list of everything you want and I will get it for you. If you back now at 15$ for Going Rogue you can up your pledge when its over and we can settle up. If those two are your favorite I can guarantee some stretch goals will be on par or better.

Just got an e-mail update with this:

‘Halcyon Virus Initiated. Argo is no more.’ - Forgemaster Tyrian Evo

Forgemaster Tyrian Evo single-handedly fell several Starlight on the distant Eastern Front, earning him the title, Tyrian the Tyrant. The most gifted of all of Ord’s Forgemasters, Tyrian is only the second Forgemaster to earn both the Ordhren Forgemaster and Theledonian Mastertect titles. Tyrian Evo is an Ordhren Overlord option.

+1 Tyrian Evo!

+4 DRX Drones!

Tyrian can increase his Fury Pool to create a DRX drone from his in-built Flash Production Drive, or expend Fury to convert an existing unit into a Legion Soldier!

Apparently the first exclusive. Not too bad, if you ask me.

Okidan_Champion wrote:

gohkm wrote:
I'm only interested in the Apostate Daughter and the Havok, and nothing else. There's no prices up on individual figs at the moment, which is making it difficult in persuading me to back this Kickstarter.

It's a toss-up between this one and the other, Cthulhu, Kickstarter. At least this one has minis to show for it.

gohkm,
Make me a list of everything you want and I will get it for you. If you back now at 15$ for Going Rogue you can up your pledge when its over and we can settle up. If those two are your favorite I can guarantee some stretch goals will be on par or better.

Mate, that's decent of you. I'll put together a list and PM you after work. In the interim, I've put in that $15 backing thingie you were talking about on Kickstarter.

Much obliged.

That exclusive does look decent, although they might want to be careful about using the terms "fury pool"...

Scale image was put up on Facebook:
http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=416827768411079&set=a.317187248375132.72933.247819308645260&type=1&relevant_count=1&ref=nf

UH OH, we got ourselves another Dystopian Legions on our hands

Because holy cow those are like 40mm


I know the Robots are suppose to be big but man those guys are huge. But hey now those Soldiers/Fireborn can be count as dreadnoughts/tau battle suits!

Unless those humanoids are suppose to be that tall OR these are suppose to be scaled up prototypes? (3 ups? 2 ups?)

Remember the description of this game

THON is a fast-paced, 28mm tactical wargame, pitting the Starlight defending Thonians against the ruthless Sons of Ord.

Now IMO I'm fine with those large minis. BUT for usage outside their game that may be a huge problem

Oh, well spotted

(I actually always though these were going to be 'large' and hadn't realised the KS advertised them as 28mm)

naught of them

All of the minis will be adjusted slightly before we tool. I want to maintain the more realistic proportions, but still keep them in line with existing minis and 28mm.

Okidan_Champion wrote:
All of the minis will be adjusted slightly before we tool. I want to maintain the more realistic proportions, but still keep them in line with existing minis and 28mm.

Ah ok so these are Ups (of some sort)

yessa!

I hope so - because if not I won't be backing this one.

I just don't have it in me to abandon all the "28mm" terrain I already have!

totally understandable, and the game is being designed with that in mind.

I'm a huge tabletop gamer as well and would not throw out 30+ years of terrain and minis either.

Good to hear - and thanks!

 Absolutionis wrote:
Scale image was put up on Facebook:
http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=416827768411079&set=a.317187248375132.72933.247819308645260&type=1&relevant_count=1&ref=nf

The size of these figures looks great, especially since "28mm" can mean anything. There are variations in people's height as much as there should be in minis. All of the figures look proportional to the sedition wars and 40k figures sitting in front of them. The only Thon figure amongst the bunch I would expect to be smaller is the manakin. Even Vakon, being the big shot he's supposed to be, would be believable at the size shown in the pictures (the proportionally correct size of a space marine, btw).

Add ons are up. Includes MRSP and discount price. Some stuff is 50% off!

I really want to pledge but I want to see some final scale shots.

Yeah, I like using minis in lots of games.

I agree about the scale issue. I'm really curious if you have any prototypes of any model that will be of the intended final scale.

Gosh darn it another update

2nd exclusive up




Say count as thunder wolves if you're desperate

Ok I'll stop the 40k analogies



Though once again I'm getting confused

It says KS Exclusive, yet it has a MSRP of $50 (for 4). Add on price of $25

That makes it just an add on item then, right? Unless they just mean KS Exclusive pricing?

Those MSRPs seem really high on some of the "normal" sized squads and characters...

I've been wondering that- they really need to clarify what they mean by "exclusive". I don't think they mean "Kickstarter only".

The discounts do look good, but as Bob says the listed MSRPs are surprisingly high for the individual units.

The prices are structured very strangely. There's a 75usd early bird for the core set and there's the normal 90usd version. But what gets stranger is there's an add-on for 85usd that you can add to the going rogue level (15usd) which is the catch-all for items you want to add.

Plus the prices are basically almost GW level. 85usd rrp for a rulebook? 25usd for a character mini? I have to wonder if the prices will stay these way because I can't imagine a new company being able to fetch these kind of prices on the market.

RiTides wrote:

The discounts do look good, but as Bob says the listed MSRPs are surprisingly high for the individual units.

Sining wrote:

Plus the prices are basically almost GW level. 85usd rrp for a rulebook? 25usd for a character mini? I have to wonder if the prices will stay these way because I can't imagine a new company being able to fetch these kind of prices on the market.

Perhaps

I mean a ADU set + Havok=$100. Which is exactly the same price as the entire box set itself. And I dont think this is going to be GW's Monopose Starter Set only plastic either

In fact adding everything together mini wise comes to $300 according to their MSRP. So if you want at least half the models its way better to buy another entire box set....

MSRP could come down once I have final numbers and final products. Right now you are still getting a pretty good discount, even if those higher priced units come down as far as say, $35.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Absolutionis wrote:
I agree about the scale issue. I'm really curious if you have any prototypes of any model that will be of the intended final scale.

I will get an image up of a more accurately scaled version soon.

Update: Stretch Goals


It doesn't say if these are going to be added to the Core Set or just free extras, hopefully the creator will clear this up.

Also, the fourth Kickstarter exclusive, Spirit.

Spirit is the Soul Core of Starlight Thon. This very Limited Edition Mini of Spirit in her CORE RUNNER form will not be available outside of this Kickstarter.

Enjoy.

Each Core Set will be upgraded with *2* Highborn Rangers.

So I jumped in for now at the $200 level simply based on aesthetics, but I'm pretty wary right now. The pricing, like some others have said, is really strange, and the dissemination of information seems a bit confused at this point.

Maybe I'm just spoiled by the warm blanket that is a CMoN KS project that they've even further refined with the Zombiecide 2 campaign (those symbols for each backer level?!? Brilliant).

Anyways. Cautiously optomistic about this one. Will take a wait and see approach, but I at least have my spot in line ;-).

@Okidan - You don't know me from Adam, so my opinion may not mean a thing, but I'd recommend creating a simple " kickstarter exclusive" graphic to put on your images to help differentiate between items that are and are not KS only.

Okidan_Champion wrote:
Each Core Set will be upgraded with *2* Highborn Rangers.

Aye we know that, but are the other stretches the same?

I'm actually going to assume yes. And if so I really hope we hit those!

Yup, all stretches are the same currently.

I'm going to put up some mini stretches like dice, cards, and boards in the next day or two.

cincy - totally understand, yes it is nice to have had a few KS under you belt already ::] I'll put some badges together.

Each of the 4 Exclusives have 'Kickstarter Exclusive' on the top of the Image. Spirit is the only Limited one. The others are Add ons and are unique and are available at about 50% off during the campaign.

If there is anything that I can clear up post here or the comments, or mail me on KS and I will try to clear it up, you probably arent alone.

Okidan_Champion wrote:


Each of the 4 Exclusives have 'Kickstarter Exclusive' on the top of the Image. Spirit is the only Limited one. The others are Add ons and are unique and are available at about 50% off during the campaign.

Maybe I'm just slow, but this is where I think you need to make it very clear what items you can ONLY get from the KS campaign. The way I read your statement, the pricing is exclusive to KS, but it's still a bit unclear what items are.

Honestly I am confused, can we get a simple rundown on what is what and what is included where.

Yes, I could probably figure it out, but I am sort on time to find the information out.

I would like to see the actual casts of the Exclusives before diving in. Are you likely to have test casts (or even finals) of those soon?

Or at the very least, full scale renders of the Exclusives. The artwork is very nice, but art doesn't always translate well into miniatures.

 PsychoticStorm wrote:
Honestly I am confused, can we get a simple rundown on what is what and what is included where.

Yes, I could probably figure it out, but I am sort on time to find the information out.

Agreed, the page could be a lot less cluttered. The "what's in the box" image needs to be updated to include the 2 rangers. Also, I'd recommend just getting rid of the add-on image and putting the add-on prices on the large renders of the models.

The whole scale thing is the 'only' issue stopping me from pledging right now.

I know you've said that the final product will be properly scaled so as to fit in with "28mm heroic" stuff... but I'm still on the fence until I see something that convinces me!

If I understand correctly, Spirit is the only limited item so far (the only real "exclusive"), and the others just have "exclusive" Kickstarter prices, then?

He said they were "unique", though, so maybe alternate sculpts or something? I dunno. I was thinking about bumping my pledge up to $200 to get the early bird with four exclusives, just in case I can't pick just two, but if I can add-on guys like Tyrian and Caurus and get the truly limited models like Spirit as my exclusives I think I'll just do that instead. Probably still gonna spend about the same amount either way, though, if not more.

Anyway, the retail prices do sound kinda high (all the more reason to back the Kickstarter ), but I guess I'll hold out hope that they come down later like Okidan said. Not that I don't believe in paying for quality and all, but I'm one of those people who were essentially priced out of 40k so I'm not exactly keen to start up another game with a similar kind of buy-in, as much as I do like some of the models/concepts so far. Like cincy said, cautious optimism and I have my place in line, so

All,

The Exclusives will not be in the Core Set. They are like Add-Ons in that they are additional models you can pick and choose to customize your order to be exactly what you want.

The Ranger is just about done so Tyrian will be the first Exclusive Render after that.

I will continue to put up progress images as we go and if there is a model you just despise I will happily refund your payment prior to shipping it out. I will try to bring prices down as much as possible.

I will reiterate this in an update.

Alpharius,
I will get an image up next week. All of the models will undergo a small amount of adjustments, this is expected.

Say hi to Omegon.

Okidan_Champion wrote:

Alpharius,
I will get an image up next week. All of the models will undergo a small amount of adjustments, this is expected.

OK, you win - I backed this KS!

Of course, I do still hold the Scipio/Azazelx Clause option and reserve the right to pull my pledge at any time, just in case!

Okidan_Champion wrote:

Say hi to Omegon.

You just did!

So when we can get a comprehensive, this is what you get so far table?


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Updated Box Contents Image, this is all Core Sets (Models Only).

1x Vakon

2x Honor Guard

2x Ranger

2x Atera Cannon

10x Manakin

2x ADU

1x Daughtus

1x HAVOK

4x ARC / 8x DRX - This sprue can make either DRX or ARC

4x Fireborn

Thanks for the fast response.

More clarity on the "Exclusives":

 Alpharius wrote:
More clarity on the "Exclusives":

Spoiler:

I find this actually a bit confusing: I was under the impression that the "Spirit of Thon" is a kickstarter exclusive, not then available in other regular channels (I'm sure also limited to some promotions). How does it then have a MSRP, and why is that exclusive a single piece? That is, all the others are a character +some number of others, or multiple items. Is the Spirit a big piece, a diorama, a set...?

Beats me!

I just hope those vehicles eventually make it into this KS too!

 Buzzsaw wrote:

 Alpharius wrote:
More clarity on the "Exclusives":

Spoiler:

I find this actually a bit confusing: I was under the impression that the "Spirit of Thon" is a kickstarter exclusive, not then available in other regular channels (I'm sure also limited to some promotions). How does it then have a MSRP, and why is that exclusive a single piece? That is, all the others are a character +some number of others, or multiple items. Is the Spirit a big piece, a diorama, a set...?

I think the Spirit with have a KS Only pose or kit or something? Seems to imply its big if its $50 (like Havoc Huge)

Spirit is the Soul Core of Starlight Thon. This very Limited Edition Mini of Spirit in her CORE RUNNER form will not be available outside of this Kickstarter.

Why is this KS so confusing!

I don't know anybody care to shed light there?

on the MSRP? I am wondering id this would be what their price would be if there would be up for regular sale, which they will not be, so what the point beyond showing how much discounted they would be.

Really its a bit confusing.

So A: they're not actually exclusive.

And B: The MSRP on them is going to be $50??

I'm not sure all that is going to give with me.....

PsychoticStorm wrote:I don't know anybody care to shed light there?

on the MSRP? I am wondering id this would be what their price would be if there would be up for regular sale, which they will not be, so what the point beyond showing how much discounted they would be.

Really its a bit confusing.

cincydooley wrote:So A: they're not actually exclusive.

And B: The MSRP on them is going to be $50??

I'm not sure all that is going to give with me.....

I must say it is a tad weird that we're 18 updates in (rough +2 a day if averaging) and things are still fuzzy

The MSRP is still a hurdle. They have said it is an estimate, but still not especially good though if it means you're potentially putting yourself into GW/PP territory and scaring off potential customers ($25 for a single 28mm model, even terminator sized, is iffy) or causing some type of panic/hoarding behavior so that more people buy add ons to get 40-50% off.

Heck the core set itself has an MSRP cost of $99, making it economically silly to buy many of the items separately seeing that they all seem to be the same kit unlike GW monoposed starter sets (making assumptions here)

And if it is an estimate, then how did they easily determined add on prices already?

The exclusive thing is also a bit weird. They need to separate exclusive PRICING with exclusive MODELS (many KS do use both BUT clearly define which is which)

I'm not saying these people are bad people, just that they could use a good moment to sit down and explain things in detail. Maybe even have some type of interview or something

All good points - hopefully the creator, who posts here now and then, can provide additional clarity.

Both here, and on his actual KS page!

Hey Guys,

The Exclusives are indeed Exclusive to KS. Ideally I could offer them again at some future time but there are no plans for that right now. The pricing is based on similar models and what they will most likely sell for if/when they are re-released.

Spirit is big, probably 75mm or so. Her body will look similar to the Core Runner, and concept/model for her is incoming.

The Core Set end MSRP will fluctuate if we hit additional stretch goals and the overall cost to manufacture it increases. During the KS campaign it is locked at 75$ early bird and 85$ Add On. I will bring the cost down as much as possible.

Thanks for dropping by and clarifying this.

concept and models would be great to see.

Again, your KS and not mine, but I'd remove the MSRP info from the exclusives at all, then. It's entirely misleading, as it suggests they will be available at another time.

I'd disagree there, simply because folk were asking what the value of the exclusive stuff would be

(and you can still use an MSRP if the only selling is any overstock at conventions)

They posted a render of one of the highborn rangers on Facebook.



I showed it to my brother and he said it "looked terrible"...personally I think I'm going to have to fething smack him for his insolence.

Anyway, I didn't expect Spirit to be so large, and if that model truly is unique to KS then I might have to get one. For the others it sounds like they might just be unique sculpts for KS but you're not ruling out the possibility of releasing something similar at a later date? That makes sense then, because I was wondering why you would make a unit like the warhound riders a KS exclusive. Not that I'd be particularly bothered, since I don't really like the concept anyway.

I also like the picture of the havok in the updated box contents image, it's a bit small (the image I mean) but from what I can tell it looks a lot cooler at that angle.

That rifle is insanely long... and no bipod.

Are you sure the gubbins under the barrel isn't a monopod (or a bipod without the center 'division' put in yet?

I thought it might have been, but it looks like there's no way for it to fold out, so it's probably just...something.

A curious update;

Shipping/FAQ Update, RPG Vid incoming
Update #19 · Mar. 09, 2013 · 3 comments

I have updated the FAQ to cover common shipping questions. Core Sets will cost $25. Realistically it will cost more than $50 so I am splitting the charge with you 50-50.

To add on Sets, please add another $25.

RPG Vid - I will be putting together a simple breakdown vid of the RPG today and it will be posted this after noon (9a now, should be up end of day). if there is something specific you would like to see, class, loadouts, mechanics, etc. post here and I will answer it or demo it in the vid.

Thanks all!

I honestly have no idea if this is meant to only apply to non-Domestic shipping of rewards, all rewards, only extras...

EDIT: Some clarity from the comments;

Outside US only. If you were paying 25$ (or more) already, and add Core Sets, please add Shipping to cover the extra Sets.

Okay, so US, ordering just one Core set, no problem. Additional Core sets, add $25.

 Sidstyler wrote:

Not much of a fan. Chunky legs, gigantic gun and a tiny head! Definitely going to wait till I can purchase the individual models later on, provided they don't cost those rather ambitious prices that is...

Is it really that her head is too small, or that every other miniature's head is too big? I disagree with "chunky legs", too, she's obviously wearing some kind of padded armor and big boots to go with it, so it's likely not going to be skin-tight like a catsuit.

The gun doesn't really bother me. It's a strange design, but I imagine it's supposed to be something like a sniper rifle, and sniper rifles in games are always stupidly huge. Who knows, though, I wouldn't assume that this is what the finished model will look like anyway and that it might get changed up before release.

I think the model is okay- could be fantastic, though, with a bit of polishing and tweaking.

Been mulling over it for a few days and that's my verdict

I'm in on this one.
It's looking pretty good to me.

Is it me or has this been stuck at 51k for days now?

It isn't just you:




It is quite stalled now.

It needs something quick to boost it along, or we might see some significant bleed off... which would be a shame!


Automatically Appended Next Post:
An update!

Some WIP shots today, first, a head variant for the Ordhren Soldier featuring a flip up visor option. Other variants coming.

Next, the Ardor Corps with Magnum. The AC is the base Ordhren Class in Narrative Play to which players can convert and add bits to kit our their AC to match their evolving and leveling character.

AC are also upgrades for a force using Forgemaster Tyrian as an Overlord in Versus play.

This week we will have updated scale images, Pics of the Honor Guard Model, new background and SCOMA vids as well as our last two Exclusives.

I dropped. I can't see myself getting into a GW,e where a single infantry model is going to retail for $50. I realize they're larger scale, but all that means to me is that none of my present terrain will work.

Sid - Most minis games exaggerate proportions pretty dramatically, closer to dwarf proportions at 4:1 as opposed to more realistic 6:1 or 8:1.

We are constantly adjusting to find the best proportions to bring out more realistic models but also ones that will hold up under scrutiny and look amazing when painted.

cincy - I'm not sure where you you see that a single model will be 50$. Other than Spirit, all of the exclusives come in multiples and the scale is being worked on.

I should have a more accurate scale shot by the end of the week. Again, these are prototypes and there will be adjustments.

Hang in there.

Okidan_Champion wrote:

I should have a more accurate scale shot by the end of the week. Again, these are prototypes and there will be adjustments.

Hang in there.

This will be a 'make or break' thing, I think!

Also - is there a gameplay video for the Miniatures side of things somewhere?


Automatically Appended Next Post:
And...

...when might be learn more about this awesome looking vehicle:

@Okidan -- I just looked and didn't realize some of the 'exclusives' came with drones, etc. My bad.

Scale is going to be a big decision point for me.

This definitely looks interesting and I think I'll chuck a couple of units of currency at it. Also, definitely echo the Gate of Antares vibe comments (Tyrian looks like he'd make a much better Hansa!).

The clincher for me would be to see how those vehicle concepts turn out (love the look of the gunship!)

There's been something about the Thon designs that's been bothering me ever since the concepts first showed up here. I think I finally figured out what it is though. The legs are too long. The characters that aren't decked out in powered armor seem to be a little too lanky in the legs.

That being said, I do love a lot of the designs and I am totally backing this project. If nothing else, I am going to love the hell out of painting those drones and power armored figures. A question though, will the Fireborn have alternate right arms? I love their design, but I don't really want them all running around with buzz saw arms.

I understand you will be adjusting scale over time, but scale is tremendously important for many people. That initial scale photo did not inspire confidence in scale.

The quality is unquestionable. The models are great. However, getting a scale photograph out and ready may be a priority. I and others are hesitant on that alone.

Agreed!

And I have to believe that has contributed to the 'stall' that this campaign now seems to be stuck in...





Combine this with no real reason to pledge now (via stretch goals, add ons, etc.) and well, I'm a bit worried now!

Yup, it sure is slipping down. Now it went below 51k

Yes it did, it needs a major rethink, or a major boost on things to come.

It needs more involvement to be honest.

I like the new model reveal tonite thank you for keeping me interested in this ks. Please show one of those vehicles from the artwork.

That is a nice piece of preview art...

Sunfury Overlord Gith Koreg - Upgraded with the massive HAVOK frame nicknamed the Anvil, Gith is as an indomitable a foe as you will encounter. His size combined with his battlefield prowess makes him a priority target.

Overlord Gith is an Overlord option for an Ordhren force. Armed with a fearsome Heavy Vulcan and a massive M92 Plated Shield, Gith is capable of shrugging off even the heaviest Thonian weapons.

Sad to see it drop in pledges, I hope it gets boosted back soon.

True, but the standard for campaigns to be "successful" is so insanely high now. This is funded, and still at close to 50K... that's pretty darn good.

Will be interesting to see if it'll boost up again at the end (I think so).

 RiTides wrote:
True, but the standard for campaigns to be "successful" is so insanely high now. This is funded, and still at close to 50K... that's pretty darn good.

Will be interesting to see if it'll boost up again at the end (I think so).

I suppose

But I dont like it when we reach a stretch goal, and then the pledge amount goes below that stretch goal. Depending on the KS that could invalidate the stretch. Could use some official words though to see what the policy is for this one

 Alpharius wrote:

It is quite stalled now.

It needs something quick to boost it along, or we might see some significant bleed off... which would be a shame!

Part of that may be due to the stealth removal of minis that led to pledges getting pulled. I don't follow this thread daily but rather maybe twice a week and my check in today on the kickstarter (which should really be linked in the OP) revealed some changes to the core box. While the changes were listed a few pages back, I didn't see anyone comment surprisingly about the loss of the Obi Wan looking Vakon mini which is now replaced with something completely different. I don't know if people didn't notice it here on dakka or if they just don't care as much as I do but I actually really liked the look of that mini.

 warboss wrote:

 Alpharius wrote:

It is quite stalled now.

It needs something quick to boost it along, or we might see some significant bleed off... which would be a shame!

Part of that may be due to the stealth removal of minis that led to pledges getting pulled. I don't follow this thread daily but rather maybe twice a week and my check in today on the kickstarter (which should really be linked in the OP) revealed some changes to the core box. While the changes were listed a few pages back, I didn't see anyone comment surprisingly about the loss of the Obi Wan looking Vakon mini which is now replaced with something completely different. I don't know if people didn't notice it here on dakka or if they just don't care as much as I do but I actually really liked the look of that mini.

Nothing has been changed or removed. Vakon is in the image and the Core Contents have not changed except for adding new models.

Okidan_Champion wrote:

 warboss wrote:

 Alpharius wrote:

It is quite stalled now.

It needs something quick to boost it along, or we might see some significant bleed off... which would be a shame!

Part of that may be due to the stealth removal of minis that led to pledges getting pulled. I don't follow this thread daily but rather maybe twice a week and my check in today on the kickstarter (which should really be linked in the OP) revealed some changes to the core box. While the changes were listed a few pages back, I didn't see anyone comment surprisingly about the loss of the Obi Wan looking Vakon mini which is now replaced with something completely different. I don't know if people didn't notice it here on dakka or if they just don't care as much as I do but I actually really liked the look of that mini.

Nothing has been changed or removed. Vakon is in the image and the Core Contents have not changed except for adding new models.

The Obi-Wan-ish below was previously the only single fig shown on pics for that faction... that is now apparently the Tau Ethereal-ish circled pic in the current core set picture. Is there something about the removal of the first mini and the addition of the second style circled mini that I'm missing? It seems to me that the mini for Vakon has drastically changed.

Actually, that's the same guy. One is just showing the prototype while the newer one is showing artwork. I think he might have a different head, but that could just be an option.

Still no word on options for the Fireborn though?

 Barzam wrote:
Actually, that's the same guy. One is just showing the prototype while the newer one is showing artwork. I think he might have a different head, but that could just be an option.

Could be. The new pic is somewhat low res but the head, shoulders, and robe look different and the weapon is on the other arm. Could it just be a difference between concept art versus production model? It's possible... but it's frankly a bit confusing. I doubt I'm the only one that thinks it changed judging from the recent pledge trends (especially when so much else on the pics changed as well like the warrior women and light frame robots and the heavy robot on the right side). The contents could definitely use some clarification as well as higher res pics of the core contents that stay consistent from update to update (either stick with concept art OR prototype figs but don't flip flop between them).

 kenshin620 wrote:

 RiTides wrote:
True, but the standard for campaigns to be "successful" is so insanely high now. This is funded, and still at close to 50K... that's pretty darn good.

Will be interesting to see if it'll boost up again at the end (I think so).

I suppose

But I dont like it when we reach a stretch goal, and then the pledge amount goes below that stretch goal. Depending on the KS that could invalidate the stretch. Could use some official words though to see what the policy is for this one

As written if the KS ends with less cash than needed to get a stretch (even if it had been reached, but pledges fell back) a company would not need to fulfill it

now many would (especially if there was not much of a shortfall), but depending on thier margins you don't want to bank on it

(some even allow post KS funding (like Mierce), or funding via paypal for those who can't do Amazon payments to count towards stretches, but again that's the exception, not the rule)

@Warboss It's the same guy; all the model pictures were changed to concept art with the change of the info-graphic.

Ah, thanks. It might be a good idea to have a larger pic displayed or at least a link to one for the all important core contents pic somewhere at the top of the kickstarter as for casual fence sitter like me. I recognized the honor guard concept art as the same one posted with the initial 3d renders of the model that differ from each other but not that one. The flip from actual minis to concept art combined with such low res pics is a bit jarring.

I think I'm going to drop my early bird core box. I can post a time if anyone is interested in scooping it up. I like the concept and the models, but my finances just won't let me justify spending $75 right now, especially if I won't get anything from it for nearly a year.

Good luck, Thon.

Unfortunately, or fortunately, there's quite a few 'early birds' left as well as various exclusive levels...

 BobtheInquisitor wrote:
I think I'm going to drop my early bird core box. I can post a time if anyone is interested in scooping it up.

They are currently in good supply, these early birds. And another one is coming up in a few minutes

The game seems to have a good vibe and some future. Had its pre-production efforts met with GoA pedigree, it would have been a show of the year. But good luck anyway.

Does the $75 level include shipping? It says under the pledge to add $25 for shipping outside of the US but then the shipping faq has a blanket statement to add $25 shipping apparently for everyone. So is it $100 total for that level within the US and $125 outside of it?

25$ is for outside US only.

Okidan_Champion wrote:
25$ is for outside US only.

So does the $75 include shipping then for the core set within the US? Thanks for the quick reply in either case.

I think it includes shipping- there was confusion over the wording of that on a previous page and it was answered (hopefully someone can verify).

Now its dipped down to 48k

With the krosmaster KS up I might drop my early bird for that......

So, just to make sure before I add some funds, $15 gets me two of the Ranger models? Am I reading that right?

 forrestfire wrote:
So, just to make sure before I add some funds, $15 gets me two of the Ranger models? Am I reading that right?

Yes, so you'll have a total of 4 if you get a basic box+add on

Uh oh...




THON has everything going for it - awesome previews, good pre-launch hype, a nice start of KS, great looking miniatures.

What the heck is happening?

Bad timing vs. other Kickstarters?

The "Scale Issue"?

Something else?

I think bad timing plus the "Scale Issue".

The latter is why I haven't pledged yet.

Yup. Sure is nose diving right now, its at 46.5k as of this minute

 Alpharius wrote:
Uh oh...

THON has everything going for it - awesome previews, good pre-launch hype, a nice start of KS, great looking miniatures.

What the heck is happening?

Bad timing vs. other Kickstarters?

The "Scale Issue"?

Something else?

It is quite surprising. Some KS's like the Gates of Anteres one that felt basically like vaporware (asking for tons of money based on a name and one mustached fig) but this one has reasonable goals and nice work to show. I really like the design and aesthetic of the universe which reminds me of a more brutal Mass Effect. The only reason I haven't pledged is that I've been burned before with buying games only to have no one to play against so I promised myself that I'd only support one game that isn't locally played at a time (currently Heavy Gear).

I don't think the timing on this is bad but I do think the scale of the figs will turn some people off. Having unarmored figs tower over spacemarines (the default scifi comparison fig) in height means that they're not going to look appropriate next to them or terrain designed for them. It also means that they'll look like giants next to the other popular lines that are more realistically proportioned like the old star wars minis, the upcoming warzone, and infinity. That added size is also a factor in the sticker shock people are seeing when they look at those future MSPRs. Its difficult enough for GW to charge $25 for a single character figure and they're the big boys on the market and not a new startup. The telltale 3d printing lines on the figs shown as well as the renders posted seem to indicate that the entire line is being done digitially which means that rescaling is a just a few mouse clicks away. That would cut down on some of the visible detail but I think lots of fans would appreciate being able to use the figs with other realistically proportioned lines (Infinity, Star Wars, etc) as well as knowing tnat future releases won't scare off potential players with high prices.

Then there are the shipping issues. Its needs to be explicitly stated how much shipping is and only mentioned under the shipping part of the FAQ. Right now there are mentions of $25 shipping ONLY if international, $25 shipping for everyone based on $50 shipping costs that will be split, and $25 shipping for additional boxes sets only. I'm extrapolating off of the owners brief post here that the $75 in the early bird offer for the core set INCLUDES shipping within the United States but I certainly don't get that from the Kickstarter nor am I 100% sure of it. If the cost were $5-10, I don't think people would mind the ambiguity so much but it's $25 instead. Then there is the recent switch from actual figs shown to low res concept art that likely led people to think the minis changed as well.

I think the scale is a big issue, but the timing couldn't be worse:

Zombicide Season 2
Mutant Chronicles Warzone Ressurection
HellDorado
Wild West Exodus

and now the newbies:

Drake
Krosmaster
Imperius Rex

Thats TON of miniatures based games competing for the same niche market.

Nice post, Warboss. Could also consider burnout as well. There have been a lot of juicy kickstarters starting and finishing lately that we may be reaching the point of burnout - we can't buy any more minis because of a lack of cash, we already have a set that look similar or we've dropped a load of cash over the past six months and we're still waiting for goodies to arrive.

When a similar looking kickstarter starts, we are immediately excited and pledge only for us to get all logical and think "Actually, I already have X and they look pretty similar. Come to think of it, I won't be seeing them for a fair few months and I'll need to paint them as well. Nah, can't justify this, so I'm pulling out..."

I think more and more people are just pledging at at rather high level as soon as a KS they might be even remotely interested in

even if they have no real intention to go through with it, and so as they run toward the middle/end you see far more pull outs

I'd be really interested in some real numbers for this

Good point on the pricing issue too - that "MSRP" could leave people thinking about not wanting to have another "GW" in their life...

 Alpharius wrote:
Good point on the pricing issue too - that "MSRP" could leave people thinking about not wanting to have another "GW" in their life...

Or Infinity, Mr. Infinity in your banner! The solution isn't to just get rid of the future MSRP details from the kickstarter and then just charge them anyways (which is the easiest way to "address" the sticker shock) but rather to find out why individual figs are $25 and whether they truely need to be. It seems like the owner is trying to go with plastic for the first release so I'm not sure if scaling the figs back IMMEDIATELY to a scale that looks appropriate with Infinity and Star Wars CMG will save much material cost but it seems like something to look into that also addresses the use of the figs outside of Thon only games. Another is whether the kickstarter should cover the entirety of the plastic costs or whether some figs should rather go with resin or metal instead to save on some of those initial costs. When I see things like $25 characters and $50 shipping quotes for a box of minis, I instinctively think that the kickstarter is trying to pay for too much of the start up costs with the KS instead of using it as an adjunct to the more traditional start up funding sources. I want to (at least) see these figs in stores as I would like to pick up a Vatok, honor guard, and some of the Fireborn fodder and/or characters assuming I can use them with my other scifi proportionately scaled minis. If I can get a good enough deal on the starter set as well as more of the details clarified, I might even go in on the KS for a core set just for the portion of figs I want.

Something does need to change though as the KS officially stopped being stalled two days ago and started instead backsliding. The number of "early bird" core sets available has more than doubled in that time to 16.

I'm a touch confused by this KS,
It's not clear to me what I'm actually getting for my money.
Maybe I'm just being a bit thick.
It's my second one, and my previous (Rogue Trooper by Mongoose) was lovely and clear as to what you would get at each level.

I've pledged the Core Runner set,
As far as I can tell I get the box, a hadback rule book, and the choice of two add ons.
The question is, do I have to pay extra for the add ons? am I just getting the oppertunity to buy them at the discounted price, or do I get them outright?

I am toying with upping to the next level to get the 4 add ons,

I like the look of this game, the aesthetic is pretty sweet.

At that level, you get to choose 2 'exclusives' for "free" (i.e., included in your pledge price).

You are, of course, free to add more money to your pledge and buy more things, for the prices listed.

I think.

That makes more sense.
Thank You.
I may up to the $200 level depending on scale/more cool stuff arriving.

Some games only raise so much. But what I like about this kickstarter is you can see they have put their own money to develop it. It's isn't a completed product going into kickstarter like zomibicide. The amount of money the have raised will produce a completed game and hopefully get it into shops!

Maybe it's stalled as they weren't fully prepared for the kickstarter beyond the original game?

I think it's the scale issue, and the fact that it's so hard to get questions answered. The shipping question should really be made crystal clear by now, but it seemingly isn't!

If they can be a bit clearer in their communication, and get some prints made of the models (just at Shapeways or anywhere) real quickly of a better scale, I think they'll be fine.

If a KS like this "only" raised $50K when all was said and done, it would be a success to me. I think folks have seen the really successful KS's and raised the bar beyond what it would be. You can do a lot with $50K upfront as a start-up. That was unheard of a few years ago. I know they'd be basically selling product beforehand, but it gives them a huge jumpstart they wouldn't have been able to get otherwise.

So, moderate expectations, and you can't be disappointed . Not everything needs to be six figures to be a success!

Scale is a big issue, price maybe, trying to be 3 things at once a problem too, I feel communication is a big issue too, if not the biggest of them all.

To me it's scale and price. I'm good with dreamforge troopers being larger than GW, but mark made so many options that they could replace imp. Guard completely. This ks just doesn't do double duty on the tabletop, so my money doesn't go as far. Love the look of the models, but not enough to buy a whole system when others might not enjoy it.

I don't know how I can be any more clear on the shipping:

$25 outside US.
Free in US/Canada.

As for communication, if you have a question, I'd be happy to answer it here or on the comments tab on KS.

Scale pic will be sent out in tonight's update.

Thanks guys.

Sounds great about the scale pic! For shipping, is it always free to US (no matter the options) and always $25 to international? Or $25 per box / per certain number of add-ons?

I beleive with the right scale it will go up because Dystopian Wars shot themselves in the foot being out of scale with everything else on the tabletop. If the scale is right it has the ability to do double duty hence able to use has stand in for 40k or warmachine therefore demand will be greater. Look at those Ord soldiers if they scale to say a terminator I need a ton. It's all about usability for most with so many ks out right now not saying it can't still be successful. Could do more with right scale though.

Okidan_Champion wrote:
I don't know how I can be any more clear on the shipping:

$25 outside US.
Free in US/Canada.

As for communication, if you have a question, I'd be happy to answer it here or on the comments tab on KS.

Scale pic will be sent out in tonight's update.

Thanks guys.

Thanks for the quick response. The above is crystal clear. Unfortunately you instead have the following under shipping along with another disclaimer under the early bird core set mentioning another $25 for international shipping.

Shipping a single Core Set costs over $50. So I am splitting with you 50-50. Please add $25 per Core Set to cover shipping. Shipping is painfully expensive.

The above does NOT specify who it applies to and the strict literal leading of your lament about shipping under the FAQ would be that EVERYONE gets charged $25 shipping per core set with international customers paying a total of $50 per set to account for the extra $25 listed under certain pledge levels.

By no means I want to undermine the will and commitment in answering question, if this came as that I am deeply sorry.

The problem is that questions for example for shipping arise even now that it has been discussed to death, it can only mean the message was not communicated clearly enough.

In any case looking forward to today's scale pic and am hopeful in a positive rebound.

I am also greatly looking forward to the scale pic, as these are amazing models, but I would want to be able to use them in other games as well.

 Alpharius wrote:
Good point on the pricing issue too - that "MSRP" could leave people thinking about not wanting to have another "GW" in their life...

I hate to say it, but I keep coming back to this myself. I don't care how amazing the sculpt or how high-quality the casts are, no single infantry-sized model is worth $20+ to me. GW priced me out with crap like that, along with $80 rulebooks, $50 codices, and $80 flyers. And as much as I like the Thon aesthetic and really want this game to take off, I don't think I can justify getting into another game with such outrageous, GW-level pricing. The Kickstarter is a good deal, but like most I don't aim to game purely with what's in the starter box and want to expand later, and if those prices don't come down considerably I don't think I can do it.

The scale issues on the other hand I don't really give a feth about, and personally I hate how that's such a big issue. People need to stop judging other games based on the ease of which they can proxy the models for 40k. I'm tired of only having one game to play, I'm bored with models sticking to one stupid aesthetic with gothic architecture and skulls everywhere, because they won't sell models if they do something different. I like the fireborn soldiers based on their own merits, not because "These would make good terminators for 40k!", and Daughtus is a cool-looking character regardless of how easy you could convert him into an Inquisitor.

May I ask what single infantry-sized model you see for sale at $20+? Every add-on save the Spirit of Thon is multiple minis and it has been said that the Spirit is a large model.

 Sidstyler wrote:


The scale issues on the other hand I don't really give a feth about, and personally I hate how that's such a big issue. People need to stop judging other games based on the ease of which they can proxy the models for 40k. I'm tired of only having one game to play, I'm bored with models sticking to one stupid aesthetic with gothic architecture and skulls everywhere, because they won't sell models if they do something different. I like the fireborn soldiers based on their own merits, not because "These would make good terminators for 40k!", and Daughtus is a cool-looking character regardless of how easy you could convert him into an Inquisitor.

I think scale wise its not so much "its not 40k sized"

Well to me its "its called 28mm, yet everything shown is exceeding 40mm or so". The pics we have been shown are the pre production upscaled models. To me it makes little sense to show those models in terms of scale and yet advertise the game to a different measurement of the supposed models. Its like showing 3 Ups right next to normal sized models without the downsized versions to match

 kilcin wrote:
May I ask what single infantry-sized model you see for sale at $20+? Every add-on save the Spirit of Thon is multiple minis and it has been said that the Spirit is a large model.

Tyrian comes with four drones. Maybe it's just because I'm a Tau player but I don't consider drones to be "models", more like accessories. And I'm not entirely impressed by the drone designs anyway.

Daughtus and Vakon are both single models and they're priced at $25.

For my taste the game tries to be too much at once.

 Sidstyler wrote:

Daughtus and Vakon are both single models and they're priced at $25.

I didn't look at those because I didn't see a reason to add them, my apologies.

Thon Update wrote:
Photo - Vakon Scale Revised

Attached is a revised and more accurately scaled Vakon. The older scaled up version on the left, and more accurately scaled version on the right. As we prep and prototype each model, proportions and scale will be adjusted so that the mini can withstand handling on the table, retain detail when painted and be broken up into the parts for tooling. It is a delicate balance of aesthetic and manufacturing requirements.

Should help with scale.

That marine is on a pretty tall base... Vakon is still a giant. Maybe he's supposed to be, though, and "normal" models would be shorter... but there's no way to tell that unfortunately.

The scale is close enough for me. That is all I was worried about I'm in for the long haul. The only question I have is the Ord soldiers scale to what.

 Sidstyler wrote:

 Alpharius wrote:
Good point on the pricing issue too - that "MSRP" could leave people thinking about not wanting to have another "GW" in their life...

I hate to say it, but I keep coming back to this myself. I don't care how amazing the sculpt or how high-quality the casts are, no single infantry-sized model is worth $20+ to me. GW priced me out with crap like that, along with $80 rulebooks, $50 codices, and $80 flyers. And as much as I like the Thon aesthetic and really want this game to take off, I don't think I can justify getting into another game with such outrageous, GW-level pricing. The Kickstarter is a good deal, but like most I don't aim to game purely with what's in the starter box and want to expand later, and if those prices don't come down considerably I don't think I can do it.

The scale issues on the other hand I don't really give a feth about, and personally I hate how that's such a big issue. People need to stop judging other games based on the ease of which they can proxy the models for 40k. I'm tired of only having one game to play, I'm bored with models sticking to one stupid aesthetic with gothic architecture and skulls everywhere, because they won't sell models if they do something different. I like the fireborn soldiers based on their own merits, not because "These would make good terminators for 40k!", and Daughtus is a cool-looking character regardless of how easy you could convert him into an Inquisitor.

Well, sorry Sid, but quite a lot of us do play primarily GW games, and look around at other miniature lines to provide us with cheaper alternatives or variety. We are as free to express our desire that new minis fit into the scale we favour as you are to complain about other people's preferences.

Hey Sid. The scale issue has nothing to do with being GW compatible for a lot of is here. It has to do with requiring is to completely re-outfit our tables with terrain. That's a big deal.

_Price has come up a number of times.
I'd be interested to hear peoples thoughts on what is acceptable/similarly priced goods, or what you *want* to pay for these and other models?

The MSRP is not set in stone and I will lower it as much as I can. Until they are manufactured and shipped I can't say with certainty.

Take a look at Malifaux's pricing or boxing strategy. They're considered a little bit pricey, but worth it for plastic figures. Generally, a hero figure goes for $11 to $16, while the boxes, which contain 5 or more guys depending on the box, go for $35. For things like drones or basic soldiers that people need a lot of, try looking at Dreamforge pricing. A larger box with a lot of options might make the price-per-model radio easier to adjust.

For me, what it comes down to is that I'm not interested in a new game, because I like several of the models but not all of them. Many of the models are absolutely beautiful, but I don't have the funds to actually buy a box for a game.

In any case, I may be more niche market, since I plan on pledging to get some of the sniper models. I like their price of $15 for two, because they're highly detailed and well-designed. It's extremely hard to get sanely-sculpted female soldiers, so these are perfect for me.

However, since they're $15 for the two, I will be buying them to be something I spend a lot of time and effort turning into showcase models, since I'll only have a few of them. If I could get a box of five or ten for $25-35ish, then I would jump on them and use them as snipers for 40k, because that's the price I'd pay for comparable models for GW/Malifaux/PP/etc.

A really nice revision to the stretch goals. As per the kickstarter update page:

Due to us dropping below the first stretch I have revised the goals. I have upped the model counts on all of the stretch goals x2 and the first goal x5. Each Stretch goal still includes a new sculpt. There will also be mini-stretches between each big stretch.

Well, I'm onboard. Can't wait

Might have to increase my pledge now you have shocked my wallet with new revisions

 Dannicus wrote:
A really nice revision to the stretch goals. As per the kickstarter update page:

Due to us dropping below the first stretch I have revised the goals. I have upped the model counts on all of the stretch goals x2 and the first goal x5. Each Stretch goal still includes a new sculpt. There will also be mini-stretches between each big stretch.

Well, that's just sweet! And smart, I think

All those modifications look nice.

I am definately keeping my $150 pledge where it is at.

I will stay at the 200 level right now but looking to increase depending on what is released next.

 Yodhrin wrote:
We are as free to express our desire that new minis fit into the scale we favour as you are to complain about other people's preferences.

Never said you weren't.

 cincydooley wrote:
Hey Sid. The scale issue has nothing to do with being GW compatible for a lot of is here. It has to do with requiring is to completely re-outfit our tables with terrain. That's a big deal.

I can see that, but so far they don't look like they'll be so horribly out of scale that existing 28mm terrain won't work. I would think you could still play with all your hills, trees, etc.

As for buildings and stuff I imagine a lot of new terrain will need to be built anyway, to match the aesthetic of Thon's architecture that we've seen from the artwork. Which I don't really see as a bad thing, or at least I personally don't have a problem with making new terrain.

 Dannicus wrote:
A really nice revision to the stretch goals. As per the kickstarter update page:

Due to us dropping below the first stretch I have revised the goals. I have upped the model counts on all of the stretch goals x2 and the first goal x5. Each Stretch goal still includes a new sculpt. There will also be mini-stretches between each big stretch.

lol, holy crap. Sadly though I dropped my pledge down to the $100 Mite level last night before this news, since the rulebook doesn't really feel necessary and the only truly "exclusive" miniature so far is Spirit. I might up my pledge again later though with add-ons.

Also, I think we need more pics of the card terrain/cover, that one on the KS isn't much to look at. And for people interested in the vehicles I noticed this in the comments by JR:

@ Tim / Alvin - The vehicles are prohibitively expensive to model and mold, which I why we are here. They are set up as a higher end stretch goal, since they will take a fair amount of resources to make. If we don't make it to them, I will look at offering them separately.

So if you want to see the vehicles before the end of this (and later this year when it hits retail) then it apparently hinges on the success of this Kickstarter.

That's good info on the vehicles.

Okidan_Champion wrote:
_Price has come up a number of times.
I'd be interested to hear peoples thoughts on what is acceptable/similarly priced goods, or what you *want* to pay for these and other models?

The MSRP is not set in stone and I will lower it as much as I can. Until they are manufactured and shipped I can't say with certainty.

I would say try to shoot for $15 for character figs that are standard "human" sizes (like Vakon) where as the bulkier ones like Daughtus should reach $20 with truely massive ones only reaching $25 each. Standard line trooper types that you need multiples of should be around $15 for 2 if human sized (like the honor guard) and $20 if significantly bulkier. Combo sets like your Warkeeper Caurus and 2 honor guard should go for $30 to $33 max to still give a token discount compared to buying figs of that size separately ($20 for bulky character +$15 for two rank and file human sized). Pricing at the above costs still puts you in the upper end of the market above even know companies like Reaper that is often talked about in terms of both quality and value but still at a reasonable number for a completely new game that doesn't have a long time minis or cross media tie-in following (like if you were doing the "official" mass effect minis). These prices are still above your KS offered ones in most cases and I'd personally put nailing that ahead of increasing the stretch goals any further (which by the way are INCREDIBLY generous at this point). That said.. the preceeding is based on true 28-32mm scale that I think you still haven't reached yet.



People who post in this thread (including myself) seem to love the aesthetic and look of the world you're creating and I'm sure there are others that will agree when they see the minis on the shelves. I wouldn't discount the importance of random buyers of 1-2 figs that don't necessarily want them to play Thon. I've bought literally hundreds of figs over the years that I thought just looked cool for use in both beer and pretzel "bring anything" minis games as well as RPGs for characters. If the figure looks too out of place with the others in that same general category (like the realistically proportioned one you're going for), I personally don't buy them. I don't want NBA players running around with the rest of my scifi RPG characters or skirmish warband. Just to give you another comparison with some of the figs I'm talking about, here's a pic with an infinity fig as well a slightly exaggerated merc with another space marine for comparison as well. It would really help to get an accurate idea of the scale if you placed the Thon figs next to other realistically proportioned ones (like the oft mentioned Infinity line or even the old prepainted plastic Star Wars minis) in addition to the ubiquitous space marine.



I'd try very hard to get the unarmored or minimally armored (in terms of bulk) humanoids like Vakon and honor guard and manakins to no taller than the chaos marine you've got pictured and then just keep the scale consistent within your universe to that. I hope that change in scale will help you as well reach the price points I mentioned above.

God, you don't notice so much when they're grouped with their own, but the Space Marine models in the pic above look so toyish in comparison to the others. Even Herpderps McBarrelbody looks better.

I really, really wish I could afford to stay in this one. I love the aesthetic, the bits of background I've read so far, and especially (most of) the models.

For me, the scale isn't as important with sci fi (lol, genegineering), but Thon just can't afford to alienate any potential customers. The two biggest concerns that they can deal with are the projected MSRP pricing and the scaling. If they fix those, or at least ameliorate them somewhat, that should help welcome a bunch of new customers. Unfortunately, I think this KS will underperform what it should achieve just because of the timing. There are half a dozen other highly anticipated mini kickstarters going on right now, and that is the real problem. It might help for Thon to take a more Dreadball approach by fostering communities, tournaments and forums for sharing fanfiction/projects/whatever to lay the groundwork for a second, larger KS later. Instead of making new sculpts at each stretch goal, they can work on campaign rules or quick-play board game scenarios or something. Make Thon a game that is easy to get into and widely known. Then cash in on it.


I do like how Thon spent a long time putting out bits and pieces of info before the KS. I honestly think Thon would be doing WWX numbers if the timing were better (and the scale and pricing issues were dealt with more quickly).

Its a good update, I hope it is a timely one too.

Its still falling, 42k now

I think it will go up a litte after wwx ks ends aloy of gamers a going in heavy with that ks. I hope this one bounces back I love the minis so far.

So I was stalking this Thon a little bit because I'm in love with the concept art, and I found this:
http://talent.adweek.com/gallery/THON-The-Game/5433927
Mostly unrevealed concept art. A ton of awesome stuff is in the works. I especially love the civilian/priest looking B&W concepts.

Also this:
http://cghub.com/images/view/449403/

 inqscott wrote:
I think it will go up a litte after wwx ks ends aloy of gamers a going in heavy with that ks. I hope this one bounces back I love the minis so far.

Maybe, maybe not.

I don't think that we'll see a big uptick because certain campaign ends - money spent is money spent - it's gone!

A shame that this one is bleeding out as much as it is...

Indeed. Unfortunately, putting out your stuff (no matter how good it looks.. and this does look good!) in a scale that isn't compatible with much and charging more as the new kid on the block than the biggest companies out there for the figs (like $25 human characters) aren't the best ideas. I do hope that those two issues are addresses sooner rather than later before this dips down below the initial funding goal. GOA frankly deserved to fail due to poor planning and hubris; this doesn't and rather just needs a few tweaks in scale (easy) and retail pricing (not necessarily easy). While it's difficult to get an exact match due to differences in angle, I tried matching the width of the marine bases to compare the size of the figs. Unfortunately, Vakon towers over everyone (even the marines) like Herman Munster even after his recent rescaling.

I have to admit - I didn't see THAT happening.

Ouch!

I know.

What the heck?

A confession first. I've backed this project to hopefully participate in the discussion, but pulled my 100 cents after getting all the interesting things in updates.

Second, the timing really couldn't have been worse, and this became apparent in the last 5 days - a new hope for Tau is coming. And this brings the question of scale - Kickstarter price vs. the MSRP back to the table. Many of those who wanted to back Thon for minis only now has turned their attention to the competition.

This project is just 6 days from un-reaching its funding goal, and the more pictures with orange battle suits will hit the web, the more likely this will happen. I am actually willing to bet on this happening.

Third, not to sound just pessimistic, this is what I see as a possible saving points.

"The game's Core Set consists of a skirmish sized army from both the Sons of Ord and the Thonian Alliance, dice, markers, reference cards and rulebook."

There should be some pledge goals without all the "dross" - simply a set of every single sprue to be produced for the project, for the collectors and modellers and those too cautious to pledge high. Similarly, there should be an a la carte menu of sprues, and not just in 15$ or 25$ increments.

Fighting through the fanboy mob is difficult, but even the worst circumstances may be (hopefully) used, if this set is promoted on the forums as an alternative to the battleforce. Right now it is 1 "not-broadside", 5 "not-crisis" (if Daughtus is included), 1 "non-ethereal" with 2 "non-honour-guard", 2 "non-stealth" and a bunch of drones and bits. Manakins are not particularly fitting for warriors, but using parts of more "human-like miniatures" this can be worked around. The first stretch goal will greatly help.

How does this compare? $50 for a Broadside. A match for a post-Kickstarter Havoc. $25 for a single Crisis. Fireborn are cheaper. Battleforce I can't read, presumably £80. Nominally in favour of Thon after the first stretch goal is met. It's an uphill battle against a well established opponent.

From reading I scale is becoming a major sticking point. I don't belive the scale is as bad as Dystopian Wars not even close. Scaling that close can be fixed with proper basing. I say show the scale of the Ord that will be either the show killer or the party starter I'm betting on the latter.

I think, unfortunately, the early bird strategy is backfiring with this campaign- folks rushed to get in on it, treating it like one of the big board game campaigns, then dropped when they didn't like what they saw.

I think it would've been better to take Dreamforge's approach in this case- no early birds, no special deals, just a good deal and taking fan feedback into account for stretch goals. It would make the "whiplash" effect of early backers coming in on a whim with little info and then bailing much less.

I also am not a fan of folks doing that... I've only cancelled my pledge on one project, Kingdom Death, and I felt I was very justified in doing so due to the things that were revealed at the time I did (partnerships, level to get stretches, overall cost, etc). But in this case I don't know why folks are bailing. I'm guessing the scale pics could be a reason, but the modified scale is much closer. I feel like people should've given them more of a chance if they had backed to start with before cancelling.

I still expect this to maintain it's funding level, but it has been a tough stretch!

I'm back in as much as I can afford. I really do want Thon to succeed because I think it looks like the most interesting new Science Fiction game out there. I'm not backing any other Kickstarters right now, but the timing is still bad for me financially--still recovering from the holidays and going into Tax Season is enough to make any wallet cautious.

I think Wirecat has a good point about "foot-in-the-door" purchase levels. Also, are you making any textured bases or terrain for this game? Try selling that as an add on.

I backed out because other KS appealed to me more. I wasnr enamoured by the exclusives of Thon, and I like the overall sculpts of WWX and Warzone more. Further, Arena Rex popped up, and so did Krosmaster.

I'd drop all of the above if wrath of kings or confrontation Phoenix started all of a sudden.

We are very interested in this project here at Angry Badger. How extensive will your art book be?

Hope you succeed.

And we're now officially under $40,000 and the kickstarter has lost 2/3 of the money earned since initially getting funded. I do wish that Okidan would post here as he did earlier when things were on the upswing about any changes if any that are planned to stop the bleeding of backers. The increased stretch goals were very generous (and unnecessarilly so IMO) but didn't actually help in any way since I don't think the stretch goals were the actual problem. He's obviously under no obligation to do so but I can't see how staying silent will help the endeavor more than doing so.

The scale issues were the decider for me. I like the concept art, I liked the test minis. I was an early bird backer that canceled.

I also think the responses could have been more clear and concise. Too often, early on, the answers made the questions less clear.

I hope the KS succeeds (as I like the fluff and the multiple uses/roles for the game bits) but I won’t be backing this one.

I'm staying in, but at this stage, I'm not confident it'll go forward.

I didn't think it would be possible, but this one is actually headed towards dipping BELOW the funding goal!




There's still plenty of time to turn it around, but... this one's in serious trouble.

 Alpharius wrote:
I didn't think it would be possible, but this one is actually headed towards dipping BELOW the funding goal!

There's still plenty of time to turn it around, but... this one's in serious trouble.

I think KS is this great slideshow of human nature, all illustrated with charts and graphs and comment flame wars.

Think about the wildly successful projects and how many people joined just to be part of the "big event"? Momentum is infectious. Similarly when a project inevitably stalls people panic and start pulling pledges because the project isn't exciting any more. It's still the same deal, same awesome minis that is there when the person signed up - but they justify it somehow.

It's the same part of our brains that causes people to *not* pledge for a project until it's successfully funded. Why when there is zero risk to their money until it is funded - and their money helps make it happen?

We excel at making totally illogical decisions and then justifying it after the fact.

It can be reversed, but it will need a major effort, not sure if it is worth spending that effort to reverse it, instead of spending it to redo it.

Its a worthy project the illustrations and the models look good, I would like to see it succeed, if not from the first attempt maybe with the second.

People do seem to be urging him to cancel the campaign and try again later.

That might be a good idea at this point...

I originally pulled my pledge, because I didn't know if I could afford to keep it or not, with an expensive dentist appointment coming up in April and now moving out of my apartment here within the next two weeks (I hope to be signing the new lease tomorrow). It's been depressing to watch this thing keep bleeding out though so I said feth it and went back in to push it up to $39k. Guess I'll be going down with the ship.

Yeah, Reading the comments it sounds pretty pesimistic. Lots of people essentially giving up hope.

And we were so close to $65K at one time.

I don't think it ever got too much over $52K, but still, point taken...

I thought I remembered seeing the numbers get close for the second extended goal.

but it could have been wishful thinking.

Alas;

What's Next?
Update #29 · Mar. 19, 2013 · comment

It is with a heavy heart that I cancel funding on THON. The upside is that we will return bigger and better, with this experience behind us.

I have no exact timeframe but please stay tuned to Facebook and the official page.

https://www.facebook.com/ThonTheGame

http://www.thonthegame.com

Thanks to all that backed us, and especially those that hung in there despite the ups and downs.

The game has changed, and we will change with it. This kickstarter is over, but our Spirit remains.

Endure.

Honestly, I'm very surprised by all of this. The project really seemed to have a lot going for it.

Hmmm....

I really liked the look of the miniatures. Surprised this ended up going south like this.

It's arguably for the best. Many people were excited about the potential of this game, but timing and scale held people back. Conversation also became fatalistic near the end.

Regardless, it's awesome that the creator hasn't given up hope. We'll see Thon again in the future.

I hope they run this after the big Kickstarters but before Warpath. Or maybe after Warpath and Confrontation if too many people are saving up by then.

I want Thon to come back and do well.

Dang. I have to stop backing new sci-fi games. I'm apparently the kiss of death.

I think this is also a victim of posters like Alpharius, and other kicktraq obsessed people.

People get too obsessed with any little stat, that they see every minor thing as a huge setback, then post that everywhere. Intentional or not, it sabotages them.

It wasn't the main reason why funding was eventually canceled, but it was a contributing factor in what is essentially funding through popularity.

It's also a victim of raised expectations. With the professionally funded kickstarters out there with lots of art to show off, it's a bit difficult to compete in terms of showmanship. It also might have helped if they had a better example of the rules since I saw only a basic example in a preview youtube.

 Vertrucio wrote:
I think this is also a victim of posters like Alpharius, and other kicktraq obsessed people.

People get too obsessed with any little stat, that they see every minor thing as a huge setback, then post that everywhere. Intentional or not, it sabotages them.

It wasn't the main reason why funding was eventually canceled, but it was a contributing factor in what is essentially funding through popularity.

It's also a victim of raised expectations. With the professionally funded kickstarters out there with lots of art to show off, it's a bit difficult to compete in terms of showmanship. It also might have helped if they had a better example of the rules since I saw only a basic example in a preview youtube.

Or it could be as basic as fundamental issues with the pricing and scale of the models.

Again, that's a contributing factor, but it's not everything.

Which you sorta ignored when you finger pointed at Kicktraq and "expectations." As the most tangible factor, I'd say it did more than its fair share of contributing.

Well, it's a shame it's being cancelled, but I can't say I'm surprised, honestly. I'm disappointed I won't be getting my Ordhren Fireborn, but hopefully in the near future it'll come back. I look forward to this Kickstarter coming back and I fully intend to back it again when it does.

 cincydooley wrote:
Which you sorta ignored when you finger pointed at Kicktraq and "expectations." As the most tangible factor, I'd say it did more than its fair share of contributing.

You mean, ignored like this?

It wasn't the main reason why funding was eventually canceled, but it was a contributing factor[ in what is essentially funding through popularity.

Considering someone had already mentioned scale, I thought I didn't have to repeat the same thing, but some people don't read the whole conversation.

Anyway, the game will come out in some form. I know first hand how much it costs to produce all the material shown and not shown in the kickstarter previews.

Most likely he can just wait another 4-6 months for competing kickstarters to finish, then relaunch with 4 factions, full rules, and a lot more artwork and finished sculpts. There is really no possible way he would abandon this project.

It's also the reason why I haven't shown too much of my game, and moved the kickstarter muuuuuuch later this year, if not next year. You have to launch with a helluva lot of stuff ready to keep the momentum going.

I feel its for the best, kickstarter is not an easy thing to do, it has its own dynamic, its own expectations and psychology,lets not forget timing, the crucial part is he will try again, hopefully this experience will shape it into a better commercial product.

Why I say this, simple, a product may be great, this does not mean it will be a great commercial product, I think the kickstarter revealed what the biggest ones were and that I believe is a good thing for Thon, waiting for attempt 2.

NOOO.

NOOOOOOO.

...well...here's hoping we'll see Thon 2: Revengeance before too long, I guess.

I hope it comes back I had such glorious plans for my Ord forces.

Wasn't interested because 40mm scale.

Anyone serious goes 28mm unless the gaming system specifically requires something different.

Skirmish games are one hell of a saturated market as well.

AS much as I'd love to have that much POWER, Thon failed due to:

1) Scale issues out of the gate
2) Unclear/confusing front page
3) Pricing issues

So, it is good to see that he'll come back better focused, with the lessons learned from this one.

Hopefully he'll be properly inoculated against the all the evil users and stat obsessed Internet Denizens out there so they won't be able to drag him down next time!

Does anyone thing the long ass time frame the KS was running on had a negative impact as well? If I recall, it was over 30 days, which seems like a solid time frame to me. I'm watching a few projects now that have time frames of 45 days plus, which seems awfully long.

At the risk of sounding overly negative, there does seem to be a new trend towards the 45 day Kickstarter vs. a 30 day campaign, and I'm not so sure that is always a good thing...

I suppose the theory is that a longer KS means more money, but you might be on to something there cincy, and it may just mean more time for a negative pledge situation?

 cincydooley wrote:
Does anyone thing the long ass time frame the KS was running on had a negative impact as well? If I recall, it was over 30 days, which seems like a solid time frame to me. I'm watching a few projects now that have time frames of 45 days plus, which seems awfully long.

Semi agree, I think longer KS creates a bit more of a middle dead zone since people think "hmm +45 days? I guess I'll pledge later" unless theres tantalizing stretch goals/tons of extra add ons

Warzone was a bit like that, though is now picking up some speed. GoA was also quite long (2 months methinks?)

At Game Salute they were toying with the idea of short kickstarters ... 2-3 weeks. The idea being there's less middle-drag and pretty much everyone who's going to back the project is going to know about it within the first week anyway, most just sit on the fence and wait till the end to see what the bonus stuff is... which kinda sucks because if they pledged early there'd be even more bonus stuff sooner...

I think 30 days works very well in terms of generating excitement while avoiding drag and "negative momentum".

You know, IF the campaign is set up correctly, has clear deliverables, good stretch goals,etc.

CMON tried a short project (I think) with Cadwallon, but seem to have come back to the 30 days or so for Zombicide 2 so for them the shorter scale campaigns advantages did not outweigh it's disadvantages

but I certainly agree that anything over 30 days does seem excessive, especially now that (in the mini/games catagory) many people pile in day 1. More time is just more time for them to drift away

 OrlandotheTechnicoloured wrote:


but I certainly agree that anything over 30 days does seem excessive, especially now that (in the mini/games catagory) many people pile in day 1. More time is just more time for them to drift away

And more time for newer KS/competition to pop up too

 kenshin620 wrote:

 OrlandotheTechnicoloured wrote:


but I certainly agree that anything over 30 days does seem excessive, especially now that (in the mini/games catagory) many people pile in day 1. More time is just more time for them to drift away

And more time for newer KS/competition to pop up too

In a perverse sort of way, it's almost vindicating GW's "secret-release" policy. The time to get into people's wallets after the first "ohhhh shiny" moment is perilously short.

The longer period for campaigns does allow for a small company the luxury of more time for their material to travel by osmosis into the world.

The virtue of a small campaign would seem best suited to a big company that only really wants to gauge interest in a particular offering. For example, suppose Privateer Press wanted to do a Kickstarter to fund resculpting some of their old infantry sculpts: they have the outreach to get a huge initial rush, and don't need to offer stretch goals, since they aren't trying to get a line off the ground. For them a quick, say 2 week campaign, would be perfect.

By contrast, a campaign like Thon or Soda Pop or Dreamforge Games, the longer it goes, the more people hear of it (theoretically), the more of the game can be realized.

This campaign is really quite puzzling, it really looked like it had everything that it would need on the product end...

I think it was less a validation of GW's puzzling "marketing" strategies and more a case of scale, a confusing KS start page and 'projected' retail pricing that scared many people off.