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MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 01:37:58


Post by: gothmog


Are the MODS here merely shills for this or that KS?

This place used to be special. Now it seems like one big promotion for the next KS. Seems like a conflict of interest for mods to be shilling for a KS, much less posting a KS link and then shilling for it.

Maybe I've been away for too long, but it seems to me that things have changed.


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 01:39:05


Post by: cincydooley


What the feth are you talking about?

Are mods not allowed to back a Kickstarter for some reason?


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 01:39:32


Post by: Azreal13


Codswallop


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 01:39:56


Post by: Cyporiean


Yes, I personally line the pockets of at least 3 mods here to promote my Kickstarters.


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 01:40:43


Post by: gothmog


Are MODS salespeople or impartial moderators of a forum?


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 01:41:05


Post by: -Loki-


 gothmog wrote:
Seems like a conflict of interest for mods to be shilling for a KS


How, at all, is it a conflict of interest? This is a generic, self funded wargaming website unaffiliated with any commercial product. All it has is a 40k slant because the majority of posters play 40k.


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 01:42:35


Post by: Tanakosyke22


I can see this thread going rather well.


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 01:43:00


Post by: -Loki-


 gothmog wrote:
Are MODS salespeople or impartial moderators of a forum?


I'd say they're impartial moderators of a wargaming forum. Thus they have the same wargaming interests as other posters. As long as they're not breaking rules - and posting informative threads is not against the rules - there's nothing at all wrong.


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 01:45:32


Post by: cincydooley


 gothmog wrote:
Are MODS salespeople or impartial moderators of a forum?


They're not trying to sell anything to anyone.

The majority of the KS threads are started by non-mods.

Are you trying to say that because they're mods they can't back a ks or like any miniatures on the miniature site in which they merely moderate?

If so, that's one of the more ridiculous claims I've read in a while.


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 01:46:28


Post by: RiTides


Well so much for the "mods are great" thread that got locked up last week

If any mod talks about a Kickstarter, they're doing so like any other poster, not on behalf the site. I've made threads for companies as well as Kickstarter campaigns for models I like... but it's "I", not Dakka!

Companies have always been encouraged to post here and engage with the community, but Kickstarter does seem to have accelerated that a bit. Not sure it's really a "mod issue", but more crowd funding becoming a really large part of wargaming the last two years, and thus generating a lot of discussion on Dakka.


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 01:49:42


Post by: gothmog


 Tanakosyke22 wrote:
I can see this thread going rather well.


I'm really not trying to start anything. Just made an observation. I've been away from the forum for a while and, having returned, it looks to me like a lot of MODS are actively pushing various KS projects. Seems like a conflict to me, unless they are investors, in which case it is definitely a conflict.


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 01:50:42


Post by: cincydooley


The problem is that you don't seem to understand what constitutes a "conflict of interests".


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 01:51:43


Post by: Alpharius


You're not trying to start anything?

The title of this thread seems to ...suggest otherwise.

Anyway, RiTides did a pretty good job of summing everything up.

I'm still wondering what the 'conflict' is that you're seeing here.


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 01:53:27


Post by: RiTides


I like blood angels too, is that a conflict?

Genuinely wondering what you see the distinction as here. I definitely think the role of crowdfunding is worth discussing... right now, it has a green light on Dakka, but that means we discuss it just like we would any company's offerings.



MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 01:53:34


Post by: gothmog


 cincydooley wrote:
The problem is that you don't seem to understand what constitutes a "conflict of interests".


Maybe not. Why don't you explain it to me.


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 01:54:56


Post by: Azreal13


 gothmog wrote:
 cincydooley wrote:
The problem is that you don't seem to understand what constitutes a "conflict of interests".


Maybe not. Why don't you explain it to me.


Well, basically, it boils down to a situation when two or more of your interests conflict....

EDIT

But seriously, you've got like 70 posts in 5 years. You say "while you've been away" I'd argue you were never really here. I think perhaps you've not fully grasped how important KS has become to wargaming.


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 01:55:35


Post by: Surtur


The mods don't need to be shills to us. After you sign up they beat you up, take your lunch money and fund kickstarters with it.


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 01:57:10


Post by: gothmog


OK, I hit a nerve. I could have used more tact in this post. I still say that being a MOD should carry a certain amount of impartiality.


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 01:57:51


Post by: Azreal13


WHY?!!!!

They're not paid!!!

Dakka is not a democracy, you are here at the sufferance of Yakface and his nominated representatives.

While it may sound trite, if you don't like that, there's other forums.


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 01:58:40


Post by: cincydooley


 gothmog wrote:
OK, I hit a nerve. I could have used more tact in this post. I still say that being a MOD should carry a certain amount of impartiality.


When it comes to conflict resolution and fairness in how they moderate. Not in what kickstarters they back.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 azreal13 wrote:
WHY?!!!!

They're not paid!!!


And this.


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 01:59:52


Post by: gothmog


 Surtur wrote:
The mods don't need to be shills to us. After you sign up they beat you up, take your lunch money and fund kickstarters with it.


So what? Just because I haven't jumped in every thread doesn't mean I haven't been paying attention.


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 02:00:05


Post by: Alpharius


I think "gothmog" is also confusing "DCM" with "MOD" as well...


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 02:00:53


Post by: Azreal13


 gothmog wrote:
 Surtur wrote:
The mods don't need to be shills to us. After you sign up they beat you up, take your lunch money and fund kickstarters with it.


So what? Just because I haven't jumped in every thread doesn't mean I haven't been paying attention.


Well, assuming you're responding to my post while quoting another, I'd say "not paying attention" is definitely a viable theory.


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 02:02:36


Post by: Krinsath


 gothmog wrote:
 cincydooley wrote:
The problem is that you don't seem to understand what constitutes a "conflict of interests".


Maybe not. Why don't you explain it to me.


A conflict of interest is when they are receiving a monetary benefit and thereby distort facts to promote a given product. To my knowledge, most mods are paying INTO KS projects, which is pretty much the exact opposite. Do they promote projects they like by posting to their threads? Sure, just like literally every other poster on the boards who posts both good and bad. Also, if they were also closing threads or deleting posts that were negative or closing off other non-KS discussion, that too could be a conflict of interest but I have yet to see a shred of evidence any of that is occurring.

Since none of those things appear to be going on, I'm going to have to agree with Cincy that you don't really understand what you're saying.


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 02:02:52


Post by: gothmog


 azreal13 wrote:
WHY?!!!!

They're not paid!!!

Dakka is not a democracy, you are here at the sufferance of Yakface and his nominated representatives.

While it may sound trite, if you don't like that, there's other forums.


What exactly does "getting paid" have to do with doing the right thing? But thanks for telling me to leave if I don't like the way you play your game.


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 02:03:49


Post by: Sean_OBrien


 Alpharius wrote:
I think "gothmog" is also confusing "DCM" with "MOD" as well...


Quite so...

Just looked back through his post history, and it seems to be as much:

http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/593167.page

In that thread, he starts the rant...even without a single MOD posting in it...at least till you did, which was after him...


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 02:04:40


Post by: insaniak


 gothmog wrote:
OK, I hit a nerve. I could have used more tact in this post. I still say that being a MOD should carry a certain amount of impartiality.

Impartiality towards members of the forum, in so far as we have to deal with forum-related issues, yes, certainly.

Our opinions towards the various gaming-related companies out there are entirely our own, though. I don't have to pretend to like every company equally just because I am a moderator on a forum discussing wargaming. That's an absurd idea.



Automatically Appended Next Post:
 gothmog wrote:
Are MODS salespeople or impartial moderators of a forum?

What makes you think that we need to be one or the other?

However, supporting a Kickstarter doesn't make someone a salesperson, any more than sharing news or rumours of any other miniature-related goings-on. We're not here to be impartial bastions of truth. We're a bunch of hobbyists who, in our spare time, keep this forum running in a more or less orderly fashion.




MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 02:06:04


Post by: Azreal13


Not what I said.

I said if you don't like the way Dakka, a privately owned website, is run, you have other choices.

Generally speaking, most "conflicts of interest" arise from somebody promoting something or modifying their behaviour for money or gratuities. That the Mods aren't paid is a fairly significant factor in them not having a conflict of interests about anything.


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 02:06:30


Post by: Alpharius


 Sean_OBrien wrote:
 Alpharius wrote:
I think "gothmog" is also confusing "DCM" with "MOD" as well...


Quite so...

Just looked back through his post history, and it seems to be as much:

http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/593167.page

In that thread, he starts the rant...even without a single MOD posting in it...at least till you did, which was after him...


Exactly!

Also, that would explain some of this - but it wouldn't explain, justify, or excuse spamming the forum with this.

I'd suggest he contact the owners of Dakka Dakka if he feels any Moderator on this site has done anything 'wrong'.


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 02:07:11


Post by: Sean_OBrien


To the point though, unless someone is somehow being pressured to back a KS campaign, I don't really see an issue. With that in mind - even given the vast powers of a forum moderator...I am pretty sure I can quite easily resist any form of pressure they might exert.

If it is simply a matter of liking or not liking a product...color me perplexed. Outside of their duties of herding the cats - moderators are normal forum members with normal opinions. Some like certain campaigns, some don't.


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 02:07:52


Post by: timetowaste85


Well...this thread is going wonderful places. It's ridiculous. Best word I can use and not get a warning, but there are far more appropriate choices...


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 02:09:17


Post by: Azreal13


Yeah, funny how my concern for the Mods enforcing rule #1 and taking away posting privileges is having a significant impact on my choice of language!


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 02:09:33


Post by: Medium of Death


I think it's time for a bane... or a at least thread of bane...

Seriously though probably should lock this thread up and cast it to the depths...

That way you can get back to shilling for KS... I kid, I kid!


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 02:09:42


Post by: Azreal13


Perhaps if I bung them a few quid.....


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 02:10:08


Post by: -Loki-


 gothmog wrote:
OK, I hit a nerve. I could have used more tact in this post. I still say that being a MOD should carry a certain amount of impartiality.


They are impartial. All they are doing is posting something that interests them and interacting with the community. Becoming a mod doesn't mean you immediately become a robot that has no interests outside of the edit, delete and ban buttons.

It would become a conflict of interests if they were financially invested in the kickstarter outside of simply being a backer, and were using their mod privileges to remove or edit negative feedback. So far, this has not happened.


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 02:11:18


Post by: jonolikespie


 gothmog wrote:
 azreal13 wrote:
WHY?!!!!

They're not paid!!!

Dakka is not a democracy, you are here at the sufferance of Yakface and his nominated representatives.

While it may sound trite, if you don't like that, there's other forums.


What exactly does "getting paid" have to do with doing the right thing? But thanks for telling me to leave if I don't like the way you play your game.

How do you believe they aren't doing the 'right thing'?
Is backing and talking about kickstarters somehow immoral?
Do you believe they are deleting comments in those KS threads they don't agree with?
Do you think they are being told/bribed to promote KSs?
Are you somehow under the impression that Dakka is affiliated with any 1 model company and shouldn't be talking about others?


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 02:18:03


Post by: Kid_Kyoto


 RiTides wrote:
Well so much for the "mods are great" thread that got locked up last week

If any mod talks about a Kickstarter, they're doing so like any other poster, not on behalf the site. I've made threads for companies as well as Kickstarter campaigns for models I like... but it's "I", not Dakka!

Companies have always been encouraged to post here and engage with the community, but Kickstarter does seem to have accelerated that a bit. Not sure it's really a "mod issue", but more crowd funding becoming a really large part of wargaming the last two years, and thus generating a lot of discussion on Dakka.


@#$% Ritides he's on to us! I knew I shouldn't have gotten that Lambregini with my KS slush money...


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 02:21:06


Post by: gothmog


 Alpharius wrote:
 Sean_OBrien wrote:
 Alpharius wrote:
I think "gothmog" is also confusing "DCM" with "MOD" as well...


Quite so...

Just looked back through his post history, and it seems to be as much:

http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/593167.page

In that thread, he starts the rant...even without a single MOD posting in it...at least till you did, which was after him...


Exactly!

Also, that would explain some of this - but it wouldn't explain, justify, or excuse spamming the forum with this.

I'd suggest he contact the owners of Dakka Dakka if he feels any Moderator on this site has done anything 'wrong'.


Yeah, I admit that I was lumping DCMs and MODs in the same boat. Still, both of them carry weight on this forum.


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 02:22:25


Post by: insaniak


 gothmog wrote:

Yeah, I admit that I was lumping DCMs and MODs in the same boat. Still, both of them carry weight on this forum.

No more so than any other prominent user.

You still haven't explained why you think this is actually a problem.


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 02:22:59


Post by: Azreal13


No, they don't.

Well, can't speak for you, but personally, I decide if I think someone is a moron or not completely independently of little abbreviations under their user name.


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 02:27:53


Post by: jonolikespie


I carry more weight as a DCM?

Dammit I wish someone told me that months ago.
NON DCM PEASANTS, BRING ME WINE!


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 02:28:24


Post by: Blacksails


Pfft, how little you all know.

My DCM status makes me important than all other non-DCM users.

It is known.


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 02:29:18


Post by: Azreal13


 jonolikespie wrote:
I carry more weight as a DCM?

Dammit I wish someone told me that months ago.
NON DCM PEASANTS, BRING ME WINE!


Go feth yourself.



MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 02:30:00


Post by: gothmog


 insaniak wrote:
 gothmog wrote:

Yeah, I admit that I was lumping DCMs and MODs in the same boat. Still, both of them carry weight on this forum.

No more so than any other prominent user.

You still haven't explained why you think this is actually a problem.


I think it is a problem because when a MOD advoctes a KS, they carry more weight that some Joe doing the same thing. It is like an agent of the FTC telling people which stocks he likes, thereby advocating a certain purchase, instead of moderating (regulating) the exchange.


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 02:30:26


Post by: Alfndrate


 jonolikespie wrote:
I carry more weight as a DCM?

Dammit I wish someone told me that months ago.
NON DCM PEASANTS, BRING ME WINE!

No, you spend all your time bringing Manchu cheese-its, and Alpharius the latest episodes of Adventure Time.

it's rough living in the DCM forums. I escaped


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 02:30:38


Post by: Blacksails


 gothmog wrote:


I think it is a problem because when a MOD advoctes a KS, they carry more weight that some Joe doing the same thing.


This is news to me.


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 02:31:37


Post by: Alfndrate


 gothmog wrote:
 insaniak wrote:
 gothmog wrote:

Yeah, I admit that I was lumping DCMs and MODs in the same boat. Still, both of them carry weight on this forum.

No more so than any other prominent user.

You still haven't explained why you think this is actually a problem.


I think it is a problem because when a MOD advoctes a KS, they carry more weight that some Joe doing the same thing. It is like an agent of the FTC telling people which stocks he likes, thereby advocating a certain purchase, instead of moderating (regulating) the exchange.

Except that they don't. If I backed every KS that RiTides and Alpharius backed, I'd be a poor poor man. In fact often times I don't have the same tastes in KS as Alpharius. So no, their [MOD] tags offer no such bearing.


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 02:33:39


Post by: motyak


This is a hell of a different tone to the last 'Mod' thread...


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 02:35:24


Post by: insaniak


 gothmog wrote:
I think it is a problem because when a MOD advoctes a KS, they carry more weight that some Joe doing the same thing.

Two things.

1 - No they don't.
and
2 - So what if we do?

You seem to have some odd, twisted idea of just what DakkaDakka is. What this site is, is a venue for discussion. That's all. If you and a bunch of guys get together at somebody's house, and the owner of that house says that he likes a particular company and everyone should check out their minis, is [i]that/i] a conflict of interest? Or is it just some guy sharing an opinion, who just happens to also be the owner of the place you're currently standing in?


It is like an agent of the FTC telling people which stocks he likes, thereby advocating a certain purchase, instead of moderating (regulating) the exchange.

No, it is nothing at all even remotely like that.


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 02:37:20


Post by: gothmog


 motyak wrote:
This is a hell of a different tone to the last 'Mod' thread...


I assure you this is not a "call-out" thread. Just an observation (AKA "opinion").


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 02:40:55


Post by: Bookwrack


Just because it's an opinion doesn't mean it's not stupid as hell with no relation to reality.


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 02:41:08


Post by: darefsky (Flight Medic Paints)


 gothmog wrote:
 Alpharius wrote:
 Sean_OBrien wrote:
 Alpharius wrote:
I think "gothmog" is also confusing "DCM" with "MOD" as well...


Quite so...

Just looked back through his post history, and it seems to be as much:

http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/593167.page

In that thread, he starts the rant...even without a single MOD posting in it...at least till you did, which was after him...


Exactly!

Also, that would explain some of this - but it wouldn't explain, justify, or excuse spamming the forum with this.

I'd suggest he contact the owners of Dakka Dakka if he feels any Moderator on this site has done anything 'wrong'.


Yeah, I admit that I was lumping DCMs and MODs in the same boat. Still, both of them carry weight on this forum.



That's a big fat crock of junk right there. I am a DCM because I support dakka dakka and I chose to show my support monetarily. I don't have any more weight/influence on this website then anyone else. To suggest otherwise is laughable and smells of envy or a bone to grind. If it's envy I'm inclined to believe you have been sorely misinformed about what benifits you get for being a DCM. I would recommend you hit the button and read what it includes.

As to the MODS on this here website, they are some if the best around, they are fair and they enforce the standards equally. Heck I have even gotten a warming for going a bit to far before.

I'd suggest taking a step back and looking at what you are really angry about, because what your suggesting is illogical at best and ill informed at the least.


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 02:42:28


Post by: gunslingerpro


Wait, did I miss the day they handed out DCM influence powers?

Guuuyyyyysss, why didn't anyone tell me I got powers with my DCM status?


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 02:43:57


Post by: gothmog


 insaniak wrote:
 gothmog wrote:
I think it is a problem because when a MOD advoctes a KS, they carry more weight that some Joe doing the same thing.

Two things.

1 - No they don't.
and
2 - So what if we do?

You seem to have some odd, twisted idea of just what DakkaDakka is. What this site is, is a venue for discussion. That's all. If you and a bunch of guys get together at somebody's house, and the owner of that house says that he likes a particular company and everyone should check out their minis, is [i]that/i] a conflict of interest? Or is it just some guy sharing an opinion, who just happens to also be the owner of the place you're currently standing in?


It is like an agent of the FTC telling people which stocks he likes, thereby advocating a certain purchase, instead of moderating (regulating) the exchange.

No, it is nothing at all even remotely like that.


No, I get it.

Not calling anyone out. Just discussing my opinion.

I think it is poor taste for MODS to be promoting KS or anything else while logged in as a MOD. Whether you like it or not, a MOD's opinion alters the discourse more than regular members.


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 02:44:26


Post by: poda_t


Do you pay to use this site? No? Shut your can. I've paid $100 to support the site so far. I have no complaint with what goes on here. What support have you offered?


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 02:45:22


Post by: Blacksails


 gothmog wrote:
Whether you like it or not, a MOD's opinion alters the discourse more than regular members.


For you, maybe.

Frankly, an opinion should be judged on the merits of its contents, not by who said it.

Especially with something as arbitrary as being a mod on a wargaming forum.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 poda_t wrote:
Do you pay to use this site? No? Shut your can. I've paid $100 to support the site so far. I have no complaint with what goes on here. What support have you offered?


Preach brotha!


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 02:46:21


Post by: gothmog


 Bookwrack wrote:
Just because it's an opinion doesn't mean it's not stupid as hell with no relation to reality.


You so eloquently prove my point. Thank you!


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 02:47:34


Post by: Alfndrate


 gothmog wrote:
No, I get it.

Not calling anyone out. Just discussing my opinion.

I think it is poor taste for MODS to be promoting KS or anything else while logged in as a MOD. Whether you like it or not, a MOD's opinion alters the discourse more than regular members.


Things of Note:
1) No one is allowed to have more than 1 account on Dakka. so Mods cannot log in as an alt account without having that account banned and taking a little break from Dakka
2) The only time anyone alters their opinions is when a mod busts out the "mod voice" generally denoted by Red text. Otherwise, they're just like us.
3) Speaking of being just like us, Mods give up their valuable free time to moderate the site. They don't get paid, they get access to a few extra forums, and the thankless task of moderating one of the largest wargaming sites on the internet.


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 02:49:27


Post by: gunslingerpro


 gothmog wrote:
No, I get it.

Not calling anyone out. Just discussing my opinion.

I think it is poor taste for MODS to be promoting KS or anything else while logged in as a MOD. Whether you like it or not, a MOD's opinion alters the discourse more than regular members.


So even if they alter it, why does that matter? Unless they are the creator of the Kickstarter, they see not tangible benefit (other than the kickstarter successfully funding). Are you worried they are drawing attention away from the game system you are partial to?


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 02:51:13


Post by: Bookwrack


 gothmog wrote:
Whether you like it or not, a MOD's opinion alters the discourse more than regular members.

Nope, wrong again. You REALLY need to work on that whole critical thinking thing.

The problem just seems to be that given your join date and low post count, you've never spent much time, or paid much attention to what's actually being posted in the forum. So whenever you were last looking around was before the current growth of kickstarter, and it only seems to you like suddenly, kickstarter threads are everywhere... because there are a lot of war-gaming kickstarter projects that people are all fired up about.

It's not rocket science. People are enthusiastic about projects, they talk about projects.

Your other major failure is the bizarre assumption that moderation on a war-gaming sight don't actually get to participate in the war-gaming hobby... not sure how you managed to dream that one up.


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 02:51:43


Post by: gothmog


 poda_t wrote:
Do you pay to use this site? No? Shut your can. I've paid $100 to support the site so far. I have no complaint with what goes on here. What support have you offered?


If you pay another $100, you unlock the "get-some-class" option.


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 02:52:18


Post by: Jimsolo


 gothmog wrote:


I think it is a problem because when a MOD advoctes a KS, they carry more weight that some Joe doing the same thing.


Nope. Not even remotely.

I've even got into heated arguments with mods over the Kickstarters they (seemed) to support, and they didn't use any of their vast moderator-superpowers to take vengeance on me, even when they thought I was smoking crack. If you could cite some kind of example of mods abusing their ability to censor/delete posts or to lock threads in order to quash dissent of a KS, or of a mod preventing someone from giving the community accurate information that might prevent investment in a mod-supported KS, you might have a case.

But simply supporting a KS hardly makes them a 'shill.'

The role of Dakka is to provide a place for people to communicate openly, peacefully, and intelligently about the wargaming hobby. Moderators are simply users that have been selected to help keep that process going, usually by maintaining the 'peacefully' and 'intelligently' portions of the equation. They are still allowed to have opinions, though. If someone starts a thread on 'What GW did wrong this week!' and a mod weighs in (pro- or anti-GW, doesn't matter), that doesn't make him a 'shill' for Games Workshop (or their competitors, as the case may be).

If anything, the mods' consistent exposure to the wargaming hobby seems to make many of them jaded and cynical. I think the opinion of a mod on a KS carries less weight than a normal person, especially if it's a negative one.

"Oh, insaniak thinks this mohawk-festooned-drug-crazed-gangbanger Kickstarter is played out and boring. Well, he might have seen this crap a hundred times, but I've never seen it before...I'll back that sucker."*




*Nothing personal, insaniak. Just an example.


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 02:52:47


Post by: Bookwrack


 gothmog wrote:
 poda_t wrote:
Do you pay to use this site? No? Shut your can. I've paid $100 to support the site so far. I have no complaint with what goes on here. What support have you offered?


If you pay another $100, you unlock the "get-some-class" option.

So we should start you a kick-starter so you can finally get some of that?


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 02:53:33


Post by: Sean_OBrien


 gothmog wrote:
Whether you like it or not, a MOD's opinion alters the discourse more than regular members.


I think you are greatly overestimating the power a moderator wields to win friends and influence people.

Heck, even mod warnings often do not result in discourse being altered by regular members (as evidenced by a plethora of locked threads).


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 02:53:59


Post by: Krinsath


 gothmog wrote:


I think it is poor taste for MODS to be promoting KS or anything else while logged in as a MOD. Whether you like it or not, a MOD's opinion alters the discourse more than regular members.


Yeah, they really don't. If Alpharius said something about a project I might listen more simply because I know from previous interactions that our tastes are roughly aligned. If insaniak or kid_kyoto or even yakface said something I wouldn't really care not because I think they're doing anything shady but I simply don't know them that well. I'd rate Azazelx's opinion higher than pretty much all of the mods because, again, our interests have shown to largely align. Has nothing to so with a MOD or DCM tag and everything to do with *who those people are as people*.

Hell, scarletsquig convinced me to drop 4 figures on DeadZone (and all I got was this t-shirt!) and he isn't even a DCM. He is, however, very helpful and insightful, and that will always trump the letters that appear under someone's name.


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 02:55:49


Post by: Absolutionis


I've always been a fan of the mods on this site that speak and discuss topics as equals rather than with any air of authority.

Of course, there is the occasional mod-text.


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 02:55:55


Post by: insaniak


 gothmog wrote:
I think it is poor taste for MODS to be promoting KS or anything else while logged in as a MOD

Yes, but you appear to think that because you think this site is something it is not.



Whether you like it or not, a MOD's opinion alters the discourse more than regular members.

Only if you let it.

I've had plenty of people disagree with my opinions over the time I have been a Mod. Unless it is something actually related to moderating this site, nobody is in any way obliged to treat my opinion as being worth any more than anyone else's. If I'm posting that I like something, it's because I like it. Being a moderator has no bearing on that... and other posters are free to agree or disagree as they see fit.

And, really, I'm still not seeing just what you're perceiving as a problem. If I post that I support a particular Kickstarter, and people choose to (for some bizarre reason) assume that the [MOD] under my username means that they should therefore check out that same kickstarter, they're still not going to automatically support that Kickstarter just because I did. At most (again, assuming you're correct and my position gives my opinion more weight), my posting might get a few more people to look at the Kickstarter who might not have otherwise. And that is a problem... why... exactly?


I should also point out that there is no 'logged in as a MOD'. Or rather, we're always logged in as a MOD. But when not actively engaged in moderating, we're just regular posters sharing our hobby, like everyone else here.


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 02:58:52


Post by: cincydooley


 gothmog wrote:



I think it is poor taste for MODS to be promoting KS or anything else while logged in as a MOD. Whether you like it or not, a MOD's opinion alters the discourse more than regular members.


No, it doesn't.

I've been banned MULTIPLE times in the past 6 months.

I've never changed the content I say or what I think simply because a mod thinks differently. I've merely become more tactful at it.

In fact, that use of tact (and a liberal use of th backspace key) are preventing me from getting banned in this thread.

You're way off base here, and you seem to have no real understanding of the "points" you're trying to make. Making the dakka dakka forum mods analogous to inside traders was particularly hilarious though. So thanks for that little gem.


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 02:59:00


Post by: gothmog


 Bookwrack wrote:
 gothmog wrote:
 poda_t wrote:
Do you pay to use this site? No? Shut your can. I've paid $100 to support the site so far. I have no complaint with what goes on here. What support have you offered?


If you pay another $100, you unlock the "get-some-class" option.

So we should start you a kick-starter so you can finally get some of that?


What? WoW! You really got me there.


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 02:59:59


Post by: timetowaste85


Normally I would think we should lock this...but can we just exterminate the thread? This is idiocy of the highest order.


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 03:01:47


Post by: insaniak


 Jimsolo wrote:
Nothing personal, insaniak. Just an example.

No problem. See you in a week.


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 03:02:39


Post by: Blacksails


 insaniak wrote:
 Jimsolo wrote:
Nothing personal, insaniak. Just an example.

No problem. See you in a week.


Awesome.


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 03:02:44


Post by: Snrub


 insaniak wrote:
 Jimsolo wrote:
Nothing personal, insaniak. Just an example.

No problem. See you in a week.
#rekt


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 03:03:13


Post by: gunslingerpro


 gothmog wrote:
 Bookwrack wrote:
 gothmog wrote:
 poda_t wrote:
Do you pay to use this site? No? Shut your can. I've paid $100 to support the site so far. I have no complaint with what goes on here. What support have you offered?


If you pay another $100, you unlock the "get-some-class" option.

So we should start you a kick-starter so you can finally get some of that?


What? WoW! You really got me there.


The fact that you've only started responded to the insults instead of the well reasoned and balanced statements in this thread shows me it wasn't about getting your opinion out there, but actively creating issues and frustration, i.e. trolling.


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 03:04:57


Post by: RiTides


I can see how confusing the DCM and Mod tags could've made this a bigger misunderstanding than it already was. But I think the point is, people can have opinions on whatever they like here, and a mod or anyone saying they like a certain company isn't a conflict- it's the point of a forum!


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 03:05:33


Post by: Accolade


I used to be a DCM. Then I saw through the sham, the money and the drugs, and the secret Fight Clubs the Mods operate. I knew then that it was time to leave.

That...or I maybe...forgot to, uh, make the next year's payment


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 03:06:47


Post by: TheAuldGrump


 jonolikespie wrote:
I carry more weight as a DCM?

Dammit I wish someone told me that months ago.
NON DCM PEASANTS, BRING ME WINE!
*Whiiinnne!*Do I haaave tooo? I dooo'nnnt waaannnaa! *Whiiinnne*

The Auld Grump


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 03:07:13


Post by: gothmog


 insaniak wrote:
 gothmog wrote:
I think it is poor taste for MODS to be promoting KS or anything else while logged in as a MOD

Yes, but you appear to think that because you think this site is something it is not.



Whether you like it or not, a MOD's opinion alters the discourse more than regular members.

Only if you let it.

I've had plenty of people disagree with my opinions over the time I have been a Mod. Unless it is something actually related to moderating this site, nobody is in any way obliged to treat my opinion as being worth any more than anyone else's. If I'm posting that I like something, it's because I like it. Being a moderator has no bearing on that... and other posters are free to agree or disagree as they see fit.

And, really, I'm still not seeing just what you're perceiving as a problem. If I post that I support a particular Kickstarter, and people choose to (for some bizarre reason) assume that the [MOD] under my username means that they should therefore check out that same kickstarter, they're still not going to automatically support that Kickstarter just because I did. At most (again, assuming you're correct and my position gives my opinion more weight), my posting might get a few more people to look at the Kickstarter who might not have otherwise. And that is a problem... why... exactly?


I should also point out that there is no 'logged in as a MOD'. Or rather, we're always logged in as a MOD. But when not actively engaged in moderating, we're just regular posters sharing our hobby, like everyone else here.


Yeah, with all due respect, disagreeing about a model or a certain army build is a lot different than advocating investing in a KS. That's all I'm saying. But I see that I didn't approach this the right way. So be it. At least you guys proved that this is a forum of free discussion. Except for the "I pay money so I can talk, but you can't because you don't, so go away" guy. He paid a $100 to prove my point.


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 03:08:07


Post by: Manchu


 Cyporiean wrote:
Yes, I personally line the pockets of at least 3 mods here to promote my Kickstarters.
How do I get a piece of this action???


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 03:09:44


Post by: gothmog


 gunslingerpro wrote:
 gothmog wrote:
 Bookwrack wrote:
 gothmog wrote:
 poda_t wrote:
Do you pay to use this site? No? Shut your can. I've paid $100 to support the site so far. I have no complaint with what goes on here. What support have you offered?


If you pay another $100, you unlock the "get-some-class" option.

So we should start you a kick-starter so you can finally get some of that?


What? WoW! You really got me there.


The fact that you've only started responded to the insults instead of the well reasoned and balanced statements in this thread shows me it wasn't about getting your opinion out there, but actively creating issues and frustration, i.e. trolling.


Yeah, hey, pot, meet the kettle.


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 03:10:12


Post by: Bookwrack


 gothmog wrote:
But I see that I didn't approach this the right way.

You called board members 'shills' in the title.

It took you three pages to figure out that was the wrong way to do things?












MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 03:10:48


Post by: Cyporiean


 Manchu wrote:
 Cyporiean wrote:
Yes, I personally line the pockets of at least 3 mods here to promote my Kickstarters.
How do I get a piece of this action???


Step 1) Back my Kickstarter.
Step 2) Shill it.
Step 3) ????
Step 4) Profit!


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 03:11:05


Post by: RatBot


 gothmog wrote:
 insaniak wrote:
 gothmog wrote:
I think it is poor taste for MODS to be promoting KS or anything else while logged in as a MOD

Yes, but you appear to think that because you think this site is something it is not.



Whether you like it or not, a MOD's opinion alters the discourse more than regular members.

Only if you let it.

I've had plenty of people disagree with my opinions over the time I have been a Mod. Unless it is something actually related to moderating this site, nobody is in any way obliged to treat my opinion as being worth any more than anyone else's. If I'm posting that I like something, it's because I like it. Being a moderator has no bearing on that... and other posters are free to agree or disagree as they see fit.

And, really, I'm still not seeing just what you're perceiving as a problem. If I post that I support a particular Kickstarter, and people choose to (for some bizarre reason) assume that the [MOD] under my username means that they should therefore check out that same kickstarter, they're still not going to automatically support that Kickstarter just because I did. At most (again, assuming you're correct and my position gives my opinion more weight), my posting might get a few more people to look at the Kickstarter who might not have otherwise. And that is a problem... why... exactly?


I should also point out that there is no 'logged in as a MOD'. Or rather, we're always logged in as a MOD. But when not actively engaged in moderating, we're just regular posters sharing our hobby, like everyone else here.


Yeah, with all due respect, disagreeing about a model or a certain army build is a lot different than advocating investing in a KS. That's all I'm saying. But I see that I didn't approach this the right way. So be it. At least you guys proved that this is a forum of free discussion. Except for the "I pay money so I can talk, but you can't because you don't, so go away" guy. He paid a $100 to prove my point.



Except neither DCMs or mods have any real influence unless you are easily swayed by people with even the tiniest modicum of authority simply by virtue of having that authority. Non-mods post kickstarter threads all the time; in fact, most kickstarter threads are posted by non-mods. A mod saying "Hey, this is pretty neat!" in a Kickstarter thread doesn't influence anyone to support it, unless that person is, as I said, easily influenced by anyone with any semblance of authority, no matter how superficial that authority is. In fact, I haven't even noticed if there's any indication that a mod has posted in a thread without actually opening the thread and stumbling upon the post itself.


In short, yeah, you have your opinion, but it's based on absolutely nothing resembling reality and is a little insane.


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 03:11:40


Post by: insaniak


 gothmog wrote:
Yeah, with all due respect, disagreeing about a model or a certain army build is a lot different than advocating investing in a KS. That's all I'm saying.

Yup. And what you're being told in response is that no, it really isn't.

In all three of those cases, all you're getting is the opinion of one gamer. Whether I tell you I like this model that GW just released, or tell you I like this model that Prodos are currently Kickstarting, you're getting the exact same thing.

Does someone else liking or disliking a model affect whether or not you do? Does who that person is affect that?

It shouldn't.


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 03:12:00


Post by: cincydooley


 gothmog wrote:


Yeah, with all due respect, disagreeing about a model or a certain army build is a lot different than advocating investing in a KS. That's all I'm saying. But I see that I didn't approach this the right way. So be it. At least you guys proved that this is a forum of free discussion. Except for the "I pay money so I can talk, but you can't because you don't, so go away" guy. He paid a $100 to prove my point.


Why? And how?

Because one is a weak willed individual easily influenced by acronyms?


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 03:12:05


Post by: Krinsath


 Manchu wrote:
 Cyporiean wrote:
Yes, I personally line the pockets of at least 3 mods here to promote my Kickstarters.
How do I get a piece of this action???


Well, first you have to use your influence as an Internet forum moderator to convince people to spend money. This is tricky, as the actual power of an Internet forum moderator is somewhere below "drive-thru cashier" and only slightly above "random guy yelling at the voices in his head in the street" but if you want that sweet, sweet shill money you've got to be creative!


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 03:12:05


Post by: darefsky (Flight Medic Paints)


 Accolade wrote:
I used to be a DCM. Then I saw through the sham, the money and the drugs, and the secret Fight Clubs the Mods operate. I knew then that it was time to leave.

That...or I maybe...forgot to, uh, make the next year's payment


You forgotten the first rule of Mod Fight Club........


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 03:13:13


Post by: gothmog


 RiTides wrote:
I can see how confusing the DCM and Mod tags could've made this a bigger misunderstanding than it already was. But I think the point is, people can have opinions on whatever they like here, and a mod or anyone saying they like a certain company isn't a conflict- it's the point of a forum!


Thank you for being a true moderator! I admit that this post was probably not as tactful as it could have been.


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 03:14:44


Post by: cincydooley


 gothmog wrote:
 RiTides wrote:
I can see how confusing the DCM and Mod tags could've made this a bigger misunderstanding than it already was. But I think the point is, people can have opinions on whatever they like here, and a mod or anyone saying they like a certain company isn't a conflict- it's the point of a forum!


Thank you for being a true moderator! I admit that this post was probably not as tactful as it could have been.


The next step is admitting you've made little sense throughout this entire diatribe.

Then you can move forward!

It's like, a 12 step program.


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 03:16:28


Post by: Sinful Hero


When I first joined, I used to also think DCMs and MODs had a little more weight in the community, and influencing other posters. In fact, I had a discussion about something very similar with a moderator a few weeks ago when I became a contributing member about my experience when I first joined. I understand why a newer poster may not know exactly what weight a DCMs or MODs opinion is, but after spending several years here it means whatever you want it to mean. I've personally found that some people can be idiots or geniuses no matter their post count or tag. I became a DCM because I appreciate how the moderators operate this forum, and I wished to support them.

Assuming a Moderator's or "high post count" member's opinion has any more weight to it is entirely your own opinion. There is not a conflict of interest involved, although I understand how one could think that having a MOD tag automatically justifies someone's opinion(After all, they're competent enough to be chosen to be a moderator), but that's entirely a subjective view.

Any poster can disagree or agree with any moderator or contributing member- this is a discussion forum, and the moderator's job is to also foster discussion here. If a moderator didn't allow a poster to disagree with them about a kickstarter, then there may be a possible conflict of interest.


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 03:18:26


Post by: Tanakosyke22


 Manchu wrote:
 Cyporiean wrote:
Yes, I personally line the pockets of at least 3 mods here to promote my Kickstarters.
How do I get a piece of this action???


First, you must have a seething hatred for the main miniature companies as well as be as hipster as possible.

The second, you must always support zombie kickstarters or Zombie-related Kickstarters, no matter if they are silly or not as they are gold mines for money. Also, you must believe that kickstarters are the way of the future of business

Okay, I made up this nonsense, as I kid and I am being sarcastic late at night.


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 03:18:27


Post by: gothmog


 Bookwrack wrote:
 gothmog wrote:
But I see that I didn't approach this the right way.

You called board members 'shills' in the title.

It took you three pages to figure out that was the wrong way to do things?






Technically, I asked a question in the title.


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 03:19:38


Post by: purplefood


I'm not a shill I'm a cultist!
Incidentally there is no conflict of interest and no one pays more attention to a MOD because they are one. They pay attention to certain people they share interests with, some of those people are MODs.


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 03:20:39


Post by: d-usa


Isn't this why Lego implemented the Exalt function? So the MODs can see who the influential users are so that they can be folded into the Kickstarter promotional team?


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 03:22:58


Post by: Manchu


DCM = KS Promotional Team, I thought?

Gosh, I have to pay more attention at the shill meetings.


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 03:25:27


Post by: Snrub


 purplefood wrote:
Incidentally there is no conflict of interest and no one pays more attention to a MOD because they are one.
Honestly this hold pretty true for me. More often then not I don't "notice" a MOD posting unless they use Red Text. Every poster just blends in together after a while.


But maybe that's just me.


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 03:26:41


Post by: purplefood


 Snrub wrote:
 purplefood wrote:
Incidentally there is no conflict of interest and no one pays more attention to a MOD because they are one.
Honestly this hold pretty true for me. More often then not I don't "notice" a MOD posting unless they use Red Text. Every poster just blends in together after a while.


But maybe that's just me.

Well during the whole Alpharius thing I can think of one MOD you probably had trouble being noticed


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 03:26:49


Post by: Brotherjanus


It pleases me to see so many mods here in this thread. Mainly Insaniak but that's because I love cats.


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 03:28:17


Post by: djphranq


If by Shills you mean 'sexy' and by KS you mean 'reals'... then yes...


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 03:30:09


Post by: -Loki-


 gothmog wrote:
I think it is poor taste for MODS to be promoting KS or anything else while logged in as a MOD. Whether you like it or not, a MOD's opinion alters the discourse more than regular members.


Why stop at kickstarters?

Alpharius runs the Infinity news and rumour thread. He's good at it, he steers conversations back on topic without using his mod voice. He's also fairly vocal about the game, tries to help drum up support, and is probably one of the bigger collectors of the game on this forum (I believe he owns miniatures from every faction).

He is, however, a mod. Should he revoke all right to have interest in the game, stop managing the news thread and generally not show any of the passion he has for the game?

After all, conflict of interest in your opinion. It's not a kick starter, but he could very well, using his mod tag under his name to unfairly gather support for the game that he loves. People will flock to the game, unwittingly swayed by the charismatic mod tag, and funnel all of their money into Corvus Bellis pockets. Not on the strength of the game system, or the quality of the models, or the enthusiastic community support offered by Corvus Belli themselves. No, that honey sweet tone that his mod tag overlays on all of his posts. It's just not fair.

And talk about a conflict of interest! His screen name is Alpharius, and his avatar is (when it's not Scarlett Johanson) an Alpha Legion space marine! He's not even hiding this very obvious immoral stance on a competitors product.

Sorry, no. Moderators are people and wargamers, and they have interests as well. There's nothing wrong with them sharing their interests with any other poster, and their moderator tag bears no actual extra weight to their opinions. If they like something that's bad, that thing they like is still bad whether they're a moderator or not. They just have their own opinion, like you like claiming you are expressing here.

Although Alpharius does carry extra weight because he's awesome.


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 03:30:17


Post by: rahxephon


Im not going to touch on this moderator impartiality that has been going on for a few pages, but with regards to KS being effectively advertised on here I kinda prefer it. I'm always interested in new models/ranges/games etc but I don't tend to go onto KS myself as there's heaps of other stuff I'd have to sift through to find things I'm interested in. Plus in some cases things in the KS like stretchgoals can develop based somewhat off the response they get from forums like this. Quite often people who start those KS also create profiles on here so they can advertise their KS. I dont know exactly how this is regulated, but they seem to stay around whereas those guys selling rolex watch replicas or louis vuitton handbags are kicked pretty quick. If its related to wargaming, it seems to have the go ahead. And that is what I'm here for.

^^haha, I actually wouldn't mind if Alph did that since there would be more people to talk about infinity with. I doubt it would start any more people in NZ playing it... but who knows how far his powers stretch?


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 03:30:41


Post by: cincydooley


Well gothmog. You figured it all out.



MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 03:30:55


Post by: Manchu


 Brotherjanus wrote:
It pleases me to see so many mods here in this thread. Mainly Insaniak but that's because I love cats.
CONFLICT OF INTEREST!

cat shills are the worst

I have the sense, and just bare with me here, that some new Dakka memes could come of this.


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 03:33:11


Post by: gothmog


Goodness! Defensive much?

It's just an opinion. Right or wrong, still an opinion.


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 03:34:14


Post by: insaniak


 -Loki- wrote:
Why stop at kickstarters?

I don't always shill, but when I do, I prefer Kickstarter.


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 03:34:19


Post by: Brotherjanus


 Manchu wrote:
 Brotherjanus wrote:
It pleases me to see so many mods here in this thread. Mainly Insaniak but that's because I love cats.
CONFLICT OF INTEREST!

cat shills are the best

I have the sense, and just bare with me here, that some new Dakka memes could come of this.


I fixed that for you.

Edit: And by doing that I now have a kitty above me! I can leave this thread a happy wargamer.

Edit 2: And a cat below me!


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 03:34:32


Post by: Azazelx


Oh my god. This thread is made of awesome.

Now, Gothmog, as a DCM, I hereby order thee to deposit money into my PayPal account, because reasons. Please note that as a non-DCM and non-mod you have no choice to refuse.
Thanks!


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 03:36:30


Post by: Avatar 720


The only reason anyone will put more stock in a DCM's or MOD's opinion is because of their own - completely true*, by the way - beliefs that we have some sort of superior knowledge or inside information. There is nothing that forces anyone to believe DCM Joe or Moderator Joe over Average Joe, and people should do their own research into their own decisions.

If you have a beef with DCMs and MODs giving their personal opinions, then why do you not have any issues with how established authors recommend books that half of them probably didn't read, or celebrity-branded food, clothing, homeware and cookware? You see myriad adverts about how a certain actor or actress swears by a certain cosmetic item and you don't bat an eyelid, but you see a DCM or MOD on some obscure forum trying to give their opinion on a kickstarter and suddenly they're trying to swindle everyone?

If someone is drawn to things based purely on the status of an individual who backs it opposed to its own merits and their own opinions then it is they who has the issue here, not the individual who backs it.

Maybe next time you see a celebrity endorse something you can accuse them of shilling, hell, it happens often enough that all you'll have to do is watch TV until the adverts come on.

*In case of strategically-broken sarcasm detectors, I feel that I must clarify that this statement was intended to be humorous, and should in no way be taken as meaning that DCM and MODs are superior.

Even if we are.


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 03:36:43


Post by: agnosto


This thread amuses me...,next round's on me in the uber-secret DCM shill-lounge. :-)


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 03:39:07


Post by: MajorTom11


This is one of the more ridiculous topics I have seen in my time... I mean, OF COURSE we're out to get you, and brainwash you into backing everything we back, because we know the absolute awe everyone has for our regal and vaunted positions. Through various shell corporations and hedge funds, we actually own all Kickstarters in the wargaming venue, from which we funnel the profits into high yield short term investments for a period of 6 months to a year before we let the project complete... hence explaining the constant KS delays.

Oh, we are also clever enough to diversely support different kickstarters, never unanimously, to maintain plausible deniability.

We are all in fact bored billionaires seeking to dominate the wargaming fanbase through a myriad of dastardly schemes, with the eventual goal of turning you into a slave force to our yet to be revealed corporate hegemony.

That, or you know, we're volunteers who get squat for our time who were and still are wargamers who happen to like some KS's ourselves from time to time with absolutely no difference from anyone else when it comes to that?

Nah, that would be too crazy. Definitely, we're out to get you and this is the first step to destroying western civilization to be replace with the Tyranny of Dakka.


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 03:39:12


Post by: timetowaste85


 gothmog wrote:
Goodness! Defensive much?

I'm just a troll. Right or wrong, still an opinion.


Fixed that for you.


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 03:39:19


Post by: gothmog


 Azazelx wrote:
Oh my god. This thread is made of awesome.

Now, Gothmog, as a DCM, I hereby order thee to deposit money into my PayPal account, because reasons. Please note that as a non-DCM and non-mod you have no choice to refuse.
Thanks!


Just a word of friendly advice: You are not nearly as funny or original as you think you are.


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 03:39:37


Post by: decker_cky


gothmog - you keep saying this isn't a call out, but it's pretty much a call-out or trolling. Show some - any example of some biased moderation, or you're just being inflammatory.

For the record, I barely used dakka until Warseer buried Kickstarters where they were guaranteed not to get any participation. It's this website's open acceptance and encouragement of discussion of kickstarters that has me as an active member here. Mods probably carry weight only because those who are invited to be mods tend to have their heads set squarely on their shoulders, so make rational and persuasive arguments. I appreciate the fact that the mods have that discussion, and anyone else who contributes to ensure there's lively discussion about kickstarters on this site. If there wasn't that discussion, why would anyone look at any kickstarter content in the rumours here?


MODS are Shills for KS here? @ 2014/05/13 03:39:40


Post by: insaniak


 gothmog wrote:
Goodness! Defensive much?

It's just an opinion. Right or wrong, still an opinion.

Yes, it's a little weird how when you start a thread that questions the integrity of a whole bunch of people based on nothing more than a misunderstanding of what those people's role is within the forum, that some of those on the forums might take it a little amiss.

People are funny like that.


So, on that note, I think that we've about exhausted the productive discussion here. We've laughed, we've cried, but it's time to lock this thread down and suspend everybody who didn't support the Kingdom Death Kickstarter.