http://www.belloflostsouls.net/2018/03/40k-rumors-a-mighty-waaagh-is-coming.html

Not sure if this has already been posted, but if it turns out to be true then I'm super pumped!

It's been in the rumor mill for a couple months. Long enough ago that people seem to have forgotten it was there. I think its pretty obviously more than a rumor.

Also, if you check the Adepticon announcements article on the community page, you'll see a blurry picture of White Dwarf with a battle that contains some previously unseen Ork models.

It is a very well established rumour that more Ork kits are coming which are backed up by the rumour engine of the orky looking wheel. The only question is when the new stuff will come. The rumours have all pointed at either summer or winter.

Wow, didn't realise I was so out of the loop O.o
Guess that's what happens when I stop checking the rumour thread

 LunarSol wrote:
It's been in the rumor mill for a couple months. Long enough ago that people seem to have forgotten it was there. I think its pretty obviously more than a rumor.

Also, if you check the Adepticon announcements article on the community page, you'll see a blurry picture of White Dwarf with a battle that contains some previously unseen Ork models.

The question is whether those unseen models are actual kits or conversions like the Guard models in the photo.

 Kanluwen wrote:

 LunarSol wrote:
It's been in the rumor mill for a couple months. Long enough ago that people seem to have forgotten it was there. I think its pretty obviously more than a rumor.

Also, if you check the Adepticon announcements article on the community page, you'll see a blurry picture of White Dwarf with a battle that contains some previously unseen Ork models.

Spoiler:

The question is whether those unseen models are actual kits or conversions like the Guard models in the photo.

It's difficult to say, but the big blue fella up on the horizon is certainly new, and the group of Orks just left from the middle of the page seem new to me as well. Their backpacks and the tubes doesn't look like any other Ork body I know of.

Thought that guy has come up a couple of times, but was a conversion (like the IG in that picture, the Ventrillian nobles)?
Looted Dreadknight or something

On the one hand, as a tried and true Ork fanatic with about 5k of WAAAGH, I'm super stoked for this rumor to pan out.

On the other hand, as someone who is just finishing up their DG army and who thought I was more or less done modeling and painting, I'm a little sad because I wont be able to stop myself buying every Ork model that releases.

I guess if you have to be sad, being sad about being buried in fun hobby projects is a pretty good place to be.

What are he hoping for rules wise??

 Sal4m4nd3r wrote:
What are he hoping for rules wise??

This isn't a wishlisting thread, this is a thread for rumors.

 TedNugent wrote:

 Sal4m4nd3r wrote:
What are he hoping for rules wise??

This isn't a wishlisting thread, this is a thread for rumors.

Sorry fun police. What are the rumors on possible rules updates.

The big thing in the back is a converted Dreadknight. Apparently it was shown in a previous White Dwarf and the owner runs it as a Meka Dread.

That would make sense. The original Glazer's Creek battle report (WD222) had a very converted ork army and a lot of ad-hoc ruled defender models, so I'd expect the sequel to showcase something more interesting than just the standard studio forces.

Nothing not rumoured before and bols so...


Well here's hoping orks will get good codex when it comes. Lack of designer in studio that loves orks is bad though.

I Don't even need good kits but give us usable walkers!

 hippyjr wrote:
http://www.belloflostsouls.net/2018/03/40k-rumors-a-mighty-waaagh-is-coming.html

Not sure if this has already been posted, but if it turns out to be true then I'm super pumped!

Where I come from this sort of article is called "selling fog"

 Agamemnon2 wrote:
That would make sense. The original Glazer's Creek battle report (WD222) had a very converted ork army and a lot of ad-hoc ruled defender models, so I'd expect the sequel to showcase something more interesting than just the standard studio forces.

I'm just really, really hoping they don't ruin my childhood. Glazer's Greek is possibly the best White Dwarf Battle report of all time, and I am not expecting them to do Paul Sawyer any justice with this...

Because of the stats of the galaxy we need Primorks. Or Prime Orks.

New Ghaz leading giant Orks from Octarius back to Armageddon would be fine with me

Ah good old BOL(lock)S, the article has no substance and is basically saying “orks are coming at some point and may have some new models”

 LunarSol wrote:
It's been in the rumor mill for a couple months. Long enough ago that people seem to have forgotten it was there. I think its pretty obviously more than a rumor.

Yeah, it's not even usual BolS clickbait, it's reheated, beaten to death, rehashed clickbait.

As for these 'new' models, wasn't consensus they were simply conversions like the opposing IG models?

does anyone have that WD yet? Id love to see it from not a hard angle and in focus

 davou wrote:
does anyone have that WD yet? Id love to see it from not a hard angle and in focus

We don't know what White Dwarf it even is!

Can someone extrapolate, so I might better understand, what we're talking about regarding "Prime Orks", both in-game and lore wise? Is it a Super-Ork... ("Sork")? Or a new species of Super Orks (Sorks) to be fielded as some ultimate-Nobz? How can one have Prime Orks when there are already Nobz/Warbosses holding the power in a strictly hierarchical culture? Or are they like Ogryns to IG?

a prime ork is a warboss that can smash any other warboss it encounters.

If an Ork population gets big or powerful enough there genetics combined with there racial psychic field causes extra types of boyz to be expressed. One of these is what the Imperium called a Prime Ork. Essentially a super Warboss that's bigger and smarter than all the other Orks.

 Whazgog Da Despot wrote:
Can someone extrapolate, so I might better understand, what we're talking about regarding "Prime Orks", both in-game and lore wise? Is it a Super-Ork... ("Sork")? Or a new species of Super Orks (Sorks) to be fielded as some ultimate-Nobz? How can one have Prime Orks when there are already Nobz/Warbosses holding the power in a strictly hierarchical culture? Or are they like Ogryns to IG?

It was in 12 book Beast War series. Kinda asspull (huge ork empire springing up from nowhere in age of peace?) but the gist of it was being next step of ork evolution - ork so big it makes a warboss look like a boy. Apparently somehow bigger = smarter, so you get orks that can fluently debate in gothic and make technology that no longer malfunctions all the time (and shoot straight, with a side dose of being humor-devoid Ork Sues). Alas, Imperium offed all the primorks (in equally asspully way) in M32 and that was that. Though, there were hints Ghaz might become one. Though, how that would change anything seeing Imperium already took on primorks, twice, and won, both times crushing armies vastly larger and more advanced than ragged band Ghaz has, we have no idea.

 Irbis wrote:

 Whazgog Da Despot wrote:
Can someone extrapolate, so I might better understand, what we're talking about regarding "Prime Orks", both in-game and lore wise? Is it a Super-Ork... ("Sork")? Or a new species of Super Orks (Sorks) to be fielded as some ultimate-Nobz? How can one have Prime Orks when there are already Nobz/Warbosses holding the power in a strictly hierarchical culture? Or are they like Ogryns to IG?

It was in 12 book Beast War series. Kinda asspull (huge ork empire springing up from nowhere in age of peace?) but the gist of it was being next step of ork evolution - ork so big it makes a warboss look like a boy. Apparently somehow bigger = smarter, so you get orks that can fluently debate in gothic and make technology that no longer malfunctions all the time (and shoot straight, with a side dose of being humor-devoid Ork Sues). Alas, Imperium offed all the primorks (in equally asspully way) in M32 and that was that. Though, there were hints Ghaz might become one. Though, how that would change anything seeing Imperium already took on primorks, twice, and won, both times crushing armies vastly larger and more advanced than ragged band Ghaz has, we have no idea.

Yeah...soooo, the only bit of this is right that there's an Ork "Empire"(centered around Ullanor) and that it was in the Beast Arises series.

 Irbis wrote:

 Whazgog Da Despot wrote:
Can someone extrapolate, so I might better understand, what we're talking about regarding "Prime Orks", both in-game and lore wise? Is it a Super-Ork... ("Sork")? Or a new species of Super Orks (Sorks) to be fielded as some ultimate-Nobz? How can one have Prime Orks when there are already Nobz/Warbosses holding the power in a strictly hierarchical culture? Or are they like Ogryns to IG?

It was in 12 book Beast War series. Kinda asspull (huge ork empire springing up from nowhere in age of peace?) but the gist of it was being next step of ork evolution - ork so big it makes a warboss look like a boy. Apparently somehow bigger = smarter, so you get orks that can fluently debate in gothic and make technology that no longer malfunctions all the time (and shoot straight, with a side dose of being humor-devoid Ork Sues). Alas, Imperium offed all the primorks (in equally asspully way) in M32 and that was that. Though, there were hints Ghaz might become one. Though, how that would change anything seeing Imperium already took on primorks, twice, and won, both times crushing armies vastly larger and more advanced than ragged band Ghaz has, we have no idea.

Yeah, super off

With all the flavor and love put into the Dark Eldar book, I'm starting to revive my Orkz now.

Im thinking to go fully Goff since we know they will have a crap trait, but an awesome Character and strategem.

 Irbis wrote:

 LunarSol wrote:
It's been in the rumor mill for a couple months. Long enough ago that people seem to have forgotten it was there. I think its pretty obviously more than a rumor.

Yeah, it's not even usual BolS clickbait, it's reheated, beaten to death, rehashed clickbait.

As for these 'new' models, wasn't consensus they were simply conversions like the opposing IG models?

Well the usual method with BoLS is to throw enough gak and eventually some of it will stick. Then they can go "LOOK SEE WE WERE RIGHT!".

You can't ban me from here for pointing that out BoLS...

 Irbis wrote:
Though, how that would change anything seeing Imperium already took on primorks, twice, and won, both times crushing armies vastly larger and more advanced than ragged band Ghaz has, we have no idea.

Given the mindnumbing discussion of the 'end of the space marines' in the first quarter or so of the first book I'm going to guess they're leaning on the idea that the current imperium is far lesser than it was 8k years ago.

Those armies didn't have the level of technology Ghaz has available to him. Ghaz is at the head of a great awakening for orks according to the last lump of Ork fluff.

The orks are heading towards the same levels as the Beast was in the novels, though they have not quite hit the critical mass levels yet.

Primaris Orks then - bigger than all the other Orks, to represent what happens when you reach that level of Ork population?

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Primaris Orks then - bigger than all the other Orks, to represent what happens when you reach that level of Ork population?

At least orks have it build into their fluff from the beginning.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Primaris Orks then - bigger than all the other Orks, to represent what happens when you reach that level of Ork population?

no, Pirmarch orks. The orks from the beast series were slapping around vulkan

It remains to be seen if GW will allow the orks to become this powerful. An Armageddon campaign would be nice.

YeOldSaltPotato wrote:

 Irbis wrote:
Though, how that would change anything seeing Imperium already took on primorks, twice, and won, both times crushing armies vastly larger and more advanced than ragged band Ghaz has, we have no idea.

Given the mindnumbing discussion of the 'end of the space marines' in the first quarter or so of the first book I'm going to guess they're leaning on the idea that the current imperium is far lesser than it was 8k years ago.

Which would be a reasonable interpretation if a direct statement in BRB (not even a in-universe quote, matter of fact statement) didn't say in timeline around M37-38 that the Imperium's borders were 'never greater' than present ones after recent crusades. So, yeah, it completely rules out Imperium in M32 (or even GC one) being stronger, unless there is stronger source retconning that.

Ditto for organizations like Custodes and SM, development of new tactics and finding of old STCs left both groups stronger than their early Imperium contemporaries (direct quote from Trajan Valoris, who has no reason to lie and is rather well placed to know that, seeing his access to all official and unofficial Imperial reports). Doubly so after introduction of Primaris. Sure, they might lack some fancy early toys but even that is being semi-retconned from 40K seeing multiple plasma blaster and volkite bits being added to range recently, both of which were most often cited as 'proof' of supposed decline.

So, yeah, 'midnight', terrible approaching dark times, yada yada, everything is lost, but I can't recall one example of supposed Imperium's problems materializing anywhere on the tabletop. When in reality, economic and manpower problems a state has reflection in military even before general populace feels it. It would be even trivial for GW to steal from history once more and make parallels with Germany in 1945, tech better than in 39, but everything else being rotten to the core showing lacks and ersatz everywhere, but alas, none of that is present. The best most of GW writers can do is grimderp for the sake of grimdumb, without even considering the consequences of what they wrote being true...

I had pretty much forgotten about the Ork rumor as well.

Maybe someone can remind me if the following is a legit rumor or if I am mis-remembering someone's wish-list.

8th edition Orks are getting Looted Tanks back, with rules that allow them to pull vehicles out of other Codexes (with modifiers to stat lines.)

 techsoldaten wrote:
8th edition Orks are getting Looted Tanks back, with rules that allow them to pull vehicles out of other Codexes (with modifiers to stat lines.)

Looted vehicles, maybe, but modified stat lines from other codexes? That sounds like wishlisting.

 BrookM wrote:
An Armageddon campaign would be nice.

Armageddon 4: The Return of The Revenge! 'This time it's personal!'

Be interesting if Ghazzy model got an update with the fluff. He was a normal boy when Grotsnik patched him up. Only took a couple yrs to unify Uruk. They warp off to Armageddon but are repelled. Ghazzy spends 54 yrs keeping low profile to test new tek and tactics and reappears at the head of a massive Waaaagh and is the size of a dreadnought. 56 or so yrs to get from boy to dread. If the storyline advanced 200 more yrs he oughta be massive by now or dead as a failed warboss. Should note too that Armageddon 3 was both the largest land and space battle the Imperium experienced up to that point in their history including surpassing the Ullanor crusade and the Siege of Terra during the HH.

Speaking of Armageddon, for some reason it's stuck in my head, as though I came across it somewhere, that he'll be back on Armageddon or latest fluff retconned and he never left.

I took the image and warped and modified it back to a flat like aspect, and ran what enhancement I could on the pixels to sharpen... was too low res to get too much more out of it, but the flatter image offers a bit better feel for what is in the pipe -

 MajorTom11 wrote:
I took the image and warped and modified it back to a flat like aspect, and ran what enhancement I could on the pixels to sharpen... was too low res to get too much more out of it, but the flatter image offers a bit better feel for what is in the pipe -

exalted! when does that WD drop?

I'm not convinced the walker isn't a converted Baby Carrier. I am convinced the Koptaz are new.

Oh no, it's way too big. If it is indeed inspired by 'The Beast', it will be a massive, armored ork covered in weapons. It won't be a little Ork in a big suit, it will be a gigantic suit.

GW don't really do conversions much anymore, not in these WD style spreads anyways.

My money is on giant 'Beast' class prime-ork...

TBH it looks like Megatron from the Michael Bay films.

This was a very cruel preview on GW's part.

Wasn't that thing confirmed has a converted Dreadknight from somebody?

That is the new gaz model and they are hiding it in plain site lol. Deff koptas are also new

One things that makes me question it being Ghaz or not, it looks to me to be blue, and I def don't see a checker in sight... those are not Ghaz/Goff colors... then again, I can't imagine them making that kit without an alt-build.

#squadgoals

I don't play Orks myself, but I would hope that not only does Ghazzy get a huge new model, but that he gets Primarch-level stats and abilities to make him as powerful as his fluff suggests.

 Formosa wrote:
Ah good old BOL(lock)S, the article has no substance and is basically saying “orks are coming at some point and may have some new models”

Isn't this every BOLS article? Nothing but click-bait.

 ZergSmasher wrote:
I don't play Orks myself, but I would hope that not only does Ghazzy get a huge new model, but that he gets Primarch-level stats and abilities to make him as powerful as his fluff suggests.

So... beatable by a Commissar?

I'd like to see him get Makari back

 Dysartes wrote:

 ZergSmasher wrote:
I don't play Orks myself, but I would hope that not only does Ghazzy get a huge new model, but that he gets Primarch-level stats and abilities to make him as powerful as his fluff suggests.

So... beatable by a Commissar?

I'd like to see him get Makari back

Ha. Nice. Makari perched on his shoulders waving a banner would be a nice touch.

 MajorTom11 wrote:

GW don't really do conversions much anymore, not in these WD style spreads anyways.

That's a funny statement, when all the Imperial Guard models in the picture are converted.

 Formosa wrote:
Ah good old BOL(lock)S, the article has no substance and is basically saying “orks are coming at some point and may have some new models”

yeah BOLS likes ton state the obvious, make some baseless speculation and paint it up as new rumors.

 Formosa wrote:
Ah good old BOL(lock)S, the article has no substance and is basically saying “orks are coming at some point and may have some new models”

If memory serves right, i think temouloun said orks were gettinh stuff com june. He's nailed these last months in so far (and started in november) so it is possibly

Those of us that are waiting patiently for real news find this thread to nowt but disappointment.

Can we please shut it down?

 MajorTom11 wrote:
Oh no, it's way too big. If it is indeed inspired by 'The Beast', it will be a massive, armored ork covered in weapons. It won't be a little Ork in a big suit, it will be a gigantic suit.

GW don't really do conversions much anymore, not in these WD style spreads anyways.

My money is on giant 'Beast' class prime-ork...

Not much except you know whole IG army against those orks?-)

Though then again more big models no surprise. As long as you can play old units competively without those being force fed upon you by broken rules all good.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:

 BrookM wrote:
An Armageddon campaign would be nice.

Armageddon 4: The Return of The Revenge! 'This time it's personal!'

"The trilogy continues!"

I'd love for the Walker to not be a conversion. It's super cool. Also, bout time for new koptas!

 PhillyT wrote:
Those armies didn't have the level of technology Ghaz has available to him. Ghaz is at the head of a great awakening for orks according to the last lump of Ork fluff.

WotB orks had 'attack moons' which were essentially deathstar-like structures capable of not just moving through the warp but materialising in a relatively close planetary orbit. As far as I'm aware, no 40k faction has the ability to jump straight into a gravity well like that, much less with something that size.

Also, they had a spaceship which could collapse a star with it's main gun.

 godswildcard wrote:
I'd love for the Walker to not be a conversion. It's super cool. Also, bout time for new koptas!

The koptas are really the same ones that belonged to the AOBR set.

I wouldn't like a new walker to be honest, we already have tons of them: kanz, dreads, nauts, the stompa and other FW stuff. Orks need new HQs and buggies more than anything, and a tank-gun boat as a completely new unit.

Orks got a line of models in the last few years, so there's a pretty low chance they'll get new models now.

I think one only has to look at the Ironjawz in AoS.40k Orks will inevitably get the same treatment.

 CREEEEEEEEED wrote:
Orks got a line of models in the last few years, so there's a pretty low chance they'll get new models now.

Are you serious? No new models since 2014, just a new sprue to an already existing kit which also becomes way more expensive. We also have several units/characters that belong to the 90s.

And by your logic SM shouldn't receive anything new until 2050

DiscoKing wrote:
I think one only has to look at the Ironjawz in AoS.40k Orks will inevitably get the same treatment.

For people who don't know the first thing about AoS, what would that be?

 Jidmah wrote:

DiscoKing wrote:
I think one only has to look at the Ironjawz in AoS.40k Orks will inevitably get the same treatment.

For people who don't know the first thing about AoS, what would that be?

Much bigger badder orcs

I admit I have to chuckle at Ork players whining about their model line...

 Blackie wrote:

 CREEEEEEEEED wrote:
Orks got a line of models in the last few years, so there's a pretty low chance they'll get new models now.

Are you serious? No new models since 2014, just a new sprue to an already existing kit which also becomes way more expensive. We also have several units/characters that belong to the 90s.

And by your logic SM shouldn't receive anything new until 2050

Yeah, the 2014 release was only 4 years ago. Most factions wait way longer to get new models than 4 years. And tbh the current SM line probably won't receive anything new (not counting primaris) for a long time. The 2015 release made sure pretty much every space marine unit had a high quality multi-part plastic kit. No need to release anything new.

 Blackie wrote:

 CREEEEEEEEED wrote:
Orks got a line of models in the last few years, so there's a pretty low chance they'll get new models now.

Are you serious? No new models since 2014, just a new sprue to an already existing kit which also becomes way more expensive. We also have several units/characters that belong to the 90s.

And by your logic SM shouldn't receive anything new until 2050

I think that's the "line of models in the last few years" he's referring to.

I personally wouldn't call the addition of Flash Gitz, Mork/Gorkanauts, Grukk, and the Meganobz a "line of models".

Maybe not a line, but 'a release' that isn't just a character like the necron guy recently, but a couple of units.

 Grimtuff wrote:

 H.B.M.C. wrote:

 BrookM wrote:
An Armageddon campaign would be nice.

Armageddon 4: The Return of The Revenge! 'This time it's personal!'

"The trilogy continues!"

Actually, a "Armagedoon 4: Return of the Returners" campaign might be a nice way to introduce both Orcs and Angron and his friendly, "helping grannies over the street" boys. Crushing the Empire left and right until a certain Group of fur-hang unshaven lapdogs apear and keep the Inquistion from murdering everyone as would have been wise the first time War came to Armageddon -

Didn’t they essentially pave the entire planet, for the Emperor’s victory parade? And then they moved it right across the galaxy before renaming and resettling it?

Anyway - something is probably hidden below the surface. Maybe it’s made of noctilith?

 CREEEEEEEEED wrote:
Orks got a line of models in the last few years, so there's a pretty low chance they'll get new models now.

Dont want to derail the thread but without some new HQ models, Orks will be stuck with the Grukk model as the only available warboss.

What I’m hoping for: decent, fun Codex; updates to the really creaky kits; maybe something cool and new that mixes in well with the existing stuff.

What I’m not hoping for: yet another boring, oversized special character kit leading to more boring, samey armies; unnecessarily crowbarring in more, bigger Orks, when Nobz already exist.

Armageddon IV: Chaos wins again, which is unacceptable because it would change the entire narrative of 40K, and so the results will be marginalized despite the overwhelming, crushing victory by Chaos.

Chaos BLEW UP CADIA and all the World Stones (Or Ward Stones? Or whatever they were), and what happened? Not a Chaos God thing. If anything, it was a good thing for the Imperium as it galvanized Cawl to log off from World of Warcraft, the Eldar to birth another God, and resurrect Bobby G who then swiped in to save the day.

That was almost two years ago, and nothing has changed since.

Back on topic, Bell of Lost Souls is like watching Fox News- you can never quite figure out if they are being serious or if it's "Fake News".

 Kanluwen wrote:

 Blackie wrote:

 CREEEEEEEEED wrote:
Orks got a line of models in the last few years, so there's a pretty low chance they'll get new models now.

Are you serious? No new models since 2014, just a new sprue to an already existing kit which also becomes way more expensive. We also have several units/characters that belong to the 90s.

And by your logic SM shouldn't receive anything new until 2050

I think that's the "line of models in the last few years" he's referring to.

I personally wouldn't call the addition of Flash Gitz, Mork/Gorkanauts, Grukk, and the Meganobz a "line of models".

There was also the mek gunz , the painboy and the mek. The 2014 release was actually pretty big. A refresh with additional kits every 4 years or so is pretty standard for GW’s more popular factions. Orks are certainly due some new stuff but I wouldn’t call them overdue yet. I fully expect that by the end of 2018 orks will have had the best year miniature wise of any Xenos army. (That wheel is definitely from an Ork kit)

 Galas wrote:
Wasn't that thing confirmed has a converted Dreadknight from somebody?

I'm pretty sure it's a looted Dreadknight, and i'm pretty sure it's the looted Dreadknight that was shown in one of the recent White Dwaves, the one with the Escher on the cover hugging the wall. It probably belongs in Dan Harden's ork army. He mentioned it being looted which would explain it being painted in Deathskullz blue.

Chikout wrote:

 Kanluwen wrote:

 Blackie wrote:

 CREEEEEEEEED wrote:
Orks got a line of models in the last few years, so there's a pretty low chance they'll get new models now.

Are you serious? No new models since 2014, just a new sprue to an already existing kit which also becomes way more expensive. We also have several units/characters that belong to the 90s.

And by your logic SM shouldn't receive anything new until 2050

I think that's the "line of models in the last few years" he's referring to.

I personally wouldn't call the addition of Flash Gitz, Mork/Gorkanauts, Grukk, and the Meganobz a "line of models".

There was also the mek gunz , the painboy and the mek. The 2014 release was actually pretty big. A refresh with additional kits every 4 years or so is pretty standard for GW’s more popular factions. Orks are certainly due some new stuff but I wouldn’t call them overdue yet. I fully expect that by the end of 2018 orks will have had the best year miniature wise of any Xenos army. (That wheel is definitely from an Ork kit)

You're right, I forget about the Mek Gunz because as sought after as the kit was...man I didn't see many get sold at that price. Painboy and Mek were similar situations after awhile.

Hopefully any Ork release means that Mek Gunz will be repacked into at least a 3 pack for cheaper.

One rumour was a gorkamorka box set in June.
Harry also mentioned ork buggies a year ago.
Ork buggy rumours have been fairly steady and I expect a release for them soon.

And in gw current design of making new kits into a board game of rereleases of nostalgia I think gorkamorka with several buggy kits might actually be legit possibility. However I’m hoping for some sweet ork fort/terrain with this set!!! But that’s wishlisting.

The whole angron les bring back more primarchs story line also seems to fit nicely into an ork armeggedon release

 Kanluwen wrote:

Chikout wrote:

 Kanluwen wrote:

 Blackie wrote:

 CREEEEEEEEED wrote:
Orks got a line of models in the last few years, so there's a pretty low chance they'll get new models now.

Are you serious? No new models since 2014, just a new sprue to an already existing kit which also becomes way more expensive. We also have several units/characters that belong to the 90s.

And by your logic SM shouldn't receive anything new until 2050

I think that's the "line of models in the last few years" he's referring to.

I personally wouldn't call the addition of Flash Gitz, Mork/Gorkanauts, Grukk, and the Meganobz a "line of models".

There was also the mek gunz , the painboy and the mek. The 2014 release was actually pretty big. A refresh with additional kits every 4 years or so is pretty standard for GW’s more popular factions. Orks are certainly due some new stuff but I wouldn’t call them overdue yet. I fully expect that by the end of 2018 orks will have had the best year miniature wise of any Xenos army. (That wheel is definitely from an Ork kit)

You're right, I forget about the Mek Gunz because as sought after as the kit was...man I didn't see many get sold at that price. Painboy and Mek were similar situations after awhile.

Hopefully any Ork release means that Mek Gunz will be repacked into at least a 3 pack for cheaper.

I think the Mek Gun had (has?) the worst price/points cost ratio of any GW model. Which is annoying because they're great in-game.

I'm not an Ork player but I do hope they get a decent codex and some updated models to match. They still sell a buggy from over 20 years ago!

Ideally I think a good release would also include a box of bits (bit like the skulls and vines) which would allow you a lot of customisation and decoration options

Buggies, Trakks (sp?), Skorchas and Deff Koptas need new kits at the very least. A plastic Warboss and Weird Boy kit would also be nice.

 Tamwulf wrote:
Armageddon IV: Chaos wins again, which is unacceptable because it would change the entire narrative of 40K, and so the results will be marginalized despite the overwhelming, crushing victory by Chaos.

Chaos BLEW UP CADIA and all the World Stones (Or Ward Stones? Or whatever they were), and what happened? Not a Chaos God thing. If anything, it was a good thing for the Imperium as it galvanized Cawl to log off from World of Warcraft, the Eldar to birth another God, and resurrect Bobby G who then swiped in to save the day.

That was almost two years ago, and nothing has changed since.

Back on topic, Bell of Lost Souls is like watching Fox News- you can never quite figure out if they are being serious or if it's "Fake News".

The whole splitting the galaxy twain, severing the Imperium in half and loading them down with more threats than they've ever had before not withstanding?

I wouldn't say that Man is doing all that well at the moment.

It would be awesome if all the clans are viable and fluffy. I'm planning on a snakebite army, and would love if boar boyz made a return. Along with more squig variants.

 BrookM wrote:
Buggies, Trakks (sp?), Skorchas and Deff Koptas need new kits at the very least. A plastic Warboss and Weird Boy kit would also be nice.

Well we've had this Rumor Engine pic for 10 months now. I'm hoping it's indeed the rumored buggy kit.



In terms of models that need updating the ones you mention are at the top of the heap, but I could also go for a much needed tankbustas/kommandos kit. Agreed on squigs though; I'd love to see a Tau drone like kit with a few squigs you can arm with bombs, ammo packs etc with various buffing effects/abilities.

If they were to re-do the Kommandos, I'd love for them to do it in this style, from old concept art:



Especially this lad:



Tacticool Kommando with a boonie hat? Just sweet!

Catachans vs. Ork Kommandos - Vietnam in Spaaaace!

Or would it be more like Afghanisan?

Would love something like this too:

Would be cool to see Deathkoptas repackaged so that we don't have to buy leftover models from three editions and starter sets ago.

 Togusa wrote:

 Tamwulf wrote:
Armageddon IV: Chaos wins again, which is unacceptable because it would change the entire narrative of 40K, and so the results will be marginalized despite the overwhelming, crushing victory by Chaos.

Chaos BLEW UP CADIA and all the World Stones (Or Ward Stones? Or whatever they were), and what happened? Not a Chaos God thing. If anything, it was a good thing for the Imperium as it galvanized Cawl to log off from World of Warcraft, the Eldar to birth another God, and resurrect Bobby G who then swiped in to save the day.

That was almost two years ago, and nothing has changed since.

Back on topic, Bell of Lost Souls is like watching Fox News- you can never quite figure out if they are being serious or if it's "Fake News".

The whole splitting the galaxy twain, severing the Imperium in half and loading them down with more threats than they've ever had before not withstanding?

I wouldn't say that Man is doing all that well at the moment.

And if any of that had any real effect on the Imperium's ability to have armies and Big Hero Men characters show up whenever required, it might have some meaning,but it doesn't. They write this or that chapter or character into a corner, then they write them out again, or they write some other thing that makes up the difference - the rift and ostensibly resurgent Chaos are immediately countered by Rowboat and his Merry Primaris. If they really boost up the Orks, either the Imperium will get a corresponding boost, or some deus ex machina will prevent the Orks from exploiting whatever advantage they're supposedly given.

40K is treading water just as much as it ever was as a temporally static setting, they've just changed over to perpetually rearranging the deckchairs.

 AegisGrimm wrote:
Would be cool to see Deathkoptas repackaged so that we don't have to buy leftover models from three editions and starter sets ago.

They all ready have the capacity to do this. They have the sprue for a one-Deathkopta all ready made for the Vedros kits. All they have to do is make a production run of it and put it into a proper 40k box. Minimal effort on their part.

And then the new Codex entry for Deffkoptas would have Rokkitz and nothing else, because that's all the kit would have.

We don't want a mono-pose kopta kit.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
And then the new Codex entry for Deffkoptas would have Rokkitz and nothing else, because that's all the kit would have.

We don't want a mono-pose kopta kit.

The really weird thing is that the Buggy kit comes with a Multi-Melta, which Buggies can't use.

 Glane wrote:

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
And then the new Codex entry for Deffkoptas would have Rokkitz and nothing else, because that's all the kit would have.

We don't want a mono-pose kopta kit.

The really weird thing is that the Buggy kit comes with a Multi-Melta, which Buggies can't use.

Is it possible thats just a big shoota?

 Nurglitch wrote:
I think the Mek Gun had (has?) the worst price/points cost ratio of any GW model. Which is annoying because they're great in-game.

Or rather kustom mega kannon is great in game. Other's less so which makes it annoying as one could use bits and scratch build others making them much cheaper. But since the other 3 are rather stinky in game terms not much help...You don't want to spend that much effort to waste on those mek guns(well bubble chukka or two can be fun for laughs but hardly competive choice. But fun little mini game of it's own and rather orky!)


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 Blitza da warboy wrote:

 Glane wrote:

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
And then the new Codex entry for Deffkoptas would have Rokkitz and nothing else, because that's all the kit would have.

We don't want a mono-pose kopta kit.

The really weird thing is that the Buggy kit comes with a Multi-Melta, which Buggies can't use.

Is it possible thats just a big shoota?

Not just possible. It IS big shoota. Well originally heavy bolter before GW decided orks have their own weapons. But obviously enough heavy bolters were made into big shootas. Dakka dakka dakka.

tneva82 wrote:
Not just possible. It IS big shoota. Well originally heavy bolter before GW decided orks have their own weapons. But obviously enough heavy bolters were made into big shootas. Dakka dakka dakka.

I think you're getting a little confused here, tneva - the Warbuggy kit has what used to be a multi-melta on top. The Wartrakk kit from GorkaMorka has the (twin?) big shoota on it.

Huh. Looks like solid slug weapon to me.

tneva82 wrote:
Huh. Looks like solid slug weapon to me.

A, I remember the datacard when it was released - trust me, multi-melta in 2nd edition

B, Look at the, for want of a better term, fuel tanks just back from the barrels. A common design component for multi-meltas.

 Dysartes wrote:

tneva82 wrote:
Huh. Looks like solid slug weapon to me.

A, I remember the datacard when it was released - trust me, multi-melta in 2nd edition

B, Look at the, for want of a better term, fuel tanks just back from the barrels. A common design component for multi-meltas.

Well look at that. I could have sworn it's heavy bolter.

Well that makes it surprising GW didn't invent orky multi melta with their model=rules attitude.

I’m pretty sure the AoBR/Vedros Kopta shares a sprue with some of the other components, so if we do see a new Kopta kit, I would imagine it’ll be a fresh sprue, hopefully meaning there are options for other guns/saws/bommz. Think the aesthetic of the old ones still holds up well, mind.

tneva82 wrote:
Well look at that. I could have sworn it's heavy bolter.

Well that makes it surprising GW didn't invent orky multi melta with their model=rules attitude.

Considering that a buggy with a twin multi-melta would actually be a very useful thing for an ork army to have, it's also pretty sad.

 Glane wrote:

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
And then the new Codex entry for Deffkoptas would have Rokkitz and nothing else, because that's all the kit would have.

We don't want a mono-pose kopta kit.

The really weird thing is that the Buggy kit comes with a Multi-Melta, which Buggies can't use.

The Loota\Burna kit comes with the options for a Big Mek to have a Rokkit Launcha, a Big Shoota, or a KMB, but they only include a arm for the (left handed) KMB so you have no way, using what comes in the box, to use the other 2 options. Quality.

Anyway, as someone with an Ork army I guess I'd like to see new models but a huge Ork release? I feel like, a few models aside (buggies, koptas, Thraka, weirdboy?) we're in a pretty good place. Some of the kits that are old aren't actually bad, like the Boyz sprues.

 Dysartes wrote:

tneva82 wrote:
Huh. Looks like solid slug weapon to me.

A, I remember the datacard when it was released - trust me, multi-melta in 2nd edition

B, Look at the, for want of a better term, fuel tanks just back from the barrels. A common design component for multi-meltas.

Isn't that just a Skorcha? Fuel tanks would definitely point at that before MM, and IIRC old ork art had definitely flamer-like weapon on top of buggy...

 CREEEEEEEEED wrote:
Maybe not a line, but 'a release' that isn't just a character like the necron guy recently, but a couple of units.

But necrons don't have units or characters that belong to the 90s like the warboss or buggies. Necrons are all quite recent models, they don't need anything new. What about finecast monopose squads? Those are something that sould be updated as well and necrons only have flayed ones IIRC other than characters. Orks have kommandos and tankbustas that no one buys because they're very expensive, monopose and made in finecast, any ork player kitbashes those units using regular boyz because the original kits are terrible.

Eldar or dark eldar could be a better example than necrons, they do need massive new releases, just like orks. Too many ancient models and too much finecast as well for both armies.


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 Ouze wrote:

 Glane wrote:

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
And then the new Codex entry for Deffkoptas would have Rokkitz and nothing else, because that's all the kit would have.

We don't want a mono-pose kopta kit.

The really weird thing is that the Buggy kit comes with a Multi-Melta, which Buggies can't use.

The Loota\Burna kit comes with the options for a Big Mek to have a Rokkit Launcha, a Big Shoota, or a KMB, but they only include a arm for the (left handed) KMB so you have no way, using what comes in the box, to use the other 2 options. Quality.

Anyway, as someone with an Ork army I guess I'd like to see new models but a huge Ork release? I feel like, a few models aside (buggies, koptas, Thraka, weirdboy?) we're in a pretty good place. Some of the kits that are old aren't actually bad, like the Boyz sprues.

Yeah I think we just need buggies and 2-3 characters. Maybe new kommandos and tankbustas kits.

 Irbis wrote:

 Dysartes wrote:

tneva82 wrote:
Huh. Looks like solid slug weapon to me.

A, I remember the datacard when it was released - trust me, multi-melta in 2nd edition

B, Look at the, for want of a better term, fuel tanks just back from the barrels. A common design component for multi-meltas.

Isn't that just a Skorcha? Fuel tanks would definitely point at that before MM, and IIRC old ork art had definitely flamer-like weapon on top of buggy...

That looks more like an artist's impression of a multi-melta, to me. Also, a Scorcha is based on a Wartrakk (the kettenrad-looking halftrack), not a Warbuggy.

Basically, if it's got a straight barrel with long vents and a fuel tank, it's a melta weapon. If the muzzle is conical, or it has a pilot light burner, it's a flamethrower.

I hope orks do get a solid new release. It's kind of the only logical explanation for why it's taken so long for rules to come out for them.

Personally I'd like to see the boyz redone, or new "primaris" boyz to come out, maybe as a re-emergence of the guys out of the "I am slaughter" stuff last year. The current kit is characterful but they are lacking in detail compared to what GW can do nowadays.

 Irbis wrote:

 Dysartes wrote:

tneva82 wrote:
Huh. Looks like solid slug weapon to me.

A, I remember the datacard when it was released - trust me, multi-melta in 2nd edition

B, Look at the, for want of a better term, fuel tanks just back from the barrels. A common design component for multi-meltas.

Isn't that just a Skorcha? Fuel tanks would definitely point at that before MM, and IIRC old ork art had definitely flamer-like weapon on top of buggy...

As AndrewGPaul mentioned, when this was released the Skorcha was a different vehicle entirely - a wartrakk with a trailer, from memory - see the painted example here.

Mandragola wrote:
I hope orks do get a solid new release. It's kind of the only logical explanation for why it's taken so long for rules to come out for them.

Personally I'd like to see the boyz redone, or new "primaris" boyz to come out, maybe as a re-emergence of the guys out of the "I am slaughter" stuff last year. The current kit is characterful but they are lacking in detail compared to what GW can do nowadays.

Please no. Better boyz model sure but don't make it new unit replacing old ones.

Mandragola wrote:
Personally I'd like to see the boyz redone, or new "primaris" boyz to come out,

That would be awesome, especially since we could mix and match these new "primaris" boyz with old boyz. Contrary to Marines, Orks have more individuality and differently sized Orks in a single mob wouldn't be too shocking (it's those boyz that are about to challenge the Nob in order to replace him).

 Nym wrote:

Mandragola wrote:
Personally I'd like to see the boyz redone, or new "primaris" boyz to come out,

That would be awesome, especially since we could mix and match these new "primaris" boyz with old boyz. Contrary to Marines, Orks have more individuality and differently sized Orks in a single mob wouldn't be too shocking (it's those boyz that are about to challenge the Nob in order to replace him).

That's what I would do with them. I have far too many Boys to justify new larger ones unless they were a new unit of some kind.

Regarding the buggy and trakk question
The buggy had a multi-melts the trakk had a twin Bigshoota and there was a Schorcha trakk as well. The buggies multi-melta under 2nd ed rules also acted like a heavy flamer, like all multi-meltas atthe time.

I'm just looking forward to getting mt hands on a new codex. We have armies to chrush and tables or pointless objective to plunder!

If they redo the Boyz kit, I’m hoping for one of two things:

-The Boyz are still close in scale to existing Boyz, and don’t stick out too badly when mixed together. That way we get more conversion bits for our hordes. While this would be the ideal from my point of view, I don’t have too much hope for it working out, as I’m persnickety about scale and GW loves it’s scale creep. Changing scale would be especially annoying if they add new weapon options that require us to use the new kit.

-The Boyz stay as they are and a new baseline infantry kit is introduced, similar to how Ironjawz were introduced in AoS. That way the scale creep is understandable and they can exist as their own separate unit, or form the basis of a totally different Ork army. Perhaps this would be a good way to get ‘Ard Boyz or Skarboyz back in game - preferably with weapon and rules options that make them different from Boyz or Nob squads.

 Irbis wrote:
Isn't that just a Skorcha?

When it was first released, it was a Multi-Melta.

I would love to have Ard Boyz back. Rules wise it gave a cheapish unit that could take a hit while having the numbers to sit on objectives.

Model wise, I have a ton of second edition armored boys that look like samurai with axes that want to play again.

Don't know if it has been mentioned but the models in the White Dwarf were confirmed not to be new models. The guy said it was just converted stuff.

Is there a (hypothetical) list of kits we can expect to be A) re-released with new kits. B) Disappear from the Codex entirely. C) Be kept without new models being released?

I have an Ork force comprised of Boyz, Nobs, Koptas, Big Gunz and a few other gubbins. I'm already sad that my looted wagon has had its rules taken away (and it's too small to proxy as a Battlewagon and too 'shooty' for a trukk).

I've been itching to buy some more boyz, burna/loota kits and some bitz from Kromlech to kitbash a load of Kommandos/Tank Bustas but have held off since this news

As for making Orks larger in the Beats Arises book... i think this was a kinda lazy and narrow idea... "GIANT ORKS!!! THAT'S HOW WE WILL MAKE THEM COOL!"... No... you're just copying from fantasy at that point. As a friend told me. It's just Flanderization of the Ork's aspect that they grow tougher and smarter the more they fight. Ork's are special to 40k because they're not as similar to LOTR Orks as you might think and by just turning them into monsters (beasts) you're ruining the fun magic behind them. I like the idea that Meks grow smart and make some awesome technology because of experience and experimentation... Not because they just unlocked level 999 abilities in their skill trees. We have to remember (some real Ork lore here... none of this headcanon stuff!) Orks (after the Old Ones) were a slave race to the Brain Boyz who were the ones who designed the Orks. They (unlike the Old Ones) had plenty of time to interject their own genetics and abilities into the Ork's so their race may live on through them (because they were all slowly dying of a plague). They focused on technology and creativity and not making big trolls!

Also how the hell would a gigantic Stompa Sized Ork in the cult of Speed supposed to be able to ride his kustom bike he spent most his life and teeth making? You're making some very sad Ork bikers GW!!!!

 Wulfmar wrote:
Is there a (hypothetical) list of kits we can expect to be A) re-released with new kits. B) Disappear from the Codex entirely. C) Be kept without new models being released?

I have an Ork force comprised of Boyz, Nobs, Koptas, Big Gunz and a few other gubbins. I'm already sad that my looted wagon has had its rules taken away (and it's too small to proxy as a Battlewagon and too 'shooty' for a trukk).

I've been itching to buy some more boyz, burna/loota kits and some bitz from Kromlech to kitbash a load of Kommandos/Tank Bustas but have held off since this news

I think the only thing we can say with relative confidence is that there will be some sort of wheeled vehicle - likely some sort of buggy, possibly part of some sort of Gorkamorka re-release.

Beyond that l, it really depends on whether GW plan on giving Orks the same kind soft reboot / fleshed out mini-faction treatment they’ve been giving to Marines, Chaos and Eldar, or if they’re going to be keeping things relatively stable and just filling holes like they’ve done with Necron, Dark Eldar and Tau. My money is on the former, which unfortunately means it’s harder to predict what kind of new ideas we get.

I want a kult of speed that ain't gunu cost me a small fortune! I like to keep a hold of my teeth!

 lolman1c wrote:
As for making Orks larger in the Beats Arises book... i think this was a kinda lazy and narrow idea... "GIANT ORKS!!! THAT'S HOW WE WILL MAKE THEM COOL!"... No... you're just copying from fantasy at that point. As a friend told me. It's just Flanderization of the Ork's aspect that they grow tougher and smarter the more they fight. Ork's are special to 40k because they're not as similar to LOTR Orks as you might think and by just turning them into monsters (beasts) you're ruining the fun magic behind them. I like the idea that Meks grow smart and make some awesome technology because of experience and experimentation... Not because they just unlocked level 999 abilities in their skill trees. We have to remember (some real Ork lore here... none of this headcanon stuff!) Orks (after the Old Ones) were a slave race to the Brain Boyz who were the ones who designed the Orks. They (unlike the Old Ones) had plenty of time to interject their own genetics and abilities into the Ork's so their race may live on through them (because they were all slowly dying of a plague). They focused on technology and creativity and not making big trolls!

Also how the hell would a gigantic Stompa Sized Ork in the cult of Speed supposed to be able to ride his kustom bike he spent most his life and teeth making? You're making some very sad Ork bikers GW!!!!

Unless you've actually read The Beast Arises, the idea of "it's just giant orks!" is patently false.

 Kanluwen wrote:

 lolman1c wrote:
As for making Orks larger in the Beats Arises book... i think this was a kinda lazy and narrow idea... "GIANT ORKS!!! THAT'S HOW WE WILL MAKE THEM COOL!"... No... you're just copying from fantasy at that point. As a friend told me. It's just Flanderization of the Ork's aspect that they grow tougher and smarter the more they fight. Ork's are special to 40k because they're not as similar to LOTR Orks as you might think and by just turning them into monsters (beasts) you're ruining the fun magic behind them. I like the idea that Meks grow smart and make some awesome technology because of experience and experimentation... Not because they just unlocked level 999 abilities in their skill trees. We have to remember (some real Ork lore here... none of this headcanon stuff!) Orks (after the Old Ones) were a slave race to the Brain Boyz who were the ones who designed the Orks. They (unlike the Old Ones) had plenty of time to interject their own genetics and abilities into the Ork's so their race may live on through them (because they were all slowly dying of a plague). They focused on technology and creativity and not making big trolls!

Also how the hell would a gigantic Stompa Sized Ork in the cult of Speed supposed to be able to ride his kustom bike he spent most his life and teeth making? You're making some very sad Ork bikers GW!!!!

Unless you've actually read The Beast Arises, the idea of "it's just giant orks!" is patently false.

I never said "It's just giant orks!" I said "It's just Flanderization of the Ork's aspect that they grow tougher and smarter the more they fight".

 lolman1c wrote:
As for making Orks larger in the Beats Arises book... i think this was a kinda lazy and narrow idea... "GIANT ORKS!!! THAT'S HOW WE WILL MAKE THEM COOL!"... No... you're just copying from fantasy at that point. As a friend told me. It's just Flanderization of the Ork's aspect that they grow tougher and smarter the more they fight. Ork's are special to 40k because they're not as similar to LOTR Orks as you might think and by just turning them into monsters (beasts) you're ruining the fun magic behind them. I like the idea that Meks grow smart and make some awesome technology because of experience and experimentation... Not because they just unlocked level 999 abilities in their skill trees. We have to remember (some real Ork lore here... none of this headcanon stuff!) Orks (after the Old Ones) were a slave race to the Brain Boyz who were the ones who designed the Orks. They (unlike the Old Ones) had plenty of time to interject their own genetics and abilities into the Ork's so their race may live on through them (because they were all slowly dying of a plague). They focused on technology and creativity and not making big trolls!

Also how the hell would a gigantic Stompa Sized Ork in the cult of Speed supposed to be able to ride his kustom bike he spent most his life and teeth making? You're making some very sad Ork bikers GW!!!!

EH, I dunno where you're getting this, but orks have always worked like that. Them tinkering and figuring things out over time is your headcannon. In the fluff they have always gotten smarter and bigger as a direct result of fighting more and getting more buddies to join in. Some of them get bigger and meaner, others get smarter, others get trickier, and others get more medically proficient.

and if a stompa sized ork wants a warbike, hes gonna get one... Ain't no meks around big enough to say no when he tells them to make it; an ork that big does not need to scrimp and save for it either. He takes the teef he needs to pay anyone to make it... Not that you'd have to pay... Every mek in my army would kill for a chance to make a warbike the size of a titan.

I think Orks don't get smarter, they get more Kunnin'

 davou wrote:

 lolman1c wrote:
As for making Orks larger in the Beats Arises book... i think this was a kinda lazy and narrow idea... "GIANT ORKS!!! THAT'S HOW WE WILL MAKE THEM COOL!"... No... you're just copying from fantasy at that point. As a friend told me. It's just Flanderization of the Ork's aspect that they grow tougher and smarter the more they fight. Ork's are special to 40k because they're not as similar to LOTR Orks as you might think and by just turning them into monsters (beasts) you're ruining the fun magic behind them. I like the idea that Meks grow smart and make some awesome technology because of experience and experimentation... Not because they just unlocked level 999 abilities in their skill trees. We have to remember (some real Ork lore here... none of this headcanon stuff!) Orks (after the Old Ones) were a slave race to the Brain Boyz who were the ones who designed the Orks. They (unlike the Old Ones) had plenty of time to interject their own genetics and abilities into the Ork's so their race may live on through them (because they were all slowly dying of a plague). They focused on technology and creativity and not making big trolls!

Also how the hell would a gigantic Stompa Sized Ork in the cult of Speed supposed to be able to ride his kustom bike he spent most his life and teeth making? You're making some very sad Ork bikers GW!!!!

EH, I dunno where you're getting this, but orks have always worked like that. Them tinkering and figuring things out over time is your headcannon. In the fluff they have always gotten smarter and bigger as a direct result of fighting more and getting more buddies to join in. Some of them get bigger and meaner, others get smarter, others get trickier, and others get more medically proficient.

and if a stompa sized ork wants a warbike, hes gonna get one... Ain't no meks around big enough to say no when he tells them to make it; an ork that big does not need to scrimp and save for it either. He takes the teef he needs to pay anyone to make it... Not that you'd have to pay... Every mek in my army would kill for a chance to make a warbike the size of a titan.

It has always been more than just that or maybe GW has just retconned it out of existence since the old days... Orks do gain nutrition and skills from fighting but they get a lot more through experience and this aspect is largely ignored to make mindless killing machines (which is a role I always just associated with the young Ork Boyz). There are a few good threads out there that go into all the misconceptions modern GW has pushed with a lot of references to older books.

If this is the case then it's funny how the real worlds mirrors the 40k... Documentation and lore is lost to time as the people who wrote it vanish and new people come on who didn't read the old stuff. XD

 lolman1c wrote:

 davou wrote:

 lolman1c wrote:
As for making Orks larger in the Beats Arises book... i think this was a kinda lazy and narrow idea... "GIANT ORKS!!! THAT'S HOW WE WILL MAKE THEM COOL!"... No... you're just copying from fantasy at that point. As a friend told me. It's just Flanderization of the Ork's aspect that they grow tougher and smarter the more they fight. Ork's are special to 40k because they're not as similar to LOTR Orks as you might think and by just turning them into monsters (beasts) you're ruining the fun magic behind them. I like the idea that Meks grow smart and make some awesome technology because of experience and experimentation... Not because they just unlocked level 999 abilities in their skill trees. We have to remember (some real Ork lore here... none of this headcanon stuff!) Orks (after the Old Ones) were a slave race to the Brain Boyz who were the ones who designed the Orks. They (unlike the Old Ones) had plenty of time to interject their own genetics and abilities into the Ork's so their race may live on through them (because they were all slowly dying of a plague). They focused on technology and creativity and not making big trolls!

Also how the hell would a gigantic Stompa Sized Ork in the cult of Speed supposed to be able to ride his kustom bike he spent most his life and teeth making? You're making some very sad Ork bikers GW!!!!

EH, I dunno where you're getting this, but orks have always worked like that. Them tinkering and figuring things out over time is your headcannon. In the fluff they have always gotten smarter and bigger as a direct result of fighting more and getting more buddies to join in. Some of them get bigger and meaner, others get smarter, others get trickier, and others get more medically proficient.

and if a stompa sized ork wants a warbike, hes gonna get one... Ain't no meks around big enough to say no when he tells them to make it; an ork that big does not need to scrimp and save for it either. He takes the teef he needs to pay anyone to make it... Not that you'd have to pay... Every mek in my army would kill for a chance to make a warbike the size of a titan.

It has always been more than just that or maybe GW has just retconned it out of existence since the old days... Orks do gain nutrition and skills from fighting but they get a lot more through experience and this aspect is largely ignored to make mindless killing machines (which is a role I always just associated with the young Ork Boyz). There are a few good threads out there that go into all the misconceptions modern GW has pushed with a lot of references to older books.

You're misrepresenting the fluff. At least as far back as 3rd ed ork codex (oldest I've got) they've always gotten bigger and more threatening the bigger and more threatening they've gotten.

Don't try and make it seem like experience does not play into it, because it certainly does. The 'beasts' on the slaughter series didn't get to be three stories tall because they inherited it genetically last week. They spent a lifetime (or more) fighting other nasty orks and each other. An ork that lives to 300 years old on barren asteroid punching rocks is never going to make it to nob sized... But a boy that has to deal with having his ass beat on by an army of warbosses for a decade will probably be warboss sized hiself by the end of it.

Suggesting that the fluff has been different in the past is misleading. Orks are unique in that they get bigger and stronger as a result of getting beaten on and beating on people. The beast series wasn't lazy in that way, it respected the fluff; the orks therein were terrifying because they made it past that meatgrinder and out into a gian galaxy spanning waaagh.

They dont have R&D teams comming up with amazing choppas, or academies teaching ork martial arts and militarycraft. They just beat on each other and things start to click. You punch a mek in the head because the shoota he handed you sucks, and the next one will suck less Or he's bigger than you and you get punched back (then you get bigger). When its your turn to see the painboy and his last patient is a gibbering ooze, you have your giant buddies threaten to feed his face to a giant squigg and it goes better.

Violence is the driver in ork society, not progress

I think you misunderstand me. I'm not saying that what you are saying is wrong. I am saying it has been pushed too much to the point you have gigantic Orks the size of buildings! It was an over expression of one aspect of the Orks. What would have been interesting to see was Orks that were Large (maybe dreadnought sized large) but focus was on their intelligence. I understand they spoke fluent Gothic in the books (they even sent ambassadors to the Imperials looking for terms of surrender) but the imagery just focused on the idea that every Ork just keeps growing to be that size is something I have a problem with. "Bigger is better!" is something I see a lot from Gw and their writers. A mech could be in a thousand battles against a thousand races but might not have the same drive and intelligence as another mech who has been in less battles but somehow turned a moon into a weapon! Orks can be just as much individuals than any other race. Look as Ghaz! He wasn't just a Warboss who stomped his way up... he was a nobody Boy who given a driving force that made him better and bigger than the other Orks! Any Warboss can smash a lot but Ghaz has a mission and is an individual in a green tide! If they just turn him into a "big ork!" then he'll just be a big bad orky boss... not an individual who has special characteristics relating to him. It's like Girly man... I just see him as Pappa smerf now thanks to GW... I don't even have a real clue about him as an individual.

This might just be me but I never really felt like the Beasts were Individuals... Even the Imperium makes this mistake. Orks used to be full of individual characters and even the models represented this (just look at all the different clan models and characters you sued to be able to get). Now they're just "Big Orks" with names I don't even remember.

In terms of "R&D teams comming up with amazing choppa" they actually kinda do. They're called Gretchins.

 lolman1c wrote:
I think you misunderstand me. I'm not saying that what you are saying is wrong. I am saying it has been pushed too much to the point you have gigantic Orks the size of buildings! It was an over expression of one aspect of the Orks.

That's Black Library for you. Those guys have restraint of Michael Bay on crack. They have over hyped their marines to such a degree that they need to write house sized orks to challenge them.

Okay thats fair.... But at the same time this is a game where we have 9 foot tall dudes..... Who are the progeny of 12 foot tall dudes, who can throw tanks around and be hit in the face with weapons that break buildings down and get up afterwards.

And to cut them a BIT more slack.... It seems like the primork thing is rare as hell.... Maybe ever rare'er than humans and their emperor. Orks are stupid populous, and there have been almost no primeorks.

At the very least, the ork Ubermench thing fits their narrative and isnt just a random supergod born in 6000 bc

 davou wrote:
Okay thats fair.... But at the same time this is a game where we have 9 foot tall dudes..... Who are the progeny of 12 foot tall dudes, who can throw tanks around and be hit in the face with weapons that break buildings down and get up afterwards.

That's BL stuff. Studio marines are seven feet tall, and I don't remember any mention of any tank throwing in codices. Though these days BL fanwank has polluted the studio fluff too, and we have giant primarchs running around...

 davou wrote:
Okay thats fair.... But at the same time this is a game where we have 9 foot tall dudes..... Who are the progeny of 12 foot tall dudes, who can throw tanks around and be hit in the face with weapons that break buildings down and get up afterwards.

And to cut them a BIT more slack.... It seems like the primork thing is rare as hell.... Maybe ever rare'er than humans and their emperor. Orks are stupid populous, and there have been almost no primeorks.

With regards to the 9ft becoming 12ft... as I say... "Big is better" Gw is just illustrating how cool Marines are through their height and not actually through giving us some cool marine characters. Would have been nice if they had given us the story of just one primaries born into a world of war but I don't think they even have any named characters outside of HQ's (none in the lore...). But look at IG! They're small and yet you can bring up a bunch of low ranking individuals in the lore who people grew connected to. That Baneblade book, for example, just tells the story of a small team in a Babeblade and even has a part where they fight a single Ork (if my memory servers me right). That single Ork had more character than I have seen in a while from GW.

I always kinda thought (now this is my own headcannon) that Orks eventually become the Korks (what they were meant to be) before they kinda just became lazy. There is even a lot of evidence to suggest the Snottlings were the ones who created Orks once the Old Ones were done with them (well there hasn't been any in a while)... Now to think that the smallest and must underrated aspect of Ork society was actually the most important would make one heck of a story!

“According to legend, the intelligent lost race of Snotlings, known as the Brainboyz, were still diminutive, so they bred a race of less-intelligent, but tougher, larger and more brutal creatures to do their work and fight their wars. These were the Orks and Gretchin.”
(Waaargh! The Orks, pg.6)

Hey guys, kindly take any further discussion regarding the fluff of those zany killer space mushrooms to the relevant subforum please, thanks!

 Blackie wrote:

 CREEEEEEEEED wrote:
Maybe not a line, but 'a release' that isn't just a character like the necron guy recently, but a couple of units.

But necrons don't have units or characters that belong to the 90s like the warboss or buggies. Necrons are all quite recent models, they don't need anything new. What about finecast monopose squads? Those are something that sould be updated as well and necrons only have flayed ones IIRC other than characters. Orks have kommandos and tankbustas that no one buys because they're very expensive, monopose and made in finecast, any ork player kitbashes those units using regular boyz because the original kits are terrible.
.

But yeah... In conclusion, just making Big Ork models is a bad move over making cool unique models that you can characterise yourself.

 Dysartes wrote:
As AndrewGPaul mentioned, when this was released the Skorcha was a different vehicle entirely - a wartrakk with a trailer, from memory - see the painted example here.

Yes, but this thing doesn't look anything like vehicle in art Iinked, which is closest to buggy out of all ork models.

 AndrewGPaul wrote:
That looks more like an artist's impression of a multi-melta, to me. Also, a Scorcha is based on a Wartrakk (the kettenrad-looking halftrack), not a Warbuggy.

Um, no. Multiple rows of round holes on a shroud linking both barrels always meant flamer IIRC. Like this one:



or this:



Now, the thing on buggy might be MM (which would be kinda wrong as even earliest MM looked like modern one, two barrels with long holes in cross pattern), but the thing in art is definitely a scorcha, and looking at early ork weapons you won't find MM, but their heavy flamer looks remarkably like buggy weapon, long straight pipe hole with fuel tanks, no cones anywhere.

my 3rd edition codex says that it could take a flamer, shoota, ect... no metla. Might be different before though.

I thought the gas tanks on the warbuggy's weapon was a nod to Mad Max Road Warrior were some of the guns were air fired.

Guys! It came out in 2nd Ed. It was a Multi-Melta.

End of story.

 lolman1c wrote:
my 3rd edition codex says that it could take a flamer, shoota, ect... no metla. Might be different before though.

It was, lolman1c - remember that the Warbuggy and War Trak kits were released during 2nd edition.

History of the Buggy, Trak and Skorcha

Alrighty then...

During Rogue Trader, the vehicles for Orks - other than the Battlewagon - were released in metal, not plastic. And I believe they were a pain to keep together.

If we go back to the 1991 Catalogue, we can see the metal War Buggy, Scorcher and War Trak.

If you zoom in, you'll note that even at this point flamer weapons only come with the Scorcher, and neither the Buggy nor Trak have one in their parts listing.

By the 1995/6 Annual, the metal vehicles are no longer on offer, but we can see the "current" Ork design for the multi-melta on their Heavy Weapons page. Note the sort of - shape markings on the multi-melta barrel.

By the 1997 Annual, we have the plastic buggy (which means is it now over 20 years old...) - note the markings on the barrel are a - shape rather than circular.

By the 1999 Annual, we have the plastic Trukk, Trak and the plastic/metal hybrid Trak Scorcha - note the design of the flamer on the Scorcha compared to the weapon on the buggy. They are definitely different weapons at this point.

Codex: Orks (2nd edition) has the Scorcher as armed with a Scorcher (shockingly), while the options for the War Buggy are listed as "Heavy plasma gun, lascannon, twin-linked autocannon and multi-melta".

Where the confusion seems to creep in is in the army lists in the 3rd edition CRB - War Buggies/War Traks are one unit entry, where the weapon options are twin-linked rokkit launcher, scorcher or twin-linked big shoota. The only difference in Codex: Orks seems to be the addition of the mega-blasta as a weapon - though I can't seem to find the stats in the book, oddly.

My guess is that what was the multi-melta was intended to be used as the mega-blasta at that point.

...and I may have been typing this too long.

Hell, I remember Wartrakks with Lascannons being fired by Orks with German Officer hats.....

Still funny how Warbuggies are from 2nd edition 40k, and Wartrakks and Scorchas are still leftovers from Gorkamorka.

I guess that because some of these minis are older than the people playing the game they forget (or just don't know) that once upon a time Orks used to use the same weapons as the Imperium.

Ork Boyz had Bolt Pistols, and wielded autocannons, meltaguns, heavy plasma guns and even heavy stubbers. Ork Dreadnoughts had heavy bolters and lascannons.

This all changed when Gorkamorka changed everything to 'sluggaz', 'shootaz' and so on. Then 3rd Ed Orks came along and all that old Imperial weaponry was gone.

*Pulls H.B.M.C a rocking chair up on the porch*

"When I was a lad..."

Yeah, i had a few models with the imperium weapons. Hehe, they also had robots. That was funny. Didn't orks also have the same BS as marines as well?

 lolman1c wrote:
Yeah, i had a few models with the imperium weapons. Hehe, they also had robots. That was funny. Didn't orks also have the same BS as marines as well?

They had WS and BS of 3 in 2nd edition, with 3rd making them WS4 and BS2 as well as replacing their “Imperial” weapons with Ork-name analogues.

Okay, for the June Orks rumor to have any merit, we need to consider the following: Dark Eldar are this weekend. We all ready know the next three codex's. There is that AoS mermaid elf army to be released. We only have 87 days until the end of June.

After Dark Eldar get released there are 84 days left.

One week of previews, and one week for releases of 4 other armies. That in and of itself puts us at 56 days, if there is an army release every other week without interruption. Even if there isn't another AoS release or some other boxed game, that only leaves three spare weekends.

Are there any actual rumours in this thread?


I'm wishing for a plastic squiggoth.

 Mousemuffins wrote:
Are there any actual rumours in this thread?


I'm wishing for a plastic squiggoth.

Well considering I just purchased, assembled and painted a regular and Gargantuan squiggoth, I'd say you're wish is as close to coming true as it could possible ever be!

Not that I'd mind adding another Squiggoth or two to the herd....

Plastic squiggoths for like £40 each would be awesome! Orks heed more snakebite stuff!

 Grimtuff wrote:

 Blackie wrote:

 CREEEEEEEEED wrote:
Maybe not a line, but 'a release' that isn't just a character like the necron guy recently, but a couple of units.

But necrons don't have units or characters that belong to the 90s like the warboss or buggies. Necrons are all quite recent models, they don't need anything new. What about finecast monopose squads? Those are something that sould be updated as well and necrons only have flayed ones IIRC other than characters. Orks have kommandos and tankbustas that no one buys because they're very expensive, monopose and made in finecast, any ork player kitbashes those units using regular boyz because the original kits are terrible.
.

Well they say there's no accounting for taste...

The Kommando and Tankbusta kits are excellent (I own both in metal so I'll concede the Finecrap point). You keep throwing around this phrase "belongs in the 90's". What do you even mean by this? Do you even know what you're trying to argue? Is it the monopose aspect (Take a look at the Plague Marines. I've got some bad news...)? Seeing as 90's Orks consisted of mini SS Stormboyz and Kommando models in woolly hats (Tankbustas did not exist until the 3rd ed. Ork dex which incidentally was released in 199, but I digress). The current Brian Nelson designed Ork range is ace and looks nothing like the "90's" Orks of old. The only remnants of this are the Warbuggies and Wartrakks. Both of the things Ork players are crying out to be redone.

With kits from the 90s I mean buggies, trakks, the warboss, ghaz and grotsnik. Probably the metal kopta as well. Those are all very old models and even if I like them (I really do) they look ancient, especially ghaz that is supposed to be a legendary warboss in an age in which even elves (ynnead) and girls (celestine) are bigger.

Kommandos and bustas are nice, I also own them, but do you only need 5 of them? Absolutely not, and I can't stand having two identical models in the same army You also get a rocket hammer, a pair of pistols and a nob with klaw that you may not want to use, so buying multiple of those kits costs a fortune and gives you only a few models to play with.

About the monopose aspect: maybe GW wants to promote monopose kits, I don't know that but I surely can't stand them (and in fact deathguard and primaris are IMHO among the ugliest miniatures since decades) and I wish it won't be a thing with eventual new orks releases.

Imperial Armour volume 8 had some interesting artwork of new designs for warbuggies - making them look like dune buggies with roll-cages and the like - that never made it itno miniatures. They'd be cool if a new model is forthcoming.

Ah yes, those! For the longest time I assumed that these were sneak previews of upcoming kits, much like how the plastic Valkyrie was previewed as a technical drawing (well, they used the CAD file) in one of the Aeronautica Imperialis books.



Good look to them, modular as well at first glance, with tracks and wheels as options for front and back.

Cool designs for sure, but they feel less Orky and more Mad Max. I think it's the roll cage that does it. Orks care not for safety.

Roll bars give you more room to mount guns and glyphs and trophies and for boyz to hang on to ride.

Or go full Fury Road and attach rusty spikes everywhere, just like those cannibals did.

I’m not sure I’d look to Forgeworld assets to predict what GW will do, based on the ways they’ve diverted on design decisions in the past - think Mekadreds vs Gorkanauts.

I do expect something a bit more Mad Max from GW’s designs. FW’s drawing is nice and functional but doesn’t really take advantage of GW’s flashier plastic design techniques.

I’d also hope that we get more interesting weapon options than big shootas and rokkits. Those are fine standbys but some specialized weapons would be a good way to make buggies more appealing.

Melee weapons for buggies would be particularly amusing. Spikes, chains, the gunner wielding a stikkbomb lance....

I can totally understand why many people want the Trakks and Buggies to be upgraded, but honesty, I see them being scrapped instead. They're just not that interesting compared to what Orks have now ('Kopters, Warbikes), so if they return, I can see them as a sort of middle ground between Trukks and Bikes, relatively tough and loaded with special weapons, not just a Flamer or a Melta, sort of like the Hellhounds, but speedier.

For me personally, I'd like a Skarboy set. Ten Boyz, automatically with 'Ard Armor, with either Mek-enchanced shields (5++ and maybe some other zany rule) or Speshul Choppas/Big Choppas that does something cool. Like a toolbox version of the Nobs, but with the size of Boyz.

 AndrewGPaul wrote:
Imperial Armour volume 8 had some interesting artwork of new designs for warbuggies - making them look like dune buggies with roll-cages and the like - that never made it itno miniatures. They'd be cool if a new model is forthcoming.

Well those still could be. And have been just waiting for release. While rare wouldn"t be first time model has been designed and waited even years for release

 The Wise Dane wrote:
I can totally understand why many people want the Trakks and Buggies to be upgraded, but honesty, I see them being scrapped instead. They're just not that interesting compared to what Orks have now ('Kopters, Warbikes), so if they return, I can see them as a sort of middle ground between Trukks and Bikes, relatively tough and loaded with special weapons, not just a Flamer or a Melta, sort of like the Hellhounds, but speedier.

For me personally, I'd like a Skarboy set. Ten Boyz, automatically with 'Ard Armor, with either Mek-enchanced shields (5++ and maybe some other zany rule) or Speshul Choppas/Big Choppas that does something cool. Like a toolbox version of the Nobs, but with the size of Boyz.

There's been a bit of speculation/rumormongering over Kult of Speed getting its own Codex.

I've personally been wondering for awhile about The Beast Arises and whether or not we might see some of the stuff from there make its way into the new game. There's something not unlike what you're talking about where there's Boyz in 'Ard Armor with what amount to slab shields and shootas that fight in a shield line and have Gretchin mixed into the unit that unleash Bomb Squigs that run out in front of them when they lift the shields.

Ignorant question for people who are familiar with older 40k editions: What is the purpose of having Trakks or Buggies? Vehicle hunting mostly? Obj. camping? HQ/Monster harassment? Would they be suitable replacements for the Tankbustas+Trukk strategy? Did the Tankbusta+Trukk strat. come about because Trakks and Buggies became unviable?

I know Biker swarms used to be everywhere...

To be sure, some updated Ork Buggy/Trakk models might look really really cool , but why field them (generally, or in a Kult of Speed army)

Rule of cool comes to mind, though personally I am more a collector first, gamer second.

 Whazgog Da Despot wrote:
Ignorant question for people who are familiar with older 40k editions: What is the purpose of having Trakks or Buggies? Vehicle hunting mostly? Obj. camping? HQ/Monster harassment? Would they be suitable replacements for the Tankbustas+Trukk strategy? Did the Tankbusta+Trukk strat. come about because Trakks and Buggies became unviable?

I know Biker swarms used to be everywhere...

To be sure, some updated Ork Buggy/Trakk models might look really really cool , but why field them (generally, or in a Kult of Speed army)

I don’t think there’s ever been a great reason to field them besides being cheap, fast harassment units.

Personally I think they’re thematically cooler than other Ork fast attack options, so I’d love to see a good kit come out. I hardly ever play so I’m more interested in the aesthetics.

BrookM wrote:Rule of cool comes to mind.

theocracity wrote: I’m more interested in the aesthetics.

I'm more of a collector as well so I also follow the Rule of Cool. Was just curious. Thanks

If you're after a 'new' buggy it's worth a look here

https://www.zinge.co.uk/products/modular-military-buggy



although it's resin the price is probably cheaper than a new GW plastic one would be now anyway

I can't find that picture in the latest white dwarf..

theocracity wrote:

 Whazgog Da Despot wrote:
Ignorant question for people who are familiar with older 40k editions: What is the purpose of having Trakks or Buggies? Vehicle hunting mostly? Obj. camping? HQ/Monster harassment? Would they be suitable replacements for the Tankbustas+Trukk strategy? Did the Tankbusta+Trukk strat. come about because Trakks and Buggies became unviable?

I know Biker swarms used to be everywhere...

To be sure, some updated Ork Buggy/Trakk models might look really really cool , but why field them (generally, or in a Kult of Speed army)

I don’t think there’s ever been a great reason to field them besides being cheap, fast harassment units.

In 5th edition the were used in many competitive ork lists for tank hunting. They would come in from the flanks and fire rokkits into rear armor, potentially destroying the vehicle or its main gun or at least scoring a "shaken" result on the damage table, preventing the vehicle from shooting next turn. With the editions vehicle became increasingly harder to kill, but the damage of buggies pretty much stayed the same, causing them to be out of a job nowadays.

 OrlandotheTechnicoloured wrote:
If you're after a 'new' buggy it's worth a look here

https://www.zinge.co.uk/products/modular-military-buggy



although it's resin the price is probably cheaper than a new GW plastic one would be now anyway

That’s a pretty good buggy. The modular template style isn’t exactly to my taste, but that could look proppa with some work done to it.

 Jidmah wrote:

theocracity wrote:

 Whazgog Da Despot wrote:
Ignorant question for people who are familiar with older 40k editions: What is the purpose of having Trakks or Buggies? Vehicle hunting mostly? Obj. camping? HQ/Monster harassment? Would they be suitable replacements for the Tankbustas+Trukk strategy? Did the Tankbusta+Trukk strat. come about because Trakks and Buggies became unviable?

I know Biker swarms used to be everywhere...

To be sure, some updated Ork Buggy/Trakk models might look really really cool , but why field them (generally, or in a Kult of Speed army)

I don’t think there’s ever been a great reason to field them besides being cheap, fast harassment units.

In 5th edition the were used in many competitive ork lists for tank hunting. They would come in from the flanks and fire rokkits into rear army, potentially destroying the vehicle or its main gun or at least scoring a "shaken" result on the damage table, preventing the vehicle from shooting next turn. With the editions vehicle became increasingly harder to kill, but the damage of buggies pretty much stayed the same, causing them to be out of a job nowadays.

I seem to recall Deffkoptas being the more popular unit for that role. It was basically a tossup between the two rules wise, and Deffkoptas tended to win - possibly because they had the more modern plastic kit.

Of course, neither of them were popular compared to Nob Bikers, which seemed to be the dominant strategy in my admittedly hazy memory.

The only reason deff kotas were used instead of buggies was that they came with AOBR, which was 5th edition's starter set. Competitive players would convert their koptas to buggies.
Buggies had the advantage of being vehicles, which meant that they basically had a 5++ save due to the damage table (only 3+ destroyed open topped vehicles unless the weapon was AP1) and were difficult to harm with low strength weapons, while koptas suffered instant death from anything S8 or higher due to their 4+1 toughness.
On top of that they would not suffer from moral and were cheaper in points. Not to mention that they could easily provide cover due to squadron rules.

The top lists played were battlewagon bash for 1750 or more points, which featured battlewagons, lootaz and buggies, at lower point levels the kan wall was the list of choice since many armies were unable to handle nine walkers with 4++ saves backed by 80+ boyz with 4+ cover.
Nob bikers sometimes appeared as part of battle wagon lists, but they got worse the more codices got released: SW long fang spam and JotWW, IG leaf blower, MC Phiston, GK Psyfelmen and anything necrons could blow them right of the board, since wound allocation shenanigans wouldn't work against all those S8 shots flying around. Therefore battlewagon lists usually ran a unit of regular nobz in a dedicated transport battlewagon instead to gain access to a fourth rolla.

 Jidmah wrote:
The only reason deff kotas were used instead of buggies was that they came with AOBR, which was 5th edition's starter set. Competitive players would convert their koptas to buggies.
Buggies had the advantage of being vehicles, which meant that they basically had a 5++ save due to the damage table (only 3+ destroyed open topped vehicles unless the weapon was AP1) and were difficult to harm with low strength weapons, while koptas suffered instant death from anything S8 or higher due to their 4+1 toughness.
On top of that they would not suffer from moral and were cheaper in points. Not to mention that they could easily provide cover due to squadron rules.

The top lists played were battlewagon bash for 1750 or more points, which featured battlewagons, lootaz and buggies, at lower point levels the kan wall was the list of choice since many armies were unable to handle nine walkers with 4++ saves backed by 80+ boyz with 4+ cover.
Nob bikers sometimes appeared as part of battle wagon lists, but they got worse the more codices got released: SW long fang spam and JotWW, IG leaf blower, MC Phiston, GK Psyfelmen and anything necrons could blow them right of the board, since wound allocation shenanigans wouldn't work against all those S8 shots flying around. Therefore battlewagon lists usually ran a unit of regular nobz in a dedicated transport battlewagon instead to gain access to a fourth rolla.

Ahhh... Those were the days. Back when we'd wait 6 months between codexes.

Then again is quantity or quality more important? GW went for quantity now and poor ad mech, grey knights etc have to wait for god knows how long now for functional codex. Plus now most factions got zero new models to boot and have to wait for ages for those

I wouldn't consider any codex non-functional or unplayable. Not compared to what we've had before in previous editions that's for sure.

With regards Ork release rumours. Valrak has claimed he has an insider who has told him we're going to get a "Prime-Ork" Ghazzy (which for me is way overdue). That doesn't mean Primaris-Boyz, just a big, beastly model for Ghaz.

Someone mentioned earlier that the WD picture had been debunked? Can I ask for a source on this as I've been following the rumour mill pretty closely and I've not seen the anything disproving it for sure, just a lot of educated guesses.

If we get new models, here's what I'd expect/hope for -

HQs -
Warboss in mega armour/new Ghazzy interchangeable model.
Standard Big Mek with KFF and weapon options.
Normal warboss with weapon options.
New Weirdboy/Zogwort interchangeable model.

Elites -
Plastic Tankbustas unlikely
Plastic Kommandos unlikely

Troops -
New Boyz possible but unlikely

Fast Attack -
New Buggies/Trakks/Skorcha interchangeable kit
AOBR DeffKoptas with possible additional sprue for weapon options

Heavy Support -
I think Big Gunz will be removed, they look awful and Mek Gunz fulfill the same role

You'll note a lack of 'Painboy on Bike' or 'Mek on Bike', I think these units will go and we'll get a similar function on a new Buggy kit or we'll have to use index rules. Technically we have Nobz on Bikes already (both in the Warbikers kit and Forgeworld) and Warboss on Bike (with Zhadsnark).

Looking at the list it might seem like a lot of units but it's only 3 HQ Clampacks, a new "big' Buggy/Trakk kit and a 'big' Ghazzy kit. The Deffkopta would be a simple re-release of an existing sprue and the other possibilities are unlikely.

The big tickets this leaves are - Mad Dok Grotsnik and Nob with WAAAGGGHH!! Banner. Perhaps Mad Dok will get a release with Ghazz at a later point and the WAAAGGHH!! Banner Nob will be interchangeable with Weirdboy kit?

Either way, I really, really hope we get some new models else I have no idea why GW would leave our release so late.

Well this is a pretty terrible first glance, if it is.

The walker definitely looks like a dreadknight conversion.

Everything in this could be a conversion.

The possibilities for what GW could be bringing are, new plastic buggy (Trakks/Skorcha), a-la above. New plastic deffkopters, new plastic kommandos/tankbusters. A plastic Ghazzy. Any of the characters in plastic (including Waaagh banner nob) + anything else GW thinks we need but don't really need.

Edit, oh and the big gunz they do look bad but really just need a sprue ala Mek Gunz. (I don't think they will be gotten rid of as everyone already has these models and uses them). Interchangeable options in the kit will give you ability to create mortar/catapult/kannon/zzap gun.

This is completely my conspiracy theory, but.....Doesn't GW usually release a game from their past in the fall (Bloodbowl, Necromunda, etc.), and didn't they make a cool game called Gorka Morka that featured Buggies and Trukks, and doesn't that seem to be awfully close to the rumored Ork codex release date? Just sayin......

Smellingsalts wrote:
This is completely my conspiracy theory, but.....Doesn't GW usually release a game from their past in the fall (Bloodbowl, Necromunda, etc.), and didn't they make a cool game called Gorka Morka that featured Buggies and Trukks, and doesn't that seem to be awfully close to the rumored Ork codex release date? Just sayin......

They did, and it was one of the best Specialist Games - alas they derped all over themselves by hugely over-printing foreign language versions of the game, and by the time all the unsold ones had been recalled and pulped GorkaMorka was seen by the company as a financial failure. Now of course, that couldn't be their fault, so they'll likely not consider GM a viable release.

Also, last call was Adeptus Titanicus this year, I thought?

A Gorkamorka box along the lines of Forgebane maybe? A couple of Trukks, 20 boyz and, say four of the new Buggy/Trakk kits would be a good start. Dunno about the rules though. Borrowed from Necromunda?

Or something that ties into Kill Team perhaps. Kill Team: Gorkamorka?

 Oguhmek wrote:
A Gorkamorka box along the lines of Forgebane maybe? A couple of Trukks, 20 boyz and, say four of the new Buggy/Trakk kits would be a good start. Dunno about the rules though. Borrowed from Necromunda?

Or something that ties into Kill Team perhaps. Kill Team: Gorkamorka?

I mean, if they did decide to use it to launch new Ork models, it would be a half-arsed rerelease of the original rules ala Shadow War with as you say a Forgebane-style mixer of mostly old models with a couple of new ones. It wouldn't be the worst thing in the world, but TBH GorkaMorka deserves better.

Gorkamorka was actually a helluva lot of fun. The expansion gangs were damn cool, too, with all-Grot rebels using wind-powered vehicles with Snotlings as juves, Mad-Max humans that wanted to be Orks but actually had their leaders owing allegiance to Necrons, and Mutants who were decendents of a crashed Imperial ship using archeotech weapons, but all rode mutant horses like desert nomads.

There have been many times I have thought about using modern Orks and their vehicles to remake a basic set of Gorkers vs. Morkers, and use modern plastic Grots to reinforce my Rebel Grot warband, even though they would need some really kitbashed vehicles.

It was just about the very height of what the crazy Specialist Games imaginations could do.