I know its AOS (it says so on the pc) but thats probably the most Warhammer pic I have seen from AOS I can;t see a single thing that would not work in the Old World?
Seeing the cover art with bestmen, a non Kharadron/Fyreslayer Dwarf, a very bretonnia-esque Knight and nothing that immediately says "age of sigmar", i thought it was The Old World at first. Seems a bit strange that it's not.
That cover art is seriously doing its best to evoke classic fantasy vibes and pretend it isn't AoS. Not that it's a terrible idea. The setting has more than enough range to allow for something closer to WHQ's original tone. Bit sad that it's Nurgle (or Chaos in general really) but whatever.
The rumours did say "Rockgut Troggoths but Nurgle", so that checks out. Very keen for this, both as the softlaunch for a new Nurgle refresh and to see what new niches they'll carve out. Love the low-er fantasy style for the heroes in the box art, my only cosmetic gripe with Cursed City was the way the eclectic heroes grated against the dark and grimy dead city
So far there’s only been compatibility between the first two AoS ones.
Whilst of course we don’t know more right now? I wish GW would Commit To The Bit and do a Proper Fat Bestiary for this one. Let us use whichever toys we have in our collection to populate a dungeon.
They very nearly kinda did it with Hammerhal, where they released loads of Adventurer Rules based on existing character models. But to be honest? Too many Heroes spoil the Spelunking Broth.
It’s variety of victims monsters that I crave.
Not only does it keep options as fresh as can be? But it’s a great excuse for a hobbyist to buy a box here and there. And that is damned good for sales.
Oh, hells yes! ^_^ I'm really surprised they didn;t save this for Warhammer Day in a few weeks - unless they know some leakers have access to a lot more details...
Hopefully this release goes better than the last one.
Looking at the heroes....I am intrigued too. Though I don't know about the game itself. I just really don't like the modern Quest mechanics compared to the original way it played.
SamusDrake wrote: But wait a minute...didn't they remove Beastmen from AOS?
The lore explanation for Beasts of Chaos leaving AoS is that the 4 Chaos Gods needed re-inforcements. They took from the undivided ranks of the Beastmen, leaving the BoC as a faction devastated and largely irrelevant in the story of AoS. They dropped some plot hooks to leave it open for their return, but that's going to be a ways off probably, if at all.
Tzaangor stayed put in Disciples of Tzeentch, Slaangor stayed in Hedonites of Slaanesh. Now we have Pestigor coming, which makes me hopeful that Blades of Khorne get their own variant down the road.
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Angronsrosycheeks wrote: I do hope there's a wider selection of heroes in the box, but I am looking forward to more previous at the very least.
That was my immediate thought as well, but maybe they'll do like classic WHQ and release character packs.
If these are the not plaguebearers, they seems to be a huge missed opportunity. Nothing more boring than when a new unit is the same as an old one but bigger.
streetsamurai wrote: If these are the not plaguebearers, they seems to be a huge missed opportunity. Nothing more boring than when a new unit is the same as an old one but bigger.
But let's wait and see
Maybe they're bigger to justify making them units of 7 for the same price?
Looking at the Heroes and looking at the baddies, looks like the "light" opponents are Pestigor, and the heroes about to get properly clobbered.
Unless they free Gotrek from a dungeon in the first scenario, the matchup is not particulary even.
Fayric wrote: Looking at the Heroes and looking at the baddies, looks like the "light" opponents are Pestigor, and the heroes about to get properly clobbered.
Unless they free Gotrek from a dungeon in the first scenario, the matchup is not particulary even.
All the way back to Heroquest, 'Quest' covers have shown the heroes way outnumbered! What true hero fights against even odds?
JimmyWolf87 wrote: That cover art is seriously doing its best to evoke classic fantasy vibes and pretend it isn't AoS. Not that it's a terrible idea. The setting has more than enough range to allow for something closer to WHQ's original tone. Bit sad that it's Nurgle (or Chaos in general really) but whatever.
My personal headcannon for Cursed City is that it's a city on the edge of the chaos wastes. No sigmarines helps sell the classic Warhammer setting!
I imagine the art looking so classic fantasy is very much on purpose. Appealing to a broad Warhammer Fantasy audience is a good idea. I also wonder if the female knight looking so much like a yelling Michael McGee, the Vein Popping Guy is also very much on purpose. I certainly hope it is.
So, I don't like to be negative- when a release comes out, whether I like it or not, I prefer to let others enjoy it without my two cents. Yes, I've made a few negative comments about Heresy era games that exclude what I consider to be the interesting factions in the game, but I generally prefer to avoid Heresy threads, knowing that I have very few positive things to contribute.
I expect that it's going to be the same with this game. I'll make my one post about it, and then I'll try to avoid posts about it for the rest of its (hopefully short) lifespan.
Dear GW: We had a simple plan- an unwritten rule, that Quest games would alternate between settings.
On that note GW, are you so fething stupid, are your memories so cataclysmically short and your brains so putrified that you forget that the last Quest game was an AoS game?
On behalf of EVERYONE who was eagerly awaiting a 40k Quest game, feth you GW. feth you right in the eye.
I'm super excited for this. I've enjoyed all the WHQ so far, they're great social games, nothing complex and good to spend time having a laugh with mates. I'll get getting the second I can.
PenitentJake wrote: So, I don't like to be negative- when a release comes out, whether I like it or not, I prefer to let others enjoy it without my two cents. Yes, I've made a few negative comments about Heresy era games that exclude what I consider to be the interesting factions in the game, but I generally prefer to avoid Heresy threads, knowing that I have very few positive things to contribute.
I expect that it's going to be the same with this game. I'll make my one post about it, and then I'll try to avoid posts about it for the rest of its (hopefully short) lifespan.
Dear GW: We had a simple plan- an unwritten rule, that Quest games would alternate between settings.
On that note GW, are you so fething stupid, are your memories so cataclysmically short and your brains so putrified that you forget that the last Quest game was an AoS game?
On behalf of EVERYONE who was eagerly awaiting a 40k Quest game, feth you GW. feth you right in the eye.
Here endeth the angry rant.
That was never the rule. The first of the modern Warhammer Quest games was Silver Tower, followed by Shadows Over Hammerhal, then Blackstone Fortress, then Cursed City. So, it was two AoS quest games in a row to start with. So, perhaps not the best idea to be throwing around accusations of stupidity and forgetfulness.
Well that is an exceedingly generic WFB-esque DnD cover.
There's nothing in that image that says AOS at all and barely anything that says warhammer. the plague guys are so similar in colour to the background they disappear.
It actually reminds me of the kind of art the talisman boardgames from BI and FFG used to have.
Do we know if they're sticking with the mechanics? I've avoided all versions since they Redid them
Will probably get a full reveal on Warhammer Day or something.
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Hellebore wrote: Well that is an exceedingly generic WFB-esque DnD cover.
There's nothing in that image that says AOS at all and barely anything that says warhammer. the plague guys are so similar in colour to the background they disappear.
It actually reminds me of the kind of art the talisman boardgames from BI and FFG used to have.
Do we know if they're sticking with the mechanics? I've avoided all versions since they Redid them
I think you've pointed out my issue, it looks too generic. There's no real flare or anything to that box cover. Maybe on purpose, but there's nothing to make it stand out from a hundred other generic fantasy dungeon crawlers.
Hellebore wrote: Well that is an exceedingly generic WFB-esque DnD cover.
There's nothing in that image that says AOS at all and barely anything that says warhammer. the plague guys are so similar in colour to the background they disappear.
It actually reminds me of the kind of art the talisman boardgames from BI and FFG used to have.
Do we know if they're sticking with the mechanics? I've avoided all versions since they Redid them
I doubt they will make significant changes to how the game works. I fully expect it to be a co-operative dungeon crawler (no 'games master' type role like Shadows over Hammerhal) with an 'activation dice' core mechanic and custom D6, D8 and D12 action dice. I honestly can't see them doing anything other than that and certainly nothing like what the old 1995 Warhammer Quest game was with all the expansive RPG type elements. That said, I do hope they release some sort of bestiary type book supplement with game stats/rules for more baddies and some solid rules for one off games outside of whatever the campaign looks like for this as that is important for replayability. As has been previously said, dungeon crawlers really thrive with real variety of enemies so while I would not be unhappy with hero pack expansions I still think a bestiary book would be even better.
SamusDrake wrote: On the 40K front I'm guessing this christmas will be Space Hulk - long overdue! - and then next year they'll probably introduce a new 40K Quest game.
Does it have to be Space Hulk? Again? Blackstone was so interesting with the types of characters and enemies it brought out. Just doing Terminators vs Genestealers again is so blah.
SamusDrake wrote: On the 40K front I'm guessing this christmas will be Space Hulk - long overdue! - and then next year they'll probably introduce a new 40K Quest game.
Does it have to be Space Hulk? Again? Blackstone was so interesting with the types of characters and enemies it brought out. Just doing Terminators vs Genestealers again is so blah.
Yes, because they aren't the same thing?
Other than both being board games, Space Hulk is it's own sub-brand within Warhammer 40k, Blackstone Fortress (depending on how you want to argue it) either expands the Warhammer Quest brand into 40k or is an effective reintroduction of Space Crusade.
I bought Cursed City because I wanted to start it up as a campaign, expand it as it goes along etc, and then they killed it off, pretended it didn't exist, and then released the figures seperate for the expansions etc.
I'm hoping this time this gets a proper release plan, no issues in the way, and that it gets plenty of support.
I'd even buy White Dwarf, if it contains new scenarios, or hero cards, or monster stats etc!
ritualnet wrote: I bought Cursed City because I wanted to start it up as a campaign, expand it as it goes along etc, and then they killed it off, pretended it didn't exist, and then released the figures separate for the expansions etc.
I'm hoping this time this gets a proper release plan, no issues in the way, and that it gets plenty of support.
I'd even buy White Dwarf, if it contains new scenarios, or hero cards, or monster stats etc!
Yeah, Cursed City was a bit of a mess. It had so much potential, the setting was really atmospheric and the expansions had potential, but just didn't work.
I can't understand why Warhammer Quest always seems to have a reboot in terms of the way it's launched and supported when, effectively, each edition has been an expansion with slightly updated mechanics.
For me, Blackstone Fortress was by far the best release and not because it was 40K. It was the way it was released and supported (or not...). You have the main boxed game, rammed with card and plastic and then sensibly sized expansions with card and plastic, plus card expansions and White Dwarf updates. The only issue was availability, those expansions were very hard to get hold of.
Hopefully, GW have learned from the Cursed City fiasco and will relaunch Quest in a similar way to Blackstone Fortress with expansions that make sense (and don't end up costing more than the base game once you factor in how many minis you need, like Cursed City).
I would prefer Quest to be more like Shadespire - a core box that comes out with the main rules and card and then releases similar to Shadespire expansions with new heroes (warbands), new cards and White Dwarf updates. A Bestiary and RPG elements like the old Quest would be amazing but probably asking too much....
It is a little odd they're not going back to 40K, given how well BSF did compared to everything else.
I do wonder if maybe they're repurposing design work that was already done for future Cursed City expansions before that all went wrong. I suspect that will be apparent when we see the actual box.
(And yeah, the reveal was weird, at first I assumed it had been leaked somewhere and they had just rushed to officially announce it, but that doesn't seem to be the case)
What a relief to see its not a 40K boxed game! My piles of shame will be safe. I still got most of my BSF stuff shrinkwrapped, I wouldnt have storage for any more 40K Quest stuff..
I do love the cover art of this one. It looks retro, but anatomically correct and technically modern and refined. A great combination if I may say so
Now that i've gotten a chance to look at the art properly, i can see the AoS side of things a lot more. The "Bret" is carrying a Freeguild shield, the lion embossment on the shield and the head and wings on the helmet look like a reference to Tahlia and her Manticore. And the breastplate has the Sigmar "S" in it and the axe has the comet. It's more subtle, but obvious if you know what you're looking at.
I’m wondering if the more…subdued? Generic? Box Art might be an attempt to broaden appeal in board game stores?
It’s not a complete thought, just something that’s been flirting around my head. Like an attempt to draw the eye and tempt the picket of those that might normally purposefully ignore a GW product?
Why would GW bother to appeal to people who purposefully avoid their products when they can't get enough product in the hands of people who want it.
I doubt GW thinks about the board game market much at all. It's probably just the amorphousness of AoS as a setting allowing them to crank up the nostalgia factor of the already deeply nostalgic Quest product line.
I don't think this will get released in stores other than GW stores. This looks to me to be a bit like Silver Tower and Cursed City (or at least what was intended for CC) in that it is a way for them to launch the new Nurgle product line while also tapping into the nostalgia/Interest for modern WHQ games.
I don't mind that as Silver Tower was great. However, I do hope they support the game post launch for a bit like BSF got.
I'm interested to see what Warhammer Quest: Still in AoS, honest! does, but every new iteration has disappointed as they keep insisting on pruning back the secret sauce of the game; progression, because it's extremely difficult to balance.
Warhammer Quest 1995, Bloodbowl, Gorkamorka, Mordheim all had progression as a core aspect and that was the element that made them work as campaign games. They've peeled them back to almost nothing in most of their modern gamelines, (Necromunda and Bloodbowl are the exception) and it really hurts the appeal.
His Master's Voice wrote: Why would GW bother to appeal to people who purposefully avoid their products when they can't get enough product in the hands of people who want it.
I doubt GW thinks about the board game market much at all. It's probably just the amorphousness of AoS as a setting allowing them to crank up the nostalgia factor of the already deeply nostalgic Quest product line.
I dunno, that cover is pretty clearly trying to go for a Hero Quest vibe.
HidaO-Win wrote: I'm interested to see what Warhammer Quest: Still in AoS, honest! does, but every new iteration has disappointed as they keep insisting on pruning back the secret sauce of the game; progression, because it's extremely difficult to balance.
Warhammer Quest 1995, Bloodbowl, Gorkamorka, Mordheim all had progression as a core aspect and that was the element that made them work as campaign games. They've peeled them back to almost nothing in most of their modern gamelines, (Necromunda and Bloodbowl are the exception) and it really hurts the appeal.
Other games make up for this though. For example Gloomhaven, Tidal Blades2 have wonderful, extremely addictive and satisfying progression systems as do Aeons Tresspass: Odyssey or Oathsworn. A scenario-driven tactical skirmish with progression is probably one of the most popular board game genres on KS and there are gems there that really put to shame what GW tries to sell as state-of-the-art game design.
HidaO-Win wrote: I'm interested to see what Warhammer Quest: Still in AoS, honest! does, but every new iteration has disappointed as they keep insisting on pruning back the secret sauce of the game; progression, because it's extremely difficult to balance.
Warhammer Quest 1995, Bloodbowl, Gorkamorka, Mordheim all had progression as a core aspect and that was the element that made them work as campaign games. They've peeled them back to almost nothing in most of their modern gamelines, (Necromunda and Bloodbowl are the exception) and it really hurts the appeal.
Other games make up for this though. For example Gloomhaven, Tidal Blades2 have wonderful, extremely addictive and satisfying progression systems as do Aeons Tresspass: Odyssey or Oathsworn. A scenario-driven tactical skirmish with progression is probably one of the most popular board game genres on KS and there are gems there that really put to shame what GW tries to sell as state-of-the-art game design.
Oh yeah GW are badly out of date on cutting edge design, it's just frustrating they cut what is actually the best part of their games because its hard to design for.
I would be quite keen to know the rules set and campaign before getting this. Blackstone got samey fast. Cursed city I was incredibly relieved my order got cancelled after I actually played it.
Hellebore wrote: Well that is an exceedingly generic WFB-esque DnD cover.
There's nothing in that image that says AOS at all and barely anything that says warhammer. the plague guys are so similar in colour to the background they disappear.
It actually reminds me of the kind of art the talisman boardgames from BI and FFG used to have.
Do we know if they're sticking with the mechanics? I've avoided all versions since they Redid them
I doubt they will make significant changes to how the game works. I fully expect it to be a co-operative dungeon crawler (no 'games master' type role like Shadows over Hammerhal) with an 'activation dice' core mechanic and custom D6, D8 and D12 action dice. I honestly can't see them doing anything other than that and certainly nothing like what the old 1995 Warhammer Quest game was with all the expansive RPG type elements. That said, I do hope they release some sort of bestiary type book supplement with game stats/rules for more baddies and some solid rules for one off games outside of whatever the campaign looks like for this as that is important for replayability. As has been previously said, dungeon crawlers really thrive with real variety of enemies so while I would not be unhappy with hero pack expansions I still think a bestiary book would be even better.
I think they didn't go back to 40K for a Quest game because you lot would just buy it and use the hero models to stand in for characters that you're supposed to be buying for $35 a pop. That's all well and good for Age of Sigmar, because at least you're buying something, but why cannibalize their own sales?
I think people are reading way too much into what bland, corporate board room, art by committee artwork looks like. It looks uninspired and overly safe because the artist received heavy handed direction and just made the boring painting like the bosses said to.
Inquisitor Gideon wrote: Now that i've gotten a chance to look at the art properly, i can see the AoS side of things a lot more. The "Bret" is carrying a Freeguild shield, the lion embossment on the shield and the head and wings on the helmet look like a reference to Tahlia and her Manticore. And the breastplate has the Sigmar "S" in it and the axe has the comet. It's more subtle, but obvious if you know what you're looking at.
None of those are unique to AOS though. They were all empire motifs before the freeguild existed.
I would have just liked some of the more unique features of if AOS more visible. As I said in my original post. It's kind of DnD bland, it just looks pretty generic fantasy. More so than I would have expected especially for an AOS branded product.
Maybe the uniqueness will be in the terrain or boards? Realm gate shenanigans or something.
That party really could be on the box cover of literally any setting agnostic dungeon crawler on the market, there's nothing that makes it AoS, there's not even anything that makes it GW.
For WQ:CC players, isn't this technically an expansion that allows you to take your city quest into the sewers beneath (if you squint very hard).
And as for the generic nature of the cover, they're trying to market this to the broadest fantasy audience they can, not just Warhammer players, for the holidays.
schoon wrote: For WQ:CC players, isn't this technically an expansion that allows you to take your city quest into the sewers beneath (if you squint very hard).
If the rules are close enough that you can mix heroes...
lord_blackfang wrote: That party really could be on the box cover of literally any setting agnostic dungeon crawler on the market, there's nothing that makes it AoS, there's not even anything that makes it GW.
Wait till you see the other heroes. The Locust Bard, who plays songs with his legs and jumps over the whole board. The Sewage Elemental that can possess water corpses and goes to the next if the host is destroyed. And of course the Sponge Magician who filters the water to create feces golems while at the same time weakens the Nurgle guys who are not used to clean water.
lord_blackfang wrote: That party really could be on the box cover of literally any setting agnostic dungeon crawler on the market, there's nothing that makes it AoS, there's not even anything that makes it GW.
I think this is a strength in some ways. GW makes the best minis. They should just make the best version of a fantasy dungeon crawler possible. AOS is on a negative trajectory, there's no point in worrying about legally distinct trade names and goofy, bespoke takes on elves and dwarves for a game that's headed to the specialist games studio.
lord_blackfang wrote: That party really could be on the box cover of literally any setting agnostic dungeon crawler on the market, there's nothing that makes it AoS, there's not even anything that makes it GW.
I think this is a strength in some ways. GW makes the best minis. They should just make the best version of a fantasy dungeon crawler possible. AOS is on a negative trajectory, there's no point in worrying about legally distinct trade names and goofy, bespoke takes on elves and dwarves for a game that's headed to the specialist games studio.
Do you have any proof AOS is on a negative trajectory? Or is this just your disdain for AOS showing?
lord_blackfang wrote: That party really could be on the box cover of literally any setting agnostic dungeon crawler on the market, there's nothing that makes it AoS, there's not even anything that makes it GW.
I was thinking beastmen are actually pretty uniqe for GW. Sure the satyrs are pretty generic due to widespread mythology, but beastmen are sort of the dark nightmare version of satyrs. One could argue satyrs are pretty "mischievious" and down right scary in some aspects, but not really worse in moral than your common guy or demigod in the ancient world.
Also, to have the chaotic and twisted side of nature based on herbivore cattle it not something you usually see utside of GW.
(not going in to the "original" beastmen that was just mutated animals, man-wolves, -bears, -badgers or what-have-you furries.
To be fair, I took this picture in a medieval church close to where I live, so the concept is not unheard of
Let me know when GW finally gives medieval art battle snails their proper due as the ultimate foes of Bretonnia. Bonus points if they're also ridden by historically accurate bunny knights.
warboss wrote: Let me know when GW finally gives medieval art battle snails their proper due as the ultimate foes of Bretonnia. Bonus points if they're also ridden by historically accurate bunny knights.
You are unfamiliar with the Cities of Sigmar attack snail?
You are unfamiliar with the Cities of Sigmar attack snail?
I was not aware of those. Given the importance of the faction, I'd expect 32mm scale and not Warmaster base dressing. Battlesnails are NOT tactical rocks! It should be clear from the authentic art posted likely drawn from in person war correspondent experience.
Not those weird creatures, but Sylvaneth has lots of strange bugs and Idoneth have extra fish and eels. I suppose Grots have some occasional squig variants and mushrooms with faces.
I was thinking beastmen are actually pretty uniqe for GW.
They're just Broo from Runequest. Citadel used to make miniatures for that game under licence, and then just ported them across to their own setting when they lost said licence.
I think skaven are probably the most unique. Can't think of any pre-skaven fiction that had ratmen of the sort represented by Skaven. Yes there were one-off ratmen or races of feral giant were-rats or whatever, but not necessarily empires of sentient anthropomorphic rats. TV Tropes actually indicates that skaven may be the trope codifier.
chaos0xomega wrote: I think skaven are probably the most unique. Can't think of any pre-skaven fiction that had ratmen of the sort represented by Skaven. Yes there were one-off ratmen or races of feral giant were-rats or whatever, but not necessarily empires of sentient anthropomorphic rats. TV Tropes actually indicates that skaven may be the trope codifier.
Yes there were... in Lieber's World of Lankhmar (Fafhrd & the Grey Mouser stories). They had an entire civilization under humanity's cities. However, these anthropomorphic ratmen were not human sized.
chaos0xomega wrote: I think skaven are probably the most unique. Can't think of any pre-skaven fiction that had ratmen of the sort represented by Skaven. Yes there were one-off ratmen or races of feral giant were-rats or whatever, but not necessarily empires of sentient anthropomorphic rats. TV Tropes actually indicates that skaven may be the trope codifier.
Breed to Come, Andre Norton 1972.
Sentient rat-people, high(-ish) tech. Opposed to all the other cat-people and dog-people, and probably other animal type-peoples too.
IIRC, they were quite a bit bigger than regular rats, but not quite human sized.
chaos0xomega wrote: I think skaven are probably the most unique. Can't think of any pre-skaven fiction that had ratmen of the sort represented by Skaven. Yes there were one-off ratmen or races of feral giant were-rats or whatever, but not necessarily empires of sentient anthropomorphic rats. TV Tropes actually indicates that skaven may be the trope codifier.
Yes there were... in Lieber's World of Lankhmar (Fafhrd & the Grey Mouser stories). They had an entire civilization under humanity's cities. However, these anthropomorphic ratmen were not human sized.
They even had a council of thirteen. And they could become human-sized through magic.
Sacredroach wrote: For another proto-Skaven reference, there was an underpeople rat-lady in Cordwainer Smith's "The Dead Lady of Clown Town." from 1964.
It is an excellent story of a retelling of Joan of Arc set in the Instrumentality of Mankind universe.
I was originally going to post the excerpt, but it would have probably made Khorne question my sense of good taste.
Just read the story. It is available online for free.
Such a great story teller, I think im due a re-read
Looks more like Underworlds than Quest, which isn't necessarily a bad thing.
Setting up the combats in Blackstone wasn't a difficult task, but they could sometimes feel like a chore depending on the size of the map. Its hard to make out if the boards have square or hex tiles...
warboss wrote: Let me know when GW finally gives medieval art battle snails their proper due as the ultimate foes of Bretonnia. Bonus points if they're also ridden by historically accurate bunny knights.
If you're willing to go third party, Meridian Miniatures and Old School Miniatures do similar creatures.
SamusDrake wrote: Looks more like Underworlds than Quest, which isn't necessarily a bad thing.
Setting up the combats in Blackstone wasn't a difficult task, but they could sometimes feel like a chore depending on the size of the map. Its hard to make out if the boards have square or hex tiles...
Not sure what this novelty board is about, but my first impression is that GW will have to do some convincing to get me interested. I like the look of a sprawling dungeon.
I could see a book of maps provide a neat way of structuring an adventure. Clear starting room two, move on to room five, then seven, then eight, win by beating boss room three, that kind of thing. Easy to flip through, easy to locate. And it saves table space. I could see GW go for something like that.
I am very excited about this. My main AoS projects at the moment are Maggotkin of Nurgle and Cities of Sigmar and my board gaming group is into dungeon crawlers. This is right up my alley.
Map definitely looks like a book. One side looks thicker than the other and you can see the spine. I wonder how this is printed? Similar map books are usually spiral bound so that they are easier to lay flat but this doesn't appear to be.
Also, I am happy to see those awful Blackstone Fortress dice gone.
Well it certainly does look very different to previous Warhammer quest games for sure. Doesn't look like a modular board. That said if you zoom in it does look like two boards one on top of the other or, as some have said, a book of maps.
Not sure how I feel about this. I need to see more.
Are we sure none of those token minis are actually Nurgling minis? GW love those little guys.
Not too surprised they're going with a book, that is the modern design choice, and they seem to let their game designers have some freedom, or lack of proper oversight in the case of Cursed City.
Geifer wrote: Not sure what this novelty board is about, but my first impression is that GW will have to do some convincing to get me interested. I like the look of a sprawling dungeon.
I could see a book of maps provide a neat way of structuring an adventure. Clear starting room two, move on to room five, then seven, then eight, win by beating boss room three, that kind of thing. Easy to flip through, easy to locate. And it saves table space. I could see GW go for something like that.
Having a mission book does work well for games like Gloomhaven Jaws of the Lion, but IMO feels a bit stripped down compared to custom tiles.
There are pluses though - potentially easier to publish white dwarf missions, and expansion books with or without new minis (minis might be in a separate expansion type).
So.... four heroes confirmed on the board... and I'm pretty sure that there are 3 heroes (+ one small helper/critter) off the board on the bottom side... means 7 heroes.
Guess they still wanna keep it under wraps and slowly reveal....also I voted for the dwarf because he looks right up my alley.
Yeah, I smiled too - amusing move from them. Well, I voted for the dwarf too. Though from the look of the blurry pic the other heroes have far more fancy models compared to the cover art.
Guess they still wanna keep it under wraps and slowly reveal....also I voted for the dwarf because he looks right up my alley.
Yeah, I smiled too - amusing move from them. Well, I voted for the dwarf too. Though from the look of the blurry pic the other heroes have far more fancy models compared to the cover art.
Checking the photo in detail... it does not appear to be the same (of the one here in the thread)... Does this mean that somebody created a potatoe camera filter at GW to mock us?? Hilarious...
Also, I voted for "Inara Sion, The Cleansing Blade" as a pity vote. Pretty sure the Knight or Duardin are going to be first.
I went for Inara sion. I have this horrible feeling she's going to be a Ghyranite mage, which means i quite possibly wasted money on that Bret damsel to turn her into a Ghyranite mage.
Voted for Bren Tylis, it seemed more likely but wasn't completely clear it was a she and not a young male with long hair. Really interesting Joan of Arc character, maybe even a candidate for use in SoB or Inq units.
I love that we now have not one but two examples of fantasy Warhammer Quest which is clearly using Warhammer Fantasy models (The Knight has an S on his shield but looks like an Empire knight and not a Bret anyway) but says it actually takes place in the Mortal Realms... Bonus points for Cursed City in destroying the entire city (And Kislevian civilisation?) so as not to have to deal with it going forward in AoS.(Unless they want to, maybe the refugees remake their culture elsewhere but given TOW maybe we never hear about them again) But I assumed maybe that happened because Old World came out and complicated things. For them to be still doing it here long after Old World came out is just confusing. Imagine if they released a Warhammer Quest game with Primaris marines but on the back of the box it says "Actually this takes place during the Horus Heresy" would anyone seriously respect that?
The dwarf is interesting because he looks so generic but actually looks a lot like the generic dwarves of early Warhammer. It's just interesting to me why GW did this, who is the market? Maybe they want to sell it to both TOW and AoS players? Maybe they think only grognards will be buying this for the price? Maybe they think the broader general audience likes the more traditional fantasy styles over AoS? But if so why not split the difference like with the dwarf and make something so generic it doesn't look like Warhammer Fantasy at all? Granted over time it seems like AoS has begun to become more like Warhammer Fantasy and dropped a lot of it's early excessive designs.
And it bears repeating, the Warhammer Fantasy background actually does have popularity for it's own sake with non-hobbyists whereas AoS is popular despite it's setting which most don't really care about. So it makes more sense to me if you aim for this product to bring in a lot of outsiders to use it. But maybe the doctrine of round base = AoS, square base = TOW decides this.
NightReconnaissance wrote: Voted for Bren Tylis, it seemed more likely but wasn't completely clear it was a she and not a young male with long hair. Really interesting Joan of Arc character, maybe even a candidate for use in SoB or Inq units.
I love that we now have not one but two examples of fantasy Warhammer Quest which is clearly using Warhammer Fantasy models (The Knight has an S on his shield but looks like an Empire knight and not a Bret anyway) but says it actually takes place in the Mortal Realms... Bonus points for Cursed City in destroying the entire city (And Kislevian civilisation?) so as not to have to deal with it going forward in AoS.(Unless they want to, maybe the refugees remake their culture elsewhere but given TOW maybe we never hear about them again) But I assumed maybe that happened because Old World came out and complicated things. For them to be still doing it here long after Old World came out is just confusing. Imagine if they released a Warhammer Quest game with Primaris marines but on the back of the box it says "Actually this takes place during the Horus Heresy" would anyone seriously respect that?
The dwarf is interesting because he looks so generic but actually looks a lot like the generic dwarves of early Warhammer. It's just interesting to me why GW did this, who is the market? Maybe they want to sell it to both TOW and AoS players? Maybe they think only grognards will be buying this for the price? Maybe they think the broader general audience likes the more traditional fantasy styles over AoS? But if so why not split the difference like with the dwarf and make something so generic it doesn't look like Warhammer Fantasy at all? Granted over time it seems like AoS has begun to become more like Warhammer Fantasy and dropped a lot of it's early excessive designs.
And it bears repeating, the Warhammer Fantasy background actually does have popularity for it's own sake with non-hobbyists whereas AoS is popular despite it's setting which most don't really care about. So it makes more sense to me if you aim for this product to bring in a lot of outsiders to use it. But maybe the doctrine of round base = AoS, square base = TOW decides this.
Anyone else think thats a Kurnothi on the left side of the board? An archer of some type on a cav base, next to a blue-ish green robed person?
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warboss wrote: I assumed the figs off board to the left were the heroes!
I think they are, now that I look at it. Maybe another mage of some sort, an Ogre of some kind and possible a Kurnothi with some sort of familiar/pet creature.
I'm sure that it'll be a nice model, but I'm less interested in a Duardin ranger simply because he's the one that fits quite happily into the AOS lore and aesthetic and I don't think I'll learn that much from it. The others seem much more of a departure from the setting, so hopefully will have some interesting story as to why...
nels1031 wrote: Anyone else think thats a Kurnothi on the left side of the board? An archer of some type on a cav base, next to a blue-ish green robed person?
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warboss wrote: I assumed the figs off board to the left were the heroes!
I think they are, now that I look at it. Maybe another mage of some sort, an Ogre of some kind and possible a Kurnothi with some sort of familiar/pet creature.
Seven would be strange number of hero characters. I'd say there'll be eight, and the small-based model is itself a hero; maybe the introduction of some AoS halfling equivalent?
I came here to confirm that I wasn't crazy seeing a book in that image. I would have preferred tiles, but presumably a book is crafted specifically for each mission and should be a visual masterpiece. On the downside, GW can sell more books for new missions / scenarios rather than making something replayable at the off.
I was pretty excited for this, but now even more so. I like that it looks like it's on a book. It gives a lot of flexibility for missions in that you can go through particular rooms in different orders, and is much easier to set up/transport than a million dungeon tiles.
The game doesn't seem to have a huge footprint either, it looks like you could probably play it on a coffee table.
In addition I'm really excited that there appears to be seven heroes.
I voted for the knight, but would be pretty happy to see any of the heroes.
Valoran believes himself to be the greatest mortal champion of the armies of Hammerhal Aqsha. For all his arrogance, the so-called Manticore Knight has a fair claim to that title.
And yet Valoran’s remarkable list of military achievements has been marred by recent disgrace. During the knight’s previous campaign, a chain explosion sent several splinters of raw Aqshian realmstone lancing through him. Instead of laying him low, it caused Valoran to enter an elemental rage that ended with him slaying not only the foe but also several comrades unlucky enough to get in his way.
This experience has left Valoran embittered and isolated, willing to risk everything in the pursuit of redemption. He remains afflicted by his emberstone-riddled flesh: his body erupts into flames when he reaches the height of rage, burning anyone nearby who would do him harm.
That's pretty neat. A sword and board tank at first glance, but also needs to keep his distance from his party. Of course, I know nothing of the game rules, so I'm not sure how that will play out in game.
Inquisitor Gideon wrote: It's a "board game" piece over a wargaming one, so i'd be surprised if they're not similar to how the Cursed City models were.
To be fair, the Cursed City pushfits were done really well. We’ve come a long way from 40k’s second edition bolter huggers.
Inquisitor Gideon wrote: It's a "board game" piece over a wargaming one, so i'd be surprised if they're not similar to how the Cursed City models were.
Those had more forgiving open poses and sprues were actually good and versatile. I would love to have this knight in bits to replace my Tahlia Vedra on the manticore.
Inquisitor Gideon wrote: It's a "board game" piece over a wargaming one, so i'd be surprised if they're not similar to how the Cursed City models were.
Those had more forgiving open poses and sprues were actually good and versatile. I would love to have this knight in bits to replace my Tahlia Vedra on the manticore.
If i was to play analysis, i would say the shield is molded directly onto the cape as a separate piece that slots into the shoulder. The torso and axe arm are all one piece and the head is separate. So a three piece model.
Laughing Man wrote: The helm is a Tahlia Vedra reference, and the axe apes the design of hers as well.
The visual similarities between the weapons are much older than Vadra's model. The twin tailed back spike predates AoS.
In any case, both the helmet and the axe use design language I associate with older Warhammer art - the kind of stuff you'd expect to find in a Blanche painting three decades ago.
I don't think that's a book. Take a look at the Blood Bowl board that is right next to it. Practically the same thing. The "spine" is just where the board folds.
With Bretonnians being in this, and Blood Bowl 3rd Season, are we going to see a new wave of models for WH:The Old World too?
SgtEeveell wrote: With Bretonnians being in this, and Blood Bowl 3rd Season, are we going to see a new wave of models for WH:The Old World too?
Empire Knights, if anything. Edmark's armor is pretty much identical to the Freeguild Cavaliers. Which is fitting, because that's what he is.
If anything's a Bretonnian, it'd probably be the sellsword, as her pauldron has what vaguely resembles the tail end of a fleur de lis.
The female mage that's yet to be revealed could probably safely proxy as a Bret Damsel, for those that mix product lines. Though in the potato cam pic, she looks to have a bunch of swirly bits.
SgtEeveell wrote: With Bretonnians being in this, and Blood Bowl 3rd Season, are we going to see a new wave of models for WH:The Old World too?
Empire Knights, if anything. Edmark's armor is pretty much identical to the Freeguild Cavaliers. Which is fitting, because that's what he is.
If anything's a Bretonnian, it'd probably be the sellsword, as her pauldron has what vaguely resembles the tail end of a fleur de lis.
The female mage that's yet to be revealed could probably safely proxy as a Bret Damsel, for those that mix product lines. Though in the potato cam pic, she looks to have a bunch of swirly bits.
Yeah, she definitely seems fairly damsel-like, but also reminds me a lot of Lumineth's elemental wizards. If she had pointy ears I'd say she fit the bill perfectly.
It would be great if Edmark became the first comically arrogant character in Warhammer. "Admit it" a popular meme and having his own animated show in the spirit of Monty Python....
SgtEeveell wrote: I don't think that's a book. Take a look at the Blood Bowl board that is right next to it. Practically the same thing. The "spine" is just where the board folds.
You can see the edge bind on the far edge of the Bloodbowl board, because it is in fact a board. You can't see any edge bind on the far edge of the Darkwater "board", because it's obscured in the same manner a hardcover book would be when viewed from the same angle.
Not sure I like the idea of static maps in a book. It feels more limited, and I rather like building up a big sprawl of interlocking card rooms and corridors and so on.
What do you think about the size of the box?
While the box depicted in the leaked photo is likely a render and not an actual photo of the real box, the size of boxes in GW promo material is usually quite accurate.
With no terrain or dungeon tiles and only about 50 mainly infantry sized miniatures, the depicted box looks too thick for the components shown. For example the War of the Rohirrim box with terrain and a comparable number of minatures is only half as thick.
So what else could be in the box that would require such a large box?
More models are unlikely as the promo picture seem to show also models that are not part of the current scenario, i.e. in play/on board.
More reference sheets, profile and equipment cards for the other models would be likely.
As would be a separate rule book if the board shown is really a book of maps/rooms.
However, that is still not enough to fill that box, unless the models are spread over a lot of sprues which I also consider to be unlikely as models for these kind of boxed games are usually simpler in their design.
Maybe the actual box is not as big as depicted after all…
Corridors dont seem likely, looking at those pictures but it would be great to have an actually Warhammer quest RPG built into this release with grid etc.
Seelenhaendler wrote: What do you think about the size of the box?
While the box depicted in the leaked photo is likely a render and not an actual photo of the real box, the size of boxes in GW promo material is usually quite accurate.
With no terrain or dungeon tiles and only about 50 mainly infantry sized miniatures, the depicted box looks too thick for the components shown. For example the War of the Rohirrim box with terrain and a comparable number of minatures is only half as thick.
So what else could be in the box that would require such a large box?
More models are unlikely as the promo picture seem to show also models that are not part of the current scenario, i.e. in play/on board.
More reference sheets, profile and equipment cards for the other models would be likely.
As would be a separate rule book if the board shown is really a book of maps/rooms.
However, that is still not enough to fill that box, unless the models are spread over a lot of sprues which I also consider to be unlikely as models for these kind of boxed games are usually simpler in their design.
Maybe the actual box is not as big as depicted after all…
I'd have thought there would almost have to be a second book - can't go questing all over the rulebook.
Plus more card decks and unit sheets.
Card stock seems to have been an issue recently and maybe getting it printed contributed to the cursed city fiasco, if so book based floors might be a way to counter that. They have reliable book printers.
You probably get more maps for your money, but can’t do things like running fights, where half the minis rush to the next room while half hang back. Which is one advantage of tiles, where you can have as many out as you have table space.
Book-mats would be amazing for Blood Bowl - imagine if they printed a full collection! They're all the same size, a separate booklet for the individual rules...I'd certainly pay for a spiral bound book like that.
Nevelon wrote: You probably get more maps for your money, but can’t do things like running fights, where half the minis rush to the next room while half hang back. Which is one advantage of tiles, where you can have as many out as you have table space.
You can always pull the staples out of the book to separate the maps.
Nevelon wrote: You probably get more maps for your money, but can’t do things like running fights, where half the minis rush to the next room while half hang back. Which is one advantage of tiles, where you can have as many out as you have table space.
You can always pull the staples out of the book to separate the maps.
Nevelon wrote: You probably get more maps for your money, but can’t do things like running fights, where half the minis rush to the next room while half hang back. Which is one advantage of tiles, where you can have as many out as you have table space.
You can always pull the staples out of the book to separate the maps.
not if it is spiral bound, though
I personally doubt that GW will go to that expense. Although that would explain why the box is so deep!
This point has me really intrigued. The image clearly shows the book does not have a spiral bound spine, yet every traditional book spine does NOT work for map books. That's why all my Loke map books and Jaws of the Lion have spiral bound. So that means one of three things: it's a bad prototype photo, they've discovered some fascinating new technology to make it work with a hardbound book spine, or they're really incompetent and didn't play test their product to realize you can't make a map book if the map doesn't lay flat. Any could be the case!
frankelee wrote: This point has me really intrigued. The image clearly shows the book does not have a spiral bound spine, yet every traditional book spine does NOT work for map books. That's why all my Loke map books and Jaws of the Lion have spiral bound. So that means one of three things: it's a bad prototype photo, they've discovered some fascinating new technology to make it work with a hardbound book spine, or they're really incompetent and didn't play test their product to realize you can't make a map book if the map doesn't lay flat. Any could be the case!
It's not quite true that traditional bindings don't work for map books. There are a variety of what are known as 'lay flat' bindings, which are suitable. Those that look most like traditional books typically involve a separate strip of paper or fabric inside the spine, that the pages are adhered to, rather than directly to the spine itself. This paper or fabric can flex, allowing the pages to open fully. This is most effective if the pages are also made of relatively thick, heavy paper. It's most effective for the middle third or so of the book. The issue with the pages close to either end is that the two sides of the book simply end up different heights, although they pages will stay lay fairly flat in principle.
It might be a poor image, but I wouldn't take that as a blank check to claim nothing could be seen in it. People who can't see the models clearly setting on a book probably are due for a trip to the opthalmologist more than the speculation has gone too far.
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And lay flat binding is exactly what I was talking about! I should have phrased it better, I didn't mean GW would invent anything new, but would find a neat answer. They like to look fancier and different than other companies, using that for a map book would be completely on brand. And the weirdly prominent book spine in the admittedly blurry photo matches that exactly.
I guess the wider point is that this sort of approach with map books is now quite common (it's used in the Mandalorian game, Tidal Blades 2, Jaws of the Lion and others).
They've all be spiral bound, I'd be surprised if they were doing it that way if a cheaper and equally good option existed. Though that doesn't mean GW wouldn't do it different for the sake of it.
GaroRobe wrote: GW, please give us a dwarf or duardin ranger unit like Drolf
Didn’t there used to be one? Prospecters or rangers or something?
Fantasy has miners and rangers but the latter only ever had bugmans rangers clad in chainmail and double handed axes. I want axes and crossbows and hoods lol
It might be the way the paint is done between the nose and the brow, it looks very flat and merged together, like he hit a brick wall face first :p
Certainly the fyreslayers have far narrower noses with more differentiation from the brow. His nostrils are sitting right next to the corners of his eyes. the art looks good, but the model doesn't really match it all.
I suspect that it is indeed down to the paintjob. I don't think the sculpt is too dissimilar from the artwork, but the model doesn't have the darker tone of the shadows and the placement of the highlights is significantly different.
I like him and I hate him.
The pose, choice of details - all pretty cool
But… ugh, CAD design with low poly execution at it again.Very-very doughy
And yeah, the paint job doesn’t help.
Seems to me that they're trying for a mass-market fantasy game suitable for the widest "Barnes & Noble" audience, who aren't necessarily familiar with Warhammer.
They appear to be sticking with well-worn fantasy tropes.
SnotlingPimpWagon wrote: I like him and I hate him.
The pose, choice of details - all pretty cool
But… ugh, CAD design with low poly execution at it again.Very-very doughy
And yeah, the paint job doesn’t help.
It's clearly not low poly, whatever you might think of the design. There are no visible edges or vertices, and it's just not something GW would ever need or choose to do. There might be all sorts of reasons a design doesn't work for you; that's not one of them.
In the video reveal there seem to be a couple of bits of small furniture - some jars and a wooden table (or chair) - it's hard to make out. Fingers crossed there are some tiny scenery bits to make the maps less "flat".
I should be super-excited for this being Warhammer Quest, but so far it's just a bunch of WHFB characters and Nurgle chaps. Nothing wrong with that but it's not what I got into AoS for, and so that leaves the environment and the game itself.
That side of things might be worth the purchase, but at this point I'm thinking that they should have just revived the 90s Warhammer Quest instead.
SnotlingPimpWagon wrote: I like him and I hate him.
The pose, choice of details - all pretty cool
But… ugh, CAD design with low poly execution at it again.Very-very doughy
And yeah, the paint job doesn’t help.
It's clearly not low poly, whatever you might think of the design. There are no visible edges or vertices, and it's just not something GW would ever need or choose to do. There might be all sorts of reasons a design doesn't work for you; that's not one of them.
I didn’t mean “low poly” literally. I meant the sharpness of detail being dull as if the “detail” bar setting has been dragged to “low” (annd expanded on the thought by describing the sculpt as “doughy”). I know it’s not made out of dough either
I think people are being too harsh on the little guy. He's a dwarf ranger, he looks like a dwarf ranger, and one from the "Warhammer world" to use the term very loosely. The box art was signal enough that they toned down the wackier AOS elements, whether because of the venues they want to sell it in, the people they want to sell it to, or just because they no longer believe the wackier AOS aesthetic is popular.
I'd expect another very self contained game, where some heroes go into the sewers to fight the same groups of Nurgle monsters. I'm not expecting anything great in terms of lite RPG or story narrative, even though I think should lean heavily into that. They're more into models and dice and I think that's what we'll get here, models and dice.
They need to assign the sculptor who handled Miao Ying for any future female characters. It you want to make it look like she's battle scarred, and has broken her nose a time or two, that's fine, but the face just looks flat. Terrible execution of the key focal point of an otherwise nice mini.
I think the whole thing is a mess. Terrible armor. Model suffers from sculptor not understanding that hips exist or how they work. Sword cross guard looks like it is 8 inches thick, stupid back pole thing that confuses the model outline, etc. I hate the whole thing.
That model may work better after seeing it from some other angles, GW does sometimes make strange decisions for the primary angle a model gets displayed at. The back lantern looks awkward at this angle, I have no idea what's going on on her thighs, the He-Man style sword is certainly a choice.
It is AOS and it is a limited angle when we should get a spin, and I like it overall discounting the nonsensical details.
I can;t see a single thing that would not work in the Old World?
Edmark's armor is pretty much identical to the Freeguild Cavaliers. Which is fitting, because that's what he is.
