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Are there any rumors lurking out there about what will be of the Blood Angels in 5th Edition? I have like 2500 pts of Blood Angels but there is no codex or anything for them.

Just the downloadable one.

Downloadable one? Is it configured to 5e & new marines or is it still the 4e?

Still the same one, and it's likely all they'll have for awhile given how recently it was made.

In saying that the chaos warriors got a list 5 months ago in WD and they are out this month for WHFB.

I to want a new (and decent list) so that only dark angels players will be the marines whining...

I just read through that codex and it really doesn't do the blood angels justice. As one of the primary chapters of SM in the earlier years I feel it should have it's own codex with a decent rules set. Not just giving assault squads as troops and making scout squads elites...JMO

Yeah, but BA still plays well with 5th, I took 3rd place at Ard Boyz 1st round with it and I know at the second round it took 4th or so. still some good options with the list just not a brutal beat stick like the new marines are without much preparation.

Yea. I agree. Do you use any special characters? Do you have any of your lists that have worked for you up on dakka?
Thanks

I spoke to Dave Taylor at the LVGT and he said Blood Angels *would* get their own, stand alone codex, but he did not have an answer as to when.

Well that's some good news...I guess I should keep them around then..lol

You shouldn't expect any update to the online codex for some time. It's not going to get the goodies from the main Marine Codex, so ONLY use the wargear that's listed online, and don't take them from the new SM book.

The new marine codex came a month or two ago. Use that. Special "Red Marines" rules can get in line behind the Necrons, Dark Eldar, and Inquisition.

Yea I guess I could just use the SM codex. It is a real bummer though

Drummerboy wrote:Yea I guess I could just use the SM codex. It is a real bummer though

Agreed. When they took out a lot of the choices for BA (VERY little unit upgrade choices), took out the SHP, and other what not, all the customization fun went out of the army. THEN gave regular SM every upgrade under the sun and more flexibility, I found very little reason to play BA. Sad since I've been playing them since 1988.

Unless you are playing in tournaments you can use the real BA codex, it´s strong the way it is.
The only thing with playing Blood Angels, and marines at all, is that you can´t really do what for example ork players do,
create one single strong list and play evenly with every other army out there. With Blood Angels you have to have extra models and choices
so you can field an army depending on your opponent.

At least that´s what I do and it works for me

But I agree with you about the codex being "a bit thin" to say the least...
But hopefully we´ll get a real printed codex some time soon!


//Edge

Yea I know other armies are due for an update, but BA have a lot more history than most of the armies out there.

I was thinking of selling my army, but I guess I'll keep my BA around until the time comes...

Wait a minute...

You have the Death Company...Feel No Pain, Furious Charge, and Rending Attacks. Put a Chaplain with them, and you have 4 Rending attacks per Marine on the charge, striking at I6 and S5, Fearless, and can reroll missed to-hit rolls. Is this not enough?

Next, you have Veteran Assault Troops. They are cheap in price, can take Meltaguns, and can either be Jump Infantry or Transport based. Is this not enough?

Blood Angels can have either normal Tactical Squads or Jump Infantry as scoring troops. Is this not enough?

Mephiston is insane...

Dante is great...

Oh yeah, and even Corbulo has a 4+ Invulnerable Save, and gives all units within 12" of him Furious Charge. Run him with 2 Veteran Squads on either side of him, and you have half your army striking at I6 with 4 attacks per Marine. That's more than 80 I6 S5 attacks on the charge if you run full squads. Is that not enough?

Almost every generic HQ choice is better than what is presented in the new Marine Codex...

These are just a few things that come to mind...I will not mention the Twin-linked Assault Cannon Predator...

How is this list a "poor" or "bad" list?

What more could you complain about?

"I don't get the new Veteran Units in my BA list..."

You can buy TWO Veteran Assault Squads, with Power Fists and Meltaguns, for the price of ONE of the new SM Codex Veteran squads.

How is this bad?

The only people who have ANY cause to complain are the Dark Angel players, and that's only because they are playing a non Death Wing / Raven wing army...

Furious Charge takes them to I5, not 6.

Mephiston is overpriced garbage.

Corbulo doesn't have a jump pack.

Leadership 9 Librarians are useless.

Don't get me wrong, I don't think the BA codex is a "bad" codex, but when I can see what kind of cheese lists can be made with the new codex, and it's done cheaper, you're going to hear some complaining.

Well I dont know about The Blood angels, but I know they're starting work pretty soon for a new SW codex. So I would assume other Chapters would follow. And the reason they aren't even mentioned in the SM Codex is because this one is focusing on Codex Chapters only. Blood angels are non-codex, as you know.

here is a list of units unique to Blood Angels:

Dante
Mephiston
Lemartes
Corbulo
Tycho

Honor Guard (w. unique characters such Sanguinary Priest and Tech Adept)

Assault squads as a troop choice

Furioso dreadnaught w. Death Company upgrade
Veteran assault squads

Baal Predators

Mephiston is a powerful special character. I think some people don't like the fact that he does not have an invulnerable save but with T5 and FNP he works quite well without one from my experience using him.

G

I forgot to mention both the BA rhinos and Baal predator both have over charged engines.

G

As a Blood Angels player, I can attest that we are not in dire straights for a rewrite. Or list is plenty powerful and we have plenty of unique things that set us enough apart.

The only things I really want are the new Strom Shields, Land Raider Redeemers, Thunderfire Cannons, and Master of the Forge. But I have APOC to field those units, so it is no big deal right now.

Mephiston is overpriced garbage.

When was the last time you faced him? Though so. Mephiston popping out a Land Raider is insane.

Corbulo doesn't have a jump pack.

He doesn't need it. I have been having good success with him riding around with a Chaplain and walking Death Company in a Land Raider. Having a Land Raider with a 12" FC zone is ace.

Leadership 9 Librarians are useless.

It's not that they are useless, they just compete with better HQ choices. They are more of an assault character anyways.

Don't get me wrong, I don't think the BA codex is a "bad" codex, but when I can see what kind of cheese lists can be made with the new codex, and it's done cheaper, you're going to hear some complaining.

I don't know if cheaper is a good way to describe the differences. Blood Angels get plenty of toys for decent prices, whereas C:SM get plenty of toys for higher prices.

My only complaint about the list is that we get zero teleport homers. But I can deal.

I forgot to mention both the BA rhinos and Baal predator both have over charged engines.

Which makes our Rhinos better.

The biggest thing I wanted from the new Marine dex was the FNP from apothecaries. I might have run a command quad in more than just apocalypse games if we got that.

I think that the Blood Angels are quite competitive, but some BA players just want the new toys in the SM codex.

And if you think you need a new codex, just look to the SW players who have been waiting years.

SW players are clever enough not to want a new codex. Long fangs and all.

G

I was originally planning to move forward as Codex Marines for 5th Edition. However, I think that the new SM Codex is poo. The more I read it, the less I like it.

I'm going to be playing Blood Angels, using the current WD / downloadable list.

CaptainLoken wrote:Wait a minute...

You have the Death Company...Feel No Pain, Furious Charge, and Rending Attacks. Put a Chaplain with them, and you have 4 Rending attacks per Marine on the charge, striking at I6 and S5, Fearless, and can reroll missed to-hit rolls. Is this not enough?

Next, you have Veteran Assault Troops. They are cheap in price, can take Meltaguns, and can either be Jump Infantry or Transport based. Is this not enough?

DC: Anyone who is afraid of 1 unit just doesn't know how to kill it. Rending used to be scarier than it is now, and the same goes for FNP. They are a great unit, but you shouldn't be wetting yourself when you see them.

Honor Guard is too expensive to use if you want to give them any gear. ESPECIALLY combining a small squad size and the new casualty removal rules; might as well just hand your opponent some points.

Vet Assault are also nice... and expensive. Your idea of "cheap" must mean something I don't understand. All of those choices bring the point cost waaaay up on a unit that's just as easy to kill as any other marine. They ARE one of the best units in the BA codex, but still... I can't justify the cost on anything other than a 1750+ game.

Looks like I didn't site enough things when I made in my complaints comparing the BA codex to the SM codex. Here goes:

1. Combat squads are utter inflexible crap. I find myself having to replace an entire unit because my points go over the list limit. Normally I could drop 1 or 2 marines out of a 10 man squad and meet my point budget. Now? No. I have to take something completely different.
2. Extremely limited options (or options that are over priced and aren't worth it) make all squads look like cookie cutter versions of every other squad. Not very exciting to build an army. Armies start looking like every other army and that's not very exciting either. I loved my older army because it stood out, now... not so much. Core units are boring as hell in this list.
3. Units that aren't worth taking are put in a codex to show "variety". See: Honor Guard
4. An army shouldn't have to put it's leaders or "trick" units in a land raider to make them useful. Corbulo shouldn't have to show up in a land raider just to make it to the front lines. No JP makes him ride in a Razor back (losing it's long range fire if you want to keep up, and fragile), a half full rhino (not enough for support and fragile), or a half full drop pod (unknown when it will come in, unknown if it will be able to be supported, etc).... or a land raider. So, I guess if you really want to use Corbulo then his cost is 350 (him + his ride).
5. No one should say a codex's leaders are the reason something should stay "as-is" or doesn't need tuning. EVERY codex should have kick ass leaders, but they're NOT the reason for the army's sole success as a whole.
6. LD 9 librarians are crap. There's no punch behind those psychic hoods. There is no fluff reason for BA NOT rate a LD 10, so again, LD 9 is unfounded.
7. SHP went on a sabatical. Did Interigator Chaplins go with them? NO? Huh! There's no reason for them to be cut out.
8. All our veterans forgot all their skills. I guess all those HUNDREDS of battles they've been in just kinda went out their collective ears. Combine that with less options and it's a double insult.
9. Scouts as "elites" is garbage. The only elite scouts are from the SW codex.
10 5 man terminator squads are not worth taking. It makes NO sense to have them limited to 5. No tactical sense and no fluff reasons.

What would I like to see?
1. Wider options for core units. Make the basic army building fun again.
2. Throw out combat squads.
3. Bring SOME of the wargear in line with the new SM codex. I'm not talking about importing everything (No Thunderfire cannon, or Sternguard for example) since the codex shouldn't have EVERYTHING the basic marine does. However, AFAIK BA aren't under any Mars embargo so some of the equipment should become standardized.
4. Scouts to troops.
5. Wider use of teleport homers as per the basic marine codex.
6. Up to 10 man terminator squads.
7. Bring back SHP.
8. Options of LD 10 Librarians.
9. Options for Elites to buy skills or certain Leaders to grant them to units (as in SM codex, taking certain leaders grants certain skills).

@Moopy: Clearly, BA gene-seed isn't very good for Librarians. But you should be thankful for WS4 BS4 Scouts, instead of WS3 BS3 Scouts. Similarly, Honor Guard and Vet Assault Marine are costed fairly. Having Assault Marines as Troops is good. And the points costs are generally fair.

JohnHwangDD wrote:@Moopy: Clearly, BA gene-seed isn't very good for Librarians. But you should be thankful for WS4 BS4 Scouts, instead of WS3 BS3 Scouts. Similarly, Honor Guard and Vet Assault Marine are costed fairly. Having Assault Marines as Troops is good. And the points costs are generally fair.

Personally, I'd much rather have WS/BS 3 scouts with teleport homers.
There is no clearly about the geneseed until it's plainly stated for the reason behind it. I could buy that logic if it were stated more prominently.
You can not tell me that 15pts for a plasma pistol is fair. You're going to use it maybe once or twice in the game and run the risk of it killing your troops while doing it. I could see 10pts, but until then, there's no way in hell I'll ever take them for my assaulters.
Honor Guard are over priced for the reasons already mentioned. Roughly 20-25 pts (depending on how you calculate DC) for an A2 walking Marine with in a small unit size isn't worth it. You can add MORE points to the expensive models by giving them jump packs, and MORE points if you want an option or two (which are easier to lose in casualty removal). A 30pt (with JP) honor guard is just as easy to kill as a normal 15 pt marine.
Assault troops as Troops IS nice. However, the options for the unit are so limited I could count them on one hand, and 4 of THOSE are for the Sgt. Again, this unit orgnaization is where the codex does well, and other reason why BA shouldn't have a lot of the specialized units from the SM codex. My point is the options for building Assault squads, that don't look like cookie cutter versions of each other, are gone.

scouts can't compete with the other great choices for elitės but that is no big loss.

VAS are of great value for the points and combined with FC I feel they are stronger than Vanguard.

DC is a unit no other army has an equivalent. No other unit in the game has as many special rules built in that work together so well in close combat. You only need five really and that is a fantastic deal pointswise.

I don't see how anyone can knock someone for fielding Corbs in a landraider. It extends the FC bubble and is very reliable to say the least.

BA are a tactical army now.

G