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Right, I'm not a fan of Communism, Nazism, or any religious beliefs of one person being worth more than another, I believe in individual freedom under the supervizing of an elected goverment.

So, to the point of this topic. I love how Tau looks on the field, I love their gear, I love their characteristics and all, but I just can't get over their fluff! As someone said loud what I was thinking when reading the fluff on another thread, 'Tau are commies'. How am I to field an army which I know are fighting for something so... oposite of what I believe in, it doesn't feel right! =s

NOTE: This thread is not made for political debate, it's a bit of ... Nerdrage I guess, and hope for that someone can help me get over the fluff somehow.

I was thinking about remaking the fluff and build an army anyhow, but since the Tau haven't been around for long there's little room for me to change much. The ideas I've had so far would be the Etherals being something priest-equivelant (equilevant?), or more monk-like (priests don't fight, monks do!). I've never made any Fluff that sticks that far off of something such important to the species before though, have anyone got an own Tau Fluff that allows inter-caste-ic(?) breeding (Not 'cause it's part of the gameplay or anything but, I still believe in blind love xD), that doesn't say that the Etherals' word is law, and so on which I could get some inspiration from?

Thankies.

- Riffzor

Riffzor wrote:

NOTE: This thread is not made for political debate, it's a bit of ... Nerdrage I guess, and hope for that someone can help me get over the fluff somehow.

Cuddles?

I'm a Swede, I don't do cuddling. =o Then again, how could I resist the offer when it comes from someone with a sheep and an owl avatar...?

I'll be the sheep, you can be the owl. You look happier already.

Actually, The Tau do not fit the definition of communist. There is a common mistake people make in equating Collectivist and Communist.

If someone tries to argue that they are, just point out thier caste system which is a form of class system.

If somebody else points to the part of Tau fluff that describes all members of the empire as equals for their proof of Tau as communists, then point out that the US makes the same claim that we are all equal. The US is definitely not communist, currently.

The Tau are probably best described as an Imperialist Theocracy.


If the differing PoV upsets you then I offer Iterwebz hugz for comfort.


If your looking for a fluff discussion I think that there maybe another forum for such.

As for a starting place for where the ethereals aren't in total control, Start with the Farsight Enclave. Maybe refugee's from the Enclave who inter bred across castes but then return to the Tau empire.

If it really bothers you, just pull a Farsight.
Ethereals are garbage on the board anyway.
Just make up some stuff about a divergent sept that doesn't follow the greater good but their own beliefs instead.
Done.

focusedfire wrote:Actually, The Tau do not fit the definition of communist. There is a common mistake people make in equating Collectivist and Communist.

If someone tries to argue that they are, just point out thier caste system which is a form of class system.

If somebody else points to the part of Tau fluff that describes all members of the empire as equals for their proof of Tau as communists, then point out that the US makes the same claim that we are all equal. The US is definitely not communist, currently.

The Tau are probably best described as an Imperialist Theocracy.


If the differing PoV upsets you then I offer Iterwebz hugz for comfort.


If your looking for a fluff discussion I think that there maybe another forum for such.

As for a starting place for where the ethereals aren't in total control, Start with the Farsight Enclave. Maueb refugee's from the Enclave who inter brd across castes but then return to the Tau empire.

I didn't accuse them of being communists more than Nazi's really, they've got part of both's ways, as well as a caste system clearly inspired by Indian mythology (Asian indian, not American Indian).

The Caste system, creating segregation between the Tau Species, making them something of sub-races, which aren't allowed to breed with one another, sounds like Nazism to me. 'You're of one race, you're of another. Don't breed'.
The Etherals obviously believing themselves to be superior, and even if they are, they tell the others what to do and pronounce themselves leaders. They're the ones who sets the rules and laws, right? Such as saying that the Fire Caste must battle for 12 years, if they survive they may join some council, otherwise they must continue to fight until they die. Dictatureship, telling people how to live, and in this case 'fight for us, your cause, until you die'.

They go ahead spreading in the galaxy, threatning other xenos to join their cause, or be killed. This was also done by Nazi's, as well as the Roman Empire, as well as European Settlers in Africa, Asia and America, and probably by Sovjet too, I'd guess blindly (even though my knowledge of the Sovjet history is very, very bad.)

Every aspect I find within the Tau, are that of Dictatureship, Extremism and Religious Zealotry, all which I despise.

However as Cobra said, I could do something like Farsight, although I need to find out what exactly that was.

Thanks for the help guys.

Riffzor wrote:Right, I'm not a fan of Communism, Nazism, or any religious beliefs of one person being worth more than another, I believe in individual freedom under the supervizing of an elected goverment.

So, to the point of this topic. I love how Tau looks on the field, I love their gear, I love their characteristics and all, but I just can't get over their fluff! As someone said loud what I was thinking when reading the fluff on another thread, 'Tau are commies'. How am I to field an army which I know are fighting for something so... oposite of what I believe in, it doesn't feel right! =s

NOTE: This thread is not made for political debate, it's a bit of ... Nerdrage I guess, and hope for that someone can help me get over the fluff somehow.

I was thinking about remaking the fluff and build an army anyhow, but since the Tau haven't been around for long there's little room for me to change much. The ideas I've had so far would be the Etherals being something priest-equivelant (equilevant?), or more monk-like (priests don't fight, monks do!). I've never made any Fluff that sticks that far off of something such important to the species before though, have anyone got an own Tau Fluff that allows inter-caste-ic(?) breeding (Not 'cause it's part of the gameplay or anything but, I still believe in blind love xD), that doesn't say that the Etherals' word is law, and so on which I could get some inspiration from?

Thankies.

- Riffzor

Okay, let's be honest. The very implication that you should be believing -anything- your 40K army stands for is ridiculous. The game is one of black and black morality, do space marine players believe extermination of people who don't share your religion or race or are just different is a good thing? I certainly hope not! Do Dark Eldar players believe... well, let's not go there. Bad things. The Tau are without a doubt have the moral high ground on pretty much all the other factions, but I can't understand -why- you'd complain that they don't reflect your political beliefs. It's a bloody game!

In addition, Tau aren't Communists, they are a rigid caste system.

Riffzor wrote:Every aspect I find within the Tau, are that of Dictatureship, Extremism and Religious Zealotry, all which I despise.

Ah-hah. I just had to cherry-pick this little gem of a statement. Bad enough you're saying you hate the -fictional- army of aliens for their belief system. Worse, Dictatorship, Extremism and Religious Zealotry are staples of every single thinking faction in the entirety of Warhammer 40k.

*folds arms* Exactly! *nods firmly* ... Wait, what?

Yeah I know it's fictional and all that, but.. There's a reason to why I prefer Khorne and Space Wolves in the CSM and Space Marines, don't tell me people don't choose armies because they enjoy their battle style and/or fluff?

If it wasn't for the boring Fluff about Space Marines, there'd probably be even more (well, if that'd be possible) Space marine players.

I think it's best not to look into the politics of 40k too much. Pretty much everyone has wretched ideals, and there is nowhere in the universe I would want to live. To be honest, the only folks who are happy in the 41st millennium are the Orks!

True.

But I think the Ork technology has become a bit too much, I like it when it's simple as in Bikers, Trukks, looted tanks. No Wierdboys or tractorbeams. As far as I can remember from the old Ork codex, it said Orks come from sacks growing under mushrooms in the shade of rocks, that starts growing when another ork... Uh.. Makes the nr.2 behind it. *nod*

Riffzor wrote:How am I to field an army which I know are fighting for something so... oposite of what I believe in, it doesn't feel right! =s

So what does this say about people who play Tyranids, Necrons, Dark Eldar, or Chaos then?

I think you're making a big deal out of nothing.

Riffzor wrote:True.

But I think the Ork technology has become a bit too much, I like it when it's simple as in Bikers, Trukks, looted tanks. No Wierdboys or tractorbeams. As far as I can remember from the old Ork codex, it said Orks come from sacks growing under mushrooms in the shade of rocks, that starts growing when another ork... Uh.. Makes the nr.2 behind it. *nod*

What do you mean by Ork tech being simple, then naming complex stuff? Weirdboyz aren't techy, they're just bonkers. Orks are cunning savages, but have the innate ability to make crap work with their imaginations. And yeah, Orks reproduce by shedding their spores, which is done by skin flaking off, dying, or yes, taking a number two.

There's some Eldar quote about Orks and how theirs is the ideal society, with no strife or social angst. They're just happy to beat the crap out of everything.

What, I don't mind Tyranids floating around eating everything, nor Necrons trying to anihilate all life, nor the Dark Eldar or Chaos whom likes to inflict pain. *shrug*

And yeah, it became big when someone poked me about it. o.O

Riffzor wrote:How am I to field an army which I know are fighting for something so... oposite of what I believe in, it doesn't feel right! =s

Yeah, better play Space Nazis (Imperium), Devourers of all living (Tyranids, Necrons), tormenting slavers (Dark Eldar), religious fanatics (DH, WH), or people killing for the fun of it (Orks)

BTW, please read a bit mora about Tau and about communism, they have not much in common. And BTW I play Tau exactly because of their fluff, as I didn't want a "aaargh ... must kill everything in sight" fluff army (except Tyranids ).

Every faction except Tyramids in 40K would fall under the definition of Fascist. This is intentional in that if you are going to wage prolonged wars you have to instill the fascist mentality into your populace or they will lose their will to continue the fight.

As to the Castes not inter-breeding. The Tau were sort of doing that at the tribal level before the Ethereals showed up. Also, the Tau are not trying to breed a master race but are practicing selective breeding to create naturally specialized individuals/tools for the Greater Good.
Now look at how breeding is handled in the Imperiums hive worlds and then think about servitors. You have a problem with a species following a natural segrgational tendency that is guided for the betterment of the whole race, but have no problems with babies being lobotomized to create memory storage units for techpriests.

As to the Fluff, Yeah, Farsight is your ticket. A string of fortress worlds run by the Fire Caste and not a single Ethereal within 50 lightyears(distance made up, but you should get the point).

I've always felt that the Tau are more like the 'space UN'.

In a bad way.

Tau are generally not that great. They get praised in the 40k threads, with people saying they'd like to be them...but they sterilise humans, and segregate each other! Neo-nazis if you ask me

the caste system is based on the Hindu one I believe, and it's stated in one of the codices that the Tau are all mind controlled by the ethereals via pheremones (otherwise they'd be fighting each other)

I think they're based more on Space Asians.

focusedfire wrote:Actually, The Tau do not fit the definition of communist. There is a common mistake people make in equating Collectivist and Communist.

If someone tries to argue that they are, just point out thier caste system which is a form of class system.

If somebody else points to the part of Tau fluff that describes all members of the empire as equals for their proof of Tau as communists, then point out that the US makes the same claim that we are all equal. The US is definitely not communist, currently.

The Tau are probably best described as an Imperialist Theocracy.


If the differing PoV upsets you then I offer Iterwebz hugz for comfort.


If your looking for a fluff discussion I think that there maybe another forum for such.

As for a starting place for where the ethereals aren't in total control, Start with the Farsight Enclave. Maybe refugee's from the Enclave who inter bred across castes but then return to the Tau empire.

The reason i say tau are commies is more along the lines of "everyhting is done for the greater good" ideology used by the tau. They are not communists per say but do have a very similar political view from what i've seen. Plus...its the only thing i've got to say against my brother's Tau so i have to keep it as an argument as to why i hate his army


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Oh and the empire of man is a fascist govenrment

SwanCo wrote:

focusedfire wrote:Actually, The Tau do not fit the definition of communist. There is a common mistake people make in equating Collectivist and Communist.

If someone tries to argue that they are, just point out thier caste system which is a form of class system.

If somebody else points to the part of Tau fluff that describes all members of the empire as equals for their proof of Tau as communists, then point out that the US makes the same claim that we are all equal. The US is definitely not communist, currently.

The Tau are probably best described as an Imperialist Theocracy.


If the differing PoV upsets you then I offer Iterwebz hugz for comfort.


If your looking for a fluff discussion I think that there maybe another forum for such.

As for a starting place for where the ethereals aren't in total control, Start with the Farsight Enclave. Maybe refugee's from the Enclave who inter bred across castes but then return to the Tau empire.

The reason i say tau are commies is more along the lines of "everyhting is done for the greater good" ideology used by the tau. They are not communists per say but do have a very similar political view from what i've seen. Plus...its the only thing i've got to say against my brother's Tau so i have to keep it as an argument as to why i hate his army


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Oh and the empire of man is a fascist govenrment

I guess I'll just field them and make up some own fluff for them, fluff doesn't matter on the table anyhow. *shrug* If I chose them, that is. >.<

maybe you could be renegade tau who broke away?

lolol i'd say chaos tau except for the fact that they can physically not stand chaos...like it would kill them

Tau can't be fascist.. They have the Space pope!

Shatter.proof wrote:Tau can't be fascist.. They have the Space pope!

Empire of man is fascist...space pope is a lie XD

I never understood that part, if they couldn't warp-travel long distances because of the warp being hazzardous for them as a race, or because their technology didn't 'permi' it. But there aren't any Tau psychers so..

And yeah, non-Chaos renegate tau. I think I've got a plan about that.

The Fire Caste were the hardest for the etherals to convince to join them, the commander of my Force, which either will be an Etheral or a Commander, will either as a commander hate the etherals because they aren't free to maraud as they want, or if it's an etheral it'll be one that lost faith in the 'greater good' when he saw that there were aliens such as tyranids and Orks that would never join their cause, and since they wouldn't stand a snowball's chance in hell of wiping them both out from existance (besides there's plenty of other Xenos out there whom never would join their cause, Eldar, Dark Eldar, Chaos, Mankind (although those aren't Xenos), Necrons, and I'm sure there are plenty of aliens not represented by armies that can be found in the novels and fluff that wouldn't care to join them. )

Naw Tau got the space pope the Empire has Jesus.

karimabuseer wrote:Tau are generally not that great. They get praised in the 40k threads, with people saying they'd like to be them...but they sterilise humans, and segregate each other! Neo-nazis if you ask me

Not truly Neo-Nazi's. The only thing the Tau share with the Neo-Nazi's is a fascist belief in thier manifest destiny. Something that all races(Except 'Nids and maybe Orks) have in 40K.

Don't get me wrong, their governmental system can in no way make them the good guys. They are just the logical ones that understand the formula of united we stand and divided we fall.

BTW, the Sterilization all humans thing seems to be a myth as to that the Tau are maintaining a Human population over a period of centuries. They may be practicing population control but are not forcing the Gue'vesa into entropy.

NoShoes wrote:the caste system is based on the Hindu one I believe, and it's stated in one of the codices that the Tau are all mind controlled by the ethereals via pheremones (otherwise they'd be fighting each other)

I think they're based more on Space Asians.

This is dead on.

SwanCo wrote:The reason i say tau are commies is more along the lines of "everyhting is done for the greater good" ideology used by the tau. They are not communists per say but do have a very similar political view from what i've seen. Plus...its the only thing i've got to say against my brother's Tau so i have to keep it as an argument as to why i hate his army

Seeing as they are the Space Asians, maybe you could just tease him that the Tau are the Hapu of the Imperium. That the Tau's position in the galaxy is as the Proprietors of open all millenia conveniance stores and to whom the Adeptus Mechanicus outsources their jobs. Thank you very much, Please come again.

Riffzor wrote:I never understood that part, if they couldn't warp-travel long distances because of the warp being hazzardous for them as a race, or because their technology didn't 'permi' it. But there aren't any Tau psychers so..

Current fluff has the Tau making use of another races Psyker abilities to navigate deeper into the Warp. Personally dont care for this bit of Fluff. Would much rather that they came up with fluff where the Tau stole the Tech from Necrons or developed some other alternate means such as Hyperspace.

Their race is based on Confucianism

Riffzor wrote:Right, I'm not a fan of Communism, Nazism, or any religious beliefs of one person being worth more than another, I believe in individual freedom under the supervizing of an elected goverment.

So, to the point of this topic. I love how Tau looks on the field, I love their gear, I love their characteristics and all, but I just can't get over their fluff! As someone said loud what I was thinking when reading the fluff on another thread, 'Tau are commies'. How am I to field an army which I know are fighting for something so... oposite of what I believe in, it doesn't feel right! =s

NOTE: This thread is not made for political debate, it's a bit of ... Nerdrage I guess, and hope for that someone can help me get over the fluff somehow.

I was thinking about remaking the fluff and build an army anyhow, but since the Tau haven't been around for long there's little room for me to change much. The ideas I've had so far would be the Etherals being something priest-equivelant (equilevant?), or more monk-like (priests don't fight, monks do!). I've never made any Fluff that sticks that far off of something such important to the species before though, have anyone got an own Tau Fluff that allows inter-caste-ic(?) breeding (Not 'cause it's part of the gameplay or anything but, I still believe in blind love xD), that doesn't say that the Etherals' word is law, and so on which I could get some inspiration from?

Thankies.

- Riffzor

It's just that, fluff. Don't let a story ruin your gaming fun. I mean yeah, it's awesome to be able to talk gak. And say "Oh my primarch did (insert comment") but even if you don't like the fluff, you can still say "Oh you remember that time my 2k tau stomped your 2k (insert army here).

n0t_u wrote:Their race is based on Confucianism

I agree, their race is based on confusion.