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I checked the forums and I did not see this in the 139 threads that came back on my search, so here we go.

I started with Ultramarines and my feeling on them is meh. They are not bad at anything, but not great. Since I am probably not the only one that feels this way, I am curious what everyone else would like to see (realistically of course).

I really think just a slight points readjustment, maybe a change to how venerable dreads work, and Tu'shan the salamanders chapter master would make it awesome. I already feel it's pretty competitive in 6th as is. What I hope they don't do is change drastically how the codex works.

I want to see a return to the "make your own chapter" strengths and weaknesses system.

It needs to be done better though. The old one was far to simplistic with some obviously powerful strengths and lame downsides you'd hardly notice.

flak missile upgrade?

As far as new units go I am not persuaded they need anything. If something like chapter traits is reinstituted that would be nice.

They will probably get some stupid large model that looks more like a toy than a proper wargame miniature since that is the current trend.

I bet they get a FAQ the day after release to fix some bonehead error since that also is a recent trend!

Devastators adjusted in cost downward heavily, Vulkan's ability re-worked/removed/apply only to his own unit/etc, AA missiles on Whirlwind, TH/SS termi's upp'd in points and ranged terminator weapons dropped in points, points drop on tanks and especially Venerable dreads, obviously adjust assault/tac squads like DA's.

A change to close combat dreads.

Nothing. Codex: Space Marines is totally fine. A few units could get minor points adjustments to bring them in line with the modern books, but this is a relatively minor factor. At this stage it looks like most of the updates provided by a new Space Marine codex would consist of minor price drops on some units (Devastators, Scouts, Predators, Vanguard) and minor price hikes on others (TH/SS Terminators).

Of course, there's potential for adding new stuff, but by and large the core of Codex: Space Marines is quite balanced at present.

Point re-ajustment for sure.

Being able to Customize your forces more to represents more chapters.

More funky gadgets like the conversion beamer and thunderfire cannon.

And make the land speeder storm a dedicated transport.

And Finaly...more the emperors sake....make the legion of the dammed usable.....such cool models going to waste....make me sad thinking about it

not rolling the black templar in with them would be a good start.

Back on topic i would say leave the units alone and mess with the points. IE assault squads, assault terminators, legion of the damned, tacs and devastators.

Maby give the predator a buff too with armor being close to a wet paper bag in 6th. something to make it survive longer than shooting once or not at all then dieing instantly from a side armor hit.

Space Marines don't need anything in 6th edition. They have the most complete line of models that GW produces, with the vast majority in plastic, even the only plastic Commander kit.

However, GW feels the need to push models with every codex release, so we will see new models. Going by recent trends, this includes at the very least - an infantry box, a 3 mid sized model box, a plastic single frame character, a large oval base box and a flyer.

Infantry
The only Infantry box Space Marines are missing in plastic are Veterans. I'd be shocked if we didn't get a dual Veteran box that builds both Vanguard and Sternguard veterans, with some more ornate looking armour and weapons, as well as a selection of special weapons.

In true GW style, it won't include the stuff people want - it'll be missing Jump packs, so people have to buy assault squads to get jump packs for them. It'll be missing combi weapons, because GW will sell a conversion pack with 1 of each, making people buy multiple packs.

3 mid sized model pack
No idea. There's rumours of a new type of power armour for the 6th edition codex, half way between a Terminator and a Dreadnought. This is a good contender.

Large oval base model
My guess is something along the lines of the Dreadknight, hopefully with less Dreadknight.

Plastic single frame character
Most likely a Librarian or Chaplain. Maybe both.

Flyer
Space Marines now have 2 flyers. As of Death from the Skies, Stormravens are vanilla legal, which gives them that and the Storm Talon. They don't need another flyer.

My guess is a new tank. Likely a new Predator box with a new turret option (maybe the Plasma Annihilator varient FW is doing) and maybe even with the Whirlwind packed in for good measure in order to further reduce Space Marine SKUs and inflate the box price a little more.

vanguard vets need to be made usable, and legion of the damned. Maybe the chapter tactics reintroduced and balanced.

That and a few minor points adjustments, and it's good to go.

Land speeder storm as a dedicated transport,
Plastic chaplain/librarian kit,
Points adjustments,
Flak missiles,
Whirlwind with Hyperios option.
Tarantulas.

That's about it really.

Point adjustments, something to make Captains worth taking again, less emphasis on taking a SC in every single game because their special rules are just too good, a return of the Chapter Traits system, but maybe with a few tweaks, something to make Honour Guard viable (think SG for BA, or DA Knights), increase costs for TH/SS Terminators, Flakk missiles, make Scouts cool again, something big to take on Riptides and Dreadknights, an anti-air Rhino variant, up the price of Artificer armour, invulnerable save for Librarians, make Cassius more expensive and give him back PE:Tyranids.

Those are the ones off the top of my head, nothing too major, just bringing it in line with other codices.

It needs delaying until we get some other codexes updated.

For the most part I think out codex is in a good place. Just a few tweaks here and there are needed.

Most of the list needs the Dark Angels price/composition adjustments. The problem is making us something besides "DA, with all the cool stuff taken out" I think the answer to that is to make a very flexible book. Let us do a all terminator army. We don't get the special death wing knights or wacky rules though. Or assault marines jump army, but no decent of angels or other BA specials. Just like we can do the all bike army now. Ravenwing has enough going on to differentiate themselves.

Captains/Chapter Masters need some sort of boost. I'd like to see a return of "Rites of Battle" where your whole army could use his leadership for moral/pinning tests. Also expand the bikes as troops if the captain has one to include jump packs and terminator armor. This could be a place to switch chapter tactics that isn't a special character, if they don't want to do it on an army level.

Librarians need to roll their powers, as much as I hate to admit it. Keeps up in line with the rest of the new books.

Techmarines and LotD need some love. Sternguard HBs should get hellfire rounds, but that's a fluffy thing.

Scouts should have LSS as a dedicated transport.

Nothing in the FA/HS slots some price tweaks can't fix.

Now we know GW is going to want some new shinies that we all need to buy. The problem is that our range is pretty well stocked. We don't need some giant monster. If they feel the need to press one on us, just go with the dreadknight. It doesn't need to exists, but it's there. Rather then inventing some new monstrous infantry thing, re-cut the dreadnought sprue. Or update the bikes. A veteran box would fly off the shelves. More plastic HQ kits would rock. Either a TDA one or a Librarian/Chaplain one

If they wanted to they could bring back some of the different artillery pieces like thudd guns, rapiers, mole mortars, and tarantulas. Or robots. Boost the role of techmarines.

I'm waiting for the book to come along and say they can pick a specific power from the BRB disciplines. Who better to give that to than Codex: Red Mage.

Certainly not going to say they NEED it, but I think GW might roll out the Legio Cybernetica again for the SM.

A squad of 3+ wound battle droids led by a techmarine? It fits the rumor about a unit between terminator and dreadnought size and gives them a good medium size plastic kit with multiple builds.

Just as an aside I do love that for all the matt ward hate he wrote rules that have lasted well for 2 editions which is saying something.

As for changes I think just some price adjustments would be enough. As others have said, adding chapter customization again would be great.

I hope they make it so you don't have to take Special Characters to make specific chapters. In other words, I hope that regular Captains/Chapter Masters let you pick your own Chapter Tactics.

Seeing where they are going with the Codex in 6th, the SM is almost competitive right now.
I see it mostly as a points adjustment...

1. Reduce cost of predators to DA levels.
2. Reduce cost of Devastators to DA/CSM levels.
3. Reduce cost of Whirlwing to DA levels.
4. Reduce Librarian costs to DA/CSM levels.
5. Add Flakk option to Missile Launchers.

I would love to see Heavy Bolters be made more viable... Perhaps as simple as a 5 point reduction in cost.
I doubt we will see it, but I would love the tactics to be free of running a special character with the exception of Biker Captain allowing Bikes as troops.

To expand on that, I would love if a Jump Pack Captain would unlock Assault Marines as troop choices.

I think Vanguard Vets are priced right IF they got their jump packs for free. Perhaps make it like the old BA White Dwarf... Free Rhino, Drop Pod or Jump Packs.

I would like to see the Honor Guard get the grenade launcher for free. It is a neat option but +15 points? I don't think so. Include it for free and it helps make them a debate between them or terminators...

I would LOVE for combat shields to go back to 5++ in close combat and stormshields to be LOWERED to 4++ at all times if for nothing than to make assault termies and regular termies more on an equal footing.

I also think Chaplains need to be discounted... To say 70 points... sure they provide a free power maul and have their 4++ rozarius but they lose out to Librarians or pure combat captains or chapter masters - especially the named ones.

As far as chapter powers... why not preset them and make people pick them?

Ultramarines - Chose to Run
Salamanders/Crimson Fist - Stubborn
Dark Ravens?? - Fleet
White Scars - Outflanking Troops

Keep the special advantages attached to the ICs (i.e. Vulkan TL Flamers and Meltas, Shrike allows you to infiltrate, etc...)

Adding too much customization can be rough to balance. If you are giving up the option to take something you weren't going to use anyway for a bonus, is that really a drawback? An example from the 4th ed codex is "Eye to Eye" where you could only take one (total) attack bike, bike, or landspeeder squad. This was a major drawback. Would it affect a predro/vulcan drop list? Gunline? Not in any real manner. And if you wanted to play a bike army, you could just use a different set of traits for that list.

In the point-based RPG, HERO system, there is a saying: "A disad is only worth points if it's actually a disadvantage" If you want to take "Vulnerable (2xdamage) from lasers" in a space opera campaign, you get a chunk of points for it. You take it in a low fantasy game, you don't get any. But that's a system with a GM to help keep things in line. With GW's loose rule set, there is nobody to slap you upside the head for being a munchkin power gamer.

I wan't enough flexibility to play White Scars, Salamanders, Crimson Fists, Iron Hands, and any other chapter you care to name. It would be nice if there was a little something besides just unit selection to make them all distinctive. But I don't want some easy to abuse system. Just by choosing fluffy units you can go a long way to personalizing your army; not everything needs special rules. I'd rather have nothing new added then some broken system.

Full customisable character system as 4th edition had, would be utterly amazing, and would give you a reason to play C:SM over their varient's. Other than that, it would have to be a point's reajustment to fit in with other marine books, make legion of the damned space marines usable, and give some option to have x as troops (probably sternguard, right now i think it only makes them scoring).

Other than that, i'm pretty happy with it right now

so for TLDR:

1. Re-adjust point's to match newer books.
2. Something uniquely scoring. (DA have termies, BA have assault marines, e.x)
3. Full on character creator, to be the "Draw in players" feature for playing vanilla marine's over the other chapters.

Echoing the calls for a return to a chapter traits system. Less of this 'count-as-SC' malarky, let us buy the traits for our HQ's instead (balanced within reason of ocurse).
Make the vanguard worthwhile points-wise.
Give us a plastic veterans set for stern/vanguard.

I'm sure there's a Zord-type thing on the cards.

I just want an iron hands guy in the book. Just give me that and I'm happy.

I'd say Raven Guard love, so I guess I'm saying a better Chapter Traits system.

I also wouldn't mind straight-out ganking Wolf Lords from the SW book. You can make some actually usable non-SC HQs with that setup.

Flakk missiles obvi
Some adjustment to a vern dread

The biggest thing imo that needs to be fixed is the legion of the damned elites
Some of the coolest models for the army but the most worthless unit. Over priced sterguard really

Chapter master needs to be fixed

Aome tweeks to the stormtalon

And thats it imo. I think that if there is a model that no one runs they need to do some tweeking to it
To make it usable

Point adjustment for tactical marines to DA levels.

Point adjustment for Devestators and WW.

Point adjustments for the HQ slots.

More options to move things into different spots in the FOC (I like Chapter masters making Sterngaurd/vangaurd troops or something like that).

Dreadnaughts to 3 HP, Venerable with an invunerable save.

Command squad reworked to be more kitable at a usable point amount

What does the 6th Edition SM codex need?

Why, Black Templars, Blood Ravens and Dark Angels of course.

 Nevelon wrote:
Adding too much customization can be rough to balance. If you are giving up the option to take something you weren't going to use anyway for a bonus, is that really a drawback? An example from the 4th ed codex is "Eye to Eye" where you could only take one (total) attack bike, bike, or landspeeder squad. This was a major drawback. Would it affect a predro/vulcan drop list? Gunline? Not in any real manner. And if you wanted to play a bike army, you could just use a different set of traits for that list.

In the point-based RPG, HERO system, there is a saying: "A disad is only worth points if it's actually a disadvantage" If you want to take "Vulnerable (2xdamage) from lasers" in a space opera campaign, you get a chunk of points for it. You take it in a low fantasy game, you don't get any. But that's a system with a GM to help keep things in line. With GW's loose rule set, there is nobody to slap you upside the head for being a munchkin power gamer.

I wan't enough flexibility to play White Scars, Salamanders, Crimson Fists, Iron Hands, and any other chapter you care to name. It would be nice if there was a little something besides just unit selection to make them all distinctive. But I don't want some easy to abuse system. Just by choosing fluffy units you can go a long way to personalizing your army; not everything needs special rules. I'd rather have nothing new added then some broken system.

Yeah, I think the best way to do it would be to allow Chapter Masters and Captains to exchange their Chapter Tactics for different ones, all within reason (different USR or something). Maybe Chapter Masters have more options than Captains or something.

BlaxicanX wrote:
What does the 6th Edition SM codex need?

Why, Black Templars, Blood Ravens and Dark Angels of course.

I think every model that comes standard with a bolt pistol should also get a close combat weapon. I'd also make Tactical Marines cheaper.