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Before the new Codex I had always imagined using a jet-seer council as my HQ. Or at the very least a Farseer on a jetbike buffing the unit with warlocks in each of my jetbike squads.
Now that the powers are randomly generated I figured the jet-seer build is probably out of the question and warlocks in bike units aren't as effective without guaranteed embolden.
I was wondering what people would be taking as their HQ and their reasons to help me decide. (I am new to 40k)

The seer council is still very viable but you can't always rely on fortune. With 2 seers leading it, you have a better chance. I foresee running a large council for a great chance at getting the armour boost power from the warlocks. Shrouding is a definite. And with 8 warlocks there will definetly have redundancy. No embolden us sad. But I'd rather look forward and new tricks instead of being sad about not having the old ones.

I'm going to try 2 seers and 8 warlocks. That's just upwards of 600 Pts. That can fit in a 1500 even. At 2000 you can start to add more hq's and another council if you saw fit.

But with the poor leadership of the warlocks and the fact they can't use ghosthelms to save them from the doubles 1s surely they will be killing themselves/not casting every so often?



Automatically Appended Next Post:
Or double 6s*

Yes it will happen every once in a while. But I wouldn't throw the whole council out because of the small chance of it happening. Gone are the days of sure fire casting and picked powers :-/.

Bonesinger and Wraithseer.

Autarch, jetbike, mantle, fusion gun, laser lance.
Eldrad

Just a pair of farseers for me. Maybe some warlocks or a shadowseer.

Being to get 4 units to reroll to hi this just way to good.

I'm looking to try out Asurmen and Karandras (not together, probably always going to have a Farseer in there).

They seem like they can do some fun stuff. Asurmen with his 3 Warlord traits, Karandras with his at-initiative power fist. Both look great with a unit of Scorpions or Harlequins, should be a hard assault unit.

Warlocks are still very good in guardian jetbike squads, remember that the primars power is conceal, so you can always get it. Shrouded stacks with Jink saves, which is awesome on your troops 2+ cover saves when moving flat out is excellent for last turn objective grabs!

 akaean wrote:
Warlocks are still very good in guardian jetbike squads, remember that the primars power is conceal, so you can always get it. Shrouded stacks with Jink saves, which is awesome on your troops 2+ cover saves when moving flat out is excellent for last turn objective grabs!

if you can successfully cast it...

GW has decided to make very thing random with psykers. I gess that's more cinematic? Yea ok. The locks low leadership gives what, a 75% chance to cast? Not great... But it's what we have to work with now.

For a Codex that has about 13 HQ options a lot of what I see just boils down to "how many Farseers do I take?"

It seems to me that all the ordinary HQs have a place in an armylist.

Farseers are obviously good.
Autarchs are a must if you run Crimson Hunters, or as a jetbike mounted Solitaire.
The Avatar wrecks face in close combat.
The Spiritseer is great as Runes of Battle is awesome and Wraithguard/blade troops are really tough.

I can't speak for the special characters, I rarely use those.

I am thinking of it like this:

Setting aside the PL, Every Hq option is very viable. Illic is a more special case, but I think our HQ's will influence our opponents even more now since we have been given more trickery .

That's cause no one really appreciates Phoenix Lords :(

Asurmen gets 1d3 Warlord Traits and if he gets the 'Re-roll Saving Throw results of 1' trait he becomes tanky as hell. The over all chance of him getting any 1 trait is 1/3(1/6)+1/3(1/6+1/5)+1/3(1/6+1/5+1/4)= ~38.33%. His weapon is +1S, AP2, Master Crafted and has Soul Razor (Ld test or Die) and has a 4+ invuln. He's a monster in cc

Karandras is also a monster in cc. He gets 5 S8 AP2 attacks at initiative. Plus a free S6 AP- hit at Initiative 10

Fuegan is... odd. He's great in cc, and is built to wreck vehicles. His main trick is that if you pair him with a Warlock Council and you get a few regenerator rolls, Fuegan can be farmed for +S/+A but that seems like alot of work. Hes just barely above the remaining P. Lords

I don't really like the other lords. Maybe someone else can extol them.

Spartan089 wrote:For a Codex that has about 13 HQ options a lot of what I see just boils down to "how many Farseers do I take?"

Of course, once you get past the random power generation (since everyone gets that) Farseers are better than before and cost less (135pts + for ML2 vs 100pts for ML3). When you break things down its always the buff/support based HQ's that end up being the most effective (and popular), and Seers are some of the best around.

Marzillius wrote:It seems to me that all the ordinary HQs have a place in an armylist.

Farseers are obviously good.
Autarchs are a must if you run Crimson Hunters, or as a jetbike mounted Solitaire.
The Avatar wrecks face in close combat.
The Spiritseer is great as Runes of Battle is awesome and Wraithguard/blade troops are really tough.

I can't speak for the special characters, I rarely use those.

You can get away without Autarchs if you run a Comms Relay, and if you are really worried about them coming on at a bad time then you can try and get Scriers Gaze with your Farseer/s. Rolling 3 dice for each Hunter with a re-roll is pretty good.

Imo the Avatar is nowhere near as good as he used to be. Sure he is better is assault, and can get there a bit faster with Fleet, but the drop from 4++ to 5++ combined with the fact that you can't reliably get Fortune anymore really hurts him. He used to be really good because with a 3+/4++ re-rollable he could tank a huge amount of firepower, and he was still easily punchy enough to deal with all but the most powerful combat characters in the game (who usually cost a good 100pts more than him). His assault ability is more of less the same, +1A and a better initative isn't going to let him win the fights that he struggled with before (its mostly the lack of Eternal Warrior that hurts him against some of the top beatsticks around).

Eldrad, because Eldrad.

Well he lost the "ignore armor saves" ability on his weapon, it's now AP3. Also Runes of Warding isn't the boardwide awesome it used to be.

However, now he casts 4 powers and they can be from Divination or Fate (Telepathy kinda disappointed).

(its mostly the lack of Eternal Warrior that hurts him against some of the top beatsticks around).

Like who? I can think of maybe one or two where this is relevant, given his T6.

People are writing the PLs off before even giving them a chance, but I'm intrigued with Jain at the moment. Her 4 AP shots+ 6 AP 2 Strikes at I7 will decimate most units before they have a chance to strike, and when they do they have to hit on a 5+ and get through a 2+, and Eternal Warrior. I think Jain and a full squad of Shees could very easily cut wholes into peoples deployment zone.

RancidHate wrote:
Eldrad, because Eldrad.

Well he lost the "ignore armor saves" ability on his weapon, it's now AP3. Also Runes of Warding isn't the boardwide awesome it used to be.

However, now he casts 4 powers and they can be from Divination or Fate (Telepathy kinda disappointed).

You forgot the force weapon. I already poked a bloodthirster to death with his two attacks

But yeah, Eldrad is still the man.

Belly wrote:

RancidHate wrote:
Eldrad, because Eldrad.

Well he lost the "ignore armor saves" ability on his weapon, it's now AP3. Also Runes of Warding isn't the boardwide awesome it used to be.

However, now he casts 4 powers and they can be from Divination or Fate (Telepathy kinda disappointed).

You forgot the force weapon. I already poked a bloodthirster to death with his two attacks

But yeah, Eldrad is still the man.

Yeah, and his redeployment ability is extremely useful too. I agree that Eldrad, is indeed, the man.

Is it just me or is Autarch with Jetbike, Banshee Mask and Shard of Anaris one of the best CC HQs in the game?

Ws6, 4 Base Attacks, I10, Fleshbane, Rending, AP3 Instant Death weapon which strikes at initiative. 130 points.

Asmodai Asmodean wrote:
Is it just me or is Autarch with Jetbike, Banshee Mask and Shard of Anaris one of the best CC HQs in the game?

Ws6, 4 Base Attacks, I10, Fleshbane, Rending, AP3 Instant Death weapon which strikes at initiative. 130 points.

It's good, and its delivery system is great, but lack of AP2 limits it from "best in the game" status. I still think it's a very useful tool.

You get tons of AP2 from D-Scythe Wraithguard already. You can even give him a Reaper launcher to make him a poor man's Sammael. (Arguably, better in combat.)

ShadarLogoth wrote:

Asmodai Asmodean wrote:
Is it just me or is Autarch with Jetbike, Banshee Mask and Shard of Anaris one of the best CC HQs in the game?

Ws6, 4 Base Attacks, I10, Fleshbane, Rending, AP3 Instant Death weapon which strikes at initiative. 130 points.

It's good, and its delivery system is great, but lack of AP2 limits it from "best in the game" status. I still think it's a very useful tool.

It only benefits from Flesbane, and Instant death during a Challenge.

and dont forget muagen ra is still the best ranged support hq in the dex imho

ShadarLogoth wrote:

(its mostly the lack of Eternal Warrior that hurts him against some of the top beatsticks around).

Like who? I can think of maybe one or two where this is relevant, given his T6.

People are writing the PLs off before even giving them a chance, but I'm intrigued with Jain at the moment. Her 4 AP shots+ 6 AP 2 Strikes at I7 will decimate most units before they have a chance to strike, and when they do they have to hit on a 5+ and get through a 2+, and Eternal Warrior. I think Jain and a full squad of Shees could very easily cut wholes into peoples deployment zone.

Mephiston can beat him now that we don't have Warding. Draigo will also deal with him. Any of the big Daemons will destroy him (they can all get the Sword the causes ID as standard). Swarmlord crushes him. I'm pretty sure a Dreadknight beats him if he gets the charge (Avatar is a Daemon so will be going last). Other characters can beat him even without ID, Abby beats him even with Disarm on the Avatar.

Jain is definitely very nice, but you would never run her with Banshees. You would be far better off attaching her to Harlies, since they are still the best choice for getting across the board intact without a transport. Even Scorpions walking across the board would probably work out better. Alternatively you could attach her to something tougher like Wraithblades or Guard.

Eldrad and Avatar. I run Harlequins and now that Eldrad has fleet there is no reason on earth not to run him with them. Avatar because fearless and 2x Melta shots at BS10 causes opponents to put an unreasonable amount of firepower at him.

Mephiston can beat him now that we don't have Warding. Draigo will also deal with him. Any of the big Daemons will destroy him (they can all get the Sword the causes ID as standard). Swarmlord crushes him. I'm pretty sure a Dreadknight beats him if he gets the charge (Avatar is a Daemon so will be going last). Other characters can beat him even without ID, Abby beats him even with Disarm on the Avatar.

I don't know about any of that. Disarm alone and his superior WS S AND I to basically everything you mentioned gives him a punchers chance. He gets off Disarm, which he should more often then not considering he has the best WS in the game, he can take them.

Jain is definitely very nice, but you would never run her with Banshees. You would be far better off attaching her to Harlies, since they are still the best choice for getting across the board intact without a transport. Even Scorpions walking across the board would probably work out better. Alternatively you could attach her to something tougher like Wraithblades or Guard

I envision them in a Wave Serpent, so none of those other options work without sacrificing Acrobatic, which is another huge part in how I envision her use.

I allways run Eldrad and a farseer, but thats for my wraith army.
This has all changed with the new book though.

If im not taking wraiths, i may just run P.lords and large units of aspects instead.
Would be nice to see an eldar army that runs something other than jetbikes, farseers and warlocks.

Jain Zar with Harlequins.... that actually sounds great! If you feel like using your other HQ for a spirit seer you can really make those Howling Harlequins stick around.