Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

Bioblast node, while pricey, is incredibly tough. I screen with gants and venomthropes for cover saves, and re rolling 1s to wound at range is fun.

SBG wrote:
Bioblast node, while pricey, is incredibly tough. I screen with gants and venomthropes for cover saves, and re rolling 1s to wound at range is fun.

I just don't see it having enough of an advantage over basic dakkafex to warrant the warrior tax. You are already rerolling, and unless you have atleast 4fex your not getting any thing from the splitfire rule your paying for.

barnowl wrote:

SBG wrote:
Bioblast node, while pricey, is incredibly tough. I screen with gants and venomthropes for cover saves, and re rolling 1s to wound at range is fun.

I just don't see it having enough of an advantage over basic dakkafex to warrant the warrior tax. You are already rerolling, and unless you have atleast 4fex your not getting any thing from the splitfire rule your paying for.

Well a fex with two weapons can technically shoot at two targets with split Fire. And rerolling 1s is certainly useful.

Don't forget that all weapons fired in the shooting phase - devourers, deathspitters - heck, even bio plasma - re roll 1's. The Tyrannofex's acid spray, too.

And shooting the Warrior's barbed strangler at a different target is a nice perk.

 jifel wrote:

barnowl wrote:

SBG wrote:
Bioblast node, while pricey, is incredibly tough. I screen with gants and venomthropes for cover saves, and re rolling 1s to wound at range is fun.

I just don't see it having enough of an advantage over basic dakkafex to warrant the warrior tax. You are already rerolling, and unless you have atleast 4fex your not getting any thing from the splitfire rule your paying for.

Well a fex with two weapons can technically shoot at two targets with split Fire. And rerolling 1s is certainly useful.

See, if this was the case then it might be better even pretty good, but I am pretty sure this not how it works

barnowl wrote:

 jifel wrote:

barnowl wrote:

SBG wrote:
Bioblast node, while pricey, is incredibly tough. I screen with gants and venomthropes for cover saves, and re rolling 1s to wound at range is fun.

I just don't see it having enough of an advantage over basic dakkafex to warrant the warrior tax. You are already rerolling, and unless you have atleast 4fex your not getting any thing from the splitfire rule your paying for.

Well a fex with two weapons can technically shoot at two targets with split Fire. And rerolling 1s is certainly useful.

See, if this was the case then it might be better even pretty good, but I am pretty sure this not how it works

Depends on your interpretation of split fire I suppose, but I always read it as allowing a single model to shoot two targets. To be honest I don't believe its worth the taxes regardless of the ruling, but it certainly helps if you rule it as affecting single model units.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
A question for the Hive Mind: With the new GW FAQs (just the main rule book one) I think that Crones have lost ground competitively, and Mawlocs are now clearly our best "support" MC to back up our mandatory Flyrants. Now the question is, what is the proper number of Lictors to compliment two Mawlocs? I am thinking 2 and 2 just because points wise it fits into my list best, but I'm curious what the rest of you have experienc with.

 jifel wrote:

barnowl wrote:

 jifel wrote:

barnowl wrote:

SBG wrote:
Bioblast node, while pricey, is incredibly tough. I screen with gants and venomthropes for cover saves, and re rolling 1s to wound at range is fun.

I just don't see it having enough of an advantage over basic dakkafex to warrant the warrior tax. You are already rerolling, and unless you have atleast 4fex your not getting any thing from the splitfire rule your paying for.

Well a fex with two weapons can technically shoot at two targets with split Fire. And rerolling 1s is certainly useful.

See, if this was the case then it might be better even pretty good, but I am pretty sure this not how it works

Depends on your interpretation of split fire I suppose, but I always read it as allowing a single model to shoot two targets. To be honest I don't believe its worth the taxes regardless of the ruling, but it certainly helps if you rule it as affecting single model units.

I don't see how you can interpret the wording to allow single models to split fire.

When a unit containing at least one model with this special rule shoots, one model in the unit can shoot at a different target to the rest of his unit. Once this shooting attack has been resolved, resolve the shooting attacks made by the rest of the unit. These must be at a different target

So your single Dakkafex can shoot at a different target than the rest of its unit. There is no rest of the unit, ergo it cannot split. Thus the Bioblast node is probably not worth the Warrior tax.

 N.I.B. wrote:

 jifel wrote:

barnowl wrote:

 jifel wrote:

barnowl wrote:

SBG wrote:
Bioblast node, while pricey, is incredibly tough. I screen with gants and venomthropes for cover saves, and re rolling 1s to wound at range is fun.

I just don't see it having enough of an advantage over basic dakkafex to warrant the warrior tax. You are already rerolling, and unless you have atleast 4fex your not getting any thing from the splitfire rule your paying for.

Well a fex with two weapons can technically shoot at two targets with split Fire. And rerolling 1s is certainly useful.

See, if this was the case then it might be better even pretty good, but I am pretty sure this not how it works

Depends on your interpretation of split fire I suppose, but I always read it as allowing a single model to shoot two targets. To be honest I don't believe its worth the taxes regardless of the ruling, but it certainly helps if you rule it as affecting single model units.

I don't see how you can interpret the wording to allow single models to split fire.

When a unit containing at least one model with this special rule shoots, one model in the unit can shoot at a different target to the rest of his unit. Once this shooting attack has been resolved, resolve the shooting attacks made by the rest of the unit. These must be at a different target

So your single Dakkafex can shoot at a different target than the rest of its unit. There is no rest of the unit, ergo it cannot split. Thus the Bioblast node is probably not worth the Warrior tax.

You're probably correct on that then. Never used the Bioblast node though, so no big deal. Thought it was bad before, now its worse!

 jifel wrote:
You're probably correct on that then. Never used the Bioblast node though, so no big deal. Thought it was bad before, now its worse!

I've tried it a couple of times, and it's a total bullet sponge if you back it up with a few Venomthropes. Obscuring the models with some cover or Termagants for easy 3+ (or 2+) cover saves, combined wit their natural armour and toughness, lets them soak up a silly amount of firepower (unless your opponent is packing D weapons, but then any group Tyranid is boned regardless). I always put the Tyrannofex at the head of the pack to tank as much firepower as possible.

Honestly I've never had cause to use Split Fire from the formation, but the re-roll 1s to wound is surprisingly good if you load up on the right weapons.By which I mean anything with large blast markers. My Tyrannofex runs an Acid Spray and Egrubs (of course), but the Carnifexes I actually run with Stranglethorn Cannons (have three of them sitting around so occasionally take them for a spin). Stranglethorns can reach out a long way and start piling the wounds up on enemy infantry. Now I know you're thinking Tyranids don't struggle with infantry but if you're sinking 690 points into this formation then you're stretching yourself pretty thin in medium sized games. Throw in a couple of Flyrants for anti-armour and anti-air and you're up to 1170 points. Suddenly those long range pie plates start to look pretty helpful.

At 1500 when using Bio-blast I usually go with something like this:

CAD
Flyrant (240)
Flyrant (240)
Malanthrope (85)
Zoanthrope (50)
Zoanthrope (50)
12 Termagants (48)
12 Termagants (48)
12 Termagants (48)

Bio-blast Node
3 Warriors /w Barbed Strangler (100)
Tyrannofex /w Acid Spray and Egrubs (185)
Carnifex /w Stranglethorn (135)
Carnifex /w Stranglethorn (135)
Carnifex /w Stranglethorn (135)

Plenty of WC to chance Catalyst, surprising firepower and it still fits in a couple of Flyrants to do the heaviest lifting.

Nice. The mobile cover saves are, in my opinion, completely necessary.

 jifel wrote:


A question for the Hive Mind: With the new GW FAQs (just the main rule book one) I think that Crones have lost ground competitively, and Mawlocs are now clearly our best "support" MC to back up our mandatory Flyrants. Now the question is, what is the proper number of Lictors to compliment two Mawlocs? I am thinking 2 and 2 just because points wise it fits into my list best, but I'm curious what the rest of you have experienc with.

Yep Mawlocs were great and didn't have any adverse rulings in the FAQs so far, so they only got better (although we really didn't get hit that hard in the FAQ except for the people using a bastion to make the Malanthrope's effective range better (and nigh unkillable).

Of course, I was :( but the beat goes on.

I'll probably try to find a way to include a Dimanchaeron instead of the bastion. You know, because 200 points is the same as 95 points. Realistically, I'll likely drop 2 lictors to make it happen. I think it's worthwhile though.

As far as your original question, I have been running a LOT of lictors per Mawloc for redundancy. At least 3. I would never do less than 2:1, so 4 lictors for 2 Mawlocs. You can focus down a lictor too easily, but two separate squads are rather difficult to uproot, even if you know what's coming. They are great at mauling MSU that isn't marines (and can sometimes win that also) and tend to be forgotten about once they have guided in the Mawlocs. Very underrated and overlooked unit. One of the best in our codex if you take advantage of Mawloc synergy IMO.

I must have missed it- which part of the FAQ killed the Bastion+Thrope combo?

 Sinful Hero wrote:
I must have missed it- which part of the FAQ killed the Bastion+Thrope combo?

Auras and area of effect rules no longer are measured from the hull of transports, they are ignored. So a Thrope in a vehicle (or fort) does nothing. Sadly Bastions, FMCs, and void shields all got hit for us... Not to mention that we lost our battle brothers. Let's just hope that there's some cool ruling in the Tyranid FAQ that will help us out!

Been seeing a lot of lists with a Dimachaeron in on these pages (and apparently one did quite well at Adepticon)! But the thing in common is that all these lists have a huge amount of flyrants and virtually no other ground pounders. Having never played with or even seen one on the table, I'm struggling to see how this can work well for the Dima - without screening units and other ground targets does he not just get focused down and die before doing anything? Any tips appreciated, as I'd like to eventually add one to my Hive Fleet!

Benlisted wrote:
Been seeing a lot of lists with a Dimachaeron in on these pages (and apparently one did quite well at Adepticon)! But the thing in common is that all these lists have a huge amount of flyrants and virtually no other ground pounders. Having never played with or even seen one on the table, I'm struggling to see how this can work well for the Dima - without screening units and other ground targets does he not just get focused down and die before doing anything? Any tips appreciated, as I'd like to eventually add one to my Hive Fleet!

Can go totally rediculous and get a Hierophant with the transport capacity upgrade. Put the Dimacheron inside. Hierophant deploys as far forward as it can (at least 12 inches in), moves 12, disembarks 6, and then assaults 2d6. Dimacheron to the face, potentially turn 1 if you go second. Fill the rest of the list with 2 flyrants, Mucalids, and maybe a mal/venothrope and your done.

Can the Hierophant transport upgrade actually carry Monstrous Creatures? I thought it was up to 20 infantry models, with no mention of MCs.

No, IA:4 is an old book. No such thing as a Hierophant carrying an MC. A Tyrannocyte gets a pass because it states it.

But could you imagine? Hierophant - Tervigon - Termagants? No one can Russian doll like Nids Russian doll!

Y'know, maybe someone needs to fire off an email to FW about that...

GMC carrying another GMC like the old Ork transport rules?

 Frozocrone wrote:
No one can Russian doll like Nids Russian doll!

Ha, and that's not even getting into matryoshka tyrannocytes. (Transport capacity one monstrous creature? Sure thing! lets put a tyrannocyte in there)

Can someone run me through Skyblight Formation tactics? My housemate is going to proxy it up this weekend, he seems to think it's really strong.

Unsure if we're playing with the FAQ changes (to test) so that may have an effect, I understand Crones have been nerfed a bit now?

zerosignal wrote:
Can someone run me through Skyblight Formation tactics? My housemate is going to proxy it up this weekend, he seems to think it's really strong.

Unsure if we're playing with the FAQ changes (to test) so that may have an effect, I understand Crones have been nerfed a bit now?

The flying circus is still one of our best builds imo, though others feel it's fallen off. In my opinion the 3x respawning gargoyle broods give us some really solid fast objective grabbers who endure even if killed (sometimes) - which is invaluable in maelstrom. A typical flyrant/mawloc build might have a lot more trouble actually winning the maelstrom than Skyblight, unless it masses lictors too.

But anyway, the flyrant works exactly as you'd expect, it's just another flyrant. The Crone and Harpies are mostly harassing units compared - you don't expect them to do as much damage, and you're almost happy if they soak up shooting that isn't going at the flyrants. However, you also really don't want to be forced to jink on them now, since swooping FMCs can't claim toe in cover and it prevents even vector strikes - so if you do you may as well fly them off the board the next turn. However, on the upside, now they can't ever be hit by blasts as per the wording of the FAQs, so there's less risk of their own weapons scattering onto them. With the Harpies I've found the Stranglethorns to be best - it's a pseudo TL-Dev in effect, shoot it at a unit of marines and it will get 5 or so hits hopefully, and do reasonable damage. The TL-VCs are pretty much only better for popping very high armour, think LRs. Even knights are alright to deal with if you have 3 flyrants or more, so you don't really need the Harpies to be on anti-vehicle duty. The crone will likely be flushing people out of cover and plinking off the haywire missles before he gets there opportunistically. Don't be afraid to land these ones to claim an objective for a turn or similar.

The gargoyles I tend to use initially to screen my fliers from first turn assaults, grav pods, and to provide cover if need be. Often several will get left in reserve (usually at least one deepstrikes) to hop onto objectives as demanded. They're pretty straightforward to play - use them to claim objectives and tie things up if necessary, and as screens/to block parts of the table off. Personally I've never really felt the need to run more than 10 per squad, and I wouldn't buy any upgrades as they're fine without them.


EDIT: Anyway, no testimonials about Dimachaeron usage at all?

I've never used a Dima or seen a reason to, so no testimonial I'm afraid. They're good assault units but 200 points and slow. Are you willing to spend 200 points in hopes he reaches assault? I am not.

 jifel wrote:
I've never used a Dima or seen a reason to, so no testimonial I'm afraid. They're good assault units but 200 points and slow. Are you willing to spend 200 points in hopes he reaches assault? I am not.

Well typically the best way to field dimas is in pods, they are real nasty in cc. My typical pure nid list has 2 in pods.

 gameandwatch wrote:

 jifel wrote:
I've never used a Dima or seen a reason to, so no testimonial I'm afraid. They're good assault units but 200 points and slow. Are you willing to spend 200 points in hopes he reaches assault? I am not.

Well typically the best way to field dimas is in pods, they are real nasty in cc. My typical pure nid list has 2 in pods.

And I can see that being their best use, but that's $275 at that point... Do you think you get more value out of that Dima than an extra flyrant and change?

 jifel wrote:

 gameandwatch wrote:

 jifel wrote:
I've never used a Dima or seen a reason to, so no testimonial I'm afraid. They're good assault units but 200 points and slow. Are you willing to spend 200 points in hopes he reaches assault? I am not.

Well typically the best way to field dimas is in pods, they are real nasty in cc. My typical pure nid list has 2 in pods.

And I can see that being their best use, but that's $275 at that point... Do you think you get more value out of that Dima than an extra flyrant and change?

Oh well, I converted mine, so I didn't spend nearly that much.

 gameandwatch wrote:

 jifel wrote:
I've never used a Dima or seen a reason to, so no testimonial I'm afraid. They're good assault units but 200 points and slow. Are you willing to spend 200 points in hopes he reaches assault? I am not.

Well typically the best way to field dimas is in pods, they are real nasty in cc. My typical pure nid list has 2 in pods.

How has that worked for you? I would assume not assaulting until turn 3 at the earliest would hold that strategy back a bit.

 gameandwatch wrote:

 jifel wrote:

 gameandwatch wrote:

 jifel wrote:
I've never used a Dima or seen a reason to, so no testimonial I'm afraid. They're good assault units but 200 points and slow. Are you willing to spend 200 points in hopes he reaches assault? I am not.

Well typically the best way to field dimas is in pods, they are real nasty in cc. My typical pure nid list has 2 in pods.

And I can see that being their best use, but that's $275 at that point... Do you think you get more value out of that Dima than an extra flyrant and change?

Oh well, I converted mine, so I didn't spend nearly that much.

I'm sorry, $275 meant 275 points! For one assault unit that cant charge till turn 3, thats too many points when a Flyrant brings consistent damage and is tougher.

 jifel wrote:

 gameandwatch wrote:

 jifel wrote:

 gameandwatch wrote:

 jifel wrote:
I've never used a Dima or seen a reason to, so no testimonial I'm afraid. They're good assault units but 200 points and slow. Are you willing to spend 200 points in hopes he reaches assault? I am not.

Well typically the best way to field dimas is in pods, they are real nasty in cc. My typical pure nid list has 2 in pods.

And I can see that being their best use, but that's $275 at that point... Do you think you get more value out of that Dima than an extra flyrant and change?

Oh well, I converted mine, so I didn't spend nearly that much.

I'm sorry, $275 meant 275 points! For one assault unit that cant charge till turn 3, thats too many points when a Flyrant brings consistent damage and is tougher.

While I agree that the flyrant is the most cost-effective offensive option in a bug army, for those who are determined to run assault nids, Dima-in-a-spore is actually a pretty good option (next to Swarmy-in-a-spore ).




Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Sinful Hero wrote:

 gameandwatch wrote:

 jifel wrote:
I've never used a Dima or seen a reason to, so no testimonial I'm afraid. They're good assault units but 200 points and slow. Are you willing to spend 200 points in hopes he reaches assault? I am not.

Well typically the best way to field dimas is in pods, they are real nasty in cc. My typical pure nid list has 2 in pods.

How has that worked for you? I would assume not assaulting until turn 3 at the earliest would hold that strategy back a bit.

The main strategy for bug-in-a-spore is more of board control/area denial than one of actual assault. Of course if he does manage to get into assault, then that's a huge plus.

I tend to look at it this way. Shooty nids > assault nids. HOWEVER, if you're determined to run an assaulty Tyranid build, then the dima-in-a-spore is a configuration that you should seriously consider. Otherwise, then just spam those flyrants and call it an army.

Fair enough. My preferred Spore unit is a TFex personally. His perceived CC is high, and that can be enough. I feel you on wanting assaulty Nids, my Hormagaunts are getting dusty... Meanwhile I bought another flyrant last month. :/