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Just found out a Velocity Tracker effects the entire unit even if you only take 1. So a single Stealth team member can take a VT and the entire unit gets +1 to hitt against Jetbikes, Skimmers, Assault Marines and well anything with Fly.

Not sure I would bother with crisis teams but worth thinking about with Stealth Teams.

Razerous wrote:
What is better;

1 XV109 Y'Vahra

or

3 (2.6) Quad-weapon commanders?

So assuming 65pts can be squeezed (or; spending the remaining 95ps elsewhere) which is better.

Context; got some marker light support and I'm already planning on fielding 1 XV109. And lots more gun drones.

Thoughts?

I'd say both are good options. I think the commanders might be a bit better but y'vahra are so good. Depends on the rest of your list and the opponents you expect.

The Triple Ion ATS boosted commanders are so cheap, comparatively.

I'm guessing the ATS ions is better/as good as the Quad-Ions?

Updated faqs are up. Shield drones get FNP, keywords fix for longstrike, broadsides can all take missile drones again, nerf to velocity tracker (only affects models now), and clarification on a few things.

All in all pretty good I think.

https://17890-presscdn-0-51-pagely.netdna-ssl.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/07/40K_8th_ed_Update_Index_Xenos_2_ver_1.1.pdf


Also a huge note against pure flyer armies. They changed sudden death to say that flyers don't count as models on the table.

 FirePainter wrote:
Updated faqs are up. Shield drones get FNP, keywords fix for longstrike, broadsides can all take missile drones again, nerf to velocity tracker (only affects models now), and clarification on a few things.

All in all pretty good I think.

https://17890-presscdn-0-51-pagely.netdna-ssl.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/07/40K_8th_ed_Update_Index_Xenos_2_ver_1.1.pdf


Also a huge note against pure flyer armies. They changed sudden death to say that flyers don't count as models on the table.

Makes Shield Drones somewhat useful as ablative wounds again, having a 4++/5+++ against direct wounds and a 5+ against Saviour Protocol, and other mortal, wounds.
Whether that is worth the loss of firepower over taking gun drones though....

Sunshark Drones got double Ion Rifle!

Shield Drones now have a 4+ Save, a 4+ Invulnerable Save, AND a 5+ FNP!

Brilliant!

 Talamare wrote:
Sunshark Drones got double Ion Rifle!

Well, that makes me glad I finished painting a Sunshark.

Shield Drones now have a 4+ Save, a 4+ Invulnerable Save, AND a 5+ FNP!

Brilliant!

Good, good.

 Talamare wrote:
Sunshark Drones got double Ion Rifle!

Shield Drones now have a 4+ Save, a 4+ Invulnerable Save, AND a 5+ FNP!

Brilliant!

Now... I'm fairly certain this is an incorrect position to have; but can a riptide pass a mortal wound over to a drone (ala ablative Heat Sink style) via Saviour Protocols, for Nova Reactor mortal wounds?

Razerous wrote:

 Talamare wrote:
Sunshark Drones got double Ion Rifle!

Shield Drones now have a 4+ Save, a 4+ Invulnerable Save, AND a 5+ FNP!

Brilliant!

Now... I'm fairly certain this is an incorrect position to have; but can a riptide pass a mortal wound over to a drone (ala ablative Heat Sink style) via Saviour Protocols, for Nova Reactor mortal wounds?

I would say no, as the Riptide is never "successfully wounded" it simply takes a mortal wound. However, you can give it the Stimulant Injector and ignore that on a 6+.

I am a bit sad to have VT nerf'd but it puts them in line with the rest of the support systems so its okay. They are still a really cheap way to get +1 on a lot of units.

Now that shield drones work, there is an excellent strat I will be trying out.

Take a triple fusion commander with the shield generator.
Take a 3 man Crisis Bodyguard team.
Take some shield drones.

Enemy shoots at the commander. 4+ inv vs high ap weapons.
If his 4+ inv fails, bodyguard takes a mortal on a 2+.
Pass it to shield drone. SG gets 5+ save.
Profit.

Enemy shoots at Bodyguard team, 1 is equipped with a SG. 4+ inv save vs high ap weapons.
Pass any wounds to SG. SG gets 5+ save.
Profit.

Enemy shoots at shield drone squad.
SG gets 4+/4++, 5+ ignore.
Profit.

You want to troll the enemy? take a huge team of shield drones to camp objectives.

Its like "what you gonna do about it? invest mortal wounds on my 8 point models?"

 BoomWolf wrote:
You want to troll the enemy? take a huge team of shield drones to camp objectives.

Its like "what you gonna do about it? invest mortal wounds on my 8 point models?"

Im thinking 8 Gun Drones and 4 shield drones would be excellent objective takers, along with a Stealth DC squad.

So are people thinking of still using gun drones for suits? Or would certain loadout benefit more from shield drones.

 BoomWolf wrote:
You want to troll the enemy? take a huge team of shield drones to camp objectives.

Its like "what you gonna do about it? invest mortal wounds on my 8 point models?"

I might start using them for that, but I think an Ethereal is in order. Drones are high susceptible to morale

 Crusaderobr wrote:
Now that shield drones work, there is an excellent strat I will be trying out.

Take a triple fusion commander with the shield generator.
Take a 3 man Crisis Bodyguard team.
Take some shield drones.

Enemy shoots at the commander. 4+ inv vs high ap weapons.
If his 4+ inv fails, bodyguard takes a mortal on a 2+.
Pass it to shield drone. SG gets 5+ save.
Profit.

Enemy shoots at Bodyguard team, 1 is equipped with a SG. 4+ inv save vs high ap weapons.
Pass any wounds to SG. SG gets 5+ save.
Profit.

Enemy shoots at shield drone squad.
SG gets 4+/4++, 5+ ignore.
Profit.

No, it does not work like that.

You don't pass wounds you failed saving, you pass the wounds before you save.

this is a very minor, but critical point.

Saviour Protocols: If a <Sept> Drones unit is within 3"
of a friendly <Sept> Infantry or <Sept> Battlesuit
unit when an enemy attack successfully wounds it, you
can allocate that wound to the Drones unit instead of
the target. If you do, that Drones unit suffers a mortal
wound instead of the normal damage

This is a common mistake I see made all the time with most of the bodyguard units in different armies.

Successfully wounding, and then allocating the hits are very distinct steps in the combat resolution, and occur BEFORE you roll saves.

Don't get me wrong - shield drones are still awesome now - but they dont take saves we fail, they take hits we don't want to.
(which is for us better - a las cannon shot that can do six damage, only passes a single mortal wound).

in general, we have to be very careful in reading the new rules (at least there are only a few of them...). there are a lot of subtle nuances in there.

 BoomWolf wrote:
You want to troll the enemy? take a huge team of shield drones to camp objectives.

Its like "what you gonna do about it? invest mortal wounds on my 8 point models?"

Your enemy will just walk a Scout Squad up and claim the objective anyway. And your Shield Drones will do nothing about it. And as long as one Scout is alive, they will hold that objective.

davethepak wrote:

 Crusaderobr wrote:
Now that shield drones work, there is an excellent strat I will be trying out.

Take a triple fusion commander with the shield generator.
Take a 3 man Crisis Bodyguard team.
Take some shield drones.

Enemy shoots at the commander. 4+ inv vs high ap weapons.
If his 4+ inv fails, bodyguard takes a mortal on a 2+.
Pass it to shield drone. SG gets 5+ save.
Profit.

Enemy shoots at Bodyguard team, 1 is equipped with a SG. 4+ inv save vs high ap weapons.
Pass any wounds to SG. SG gets 5+ save.
Profit.

Enemy shoots at shield drone squad.
SG gets 4+/4++, 5+ ignore.
Profit.

No, it does not work like that.

You don't pass wounds you failed saving, you pass the wounds before you save.

this is a very minor, but critical point.

Saviour Protocols: If a <Sept> Drones unit is within 3"
of a friendly <Sept> Infantry or <Sept> Battlesuit
unit when an enemy attack successfully wounds it, you
can allocate that wound to the Drones unit instead of
the target. If you do, that Drones unit suffers a mortal
wound instead of the normal damage

This is a common mistake I see made all the time with most of the bodyguard units in different armies.

Successfully wounding, and then allocating the hits are very distinct steps in the combat resolution, and occur BEFORE you roll saves.

Don't get me wrong - shield drones are still awesome now - but they dont take saves we fail, they take hits we don't want to.
(which is for us better - a las cannon shot that can do six damage, only passes a single mortal wound).

in general, we have to be very careful in reading the new rules (at least there are only a few of them...). there are a lot of subtle nuances in there.

Ah my bad, you are correct. Allocating a wound normally assigned to a commander/crisis suit is still great on a shield drone though. Also, the bodyguards will function the way I described if someone shoots the commander, so you can take a 4+ inv save on the commander, and if he fails, a bodyguard can intercept and take the mortal wound. Handy when you run out of drones to allocate to, or if you would rather take a wound to the bodyguard instead of the commander.

Sense of stone and stimulant injectors are cumulative. Add a shield generator on that and wow. Some suits can become really tough.

casvalremdeikun wrote:

 BoomWolf wrote:
You want to troll the enemy? take a huge team of shield drones to camp objectives.

Its like "what you gonna do about it? invest mortal wounds on my 8 point models?"

Your enemy will just walk a Scout Squad up and claim the objective anyway. And your Shield Drones will do nothing about it. And as long as one Scout is alive, they will hold that objective.

Did you miss the 'huge' word? Drones can take objectives now. Objectives are taken by the player with more models within 3" of their center; drones are cheaper than scouts.

Edit: just saw winter SEO SM codex review... SM troops have 'objective secured'-like ability. Ugh.
Hm... bubble wrap!

 Crusaderobr wrote:

davethepak wrote:

 Crusaderobr wrote:
Now that shield drones work, there is an excellent strat I will be trying out.

Take a triple fusion commander with the shield generator.
Take a 3 man Crisis Bodyguard team.
Take some shield drones.

Enemy shoots at the commander. 4+ inv vs high ap weapons.
If his 4+ inv fails, bodyguard takes a mortal on a 2+.
Pass it to shield drone. SG gets 5+ save.
Profit.

Enemy shoots at Bodyguard team, 1 is equipped with a SG. 4+ inv save vs high ap weapons.
Pass any wounds to SG. SG gets 5+ save.
Profit.

Enemy shoots at shield drone squad.
SG gets 4+/4++, 5+ ignore.
Profit.

No, it does not work like that.

You don't pass wounds you failed saving, you pass the wounds before you save.

this is a very minor, but critical point.

Saviour Protocols: If a <Sept> Drones unit is within 3"
of a friendly <Sept> Infantry or <Sept> Battlesuit
unit when an enemy attack successfully wounds it, you
can allocate that wound to the Drones unit instead of
the target. If you do, that Drones unit suffers a mortal
wound instead of the normal damage

This is a common mistake I see made all the time with most of the bodyguard units in different armies.

Successfully wounding, and then allocating the hits are very distinct steps in the combat resolution, and occur BEFORE you roll saves.

Don't get me wrong - shield drones are still awesome now - but they dont take saves we fail, they take hits we don't want to.
(which is for us better - a las cannon shot that can do six damage, only passes a single mortal wound).

in general, we have to be very careful in reading the new rules (at least there are only a few of them...). there are a lot of subtle nuances in there.

Ah my bad, you are correct. Allocating a wound normally assigned to a commander/crisis suit is still great on a shield drone though. Also, the bodyguards will function the way I described if someone shoots the commander, so you can take a 4+ inv save on the commander, and if he fails, a bodyguard can intercept and take the mortal wound. Handy when you run out of drones to allocate to, or if you would rather take a wound to the bodyguard instead of the commander.

Absolutely! Awesome idea with the bodyguards - they look like they take the entire hit, regardless of the number of wounds - so a las cannon that does 5 points turns into a single mortal wound on the bodyguard. Also, considering they are slightly better stats than crisis, sounds like a good replacement.

And then if that bodyguard has stims and an etheral is near, you can try to save that mortal wound twice on 6+++ ^^

Watching winter SEO's SM codex review, I've noticed some units have decreased in points (some more than 10). So, I'm hopeful we'll see serious point changes among our units with our codex!

I'm wondering if the new Shield Drone ability, since it affects any shielded drone and not just the basic ones, makes the Riptide's Shielded Missile Drones worthwhile. I think maybe it would if Riptides weren't so god-awful expensive. Although I'm still thinking of taking mine with HBC and SMS. Might have to give it a try in a non-competitive game at least.

 Vector Strike wrote:
Watching winter SEO's SM codex review, I've noticed some units have decreased in points (some more than 10). So, I'm hopeful we'll see serious point changes among our units with our codex!

It's literally the Riptide's only hope, but anything less than a 50pt reduction probably won't make much difference.

Has anyome given Piranhas a try? They seem to have a similar damage output as XV25s, but can't take the ATS. Guess that'd make the FB better than the BC on them, as if your after more S5 you may as well take the suits unless I'm wrong?

Can a riptide allocate the mortal wound on to a shield drone when it uses its nova reactor ability?

No, the mortal wound for activating the nova reactor cannot be allocated per the FAQ.

Pages 53, 56, 57, 62, 63, 64, 65, 66, 68, 69, 70, 71, 72, 73 and 74 – Saviour Protocols Change this rule to read: ‘ Saviour Protocols: If a <Sept> Drones unit is within 3" of a friendly <Sept> Infantry or <Sept> Battlesuit unit when an enemy attack successfully wounds it, you can allocate that wound to the Drones unit instead of the target. If you do, that Drones unit suffers a mortal wound instead of the normal damage.’

Wait, wasn't that change to saviour protocols made a few weeks ago? Am I missing something?

 casvalremdeikun wrote:

 BoomWolf wrote:
You want to troll the enemy? take a huge team of shield drones to camp objectives.

Its like "what you gonna do about it? invest mortal wounds on my 8 point models?"

Your enemy will just walk a Scout Squad up and claim the objective anyway. And your Shield Drones will do nothing about it. And as long as one Scout is alive, they will hold that objective.

I have a question: where is written that you can make the "fnp" 5+ roll aftr a mortal wound? Is a mortal wound a wound also?