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KingCracker wrote:
I have to agree...its a black suit. So what. I mean...its.....a black suit. Thats a costume now?

Costume design is based not only on how you want the actress to look, but how the actress will look. If you have a particular woman in mind, say one who is approaching 30 and has never been in what Hollywood would consider impeccable shape, your choices are limited.

dogma wrote:

KingCracker wrote:
I have to agree...its a black suit. So what. I mean...its.....a black suit. Thats a costume now?

Costume design is based not only on how you want the actress to look, but how the actress will look. If you have a particular woman in mind, say one who is approaching 30 and has never been in what Hollywood would consider impeccable shape, your choices are limited.

Are you saying Anne Hathaway is fat?

I dunno...while the costume isn't showing skin, it's pretty tight.

http://www.postgazette.com/pg/11217/1165413-60.stm

Flashman wrote:
Are you saying Anne Hathaway is fat?

I'm saying that the fact that a woman is attractive does not mean that she will look good in Catwoman's nominal bodysuit.

Katy Perry is attractive too, but I doubt she would be able to pull off the Black Widow look from Iron Man 2, which was noted as a struggle for Ms. Johansson.


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gorgon wrote:I dunno...while the costume isn't showing skin, it's pretty tight.

http://www.postgazette.com/pg/11217/1165413-60.stm

Based on the one picture I've seen (your link doesn't work, so I can't see anything there) it is very tight in the arms (which are easy to shape with fabric), but shows significant pooling (a sign of loose fabric) around the torso.



Disclaimer: I dated a number of costume/fashion designers.

dogma wrote:

Flashman wrote:
Are you saying Anne Hathaway is fat?

I'm saying that the fact that a woman is attractive does not mean that she will look good in Catwoman's nominal bodysuit.

Katy Perry is attractive too, but I doubt she would be able to pull off the Black Widow look from Iron Man 2, which was noted as a struggle for Ms. Johansson.

Agreed. Katy Perry wouldn't have the same goodnes that Ms. Johansson did in that outfit.

Disclaimer: I dated a number of costume/fashion designers.

I have faith in Nolan. Costumes are an irrelevance to be honest. For me, it's all about how the characters are developed and played.

And you can't have everyone with"issues" which mean they feel a need to put on a daft costume. Batman covers this idiosyncracy perfectly adequately with out extending it to the entire cast.

Flashman wrote:I have faith in Nolan. Costumes are an irrelevance to be honest. For me, it's all about how the characters are developed and played.

And you can't have everyone with"issues" which mean they feel a need to put on a daft costume. Batman covers this idiosyncracy perfectly adequately with out extending it to the entire cast.

Costumes are part of character development, when done well. A bad costume can ruin a character. For example, if the Bat wore a pink leotard few people would take it seriously.

Need we revisit Jim Carey's Riddler?

Why? To remember how awesome it was?

dogma wrote:
Disclaimer: I dated a number of costume/fashion designers.

That explains it then. Anne Hathaway is more than attractive enough to be Catwoman even though she may not have the body of Halle Berry kind of like Trinity in the Matrix.

And for the hell of it, meow:

It is actually pretty interesting when you start looking at the costume, and what it does to the body, rather than at the body.

Its a lot like the game real, fake, or assisted.

dogma wrote:

Flashman wrote:I have faith in Nolan. Costumes are an irrelevance to be honest. For me, it's all about how the characters are developed and played.

And you can't have everyone with"issues" which mean they feel a need to put on a daft costume. Batman covers this idiosyncracy perfectly adequately with out extending it to the entire cast.

Costumes are part of character development, when done well. A bad costume can ruin a character. For example, if the Bat wore a pink leotard few people would take it seriously.

Yes, but what Hathaway is wearing is hardly out of context. At the end of the day, Catwoman/Selina Kyle is a thief. She doesn't need to dress like a cat to steal things.

Batman on the other hand is trying to instill fear in the criminal populace, hence the decision to be "theatrical" in his attire (to quote Batman Begins).

I'm not sure my argument is aimed at you Dogma. I've lost track of which point you were making

I doubt she'll ever be referred to as Catwoman in the movie.; she will be Selina Kyle. Now they may drop a reference to her being a cat burglar or something to that effect. I think Flashman is right in that they aren't going to have her dress as a cat.

Although the character is CATwoman. As much as Nolan touts keeping the series grounded and "real," there's some pretty ridiculous stuff. Even Two-Face got a very over-the-top scarred side. Nolan coulda gone with terrible surface scarring, etc. But no, he went full comic book, lidless eye, exposed jaw and all. And Catwoman can't get a hat with little ears?

Perhaps the character will only be Selina Kyle, and not Catwoman explicitly. It'd be an odd choice, but then Nolan's unafraid to make fairly significant character alterations. Consider Two-Face. His character -- again, despite the comic-booky burns -- was really just a guy pi$$ed off about his girlfriend's death and not the multiple personality crime boss of the comics. He was very much comic Two-Face on the outside -- coin and all -- but completely different internally.

Also note that rumors point to Catwoman being a vigilante filling in for Batman instead of a professional thief. Not what I expected, given that the latter would work perfectly well in the film universe, but like with Two-Face I suppose it's all part of the story he wants to tell.

Hmm. I'm not sure what I'm arguing anymore either. Other than that Catwoman needs a hat.

Edit: Ninja'ed by Ahtman.

dogma wrote:It is actually pretty interesting when you start looking at the costume, and what it does to the body, rather than at the body.

Nope, not even going to try. Too worried about the "what is seen cannot be unseen." I enjoy looking at the body too much

Ahtman wrote:I doubt she'll ever be referred to as Catwoman in the movie.; she will be Selina Kyle. Now they may drop a reference to her being a cat burglar or something to that effect. I think Flashman is right in that they aren't going to have her dress as a cat.

So Nolan is taking the most iconic Batman villain (in this movie) and removing everything that makes her character unique. I suppose he did the same with Two Face and Ra's Al Ghul (taking them from major threats to supporting cast), but the Joker and Scarecrow really stood out in their place. I just don't see that happening with Bane.

Again, based wholly on your speculation and a single still from the movie, but that all seems to be a reasonable interpretation based on the available information. Plus, would anyone ever cast Anne Hathaway in a "bad girl" role?

Most iconic Batman villain? Catwoman? YEAH RIGHT. That honor definitely goes to Joker. Half the folks that walk into the theater aren't even going to know that Selina Kyle = Catwoman. Hell, a lot of the younger ones probably wouldn't even realize Selina Kyle was Batwoman if she was was wearing a more appropriate Catwoman costume, I've known several people that were completely unaware that Catwoman and Batman were part of the same continuity. Joker on the other hand... there are kids in 3rd world countries that haven't eaten in weeks that know Joker is Batman's greatest enemy.

Not only that, but she isn't even a villain. More of an anti-heroine.

chaos0xomega wrote:Most iconic Batman villain? Catwoman? YEAH RIGHT.

biccat wrote:the most iconic Batman villain (in this movie)

Bane is a second tier villain.

biccat wrote:Bane is a second tier villain.

Well sure, if you don't read the comics.

I dunno about Bane. Figure Joker is alone on the first tier, he's the arch-enemy. Would anyone argue against Riddler and Two-Face firmly on the second tier? If we can agree to that, does Bane truly fit alongside them? It's questionable, if you ask me. The non-readers may not know that Selina Kyle = Catwoman, but they know Catwoman, Riddler and Two-Face much better than Bane.

What about the Penguin vs. Bane? I figure they're almost opposites. Penguin is iconic and has the long history, but no real defining moment in the comics. Bane is a newer villain (at least for Batman's rogue's gallery), (arguably) not as iconic, but has the one great storyline. Who's on a higher tier?

Back more on topic, it seems like that the Nolan formula is two villains, one more or less the comics version, and one a more significant departure.

Also just heard some of the Steelers will have cameos in the TDKR scenes shot at Heinz Field


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chaos0xomega wrote:Not only that, but she isn't even a villain. More of an anti-heroine.

That's accurate in current continuity, but she was a criminal and villain for a decent stretch of Batman history. Like I said, rumors were that she fills in for Batman in some fashion, so maybe she's more of a straight-up "hero" in TDKR? At least as far as heroes go in Nolan's universe.

biccat wrote:Plus, would anyone ever cast Anne Hathaway in a "bad girl" role?

What about those dudes who casted Heath Leager as a psychotic murderer?

Slarg232 wrote:

biccat wrote:Plus, would anyone ever cast Anne Hathaway in a "bad girl" role?

What about those dudes who casted Heath Leager as a psychotic murderer?

Clearly you've never seen A Knight's Tale.

biccat wrote:

chaos0xomega wrote:Most iconic Batman villain? Catwoman? YEAH RIGHT.

biccat wrote:the most iconic Batman villain (in this movie)

Bane is a second tier villain.

biccat wrote:

Slarg232 wrote:

biccat wrote:Plus, would anyone ever cast Anne Hathaway in a "bad girl" role?

What about those dudes who casted Heath Leager as a psychotic murderer?

Clearly you've never seen A Knight's Tale.

I own it

He's not a psychotic murderer in that, though....

I just want to go on record and say that Heath Ledger did beyond an awsome job as the Joker. He honestly came off as a total nutjob

Hathaway has played some crazy. She can certainly do it; she gets the wild eyes convincingly.

biccat wrote:

dogma wrote:It is actually pretty interesting when you start looking at the costume, and what it does to the body, rather than at the body.

Nope, not even going to try. Too worried about the "what is seen cannot be unseen." I enjoy looking at the body too much

Ahtman wrote:I doubt she'll ever be referred to as Catwoman in the movie.; she will be Selina Kyle. Now they may drop a reference to her being a cat burglar or something to that effect. I think Flashman is right in that they aren't going to have her dress as a cat.

So Nolan is taking the most iconic Batman villain (in this movie) and removing everything that makes her character unique. I suppose he did the same with Two Face and Ra's Al Ghul (taking them from major threats to supporting cast), but the Joker and Scarecrow really stood out in their place. I just don't see that happening with Bane.

Again, based wholly on your speculation and a single still from the movie, but that all seems to be a reasonable interpretation based on the available information. Plus, would anyone ever cast Anne Hathaway in a "bad girl" role?

Except that she has only been confirmed as playing Selina Kyle, the name Catwoman has only been brought up by people postulating about the movie, and saying "she doesn't look enough like catwoman!", when the character isn't catwoman, its Selina Kyle.

KingCracker wrote:I just want to go on record and say that Heath Ledger did beyond an awsome job as the Joker. He honestly came off as a total nutjob

He played it so well that he developed insomnia, meaning that he needed sleeping pills, leading to his death.

Goliath wrote:...when she isn't catwoman, shes Selina Kyle.

Say what?

dogma wrote:

Goliath wrote:...when she isn't catwoman, shes Selina Kyle.

Say what?

Sorry, now that I have re-read it my initial post was poorly worded.

Nolan has given no mention of the name Catwoman.

The character in the photos isn't Catwoman, its Selina Kyle.

So the people complaining about her not looking "catty" enough, are effectively complaining that Bruce Wayne doesn't look bat-like, when not wearing his bat suit.

Kanluwen wrote:Why? To remember how awesome it was?

There's some truth to that. Jim Carrey had some great potential for the Riddler, but the script and the costume ruined it.

Anung Un Rama wrote:

Kanluwen wrote:Why? To remember how awesome it was?

There's some truth to that. Jim Carrey had some great potential for the Riddler, but the script and the costume ruined it.

I actually agree, Carrey did have some good moments as the Riddler, mostly near the beginning of the film...
However, in my perfect world...The Riddler would be the current Nolan " bad guy" and would be played by none other than this man...

...But of course that's just my wish listing...

I think Batman Forever's casting went something like this...

"Which of the main villains haven't we done yet?"
"The Riddler."
"Ok, cool. Who's really hot right now?"
"Jim Carrey."
"Great, get me his agent."

Carrey was very much in his buffoonery phase (like it or loathe it) at that point and the success of his recent hits allowed the film to driven by his pratting about. I'm not saying he didn't make me chuckle ("Tell the fat lady she's on in five."), but it wasn't Batman (although it was slightly more Batman than the travesty that followed).

EDIT - And for those still grumbling about costumes or lack there of...