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These were planned months, almost a year ago, to help revitalize the dying product line. The sent all the info to China for the cost of printing the hardcovers were smaller. But to get the lowest cost of shipping, they had to order a maxed minimum. The moment they all sold out, GW learned how much interest the fans still had. The problem fell with us always "boohooing" and crying how we all "disliked practices." The online only deal is also to help hobbyists get one instead of some random dude buying 10 then ebaying them for overcost, happened with nagash and glotkin.

Is there some kind of mechanism in place in the online shop to stop scalpers doing that again...?

Does anyone know when pre-orders usually pop up?

 Vermis wrote:
Is there some kind of mechanism in place in the online shop to stop scalpers doing that again...?

Usually you can only add two to your cart. It can be worked around, but if it sells out in minutes it's unlikely you can do it more than once.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 pities2004 wrote:
Does anyone know when pre-orders usually pop up?

Friday, 2-3PM here in Central US time.

All this will do is make the 4 and 5th books cost even MORE on ebay. In addition, I know that if I cant get the 4th book in HC, I will sell off all three of my other books on Ebay and not look back. Im already scaling back my collection (from having to have an extra bedroom just for all of it) to just 2 armies in each (WHFB, 40k). Depending on how badly they butcher 9th, they may push me over to abandon them wholly and only keep one painted army of each for when the occasional garage game springs up. I enjoy painting the most anyway, I'll just paint and sell

Spaz431 wrote:
These were planned months, almost a year ago, to help revitalize the dying product line. The sent all the info to China for the cost of printing the hardcovers were smaller. But to get the lowest cost of shipping, they had to order a maxed minimum. The moment they all sold out, GW learned how much interest the fans still had. The problem fell with us always "boohooing" and crying how we all "disliked practices." The online only deal is also to help hobbyists get one instead of some random dude buying 10 then ebaying them for overcost, happened with nagash and glotkin.

I don't see at all how this helps hobbyists get the book. People can buy them and flip them from Mailorder just as easy as getting them from stores. The only difference i see is that the hobbyists who bought the first 3 from stores are pissed they probably can't complete their set without going to SC. GW encouraged me to get pre-orders for the earlier books. I did so for the last two. Now i'll have the joy of telling hobbyists who wanted the books and committed early that i didn't get them.

After 25 years of dealing with GW, i know the pattern. They make a decision. Then they make up reasons to back the decision.

"Stop the Scalpers" isn't the reason.

Neither is "this conveniently puts all the books in one place".

It was done because they make more money doing it this way. Pure and simple.

Think about it:
-How many times in the last few years have you seen GW worry about hobbyists? GT's? GamesDays? 'Ardboyz? Global Campaigns? Nothing.
-Now think of how many times and ways GW has made a decision that makes them money.

Artificial restriction of supply. Which is being demonstrated again and again, can be used to control pricing.

Limited edition is sold out in Oz, BTW.

Book and dice available from my FLGS, the over reactions in here are amazing.

The Division Of Joy wrote:
Book and dice available from my FLGS, the over reactions in here are amazing.

Why is that?

That you and your experience of a massive sample of one FLGS is in some way more accurate than many others having a contrary view?

Was told yesterday by my local GW that they're not getting any hardcovers of Thanquol as regular stock.

They'll only get the copies that people preordered.

Just saves folks from buying books that are about to become obsolete, anyway!

Kanluwen - did they mention when they'll get the softcover? Not a simultaneous release?

Supposedly they'll get the softcover, but I haven't seen any of the other softcovers on the shelves ever.

rich1231 wrote:

The Division Of Joy wrote:
Book and dice available from my FLGS, the over reactions in here are amazing.

Why is that?

That you and your experience of a massive sample of one FLGS is in some way more accurate than many others having a contrary view?

Because people have been bleating and moaning over something that isn't true 100%. If my FLGS can get them from GW then so can others, that's obvious.

The Division Of Joy wrote:

rich1231 wrote:

The Division Of Joy wrote:
Book and dice available from my FLGS, the over reactions in here are amazing.

Why is that?

That you and your experience of a massive sample of one FLGS is in some way more accurate than many others having a contrary view?

Because people have been bleating and moaning over something that isn't true 100%. If my FLGS can get them from GW then so can others, that's obvious.

What an independent in the UK can get is not going to necessarily be the same as what an independent in the US can get.

Plus the dice were not going to be restricted to webstore only like "End Times: Thanquol" was.

And you might want to double-check because "The End Times: Rise of the Horned Rat" is a book coming out at the same time and it is not "End Times: Thanquol".

 Kanluwen wrote:

The Division Of Joy wrote:

rich1231 wrote:

The Division Of Joy wrote:
Book and dice available from my FLGS, the over reactions in here are amazing.

Why is that?

That you and your experience of a massive sample of one FLGS is in some way more accurate than many others having a contrary view?

Because people have been bleating and moaning over something that isn't true 100%. If my FLGS can get them from GW then so can others, that's obvious.

What an independent in the UK can get is not going to necessarily be the same as what an independent in the US can get.

Plus the dice were not going to be restricted to webstore only like "End Times: Thanquol" was.

And you might want to double-check because "The End Times: Rise of the Horned Rat" is a book coming out at the same time and it is not "End Times: Thanquol".

Seconded. My LGS was on the phone for 2 hours on hold / on the line with their rep for the 4 people at our store that pre-ordered and wanted to make sure they were getting hardbacks. At first it was "no they are getting softbacks, if they want hardbacks you/they will have to jump on the site like everyone else".

After what i'm sure was a pretty spirited discussion (note, in the five states that are within 3 hours driving distance from me, there is exactly 1 GW store, and it's about 97 miles away, so if they want to sell product in this part of New England, they are relying independents of one shape or another more than likely), the rep was able to figure out enough copies for the 4 of us.


So that's not exactly as easy peasy as DoJ is making it seem like any other product "Oh, i want that". "Sure, np, it'll be in in 10 days".

So we can just change the title of this to reflect only US stores. Good plan.

 Haight wrote:

Seconded. My LGS was on the phone for 2 hours on hold / on the line with their rep for the 4 people at our store that pre-ordered and wanted to make sure they were getting hardbacks. At first it was "no they are getting softbacks, if they want hardbacks you/they will have to jump on the site like everyone else".

After what i'm sure was a pretty spirited discussion (note, in the five states that are within 3 hours driving distance from me, there is exactly 1 GW store, and it's about 97 miles away, so if they want to sell product in this part of New England, they are relying independents of one shape or another more than likely), the rep was able to figure out enough copies for the 4 of us.


So that's not exactly as easy peasy as DoJ is making it seem like any other product "Oh, i want that". "Sure, np, it'll be in in 10 days".

Was that yesterday?

Because yesterday their site exploded...

Anecdotal - my FLGS worked the phones [once they came back online at GW Memphis] and was able to get multiple copies of the hardback. The Glottkin, Khaine, and now Thanquol releases have required him to take extraordinary measures to simply have stock for some of us in the area.

My friend who owns a game store said he had to do the direct order from GW, but he is getting a couple. Direct order meaning it'll cost a bit more for him, but not full price. Or he already got them. Or w/e. I don't remember. I'll double check tomorrow and fill you guys in. I don't remember the release date.

 timetowaste85 wrote:
My friend who owns a game store said he had to do the direct order from GW, but he is getting a couple. Direct order meaning it'll cost a bit more for him, but not full price. Or he already got them. Or w/e. I don't remember. I'll double check tomorrow and fill you guys in. I don't remember the release date.

This is exactly what we had to do at my store. We were informed about what time the books would go up on the website, then we simply had to log on and buy the HCs as a direct item, which basically means we as a retailer don't get as much off as we would on a regular item. Kind of crappy, but at least we were able to get a bunch of the books.

Ok...to address a few other comments that have been made in this thread.

Local GW stores:
If an item is ordered for and paid for in a local GW store, the money goes toward that local GW store profits. Keeping the lights on, paying the manager's salary..all that jazz. If you order something from the website and ship it to a local GW store, the local GW store gets zip for keeping the place open.

Local GW Store: for any sort of release item, the preorders will change the amount that they get in stock. However, the number they are allotted to begin with, can be super small, especially if it's a new /young/lower money making GW store. For many of the last big book releases, a new/young GW store will get like 2 books, maybe 3.

Going back to the whole Void Shield Generator thing, last year in March? ...they were sold out on the website before you could even buy them. If you were a GW employee or standing in a GW store trying to buy one, you were .

GW stores cannot put out the white dwarf or any other item early. It has to go out on a saturday (release day).

GW stores cannot advertise. They're not even allowed to put up a sign (outside of the storefront sign) if they're in like a big shopping mall plaza.

(Why GW doesn't put the white dwarf one week ahead of time is stupid....along with a number of things they do. I'd swear, there's a few things they could change a make a ton more money..at least it appears that way).

Over the last few months, the time for books selling out has been like this:

(These are regular hard copy editions)

Glottkin: 4-5 hours.
Khaine: 2 and half minutes. Limited to 2 per customer.
Shield of Baal: Leviathan: Within the hour.
Shield of Baal: Exterminatus: Within the hour. Limited to 1 per customer.
Thanqol and the Dice were limited to 1 per customer.

Nagash was reprinted at least once in hardback and sold out again. (possibly twice, I can't recall).

It was after glottkin that they decided they were going to start doing softcovers.

I have stood there at the order point inside a GW more than once, had an item in my cart and couldn't check out with because it was sold out.



So depending on where the customer base is, Customers, are getting screwed, one way or another.

 Kanluwen wrote:

 Haight wrote:

Seconded. My LGS was on the phone for 2 hours on hold / on the line with their rep for the 4 people at our store that pre-ordered and wanted to make sure they were getting hardbacks. At first it was "no they are getting softbacks, if they want hardbacks you/they will have to jump on the site like everyone else".

After what i'm sure was a pretty spirited discussion (note, in the five states that are within 3 hours driving distance from me, there is exactly 1 GW store, and it's about 97 miles away, so if they want to sell product in this part of New England, they are relying independents of one shape or another more than likely), the rep was able to figure out enough copies for the 4 of us.


So that's not exactly as easy peasy as DoJ is making it seem like any other product "Oh, i want that". "Sure, np, it'll be in in 10 days".

Was that yesterday?

Because yesterday their site exploded...

No, Friday.

 Haight wrote:

 Kanluwen wrote:

 Haight wrote:

Seconded. My LGS was on the phone for 2 hours on hold / on the line with their rep for the 4 people at our store that pre-ordered and wanted to make sure they were getting hardbacks. At first it was "no they are getting softbacks, if they want hardbacks you/they will have to jump on the site like everyone else".

After what i'm sure was a pretty spirited discussion (note, in the five states that are within 3 hours driving distance from me, there is exactly 1 GW store, and it's about 97 miles away, so if they want to sell product in this part of New England, they are relying independents of one shape or another more than likely), the rep was able to figure out enough copies for the 4 of us.


So that's not exactly as easy peasy as DoJ is making it seem like any other product "Oh, i want that". "Sure, np, it'll be in in 10 days".

Was that yesterday?

Because yesterday their site exploded...

No, Friday.

his post was on Saturday, so yesterday then was Friday.

The Division Of Joy wrote:
Book and dice available from my FLGS, the over reactions in here are amazing.

Softback book and only 2 sets of dice (both of which are reserved).

The Division Of Joy wrote:
Book and dice available from my FLGS, the over reactions in here are amazing.

That's lucky.

From the GW site

http://www.games-workshop.com/en-GB/What's-New-Today-from-the-White-Dwarf-Team/2014/12/16/Book-IV-of-the-End-Times

The hardback, slipcased edition is available online as a webstore exclusive now.

 mikhaila wrote:


Pure money grab.

No. Just no, I get your mad but this is wrong & ill informed.

It's not a money grab. it's due to the large backlash when Khaine sold out in under 2 minutes. It sold out before the notification email was sent. Rerunning a hardbound book takes time, time they didn't have so to avoid another PR gak storm like what happened when Khaine dropped GW decided to hold hardbacks for themselves. I mean social media lit up with hate, podcasters are still venting their frustrations over it, it was a mess.

It was to avoid another load of bad PR not a money grab, a money grab would be holding ALL (hard and soft) copies for themselves.


EDIT: I don't know turnaround time on a hardcover but if you take into account the queue in front of the book you want, the production time, packaging time, shipping time out of china via cargo ship, breakdown of bulk order, shipping to distributors, shipping to stores it can easily take months.

Have you got a citation for that?

The hard backs are what, £50 each, so by selling direct they make an extra 40% (£20 each). I really don't believe they care about the backlash of something selling out so quickly, if anything they'd use that to drive faster sales. I do believe though, that they saw how successful it was and decided to keep the whole pie to themselves.

GW caring more about their customers than money? That'll never happen. Besides, this move probably caused even more nerd rage due to people who use FLGS's getting shafted.

I don't need a citation it's common sense. I'm not saying extra money wasn't a factor but it wasn't a PURE money grab as OP claims.

Bad PR is bad for business many people flat out said "If I can't get hardcover I'm not buying one" which means some people might not even check the site for book IV and just said F it. There were talks on podcasts of people just putting their hardbacks up on ebay and being done with end times (further decreasing sales) Every decision GW (or almost any for-profit company) makes ultimately comes down to "How much will this make or lose us?"

Yes money played a factor but no it wasn't a PURE cash grab it was also to mitigate bad PR which in turn affects business revenue. So it does all come down to $$ (just like any other business) and call it a cash grab if you want, I see it as damage control.

Since when has GW shown any common sense?

And would they really try and avoid upsetting customer A by upsetting customer B instead? I think you're giving them far too much credit.