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 Red__Thirst wrote:
Lord Dante, commander of the Host
Mephiston, the Lord of Death
Lemartes, Guardian of the Lost
The Sanguinor
Astorath the Grim
High Priest Corbulo
Librarian Dreadnoughts
Death Company Dreadnoughts
Furioso Dreadnoughts
Baal Predators
Death Company
Sanguinary Guard
Unique wargear for Tactical Squads & Devastator Squads (Hand Flamers, Inferno Pistols, Heavy Flamers)
Unique wargear for Assault Squads (Meltaguns and Plasma Guns, plus Hand Flamers and Inferno Pistols)
Unique options for Apothecary/Sanguinary High Priests & Company Champions (Jump Packs)
Unique wargear and options for Company Veteran Squads (Jump Packs, Hand Flamers and Inferno Pistols)
Unique wargear for all non named characters (Inferno Pistols & Hand Flamers), plus an extra piece of wargear available to some specific characters (Death Masks)

No access to a lot of other units that standard space marines have access to.

I think that's enough different to justify having their own book, not to mention they've always had their own book, and unless something drastic happens, always will be in their own book.

Asking for or claiming they should be rolled into the standard marine codex with Dark Angels or any other chapter is simply not going to happen, and frankly ignorant on the part of the people asking.

Seriously, grow up and find something else to gripe / moan / whinge / about. This crap got old 10+ years ago, and the fact that you're STILL beating this dead horse now that it's down to a skeleton says something, don't you think?

Take it easy.

-Red__Thirst-

You missed captain tycho (both versions) and Seth (admittedly from a descendent chapter,) and lucifer engines, which are a BA staple, although they don't really have a lot of presence in the index.

Heard from a friend to expect preorder on the 2nd of December, did not indicate any new models with the release.

...damn it. I had read/hoped BA was released November 25 and DA December 9. Still hoping for this to be the case.

Bremon wrote:
...damn it. I had read/hoped BA was released November 25 and DA December 9. Still hoping for this to be the case.

Three days after the release of the necromunda stuff? Doubt it.

the_scotsman wrote:

Bremon wrote:
...damn it. I had read/hoped BA was released November 25 and DA December 9. Still hoping for this to be the case.

Three days after the release of the necromunda stuff? Doubt it.

I'm confused by both of you. Necromunda comes out on the 25th. (Site says it ships on the 24th) Not sure where 3 days is coming from.

I kinda hope we get a new Start Collecting like what Eldar and Tyranids did. No idea what would be in it though.

Voss wrote:

the_scotsman wrote:

Bremon wrote:
...damn it. I had read/hoped BA was released November 25 and DA December 9. Still hoping for this to be the case.

Three days after the release of the necromunda stuff? Doubt it.

I'm confused by both of you. Necromunda comes out on the 25th. (Site says it ships on the 24th) Not sure where 3 days is coming from.

Now I hate Necromunda. 2 weeks of preorder? Burn it all down, GW is the worst.

 casvalremdeikun wrote:
I kinda hope we get a new Start Collecting like what Eldar and Tyranids did. No idea what would be in it though.

Agreed, needs new stuff in it. That way I can get more stuff I don’t have. I’m good on Baal Preds and Tac marines lol.

If we were to get a different Start Collecting! Box, tgey'd just swap the Baal Pred for a Furioso, to bring it in libe with the Space Marine box

diepotato47 wrote:
If we were to get a different Start Collecting! Box, tgey'd just swap the Baal Pred for a Furioso, to bring it in libe with the Space Marine box

Perhaps. I wouldn't mind a Terminator Librarian or Captain, a set of BA Assault Terminators, and a Furioso. We already had a Battleforce that was a PA Captain, a squad of Tacticals, and a Furioso, so I don't really care to see another box with the Tactical Squad in it. The two newest Start Collecting boxes have had units that were a bit out of left field, so who knows what to expect. Though the did update the BA box to have the black background, so I am disinclined to think we would get a new Start Collecting (even if the one we have is so weird with the Terminator Captain).

I thought the engines were represented on the Baal predator exclusively now? Though I do hope the make a return to the Razorback& Rhino, along with the Vindicator in the new codex.

I also didn't mention Tycho on purpose. He's dead to me. *Rimshot*

Speaking of rumors.

The current rumor mill I've seen has our chapter tactics being +1" added to our charging and advance rolls, along with the ability to leave combat and charge again in the same turn across the board.

Is it just me, or is this potentially pretty good?

You can, with jump pack movement, ignore some bubble wrap, depending. Of course it wouldn't work perfectly, the opponent could always fall back away from you in their turn, but you're still displacing bubble wrap. If they stay engaged with your Blood Angels unit(s), then you leave combat and move 12" over the bubble wrap, shoot whatever is in the back field behind the wrap, and then charge in on it if need be. Jump Packs allow you to move over intervening models (From the battle primer: "If the datasheet for a model says it can Fly, it can move across models and terrain as if they were not there."). It seems to me running larger squads may be the order of the day to give us more attacks on the first and subsequent charges as we bounce from several units as the game progresses.

I also fully expect at least one strategem, costing 2 CP if I had to guess, that allows one of your squads to strike first as though they were a charging unit, even if they were themselves charged. In addition, perhaps something that allow us to prevent Overwatch on a charge (Relic Death Mask or a Psychic Power if not a strategem maybe).

Curious to see if this rumor is true and how it'll help/change our tactics & gameplay for sure.

Take it easy.

-Red__Thirst-

Edits: Stupid Spoiler tags.

 Red__Thirst wrote:

Librarian Dreadnoughts
Sanguinary Guard
Unique wargear for Tactical Squads & Devastator Squads (Hand Flamers, Inferno Pistols, Heavy Flamers)
Unique wargear for Assault Squads (Meltaguns and Plasma Guns, plus Hand Flamers and Inferno Pistols)
Unique options for Apothecary/Sanguinary High Priests & Company Champions (Jump Packs)
Unique wargear and options for Company Veteran Squads (Jump Packs, Hand Flamers and Inferno Pistols)
Unique wargear for all non named characters (Inferno Pistols & Hand Flamers)
I think that's enough different to justify having their own book, not to mention they've always had their own book, and unless something drastic happens, always will be in their own book.

Asking for or claiming they should be rolled into the standard marine codex with Dark Angels or any other chapter is simply not going to happen, and frankly ignorant on the part of the people asking.

Seriously, grow up and find something else to gripe / moan / whinge / about. This crap got old 10+ years ago, and the fact that you're STILL beating this dead horse now that it's down to a skeleton says something, don't you think?

Take it easy.

-Red__Thirst-

I know that it is too late to roll ba and da into sm (5th ed was probably the last point it would have worked) but a lot of the things ba have that make them distinct are mainly to keep ba distinct, rather than any other rules or fluff reason. There is no reason other chapters don't have librarian dreads, while things like jump honor guard or apothecaries would fit right in for raven guard, and why do ba and sisters of battle have hand flamers but not salamanders?

My only response to that is: Ask Games Workshop.

None of us can answer this question nor can we know the why. It's simply the way it is currently. If you want it changed, contact GW (Or get a petition signed by however many people you can get to sign it) and let them know how you (collectively) feel.

Armies have differences. Those differences are what they are, and if they change, so be it. Until they do, we use what we're given. I know that's stating the obvious, but it's still true and apparently needs to be said.

Take it easy.

-Red__Thirst-

That’s sort of like saying why do space wolf dreadnoughts have storm shields (“blizzard shields”) but other chapters don’t, yeah space marines could and would more than likely share equipment and technology but then when it comes to this being a game all space marines would just be different coloured marines.

 Mantle wrote:
That’s sort of like saying why do space wolf dreadnoughts have storm shields (“blizzard shields”) but other chapters don’t, yeah space marines could and would more than likely share equipment and technology but then when it comes to this being a game all space marines would just be different coloured marines.

Literally not even close to being the same. Hell, Tactical Marines HAD Heavy Flamer access before and then lost it because reasons.

CountryMac wrote:
Maybe you guys should make a separate thread about BA not deserving a codex... I came here for rumors and/or more information about the codex coming out, which I think is the purpose of this thread... I don't know maybe I'm wrong?

I read it different, I see every post in this thread as an argument for why they don't need their own book.

 techsoldaten wrote:

CountryMac wrote:
Maybe you guys should make a separate thread about BA not deserving a codex... I came here for rumors and/or more information about the codex coming out, which I think is the purpose of this thread... I don't know maybe I'm wrong?

I read it different, I see every post in this thread as an argument for why they don't need their own book.

The way I see it, the legitimacy of BA getting a codex has little to do with rumor and speculation about the non-theoretical, actual codex that BA are getting a codex. You could use this thread as evidence, but that doesn’t make this thread a good place to make an argument for or against it.

 gnome_idea_what wrote:

 techsoldaten wrote:

CountryMac wrote:
Maybe you guys should make a separate thread about BA not deserving a codex... I came here for rumors and/or more information about the codex coming out, which I think is the purpose of this thread... I don't know maybe I'm wrong?

I read it different, I see every post in this thread as an argument for why they don't need their own book.

The way I see it, the legitimacy of BA getting a codex has little to do with rumor and speculation about the non-theoretical, actual codex that BA are getting a codex. You could use this thread as evidence, but that doesn’t make this thread a good place to make an argument for or against it.

I agree.

Let's go with this.

Personally, I wouldn't mind being able to fallback and charge!

Fall back and Charge will help Assault Marines immensely. And Death Company will be able to maximize their ability to get additional attacks on the Charge.

 Alpharius wrote:

 gnome_idea_what wrote:

 techsoldaten wrote:

CountryMac wrote:
Maybe you guys should make a separate thread about BA not deserving a codex... I came here for rumors and/or more information about the codex coming out, which I think is the purpose of this thread... I don't know maybe I'm wrong?

I read it different, I see every post in this thread as an argument for why they don't need their own book.

The way I see it, the legitimacy of BA getting a codex has little to do with rumor and speculation about the non-theoretical, actual codex that BA are getting a codex. You could use this thread as evidence, but that doesn’t make this thread a good place to make an argument for or against it.

I agree.

Let's go with this.

Quoting myself - good grief! - and putting in Orange so that everyone knows it is Official now.

Rule 1 - BE POLITE.

Rule 2 - STAY ON TOPIC.

Thanks!

Has anyone seen any news about whether other chapters will get any love? I assume Gabriel Seth will be in there, but I'd love to see some Lamenters love, personally. I suspect it will be purely BA and Seth, with a "change <Blood Angels> to <successor chapter X or Y> statement though.

Last couple of editions my Baal Predators were lack-luster. I really want them to be something I WANT to take. They are awesome and I want to BE awesome.

I want to deepstrike my Landraider (its ok if I don't get to)

I want the Red Thirst to mean something, like, my TAC squad goes on a murder frenzy in CC and actually works. Maybe a strategem?

I want Dante to regen CP or something, show how much of a tactical genius he is

I want Storm Ravens moved to dedicated transport

I want Mephiston to have a gaze attack

I want mag grapples to be better.

WANT WANT WANT

 MajorWesJanson wrote:

 Red__Thirst wrote:

Librarian Dreadnoughts
Sanguinary Guard
Unique wargear for Tactical Squads & Devastator Squads (Hand Flamers, Inferno Pistols, Heavy Flamers)
Unique wargear for Assault Squads (Meltaguns and Plasma Guns, plus Hand Flamers and Inferno Pistols)
Unique options for Apothecary/Sanguinary High Priests & Company Champions (Jump Packs)
Unique wargear and options for Company Veteran Squads (Jump Packs, Hand Flamers and Inferno Pistols)
Unique wargear for all non named characters (Inferno Pistols & Hand Flamers)
I think that's enough different to justify having their own book, not to mention they've always had their own book, and unless something drastic happens, always will be in their own book.

Asking for or claiming they should be rolled into the standard marine codex with Dark Angels or any other chapter is simply not going to happen, and frankly ignorant on the part of the people asking.

Seriously, grow up and find something else to gripe / moan / whinge / about. This crap got old 10+ years ago, and the fact that you're STILL beating this dead horse now that it's down to a skeleton says something, don't you think?

Take it easy.

-Red__Thirst-

I know that it is too late to roll ba and da into sm (5th ed was probably the last point it would have worked) but a lot of the things ba have that make them distinct are mainly to keep ba distinct, rather than any other rules or fluff reason. There is no reason other chapters don't have librarian dreads, while things like jump honor guard or apothecaries would fit right in for raven guard, and why do ba and sisters of battle have hand flamers but not salamanders?

I mean this respectfully. But the answer to that question in my opinion is that Games Workshop has never done any house cleaning of the models. That's why it's never been done, because they don't want to make the hard decisions on what stays and what goes.

 Fifty wrote:
Has anyone seen any news about whether other chapters will get any love? I assume Gabriel Seth will be in there, but I'd love to see some Lamenters love, personally. I suspect it will be purely BA and Seth, with a "change <Blood Angels> to <successor chapter X or Y> statement though.

I definitely hope that the Flesh Tearers will be more than just Gabriel Seth. And perhaps the newest BA Successor (whose name escapes me) will have some new rules, who knows.

We actually have a precedent with the Crimson Fists vs. Imperial Fists. Perhaps the Flesh Tearers will be like that. Same bonus same Strategem, different trait, different, relic.

 Fifty wrote:
Has anyone seen any news about whether other chapters will get any love? I assume Gabriel Seth will be in there, but I'd love to see some Lamenters love, personally. I suspect it will be purely BA and Seth, with a "change <Blood Angels> to <successor chapter X or Y> statement though.

Actually - I think that Blood angels WILL get the successor chapter traits/tactics - as in 7-ed. codex there is an artworks and background for a bunch of notable successor chapters.
Flesh teares have a TON of background artworks books and even chaptermaster.
I even noticed that Gabriel Seth have probably more official artworks than Dante

If overcharged engines or something like them return for vehicles, then I’d like to see them do more than provide a movement speed increase. Maybe they allow falling back further to account for increased acceleration, or maybe they boost melee attacks on the charge to represent ramming speed, but they should affect more than the move phase.

I want overcharged engines to do something useful.

 doomdreamer wrote:
Last couple of editions my Baal Predators were lack-luster. I really want them to be something I WANT to take. They are awesome and I want to BE awesome.

I want to deepstrike my Landraider (its ok if I don't get to)

I want the Red Thirst to mean something, like, my TAC squad goes on a murder frenzy in CC and actually works. Maybe a strategem?

I want Dante to regen CP or something, show how much of a tactical genius he is

I want Storm Ravens moved to dedicated transport

I want Mephiston to have a gaze attack

I want mag grapples to be better.

WANT WANT WANT

Deepstriking land Raiders was silly. I don't want that to return.

Now, the Red thirst should not be able to be turned on/off. I say once it's on, it stays on for the rest of the game. What that effect is I think should have both advantages and disadvantages. Being better at close combat, but being unable to fall back would be fine with me.

I think Storm Ravens are fine where they are.

Definitely need some boosts for characters.

Bremon wrote:
I want overcharged engines to do something useful.

This. I want them to allow the tanks to advance and shoot Heavy and Rapid Fire weapons.

Bremon wrote:
I want overcharged engines to do something useful.

Other than a little extra speed, what if Baal Predators had the Leman Russ's Grinding advance rule?