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witches! he likes witches, which witches are the cool witches?
If you ever play with "that guy" remember this :
"there may be times when you are not sure exactly how to resolve a situation that has come up during play. When this happens, have a quick chat with your opponent and apply the solution that makes the most sense to both of you (or seems the most fun!), If no single solution presents itself, you and your opponent should roll off, and whoever rolls the highest gets to choose what happens." BRB pg 180
gkos wrote: witches! he likes witches, which witches are the cool witches?
wYches are good in general
wYch cult units? For sure wYches and Succubi, Reavers and Hellions are not as good as they should be, they just dont do enough for their points.
Honestly i usually just skip out on wych units altogether and go covens. The entrance tax for a 3rd sub-faction in 2k or so points is far too much. Covens do much better. I'm not sure how good wracks are (don't use enough) but grotesques and talos are so good i'd never bother with wyches. Most wych units have no AP value in their attacks and no ability to get it or very little ap value. Best you can do maybe is that fly by that does mortal wounds and even that only really hurts infantry. Hellions are very much anti-knight (if anybody even takes knights where you're at) and cost a lot for no AP value. Reavers are ok for objective grabbing and holding down some shooting for probably a single turn. Reavers just don't do enough in melee.
For wyches i'd imagine you need the bikes or something to at least tie up overwatch for them. Even then my big issue with wyches is they only shine in infantry fighting as the enemy can just leave combat otherwise and pour shots into them and there's quite a few non-infantry models. Usually i find shredders to be more useful. I take shredderborn in venoms but i do feel my anti-tank/monster is lacking so i should probably bring something (talos maybe?).
Anyway for unavoidable melee i'd just suggest covens over wych cults. Kabal have good shooting if you include trueborn. If trueborn didn't exist non-covens dark eldar would be extremely hard i think and our power might be knocked down unless we spam talos and grotesques.
This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2018/12/11 02:24:47
I do too, but if you want to play Wych cult they are still viable.
5mans along with 1 super buffed 10man can do well, Shardnets being 2D and a 4++ in combat does better than it looks. They also are cheap what the damage they do. you get 10 girls with more damage than 5 quins loaded fully for Melee for the same points (yes Troupes are that bad)
Out of interest, how useful have you guys found Kabalites?
I've been using 6 5-man squads in my list, as I like having lots of infantry, but I'm not sure they're really worth it.
They're cheap, certainly (albeit less so when you factor in the cost of their transports), but they just don't seem to do anything. Each 5-man squad is basically 1 blaster and then 4 water pistols (who double as ablative wounds for said blaster).
Has anyone had success using lots of Kabalites? If so, do you have any tips for me?
blood reaper wrote: I will respect human rights and trans people but I will never under any circumstances use the phrase 'folks' or 'ya'll'. I would rather be killed by firing squad.
the_scotsman wrote: Yeah, when i read the small novel that is the Death Guard unit options and think about resolving the attacks from a melee-oriented min size death guard squad, the thing that springs to mind is "Accessible!"
Argive wrote: GW seems to have a crystal ball and just pulls hairbrained ideas out of their backside for the most part.
You're not. If you're worried about your opponent using 'fake' rules, you're having fun the wrong way. This hobby isn't about rules. It's about buying Citadel miniatures.
Please report to your nearest GW store for attitude readjustment. Take your wallet.
I tipycally play the mandatory 3x5 for the battallion, in two raiders. One of which is joined by archon. Occasionally I add two other units in venoms but I prefer going heavy with shooty vehicles (lots of diss cannons) and coven stuff.
I usually give them blasters. And I agree, they do absolutely nothing thanks to their crappy poison, they're mostly ablative wounds for that single blaster shot.
I don't think they're that good to spam multiple units of them, but since overall our codex is pretty strong they should do quite fine anyway.
vipoid wrote: Out of interest, how useful have you guys found Kabalites?
I've been using 6 5-man squads in my list, as I like having lots of infantry, but I'm not sure they're really worth it.
They're cheap, certainly (albeit less so when you factor in the cost of their transports), but they just don't seem to do anything. Each 5-man squad is basically 1 blaster and then 4 water pistols (who double as ablative wounds for said blaster).
Has anyone had success using lots of Kabalites? If so, do you have any tips for me?
My 3x5mans get in the way all the time lol. With BH turn 1 they can jump out of the transports 3" and move +run with re-roll. The FnP makes it so many times 1 or 2 are still alive and my opponent will ignore them or waste more shots. ALso can Run turn 1 while my Shiny Spears and Ravagers are taking most the damage/Shots then turn 2 charge so soak up ow or a tank, take an objective, etc...
I was practicing for a ITC tournament in a couple weeks Yesterday, they protected my 2 Archon's (it was mission 6 so i need 3 character on objectives) for 4 turns, i had them between 2 objectives and back to stop DSing.
Yeah my Archon only help with a bit of re-rolls. But i got 4 VP's b.c of them. Its also 5CP too, soooo
Edit: To be far i also had 2x5 rangers and a 20man Guardian squad in front, so the kabals where in back. .
This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2018/12/14 12:23:34
My 3x5mans get in the way all the time lol. With BH turn 1 they can jump out of the transports 3" and move +run with re-roll. .
If you don't mind me asking, why have them leave their transport?
blood reaper wrote: I will respect human rights and trans people but I will never under any circumstances use the phrase 'folks' or 'ya'll'. I would rather be killed by firing squad.
the_scotsman wrote: Yeah, when i read the small novel that is the Death Guard unit options and think about resolving the attacks from a melee-oriented min size death guard squad, the thing that springs to mind is "Accessible!"
Argive wrote: GW seems to have a crystal ball and just pulls hairbrained ideas out of their backside for the most part.
You're not. If you're worried about your opponent using 'fake' rules, you're having fun the wrong way. This hobby isn't about rules. It's about buying Citadel miniatures.
Please report to your nearest GW store for attitude readjustment. Take your wallet.
My 3x5mans get in the way all the time lol. With BH turn 1 they can jump out of the transports 3" and move +run with re-roll. .
If you don't mind me asking, why have them leave their transport?
1 Unit is for Body guards for my Archons and its 1 drop compare to 3, and sometimes Yvarine as well making it 1 drop oppose to 4. The other 2 are normally not in, and are there as bubble wrap.
Amishprn86 wrote: I do too, but if you want to play Wych cult they are still viable.
5mans along with 1 super buffed 10man can do well, Shardnets being 2D and a 4++ in combat does better than it looks. They also are cheap what the damage they do. you get 10 girls with more damage than 5 quins loaded fully for Melee for the same points (yes Troupes are that bad)
Have you tried shedderborn in venoms yet? Make sure to take them as Flayed Skull detachment to negate any cover bonuses for trueborn in transports. You'll need more anti-tank somewhere but they're amazing against anything outside of toughness boosted death guard terminators in my experience (with 5+ FnP) and that was mostly because my shedder rolls were bad and his saves were good that day. They wound almost all infantry units on a 2 or 3 and re-roll to wound infantry (only grotesques and boosted toughness death guard marines are wounded on 4's and they still allow re-rolls to wound). Also i've found them to be decent at hero killing for whatever reason (as are void ravens believe it or not). They're not that good against things bigger than hive guard sized enemies but str 6 can still hurt things. They have a small profile and with Flayed Skull venoms can move pretty far (19" movement best waifu ever!). Seriously with Flayed Skull enemy MEQ units get a 4+ save and you generally put out enough wounds that a shredderborn squad in a venom may even nearly wipe a marine squad or squad of death guard.
So in short shredders are great against almost any infantry unit in the game right now but you may need something to tie enemies down in combat once they hit. I take the shredderborn in venom to DS turn 2 and they often do a very good job. Quite a few opponents at my store have learned to fear and hate the shredder and complain it's BS. Only issue is best way to stack it is with trueborn or scourge and both are also vying for anti-tank. If you face a tank army shredders suck but if you face an infantry army and they live long enough they may as well be made out of gold. I use 12 shredders in 2k and they do well on trueborn in venoms with Flayed Skull. I'd be shocked if they didn't get nerfed to an extent. The only real disadvantage is what you can take them on, the amount you can have and the cost. As i said only trueborn and scourge seem to cost them effectively and maybe DS two 20 man squads of warriors.
I apologize for the wall of text and repeating myself but shredders used well, fighting significant infantry forces and living long enough will do some good damage.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/12/21 21:58:07
Flayed Skull or Obsidian Skull Trueborn in Venoms is nice.
Regular Kabalites are pretty great for their cost, although granted poison is the worst default infantry gun outside of maybe a few exceptional match ups. I’ve gotten decent results maximizing splinter fire spam, but even with a cannon and racks (which frustratingly don’t interact), that’s an average of 18 hits on a target.
Hey all I'm looking to expand my small Drukhari force and posted this list in the Army List threads, I was wondering if I could have your opinion on it please ? Thanks.
Spoiler:
Hi all, I'm looking to start expanding my Drukhari now that my AdMech and DA are mostly completed for now, and as I only own +- 490 pts right now I wrote a list to start playing with them at 1000 pts in my LGS, playing GW + CA missions only. I'd like an effective list as I'm tired of playing "friendly lists" just to get stomped by my opponent's idea of a friendly list.
At this point level I'd like to stay on playing Kabals only, I'm looking at a Battalion for having 8 CP to play with and not paying too much on HQ tax. I thought about including a Cursed Blade Wych Patrol of Succubus (in the Venom) + 20 Wyches deepstriking but it looks unreliable and far too fragile, I won't be at ease playing this way. So I reworked the list a bit to include Scourges and add Blasters to my Kabalites. So here's the list:
The idea is to have a very mobile force packed with a good amount of anti-vehicle/monster with the 6 blasters, 2 blast pistols, 3 Dark lances and 4 Haywire blasters. I know splinter weapons are not the best anti-infantry but I feel it should suffice. I'll ignore cover with the Raiders, and what is too tough for the splinter rifles won't resist the blasters or the Archons, and won't be in good numbers if they're resilient. Every flying thing has a 5++ except the Scourges but they'll have a 3+/6++ in cover. So the general tactic is to fly fast, sting hard and then control the board. Do you guys think this list could hold its own ?
HandofMars wrote: Flayed Skull or Obsidian Skull Trueborn in Venoms is nice.
Regular Kabalites are pretty great for their cost, although granted poison is the worst default infantry gun outside of maybe a few exceptional match ups. I’ve gotten decent results maximizing splinter fire spam, but even with a cannon and racks (which frustratingly don’t interact), that’s an average of 18 hits on a target.
Actually BS3+ poison shots are great on T4. And really good after that. The problem is that it is not good vs T3 that are cheaper then you. And thos armies are natural gunlines witch is DE worst matchup.
Aaranis wrote: Hey all I'm looking to expand my small Drukhari force and posted this list in the Army List threads, I was wondering if I could have your opinion on it please ? Thanks.
Spoiler:
Hi all, I'm looking to start expanding my Drukhari now that my AdMech and DA are mostly completed for now, and as I only own +- 490 pts right now I wrote a list to start playing with them at 1000 pts in my LGS, playing GW + CA missions only. I'd like an effective list as I'm tired of playing "friendly lists" just to get stomped by my opponent's idea of a friendly list.
At this point level I'd like to stay on playing Kabals only, I'm looking at a Battalion for having 8 CP to play with and not paying too much on HQ tax. I thought about including a Cursed Blade Wych Patrol of Succubus (in the Venom) + 20 Wyches deepstriking but it looks unreliable and far too fragile, I won't be at ease playing this way. So I reworked the list a bit to include Scourges and add Blasters to my Kabalites. So here's the list:
The idea is to have a very mobile force packed with a good amount of anti-vehicle/monster with the 6 blasters, 2 blast pistols, 3 Dark lances and 4 Haywire blasters. I know splinter weapons are not the best anti-infantry but I feel it should suffice. I'll ignore cover with the Raiders, and what is too tough for the splinter rifles won't resist the blasters or the Archons, and won't be in good numbers if they're resilient. Every flying thing has a 5++ except the Scourges but they'll have a 3+/6++ in cover. So the general tactic is to fly fast, sting hard and then control the board. Do you guys think this list could hold its own ?
Thanks in advance !
- 5 Scourges, 4 Splinter cannons
Pointless, put something else on them like Shredders, or put nothing o them at all, as 3 shots for free is better than Splinter cannons for the points.
4Shredders = 104pts
4Scannons - 112pts
Shredders are cheaper and better in everyway but range
4SC 112pts for 27 shots
8 Shardcarbine Scourges 108pts for 24 shots (or 9 for 120 for 27shots), now you have same shots but more bodies.
You're right, thanks, I'll probably give them either shredders or more anti-tank like blasters or haywire blasters. The splinter cannons are better on the Flayed Skulls Kabalites who'll get to reroll their 1s.
I'm hearing lots of chatter about dissie ravagers but has anyone one had any success running them with dark lances?
Also a quick question about the flayed skull kabal, do they get their re roll of ones even when outside of their transport?
I feel the rule could be interpreted either way but I feel they should only benefit from the re roll when in their raider/venom.
Finally i'm not having much luck with hwb scourges anyone running them with blasters? (I don't run blaster born in an attempt to not use index units)
Fantome wrote: I'm hearing lots of chatter about dissie ravagers but has anyone one had any success running them with dark lances?
Also a quick question about the flayed skull kabal, do they get their re roll of ones even when outside of their transport?
I feel the rule could be interpreted either way but I feel they should only benefit from the re roll when in their raider/venom.
Finally i'm not having much luck with hwb scourges anyone running them with blasters? (I don't run blaster born in an attempt to not use index units)
I have 3 of each, and honestly the Dissie cannon is so much better IMO, not only does it deal 90% the damage to heavy tanks, but also kills elite units even better (hehllblasters, and such).
I have how every taken 3 DC ravagers and 3 Reapers, that was really fun.
Hey guys, regarding Reavers, if I want to play them as Red Grief just to tie up enemy shooting, should I let them go barebones ? I was thinking of including a Blaster but 17 pts for a suicide unit it may be too much. Would a unit of 6 suffice or should I go with two, to cover more terrain ? They'd have to survive overwatch so units of 3 seems suboptimal. 192 pts for 2 units of 6 barebones to prevent the opponent from shooting me with his anti-tank for at least one round seems fair to me.
Aaranis wrote: Hey guys, regarding Reavers, if I want to play them as Red Grief just to tie up enemy shooting, should I let them go barebones ? I was thinking of including a Blaster but 17 pts for a suicide unit it may be too much. Would a unit of 6 suffice or should I go with two, to cover more terrain ? They'd have to survive overwatch so units of 3 seems suboptimal. 192 pts for 2 units of 6 barebones to prevent the opponent from shooting me with his anti-tank for at least one round seems fair to me.
I usually add a Grav talon because they are cheap and and easy way to get a MW in, but that's about it for a tie up unit. For larger units I might go with a Blasters or two, but not in min sized units
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/01/03 19:27:31
Sometimes, you just gotta take something cause the model is freakin cool...
Guys i'm having a serious problem facing vehicles these days. It's mostly the ones with invulnerable saves. I feel like a good chunk of my games have a forgeworld dreadnought or more against me and they tend to have good invulnerable saves and even when they fail a few wounds they just command point re-roll and then it does nothing at all.
I think my options are: Talos, scourge with haywire and reavers for tying things up with.
Honestly our anti-tank is pretty bad and this is an issue for me.
Bring dark lances, void lances and blasters then. Scourges with haywire blasters cost just 92 points. 3x of them are pretty effective against lists that are heavy on vehicles.
Try something like 3-4 units of kabalites with a blaster, 1 blaster archon, 2 ravagers with dissies and 1 with lances (or just mix their loadouts), 1 bomber and 5 scourges as the core of a list. Pretty much TAC and effective against vehicles.
The superbuffed knight is a complete different matter though. 3x haywire scourges should still strip half its wounds (approx 12W on average rolls) in a single turn of shooting even with no CWE allied.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/01/13 14:51:03
BlaxicanX wrote: What if he doesn't own a Farseer, because he is a Dark Eldar player and not an "Aeldari soup" player?
8th is the edition of soup, if you dont like it thats fine, but getting 1-3 key units is a must for filling holes in the weakness of armies now.
If you dont have one and dont want to buy one, then make 1, get a friend with an extra head and shuriken catapult (every eldar player has those), make it out of a Reaver, give it a narrative.
Or just go full proxy using a standard reaver. Heads are no problem since craftworlds and drukhari are both space elves and a kabalite's head, just to look a bit different from reavers, should be ok. Both bikes' standard weapons look pretty much identical. They're also mounted under the jetbike, no one will notice the difference if you keep the twin splinter rifle.
Maybe just give that biker a close combat weapon like a spared p.sword, agoniser or even one of those spears that come from the raider's kit which are quite close to the actual farseer's official weapon, you'd certainly have some of those in your bitz box.
15k+
Emperor's Spears 2500
Beastmen 10k
