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Made in ca
Been Around the Block




 sigismund22 wrote:

I never said it was perfect. I never said it had the same "value" as Indomitus regarding content.

I’ve never said you said that tho.
You said the box is amazing and I disagreed on that while explaining why.
You said the sprues are generous and I disagree (it would have been true if that sprue didn’t come with the mandatory neohpytes (neophytes that only have 2 poses btw)).
you said the codex is a piece of art and I think I went into a LOT of detail on why that’s clearly not the case.
You said everything is above what you hoped for the upgrade (I guess you are talking about the upgrade sprue) and here too I’ll have to hard disagree.
I’ve already talked about it ealier on that thread but basically that sprue is (like the rest) very lacking compared to 3rd ed stuff, and just bad objectively when looked on its own:
- only 2 helmets, 1 of them being a pretty ugly relic
- The shoulder pads are once again that very generic and bland “fresh of factory with just the chapter icon stamped on it”
- No chained weapons,
- No chest pieces
-A good chunk of the sprue is taken by unmarked scout shotguns that have NOTHING to do here,
- No vehicle bits (outside of a weapons that should be baseline)
- etc , etc etc
Basically that upgrade sprue doesn’t do it job, it doesn’t let you turn you standard marine into something that look like a BT. For that you’ll have to buy crusader sprues and ditch half of them because they contain the neophytes.
You said this box is all you’ve been dreaming of for years and to that I have nothing to say, because that’s just you and I can’t really say anything about it, you do you, but what I can do is just laying down simple facts to put into context what that box is REALLY compared to what you are trying to pass it as.
 sigismund22 wrote:
Please avoid being pedantic. Not everyone has the same expectations, this is not about memory or "little standard". And sorry for my weird english.

I'm not being pedantic, I'm just laying out some very simple facts based on very simple comparisons, just because YOU decided to love that box purely based on nostalgia value doesn't mean everyone will have automatically to agree with you (nor anyone have to automatically agree with me either btw, that's the beauty of a forum, we are just here to share our takes on stuff).
 NAVARRO wrote:
In this case you can love this box for the savings etc or you can hate it if your expectations were different.

Nah, I don’t buy that kind of extreme relativism "everything is subjective" mindset. There's a objective value here, and it's not that good. The book content is of very OBJECTIVLY poor.
Your feelings about it are the subjective part. You could like or hate it anyway, that's your opinion, but the facts are that this is a frankly poorly edited, vacuous book that somehow managed to contain way, WAY less content than a previous one that had 15 less pages.

 NAVARRO wrote:
ISold out right? So another hit for GW. That is what it boils down to.

That's the funny thing. It's not sold out, go check the site it's still there next to Dominion on the pile of "didn't sold as well as we thought" box.
And the obvious reason is that the value wasn't there for the price asked.

HeIlsing wrote:

And this is the second time, in the same thread afaik, you saying that someone with a low post count is more likely to be a troll.
Will I be number 3 now?

Funilly enough I was the previous target of that frankly stupid attack.
HeIlsing wrote:
From the the pages i read here the only thing you do is complain. I get it, GW is bad, and they really hurt you, but how about you shut up and get out. Idk why you are even still here, except to gak on anyone who says anything remotely good about this BT release.

The man is free to express is opinion just like Sigismund is, telling the people you disagree with to just leave is the best way to end up with a pretty stupid echo chamber. If you don’t like it, just don’t read it.
 MonkeyBallistic wrote:
I find the ignore function has noticeably increased my enjoyment of this forum

This guy gets it.
 Theophony wrote:

Very true, unfortunately people keep quoting and engaging the real trolls.

And unfortunately people keep throwing the word “troll” around at everyone they disagree with.
   
Made in gb
Longtime Dakkanaut






Oh good, another one with an overblown sense of self importance, just what this board needs. Just let people enjoy what they want to enjoy, eh?
   
Made in gb
Fanatic with Madcap Mushrooms







What? just checked again and still says no longer available online?

As for extreme relativism and your definitions of objective I loved them...

Why would you assume everyone wants your definition of better value by comparison with the previous book? why you assume previous book was better value for everyone because It had more things you like? I mean We can be here all day comparing things and get no where.
I can compare it with the hell I want and come up with different results cause you know its a damn silly beer and pretzel rulebook for a silly game created to sell minis.

As such It may not be for me because I really dont need it but I understand people wanting a simple book for their faction of choice and being satisfied with it. Just let people enjoy the things they like.


   
Made in at
Fresh-Faced New User





@(HN)

I never said he is not free to express an opinion, but at first he would have to do so.
Would I tell him to leave if its a "real" discussion about something? No.
Using half the time attesting other people being a troll and the other half putting words in other peoples mouth is not expressing an opinion.
There is nothing to agree or disagree on, if you write gak like this.

The only take of his I could get is that GW is overpriced. Thats an opinion, and I do agree, yet i still enjoy the stuff.

What I am going to do is using the best advice anyone can give. Use the ignore button.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2021/10/23 21:11:14


 
   
Made in fr
Crazed Zealot





France

(HN) wrote:
 sigismund22 wrote:

I never said it was perfect. I never said it had the same "value" as Indomitus regarding content.

I’ve never said you said that tho.

It was a bit confusing, but thanks for clarifying.
(HN) wrote:
You said the box is amazing and I disagreed on that while explaining why.
You said the sprues are generous and I disagree (it would have been true if that sprue didn’t come with the mandatory neohpytes (neophytes that only have 2 poses btw)).

I mean, regarding existing sprues, keeping in mind that BT is a sub faction, I think they are decent enough (for example, the recent Beast Snagga army box was really weak regarding options). The only 3 crusaders bodies allows many options and I was afraid of only monopose. I'm still a bit disappointed about neophyte variation indeed, they deserved another specific sprue. Ideally, GW would have make a neophytes sprue with 4 differents bodies and shotguns included. And a 5 crusaders sprues that can be doubled. But I was expecting something worse tbh.
(HN) wrote:
you said the codex is a piece of art and I think I went into a LOT of detail on why that’s clearly not the case.

Your comments about the book were on point and I didn't contest any of that. I find it really pleasant and beautiful though, as stated before this is totally subjective. However, there was passion put in its creation and it can be appreciated. Maxime Corbeil had a really good influence on it I guess.
(HN) wrote:
You said everything is above what you hoped for the upgrade (I guess you are talking about the upgrade sprue) and here too I’ll have to hard disagree.

I was only talking about the box that I recently opened.

(HN) wrote:
You said this box is all you’ve been dreaming of for years and to that I have nothing to say, because that’s just you and I can’t really say anything about it, you do you, but what I can do is just laying down simple facts to put into context what that box is REALLY compared to what you are trying to pass it as.

I'm not trying anything, I was sharing some enjoyment in a topic full of salt. Enjoyment is whats makes a hobby a hobby.
(HN) wrote:
I'm not being pedantic, I'm just laying out some very simple facts based on very simple comparisons, just because YOU decided to love that box purely based on nostalgia value doesn't mean everyone will have automatically to agree with you (nor anyone have to automatically agree with me either btw, that's the beauty of a forum, we are just here to share our takes on stuff).

Talking about low standard sounded a bit insulting, but glad to know it wasn't your intention. Neither was I expecting everyone to agree, quite the opposite in fact. I said before that it was really personal.

My first message was meant to be read as "Despite every negative thing that had been said about the box, for good reason mostly, I still enjoy it". I wasn't expecting hostility, though I appreciate sharing different advice.
   
Made in ca
Been Around the Block




 NAVARRO wrote:
What? just checked again and still says no longer available online?

Yaknow that stocks depend on country right?
Check US and CA still have it up to this day, and the rest of the counties had it far pat the preoder period.

 NAVARRO wrote:
As for extreme relativism and your definitions of objective I loved them...

Why would you assume everyone wants your definition of better value by comparison with the previous book? why you assume previous book was better value for everyone because It had more things you like? I mean We can be here all day comparing things and get no where.
I can compare it with the hell I want and come up with different results cause you know its a damn silly beer and pretzel rulebook for a silly game created to sell minis.

Oof. Talk about missing the point and not knowing what "objective reality" mean.
Have you even read my post where I least objective facts about the two books?
My opinion is that the 3rd ed book is miles better on every aspect outside of maybe very superficial visual level (I mean, the 9td book is almost half illstration so it has to "look" a little better).
The objective facts that have nothing to do with my opinion is that the book is poorly edited and contain factually less stuff than the 3rd.

 NAVARRO wrote:
As such It may not be for me because I really dont need it but I understand people wanting a simple book for their faction of choice and being satisfied with it. Just let people enjoy the things they like.

Again (crazy how people like you seem to have a hard time getting very simple facts) I'm not preventing everyone from enjoying anything. I'm not going in their home, slapping the book off their hand, kicking their dog and fething their wives while yelling "YOU CAN'T ENJOY IT!" I'm just doing what they do, comment on the quality of the stuff, but I'm trying to do it with just a little bit of standard and objectivity rather than just saying "it's better than nothing" or "I like it because I like it".

I honest dont care if you like it or not, that was never the point. The point is that I wont let people run around trying to pretend this is the best book ever and everyone should rejoice, when its not. It's an objectively mediocre book from the rule, lore, edition, content, hobby point of view.
They two vow pages that repeats are the perfect example of that, and the fact that they used 80% of the photo space to show only the 2 new kits rather than showing us how to pain a BT army is another one.

 sigismund22 wrote:

I mean, regarding existing sprues, keeping in mind that BT is a sub faction, I think they are decent enough (for example, the recent Beast Snagga army box was really weak regarding options). The only 3 crusaders bodies allows many options and I was afraid of only monopose. I'm still a bit disappointed about neophyte variation indeed, they deserved another specific sprue. Ideally, GW would have make a neophytes sprue with 4 differents bodies and shotguns included. And a 5 crusaders sprues that can be doubled. But I was expecting something worse tbh.

See that’s the problem, its your frame of reference. If you take the worst as reference, OFC anything will be better.
I was too fully expecting the crusader squad to be the same than the new boys squad, a fully monopose sprue that don’t allow for ANY customization outside of sergeant and the special weapon, with a garbage incompleate gear option that makes the thing unplayable.
I was very relive to constat that it wasn’t the case, but that doesn’t mean I’d suddenly pretend this box is the best thing ever, because it’s not.
Better than what could have happen, sure, but still not good enough.
As you said, there should have been two boxes, one for neophytes (that contain the shotgun) and one for initiate (that would have been very useful as a “real” upgrade sprue for the rest of the army.

 sigismund22 wrote:

Your comments about the book were on point and I didn't contest any of that. I find it really pleasant and beautiful though, as stated before this is totally subjective. However, there was passion put in its creation and it can be appreciated. Maxime Corbeil had a really good influence on it I guess.

Call me petty and salty, but when I see that repeat of the vow page, or the fact that they couldn’t be bother to paint even just a blade guard unit (yaknow, the thing that is flat out better than the new swordbreathren) to show us how they should look (I’ll be painting mines like terminators, white helemets, gold weapons), or the fact that they somehow decided to retcon the Templar colorsheme out of nowhere for no other reason then “shrug, I dunno”… well, I have a hard time believing any passion was put in there.
They basically copied what the 3rd ed book did, but they did it worse which shouldn’t be acceptable.

 sigismund22 wrote:

I'm not trying anything; I was sharing some enjoyment in a topic full of salt. Enjoyment is what makes a hobby a hobby.

Sure, but what you do at the same time is being complaisant, and complaisance is what kills the hobby, especially these days where GW is constantly trying to lower the bar of what we should expect.

 sigismund22 wrote:

My first message was meant to be read as "Despite every negative thing that had been said about the box, for good reason mostly, I still enjoy it". I wasn't expecting hostility, though I appreciate sharing different advice.

This wasn’t meant as hostility, just simple disagreement, and shouldn’t be taken personally.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/10/23 22:49:50


 
   
Made in gb
Sword-Bearing Inquisitorial Crusader






Some people don’t seem to know the difference between disagreeing and trying to prove that their opinion is the only correct opinion
   
Made in au
Slaanesh Chosen Marine Riding a Fiend




Australia

(HN) wrote:
It's an objectively mediocre book from the rule, lore, edition, content, hobby point of view.


I don't think you understand what "objectively" means.

The Circle of Iniquity
The Fourth Seal
(HN) wrote:
It's an objectively mediocre book from the rule, lore, edition, content, hobby point of view.
 
   
Made in ca
Been Around the Block




 MonkeyBallistic wrote:
Some people don’t seem to know the difference between disagreeing and trying to prove that their opinion is the only correct opinion

Some people seem to think that making snooty remark makes them somehow look smart rather than petty bitches.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Marshal Loss wrote:
(HN) wrote:
It's an objectively mediocre book from the rule, lore, edition, content, hobby point of view.


I don't think you understand what "objectively" means.

Oh no no, I do.
That's why I'm able to put two books next to eachothers and compare them like a normal human behind that can compare stuff.

I hope you'll reach that point one day too.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/10/24 00:21:16


 
   
Made in es
Grim Dark Angels Interrogator-Chaplain




Vigo. Spain.

I have to say that I have been underwhelmed by 9th books from a fluff perspective.

Just the removal of the unit "bestiary", my favourite part of any book , has made me not buy any 9th edition codex.

 Crimson Devil wrote:

Dakka does have White Knights and is also rather infamous for it's Black Knights. A new edition brings out the passionate and not all of them are good at expressing themselves in written form. There have been plenty of hysterical responses from both sides so far. So we descend into pointless bickering with neither side listening to each other. So posting here becomes more masturbation than conversation.

ERJAK wrote:
Forcing a 40k player to keep playing 7th is basically a hate crime.

 
   
Made in pl
Longtime Dakkanaut




Just to refresh people's memory- the BT box is 199$ and contains 13 models, including 1 walker, and an 80-page book and some cards.

One year ago, for $199 for warhammer 40k you could've purchased another LE-only box.
That one had 61 miniatures, including 3 bikes and 1 walker and a 386 page book plus a quickstart guide.

So yeaaaah, I am not sure how anyone can look at this and think "this is VALUE". It might be standar GW fare, but GW shown what real value looks like...and 13 models for 200 bucks ain't that.
   
Made in us
Owns Whole Set of Skullz Techpriests






Gathering the Informations.

That one was also a "starting the game" set, which across basically any spectrum of miniatures is always code for "loss leader".
   
Made in au
Slaanesh Chosen Marine Riding a Fiend




Australia

(HN) wrote:

 Marshal Loss wrote:
(HN) wrote:
It's an objectively mediocre book from the rule, lore, edition, content, hobby point of view.


I don't think you understand what "objectively" means.

Oh no no, I do.
That's why I'm able to put two books next to eachothers and compare them like a normal human behind that can compare stuff.


No, you clearly do not. Comparing and contrasting two products with an arbitrary set of criteria that you've cobbled together in a comment section may produce a convincing argument which contains some salient points, but it does not mean that your verdict is objectively correct, and throwing "objectively" into every second sentence doesn't make you sound smart. It makes you sound like a first year undergrad desperate to attain some kind of authority.

(HN) wrote:
I hope you'll reach that point one day too.


That you reflexively resorted to childishness when I didn't say I disagreed with your opinion speaks volumes about your mental capacity. Stick to the comment section on SpikeyBits.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/10/24 00:41:57


The Circle of Iniquity
The Fourth Seal
(HN) wrote:
It's an objectively mediocre book from the rule, lore, edition, content, hobby point of view.
 
   
Made in pl
Longtime Dakkanaut




 Kanluwen wrote:
That one was also a "starting the game" set, which across basically any spectrum of miniatures is always code for "loss leader".

Ok, and? It was a set, published by GW, that had 61 models for the same price as a set also published by GW that has 13 models. What do I care how GW classifies those releases? I could get 61 models or 13 models for 200 dollars, I know which deal I want. Hell, take out the necron part and you're still left with 24 marine models, almost 2x the content of this box for the same price.
   
Made in us
Owns Whole Set of Skullz Techpriests






Gathering the Informations.

Cool, now do the part where those are models you might actually want.

Value's something that can be quantified both subjectively (I wouldn't care for a $500 for $200 set of Marines if it's all Space Wolf iconography, for example) and objectively ($200 is cheaper than $500).

Indomitus was a great deal. There's no denying that. But it also was only available last year. It's a nonentity as far as new players go, and for someone who wants to play Black Templars and wants to start with this set...this set might be better in their eyes.
   
Made in ca
Been Around the Block




 Marshal Loss wrote:

No, you clearly do not. Comparing and contrasting two products with an arbitrary set of criteria that you've cobbled together in a comment section may produce a convincing argument which contains some salient points, but it does not mean that your verdict is objectively correct, and throwing "objectively" into every second sentence doesn't make you sound smart. It makes you sound like a first year undergrad desperate to attain some kind of authority.

Gotha love how you try to reframe me comparing the book point by point on every section and aspect as "an arbitrary set of criteria that you've cobbled together in a comment section", it really hilight how clueless or just outright stupid you are.

What I did was open both book on my desk (because I have both book) and go trough it section by section.
In every single section or aspect the book was numerically and qualitatively inferior to the 3rd one.
This is couldn't be more objective of a process.

You may not like the result, but to be honest I couldn't give less of a feth about what you think since its pretty clear that you aren't really playing with a full set of card.


(HN) wrote:
That you reflexively resorted to childishness when I didn't say I disagreed with your opinion speaks volumes about your mental capacity. Stick to the comment section on SpikeyBits.

Again, nice attempt at reframing and gaslighting.
What you did is say that I'm talking out of my ass and don't know what objectivity is, while clearly showing that you are literally too dumb to even know what I did, so ofc I'll answer in kind, just be a man and dont try to pull the victim card.
And that cute little jab at spikeybits is very cute, gotha love when a basement dweller from a random site is better than another random site, I guess that distaste from outside of your little box passes as a virtue in a shrunk mind like yours.

 Galas wrote:
I have to say that I have been underwhelmed by 9th books from a fluff perspective.

Just the removal of the unit "bestiary", my favourite part of any book , has made me not buy any 9th edition codex.

Just remember, you can't say removing that part is objectively a bad thing apparently, mister bigbrain have decided so.

Cronch wrote:
Just to refresh people's memory- the BT box is 199$ and contains 13 models, including 1 walker, and an 80-page book and some cards.

One year ago, for $199 for warhammer 40k you could've purchased another LE-only box.
That one had 61 miniatures, including 3 bikes and 1 walker and a 386 page book plus a quickstart guide.

So yeaaaah, I am not sure how anyone can look at this and think "this is VALUE". It might be standar GW fare, but GW shown what real value looks like...and 13 models for 200 bucks ain't that.

Dont you dare trying to compare objective numbers, that's not allowed here!


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Kanluwen wrote:
Cool, now do the part where those are models you might actually want.

Ya suuuure you want to go with that angle of attack here?

About the box that EVERYONE has been pointing out how it has been padded with a dread that nobody really want compared to getting MORE black templar things (yaknow, the thing people want)?
If that box had contained another templar box and a sword breathren nobody would have complained about the box, but GW got out of its way to put the bare minimum BT in there by slapping a big dread in it.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2021/10/24 00:59:29


 
   
Made in pl
Longtime Dakkanaut




But it also was only available last year

And this thing is a LE set that won't be available in 2 months either.

But sure, let's compare it to a set that is in production now. The 40k Elite starter is 99$, with 27 figures. It doesn't come with any book to speak of, but is full $100 cheaper than the BT box 2x as many figures.


The point being made is that GW can and does sell more models for cheaper or the same price, often with bigger books too. Nothing that the BT set offers is actually "value" when compared with other GW sets at a similar cost. As a gaming product, it has some of the worst value of all 40k boxed sets. Literally the only "value" it has is the subjective "it's new models" or "it's got BT iconography" aspect. Objectively, you're getting fewer marine models (nothing stops you from painting your marines in black and white with a maltese cross) for more.
   
Made in es
Grim Dark Angels Interrogator-Chaplain




Vigo. Spain.

I could defend this set over "starter" sets like Indomitus with monopose models.

But this box just like the Beast Snagga is full of monopose miniatures with nearly no options so feth them. Just 2 years ago, monopose units were sold as ETB and by nearly half the cost. Right now they are selling them as normal kits. Look at Outriders or Skorpekh Destroyers.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/10/24 01:27:59


 Crimson Devil wrote:

Dakka does have White Knights and is also rather infamous for it's Black Knights. A new edition brings out the passionate and not all of them are good at expressing themselves in written form. There have been plenty of hysterical responses from both sides so far. So we descend into pointless bickering with neither side listening to each other. So posting here becomes more masturbation than conversation.

ERJAK wrote:
Forcing a 40k player to keep playing 7th is basically a hate crime.

 
   
Made in us
Owns Whole Set of Skullz Techpriests






Gathering the Informations.

I didn't realize I could run Necrons as Space Marines.

Again, using starter products as some kind of "gotcha" just shows a wild misunderstanding of what drives sales of certain sets vs others.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/10/24 01:28:49


 
   
Made in ca
Been Around the Block




 Kanluwen wrote:
I didn't realize I could run Necrons as Space Marines.

Again, using starter products as some kind of "gotcha" just shows a wild misunderstanding of what drives sales of certain sets vs others.

How about you stop focusing on that box "started status" and just realize that even compared to OTHER box of the SAME TYPE its just bad.

I don't recall the beast snagga box having ONE squad of Snagga, 2 characters and a dread.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/10/24 01:42:54


 
   
Made in us
Stealthy Warhound Titan Princeps





United States

(HN) wrote:
 Kanluwen wrote:
I didn't realize I could run Necrons as Space Marines.

Again, using starter products as some kind of "gotcha" just shows a wild misunderstanding of what drives sales of certain sets vs others.

How about you stop focusing on that box "started status" and just realize that even compared to OTHER box of the SAME TYPE its just bad.

I don't recall the beast snagga box having ONE squad of Snagga, 2 characters and a dread.


I was just wondering, your whole position here has been that the box isn't good enough for the cost. You build this premise by saying that the models, book, etc aren't as good as they could be when compared to an older product of the same type?
   
Made in ca
Been Around the Block




Togusa wrote:


I was just wondering, your whole position here has been that the box isn't good enough for the cost. You build this premise by saying that the models, book, etc aren't as good as they could be when compared to an older product of the same type?

It's a double tap.
Not only the box content just quantitatively not good enough, but also qualitatively not good enough.

Not enough stuff and what there is is not good enough (especially for the book, the minies are "okay" but the sprue that force you to get scout when you want crusader is just bad).

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/10/24 02:15:17


 
   
Made in jp
Crushing Black Templar Crusader Pilot





Ishikawa Prefecture, Japan

So, uhhhh, any news or rumors today guys?
   
Made in at
Regular Dakkanaut





Only just realized you don't get enough shoulder pads in the crusader squad kit to build the Sword Brother as a normal Initiate?

You get 8 Neophyte, 10 Initiate and 2 Sword Brother shoulder pad per 10 guys so if you want to have a 20 man unit (meaning you want to build a Sword Brother as an Initiate) you have to buy the upgrade sprue.
   
Made in us
Stealthy Warhound Titan Princeps





United States

(HN) wrote:
Togusa wrote:


I was just wondering, your whole position here has been that the box isn't good enough for the cost. You build this premise by saying that the models, book, etc aren't as good as they could be when compared to an older product of the same type?

It's a double tap.
Not only the box content just quantitatively not good enough, but also qualitatively not good enough.

Not enough stuff and what there is is not good enough (especially for the book, the minies are "okay" but the sprue that force you to get scout when you want crusader is just bad).


So you don't like it, why waste so much of your time being upset and arguing about it online? It's not going to magically change the sprues or what is in the book? It sounds like the product isn't for you.

Personally I hope GW keeps designing their rules in such a way that min/maxing squads so that you can have the ultimate best snowflakes becomes impossible. The less competitive the game is, the better it will be. But that's just my opinion. YMMV.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/10/24 07:12:57


 
   
Made in pl
Longtime Dakkanaut




Germany

 Kanluwen wrote:
Cool, now do the part where those are models you might actually want.

Value's something that can be quantified both subjectively (I wouldn't care for a $500 for $200 set of Marines if it's all Space Wolf iconography, for example) and objectively ($200 is cheaper than $500).

Indomitus was a great deal. There's no denying that. But it also was only available last year. It's a nonentity as far as new players go, and for someone who wants to play Black Templars and wants to start with this set...this set might be better in their eyes.


Oh yes that Redemptor that contributes like 1/3rd of the price is very Black Templars specific.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Matrindur wrote:
Only just realized you don't get enough shoulder pads in the crusader squad kit to build the Sword Brother as a normal Initiate?

You get 8 Neophyte, 10 Initiate and 2 Sword Brother shoulder pad per 10 guys so if you want to have a 20 man unit (meaning you want to build a Sword Brother as an Initiate) you have to buy the upgrade sprue.


Great Value!

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/10/24 08:59:36


"Tabletop games are the only setting when a body is made more horrifying for NOT being chopped into smaller pieces."
- Jiado 
   
Made in us
Stealthy Warhound Titan Princeps





United States

 Wha-Mu-077 wrote:
 Kanluwen wrote:
Cool, now do the part where those are models you might actually want.

Value's something that can be quantified both subjectively (I wouldn't care for a $500 for $200 set of Marines if it's all Space Wolf iconography, for example) and objectively ($200 is cheaper than $500).

Indomitus was a great deal. There's no denying that. But it also was only available last year. It's a nonentity as far as new players go, and for someone who wants to play Black Templars and wants to start with this set...this set might be better in their eyes.


Oh yes that Redemptor that contributes like 1/3rd of the price is very Black Templars specific.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Matrindur wrote:
Only just realized you don't get enough shoulder pads in the crusader squad kit to build the Sword Brother as a normal Initiate?

You get 8 Neophyte, 10 Initiate and 2 Sword Brother shoulder pad per 10 guys so if you want to have a 20 man unit (meaning you want to build a Sword Brother as an Initiate) you have to buy the upgrade sprue.


Great Value!


I mean Templars have dreadnoughts.
Dreadnoughts have amazing rules at present.
Dreadnoughts are even better in a Templars army where they can get a 5++ increasing their resilience.
The Redemptor is a great looking model.

Seems like a win-win to me. I am certainly enjoying building the one that came in my BT box, the mini-Gatling gun is pretty dope.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 posermcbogus wrote:
So, uhhhh, any news or rumors today guys?


Nada, pretty sure we're just waiting on Wave 2, then they can lock this thread up.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2021/10/24 09:29:21


 
   
Made in au
Ork-Hunting Inquisitorial Xenokiller




Was a good value box if want everything in it, and I do, ye a redemptor is great (I still think great value if want all, considering prices of character models and if buy set from a secondary retailer so get 25% off).

They haven't even bought out the GK Combat Patrol box yet, so idk what time frame on the BT Combat Patrol box.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2021/10/24 10:43:20


14k Generic Space Marine Chapters
20k Deathwatch
10k Sisters of Battle
3k Inquisition
4k Grey Knights
5k Imperial Guard
4k Harlequins
4k Tau



 
   
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Stealthy Warhound Titan Princeps






 Kanluwen wrote:
That one was also a "starting the game" set, which across basically any spectrum of miniatures is always code for "loss leader".


Except, of course, they are not actually selling at a loss, there.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Kanluwen wrote:
Cool, now do the part where those are models you might actually want.

I mean, I did. That's why I bought Indomitus, because I wanted what was in the box (all of it, actually) and the pricepoint was palatable.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Spectral Ceramite wrote:
Was a good value box if want everything in it, and I do, ye a redemptor is great (I still think great value if want all, considering prices of character models and if buy set from a secondary retailer so get 25% off).

They haven't even bought out the GK Combat Patrol box yet, so idk what time frame on the BT Combat Patrol box.


I don't agree and I do believe the value of the box was poor, but I am happy that it worked for you and that you enjoyed it

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2021/10/24 10:46:40


 
   
Made in pl
Longtime Dakkanaut





 Matrindur wrote:
Only just realized you don't get enough shoulder pads in the crusader squad kit to build the Sword Brother as a normal Initiate?

You get 8 Neophyte, 10 Initiate and 2 Sword Brother shoulder pad per 10 guys so if you want to have a 20 man unit (meaning you want to build a Sword Brother as an Initiate) you have to buy the upgrade sprue.

Why? There were always BT with more decorative pads, simply don't paint the second one with red rim/cross SB have, done. And it's kinda funny to see this right next to the post complaining there are not enough different new pads on the sprues

 Wha-Mu-077 wrote:

Oh yes that Redemptor that contributes like 1/3rd of the price is very Black Templars specific.

What, BT are orks now and deff dreads instead of dreadnoughts?
   
 
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