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2017/02/24 21:42:49
Subject: Re:Gathering Storm III: Rise of the Primarch Cinematic trailer p42
Oh god, if they release a Fallen box, I will need it! Probably into the form of a Mk IV box with the Dark Angels upgrade, but still. Me want!
I believe the 'Sprues and Glue' articles are kitbashes.
'It is a source of constant consternation that my opponents cannot correlate their innate inferiority with their inevitable defeat. It would seem that stupidity is as eternal as war.'
- Nemesor Zahndrekh of the Sautekh Dynasty Overlord of the Crownworld of Gidrim
2017/02/24 21:58:52
Subject: Gathering Storm III: Rise of the Primarch Cinematic trailer p42
I fail to see how bringing a primarch back to life failed to impress you, but a secret name of a character revealed is over the top for just another 40k expansion.
warhammer 40k mmo. If I can drive an ork trukk into the back of a space marine dread and explode in a fireball of epic, I can die happy!
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2017/02/24 22:03:48
Subject: Gathering Storm III: Rise of the Primarch Cinematic trailer p42
Ewww. Didn't care for that "reality breaks down but the bad guys are going to help me save it". That sound suspiciously like the AOS crap. 40k was always great because it was a huge galaxy full of neat stuff. They really shouldn't blow it up if they have an ounce of sense. I doubt they'll get more out of trashing everything than they would have of releasing a cool new campaign book like the ones in the past, and they could lose a lot more.
2017/02/24 22:23:20
Subject: Gathering Storm III: Rise of the Primarch Cinematic trailer p42
kestral wrote: They really shouldn't blow it up if they have an ounce of sense.
Emps dying and the imperium going to gak is hardly blowing the universe up. If anything it would be nice to have a sense of urgency for the threats to the imperium for a change.
Ork wagghs closing in on IG worlds.
Necron worlds waking up near terra.
A new tyranid arm shows up and confirms that two previously independent swarms are in fact one giant shitstorm of terrible.
And all of it, the IOM can do nothing about because they have no more warp becon Awesome.
The fluff is like ketchup and mustard on a burger. Yes it's desirable, yes it makes things better, but no it doesn't fundamentally change what you're eating and no you shouldn't just drown the whole meal in it.
2017/02/25 00:13:54
Subject: Gathering Storm III: Rise of the Primarch Cinematic trailer p42
kestral wrote: Ewww. Didn't care for that "reality breaks down but the bad guys are going to help me save it". .
Cypher has never been the bad guy.
"'players must agree how they are going to select their armies, and if any restrictions apply to the number and type of models they can use."
This is an actual rule in the actual rulebook. Quit whining about how you can imagine someone's army touching you in a bad place and play by the actual rules.
Freelance Ontologist
When people ask, "What's the point in understanding everything?" they've just disqualified themselves from using questions and should disappear in a puff of paradox. But they don't understand and just continue existing, which are also their only two strategies for life.
2017/02/25 01:02:51
Subject: Re:Gathering Storm III: Rise of the Primarch Cinematic trailer p42
Sprues and glue... from what I can see in the pics, the fallen are a dark angels robed sprue and a mk 4 sprue mixed. Doesn't look like a fallen kit, unless they put those sprues in a box and label it a fallen box set.
IN ALAE MORTIS... On the wings of Death!!
2017/02/26 15:57:06
Subject: Re:Gathering Storm III: Rise of the Primarch Cinematic trailer p42
Yeah I don't think they will bring out a 'fallen' box mixed with DA vets bits and mkIV armour as there wouldn't be any point in the sprue and glue article since you wouldn't really be mixing bits from different kits.
Fury from faith
Faith in fury
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2017/02/26 16:07:20
Subject: Gathering Storm III: Rise of the Primarch Cinematic trailer p42
455_PWR wrote: Sprues and glue... from what I can see in the pics, the fallen are a dark angels robed sprue and a mk 4 sprue mixed. Doesn't look like a fallen kit, unless they put those sprues in a box and label it a fallen box set.
It definitely appears that way. Sprue and Glue is one of my favorite articles. I am glad to see it back.
kestral wrote: Ewww. Didn't care for that "reality breaks down but the bad guys are going to help me save it". .
Cypher has never been the bad guy.
You haven't read much of the 30K Dark Angel books have you?
Yeah really, he's definitely the bad guy if you actually read the backstory (not like GW reads it either).
Spoiler:
He sold his soul to Chaos and was responsible for bringing Luther over to Horus' side. The 40k fluff for Cypher basically ignores ALL of the character development from the Heresy series.
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2017/02/26 17:09:47
Subject: Gathering Storm III: Rise of the Primarch Cinematic trailer p42
Is there any confirmation so far that 30k Cypher is the same person as 40k Cypher?
Edit either way I agree he's gonna need a fallen retinue. A Gauntlet tactical squad box combo'd with some mk4 and mk3 parts should do the trick nicely.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/02/26 17:43:52
2017/02/26 17:45:15
Subject: Gathering Storm III: Rise of the Primarch Cinematic trailer p42
To be fair, the 40k fluff ignores a lot of the heresy fluff because ;
A) it's been backfilled in
B) it's always been part of the 40k universe that the "truth" of the heresy is what the imperium says it is.
Cypher is only bad in terms of the imperium definition, he's really neither good nor bad and working to his own agenda, or potentially the agenda of the cabal - think similar to what Ol Pearson is setting up seemingly in the heresy series; a ton of events small and large, designed so that at the right moment in time the right person is in place to change the future.
What if all this was set up, over thousands of years , to put Cypher in place to kill Abaddon (if that's what even happens) ?
2017/02/26 17:59:57
Subject: Gathering Storm III: Rise of the Primarch Cinematic trailer p42
kestral wrote: Ewww. Didn't care for that "reality breaks down but the bad guys are going to help me save it". .
Cypher has never been the bad guy.
You haven't read much of the 30K Dark Angel books have you?
Yeah really, he's definitely the bad guy if you actually read the backstory (not like GW reads it either).
Spoiler:
He sold his soul to Chaos and was responsible for bringing Luther over to Horus' side. The 40k fluff for Cypher basically ignores ALL of the character development from the Heresy series.
Guys, come on.
No, that's not true at all. First of all, you're talking about Lord Cypher, which was a pre-heresy post and occupied by multiple people and may not possibly be the same as modern day Cypher.
He could have taken that name as a symbolic title for all we know (we really don't know who Cypher is unless this new material reveals his true identity).
Read Angels of Caliban for the actual facts.
Corrections:
Spoiler:
For one thing, Zahariel kills the Lord Cypher in Angels of Caliban, and then is named the new Lord Cypher by Luther. If Cypher is supposed to be Redloss, Redloss is the voted lieutenant of the Dreadwing and loyal to Lion. He is actually present with him on Macragge and is far away from Caliban during the events of the Heresy. If Cypher is Redloss, he is NOT the same as the Lord Cypher. PS, also noteworthy is that Holguin, leader of the Deathwing, receives the broken shards of the Lion Sword from the Lion, not Redloss. I don't know how much stock I would put in this until it is confirmed.
This is especially because Holguin blames Redloss for the Dark Angels being evicted from Macragge. Holguin is also much closer to Lion, receives the shards of the Lion Sword and goes to Macragge with Lion alone to confront Guilliman.
Second, Luther NEVER declares loyalty to Horus and explicitly says he is declaring Caliban's independence from everyone - Horus, Lion, and even the Emperor.
As far as the original Lord Cypher is concerned, he was on the side of the Watchers and was killed by Zahariel as he was possessed by the Ouroboros. Ouroboros is a very dark and mysterious, possibly Chaos related force at the heart of Caliban that is being contained by The Watchers. The Watchers are the keepers of the Ouroboros. This means Zahariel moved against the Watchers by killing Lord Cypher and cemented his alliance with Luther by the end of the events of this novel.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2017/02/26 20:50:33
Fang, son of Great Fang, the traitor we seek, The laws of the brethren say this: That only the king sees the crown of the gods, And he, the usurper, must die.
Mother earth is pregnant for the third time, for y'all have knocked her up. I have tasted the maggots in the mind of the universe, but I was not offended. For I knew I had to rise above it all, or drown in my own gak.
2017/02/26 20:08:00
Subject: Re:Gathering Storm III: Rise of the Primarch Cinematic trailer p42
GoatboyBeta wrote: Is there any confirmation so far that 30k Cypher is the same person as 40k Cypher?
Edit either way I agree he's gonna need a fallen retinue. A Gauntlet tactical squad box combo'd with some mk4 and mk3 parts should do the trick nicely.
Spoiler:
Well who's the "final" 30k Cypher remains to be seen I think. In Angels of Caliban one Cypher was killed and another replaced him. Come to think of it's actually possible for Cypher to be both Chaos corrupted one that converts Luther to Chaos and Imperium's ally...How?
In Angels of Caliban member of Luthor's group killed by then Cypher and assumed Cypher's position. HE could be the Cypher that led Luther to Chaos. Then the dreadwing guy in new book could be the one that becomes Cypher of 40k.
That way we have 2 guys that had title Cypher but completely different allegiance. Could work.
2024 painted/bought: 109/109
2017/02/26 20:37:36
Subject: Re:Gathering Storm III: Rise of the Primarch Cinematic trailer p42
GoatboyBeta wrote: Is there any confirmation so far that 30k Cypher is the same person as 40k Cypher?
Edit either way I agree he's gonna need a fallen retinue. A Gauntlet tactical squad box combo'd with some mk4 and mk3 parts should do the trick nicely.
Yes, 40K Cypher is Zahariel. The Librarian who was possessed by Ourberos, and worked with Luther to turn traitor from the Emperor. Sure, they didn't join with Horus, but they threw in with Chaos none the less.
Full Frontal Nerdity
2017/02/26 20:48:24
Subject: Re:Gathering Storm III: Rise of the Primarch Cinematic trailer p42
GoatboyBeta wrote: Is there any confirmation so far that 30k Cypher is the same person as 40k Cypher?
Edit either way I agree he's gonna need a fallen retinue. A Gauntlet tactical squad box combo'd with some mk4 and mk3 parts should do the trick nicely.
Yes, 40K Cypher is Zahariel.
There is no evidence of this.
Fang, son of Great Fang, the traitor we seek, The laws of the brethren say this: That only the king sees the crown of the gods, And he, the usurper, must die.
Mother earth is pregnant for the third time, for y'all have knocked her up. I have tasted the maggots in the mind of the universe, but I was not offended. For I knew I had to rise above it all, or drown in my own gak.
2017/02/26 20:55:56
Subject: Re:Gathering Storm III: Rise of the Primarch Cinematic trailer p42
GoatboyBeta wrote: Is there any confirmation so far that 30k Cypher is the same person as 40k Cypher?
Edit either way I agree he's gonna need a fallen retinue. A Gauntlet tactical squad box combo'd with some mk4 and mk3 parts should do the trick nicely.
Yes, 40K Cypher is Zahariel.
There is no evidence of this.
Zaharial was the one to carry the rank at the time the Fallen came into being. He was possessed by a daemon engine, one of three. In the latest 40K story with his involvement, he was instrumental in those daemon engines being used trying to alter the history that made him an outcast.
There is plenty of evidence supporting it. This latest turn in the story is likely him seeking repentance for what he's done, most likely having finally thrown off the daemon that had possessed him after that whole story.
Full Frontal Nerdity
2017/02/26 21:02:06
Subject: Re:Gathering Storm III: Rise of the Primarch Cinematic trailer p42
GoatboyBeta wrote: Is there any confirmation so far that 30k Cypher is the same person as 40k Cypher?
Edit either way I agree he's gonna need a fallen retinue. A Gauntlet tactical squad box combo'd with some mk4 and mk3 parts should do the trick nicely.
Yes, 40K Cypher is Zahariel.
There is no evidence of this.
Zaharial was the one to carry the rank at the time the Fallen came into being.
You don't know that. He was only the one to carry the rank after Luther declares independence. The rank is also a formal rank and does not mean that he is the same person as the 40k Cypher.
He was possessed by a daemon engine, one of three. In the latest 40K story with his involvement, he was instrumental in those daemon engines being used trying to alter the history that made him an outcast.
And how does any of this mean that 40k Cypher is Zahariel?
There is plenty of evidence supporting it. This latest turn in the story is likely him seeking repentance for what he's done, most likely having finally thrown off the daemon that had possessed him after that whole story.
I haven't seen you cite any. This is just your baseless theorizing.
Fang, son of Great Fang, the traitor we seek, The laws of the brethren say this: That only the king sees the crown of the gods, And he, the usurper, must die.
Mother earth is pregnant for the third time, for y'all have knocked her up. I have tasted the maggots in the mind of the universe, but I was not offended. For I knew I had to rise above it all, or drown in my own gak.
2017/02/26 21:20:37
Subject: Re:Gathering Storm III: Rise of the Primarch Cinematic trailer p42
GoatboyBeta wrote: Is there any confirmation so far that 30k Cypher is the same person as 40k Cypher?
Edit either way I agree he's gonna need a fallen retinue. A Gauntlet tactical squad box combo'd with some mk4 and mk3 parts should do the trick nicely.
Yes, 40K Cypher is Zahariel. The Librarian who was possessed by Ourberos, and worked with Luther to turn traitor from the Emperor. Sure, they didn't join with Horus, but they threw in with Chaos none the less.
This is in conflict with this:
Apparently cypher is redloss, first captain of the dark angels dread wing and Captain of the Lions honor guard
Already gave one theory how both characters could be Cypher. Zahariel was Cypher and worked with Luther but will be killed off later. Redloss then later becomes Cypher and goes into 40k.
Technically speaking there could even be 1+ Cypher between Zahariel and Redloss but probably not...
2024 painted/bought: 109/109
2017/02/26 21:27:52
Subject: Re:Gathering Storm III: Rise of the Primarch Cinematic trailer p42
Interesting stuff. I quite like the idea of Cypher as a fallen DA dread pirate Roberts type with the mantle being passed on/taken over the millennia. Cypher as Zahariel could be complicated due to the demonic possession. But having him as some one who has managed to resist possession could explain how he has remained uncorrupted by Chaos and the loss of his psyker powers, as well as a possible link to the old Illuminati fluff.
2017/02/27 11:38:31
Subject: Re:Gathering Storm III: Rise of the Primarch Cinematic trailer p42
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Fang, son of Great Fang, the traitor we seek, The laws of the brethren say this: That only the king sees the crown of the gods, And he, the usurper, must die.
