Did maulerfiends just get really good at taking on MCs?

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**Thariinye**

Big Blind Bill wrote:
The Daemon Flying Circus list doesn't care about getting into melee, it's all about keeping their MCs out of danger as long as possible, and that's buffed in 7e it seems

Daemon FMC is going to be a totally different beast now. To say they don't care about getting into melee is wrong. Their entire power comes from the fact that they can hide for the entire game and then go anywhere they want and do anything they want. Taking melee out of this equation limits their gameplay.

The changes to FMC not being able to charge after swooping seriously impacts their end game plays. No longer will they be able to charge on the last turn to take that objective off you without exposing themselves to a turn of fire first.

They are also no longer scoring whilst swooping so again they will not be able to score in the last turn as they once did.

Non contestable scoring troop choices are also going to pose a challenge. Even if your FMC changes to glide and gets with 3 of an objective, if there is an enemy troop choice there then there is nothing you can do.

Tzeentch Daemons without the gimoire and portal glyph care less about the smash rules than most though, as they can get easy access to st 8, which is enough vs most vehicles.

Yeah, you are actually right about that. I don't think it ruins their strat though, but it will force them to change up how they go about it. Maybe you'll see more ranged attacks to attempt to drive weak troops off objectives? I don't actually know what FMcircus ran in particular, so I'm mostly theoryhammering for that list.

**minigun762**

herpguy wrote:
I just want to know what the heck Daemons and Tyranids are supposed to do against Knight??
Both of those codexes literally have no good counters to Knights. An army that is virtually immune to two whole armies is extremely bad rules writing.

Daemons have easy access to S8 FMCs without the need to smash. Problem solved.

**PrinceRaven**

And it only takes 3 Hive Crones firing all of their tentaclids and Vector Striking to put down a single Knight (provided you avoid firing at the shield), so all you need to do is write a massive cheque to your local Games Workshop retailer so you can have 3 times as many Crones as your enemy has Knights.

**Blackskull**

smash nerf seems to help a aobf prince, previously is was a bad idea as black mace was so much better for a few extra points as you can deal with infantry insanely well and armour wasn't a problem due to smash.

now the table has switched and AoBF price is the king of deleting units from the battlefield up to 13 S9 ap2 attacks, still dies the minute it kills (due to all the fire being attracted) but it all depends on what you killed, land raider and termie squad=good, cultist squad = bad

**koooaei**

Aobf prince looses his ws9 and is now hit on 4-s with ws4 guyz - not 3-s

**N.I.B.**

Exergy wrote:
Did maulerfiends just get really good at taking on MCs?

Yes. Basically, you have a single turn to take them out before they hit your lines (and are pretty much immortal in close combat against Tyranids). Against other armies that didn't rely on Smash to defend against Walkers, not so much.