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Also, you could look like Hoagy Carmichael in the way that the Moonraker quote describes whilst still being black.

 thedarkavenger wrote:
First things first, I'm not a racist. I'm a bigot. There's a difference.

From Merriam-Webster:

big·ot noun
: a person who strongly and unfairly dislikes other people, ideas, etc. : a bigoted person; especially : a person who hates or refuses to accept the members of a particular group (such as a racial or religious group)

Never once did I say anything actually racist.

You must not have read anything you wrote.

And yes, his background was pointed out in a later novel, but in Casino Royale, THE FIRST BOND NOVEL WRITTEN, Vesper Lynd stated: "Bond reminds me rather of Hoagy Carmichael, but there is something cold and ruthless."

Then in Moonraker, Gala Brand states: "certainly good-looking ... Rather like Hoagy Carmichael in a way. That black hair falling down over the right eyebrow. Much the same bones. But there was something a bit cruel in the mouth, and the eyes were cold."

Also in the novels, Bond's physical description has generally been consistent: slim build; a three-inch long, thin vertical scar on his right cheek; blue-grey eyes; a "cruel" mouth; short, black hair, a comma of which falls on his forehead. His height also differs from Idris Elba. Idris elba is 190cm tall, and weighs 95kg. Bond is 183cm tall and weighs 76KG. There is no way Idris Elba could protray the role of Bond accurately without appearing malnourished.

Allow me to reiterate. Idris cannot play Bond properly , or accurately, but that does not mean he cannot play 007. Those two are not interlinked, nor are they mutually exclusive. James Bond is the character, 007 is the codename.

No person that has ever portrayed James Bond in cinema has ever fit that description, yet you keep falling back on it as the reason by a black man cannot play James Bond in cinema.

Yep, he's really reaching...

I would also like to point out that Sean Connery and Idris Elba are the same height (6'2") and Connery was not of "slim build." On the initial casting of Connery, Flemming even said, "He's not what I envisioned of James Bond looks" and "I'm looking for Commander Bond and not an overgrown stunt-man."

Here is how Ian Flemming picture Bond:


This is Hoagy Carmichael:


Here are all of the men that have played Commander Bond in the official films:


None of those men even come close to Flemming's view of the character so I guess none of them have every truly portrayed "James Bond?"

But, hey, racism isn't a particularly rational behavior. No reason to think the justification for racism would be particularly rational.

Wow. This thread is now heading to racist point; counter point.

 Deadshot wrote:
Similar to the news than Captain America and Human Torch will now be black and Thor a woman, although at least in those cases there is fiction storylines to back the ideas up, whereas here it is just up and out attempts to appease the Political Correctness crap. Not saying you shouldn't have equality, but this guy is not a Bond.

It's quite a bit different. Thor isn't now a woman. Thor Odisonson remains Thor Odinson. The female "Thor" is a different character. Same applies to Captain America. Steve Rogers isn't suddenly black - he's still the same Steve Rogers as always - but Sam Wilson has taken up the title/role of Captain America.

Having Bond suddenly be black is quite different, unless you go for the "James Bond/007 is a codename" theory, which some people do, some people don't, and, if you're Ahtman, some people get really aggressive over.

Was there this much uproar back when M suddenly became a woman?

The Bond's mutable universe has absolutely done this before, offered no explanation, and been just fine. Having seen what Idris has done in Thor and the Office, I think he could pull off a pretty vicious Bond if he so desired.
http://theoffice.wikia.com/wiki/Two_Weeks

No clip sadly, but reference this episode.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
if you're Ahtman, some people get really aggressive over.

It is because I'm tired of hearing such a ludicrous idea.

 d-usa wrote:
Which book has Bond imply that he has slept with men while fighting an ex-agent who engages in cyber terrorism?

Didn't that happen in Skyfall? If so, Skyfall is not a book.

 thedarkavenger wrote:

 d-usa wrote:
Which book has Bond imply that he has slept with men while fighting an ex-agent who engages in cyber terrorism?

Didn't that happen in Skyfall? If so, Skyfall is not a book.

I can't tell if you're facetious or not.

 thedarkavenger wrote:

chaos0xomega wrote:

 thedarkavenger wrote:

 d-usa wrote:

 thedarkavenger wrote:

chaos0xomega wrote:
#IdrisElba007

Sing it from the rooftops, tweet it from your computing devices, lets make this happen.

Bonds physical appearance, at least insofar to things like skin color, eye color, hair, etc are entirely irrelevant (for the purposes of the movies). Ian Flemings description of Bond is meaningless, as thd movies are inspired by his works rather than a true adaptation (and in fact the films have diverged rather significantly). The portrayal of previous actors are also largely meaningless, as there has been nothing to imply continuity from actor to actor. The only true constants thus far have been Q and M, both of whom are no longer part of things in case you havent noticed, all other recurring roles have been portrayed by several actors throughout the history of the series, and in the case of Moneypenny and Felix by both black and white actors. Further, its important to note that the Craig series would occur before any of the other films cronologically (at the start of Casino Royale Bond receives his 00 status), yet at the end of Skyfall M has been replaced by Mallory, creating a bit of a continuity loop.

What does matter, is Bonds personality. Idris Elba is more than capable of playing the Bond persona, his skin color is therefore a nonissue

Casino Royale was the first bond book written. And whether or not he can play the part is irrelevant, as casting him will make the films cease to be about Bond.

So when they cast a blonde guy it made the films quit being about Bond?

If they hire him for the sole purpose of having a black Bond, then you might have a point because the studio would have chosen to put race over character. If they hire him because he would be very good at being Bond (mannerisms, character, attitude, etc) regardless of his race, then the movie would still be about Bond.

Daniel Craig has the features. As for the hair, it can be put down to mundane things like hair dye.

But a complete change of appearance and race? That's too far.

James Bobd, son of Andrew Bond has had his appearance and name chosen to be dull and not to stand out. Ostia Elba fulfills none of the necessary criteria, regardless of his credentials.

This might be the most racist post on dakka. There is nothing truly remarkable about Idris Elba, other than the fact that he is a black man, which is itself unremarkable, or should be. In some parts of the world, Brazil for instance, skin color is regarded as just that, skin color, and a change like this would be seen as inconsequential, as it should be.

 thedarkavenger wrote:

 d-usa wrote:
Bond is a behavior, an attitude, a way of carrying himself. His looks have never been a factor beyond "women want to feth him". As long as he is good looking enough for a Bond girl to shag him anyone will do as long as they can behave like Bond.

Bond is a character. His character was crafted to be remiscent of Hoagy Carmichael with aspects of Fleming's own. He's a Scot who went to Eton. His defining features have generally been consistent: slim build; a three-inch long, thin vertical scar on his right cheek; blue-grey eyes; a "cruel" mouth; short, black hair, a comma of which falls on his forehead.

Bond's appearance does matter. It's like making Gandalf a dwarf, because of an actor.

Youd be correct if we were talking about the books.

As far as replacing a man of one skin tone with that of another being some radical change, well, no...not really, unless you believe there is some inherent differences that make them stand so far apart to essentially be different species their skin tone. If not it is such a minor change that it shouldn't be that important that it ruins the character.

Sadly, I get the impression that a lot of people think that way. A lot of the arguments Ive heard have been to the effect of, "Bond is supposed to be x,y, and z" where x y and z are personality or background characteristics such as : womanizer, Eton graduate, Scotsman, etc. etc. Yet none of those characteristics are exclusive to a white man or a black man, theyre just characteristics of a HUMAN.

First things first, I'm not a racist. I'm a bigot. There's a difference. Never once did I say anything actually racist. I merely stated that a man who does not fit the visual, or physical constraints of a role should not play a role.

And yes, his background was pointed out in a later novel, but in Casino Royale, THE FIRST BOND NOVEL WRITTEN, Vesper Lynd stated: "Bond reminds me rather of Hoagy Carmichael, but there is something cold and ruthless."

Then in Moonraker, Gala Brand states: "certainly good-looking ... Rather like Hoagy Carmichael in a way. That black hair falling down over the right eyebrow. Much the same bones. But there was something a bit cruel in the mouth, and the eyes were cold."


Also in the novels, Bond's physical description has generally been consistent: slim build; a three-inch long, thin vertical scar on his right cheek; blue-grey eyes; a "cruel" mouth; short, black hair, a comma of which falls on his forehead. His height also differs from Idris Elba. Idris elba is 190cm tall, and weighs 95kg. Bond is 183cm tall and weighs 76KG. There is no way Idris Elba could protray the role of Bond accurately without appearing malnourished.

Allow me to reiterate. Idris cannot play Bond properly , or accurately, but that does not mean he cannot play 007. Those two are not interlinked, nor are they mutually exclusive. James Bond is the character, 007 is the codename.

Thatd be all well and good if:
1. The films had something in common with the books, aside from the names.
2. Any of the Bonds actually looked like that.

 A Town Called Malus wrote:
Also, you could look like Hoagy Carmichael in the way that the Moonraker quote describes whilst still being black.

Agreed. Looking like Hoagy Carmichael doesnt necessarily mean one must have the same skin color as Hoagy Carmichael. Katt Williams looks like David Spade, the only obvious difference there is that Katt Williams is black, that doesnt stop him from having similar hair, eyes/nose structure, forehead and facial shape, etc.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:

 Deadshot wrote:
Similar to the news than Captain America and Human Torch will now be black and Thor a woman, although at least in those cases there is fiction storylines to back the ideas up, whereas here it is just up and out attempts to appease the Political Correctness crap. Not saying you shouldn't have equality, but this guy is not a Bond.

It's quite a bit different. Thor isn't now a woman. Thor Odisonson remains Thor Odinson. The female "Thor" is a different character. Same applies to Captain America. Steve Rogers isn't suddenly black - he's still the same Steve Rogers as always - but Sam Wilson has taken up the title/role of Captain America.

Having Bond suddenly be black is quite different, unless you go for the "James Bond/007 is a codename" theory, which some people do, some people don't, and, if you're Ahtman, some people get really aggressive over.

People need to get off that line of thinking. You can replace Bond with a black man, have him be the actual James Bond, and still keep the continuity of all the previous stories. The narrative and plots dont suddenly unravel if Bond suddenly becomes black. The dialogue and events of previous films dont suddenly become invalidated by Bond becoming black. Just because Bond has been portrayed by white actors doesnt necessarily mean that Bond is white, likewise just because Bond may be portrayed by a black actor doesnt mean Bond is black. Bond simply is, if Idris Elba gets the role, he is still the same Bond even if his physical appearance is slightly different, just like with all the previous ones. Of course, this would require there to actually be continuity to thr series which is highly dubious.

Case in point, M (female M, aka Olivia as per Skyfall) was new to her position within the continuity as of Goldeneye whereas Bond was a veteran field agent. In Casino Royale she has been in her position for quite some time (further backed up by Quantum and Skyfall), yet Bond is still a relative rookie. This means if all the films present a continuous continuity, that Bond started his career with Olivia as M, when she died she was replaced by Mallory, who in turn would be replaced by Admiral Messervy at some point, who would be replaced by Admiral Hargreaves, who would then himself be replaced by an amnesiac zombie Olivia... who died in Bonds arms some years prior... meanwhile a young Q and a young black Eve Moneypenny would suddenly appear, despite both characters having been missing, beyond old, and/or dead for some years....

Think Ian Fleming Production has a say on who plays Bond.


Edit

Though a Black James Bond 007 done in a Educational TV series though can be done without legal ramification.

 Albatross wrote:

 thedarkavenger wrote:

 d-usa wrote:
Which book has Bond imply that he has slept with men while fighting an ex-agent who engages in cyber terrorism?

Didn't that happen in Skyfall? If so, Skyfall is not a book.

I can't tell if you're facetious or not.

The bond books turned into films range from Dr. No, to Casino Royale. In that order.

And as I already pointed out, Bond is not a codename. It's his birth name.

I think Elba would make an excellent Bond. I'd love to see it personally.