Eldar Rumors - Page 24/25 first info & pics.

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**Leth**

No, most onager weapons done have the cognis rule, only the stubbers do.

**Fayric**

Just realized the Hemlock wraithfighter is suddenly truly terifying.

**ronin_cse**

Without the icarus array they would still do well against bikes. The Neutron Laser would basically delete them, and if it's a 10 model unit even if it scatters it would probably get 3-5, a unit of 3 Onagers would probably take out one unit a turn, maybe more depending on how close other bike units are. Then getting shot at they would still need to roll 6s to glance and then would be further reduced by the 4++

**Hive City Dweller**

Leth wrote:
No, most onager weapons done have the cognis rule, only the stubbers do.

Oh damn, my mistake.

**MasterSlowPoke**

Fayric wrote:
Just realized the Hemlock wraithfighter is suddenly truly terifying.

It sounds like D-scythes don't get the whatever grants the Destroyer rule - it calls out Wraithguard, Wraithknights, and Vaul's Wrath D-Cannons in particular.

**Big Blind Bill**

ronin_cse wrote:
Without the icarus array they would still do well against bikes. The Neutron Laser would basically delete them, and if it's a 10 model unit even if it scatters it would probably get 3-5, a unit of 3 Onagers would probably take out one unit a turn, maybe more depending on how close other bike units are. Then getting shot at they would still need to roll 6s to glance and then would be further reduced by the 4++

You are regularly hitting 3-5 models with a little blast? 1-2 would be more likely.

I disagree with the idea of the neutron laser deleting them. With their move speed it will be difficult to get clear shots on them, usually they will be out of line of sight, or in cover. Even if not in cover they can jink. With a 4+ cover save you will need 24 neutron hits to wipe the squad out. That's not an easy number to achieve.

Best counters would be barrage to hit hit them whilst they hide, Heldrake flamers or other ignores cover ap3 weapons (especially LoS ignoring or on fast vehicles) or a large alphastrke to cripple their squads before they can shred your army.

**legions_no_more**

Hate to say it, but i been waiting on new jet bikes. I have 3 boxes, maybe 4, I did not build because I hated how it looked like a nose. Just ordered 10x box of the windrider, and 5x of sky runner. They just look too awesome not to field that many.

**Nocturnus**

Great White wrote:
iddy00711 wrote:
Jetbikes are easy to counter. If there's 40 of them that's units of 10/7, that big of a footprint makes them vulnerable to multi-assult which is particularly bad considering they're LD8. Although clearly they're biggest weakness is AP2/3 weapons and AV13.

With Marines you've got Cent star, bike grav, Relic whirlwind that ignores cover, Sicarian etc.

Nids have Mawlocs and lictors, which in this instance would works wonders against a clumped up bike army.

Chaos/Daemons has hounds, D. Princes and helldrakes.

Tau has farsight, sky rays and tides.

So if you're really having problems with them you have a large selection of codexs you can ally with. Also if you get them to jink, their shooting ablility goes right down.

Saying that I wouldnt expect to see more than 21 of them in any given army. Not spamming them makes them 1000% more effective.

Also the fact that each model has 4 shots a piece, when you start killing them their amount of shots goes down exponentially

Plus 36" range, psychic buffs. I think OP is confused. Jetbikes are very strong and hard to counter. Plus, they can always Jink if they take too much heat...

**Big Blind Bill**

I run 30 bikes with my WS army at 1000 points, and I can tell you that space is not too much of an issue.

It certainly doesn't limit my movement or ability to spread out and avoid blasts.

Now this is with SM bikes. Eldar bikes are going to have more than double the effective range as well as the ability to jump over buildings.

I can see them being spammed competitively at around the 30 mark.

**Mulletdude**

Any bets on if the Windrider Host formation gives the bikes hit and run? I think the odds would be in favor of such shenanigans.

**streetsamurai**

really really weird that they didn't include the part to make shining spears. unless I'm missing something, they just would have to put a few hands, and lances.

**koooaei**

They didn't cause they thought: "Who'd use shining spears when you can spam scatter lasers?".

**Toofast**

OMG the sky is falling! Nobody will ever play against my eldar again. Oh, except at leagues, tournaments and practicing for tournaments, where I play 95% of my games. If you want to forfeit and save me 3 hours of whooping your ass, fine by me. I'll go grab another adult beverage and watch someone else's game.

**Gamgee**

If it's as broken as it looks. Yep. Never playing an Eldar player again until they fix it. How entertaining will it be never using them in any games if no one wants to play with you?

**PlaguelordHobbyServices**

That new Autarch looks pretty awesome. Kinda makes me want to start up an Eldar army now.

**koooaei**

Toofast wrote:
OMG the sky is falling! Nobody will ever play against my eldar again. Oh, except at leagues, tournaments and practicing for tournaments, where I play 95% of my games. If you want to forfeit and save me 3 hours of whooping your ass, fine by me. I'll go grab another adult beverage and watch someone else's game.

Aren't you the one constantly QQ-ing about how bad it is when there's no ballance and that we shouldn't support GW and stuff.

**Toofast**

Gamgee wrote:
If it's as broken as it looks. Yep. Never playing an Eldar player again until they fix it. How entertaining will it be never using them in any games if no one wants to play with you?

See my post above. I would love that, I'll get to drink and watch my future opponents games and get an auto win. My opponent who forfeit will most likely be DQd from the tournament for quitting just because he didn't like my list. The next round I'll get a game and he'll be sitting in his hotel room.

**LordBlades**

Toofast wrote:
OMG the sky is falling! Nobody will ever play against my eldar again. Oh, except at leagues, tournaments and practicing for tournaments, where I play 95% of my games. If you want to forfeit and save me 3 hours of whooping your ass, fine by me. I'll go grab another adult beverage and watch someone else's game.

Depending what tournaments you play in, there's a decent chance a significant part of your codex will be outright banned.

**Q0rbin**

I think that even 10 jetbikes with either scatterlaser or shuriken cannon is Op. Not just because the weapons but also for they have both the 3+ and are the fastest unit in 40k, if this is all true.

**Gamgee**

Toofast wrote:
Gamgee wrote:
If it's as broken as it looks. Yep. Never playing an Eldar player again until they fix it. How entertaining will it be never using them in any games if no one wants to play with you?

See my post above. I would love that, I'll get to drink and watch my future opponents games and get an auto win. My opponent who forfeit will most likely be DQd from the tournament for quitting just because he didn't like my list. The next round I'll get a game and he'll be sitting in his hotel room.

You misunderstand me. I would start with myself not playing Eldar. Grow it into a few small friends. Then tournaments, and then really get the Eldar just removed form tournament play or enforce strict choices on what is allowed. At least until the codex is brought in line.

Hahaha you thought I would stop with me. That's funny. Politics kiddo. It's not really a political protest if the things your protesting can still play in tournaments. Know what I mean?

**Toofast**

Frontline gaming has already said they're going to evaluate their ranged D ban due to this codex. I highly doubt it will stand. Also, there's plenty of tournaments that aren't ITC. If they keep the ban, I can take d scythe WG and fire dragons in serpents and warp spiders or hawks instead. It's not like eldar depended on ranged D shooting to win tournaments before. Yes the lynx is good, but I didn't see it win any majors.

**Capamaru**

plastictrees wrote:
Talys wrote:
adamsouza wrote:
We have different opinions on what is expensive then.
10 boxes @ $41 + 3 boxes @ $33

$509 ($407.20 after 20% discount) for only 960 points of an army is still beyond what most players are willing to spend in my experience.

How many White Scars biker armies do you see in your meta ?

Well, let's go back to MSRP for a sec. 10 boxes - $410 MSRP. With scatter lasers, which everyone is talking about, you're going to be at 810 points. I dunno what other boxes you mean, so let me leave those alone.

If you were to play 3 imperial knights you'd pay $420 MSRP for 1,125 points. To play the BA Angel's Fury formation at 1,080 points, you need $380 MSRP for 3 Storm Ravens and 30 tactical marines. So yes, there's a premium, but it's not exactly towering.

And yeah, your "typical" armies aren't going to have 30 jetbikes OR 30 30 SM bikes. Transporting 30 jetbikes is also an issue.

By the sound of things transporting or buying them won't be an issue. You can just say that you'll be bringing 30+ scatriders, no-one will agree to play you and you can go home content in your martial prowess and without having to spend any money on models.

Exalted for truth.

Toofast wrote:
OMG the sky is falling! Nobody will ever play against my eldar again. Oh, except at leagues, tournaments and practicing for tournaments, where I play 95% of my games. If you want to forfeit and save me 3 hours of whooping your ass, fine by me. I'll go grab another adult beverage and watch someone else's game.

**ImAGeek**

Drink a bear?

**koooaei**

What have you done! I now have to calm down my pet bear. He's throwing bottles of vodka at the walls and overall panicking.

**Q0rbin**

Toofast wrote:
Gamgee wrote:
If it's as broken as it looks. Yep. Never playing an Eldar player again until they fix it. How entertaining will it be never using them in any games if no one wants to play with you?

See my post above. I would love that, I'll get to drink and watch my future opponents games and get an auto win. My opponent who forfeit will most likely be DQd from the tournament for quitting just because he didn't like my list. The next round I'll get a game and he'll be sitting in his hotel room.

I will not see that as an autowin if your opponent refuse to meet 40 jetbikes. I see it more that the Eldar players who fields an army like that don't dare to field something own.

**Capamaru**

LOL adult beverage... bear you know... like beer!

**Toofast**

Q0rbin wrote:
Toofast wrote:
Gamgee wrote:
If it's as broken as it looks. Yep. Never playing an Eldar player again until they fix it. How entertaining will it be never using them in any games if no one wants to play with you?

See my post above. I would love that, I'll get to drink and watch my future opponents games and get an auto win. My opponent who forfeit will most likely be DQd from the tournament for quitting just because he didn't like my list. The next round I'll get a game and he'll be sitting in his hotel room.

I will not see that as an autowin if your opponent refuse to meet 40 jetbikes. I see it more that the Eldar players who fields an army like that don't dare to field something own.

You must not have read many tournament FAQs. If you forfeit a game, you lose. If the forfeit is due to something other than a medical/family emergency, you're removed from the tournament. People don't spend money and take time off from work/real life to go play a tournament only to stand around and watch games because the opponent doesn't like their list. My local meta is competitive and typically you're expected to bring a good list. I see guys get crap for bringing bad lists more than for bringing cheese. It's like "come on man, do I really have to face your dark angels? Do you have that triptide list in the car? I'm practicing for NOVA here."

**SharkoutofWata**

Gamgee wrote:
Toofast wrote:
Gamgee wrote:
If it's as broken as it looks. Yep. Never playing an Eldar player again until they fix it. How entertaining will it be never using them in any games if no one wants to play with you?

See my post above. I would love that, I'll get to drink and watch my future opponents games and get an auto win. My opponent who forfeit will most likely be DQd from the tournament for quitting just because he didn't like my list. The next round I'll get a game and he'll be sitting in his hotel room.

You misunderstand me. I would start with myself not playing Eldar. Grow it into a few small friends. Then tournaments, and then really get the Eldar just removed form tournament play or enforce strict choices on what is allowed. At least until the codex is brought in line.

Hahaha you thought I would stop with me. That's funny. Politics kiddo. It's not really a political protest if the things your protesting can still play in tournaments. Know what I mean?

Let's take a poll on who cares what you personally decide what is legal and what shouldn't be allowed on a 40k table. Please do that and see where your voice takes you. You might get your friends to boycott Eldar too, but no one reasonable cares about the belly aching of some random guy. Companies don't care about your complaints. Players don't care about your complaints. I would be happy to never play against you because you want to blanket ban Eldar. You do not seem like the sort of person I even want to casually game with. One less person I have to hear 'oh that race is so cheesy and that's why you won'. The game rules aren't meant to cater to Gamgee from DakkaDakka. There is a lot more than just what you deem appropriate.

**hiveof_chimera**

If said rumours are true, I'll probably use 6th edition book, with SL changes and WK changes, should I be changing anything else?

**Capamaru**

Toofast wrote:
Q0rbin wrote:
Toofast wrote:
Gamgee wrote:
If it's as broken as it looks. Yep. Never playing an Eldar player again until they fix it. How entertaining will it be never using them in any games if no one wants to play with you?

See my post above. I would love that, I'll get to drink and watch my future opponents games and get an auto win. My opponent who forfeit will most likely be DQd from the tournament for quitting just because he didn't like my list. The next round I'll get a game and he'll be sitting in his hotel room.

I will not see that as an autowin if your opponent refuse to meet 40 jetbikes. I see it more that the Eldar players who fields an army like that don't dare to field something own.

You must not have read many tournament FAQs. If you forfeit a game, you lose. If the forfeit is due to something other than a medical/family emergency, you're removed from the tournament. People don't spend money and take time off from work/real life to go play a tournament only to stand around and watch games because the opponent doesn't like their list. My local meta is competitive and typically you're expected to bring a good list. I see guys get crap for bringing bad lists more than for bringing cheese. It's like "come on man, do I really have to face your dark angels? Do you have that triptide list in the car? I'm practicing for NOVA here."

While you get to the car to bring the triptide list don't forget the adult beverages! What you don't seem to get is that codex eldar in its new form is gonna tramp most lists so in your super competitive environment sooner or later everyone will switch to eldar and dring adult beverages.