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Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut




Quick question for you guys regarding Y'Vahras:

"Overcharged Burst" rules state that "The Y'Vahra can fire using a weapon's Nova Reactor profile." Does that mean both weapons can be fired with the nova profile or that you have to choose which one gets said profile?
   
Made in us
Fireknife Shas'el





Reedsburg, WI

I would say one weapon as the possessive " weapon's " is singular. If it had said " weapons' " then I would say both.

Wyomingfox's Space Wolves Paint Blog A journey across decades.
Splinter Fleet Stygian Paint Blogg Home of the Albino Bugs. 
   
Made in gb
Ship's Officer



London

MilkmanAl wrote:
Quick question for you guys regarding Y'Vahras:

"Overcharged Burst" rules state that "The Y'Vahra can fire using a weapon's Nova Reactor profile." Does that mean both weapons can be fired with the nova profile or that you have to choose which one gets said profile?


When you say "a weapon's" you are referring to a single weapon. There's no other way to take that. And honestly the Y'Vahra is either broken or well over 400 points, so be happy with the filth it already is.

Razerous wrote:
 luke1705 wrote:
 The Shrike wrote:
 Cephalobeard wrote:
I'm of the opinion 3 Y'vahra (Point Depending) and then Multiple Commanders and as many drones you can Jam in will be pretty decent.


It seems like, given its 20 power level, we're probably looking at 400 points. I'm definitely thinking hey'll still work best in pairs, but 3 seems like it would crowd out support units.

If we assume the three worthy systems for the Y'Vahra are ATS, TL and Stims, only one of those can be replicated in other ways. I'm going to go Stims and ATS, then take a couple units of Pathfinders and some marker drones to help the IDC. After that marker support that leaves me 1000 points for a Quad fusion commander, a Coldstar, a Breacher team in a Fish for the Relic (and other distant objectives), 20 Vespid and 30-40 Kroot.


I'm definitely going to shoot for 2 storm surges and 2 Y'Vahras and then see what else I can do from there. Shadowsun's double Kauyon seems awesome, but maybe not worth the increased cost over a regular commander.
But the stormsurges are so poor.


I don't know if stormsurges are really that bad - yet. I think that there's real value in having a survivable model with an enormous threat range. Its alpha strike really is serious as well.

Whether it's worth its points, I'm not sure. Fully kitted out, with the probably obligatory ATS and shield generator, it's close to 500 points. It's a huge amount, but the alpha strike it can do is also pretty huge. Honestly I would not be at all surprised to see these things making their points back a lot of the time.

For a third support slot I think I'd give it an early warning override. This is great protection for it if the other guy's plan is to drop plasma or melta squads nearby. So far as I can see, it can fire all its weapons every time a unit deploys - though opponents will probably learn their lesson after the first unit!

I can't see a use for the pulse blastcannon, I'm sorry to say. This guy clearly wants to be nailed down, nice and far away. The idea of approaching closer to the enemy is contrary to everything else about him.
   
Made in us
Grim Dark Angels Interrogator-Chaplain






A Protoss colony world

Razerous wrote:
But the stormsurges are so poor.

I disagree. It's expensive, but with all those guns and how tough it is it had better be. Obviously you shouldn't expect it to last very long in melee against, say, an Imperial Knight, but I think it will be a great gunline unit if it sits in the backfield, deploys its anchors, and it is properly supported by other units. I can't see taking more than one, though, and it definitely is not a must take anymore. At least it's better than the horribly nerfed RIPtide.

My armies (re-counted and updated on 9/25/20, including modeled wargear options):
Dark Angels: ~16000 | Space Marines (Blood Ravens and others): ~900 | Space Wolves: ~3800
Astra Militarum: ~800 | Officio Assassinorum: ~600 | Imperial Knights: ~1300 | Sisters of Battle: ~1900
Check out my P&M Blogs: ZergSmasher's P&M Blog | Imperial Knights blog | Total models painted in 2019: 62 | Total models painted in 2020: 28 | Current main painting project: The Witch-King of Angmar on Fell Beast
 Mr_Rose wrote:
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Towering Hierophant Bio-Titan



UK

Mandragola wrote:
Spoiler:
MilkmanAl wrote:
Quick question for you guys regarding Y'Vahras:

"Overcharged Burst" rules state that "The Y'Vahra can fire using a weapon's Nova Reactor profile." Does that mean both weapons can be fired with the nova profile or that you have to choose which one gets said profile?


When you say "a weapon's" you are referring to a single weapon. There's no other way to take that. And honestly the Y'Vahra is either broken or well over 400 points, so be happy with the filth it already is.

Razerous wrote:
 luke1705 wrote:
 The Shrike wrote:
 Cephalobeard wrote:
I'm of the opinion 3 Y'vahra (Point Depending) and then Multiple Commanders and as many drones you can Jam in will be pretty decent.


It seems like, given its 20 power level, we're probably looking at 400 points. I'm definitely thinking hey'll still work best in pairs, but 3 seems like it would crowd out support units.

If we assume the three worthy systems for the Y'Vahra are ATS, TL and Stims, only one of those can be replicated in other ways. I'm going to go Stims and ATS, then take a couple units of Pathfinders and some marker drones to help the IDC. After that marker support that leaves me 1000 points for a Quad fusion commander, a Coldstar, a Breacher team in a Fish for the Relic (and other distant objectives), 20 Vespid and 30-40 Kroot.


I'm definitely going to shoot for 2 storm surges and 2 Y'Vahras and then see what else I can do from there. Shadowsun's double Kauyon seems awesome, but maybe not worth the increased cost over a regular commander.
But the stormsurges are so poor.


I don't know if stormsurges are really that bad - yet. I think that there's real value in having a survivable model with an enormous threat range. Its alpha strike really is serious as well.

Whether it's worth its points, I'm not sure. Fully kitted out, with the probably obligatory ATS and shield generator, it's close to 500 points. It's a huge amount, but the alpha strike it can do is also pretty huge. Honestly I would not be at all surprised to see these things making their points back a lot of the time.

For a third support slot I think I'd give it an early warning override. This is great protection for it if the other guy's plan is to drop plasma or melta squads nearby. So far as I can see, it can fire all its weapons every time a unit deploys - though opponents will probably learn their lesson after the first unit!

I can't see a use for the pulse blastcannon, I'm sorry to say. This guy clearly wants to be nailed down, nice and far away. The idea of approaching closer to the enemy is contrary to everything else about him.
How great is the firepower? A number of Str 5 shots (gun drones?!) and some Str 10 AP -3/-4 shots.

No great accuracy, no great speed. Its resilience is okay to very good, depending.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Friend of mine just sent me this:

"The Tyranid Codex, where I learned the truth about despair, as will you. There's a reason why this codex is the worst hell on earth... Hope. ."
Too be fair.. it's all worked out quite well!

Heh.  
   
Made in us
Trustworthy Shas'vre





Philadelphia

For less points, Drukharii can have 3 ravagers that collectively have NINE S8 -4 d6 damage shots and 30 wounds. i know that isn't apples to apples but come on. (also, rail gun hammerheads only do 1d6 damage? really?)

I'm not joining in the "8th Tau stink" chorus, but they did overcorrect some things. Surges lost FNP, stomp and fearless natively as well as 6" of movement. It deserved a points decrease not a modest increase.

R.I.Ptide.

Hammerheads are a joke compared to predator annihilators and ravagers.

Breachers were nerfed now that they can't be buffed by a character for an extra shot at half range. Why? When was that ever a problem?

S5 is nerfed in the new wound chart, so our big bad infantry gun isn't big or bad anymore. S6 would have represented a similar superiority in 8th's system as S5 once did.

Markerlights are ok, but a sixth hit should have granted twin linked. More importantly, markerlights as they have functioned for the last five editions were meant to counteract our innately poor BS. We already yield two entire phases of the game. With the nerf of markerlights, we're a shooting army that misses half the time...that's supposed to be Guard's job but are cheap enough to mitigate that. "Quantity has a quality all its own." is their thing not ours.

Rant over; we're still usable, and can still compete. Just have a narrower selection, which is a shame because most armies saw their choices expand.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2017/06/14 23:08:24


Rule #1 is Look Cool.

4000 Tau'Arn Desert Raiders

2000 Sa'Cea Sept Urban Assault Cadre

1000 V'iet Jungle Insurgents (Under Construction)  
   
Made in us
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A Protoss colony world

 The Shrike wrote:
For less points, Drukharii can have 3 ravagers that collectively have NINE S8 -4 d6 damage shots and 30 wounds. i know that isn't apples to apples but come on. (also, rail gun hammerheads only do 1d6 damage? really?)

I'm not joining in the "8th Tau stink" chorus, but they did overcorrect some things. Surges lost FNP, stomp and fearless natively as well as 6" of movement. It deserved a points decrease not a modest increase.

Surges did lose those things, but many of them were considered OP by many players, especially Stomps. There were rant threads here on Dakka about how undercosted the Stormsurge was (although I never thought so). I think in the new edition the points should have stayed about the same, but oh well, I think they are still playable.
R.I.Ptide.

Sadly, you're not wrong about this one. Massive overcorrection by GW if you ask me.
Hammerheads are a joke compared to predator annihilators and ravagers.

In a direct comparison, yes they are.The Pred's weapons, and those of the Ravager, are going to be wasted on smaller models, whereas the Hammerhead can do some work with its SMS and submunitions rounds to thin hordes. Longstrike does help Hammerheads as well, so I think they are still usable.
Breachers were nerfed now that they can't be buffed by a character for an extra shot at half range. Why? When was that ever a problem?

Uh, who was actually doing that in their lists? I would never risk an Ethereal that close to the enemy in 7th. Half range on Breachers is crazy close for a model that gives up an extra VP when he dies. Since they've made Ethereals so cheap and they no longer give up VP when they die, they probably wanted to kill those shenanigans since there is so little risk involved now.
S5 is nerfed in the new wound chart, so our big bad infantry gun isn't big or bad anymore. S6 would have represented a similar superiority in 8th's system as S5 once did.

Not really nerfed, at least not badly. S5 will wound pretty much anything on 5's or better, which is pretty nice when they previously needed 6's to wound big things, if they could even touch them at all. Sure, you can't blink out Guardsmen on 2's anymore, but I don't think that's honestly a huge deal.
Markerlights are ok, but a sixth hit should have granted twin linked.

That would have been nice, but they are trying to cut down on the rerolls. Theoretically.
Rant over; we're still usable, and can still compete. Just have a narrower selection, which is a shame because most armies saw their choices expand.

Narrower selection? Not sure I agree. Vespids are playable now, Gun Drones are awesome (who ever took them before other than in Piranha Wing gimmick lists?), Krootox are okay since they are their own units now, and Pathfinders are pretty nice as well. Yes, we lost Riptides and Sky Rays, at least competitively, but most of the rest of our book is usable if played well.

My armies (re-counted and updated on 9/25/20, including modeled wargear options):
Dark Angels: ~16000 | Space Marines (Blood Ravens and others): ~900 | Space Wolves: ~3800
Astra Militarum: ~800 | Officio Assassinorum: ~600 | Imperial Knights: ~1300 | Sisters of Battle: ~1900
Check out my P&M Blogs: ZergSmasher's P&M Blog | Imperial Knights blog | Total models painted in 2019: 62 | Total models painted in 2020: 28 | Current main painting project: The Witch-King of Angmar on Fell Beast
 Mr_Rose wrote:
Who doesn’t love crazy mutant squawk-puppies? Eh? Nobody, that’s who.
 
   
Made in gb
Ship's Officer



London

A stormsurge wants to have someone call Kauyon for it on turn one, and preferably a bunch of markerlight hits on things too, for +1 BS. Then it can pretty reliably stick ~7 mortal wounds on something like a ravager or predator and finish it off with the pulse driver cannon.

It can only do that once of course. The thing it does every turn is spit out an average 22 S5 shots with good range, while being very hard to get rid of. That durability is hard to measure and assign a value to, but it's what made riptides good in the past.

I'm definitely not saying that it's a must take. Not for a second. It costs a lot and the stuff to go with it is pricey too. But I think it's a perfectly valid option.

I've been thinking about some other units that I'd like to use. Pathfinders with rail rifles are really cool, but the challenge is to somehow keep them alive, firing for multiple turns. I think I may have found a way to achieve this, with the various tidewall thingies. They are effectively moderately tough open-topped transport vehicles.

The droneport might be the best of all of these. You can have 4 marker drones that use the pathfinders' BS, plus maybe a bonus if there are DCs nearby. You deploy the droneport, its drones and the pathfinder squad as a single drop, perhaps even with the odd character inside too.

It's nothing all that amazing, but it seems quite fun. The whole lot comes to around the price of a broadside.

I'm not sure tidewalls are worth it for fire warriors. The answer there is probably either having them ride in devilfish, or just having loads of them. I'm not sure I agree that S5 has been nerfed. Yes, it only wounds S3 on a 3+ instead of a 2+, but it's equal or better against literally everything else. I think that fire warriors will have benefited from the changes to the AP system, as there were quite a lot of ap4 weapons with high rates of fire before, and these now tend to only have AP-1 now. If you can find cover for them they'll have a 3+ save a lot of the time, which is pretty cool.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/06/14 23:34:00


 
   
Made in us
Grim Dark Angels Interrogator-Chaplain






A Protoss colony world

Mandragola wrote:
I'm not sure tidewalls are worth it for fire warriors. The answer there is probably either having them ride in devilfish, or just having loads of them. I'm not sure I agree that S5 has been nerfed. Yes, it only wounds S3 on a 3+ instead of a 2+, but it's equal or better against literally everything else. I think that fire warriors will have benefited from the changes to the AP system, as there were quite a lot of ap4 weapons with high rates of fire before, and these now tend to only have AP-1 now. If you can find cover for them they'll have a 3+ save a lot of the time, which is pretty cool.

Breachers definitely need a 'fish rather than a tidewall, but Strike Teams? With what a Devilfish costs compared to the 70 points needed for a Tidewall Shieldline (which can potentially give mortal wounds back to people that fire at it!), I think it's not terribly clear cut. The only question I have is aura abilities. Do any of them work on units inside of vehicles? I'm not entirely sure. If not, then maybe a Tidewall is not such a great idea except in certain cases.

My armies (re-counted and updated on 9/25/20, including modeled wargear options):
Dark Angels: ~16000 | Space Marines (Blood Ravens and others): ~900 | Space Wolves: ~3800
Astra Militarum: ~800 | Officio Assassinorum: ~600 | Imperial Knights: ~1300 | Sisters of Battle: ~1900
Check out my P&M Blogs: ZergSmasher's P&M Blog | Imperial Knights blog | Total models painted in 2019: 62 | Total models painted in 2020: 28 | Current main painting project: The Witch-King of Angmar on Fell Beast
 Mr_Rose wrote:
Who doesn’t love crazy mutant squawk-puppies? Eh? Nobody, that’s who.
 
   
Made in gb
Ship's Officer



London

I'm debating just putting fire warriors on foot, without any kind of transport. They are cheap and have long-ranged guns, so rather than putting them on a tidewall I'd have (nearly) twice as many of them instead. A good way to be survivable is to have twice as many guys, and shoot the other guys twice as dead.

As you suggest, there are a ton of rules questions that come up when you put units in tidwall things. These are some:

1. What happens with any drones the unit may have? They aren't allowed inside, so do they deploy outside? Can they deploy in coherency of models in a transport at all?

2. Aura abilities don't work from inside a transport going out. Do they work if someone outside uses them? I think not, as there's a wording in the transport rules saying that embarked models can't be affected by stuff.

3. A tidewall thingy would seem a good place to stick a firesight marksman, especially since he can give his 3+ BS to droneport drones. But does he have line of sight to anything while he's in there, so as to give +1 BS to his sniper drones? I think maybe he does, because we do have rules saying to measure LoS for him from any point on the droneport. His ability is not an aura with a range (which wouldn't work), it only requires him to have LoS. All still probably rather irrelevant, given that the only reason to take sniper drones is to fill a brigade.

4. If I drop my droneport, with its own drones, a marksman and a unit of pathfinders inside it, plus their drones outside it, is that all one drop for deployment? I think it probably is, though there seem to be no rules for deploying the drones one way or the other.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2017/06/15 00:16:55


 
   
Made in us
Regular Dakkanaut




I think something Tau and Eldar players are underrating is the value of Fly on their tanks. Tying up tanks and the counters to that will definitely develop, we're above all that (see what I did there?).

Don't agree that S5 is somehow devalued.
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut




S5 is worse against T3, but that's it. I'd actually argue that FW got a substantial buff from the to-wound table, rather than a nerf. You won't be mowing down guardsmen like you used to, I suppose, but now you can tackle light vehicles competently and even take a few chunks out of superheavies through weight of fire. That's a huge improvement. It's not like we are lacking in the crowd control department, so wounding T3 on 3s isn't a crippling change, in my opinion.
   
Made in il
Warplord Titan Princeps of Tzeentch






xmbk wrote:
I think something Tau and Eldar players are underrating is the value of Fly on their tanks. Tying up tanks and the counters to that will definitely develop, we're above all that (see what I did there?).

Don't agree that S5 is somehow devalued.


I don't lnow about eldar-but Fly on tau tanks is worth nothing.

Because tau tanks, are worth nothing.


See, the problem si, the "all mighty railgun", doesn't actually KILL anything.
It does 2.2 wounds on average per turn to a land raider or 1.88 to an imperial knight WITH the buff from longstrike. that's not helping anyone. not at the abnormal price tag it has.

The hammerhead, skyray, devilfish, piranha. they all share a common factor-they can't kill a damn thing compared to how much they cost.

Sure, they are relatively fast, and they can get out of combat.
But locking them in combat hardly changes anything, as they hardly kill anything to begin with, being fast doesn't matter when you can't do anything once you reach into position and the hammerhead's range doesn't matter when the practical target range is between 6" to 48" away.

Tau armor is not a thing in 8th, hopefully the codex will fix that.

can neither confirm nor deny I lost track of what I've got right now. 
   
Made in us
Regular Dakkanaut




And 16 points of Kroot Hounds can stop that Land Raider from firing for a turn. Also, BC on a Hammerhead can be good for character assassination. Raiders don't have that kind of maneuvering. If you prefer the gun drones everyone is going crazy over, don't forget to include them when factoring the cost of a Hammerhead. Not saying the Raider isn't good, but people tend towards extreme analysis when new books come out. Plus we're used to GW creating extreme imbalances. I'm optimistic there will be less of that this edition.
   
Made in nl
Water-Caste Negotiator




 ZergSmasher wrote:
Krootox are okay since they are their own units now

How are they okay now? They used to be great, buffed by an ethereal, having cheap ablative wounds, stealth (forest), and decent enough in cc, they were awesome at taking down void shields (my brother runs orcs battle wagons while hiding under a void shield generator the first 1-2 turns). Krootox' lost every one of their possible buffs so now the firepower is meh (like everything we have) and they can be easily picked off. I doubt I'll be running them in 8th which is a shame because they are expensive models (money wise).

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/06/15 15:08:10


1500, 100% WIP, 100% kick-ass
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Ship's Officer



London

 BoomWolf wrote:
xmbk wrote:
I think something Tau and Eldar players are underrating is the value of Fly on their tanks. Tying up tanks and the counters to that will definitely develop, we're above all that (see what I did there?).

Don't agree that S5 is somehow devalued.


I don't lnow about eldar-but Fly on tau tanks is worth nothing.

Because tau tanks, are worth nothing.


See, the problem si, the "all mighty railgun", doesn't actually KILL anything.
It does 2.2 wounds on average per turn to a land raider or 1.88 to an imperial knight WITH the buff from longstrike. that's not helping anyone. not at the abnormal price tag it has.

The hammerhead, skyray, devilfish, piranha. they all share a common factor-they can't kill a damn thing compared to how much they cost.

Sure, they are relatively fast, and they can get out of combat.
But locking them in combat hardly changes anything, as they hardly kill anything to begin with, being fast doesn't matter when you can't do anything once you reach into position and the hammerhead's range doesn't matter when the practical target range is between 6" to 48" away.

Tau armor is not a thing in 8th, hopefully the codex will fix that.


I agree with you on the hammerhead, and even more so on the skray. They fail to do their jobs.

But the devilfish and piranha are entirely different stories. The fish is a good transport and has decent firepower for its cost (if not insanely good, like the AC razorback). You can stick a couple of units into it, and maybe even characters too, to speed up your drops and get first turn. I think it's a correctly-costed unit.

And the piranha is a cheap, reasonably shooty, very fast platform. I can't honestly say I'll be using them, but it's not an awful vehicle. Decent in maelstrom, in particular.

Both vehicles benefit from being armed with assault weapons, rather than heavy ones, so they are able to bring their guns to bear pretty easily. In fact a piranha has firepower very similar to a battlesuit, just with twice the speed and twice the wounds for only 3 more points.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/06/15 16:22:36


 
   
Made in us
Discriminating Deathmark Assassin





Has anyone heard anything about the supremacy armour? I bought one of these this year and only managed to play it once (took awhile to build and paint properly) before 8th came out :(
   
Made in br
Loyal Necron Lychguard




Lisbon, Portugal

 necron99 wrote:
Has anyone heard anything about the supremacy armour? I bought one of these this year and only managed to play it once (took awhile to build and paint properly) before 8th came out :(


We'll have to wait FW's Index Xenos. I bet we'll see its profile only by July

AI & BFG:
40k:
SW Legion & X-Wing: CIS

 Unit1126PLL wrote:
"FW is unbalanced and going to ruin tournaments."
"Name one where it did that."
"IT JUST DOES OKAY!"

 Shadenuat wrote:
Voted Astra Militarum for a chance for them to get nerfed instead of my own army.
 
   
Made in us
Focused Fire Warrior




Sacratomato

I am waiting on Ramora stats too. Just got 4 of them in the mail yesterday........

70% of all statistics are made up on the spot by 64% of the people that produce false statistics 54% of the time that they produce them. 
   
Made in gb
Towering Hierophant Bio-Titan



UK

 Vector Strike wrote:
 necron99 wrote:
Has anyone heard anything about the supremacy armour? I bought one of these this year and only managed to play it once (took awhile to build and paint properly) before 8th came out :(


We'll have to wait FW's Index Xenos. I bet we'll see its profile only by July
How will they release it, do you think?

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Friend of mine just sent me this:

"The Tyranid Codex, where I learned the truth about despair, as will you. There's a reason why this codex is the worst hell on earth... Hope. ."
Too be fair.. it's all worked out quite well!

Heh.  
   
Made in gb
Regular Dakkanaut




Hey guys,

Just thought I'd post here.

Im not a Tau Player *Boo Hiss* but my friend plays Tau and we have a few 8th edition games under our belts now.

He seems to be favoring suits/mech and drones.

It's actually got to the point I don't want to play his lists.

Twice against his list I was as good as tabled at the end of Turn 1.
50PP games.

He ran, (I think)

2 Shadow Keel? 2 Flamers and Raker.
2 S/Drones.

2 Commanders, 4 Fusion

3 Stealth Suits

3 Drones

3 Drones

2 Units Fire warriors for obj holding.

My unit of 10 termies disappeared in 1 turn. Including a Long Fang pack.



I had 1 round of shooting, 1st turn. Everything wound that went through was diverted to a drone.

His turn, he Deep Striked the commanders within 9" of my termies for 2d6 Damage. (To be sure)

And flamered my long fangs.

Termies went from 10 strong to 3. Died on Morale.
   
Made in us
Discriminating Deathmark Assassin





Razerous wrote:
 Vector Strike wrote:
 necron99 wrote:
Has anyone heard anything about the supremacy armour? I bought one of these this year and only managed to play it once (took awhile to build and paint properly) before 8th came out :(


We'll have to wait FW's Index Xenos. I bet we'll see its profile only by July
How will they release it, do you think?


That was the other unfortunate event - I spent like $200 on the tau and heritics books in January...now they'll be boxed up with everything else from 7th edition and head up to the attic :(
   
Made in br
Loyal Necron Lychguard




Lisbon, Portugal

Razerous wrote:
 Vector Strike wrote:
 necron99 wrote:
Has anyone heard anything about the supremacy armour? I bought one of these this year and only managed to play it once (took awhile to build and paint properly) before 8th came out :(


We'll have to wait FW's Index Xenos. I bet we'll see its profile only by July
How will they release it, do you think?


Absolutely no idea. As Ta'unar was a quite controversial unit, I might guess it'll come with some serious changes. Also, as Blast weapons got nerfed in 8th, I think the super-railgun will be its best weapon.

mcsheehy wrote:Hey guys,

Just thought I'd post here.

Im not a Tau Player *Boo Hiss* but my friend plays Tau and we have a few 8th edition games under our belts now.

He seems to be favoring suits/mech and drones.

It's actually got to the point I don't want to play his lists.

Twice against his list I was as good as tabled at the end of Turn 1.
50PP games.

He ran, (I think)

2 Shadow Keel? 2 Flamers and Raker.
2 S/Drones.

2 Commanders, 4 Fusion

3 Stealth Suits

3 Drones

3 Drones

2 Units Fire warriors for obj holding.

My unit of 10 termies disappeared in 1 turn. Including a Long Fang pack.



I had 1 round of shooting, 1st turn. Everything wound that went through was diverted to a drone.

His turn, he Deep Striked the commanders within 9" of my termies for 2d6 Damage. (To be sure)

And flamered my long fangs.

Termies went from 10 strong to 3. Died on Morale.


We welcome players from various factions to share with us their opinions and suggestions - especially when they're as nice as you!

May I ask if he used a homing beacon with the stealth suits? Normally, we cannot manta strike (the new name of Tau's deep strike) within 9" of an enemy unit.

AI & BFG:
40k:
SW Legion & X-Wing: CIS

 Unit1126PLL wrote:
"FW is unbalanced and going to ruin tournaments."
"Name one where it did that."
"IT JUST DOES OKAY!"

 Shadenuat wrote:
Voted Astra Militarum for a chance for them to get nerfed instead of my own army.
 
   
Made in de
Focused Dark Angels Land Raider Pilot




Germany

MilkmanAl wrote:
Quick question for you guys regarding Y'Vahras:

"Overcharged Burst" rules state that "The Y'Vahra can fire using a weapon's Nova Reactor profile." Does that mean both weapons can be fired with the nova profile or that you have to choose which one gets said profile?


since the rule uses an indefinite article instead of "one" or "a single", it is pretty clear that there is no limitation on how many weapons may use the nova reactor effect.
if the authors of the rules intended to limit the use to one, it would be written "The Y'Vahra can fire using a single weapon's Nova Reactor profile."
"a single" is the usual term GW uses, if they want to limit the use of something.

Otherwise aura abilities would be kinda trash.
For example Kaldor Draigos Bane of Evil:
"When a friendly GK unit within 6'' [...] you can reroll damage rolls for that unit"
If you would read "a" as "a single" this would mean that his aura only applies to one unit only.
Since this is not the case and the same wording is used for the Y'Vahra, the meaning of the rule is pretty clear.
And yes, its very much op. But that can never be an argument when dealing with FW Rules.
   
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Loyal Necron Lychguard




Lisbon, Portugal

The Y'vahra will probably cost 400ish points and has short-ranged weapons. Not only it won't endure too long in the battlefield, it already has a steep cost. I find it quite ok to have both weapons nova'ed at once

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Made in gb
Ship's Officer



London

Aeri wrote:
MilkmanAl wrote:
Quick question for you guys regarding Y'Vahras:

"Overcharged Burst" rules state that "The Y'Vahra can fire using a weapon's Nova Reactor profile." Does that mean both weapons can be fired with the nova profile or that you have to choose which one gets said profile?


since the rule uses an indefinite article instead of "one" or "a single", it is pretty clear that there is no limitation on how many weapons may use the nova reactor effect.
if the authors of the rules intended to limit the use to one, it would be written "The Y'Vahra can fire using a single weapon's Nova Reactor profile."
"a single" is the usual term GW uses, if they want to limit the use of something.

Otherwise aura abilities would be kinda trash.
For example Kaldor Draigos Bane of Evil:
"When a friendly GK unit within 6'' [...] you can reroll damage rolls for that unit"
If you would read "a" as "a single" this would mean that his aura only applies to one unit only.
Since this is not the case and the same wording is used for the Y'Vahra, the meaning of the rule is pretty clear.
And yes, its very much op. But that can never be an argument when dealing with FW Rules.

This is just wrong. If you walk into a bar and order "a beer", you get one beer. If you want another beer you have to hand over more money. A reference to "a <thing>" is singular. One of that thing.

Your Draigo reference is not relevant because entirely different things are happening there. A unit within 6" fires and gets to reroll to hit, or whatever. Then another unit within 6" fires and also gets to reroll to hit. In this case, the unit is triggering the effect, by firing within 6" of Draigo. There's nothing to stop that from happening multiple times. When the battlesuit activates its nova reactor it takes a wound and a weapon gets to fire with the nova platform. If another one activates its nova reactor then it also gets to power up a weapon.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/06/15 23:33:42


 
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut




When I initially asked the question, I was leaning towards Aeri's rationale and thinking that maybe both weapons get nova'd at the same time. I'm still on that side of the fence, but we'll have to wait for a FAQ to settle it for sure, I suppose.

In any event, here's the list I'm going to run this weekend:

Battalion
3 Commanders - 4 fusion - 480
6 gun drones - 48
3x5 fw - 120
15 total pf - 120
2x3 Stealth Suits - fusion with DC, 2 VT - 226
10 Gun Drones - 80
1074

Battalion
3 Commanders - 11 fusions, dc - 467
6 gun drones - 48
3x10 gun drones - 240
3x5 fw, 2 gun drones - 168
923

1997 total

I'm basically trying to maximize Commanders and Gun Drones, which it seems like everyone agrees are currently the strongest choices in our index. I don't think much can hold up to that volume of precision-dropped melta, and there's a veritable storm of S5 to back it up.

The Stealth Suits are the only questionable choice, in my opinion. They're there to be drone controller caddies and nothing else, but an extra fusion here and there never hurts, right? They should be plenty fast enough to position themselves near the Commander drop(s) for a little backup. They have VTs because it's a cheap upgrade that may end up giving a significant bonus. I'd probably run them naked, otherwise.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/06/15 23:55:41


 
   
Made in gb
Towering Hierophant Bio-Titan



UK

If the Y'vahra costs 400pts, can fire one or both weapons Nova'd.... either way I'm happy, it provides high-end effective damage on a reliable platform.

Will it be able to take out a Knight, one vs. one, curiously?

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Heh.  
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut




By the numbers, an Y'Vahra can reasonably reliably take out a knight in two turns, even if you can only nova charge 1 weapon.
   
Made in gb
Ship's Officer



London

MilkmanAl wrote:
When I initially asked the question, I was leaning towards Aeri's rationale and thinking that maybe both weapons get nova'd at the same time. I'm still on that side of the fence, but we'll have to wait for a FAQ to settle it for sure, I suppose.


There is only one interpretation of "a weapon". There are plenty of unclear rules in 8th and the indexes, but this isn't among them.

Let me try and explain this with an example. Meet farmer John. Farmer John has a cow. How many cows does Farmer John have?

Circle one answer:
a) 1 cow.
b) 2 cows.
c) We'll have to wait for a FAQ to settle it for sure.

See pic if you need more help.



Sorry for going off on one. Honestly the Y'Vahra is annoyingly good and is getting on my nerves a bit. The problem is that if it's not really seriously expensive it will be broken. I wish FW would write good rules to go with their models but they consistently fail to, and remain banned from many events. I don't see that changing, based on the evidence of the Y'Vahra.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/06/16 10:11:25


 
   
 
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