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We were treated to AN EARLY COPY AT OUR LOCAL STORE TODAY

SOME OF THE RUMORS ARE TRUE SOME NOT SO MUCH

tracked vehicles get screwed in moving and shooting fast moving vehicles do not suffer penalties

All you eldar players can calm down, your holo falcon lists are going to be just fine

assauting a vehicle does indeed attack rear armor ..

perils of the warp tests if you fail your psych tests you must then make a perilsof the warp test.. you roll you invo save if you make you must roll it again.. double jeapordy..

ALL SNIPER WEAPONS ARE NOW PINNING AND RENDING...Nuff said

Rending is indeed on the wound

Run.. same as rumor

thats all i can think of right now.. ill post more later

Oh and yes you have to have 2 power fist now to get the extra attack.. dont know how you will do that my space marine codex wont allow me to take a second one if i remember correctly.. or 2 thunder hammers....

Can you find out if it is only troops then that can hold objectives?

yes it is indeed troops only as scoring units

Warpaint Studio wrote:

All you eldar players can now go shut up.. your precious holo falcon lists are going to be just fine

Oh? So fast movement is still 24" and moving at speed is still an auto-glance instead of a 5+ save? Whew!

assauting a vehicle does indeed attack rear armor .. This rule sucks so bad its not funny. They will have to change that one.. im not going to allow you to attack my rear armor if you can barely reach the front its assanine or if i am backed up to the edge of the table

...because unlike normal tanks, YOUR tanks have no vew slits to throw grenades or fire bolters into, weak points on the tracks, or any number of weaknesses that this rule is meant to represent? I guess you're not going to be playing 40k Fizzith edition then?

Oh and yes you have to have 2 power fist now to get the extra attack.. dont know how you will do that my space marine codex wont allow me to take a second one if i remember correctly.. or 2 thunder hammers....its totally lame

Again, I fail to understand why this rule is SO lame....considering its the same for every powerfist in the game, not just the ones in YOUR army. I dont understand.

Ok.. no you can move your normal moving distance and fire all of your guns you now get covers saves to ignore getting shot at at all..

Warpaint Studio wrote:yes it is indeed troops only as scoring units

However, non-troops can contest objectives.

no according to the book only scoring units can control objectives so anything not scoring can not
page 90 of the new book

What i have not found yet is wether or not you can shoot through area terain thats what im looking at right now

TBH I think PKs for orks just got a boost (yay!), AV 14, meet my big power klaw. Oh sorry, AV10. But I get one less attack, so that's only 4 on the charge for a nob...at strength 8. Ouch. I'll miss 25" movement trukks though.

Warpaint Studio wrote:no according to the book only scoring units can control objectives so anything not scoring can not
page 90 of the new book

I'm not stating non-troops can control objectives. I'm stating that non-troops can stop (contest) enemy troops from securing an objective.

Non scoring troops can contest objectives. They cannot take objectives, but if they are within 3" of the objective, they contest it, and no one can claim it. This is usually stated in any of the missions with objectives.

I'm quite happy to have the book in my hands right now. Advantages of owning a store, I can take the preview book home to peruse in my few off hours.

AgeOfEgos wrote:

Warpaint Studio wrote:no according to the book only scoring units can control objectives so anything not scoring can not
page 90 of the new book

I'm not stating non-troops can control objectives. I'm stating that non-troops can stop (contest) enemy troops from securing an objective.

you are quite correct its at the bottom of the page i missed it my apologies

still trying to read and type at the same time
sorry

Warpaint Studio wrote:Ok.. no you can move your normal moving distance and fire all of your guns you now get covers saves to ignore getting shot at at all.. give me a break.. eldar will be the dominant army for a long time to come

The strength of the falcon was that it could only be glanced when moving, making it exceedingly difficult to kill when kitted. The fact that it CAN be penetrated breaks it. Its still good, but nowhere near as good.

oh its ok that your one lone guardian can barely make contact with my vehicle but yet you get to attack its weakest point?

yes it is, since a lone guardian has no way to break armour 10 when charging, (he's str 3) not unless you can use its catapult in the hth phase somehow...which i doubt.

why dont you get off your high horse and learn game mechanics before you spout off wether people think a rule is lame or not

after needing to explain that guardians cannot beat armour 10 on the charge and the intracacies if piloting a falcon, I do beleive you could benefit from a skimming of the rules yourself there chief.

why is the rule lame? because einstein you cant take 2 power fists in any codex! hows that grab you smart guy?
its a rule that doesnt exist for any army out there

so where is the big disadvantage? every army is on the same page then, right? noone is at a disadvantage since everyone is following the same rule.


...by the way, calm down.

the rules arent that bad but some of them cannot be implemented

they also show pics of dark eldar models the wytches didnt change there is a mandrake model now.. sucks.. an archon model... ok grotesques .. ehh.. warriors didnt change at all

(deleted)

When is this thing actually due out again? 12 July, isn't it? Damn, I will be out of the country. That means I will have to wait another 5 weeks to get my copy.

That just sucks.

Is there anyway to get a SLIGHTLY early copy (say, 07 July) of this thing that I can take with me? Well, anyway to do it and NOT cause a stampede of GW attornies toward anyone's door or business?

also

there are new line of sight issues whch are going to slow the game down immensely

also there are several new mods to make when calculating armor pen rolls more time.. say hello to 4 hour warhammer games at 1500 points, in my opinion.

grizgrin wrote:When is this thing actually due out again? 12 July, isn't it? Damn, I will be out of the country. That means I will have to wait another 5 weeks to get my copy.

That just sucks.

Is there anyway to get a SLIGHTLY early copy (say, 07 July) of this thing that I can take with me? Well, anyway to do it and NOT cause a stampede of GW attornies toward anyone's door or business?

you could make arrangements to have one shipped to you by any one of a number of online retailers where are you going to be?

Warpaint Studio wrote:
also there are several new mods to make when calculating armor pen rolls more time.. say hello to 4 hour warhammer games at 1500 points

*Damage table is
1. Shaken
2. Stunned
3. Weapon destroyed
4 Vehicle immobilized
5 Wrecked
6 Vehicle explodes d6 inches, Strength 3 ap- hit.
(Glancing is -2, Ap1 is +1. AP- is -1)

*Skimmer rules: Fast skimmers may move 6 inches and fire all weapons, or 12 inches and fire 1 main and all defensive weapon. Skimmers may not move and fire all weapons, or move up to 6 and fire one main and all defensive weapons.

*Fast Skimmers may move flat out i.e. 12-24, fast vehicles may move flat out 12-18, and gain a 4+ obscured cover save. There is no save for a skimmer moving less than 121 These are cover saves, so cannot be gained against template weapons, crack shot, marker lights reducing it. Etc. Works like a normal cover save. Can by fortuned.

*Smoke launchers give you a 4+ cover save for next enemy shooting phase.

*Ramming is exactly as it was in the PDF, i.e. for every 3 inches moved its +1 strength, for every armor point above 10 its +1. The book has the example of a land raider ramming an ork truck in the side. The land raider has moved 12 so inflicts strength 8 hit on the trukk. The truck only inflicts a strength 4 hit since its only armor 10, so the land raider is in no danger. Interestingly strength isn't capped here.

*Tanks are relentless in the fact that they can move 6 and still fire a rapid fire weapon up to its maximum range, or fire heavy weapons, but they are still limited by the limits on vehicles moving. For example a land raider can move up to 6 and still fire one of its weapons, i.e. lascannon, but a crusader can move and fire both hurricane bolters, As they are defensive, the pintle mounted storm bolter, again defensive, but only fire one out of the assault cannon or multimelta.

*Vehicle Squadrons - immobilized result = vehicle destroyed.

*Transports can transport any unit, not just the unit they were bought for. You can't hold a unit in reserves in the tank though unless it's a dedicated transport.

*Walkers fire 2 weapons

*Defensive weapons are S4.

*When a vehicle counts as obscured, i.e. 50% of its hull is not visible to the firer, it gets a cover save equal to the cover that’s doing the obstructing.


Changes in 5th that matter....and I don't really see any of those adding hours to the game?

Marnius Calgar.

Aduro wrote:Marnius Calgar.

Yeah, or maybe two PFs are an option in the new Marine dex. *Shrug*

taking the time to determine if indeed half or more of the vehicle is obscured how many times have you played the win at all costs guys who will argue and say its more than half when it isnt

the new effects of the rules will increase game time dramatically

thats not something to quibble over it will when you have to add and subtract additiaonl numbers on a chart that even vets dont have memorized it slows stuff down

(deleted)

Maybe the whole point WAS to make you lose an attack for taking a Power Fist, and adding in the rule about having two gives them a loophole they can use later if they want to.

Warpaint Studio wrote:Ultras nope

Actually, Ultramarines are the only army I can think of which CAN field a model with two powerfists.

As far as Falcons go, I'm pretty sure that they've been nerfed by these rules. They'll be easier to kill now. Still tough, but probably not quite so unreasonable as they have been.

Warpaint Studio wrote:taking the time to determine if indeed half or more of the vehicle is obscured how many times have you played the win at all costs guys who will argue and say its more than half when it isnt

the new effects of the rules will increase game time dramatically

thats not something to quibble over it will when you have to add and subtract additiaonl numbers on a chart that even vets dont have memorized it slows stuff down

This:

*Damage table is
1. Shaken
2. Stunned
3. Weapon destroyed
4 Vehicle immobilized
5 Wrecked
6 Vehicle explodes d6 inches, Strength 3 ap- hit.
(Glancing is -2, Ap1 is +1. AP- is -1)


Is hardly complicated and easier to remember than 2 different charts (As it is now). As far as gaming time goes, our 5th games have been about the same if not shorter than 4th. The main drag of large game 4th is mired down HTH that lasts turns and when I initially read the wound allocation I was quite worried. However, with the following changes:

*Charge units get a 6" counter assault to get as many models in base as possible before attacks are made. No 2 inch kill zone, remove casualties anywhere in the unit. All models with in 2" get to attack.

*You cannot use a consolidation move to start a new combat. However you can join one already in progress.

*When taking wounds from a combat, it is allocated exactly like shooting, and you can take guys off from anywhere in the combat, i.e. not within 2 inches, so basically unless you kill a model that was within 2 inches before dice were rolled, you can attack them.
Independent characters no longer have to be in B2B contact with the enemy to fight, just within 2 inches. This does mean the enemy within 2 of him can allocate attacks....

*Break tests are taken by the loser, with the difference he lost by subtracted from his leadership (IE Lose by 6 wounds, Leadership 10 becomes Leadership 4!)


We've found HTH to be short, bloody affairs. I think 5th is faster.

I can see the benefits of a 4+ cover save.

I can also see the benefits of the way the falcon works in 4th...which is clearly better considering the way that a falcon is most effectivly deployed...as a heavy transport for dragons or harlies.

I can assure you, eldar players that would rather have it the old way are in the majority.

.............................

as far as the power fist issue, all I'm saying is that its hardly as "lame" as you make it sound. So there's a rule out there that noone can use, that doesnt make fists lame, if you really plan on rushing out and putting 50 points in powerfists on a single model just to get an extra attack however....I dunno WHAT to say to you....considering that its a stupid buy.

Then again, I've always thought that its outright "lame" that there are no rapid fire weapons in the game that have a max range of 27 1/2 inches, but that's just me.

yes unltras have marnius i have yet to see him played in a game over the last 5 years

other than that no one can use 2 unless you were modeling it as master crafted i have a guy with 2 thunderhammers for that reason

Warpaint Studio wrote:

AgeOfEgos wrote:

Aduro wrote:Marnius Calgar.

Yeah, or maybe two PFs are an option in the new Marine dex. *Shrug*

ok and that comes out how far after?

and that changes the other marine armies how ?

what im saying is they are makign changes to the game that no one can use for several months aftre its release... i wouldnt want to pl;ay 5th edition as a space amrine until they release the new dex

with wolves sposibly comming out end of year i hope they address this there

Marines will be out in Sept, possibly Oct. That's around 60-90 days after 5th....not exactly a long time..

FYI, I would rather they just get rid of any bonus attacks when you have a PF. Hidden PFs have become weaker with allocation rules and reduction of attacks....but as a Marine player I think it was needed. Two PF is just covering a model/special character/possible strange option so they don't have to FAQ it (Probably).

Dude i play eldar along with other armies

it wont affect me that much at all.. especially since i cant be killed on a glancing shot

ill gladly take a 4+ cover save to ignore you plasma pistol on my rear armor or wherever

there are serious advantages given to the eldar in this edition

i know i have read it.. i can see the implecations of how much an advantage the skimming tanks now have over everyone else