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I have played 40k since 1998 or so. First army was Ultramarines. I have dabbled with sisters, BA's, Spacewolves, Armored column, pre codex Necrons. I always came back to Ultramarines. I have blog in P&M that has been dormant for awhile. Have a full battle company + of Ultramarines with all the bells and whistles. Metal shoulder pads, 50+ heavy weapons for all options, rhinos have all varitions of any SM tank available. Very few things I'm missing from UM line of figs.

I'm having trouble finding a reason to continue project. Ever since I saw and bought Dark Angels RW battleforce and oop Dark Angel BF. Seeing all those bits for vehicles has left me drooling . I have 3 full Ravenwing bikes squads and 30+ DW termies.

Why pay for forgeworld doors/hatches for vehicles? When they are readily available in plastic through the disgusting amount of bits you get in BF's.

I have read and like fluff behind DA's. Green is a nice color. What I wonder is this. WHat kind of changes does anyone foresee for DA's in future? Any big changes for codex? My plan is to build RW/DW and switch over my 12 UM rhinos to DA's. I also like the techmarine trick you can do with DA's

So vanilla or Dark? With the release of 5th and October's new SM codex I see a vanilla power reduction. So I continue in my struggle of how to serve the Emperor .......

Well it'd be hard to get much worse than the Dark Angels, so personally I'd wait and see. The new Marine Codex will either end up as good (bad?) as the DA one, or a bit better.

If the former happens, then you can just decide what army you like more and if you like the idea of having to bring special characters in every game to field a different force. If the latter happens, and you want a more powerful army, then pick Ultras.

BYE

I think the DA will benefit from the new set-up rules in 5th, especially the Ravenwing/Deathwing combined arms team. Foreknowledge of going first/second (barring that roll of 6) allows one to better utilize the scout move/Deathwing Assault combo move that they have.

And hell, Terminators as troops can claim objectives. Concept-wise, it doesn't seem like a bad idea, though I'm sure I'm about to get about 30 internet naysayers jump on me telling me how wrong I am because of xyz mathhammer reason.

Well I wouldn't want to do it because I find the idea of having to bring Special Characters just to use Deathwing to be utterly idiotic.

BYE

DA Deathwing is just sick. I watched this guy level a Tau army. He lost 1 terminator the entire game. And the DA fluff is really good.

Really good?

What about the last Jetbike in the Imperium? And fluff kinda falls aprt when Belial shows up to every minor skirmish that involves the Deathwing. Does he board every Hulk they attack nowerdays as well? There's lack of imagination and then there's... well... Jervis.

BYE

Either are good, DIY is better.
Options:
1. Wait until the new codex is out to make better determinations in that regards
2. Work up a DIY chapter. It could then use the DA, vanilla (when comes out), BT or even BA (only wolves can be wolves ruff).

DA rules were written with 5th in mind, so we shouldn't expect to see any new DA rules any time soon. And considering the fact that they're considered the most underpowered of the MEq armies, you've got your work cut out for you if you choose them. That being said, one of the armies I'm currently working up is a Deathraven combined arms force - if you choose DA, it is a labor of love.

If you want a more competitive army, then go vanilla marines. While they're going to be getting some nerfing with the new codex, I can't see GW ever nerfing marines so much that they'd be unplayable - that'd be bad for business. I agree with jfrazell - work up a DIY chapter (or a more obscure chapter) and use whichever ruleset comes best. For example - Space Sharks - though they're an established Chapter, you could pretty easily find ways to use vanilla, BT, or even SW rules.

Why is it that Dark Angels always are perceived as having been shafted?

I don't feel the codex is that bad. I think it's balanced.

I do feel badly that both BA and DA will be missing out on Sterngard and Vanguard Vets, and scout bikers.

Given the relative power of the newly revealed White Scar Kahn, I don't know how we non-vanillas will keep up.

Sorry, a bit off topic there...

I've been considering having my DA army use the vanilla codex for a while due to all the talk of how underpowered the DA codex is. All the rumors about the new Marine codex are only reinforcing that consideration...

jfrazell wrote:(only wolves can be wolves ruff).

nitpick incoming..

even space wolfs had succesor chapters. and who knows how far from the space wolf style they have gone. shoot, they might even have adopted the codex style army set up.. lol.. Yeah I know, it's a stretch, but hell, you can use any army and call it whatever you want and make it a successor of whatever army you choose and can change it every other day if you so choose.

No. Only wolves have the secret paw shake

Isn't there a founding chapter that has no successors? Seems like I read that sometime recently...

Old Man Ultramarine wrote:I have played 40k since 1998 or so. First army was Ultramarines. I have dabbled with sisters, BA's, Spacewolves, Armored column, pre codex Necrons. I always came back to Ultramarines. I have blog in P&M that has been dormant for awhile. Have a full battle company + of Ultramarines with all the bells and whistles. Metal shoulder pads, 50+ heavy weapons for all options, rhinos have all varitions of any SM tank available. Very few things I'm missing from UM line of figs.

I'm having trouble finding a reason to continue project. Ever since I saw and bought Dark Angels RW battleforce and oop Dark Angel BF. Seeing all those bits for vehicles has left me drooling . I have 3 full Ravenwing bikes squads and 30+ DW termies.

Why pay for forgeworld doors/hatches for vehicles? When they are readily available in plastic through the disgusting amount of bits you get in BF's.

I have read and like fluff behind DA's. Green is a nice color. What I wonder is this. WHat kind of changes does anyone foresee for DA's in future? Any big changes for codex? My plan is to build RW/DW and switch over my 12 UM rhinos to DA's. I also like the techmarine trick you can do with DA's

So vanilla or Dark? With the release of 5th and October's new SM codex I see a vanilla power reduction. So I continue in my struggle of how to serve the Emperor .......

Neither.

Legion of the Damned is the way to go. Them or the Xenos hunter marines.

jfrazell wrote:No. Only wolves have the secret paw shake

Actually, official sources list the Space Wolves as having split a second chapter off after the HH - the Wolf Brothers. They were later disbanded due to genetic instability. However, that's the only known descendant chapter. Who knows if the Wolf Brothers might have spawned others? There could be some unknown ones floating around out there...

You could always just paint them in Dark angels and use what ever rules you choose.
That's what I've been doing with my Ultramarines for years.

Just keep your models, and paint whatever you feel like painting on any given day. There's no reason to make a decision now that will last your entire life. Just go with the flow, man.

What I don't want to do is paint 2 complete armies.

When I make choice it will be a complete army with ALL options.

I, too do not understand the DA codex hate. Sure it has limitations, but it has options other codexes don't offer.

H.B.M.C. wrote:Well I wouldn't want to do it because I find the idea of having to bring Special Characters just to use Deathwing to be utterly idiotic.

BYE

So you are saying that a company that commits 25-40% of it's strength shouldn't be led by it's Master? If DW is based on 100 terminators.......

You could always do something outlandish and make an army that doesn't actually have any rules (no, I'm not talking about my LatD army).

I have a 2500 point Deathwatch army, with many conversions and lots of different Chapters making up different squads. There are Deathwatch Assault, Devastator, Tactical and even Terminators.

There are no rules for them - I could use them as any DIY chapter really - but they are just awesome to have and I don't have to worry about whether the Dark Green Space Marine rules are better or worse than the Blue Space Marine rules.

BYE

Old Man Ultramarine wrote:
So you are saying that a company that commits 25-40% of it's strength shouldn't be led by it's Master? If DW is based on 100 terminators.......

The Deathwing force that made Deathwing famous was led by a Librarian. Chaplains often lead men into battle. I mean, if the rule says 'Your commander must be in Terminator Armour' or 'You must mount your Commander on a Bike to field a Ravenwing Force', then ok... but to always have to bring a Special Character? Uhh... spare me.

BYE

I play a DIY chapter fondly/jokingly called "The Emperors Shiny Mirrors".

I have played Dark Angels since back when they were black and Dark Angels Green was Salamanders Green.

Today I have enough models to field any chapter I feel like. Black Templars today, Vanilla yesterday and Dark Angels tomorrow.
In that regard I lament the loss of Traits. I allowed me to make a lot of different and fun armies. Not all of them particular effective, crushing or tournament minded but all of them fun.

Old Man Ultramarine wrote:What I don't want to do is paint 2 complete armies.

When I make choice it will be a complete army with ALL options.

I, too do not understand the DA codex hate. Sure it has limitations, but it has options other codexes don't offer.

To each their own. I would get tired of painting everything all one color. Which explains why I have 3.5 armies, I suppose.

With Apocalypse being fairly popular.....I'd like to be able to drop full battle company.

When I play 40k I'd like to be able to look in codex and brainstorm an army list, then go to my transport case and yank out the models.

Probably going to make RW/DW with 3 preds with techmarine trick and maybe 3 Vindicator in DA green.

I recently saw a vindicator painted up with dozer blade in that yellow/black warning scheme that just says "win" is coming.