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I was talking to my friend about things of cheddar and I told him about the Nob squad that makes every model different enough to allow the controlling player to save models by moving all the wounds on all the models...

But is it worth the trouble of making all Nobs different and do they lose any power by abandoning conformity in a unit...

With Deffkoptas being more than 1 wound I wonder if you can do the same with them, effectively of course, not merely for the sake that you can...

What is the most powerful combination for a Nob squad, Deffkopta unit, and Nob Bikers that still allow for wound allocation abuse...

(it would be also be pretty cool if someone made an all Nob army that just used wound allocation as a major theme...)

Its worth it with tyranid warriors.

(it would be also be pretty lame if someone made an all Nob army that just used wound allocation as a major theme...)

fixed

QuietOrkmi wrote:(it would be also be pretty cool if someone made an all Nob army that just used wound allocation as a major theme...)

Already done mate.

A lot!

The only problem with doing it is having to waste points on extra bosspoles/ammo runts that wont be used, as well as having to sacrifice kombi-scortchas for Kombi-rokkits to make each model different.

You can only 'abuse' the complex unit wound allocation if your opponent can throw enough firepower your way.

I personally really like the way it encourages diversity in units.

An army entirely of Nobz or equivalents would be pretty cool, though you might want to include some Gretchin to play Operation: Green Shield.

Nurglitch wrote:though you might want to include some Gretchin to play Operation: Green Shield.

But seriously, dont go with grots, use Boyz. While Double the cost, they dont need Runtherds, and wont run off T1 when the enemy Coughs at them.

Wound allocation shenanigans are worthwhile if you are familiar enough with the complex unit rules so that you don't slow down the game too much or make mistakes.

I like my IG wound allocation. 9 wounds, oh I'll just keep my vox caster alive so he has Ld 9 and can regroup and contest an objective.

Personally, I think that, since wound allocation on Nob bikers is perfectly within the rules. It is not "abusive" or "shenanigans."
Now, granted, that's just my opinion... and we all know that not everyeone agrees when opinions start flinging around. : )

Keep in mind, though, that my gaming group is the "Bring the hardest list you can. If it's codex legal, it's fine" kind of group, too... and I LOVE it.

Eric

Arbalest wrote:Wound allocation shenanigans are worthwhile if you are familiar enough with the complex unit rules so that you don't slow down the game too much or make mistakes.

I feel that most people will agree as the biggest offense is how much time it can possibly suck up from gameplay, if a relatively green (pardon the pun) tries to wield it...

Can we establish for the noobs here what you guys are talking about with wound allocation abuse? When I read the rulebook, it was pretty specific about how to do it...

hehe... we had a team at a team tourney put all stealer rends on one guy in a CSM squad... there were a few guys left... melta gun, PF, and a few bolter joes.

rend on melta, armor saves on reveryone else, rend on melta, armor saves on reveryone else, rend on melta, armor saves on reveryone else........

of course that (and a few other things) got them a "Low" sportsmenship score.

If those few other things you mentioned were things like being rude, then I can understand the low sportsmanship score. But it my mind he's just using the rules to mitigate a potentially brutal attack against a squad.

Envy89 wrote:hehe... we had a team at a team tourney put all stealer rends on one guy in a CSM squad... there were a few guys left... melta gun, PF, and a few bolter joes.

rend on melta, armor saves on reveryone else, rend on melta, armor saves on reveryone else, rend on melta, armor saves on reveryone else........

of course that (and a few other things) got them a "Low" sportsmenship score.

Well i hope it was for the few other things...not using wound alocation. Really if its legal and you know how to use it (aka no time wasted) then it shouldn't negativly effect their score...seems kind of harsh is all.

all in all... i would refuse to play a game with them if they showed up at a store. ive been playing for 5-6 years now, and have only had one game more unplsent that that one....

If everyone's doing it does that make it right?

I personally don't like or do it as I feel it goes against the spirit of having a 'fun' game.

Casper wrote:

Envy89 wrote:hehe... we had a team at a team tourney put all stealer rends on one guy in a CSM squad... there were a few guys left... melta gun, PF, and a few bolter joes.

rend on melta, armor saves on reveryone else, rend on melta, armor saves on reveryone else, rend on melta, armor saves on reveryone else........

of course that (and a few other things) got them a "Low" sportsmenship score.

Well i hope it was for the few other things...not using wound alocation. Really if its legal and you know how to use it (aka no time wasted) then it shouldn't negativly effect their score...seems kind of harsh is all.

Seriously... if you're causing so many wounds that you can stack 3 rends on one model, the squad's probably not going to survive anyways, AND the owning player is sacrificing a model with important gear to give the unit that tiny, tiny chance at survival... so what's the big deal? If he was a poor sportsman in other ways I can understand... but just following the rules is not poor sportsmanship in any way at all.

In any game system there are players who prefer to play by how they think the game should be. They establish a certain set of artificial constraints on their play that aren't actually in the rules, and then they like to be passive aggressive against people who play by the actual rules.

The person "abusing" the wound rules usually paid a lot of point for the unit that lets him do it. This is at the cost of many models, in the case of Nobs on bikes, it translates into something like over 100 boys. If you think a pair of units that costs well over 100 boys should be easy to kill, well I don't know what to tell you.

In a normal situation, with a player stacking PW, or PF/PK wounds on the schmo and the rest of the unit taking normal hits, its quit possible that one guy was stuck fighting the guy with the PW, and his corpse was blocking the way! The job of red shirts is to jump on the grenade, run into the buzz-saw trap, and die horribly so the rest of the important people can have a chance.

The funniest thing is when whiny kids starts yelling about how cheesy it is to use the wound allocation system.....and completely skip the part where the rulebook tells us it is a good thing to do.

Exactly. It's just a shift in the metagame making STR 8+ weapons more important when building a list, so it's a bit of a stealth-nerf to plasma guns, but helps give missile launchers and such a place in the metagame they didn't really have before.

Wound allocation abuse in nob bikers is a bit cheesy yes but since its completely legal rules wise, I have no problem with someone doing it. You just have to prepare for it, lascannons and missile launchers will just tear through the squad if they can't pass their cover. For tau, just use railguns and pathfinders to remove the cover. A Wave Serpent full of Fire Dragons cold be just the thing

Or maybe just a 30 man ork boy mob with a nob with power klaw, I havent done the math so i dunno who would win. Youre taking 700 point super squad of near unstoppable nobs, but i can take 100 boyz and get power claws

Its cheese yes, but thats what any game is made of, you just have to send your cheese after their cheese.

Envy89 wrote:hehe... we had a team at a team tourney put all stealer rends on one guy in a CSM squad... there were a few guys left... melta gun, PF, and a few bolter joes.

rend on melta, armor saves on reveryone else, rend on melta, armor saves on reveryone else, rend on melta, armor saves on reveryone else........

of course that (and a few other things) got them a "Low" sportsmenship score.

The rulebook specifically points out that this is legal. I don't know what "other things" you're referring to, but if you give someone a low sportsmanship score for doing something that the rules explicitly say is legal then is it you who are the poor sport, not them.

Envy89 wrote:all in all... i would refuse to play a game with them if they showed up at a store. ive been playing for 5-6 years now, and have only had one game more unplsent that that one....

what part of that do you people not understand.... if they JUST abused the wound allocation, it would have been ok.... annoying, but ok.

I play Tau, and wound allocation is very needed for my crisis battle suit teams. I don't have a problem with it.

Avrik_Shasla wrote:I play Tau, and wound allocation is very needed for my crisis battle suit teams. I don't have a problem with it.

OMGZ U Iz liek a cheezy git! No1 liek yoo!

But yeah, Wound Allocation is fine. Dont forget to even do it they have to shell out points of upgrades they wont ever use or would not take in the first place.

This question answers itself.

Do I want my squad to work as effectively as possible? The answer is yes.

Is it my fault designers made this available to Ork players? No

Should you be dinged in tournements for playing this.? No

Should your opponents cry when facing the Nob bikers? Hell yes.

It's all legal, so feel free to do. It's really worth it.

I have to ask again, what is this wound allocation abuse? Page 26 of the rulebook seems pretty straightforward about how to do it.

Wound allocation works fine for 1 Wound units. It works 'good enough' for small (3 model) multi-wound units like Crisis Suits. It totally breaks down at 10 nobz and a warboss.

@tuatha1337,

Imagine 10 Nobs (2 wounds each) on bikes (T5) that have a perma-cover save and FNP. Each Nob is equiped with different gear so when it comes to wound allocation, the Nob player can put whatever he wants, where ever he wants.

Some Nobs already have a wound from last turn? No problem, they will be the last to get asigned any wounds. This makes it very hard to actually kill a Nob on a bike.

The idea is that the Lascannon guy in a 5 man combat squad is at risk of popping early if you load that squad up with wounds. Nobs take this to the extreme, and have 2 wounds each, so that none of them need to die for quite a while.

As I mention ed earlier, the ork nob biker phenomenon really just makes it more important to pack ID weapons, and to be very specific about the order that you fire weapons at the unit. If you fire lots of multi-shot-low-str weapons first, than any shots that get past the toughness and both saving throws will be allocated to individual models. If you shoot your ID-causing stuff after that, then the same wounds will get allocated to the already-wounded guys. So the key is to take lots of ID stuff, and shoot that stuff at the nobs first.

The "abusive" thing about nob bikers is not wound allocation, but the fact that they get +1 toughness, 4+ armor, and 4+ cover all from one wargear upgrade, then the painboy gives them all FNP. Regular nobs can play the "wound allocation" game just as well as nob bikers can, but you never hear complaints about them... and for good reason.

There is no such thing as "abusing" wound allocation.