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A good idea or no? Would having that ability make them extremely broken?

Obliterators are already pretty nasty, so it might just push them over into the realm of broken.

Obliterators are just fine as they are now.

Give it to them I say. Against other heavy weapon troops, they'll lose. Because they'll lose both of their wounds to MM, lascannons.
Also I'm a chaos player

They have an invun save and 2 wounds anyway, along with a wide array of weapons: giving them Eternal Warrious would just be a bad idea.

2 wounds? 1 wound with a Str 8+ Weapon and KAPOW!
Both wounds gone.

You could say that about any multi wound model with t4. Crisis suits and ork nobs don't get eternal warrior. I get that oblits are supposed to be tough, but eternal warrior is overboard.

Agreed. May as well get rid of the instant death rule entirely if you're going to start handing out eternal warrior to everyone who might be effecting.

I think eternal warrior makes them a bit too powerful

Obliterators are already one of the more overpowered units in the game. Granted, this has a lot to do with Lash of Submission being in the same army, but giving Obliterators Eternal Warrior doesn't do anything to fix that at any rate.

Lord_Mortis wrote:A good idea or no? Would having that ability make them extremely broken?

I donno if it would make them extremely broken, they are, already, somewhat overbalanced, but on the other hand they are slow and purposeful, so an army full of rhinos will not be able to move them around, they kinda stay put the whole game and if they can't shoot something, and/or lash's psychic test fails, tough luck. Since there's no way to turn them into wound buckets though, you don't need to shoot them with S8+ guns, just lots of shots will kill them (plasma, or huge masses of bolter fire)

Still, I'm leaning to no (and it doesn't make too much sense to me, edit: EW is normally an ability given to great heroes or certain demons, how does a roving mercenary in terminator armor get it?)

Our Oblits are T5 W3 Sv2+/4+(I)... but then again our Oblits are a unit that's 0-1 rather than being able to take 9 of the damned things...

H.B.M.C. wrote:Our Oblits are T5 W3 Sv2+/4+(I)... but then again our Oblits are a unit that's 0-1 rather than being able to take 9 of the damned things...

This. I mean, if they're Chaos... sorry, Renegade Techmarines, how many could there be? And why do they like hanging out with Plague Marines and Slaaneshi Daemon Princes so much?

They just need some kinky slimy love?

they used to be straight t5 in the first printing of the previous chaos codex. t5 is effectively eternal warrior for everything short of a broadside or demolisher blast and gw changed it to t4(5) because they were too powerful.

lol! Eternal warrior would just catch them up to all the other important multiwound models

But in all seriousness they have no business being an eternal warrior, nor do tyranids or daemons (at least vs force weapons)

agreed. if they want them to survive *most* instadeath weapons, make them natural t5 and cost them appropriately. so... let me get this straight, the tyrannid warrior survives a 60lb high explosive missle to the chest that chunked 80% of his body because he's got the hive mind on mental speed dial???

Cause Obliterators are not overpowered enough already? Tau Broadsides are the same amoutn of points and have either a twinlinked S10 AP 1 shot or 4 S5AP5 shots. Obliterators have over twice that amount of firepower. Both have 2 wounds. Obliterators have a 5++ on top of the 2+ armor save. They also have Slow and Purposeful which is an upgrade for Broadsides. Points-wise they are very close to each other but Obliterators are already much better than broadsides.

Orkeosaurus wrote:Obliterators are already one of the more overpowered units in the game. Granted, this has a lot to do with Lash of Submission being in the same army, but giving Obliterators Eternal Warrior doesn't do anything to fix that at any rate.

Why is this exactly? Because they have, god forbid, a template? Woe, the synergy!

Over half the units in the Chaos Codex need eternal warrior in my mind. More standard marines have EW than their Chaos counterparts, which makes no sense. I've kinda stopped taking Oblitz since they nearly always get insta-gibbed now. They're no more broken (and have fewer wounds) than having a marine heavy-weapon squad.

starbomber109 wrote:Still, I'm leaning to no (and it doesn't make too much sense to me, edit: EW is normally an ability given to great heroes or certain demons, how does a roving mercenary in terminator armor get it?)

Well, I am trying to make an apocalypse datasheet for my undead CSM where the obliterators are more "wraiths" instead of Corrupted Techmarines or whatever.

Bad idea. I think eternal warrior should be eliminated. you get hit by a big enough gun your going down.

I say making them T5, this solves the obliterating problems, but doesnt make them to overpowered. Fluff wise obliterators should be T5, they are basically living machines.

Granted they would cost more at T5, but eternal warrior isnt appropriate. Usually eternal warrior is made for HQ's and special characters.

Cannerus_The_Unbearable wrote:Why is this exactly? Because they have, god forbid, a template? Woe, the synergy!

Over half the units in the Chaos Codex need eternal warrior in my mind. More standard marines have EW than their Chaos counterparts, which makes no sense. I've kinda stopped taking Oblitz since they nearly always get insta-gibbed now. They're no more broken (and have fewer wounds) than having a marine heavy-weapon squad.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, you play dual lash and get personally offended that people don't like the power.

Dual lash + Oblits only became popular because of pure chance, and has never been one of the most powerful builds in the game, and you only use two Daemon Princes with Lash of Submission because it's fluffy or something.

(I do agree about the need of Eternal Warrior for the Chaos Champions, though, they're embarrassing at the moment. How the feth can Kharn not get it when he actually has been resurrected by Khorne?)

warboss wrote:agreed. if they want them to survive *most* instadeath weapons, make them natural t5 and cost them appropriately. so... let me get this straight, the tyrannid warrior survives a 60lb high explosive missle to the chest that chunked 80% of his body because he's got the hive mind on mental speed dial???

The most annoying thing is that in every other instance the effect described in the Tyranid codex would give Feel no Pain. Which is the exact opposite of Eternal Warrior.

Lord_Mortis wrote:

starbomber109 wrote:Still, I'm leaning to no (and it doesn't make too much sense to me, edit: EW is normally an ability given to great heroes or certain demons, how does a roving mercenary in terminator armor get it?)

Well, I am trying to make an apocalypse datasheet for my undead CSM where the obliterators are more "wraiths" instead of Corrupted Techmarines or whatever.

Hmmm, interesting idea, if your going to give them eternal warrior though, mess around with their stats, remove their armor save, and give them a 4++ or a 3++ like other ghosts/wraiths.

yea, obliterators with a 3++ and eternal warrior. that sounds REAL balanced.

oblits are already powerful. making them immune to ID (a trend that makes no sense...everything and its mother gets this "eternal warrior" bs) plugs them over the top.

am i the only chaos player that uses lots of oblits and no lash?

the joys of playing iRon warriors

i still think they should have T5, being pepepered with botler fire is somthign which happens in the fluff but doesn't even slow them.

I think T5 is better than eternal warrior

EW is handed out a bit much and whats the point of having ID if almost every multi-wound model has EW. Id rather see Typhus, C'Tan, and Lucius the ETERNAL get EW before oblits.

If oblits are so underpowered, why do people still take 6-9 of them? Because they still are the best heavy support option.

thehod wrote:EW is handed out a bit much and whats the point of having ID if almost every multi-wound model has EW. Id rather see Typhus, C'Tan, and Lucius the ETERNAL get EW before oblits.

If oblits are so underpowered, why do people still take 6-9 of them? Because they still are the best heavy support option.

QFT. EW should be reserved for certain Unique IC`s and Monstrous Creatures. Typhus, Lucius, Kharn, C`Tan and The Avatar really should have EW. Maybe when their armies get 6th Edition Codexes in 2020 .

Let me post a little of the Apocalypse Datasheet I am working on that includes Obliterators. First it is for my Undead CSM army.



I was trying to come up with some rules that would fit the background. Basically, they were a Cursed Founding chapter of Blood Angels. The Black Rage ran rampant through them, and so they heavily favored assault troops rather than heavy weapons. They were betrayed and ambushed by some Renegade Space Marines. They fled into a warp hole in order to escape, and the captain vowed vengeance. Some years later they returned from the Netherworld as Undead Revenants, with a host of ethereal creatures at their command. Think of the cursed pirates from Pirates of the Caribbean.

The selections that would be included from Codex:CSM would be as follows:

Chaos Lord, Chaos Sorceror

Terminators, Chosen, Dreadnought

Chaos Space Marines

Raptors, Bikers

Obliterators, Landraider

Lesser Demons

Special rules that would cover them are: Feel no Pain, Eternal Warrior, Fearless

Lesser Demons are included because I would use them as "ghosts."



Since according to the fluff they didn't really use Heavy Weapons or Tanks, preferring to load up in Rhinos and Land Raiders, Jump Packs, and Bikes and fling themselves full speed into the enemy, the Obliterators are included as "Gun Wraiths," ethereal creatures that came under their command once they became Revenants.



A lot of objections have been raised about them having EW because of other things that can be used with them from Codex:CSM. Now, based on the fluff here and the just the selections that can be taken per the Datasheet, would them having EW still be too much even for Apocalypse? Because these are only intended to be fielded in games of Apocalypse.