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With all this speculation about the Inquisition, do you think this will affect the Grey Knights much? I'm looking to get into Grey Knights but I'm a little unsure now..

Anyone able to give me advice either way?

I could see a Deathwatch supplement allowing different options for units without adding different units or being more of a standalone codex

dalloskid wrote:
With all this speculation about the Inquisition, do you think this will affect the Grey Knights much? I'm looking to get into Grey Knights but I'm a little unsure now..

Anyone able to give me advice either way?

According to GW: Digital Editions this basically doesn't effect the Grey Knights codex.

Ok awesome. I was worried that I would get some models and then they would not be able to be used as standalone or something strange. Thanks!

 pretre wrote:

 1hadhq wrote:
Everywhere and everyone is the same thing?
Am pretty sure you don't get digital publications in a brick and mortar store. Excludes the FLGS from these releases.

You also don't get the entire line of direct-only products at a FLGS. So I guess we have three product lines: Stuff available in FLGS, Direct-Only and Digital.

Now we are getting closer to the point: Less sales through FLGS is GW's idea of more profit.

 ClockworkZion wrote:

dalloskid wrote:
With all this speculation about the Inquisition, do you think this will affect the Grey Knights much? I'm looking to get into Grey Knights but I'm a little unsure now..
Anyone able to give me advice either way?

According to GW: Digital Editions this basically doesn't effect the Grey Knights codex.

Keep in mind that GW Digital Editions just skrewed all people that bought the WD Codex Sororitas just two year ago.

 Kroothawk wrote:

 pretre wrote:

 1hadhq wrote:
Everywhere and everyone is the same thing?
Am pretty sure you don't get digital publications in a brick and mortar store. Excludes the FLGS from these releases.

You also don't get the entire line of direct-only products at a FLGS. So I guess we have three product lines: Stuff available in FLGS, Direct-Only and Digital.

Now we are getting closer to the point: Less sales through FLGS is GW's idea of more profit.

Not to nit-pick, but that's exactly what it is. We might not agree with that idea, but it is pretty simple:

Sale through FLGS = Retail Price of Item - Discount for FLGS
Sale through GW direct = Retail Price of Item

By definition, that's more profit for GW.

Of course, there are other things involved but more money for the same item, that's everyone's idea of more profit.

What I would REALLY like is for there to be other units in the Codex, rather than just an Inquisitor and their retinue. I own 40 Adeptus Arbites miniatures. I was able to use them in the old Witchhunters codex, but now I have to use Veteran Guardsmen...which means that I cannot use the Riot Shield and Shock Maul guys, or Inquisitorial Henchmen...but that is still not accurate, and I have to take Coteaz...there is no such thing as a Psi-marshall in Artificer Armor...with a Deamon Hammer...

Come on GW...throw us a bone! Let us take Inquisitorial Storm Troopers and Arbites again! Please!!!

 CaptainLoken wrote:
What I would REALLY like is for there to be other units in the Codex, rather than just an Inquisitor and their retinue. I own 40 Adeptus Arbites miniatures. I was able to use them in the old Witchhunters codex, but now I have to use Veteran Guardsmen...which means that I cannot use the Riot Shield and Shock Maul guys, or Inquisitorial Henchmen...but that is still not accurate, and I have to take Coteaz...there is no such thing as a Psi-marshall in Artificer Armor...with a Deamon Hammer...

Come on GW...throw us a bone! Let us take Inquisitorial Storm Troopers and Arbites again! Please!!!

Arbites weren't technically even in the Witchhunters book (ISTs with Shotguns note at the bottom is about it) and there was certainly no unit for Riot Shield/Shock Maul.

Nowadays, you can use henchmen squads to do mixed Arbites using C:GK (Crusaders for Shockmaul/Shield, Arco-flagellants for attack dogs, Warriors for standard dudes in Carapace). I imagine you'll be able to do much the same with Codex: Inquisition. At least now though, you won't have to take Coteaz.

 pretre wrote:
Not to nit-pick, but that's exactly what it is. We might not agree with that idea, but it is pretty simple:

Sale through FLGS = Retail Price of Item - Discount for FLGS
Sale through GW direct = Retail Price of Item

By definition, that's more profit for GW.

Of course, there are other things involved but more money for the same item, that's everyone's idea of more profit.

May I remind you of the White Wolf story:
White Wolf was famous for doing the Vampire The Masquerade roleplay game, with rules also supporting a huge Live Action RPG community. They then revised the background so that the LARP community wasn't supported anymore. They then had the gloriuos idea that they could make even more profit by stopping sales through FLGS and make every book a digital download (with optional print on demand version). Noone has ever heard from this company and the game again, even while the website is still alive.

GW might profit from the 40k scene not dying quick enough without support, but it will. First in non-Englsh speaking countries of course.
Total profit is profit per product times products sold. GW sells less products every year for 8 years. They are now in a state where doubling prices just keeps revenue flat. That strategy killed Hobbit sales from the start: Double profit marge but still no profit. Limited Edition starter box still available after 11 months.

 Kroothawk wrote:
Keep in mind that GW Digital Editions just skrewed all people that bought the WD Codex Sororitas just two year ago.

Do you mean the WD Codex: Sisters of Battle that was OOP for 2 years? How is that mean we got screwed?

Also don't blame Digital Editions, they're just the face that handles the issues and sells them, it's GW who makes the things they sell.

EDIT: Where was the price doubling this year Kroot? And why aren't we considering the price increases have to do with demand exceeding supply thus leading to the increase to control supply because they can't just wave a wand and increase production?

It's like we're trying to ignore other possibilities to vilify a company again.

 Kroothawk wrote:
May I remind you of the White Wolf story:
White Wolf was famous for doing the Vampire The Masquerade roleplay game, with rules also supporting a huge Live Action RPG community. They then revised the background so that the LARP community wasn't supported anymore. They then had the gloriuos idea that they could make even more profit by stopping sales through FLGS and make every book a digital download (with optional print on demand version). Noone has ever heard from this company and the game again, even while the website is still alive.

As I said, there's some differences, but, by definition, they make more profit selling directly than indirectly. They also have higher overhead, etc so on.

White Wolf is a completely different beast and doesn't have retail stores, a distribution chain, etc. (Also, White Wolf is part of CCP right now so is probably focusing on their MMO.)





Automatically Appended Next Post:

 ClockworkZion wrote:

 Kroothawk wrote:
Keep in mind that GW Digital Editions just skrewed all people that bought the WD Codex Sororitas just two year ago.

Do you mean the WD Codex: Sisters of Battle that was OOP for 2 years? How is that mean we got screwed?

Yeah, we totally got screwed by getting an army update with new rules, fluff, artwork, etc.

Those bastards!

 Kroothawk wrote:
Keep in mind that GW Digital Editions just skrewed all people that bought the WD Codex Sororitas just two year ago.

They've "screwed" us by updating our rules, making the codex buyable and giving us a stronger codex?

And no, it doesn't at all matter that it is Digital only. You can print a copy out, which BL specifically allows for.

ClockworkZion wrote:Where was the price doubling this year Kroot?

All Hobbit boxes cost double than comparable existing LOTR ones.
All Codices and armybooks cost double than their previous edition at release.
All Elite boxes make Goldswords look cheap.
All new flyers now cost double DE flyer price, for the same number of sprues.
All collossal walkers cost 30% more than the one from last month.
Single plastic Space Marine for 30$ (Librarian).

pretre wrote:Yeah, we totally got screwed by getting an army update with new rules, fluff, artwork, etc.
Those bastards!

... and all those new miniatures ... wait!
BTW you can't fool me: I have seen the digital Codex: Pretending that it includes new background is an insult to all veteran players.

 Kroothawk wrote:
... and all those new miniatures ... wait!

They can't just make SoB minis on a whim. They've had modelling issues to deal with, and now a whole army's models to redo.

Tell me, is it better to have no minis and outdated, unobtainable rules or no minis and updated, obtainable rules?

 Kroothawk wrote:
BTW you can't fool me: I have seen the digital Codex: Pretending that it includes new background is an insult to all veteran players.

A lot is recycled, but there is new stuff in there, which many SoB players liked.

 Kroothawk wrote:

ClockworkZion wrote:Where was the price doubling this year Kroot?

All Hobbit boxes cost double than comparable existing LOTR ones.
All Codices and armybooks cost double than their previous edition at release.

That's not 'doubling this year' that's doubling since the last release which was, wait for it, not last year.

All Elite boxes make Goldswords look cheap.
All collossal walkers cost 30% more than the one from last month.
Single plastic Space Marine for 30$ (Librarian).

Which of these are double?

All new flyers now cost double DE flyer price, for the same number of sprues.

So the DE flyer is twice what it cost before? Oh wait, no different models are twice what the DE flyer cost. So where is the price doubling again?

... and all those new miniatures ... wait!

Move goalposts much?

BTW you can't fool me: I have seen the digital Codex: Pretending that it includes new background is an insult to all veteran players.

Or the truth, either way.

Also, shouldn't you be managing your sanctioned GW complaint thread rather than trolling us?

This just in from Facebook:

The codex is primarily designed to be included as allies, but you will be able to take a primary detachment if you like.
there aren't any Space Marines in the book, so no Deathwatch (but we've certainly got our eye on them for their own digital something in the future).

- Eddie

Lots of relevant info here guys!

 ultimentra wrote:
This just in from Facebook:

The codex is primarily designed to be included as allies, but you will be able to take a primary detachment if you like.
there aren't any Space Marines in the book, so no Deathwatch (but we've certainly got our eye on them for their own digital something in the future).

- Eddie

Lots of relevant info here guys!

This goes completely against the "Sisters/Inquisition/Red Hunters" info we were going on earlier.

How would one take them as a primary detachment, I wonder? I'm guessing that retinue units can be troops and such?

 Eldarain wrote:

 ultimentra wrote:
This just in from Facebook:

The codex is primarily designed to be included as allies, but you will be able to take a primary detachment if you like.
there aren't any Space Marines in the book, so no Deathwatch (but we've certainly got our eye on them for their own digital something in the future).

- Eddie

Lots of relevant info here guys!

This goes completely against the "Sisters/Inquisition/Red Hunters" info we were going on earlier.

Well against what we're expecting them to do. It still doesn't mean there can't be other rules in there we don't know about yet. Either way I remain hopeful that this will be something interesting that pairs well with my Sisters.

 Kroothawk wrote:
May I remind you of the White Wolf story:
White Wolf was famous for doing the Vampire The Masquerade roleplay game, with rules also supporting a huge Live Action RPG community. They then revised the background so that the LARP community wasn't supported anymore. They then had the gloriuos idea that they could make even more profit by stopping sales through FLGS and make every book a digital download (with optional print on demand version). Noone has ever heard from this company and the game again, even while the website is still alive..

Sorry, friend, but this is rubbish. Does the name Exalted ring any bells? Vampire: The Requiem? Hunter: The Vigil? No? Anyone? Bueller? White Wolf still publishes games, contrary to your fantasy.

 Agamemnon2 wrote:

 Kroothawk wrote:
May I remind you of the White Wolf story:
White Wolf was famous for doing the Vampire The Masquerade roleplay game, with rules also supporting a huge Live Action RPG community. They then revised the background so that the LARP community wasn't supported anymore. They then had the gloriuos idea that they could make even more profit by stopping sales through FLGS and make every book a digital download (with optional print on demand version). Noone has ever heard from this company and the game again, even while the website is still alive..

Sorry, friend, but this is rubbish. Does the name Exalted ring any bells? Vampire: The Requiem? Hunter: The Vigil? No? Anyone? Bueller? White Wolf still publishes games, contrary to your fantasy.

And oddly enough, sales actually grew with the Digital Download system and it allowed them to easily produce and update rules as a result. They even managed to revive the Vampire the Masquerade series after going on so long with the New World of Darkness thanks to the money they both saved from printing costs and with all the new fans they've gained as a result.

In 2011, White Wolf announced a 20th anniversary edition of Vampire: The Masquerade, and started making Old World of Darkness gamebooks available via print on demand. At that year's Gen Con, they announced they would now be releasing new books for both old and new Worlds of Darkness with the Onyx Path imprint. In late 2011 they began development of the 20th anniversary edition of Werewolf: The Apocalypse.

I have no clue what fantasy he's under though to think they are dead, they are even working on the next edition of Exalted right now.

http://avatarcomic.net/ExaltedWiki/mediawiki-1.19.1/index.php?title=Exalted_3E:_What_We_Know

In 2012, Rich Thomas, White Wolf's Creative Director, announced he'd created a new company, Onyx Path Publishing, which had licensed the old World of Darkness, the new World of Darkness, and Exalted from WW/CCP, bought Scion and Trinity Universe from them outright, and was planning to publish their own games.

 ZebioLizard2 wrote:
I have no clue what fantasy he's under though to think they are dead, they are even working on the next edition of Exalted right now.

http://avatarcomic.net/ExaltedWiki/mediawiki-1.19.1/index.php?title=Exalted_3E:_What_We_Know

My guess that these changes werent taken so positively in Germany and that the local scene there has dried up.

The areas I know about in Australia mainly dried up not through lack of LARP but more the changes to the new editions and the changes there.

 Vain wrote:

 ZebioLizard2 wrote:
I have no clue what fantasy he's under though to think they are dead, they are even working on the next edition of Exalted right now.

http://avatarcomic.net/ExaltedWiki/mediawiki-1.19.1/index.php?title=Exalted_3E:_What_We_Know

My guess that these changes werent taken so positively in Germany and that the local scene there has dried up.

The areas I know about in Australia mainly dried up not through lack of LARP but more the changes to the new editions and the changes there.

Here world of darkness series still kick ass (both old and new). But let's talk about the =I= please?

 Kroothawk wrote:

 pretre wrote:

 1hadhq wrote:
Everywhere and everyone is the same thing?
Am pretty sure you don't get digital publications in a brick and mortar store. Excludes the FLGS from these releases.

You also don't get the entire line of direct-only products at a FLGS. So I guess we have three product lines: Stuff available in FLGS, Direct-Only and Digital.

Now we are getting closer to the point: Less sales through FLGS is GW's idea of more profit.

How dare games workshop do the same thing as every other publishing house in the world in offering digital only books! I mean it's almost like they are embracing the future of publishing, but this can't be the case as GW are the evils and hate technology and refuse to change.

And I hardly call updating a two year old WD codex as screwing people over. If it was a reprint of the WD codex you would be complaining about them not updating anything.

Seriously, the blind anger at everything GW do is getting old. There is stuff to criticism, but not everything. Look at the GW digital FB page this came from. They are talking to customers. They are giving previews. Stuff is changing, but some people are just to angry to see it.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Troike wrote:
How would one take them as a primary detachment, I wonder? I'm guessing that retinue units can be troops and such?

I suspect they will be mostly HQ with options to use subbed in to other codexes, possibly with some troops to fill the troops slot on an allies to give you access to some tasty SM/GK/SoB/Guard elites fast attack or heavy options as allies. I suspect we are going to see something that has some options in it but works more like a supplement than a main codex.

 Eldarain wrote:

 ultimentra wrote:
This just in from Facebook:

The codex is primarily designed to be included as allies, but you will be able to take a primary detachment if you like.
there aren't any Space Marines in the book, so no Deathwatch (but we've certainly got our eye on them for their own digital something in the future).

- Eddie

Lots of relevant info here guys!

This goes completely against the "Sisters/Inquisition/Red Hunters" info we were going on earlier.

As long as they don't explicitly say there is not an option to replace a HQ choice with/ add an Inquisitor to one of the aforementioned armies, it doesn't change anything... All it says is that they are primarily designed to be allies, which is what at least I expected.

Rostere wrote:

 Eldarain wrote:

 ultimentra wrote:
This just in from Facebook:

The codex is primarily designed to be included as allies, but you will be able to take a primary detachment if you like.
there aren't any Space Marines in the book, so no Deathwatch (but we've certainly got our eye on them for their own digital something in the future).

- Eddie

Lots of relevant info here guys!

This goes completely against the "Sisters/Inquisition/Red Hunters" info we were going on earlier.

As long as they don't explicitly say there is not an option to replace a HQ choice with/ add an Inquisitor to one of the aforementioned armies, it doesn't change anything... All it says is that they are primarily designed to be allies, which is what at least I expected.

Yes, but the point of the Red Hunter rule was that it implied you could ally Sisters to Marines as Battle Brothers is one force had an Inquisitor in it, but if the Inquisition stuff uses the normal Allies rules then that makes no sense since you can only ally two forces together not three.

I think we'll be seeing Inquisitors as the HQ choices for a lot of Imperial Armies, as they won't take up the Allies slot to get access to them.

From how the FW SM Chapter Tactics for the Red Hunters is worded, you could Take SoB, an Inquisitor, AND then allie in some SM.

 Cortez667 wrote:
I think we'll be seeing Inquisitors as the HQ choices for a lot of Imperial Armies, as they won't take up the Allies slot to get access to them.

OR Inquisitor will be able to take Sisters of Battle squad as troops in their Inquisition detachment.

Why have Sisters as troops in the Inquisition codex when the Inquisition codex is meant to ally to the Sisters, and can ally them in anyway? Seems a bit redundant.

I'm guessing that the troops will just be retinue members. Basically Corteaz's ability army-wide. Maybe Inquisitorial Stormtroopers, since all of the Ordos have those, IIRC.

 Yodhrin wrote:

Rostere wrote:

 Eldarain wrote:

 ultimentra wrote:
This just in from Facebook:

The codex is primarily designed to be included as allies, but you will be able to take a primary detachment if you like.
there aren't any Space Marines in the book, so no Deathwatch (but we've certainly got our eye on them for their own digital something in the future).

- Eddie

Lots of relevant info here guys!

This goes completely against the "Sisters/Inquisition/Red Hunters" info we were going on earlier.

As long as they don't explicitly say there is not an option to replace a HQ choice with/ add an Inquisitor to one of the aforementioned armies, it doesn't change anything... All it says is that they are primarily designed to be allies, which is what at least I expected.

Yes, but the point of the Red Hunter rule was that it implied you could ally Sisters to Marines as Battle Brothers is one force had an Inquisitor in it, but if the Inquisition stuff uses the normal Allies rules then that makes no sense since you can only ally two forces together not three.

No, these are three separate but compatible notions:

1. An Inquisition army can be fielded as a main contingent (but since the unit choices are few, this is not to recommend)
2. An Inquisitor can be chosen as a HQ choice in any Imperial army, replacing a HQ slot in the main contingent
3. An Inquisition army can be fielded as an allied contingent

GW staff has said that the new codex is primarily designed for role number 3, but can also fulfil number 1. But unless they directly deny option 2 - which is very much alluded to by the SoB and Red Hunters rules - we cannot exclude it.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
The likely unit choices will probably be:

HQ: Inquisitors of the various Ordos
Elites: Assassins
Troops: ISTs and Henchmen
Fast Attack: Inquisitorial Valkyries
Heavy Support: Orbital Strike, maybe but unlikely an Inquisitorial Land Raider

Dedicated transports: Inquisitorial Chimeras and maybe but unlikely Inquisitorial Rhinos

If the codex features anything else, I would be surprised. On the other hand, I fully expect to see new interesting Warlord Traits and new wargear, possibly even quite a few changes to the Henchmen unit.