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Made in at
Pyromaniac Hellhound Pilot





Crossfire's a cute way of making GSC more than just go-melee-or-go-home. I imagine it'll mostly come down to shooting with Neophytes so your Ridgerunners can do their job, maybe with the Alphus automatically applying a token or whatever.

Those Custodes rules though. Yikes.

 Galas wrote:
 Arbitrator wrote:
Sunny Side Up wrote:
The idea of a company being able to generate the demand for a product simply by producing/selling it is ludicrous.

If that were the case, no product or product line and ultimately no company would ever fail. We'd all be drinking New-Coke, drive Delorians and watch Apple TV all day.

GW cannot dictate what people buy or don't buy. They have to make guesses and weigh the risks/rewards for investing X amount of money into Product Y like every company ever, from the one-guy-in-mom's-basement operation to General Motors, Microsoft & co.

Worked for AoS didn't it?

GW's fanbase can't really be viewed the same way a normal company's would be. If GW want to market, push and shift something onto their fanbase, then eventually something just clicks into place and it happens. Sure, they'd never hit Marine sales - Sigmarines are a testament to that - but generally if GW show their intention to support something longterm, they seem to do extremely well out of something no matter what.



No it didn't, AoS at launch was a massive failure and the worst and best example of GW thinking themselves too good to fail and "Our customers will buy whatever we put out".

Except it eventually did. They slapped some points on their barely-existent ruleset and it sprung up to the second most popular tabletop game after 40k before 2e was even a thing.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2021/12/02 17:31:40


 
   
Made in gb
Veteran Knight Baron in a Crusader





So they did have to offer something people actually want to buy, instead of just overturning bins full of product at a local point of congregation and telling people to form an orderly queue, is what your saying.
   
Made in us
Da Head Honcho Boss Grot




New Jersey, State of Perfection

 Grimskul wrote:
 Asmodai wrote:
 the_scotsman wrote:
I really, really love the fact that this sentence:

"Sorry, but you can't fall back with that unit because I have declared the tertiary kaptaris ka'tah stance 2, having already declared the secondary dacatarai ka'tah last turn"

has real meaning in the game warhammer 40,000. Absolute dadaist brilliance. Phenomenal. I watched my friend defend his doctoral thesis in theoretical particle physics yesterday and there were not just one but multiple sentences more comprehensible to me than the rules for this game i've played for over 15 years.


But wait, there's more! https://www.warhammer-community.com/2021/12/02/powerful-new-shield-host-rules-cement-the-adeptus-custodes-as-the-true-elites-of-humanity/

"Sorry, but you can't fall back with that unit because I have declared the tertiary kaptaris ka'tah stance 2, having already declared the secondary dacatarai ka'tah last turn, I'm allowed to do this despite declaring the primary kaptaris ka'tah stance 1 the turn before that because kapataris is the martial ka'tah of my Shield Host, having chosen to forgo Magna Imperator."


I am very happy that I chose not to give into the temptation of starting a Custodes side army now. My god what is that word gumbo.

I also like how they already have a typo where the relic spear hits at strength 2, not Strength PLUS two.


I am convinced that the lead designer on Necrons, AdMech and Custodes was the same person. This game does not need and should not have factions which have special rules that change every fething turn. Its confusing enough as it is without throwing that hand grenade of a design feature into the mix.

At the very least, this gak should be like "here is a menu of options you can apply to your army each turn, you pick one each command phase, have fun" without all these requirements and stipulations that you can't select the same one more than once or in back to back turns or if you pick from a different option then you can't go back and use the sub-option from the one you used previously, etc. Theres far too much gak to remember which isn't directly tied to board state - its really piss poor game design.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
The GSC Crossfire/Exposed rule is pretty neat, agree that it makes more sense/should be core rules that everyone plays with rather than rules for one specific faction. I understand the angle they are going for with giving it to GSC, but thats the sort of maneuver warfare doctrine that you would expect trained and drilled military forces to leverage rather than something you would expect from ragtag rebels.

This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2021/12/02 18:19:01


This ain't no pansy GW Armor, son - Digital Sculpting Plog, Now with Heavy Weapon Platforms!
Sympathy for the Devil, or: The Project Log from Hell

Ma55ter_fett wrote:It reads like the ramblings of a Nigerian lobotomized Shakespeare typed into a cellphone with a very aggressive autocomplete function.
 
   
Made in us
Ancient Venerable Dark Angels Dreadnought





Whoever decided upon the Necron, Custodes, Admech rules must be thinking the game has about 10-15 models on the table like a skirmish. No reason whatsoever that so much detail and bloat should be added to a tabletop wargame of this scale.
   
Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut





Seen elsewhere:

Ka’tah’s are wordy but pretty straightforward:

1) You pick 3 of them after deployment and order them 1st, 2nd, and 3rd.
2) In your first command phase, you activate one of the choices from your 1st. 1a or 1b.
3) In your next command phase, you can either pick the other option from your first or go to 2 and pick 2a or 2b. If you go to 2 you can never go back to 1.
4) In your next command phase you can pick the other 2 or go to 3 just like in the last step.

Once you’re at 3, you only have the two options left. You can run out early. There may be a strat to manipulate ka’tahs like doctrines but I’m doubtful.

The only modifier to this is that every shield host will have a preferred ka’tah. While that one is active, you don’t pick a or b, you get both once per game.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2021/12/02 19:11:14


   
Made in us
Tunneling Trygon




Mexico

 bullyboy wrote:
Whoever decided upon the Necron, Custodes, Admech rules must be thinking the game has about 10-15 models on the table like a skirmish. No reason whatsoever that so much detail and bloat should be added to a tabletop wargame of this scale.

To be fair to Custodes, they usually only have 20-30 models on the table, being the third most elite army after both flavors of Knights.

This message was edited 4 times. Last update was at 2021/12/02 19:20:50


 
   
Made in gb
Regular Dakkanaut




 Tyran wrote:
 bullyboy wrote:
Whoever decided upon the Necron, Custodes, Admech rules must be thinking the game has about 10-15 models on the table like a skirmish. No reason whatsoever that so much detail and bloat should be added to a tabletop wargame of this scale.

To be fair to Custodes, they usually only have 20-30 models on the table, being the third most elite army after both flavors of Knights.


and let's be real, the Necron Command Protocols might as well not exist.

Though I agree with the point that they are just unnecessary complexity.
   
Made in gb
Regular Dakkanaut




Does any necron player even bother with command protocols? I think I've used them like once.
   
Made in pl
Longtime Dakkanaut





It could have been so much simpler and fluffier: "Before game, assign each of your units kata of your choice. That unit can use one of two benefits once per game. If your shield host likes that kata, it can be used twice, but different benefit each time". There, done.

Also, I like GSC nonsense. That terminator, that walked through hundreds of las shots without anything more serious than slightly burned paint on his plate? Now hides in corner huddling his head in his power fist refusing to fight because he was hit five times with a thrown rock. Or that warlord titan next to him? It can suddenly be blown up with S3 hand flamers as they disproportionately benefit with +1 to wound roll. Necromunda bit makers knew what they were doing, it's new melta

Another funny thing - you can be exposed if you are hit five times even if these hits do nothing, but you aren't exposed if these shots will kill half of your unit and you strategically remove models in a way that stops GSC player from drawing a line. Apparently guns cease to be scary if they are really effective at killing your buddies
   
Made in us
Da Head Honcho Boss Grot




New Jersey, State of Perfection

 Daedalus81 wrote:
Seen elsewhere:

Ka’tah’s are wordy but pretty straightforward:

1) You pick 3 of them after deployment and order them 1st, 2nd, and 3rd.
2) In your first command phase, you activate one of the choices from your 1st. 1a or 1b.
3) In your next command phase, you can either pick the other option from your first or go to 2 and pick 2a or 2b. If you go to 2 you can never go back to 1.
4) In your next command phase you can pick the other 2 or go to 3 just like in the last step.

Once you’re at 3, you only have the two options left. You can run out early. There may be a strat to manipulate ka’tahs like doctrines but I’m doubtful.

The only modifier to this is that every shield host will have a preferred ka’tah. While that one is active, you don’t pick a or b, you get both once per game.


Thats not straightforward at all. We all get how the rule works, the issue is not one of people not understanding the rules or how they work, the issue is one of the mental overhead and bookkeeping required to actually use the rule. You gotta pick your 3 katas - each of which provides you with 2 separate and distinct rules - then you gotta know which 2 katas are linked to eachother and figure out when to use them, you have to remember which ones you have already used, etc. Its a ton of overhead and bookkeeping that isn't actually built into actual gameplay with any sort of dashboard or system to track any of that. The designers put that on you as the player to create your own tokens/system for tracking that, and while printing out a sheet with all this stuff written up on it and just crossing stuff out as needed is easy enough, its still an unnecessary burden to actually have to reference back to that as you play to put it into use.

It could have been so much simpler and fluffier: "Before game, assign each of your units kata of your choice. That unit can use one of two benefits once per game. If your shield host likes that kata, it can be used twice, but different benefit each time". There, done.


Thats not really simpler, now you would have to track a separate kata for every unit in your army which is arguably even more confusing. The simplest way of doing it would be to just give you a list of abilities to choose from and say "choose 1 to apply to your entire army each command phase". Done. No need for "can only use it once unless its your special thing then you get to use it twice" and all the tracking that comes with it, no need to track each unit individually, etc. Its just a bonus that you can implement each turn to give you that extra edge you might need.

This ain't no pansy GW Armor, son - Digital Sculpting Plog, Now with Heavy Weapon Platforms!
Sympathy for the Devil, or: The Project Log from Hell

Ma55ter_fett wrote:It reads like the ramblings of a Nigerian lobotomized Shakespeare typed into a cellphone with a very aggressive autocomplete function.
 
   
Made in nl
Longtime Dakkanaut





 Daedalus81 wrote:
Seen elsewhere:

Ka’tah’s are wordy but pretty straightforward:

1) You pick 3 of them after deployment and order them 1st, 2nd, and 3rd.
2) In your first command phase, you activate one of the choices from your 1st. 1a or 1b.
3) In your next command phase, you can either pick the other option from your first or go to 2 and pick 2a or 2b. If you go to 2 you can never go back to 1.
4) In your next command phase you can pick the other 2 or go to 3 just like in the last step.

Once you’re at 3, you only have the two options left. You can run out early. There may be a strat to manipulate ka’tahs like doctrines but I’m doubtful.

The only modifier to this is that every shield host will have a preferred ka’tah. While that one is active, you don’t pick a or b, you get both once per game.
except that with your prefered kata you still have to pick a or b, and then you chose if you want both, regardless of if you already did the other one.

so assuming kata 2 is your preferred you can go '2a, next turn 2b + a' or '2a +b, next turn 2b'
   
Made in us
Daemonic Dreadnought




The dark hollows of Kentucky

 The Phazer wrote:
Yeah, interesting, but it's odd to add such a mechanic to just a single faction really. It almost feels more Tau ish.

I wouldn't be surprised to see Tau and the Guard get similar rules. This definitely sounds how multiple squads of Guardsmen should work together.
   
Made in us
Hurr! Ogryn Bone 'Ead!






Crossfire and Exposed are neat, but it kind of feels like they should be basic rules of the game, not some specialist rule for a single faction. Also not quite sure why exposed has a 12" limit on it, I'd imagine lighting up a heavy unit like a christmas tree would give the lascannon operator farther back, or a sharpshooter an easier shot. I mean, the game is lethal enough as it is so limitations on how this can be used is probably a good thing.

Still just odd to me why this isn't core rule level stuff, and comes with some sort of suppression mechanic as the target unit hunkers down to avoid needless casualties.
   
Made in au
Owns Whole Set of Skullz Techpriests






Versteckt in den Schatten deines Geistes.

 Asmodai wrote:
"Sorry, but you can't fall back with that unit because I have declared the tertiary kaptaris ka'tah stance 2, having already declared the secondary dacatarai ka'tah last turn, I'm allowed to do this despite declaring the primary kaptaris ka'tah stance 1 the turn before that because kapataris is the martial ka'tah of my Shield Host, having chosen to forgo Magna Imperator."
Are... are you having a stroke?

Industrial Insanity - My Terrain Blog
"GW really needs to understand 'Less is more' when it comes to AoS." - Wha-Mu-077

 
   
Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut





Tampa,FL USA

 kurhanik wrote:
Crossfire and Exposed are neat, but it kind of feels like they should be basic rules of the game


I said the exact same thing to my group the moment I saw them.

You know you're really doing something when you can make strangers hate you over the Internet. - Mauleed
Just remember folks. Panic. Panic all the time. It's the only way to survive, other than just being mindful, of course-but geez, that's so friggin' boring. - Aegis Grimm
Hallowed is the All Pie
The Before Times: A Place That Celebrates The World That Was 
   
Made in gb
Tunneling Trygon






 Platuan4th wrote:
 kurhanik wrote:
Crossfire and Exposed are neat, but it kind of feels like they should be basic rules of the game


I said the exact same thing to my group the moment I saw them.


Tyranids were the first faction to get Objective Secured before it was rolled into the main game. Maybe GSC are the test bed for this rule being in 10th?
   
Made in fi
5th God of Chaos (O'rly?)





 Ordana wrote:
Rihgu wrote:
Is the Custodes stuff not nearly identical to the Necron stuff in how it operates?

Before the game, set 3 kata which have 2 abilities each. Each subfaction lets you use both kata abilities at once for one set of kata.
its a little more freedom then Necrons since your only forced to move on to the next kata after having used both options of the previous. So you can stall for time and go 1a-1b-2a-2b-3a or if you need your 2nd kata in turn 2 you can go 1a-2a-2b-3a-3b.


And the subfaction one you can use better bonus 2 turns in row.

2022 painted/bought: 38/38 
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut





 kurhanik wrote:
Crossfire and Exposed are neat, but it kind of feels like they should be basic rules of the game, not some specialist rule for a single faction. Also not quite sure why exposed has a 12" limit on it, I'd imagine lighting up a heavy unit like a christmas tree would give the lascannon operator farther back, or a sharpshooter an easier shot. I mean, the game is lethal enough as it is so limitations on how this can be used is probably a good thing.

Still just odd to me why this isn't core rule level stuff, and comes with some sort of suppression mechanic as the target unit hunkers down to avoid needless casualties.


Maybe this will get implemented for all the BS4 armies?
   
Made in us
Stealthy Warhound Titan Princeps





United States

 Geifer wrote:
 Togusa wrote:
Spoiler:
 Grimskul wrote:
 the_scotsman wrote:


GOOD fething lord no are you kidding man, GW would have to make a new sculpt for sisters of silence!!!

AND THEY SHALL KNOW. ONE. SPRUEEEE!


It is really funny that GW has like an endless supply of primaris lieutenants sculpts in their closet or something but they can't be bothered with one official clampack HQ model for SoS.


It's economics. How many people would really buy such a model? Given I have NEVER seen SoS on the tabletop, outside of promotional pictures and stuff like that, I have a hard time believing anyone even uses these models in the Custodes book. I doubt that's going to change. SoS seems like the most useless thing when we have SoB already. IMO.


Aside from being women in power armor, there's no overlap between Sisters of Silence and Sisters of Battle. Sisters of Battle are a complete, functional army with all that entails, that lacks the one thing Sisters of Silence exist to provide: dedicated psychic defense. Sisters of Silence have a completely different function to a squad of Sisters of Battle. Lorewise, they're also as far apart as you can be.

Sisters of Silence came out as plastic models before Sisters of Battle received theirs, and primarily for Horus Heresy with 40k rules as a bonus. They, like Custodes at the time, were a single squad meant to be allied into an Imperial army. When GW finally got around to making Codex Adeptus Custodes, rather than Codex Talons of the Emperor, Custodes were elevated to a full army and instead of integrating Sisters of Silence as a specialist unit in that army as they should have, GW instead left them orphaned as one of those units that technically exist, but that simply don't get to appear in a mainline codex. Much like Inquisition, really. That means less exposure for Sisters of Silence and less reason to take them. Even less so after GW shifted their rules design away from merry souping to powerful mono-faction bonuses. Sisters of Silence have to be integrated into the Custodes codex, which, again, is where they belonged in the first place, if they are to stand any chance of being taken in their own army lest they break the weak kung fu GW is adding to the new codex.

And with being a full part of the army, finally, you have to ask the question whether they should have an HQ character to go with them. GW asked that question and found the answer to be yes. So apparently at least they think the idea has merit. As far as your comment about economics goes, it was long held to be true that Sisters of Battle didn't warrant translation to plastic, both by GW and a portion of the community. Now it looks like Sisters are a popular seller and the only thing that got in the way of making money on plastic Sisters was GW's refusal to make them. This applies to a number of other models as well. For a Sisters of Silence character, GW has the sculptors and plastic casting expertise to make such a model look good and desirable. If it still fails to sell, they have rules writers that can help popularity along. But none of that matters if the model doesn't exist in the first place. As much as you can say without data it's prudent not to invest in the mold, it's just as easy to argue that without investment, you'll never see returns. Since GW has been making plastic characters for over a decade now, it's probably a safe assumption to say character clampacks have worked out for them if they keep investing in them. And at that point you have to ask, if they want to make Sisters of Silence successful, why shy away from that investment?


Do we need them to be a faction? I say no, they just need to be a unit choice for Custodes players. The game has too many factions as it is.
   
Made in gb
Rampaging Khorne Dreadnought




Quasistellar wrote:
 kurhanik wrote:
Crossfire and Exposed are neat, but it kind of feels like they should be basic rules of the game, not some specialist rule for a single faction. Also not quite sure why exposed has a 12" limit on it, I'd imagine lighting up a heavy unit like a christmas tree would give the lascannon operator farther back, or a sharpshooter an easier shot. I mean, the game is lethal enough as it is so limitations on how this can be used is probably a good thing.

Still just odd to me why this isn't core rule level stuff, and comes with some sort of suppression mechanic as the target unit hunkers down to avoid needless casualties.


Maybe this will get implemented for all the BS4 armies?


I doubt it/hope not unless there's a fair way to make all units get an artificial +1 to hit, not just BS4 otherwise BS4 might as well not exist.
   
Made in at
Pyromaniac Hellhound Pilot





 Gadzilla666 wrote:
 The Phazer wrote:
Yeah, interesting, but it's odd to add such a mechanic to just a single faction really. It almost feels more Tau ish.

I wouldn't be surprised to see Tau and the Guard get similar rules. This definitely sounds how multiple squads of Guardsmen should work together.

Cadians have a Strat that's similar already, so it'd not be too wild if it happened.
   
Made in gb
Longtime Dakkanaut




I think the crossfire rules fit GSC because mechanically its meant to encourage surrounding and actually ambushing with your units with ranged weapons. As opposed to just effectively Deep Striking in a line across the table with mass acolytes and charging in. Whether it actually works however remains to be seen.

The Custodes stuff just makes me go crosseyed. I suspect once you play it a few times you might get sort of used to it but you don't need this many options. Its going to be hard for the Custodes player to keep in their head - never mind anyone else.

(FWIW I kind of liked the Necron rules as a concept - but it should be army wide not only applicable if you have a character baby sitting the regular units. Instead you have a clunky rule which is rarely ever up anyway.)
   
Made in gb
Lord of the Fleet






London

 Daedalus81 wrote:
Seen elsewhere:

Ka’tah’s are wordy but pretty straightforward:

1) You pick 3 of them after deployment and order them 1st, 2nd, and 3rd.
2) In your first command phase, you activate one of the choices from your 1st. 1a or 1b.
3) In your next command phase, you can either pick the other option from your first or go to 2 and pick 2a or 2b. If you go to 2 you can never go back to 1.
4) In your next command phase you can pick the other 2 or go to 3 just like in the last step.

Once you’re at 3, you only have the two options left. You can run out early. There may be a strat to manipulate ka’tahs like doctrines but I’m doubtful.

The only modifier to this is that every shield host will have a preferred ka’tah. While that one is active, you don’t pick a or b, you get both once per game.


Why can't GW phrase rules like this? While there'll have to be some slight changes to ensure the rules flow correctly, I don't see why it has to be as complicated as previewed.
   
Made in us
Shadowy Grot Kommittee Memba






 Platuan4th wrote:
 kurhanik wrote:
Crossfire and Exposed are neat, but it kind of feels like they should be basic rules of the game


I said the exact same thing to my group the moment I saw them.


A xenos faction: Gets Anything

Imperial players: "B-b-b-b-b-b-b-b-b-ut why dont we have this? I DEMAND SPACE MARINE CODEX 9th Ed 4.0 RIGHT NOW!"

"Got you, Yugi! Your Rubric Marines can't fall back because I have declared the tertiary kaptaris ka'tah stance two, after the secondary dacatarai ka'tah last turn!"

"So you think, Kaiba! I declared my Thousand Sons the cult of Duplicity, which means all my psykers have access to the Sorcerous Facade power! Furthermore I will spend 8 Cabal Points to invoke Cabbalistic Focus, causing the rubrics to appear behind your custodes! The Vengeance for the Wronged and Sorcerous Fullisade stratagems along with the Malefic Maelstrom infernal pact evoked earlier in the command phase allows me to double their firepower, letting me wound on 2s and 3s!"

"you think it is you who has gotten me, yugi, but it is I who have gotten you! I declare the ever-vigilant stratagem to attack your rubrics with my custodes' ranged weapons, which with the new codex are now DAMAGE 2!!"

"...which leads you straight into my trap, Kaiba, you see I now declare the stratagem Implacable Automata, reducing all damage from your attacks by 1 and triggering my All is Dust special rule!"  
   
Made in us
Exalted Beastlord




 the_scotsman wrote:
 Platuan4th wrote:
 kurhanik wrote:
Crossfire and Exposed are neat, but it kind of feels like they should be basic rules of the game


I said the exact same thing to my group the moment I saw them.


A xenos faction: Gets Anything

Imperial players: "B-b-b-b-b-b-b-b-b-ut why dont we have this? I DEMAND SPACE MARINE CODEX 9th Ed 4.0 RIGHT NOW!"


Yep. That's certainly the issue, when someone suggests these are good additions to the basic shooting rules (because they actually add a measure of depth to maneuver and shooting, rather than bloat), they mean only for the Imperium.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/12/03 16:46:54


Efficiency is the highest virtue. 
   
Made in gb
Rampaging Khorne Dreadnought




 the_scotsman wrote:
 Platuan4th wrote:
 kurhanik wrote:
Crossfire and Exposed are neat, but it kind of feels like they should be basic rules of the game


I said the exact same thing to my group the moment I saw them.


A xenos faction: Gets Anything

Imperial players: "B-b-b-b-b-b-b-b-b-ut why dont we have this? I DEMAND SPACE MARINE CODEX 9th Ed 4.0 RIGHT NOW!"


I mean that might be oft correct, but on this occasion it is actually a fun depth bringing mechanic that could be adapted for everyone. Imperial scum or otherwise.
   
Made in de
Powerful Ushbati






 Togusa wrote:
 Geifer wrote:
 Togusa wrote:
Spoiler:
 Grimskul wrote:
 the_scotsman wrote:


GOOD fething lord no are you kidding man, GW would have to make a new sculpt for sisters of silence!!!

AND THEY SHALL KNOW. ONE. SPRUEEEE!


It is really funny that GW has like an endless supply of primaris lieutenants sculpts in their closet or something but they can't be bothered with one official clampack HQ model for SoS.


It's economics. How many people would really buy such a model? Given I have NEVER seen SoS on the tabletop, outside of promotional pictures and stuff like that, I have a hard time believing anyone even uses these models in the Custodes book. I doubt that's going to change. SoS seems like the most useless thing when we have SoB already. IMO.


Aside from being women in power armor, there's no overlap between Sisters of Silence and Sisters of Battle. Sisters of Battle are a complete, functional army with all that entails, that lacks the one thing Sisters of Silence exist to provide: dedicated psychic defense. Sisters of Silence have a completely different function to a squad of Sisters of Battle. Lorewise, they're also as far apart as you can be.

Sisters of Silence came out as plastic models before Sisters of Battle received theirs, and primarily for Horus Heresy with 40k rules as a bonus. They, like Custodes at the time, were a single squad meant to be allied into an Imperial army. When GW finally got around to making Codex Adeptus Custodes, rather than Codex Talons of the Emperor, Custodes were elevated to a full army and instead of integrating Sisters of Silence as a specialist unit in that army as they should have, GW instead left them orphaned as one of those units that technically exist, but that simply don't get to appear in a mainline codex. Much like Inquisition, really. That means less exposure for Sisters of Silence and less reason to take them. Even less so after GW shifted their rules design away from merry souping to powerful mono-faction bonuses. Sisters of Silence have to be integrated into the Custodes codex, which, again, is where they belonged in the first place, if they are to stand any chance of being taken in their own army lest they break the weak kung fu GW is adding to the new codex.

And with being a full part of the army, finally, you have to ask the question whether they should have an HQ character to go with them. GW asked that question and found the answer to be yes. So apparently at least they think the idea has merit. As far as your comment about economics goes, it was long held to be true that Sisters of Battle didn't warrant translation to plastic, both by GW and a portion of the community. Now it looks like Sisters are a popular seller and the only thing that got in the way of making money on plastic Sisters was GW's refusal to make them. This applies to a number of other models as well. For a Sisters of Silence character, GW has the sculptors and plastic casting expertise to make such a model look good and desirable. If it still fails to sell, they have rules writers that can help popularity along. But none of that matters if the model doesn't exist in the first place. As much as you can say without data it's prudent not to invest in the mold, it's just as easy to argue that without investment, you'll never see returns. Since GW has been making plastic characters for over a decade now, it's probably a safe assumption to say character clampacks have worked out for them if they keep investing in them. And at that point you have to ask, if they want to make Sisters of Silence successful, why shy away from that investment?


Do we need them to be a faction? I say no, they just need to be a unit choice for Custodes players. The game has too many factions as it is.


I never said Sisters of Silence should be a faction of their own? Quite the opposite, actually.

Nehekhara lives! Sort of!
Why is the rum always gone? 
   
Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut





Tampa,FL USA

 the_scotsman wrote:
 Platuan4th wrote:
 kurhanik wrote:
Crossfire and Exposed are neat, but it kind of feels like they should be basic rules of the game


I said the exact same thing to my group the moment I saw them.


A xenos faction: Gets Anything

Imperial players: "B-b-b-b-b-b-b-b-b-ut why dont we have this? I DEMAND SPACE MARINE CODEX 9th Ed 4.0 RIGHT NOW!"


Funny, since neither post mentioned Marines(or any other army for that matter). Maybe you shouldn't project your own bugbears on other people?

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/12/03 19:44:15


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Why would Space Marine players want bonuses for things like clever positioning or aggressive maneuvering? They already get better bonuses than that from standing still on their own front step.
   
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 the_scotsman wrote:
A xenos faction: Gets Anything

Imperial players: "B-b-b-b-b-b-b-b-b-ut why dont we have this? I DEMAND SPACE MARINE CODEX 9th Ed 4.0 RIGHT NOW!"
That's not what's happening here. You know that.

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