Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

Ok i was thinking of doing a chaos chapter of the fallen angels,(DA)... I remember back in the day they were fawn of lasguns( for side arms), But my quiet is,
Was there armour black or just a very deep green that looked black??
What color were there Robes?? green? Black? white? or beige?

Im lost, plus i dont have access to my freinds vast knowledge DA history.. any more/;

If no-one replies I suggest getting onto www.librarium.com. It has a ton of fluff about the game.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
oops, not the right site...will try to find the right one.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
it's www.lexicanum.com

Fallen Angels should wear black power armour,as this was the Heresy-era Dark Angels colours. Their robes can probably be any colour you want given that they use them to disguise their identities. The exception to this is the Cypher who is explicitly described as having green power armour... but then he always was a bit of a mystery

http://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/Cypher

http://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/The_Fallen

lot of info about cypher and the fallen angels. I would personally get a lot of the robed dark angels models and use those with cypher as your hq choice.

I was going too do huge footslogging army, with cypher as the hq choice( just have to find the model again.)


So black power armor..... what about a dark green that almost look black?

StarGate wrote: I was going too do huge footslogging army, with cypher as the hq choice( just have to find the model again.)


So black power armor..... what about a dark green that almost look black?

I think if cypher is wearing dark green armor an army following him wearing that wouldn't be a major problem.

Oh brother!
Let kill that green true traitors!

We,Fallen Angels wore black armor and red heraldry.
Robe are bone white....but I don have references.

I believe there's a picture of their paint scheme in the chaos codex.
It's on one of the pages that shows the color shcemes for the different legions.
It's listed as "UNKNOWN" but the marine has green armor and a black robe.

Well, given that the Fallen are no longer really a coherent organization(for the most part)--I'd say that a uniform look would be kinda silly.

The Fallen since the...well, Fall, seem to have begun either trying to blend themselves back into Imperial society or flatout joining one of the Traitor Legions themselves(in which case, they adopt warband colors).

I think there is a Scenario on GWs website that was a hunt the fallen set up and they had some Fallen models. they looked like DAs, but their armor was so dark and worn.

They were Brownish black with just a hint of green if you looked hard enough. their tabards were extreamly dirty bleached bone. Very sooty looking chaps.

Well I was going too too do there armor in a Green/ black ink wash i have.....( so it looks black but in direct light it has a greenish color).

There robes i have no idea yet...( white or a bleach bone would be nice...) but what about Icons... i have no idea yet, since all the research Ive done shows only white or bleachbone Icons... which seems kinda werid...

The Fallen are just pre-heresy Dark Angels with really worn armour and equipment. So best bet is to follow this guide:

http://www.heresy-online.net/forums/showthread.php?t=22506

Remember that fluff-wise the Fallen aren't (for the most part) servants of Chaos, and so they only tenuously ally themselves to Chaos forces. They are just at home fighting alongside Imperial Guard (yes original rules for Cypher allowed him to be taken by Imperial Guard armies) or with mercenaries/pirates. As for taking "warband colours", since when have renegade marines given up their chapter colours to match those of the marines they are fighting with; they sometimes change en masse as a chapter but you only have to look at the number of different colour schemes of marines following Huron to see that there is no single warband colour scheme.

Guys, lets get this colour things sorted once and for all.

The Dark Angels were, originally, black armour with red and white markings and heraldry when they were a Terran-founded Legion.

When El'Jonson was discovered and the Legion moved it's home to Caliban, their armour changed to very dark green in honour of the huge forests that covered most of the planet.

Which is why Cypher had green armour.

Miraclefish wrote:Guys, lets get this colour things sorted once and for all.

The Dark Angels were, originally, black armour with red and white markings and heraldry when they were a Terran-founded Legion.

When El'Jonson was discovered and the Legion moved it's home to Caliban, their armour changed to very dark green in honour of the huge forests that covered most of the planet.

Which is why Cypher had green armour.

You will never "get this sorted" because it is up to the player what the fallen look like until GW tells us otherwise. It doesn't matter what they wore when the fall happened because there has been quite a bit of time since then. They could have changed their uniforms/armor color to match Cypher's. They could maintain the old dark angel armor color of black. They could be wearing red and white polka dots or be all different colors because they are a ragtag band. No one here can say definitively that any one color or set of colors is what the fallen look like, the end.

My CSM army is a fallen army theme to it and i used mostly black with some green and red as secondary colors much like the picture in the codex but really you can choose to do it your way since they mey very well change what colors their armour is to try and hide who they are.

As a side note figure out whether you want your Fallen to have Fallen to Chaos or not as not all of them might have. IIRC in angels of darkness:



Edit: Spoiler tag - glad I caught it quick

There is a fair chance both were loyal and thought the other traitors. I find that one of the greater tragedies of the HH, although I have no idea why. Just something irrational and emotional. (I don't particularly like DA. Although I find what they do in the Rock intriguing.)

Im just going too do a Renegade army( so i can use them as both CSM andCCSM Undivided.... Now my next worry is trying to find robed Termies..... does any one know of any... I can make, but i want a whole Deathwing army too in robes....

Im going with a dark green that almost looks black in low light, but in direct light it has a green hue too it...

With a standard Beige robe, that will be soiled and tated at the ends.

Not really sure about robes for Termies. Prolly gonna have to green stuff that. I'd be interested in seeing that when its finished too

Miraclefish wrote:The Dark Angels were, originally, black armour with red and white markings and heraldry when they were a Terran-founded Legion.

When El'Jonson was discovered and the Legion moved it's home to Caliban, their armour changed to very dark green in honour of the huge forests that covered most of the planet.

Where does that come from? Because my understanding was that they wore black up until the Heresy. They repainted the armour green just before the assault on Caliban, so that the loyalists could tell each other apart from the Fallen.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Shas'O Dorian wrote:As a side note figure out whether you want your Fallen to have Fallen to Chaos or not as not all of them might have. IIRC in angels of darkness:

Spoiler:

Astelan claims that the Lion was intentionally late to terra, awaiting to see who emerged victorious that he may claim he was on his way to help them. Thus Astelan claims that he & the fallen did not succumb to chaos but rather the Lion & the others could have.

...which is meant to cast doubt on the whole story, coming as it does from one of the Fallen, not to count as established fact.

insaniak wrote:
...which is meant to cast doubt on the whole story, coming as it does from one of the Fallen, not to count as established fact.

Very true but who's to say that he isn't right. As far as I know GW hasn't put out an official stance of what happened (3rd DA HH book maybe?) so while unlikely I still believe Astelan could have been right, and the fallen who have turned to chaos did so out of desperation / betrayal / doubt after the events on Caliban. As the old saying goes, history is written by the victor, the events on Caliban are not often told from the point of view of a Fallen and even when it is, it gets quickly labeled as lies, deceit and heresy.

Shas'O Dorian wrote:

insaniak wrote:
...which is meant to cast doubt on the whole story, coming as it does from one of the Fallen, not to count as established fact.

Very true but who's to say that he isn't right. As far as I know GW hasn't put out an official stance of what happened (3rd DA HH book maybe?) so while unlikely I still believe Astelan could have been right, and the fallen who have turned to chaos did so out of desperation / betrayal / doubt after the events on Caliban. As the old saying goes, history is written by the victor, the events on Caliban are not often told from the point of view of a Fallen and even when it is, it gets quickly labeled as lies, deceit and heresy.

The Fallen Dark Angel from Eye of Terror definitely fell to Chaos before Caliban died. In fact, he specifically mentions that they turned from the Emperor to Chaos because the Emperor abandoned and betrayed them.

Further supported by the lies he told the other Dark Angel about the Emperor losing and dying at the end of the Heresy and Chaos gaining the galaxy. Also, supported by said other Dark Angel eating the first one's brain and gaining his memories.

I have been gaming 40k since the start. I have followed the Dark Angels for years. With all the nice Horus Hersy novels and all the vast array of other fluff out there, the Fallen are getting to be more understood in many ways. The original DA were black armoured, with red logo wings with (unbroken) sword. As far as preheresy, anything from mk1 to mk5 (or even mk6 beakies) is good. Here is a pick of the bits best to use. I am making a preheresy DA army myself, and have a preheresy LR from FW, and chapterhouse makes drop pod, rhino, jet pack, and shoulder pad pre heresy kits to go on current GW models. Termies need a little work, dreads should be on legs, etc....here are pics (not of my minis) to give you ideas and direction....

spartanlegion wrote:I have been gaming 40k since the start. I have followed the Dark Angels for years. With all the nice Horus Heresy novels and all the vast array of other fluff out there, the Fallen are getting to be more understood in many ways. The original DA were black armoured, with red logo wings with (unbroken) sword. As far as preheresy, anything from mk1 to mk5 (or even mk6 beakies) is good. Here is a pick of the bits best to use. I am making a preheresy DA army myself, and have a preheresy LR from FW, and chapterhouse makes drop pod, rhino, jet pack, and shoulder pad pre heresy kits to go on current GW models. Termies need a little work, dreads should be on legs, etc....here are pics (not of my minis) to give you ideas and direction....

I'm not sure what exactly you were trying to clear up but I don't think it was the OPs question. I don't think many people are arguing about what they looked like pre-heresy. The biggest point of contention is what the fallen look like currently. You claim you have all the knowledge to correct those of us with lesser intelligence. I still hold by the fact that no one really knows what the fallen would look like because of a lot of different factors:

It is entirely possible they kept their original colors and would look as others have described their pre-fallen armor. They could be wearing salvaged/stolen/bought/self-built armor either to replace worn/lost pieces or to hide their identities as fallen somewhat. They could be wearing current dark angel colored armor because they've taken it from slain loyalist dark angels they've killed/captured in battle. They may have repainted their armor to look like cypher's armor either in honor of him or at his request. Those that have fallen to the dark powers as time has gone might be wearing icons of their chosen god or have mutations. The list is nearly endless as to the reasons they might be wearing almost any color armor you might think up.

Guys guys guys. Read the First DA HH book. When El'Jonson reclaims his legion, the legion is Named the "Hell Hounds" with Black PA and red/white markings. He changes that scheme to Dark Green with White markings and renames them the dark angels. I'm going to try to find the page numbers involved in this, but @ the time of the Assault of Caliban, all of the "Fallen" where in Dark Angels Green PA. Except for maybe the Ravenwing, which would still be black in honour of the Cavalry Division of the The Order(Lion El'Jonson's Order of Knights on Caliban).

So, as far as what their Base PA would look like, it would be Dark Angels green. Know they have been fighting for millennium now, so they might of had to repair parts with other CM/CSM PA parts.

Rashim wrote:Guys guys guys. Read the First DA HH book. When El'Jonson reclaims his legion, the legion is Named the "Hell Hounds" with Black PA and red/white markings. He changes that scheme to Dark Green with White markings and renames them the dark angels. I'm going to try to find the page numbers involved in this, but @ the time of the Assault of Caliban, all of the "Fallen" where in Dark Angels Green PA. Except for maybe the Ravenwing, which would still be black in honour of the Cavalry Division of the The Order(Lion El'Jonson's Order of Knights on Caliban).

So, as far as what their Base PA would look like, it would be Dark Angels green. Know they have been fighting for millennium now, so they might of had to repair parts with other CM/CSM PA parts.

Oooorrrr... you could read the actual fluff written by the company and not free-lance writers, which states that the pre-Heresy scheme is black and the green was done to differentiate the loyalists and Fallen.

If we were to take the BL books as gospel, then Marines are all about Multi-lazors and Ladn Raiders can change into Razorbacks then back again.

Platuan4th wrote:

Rashim wrote:Guys guys guys. Read the First DA HH book. When El'Jonson reclaims his legion, the legion is Named the "Hell Hounds" with Black PA and red/white markings. He changes that scheme to Dark Green with White markings and renames them the dark angels. I'm going to try to find the page numbers involved in this, but @ the time of the Assault of Caliban, all of the "Fallen" where in Dark Angels Green PA. Except for maybe the Ravenwing, which would still be black in honour of the Cavalry Division of the The Order(Lion El'Jonson's Order of Knights on Caliban).

So, as far as what their Base PA would look like, it would be Dark Angels green. Know they have been fighting for millennium now, so they might of had to repair parts with other CM/CSM PA parts.

Oooorrrr... you could read the actual fluff written by the company and not free-lance writers, which states that the pre-Heresy scheme is black and the green was done to differentiate the loyalists and Fallen.

If we were to take the BL books as gospel, then Marines are all about Multi-lazors and Land Raiders can change into Razorbacks then back again.

Source's Please.

Fluff orders works in this way
1.Rulebook
2.Codex
3.Black Library

All Fluff in BL is sanctioned by GW unless retconned (of course). I've owned 3rd and 4th edition DA codex's for years, and I don't know of anything stating they were All black Pre-Hersey.

Rashim wrote:

Platuan4th wrote:

Rashim wrote:Guys guys guys. Read the First DA HH book. When El'Jonson reclaims his legion, the legion is Named the "Hell Hounds" with Black PA and red/white markings. He changes that scheme to Dark Green with White markings and renames them the dark angels. I'm going to try to find the page numbers involved in this, but @ the time of the Assault of Caliban, all of the "Fallen" where in Dark Angels Green PA. Except for maybe the Ravenwing, which would still be black in honour of the Cavalry Division of the The Order(Lion El'Jonson's Order of Knights on Caliban).

So, as far as what their Base PA would look like, it would be Dark Angels green. Know they have been fighting for millennium now, so they might of had to repair parts with other CM/CSM PA parts.

Oooorrrr... you could read the actual fluff written by the company and not free-lance writers, which states that the pre-Heresy scheme is black and the green was done to differentiate the loyalists and Fallen.

If we were to take the BL books as gospel, then Marines are all about Multi-lazors and Land Raiders can change into Razorbacks then back again.

Source's Please.

Fluff orders works in this way
1.Rulebook
2.Codex
3.Black Library

All Fluff in BL is sanctioned by GW unless retconned (of course). I've owned 3rd and 4th edition DA codex's for years, and I don't know of anything stating they were All black Pre-Hersey.

Index Astartes: Dark Angels. Here's a picture from it labeled, funnily enough, "Pre-Heresy":



Also, I'd have to check, but I'm pretty sure 2nd ed. book ALSO stated it.

Also, things printed in WD ALSO over ride BL. Just because it's sanctioned, doesn't make it CANON(see Star Wars Movies v novels for an example of how it works).

Lexicanum picture =/.

But if It is in 2nd Edition, then I would say all black, because I firmly believe that the Codicies are god =)!

I'm going to have to find a 2nd ed Codex somewhere.

Also, I miss Asmodai =(

Rashim wrote:Lexicanum picture =/.

But if It is in 2nd Edition, then I would say all black, because I firmly believe that the Codicies are god =)!

I'm going to have to find a 2nd ed Codex somewhere.

Also, I miss Asmodai =(

All Lexicanum pictures are pulled from WD or codices, so they're technically GW pics. If you want, I can scan that exact picture from my copy of Index Astartes Vol. 1(when I can find it under all the codices and minis).

Also, if you get a chance, buy the 2nd ed. Angels of Death book, it's worth it.

I've owned it twice(one from 2nd which I lost and one I obtained from a friend years after I lost my original) and I heartily recommend it.

DA were my second army(after Eldar) and probably my single largest(10K+ points, but not my most numerous in model count[that's my Chaos with 8 or 9K, mostly infantry]) thanks to the "DA Chapter Project" we started in New Orleans. Also my favorite army(and favorite to play of the 4 chapters I have).