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Played a 1500pt game yesterday vs the new Blood Angels (as played by the local cheater/powerplayer but hell I wanted a game). A rough rundown of his list was

Mephiston

Dante (as one unit in reserve with)
5 man Sanginary guard all with melta pistol thingies
Sanginuary Priest Jump pack and melta pistol

10 man Tac w/lascannon (which he combat squaded)

Furioso (w/magna grappel)

Furioso (w/magna grappel)

Vindicator

Speeder w/missile and multimelta

Meanwhile in the Traitor guard corner

Command squad w/4 flamers in chimera

Vet squad demolitions and 3 meltas in a Vendetta

Platoon Command w/3 flamers in chimera

Infantry Squad in chimera

Infantry Squad (in Reserve)

5 Ratlings

2 Hydras

2 Leman Russ Demolishers w/las cannons

2 Leman Russ MBTs


Pitched Battle 4 objectives
He got first turn (after I got him to redeploy within 12" not 14-16" he thought was acceptable and scoted my vendetta up the right side of the board) and moved forward with everything but the Tac Squad he'd combat squaded and placed on objectives; his shooting got him nadda and it became my turn . I scooted 6" to deny Mephiston a cover save from my vendetta (this guy will argue for 20 mins about getting cover saves) and disembarked the vets, moved my tanks to get clear shots. Shooting phase and here is where BA Player learned to hate the guard! Killed a Furioso, landspeeder stunned his vindicator but most importantly killed mephiston. His Turn 2 saw the arrival of his uber Dante and friends squad which rerolls reserve roll to come on and thanks to Dante does NOT scatter, vindi moved 12" Furioso closed in on my vets, shooting saw me lose both demolishers but assault phase saw him lose his furioso when he charged my vets (killed 3) and then found out my vets carry melta bombs a lucky 3 out of 6 attacks scored a six leading to two pens and a wrecked furioso. My turn 2 moved to get shots on uber unit with everything but the vendetta which picked up my vets and scooted 6" for a shot on his vindicator and my LRMBT which lined up for the lascannon combat squad on and objective. Shooting Blew the cannon off the vindicator, obliterated the lascannon squad (After an argument about wound allocation) and everything else shot uber squad reducing dante to 1 wound and remove one sanguinary guard with 50+ wounds caused (2+ saves and Feel no pain are a bitch). His 3rd Turn moves his uber unit into a nearby building to score/contest an objective (have another argument about how far 12" is in everybodies but his reality) and makes a really big error in seperating his Priest and dante from the uber unit stuns a LRMBT and he's done. My turn Shows him his error as the priest finds himself on the recieving end of a vendetta vaporising him and leaving the uber squad without it's feel no pain. Dante found 1 wound with a 2+ save aint enough vs las gun infantry and multitudes of flamers Ba player concedes before end of shooting phase.

What I learnt Dante's squad not scattering is awesome! Sanginuary Priests are just plain nasty. Vendettas really spoil peoples day but not as much as vets with demolitions.

What was your squad please.

I will always hate IG more than any MEQ (no offense). The sheer amount of firepower ensures that your army will typically be able to handle anything from across the table, which is something few other armies can say. Tau come close, but their strength is their mobility and ability to hide during the opponent's shooting phase.

Good job on the win! Again, my taste vs. your army is biased, I love my tyranids and we don't do so well against massed IG fire.

the_ferrett wrote:What was your squad please.

The Infantry Squads? just standard 10 man with lasguns sarge with cc and laspistol cheap and cheerfull.

@tetrisphreak

I understand your hatred but to be honest we all have army styles our own army can't handle with my IG it's in your face deepstriking/outflanking armies without a couple of turns to soften up the opposistion I get minced.

Sounds like he wanted to try out a bunch of the uber-choices all at once.

Mephiston + Dante + Sanguinary Priest seems like a lot of points tied up in very few models.

I'd guess that the BA will work better with fewer of those uber choices and more standard troops. Especially in objective games where you'll want more scoring units.

Thanks for the report.

A well built IG army with a competent general is the best combo in the game. Other armies have there fancy pants magic, dog riders and flying Greek statues but at the end of the day the guy with the bigger gun always wins.

jshbchnn wrote:Sounds like he wanted to try out a bunch of the uber-choices all at once.

Mephiston + Dante + Sanguinary Priest seems like a lot of points tied up in very few models.

nah, the guy just likes his uber-units (and fudging movements).

@ The Strange Dude - Sounds like you did well, I watched Steve struggle against him on Tuesday before Steve ripped my modified mechanised force apart :(

I love that he conceded and left to cry himself to sleep, LOL. I can't stand players like that. I love the hobby, and enjoy playing (Win or Lose). It's not very fun to just show up and try and bully the crap outta everyone. Good report!!

question: how did you kill mepheston in one shooting phase?

he has 5 wounds on T6 and is immune to ID. you must have gotten alot of hits and wounds with AP2.

Grey Templar wrote:question: how did you kill mepheston in one shooting phase?

he has 5 wounds on T6 and is immune to ID. you must have gotten alot of hits and wounds with AP2.

Massed fire?

remember, quantity is a quility all on its own

What was his second troop choice? I see one tactical squad. Combat squadded makes it two units, but it's still only one choice.

wizard12 wrote:

Grey Templar wrote:question: how did you kill mepheston in one shooting phase?

he has 5 wounds on T6 and is immune to ID. you must have gotten alot of hits and wounds with AP2.

Massed fire?

remember, quantity is a quility all on its own

coming from a deathwing player this statement has an irony worth pointing out

Question for OP. If this guy is a power player id hate to see what you would think of some really optimized lists.

Dante makes the sanguanary guard troops.

The way you kill Mephiston is simple...

it doesn't say in his profile that he is Eternal Warrior.

He has toughness 6 so that just means that str 10 still doesn't instantly kill him.

Instead use a force weapon, unless he gets lucky and cancels it with the force hood, (although he'd strike before you, and if he's smart he'd have used "Transfixing Gaze" on you... making him able to reroll hits and wounds. If that failed he would have made you a preferred enemy through his psychic power. Then the Sword would have made him STR 10 which would have already killed you...

He's dead killy.

The best way it was discussed at the store I go to, is to take a Witch Hunters Inquisitor with Retinue. I forget what the combonation is, but basically the retinue will make it so that you can only strike once, the fact that the Inquisitor is part of the unit as per the rules stated in the book you cannot separately target him. Then the Inquisitor will then hit Mephiston with his Force Weapon, also following the older rules are listed in the codex. You will get absolutely no saves against it at all. The only thing that I see as a problem with all this is how the Inquisitor will get that 6 he needs to wound Mephiston...

Perhaps it was with a Cannoness or something instead that the force weapon was used with but you get the point.

Basically to only way to effectively deal with him is going first and hitting him with Ap1/2 because he has no invulnerable save...

Keep him at a distance and you got him (hard to do because of his Wings Of Sanguine!)

Broodlords with Implant Attack stand a good chance against him. Plus they can use Enrapturing Gaze [and avoid his psychic hood], then win the roll-off [hopefully], preventing Mephiston from attacking.

That's nice and all, but Mephiston more importantly can't target the broodlord as he's a sergeant-type character, and the broodlord will insta-kill mephiston if he rolls a 6 to wound. With 4+ to hit, re-rolling 1's, it's not terrible odds. Mephiston also has to roll 3d6 for his psychic powers while fighting the genestealers, putting him to his basic 5 attacks.

What's "Enrapturing Gaze"... I looked through the Tyranid codex and there isn't anything called that as far as I see...

there's HYPNOTIC gaze... if that's what you mean... and that's the thing that can stop him from attacking...

One important thing to add is that he'll still be able to cancel that with his Psychic Hood, that won't avoid his psychic hood since it's still a psychic power.

Even then you'll need to get lucky to beat him that way, rending and for such... although the Genestealer squad would have a good chance of offing him, that's only if they're the ones assaulting so that you can use your Psychic power.

If he's the one assaulting, and considering that he can move as a jetpack because of his Wings of Sanguine, he's most likely going to be the one charging and therefore get to use his psychic powers...

Even with the 3d6 that doesn't seem to change anything much for me at least... I don't know about anybody elses experiences of course...


But at this point I'm sure we can agree on the fact that there are a lot of ways to kill Mephiston...

I agree, that BA list looks like ADHD on crack. I can just imagine the guy's drool pooling under his slack jaw as he threw every shiny unit into the list that would fit.

I'd have gone a very different route. I'm partial to the assault squads having 2 meltaguns apiece, so I like using that.

I grappled the shoggoth wrote:
Question for OP. If this guy is a power player id hate to see what you would think of some really optimized lists.

He's not good at lists he is good at bending, ignoring and breaking nearly every rule in 40k. A game against him is an exercise in frustration with an average of 5 arguments a turn on rules (he'll argue even when proved wrong in an attempt to get a dice off) combine this with a need to watch his every move; add up his list mentally to make sure he's on; and his amazing dice karma. All this doesn't make him a power player by the traditional sense of the word but in his way he is.

Grey Templar wrote:question: how did you kill mepheston in one shooting phase?

he has 5 wounds on T6 and is immune to ID. you must have gotten alot of hits and wounds with AP2.

I would assume his Vendetta did some of the work, 3 TL lascannons will eat a 2+ save w/ fnp (no invuln, strangely) alive.

I hope that people aren't gonna whine and bitch for the next few months about Blood Angels being overpowered...

I've played a quite a few games with them since they came out and I've found them to be very much balanced.

Sadly though I've left out 3 major rules that I finally noticed...

Mephiston is Fleet
Blood Chalice also gives Furious Charge
I keep forgetting to role for Red Thirst

I don't think in terms of fast vehicles the costs are balanced vs normal marine codex vehicles. However, the rage, furious, special wargear, fnp, etc. seem to be balanced in terms of cost.

That's why I think heavy mech lists will all defect to BA rules. Why would I take a dual vindicator marine mech list when I could make them all fast?

Not sure if you're aware, and I couldn't tell from your batrep, but Mephiston is NOT an independent character.

jy2 wrote:Not sure if you're aware, and I couldn't tell from your batrep, but Mephiston is NOT an independent character.

Umm I'll bet the farm that he is. I think GW made a typo on him.

/facepalm... doesn't matter. RAW = not an IC.
Until they FAQ it, it's all house rules to use IC with him.

I see it as akin to barliohammer and not warhammer...Mephy is not the only one without IC status...in most ways it's RAI and RAW hand in hand as I see it.

barliohammer, I like the sound of that...

Ok so in that case what does that mean when he joins a unit?

Edit: I know what you're saying about RAW, but I'm generally a RAI person.

He cant join a unit. He isnt an independent character.

Yeah not being an IC, means he can't join a unit. Makes it easy to mass firepower him down. Personally, I'm thinking a CCS full of Plasma guns will take care of him nicely.

I think it was intentional on the part of GW that Mephiston is not an IC.

G

If you are playing BA and your opponents #1 target priority in terms of sight and fear is mephiston you are doing something wrong.

Go ahead and shoot plas at mephiston, my other character which has no army buffing abilities compared to Sanguinor, while 50 dudes roll up in your face in 18 inch smoked rhinos and jump packs behind that turn 2.

Just sayin. Yeah any character is easy to kill if your opponent is a moron and sticks him out like a sore thumb and your 8 plasmaguns are conveniently right there.

Mephiston having near-daemon stats, I'm sure they wanted to balance him a bit, thus the lack of IC. Of course, for the cost of a land raider I don't think he should be lacking it, but I could just be biased.