Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

DO IT TO IT wrote:
Nothing is a "bad idea" if you like it, despite what the internet list group-think says.

Sorry, no, that's nonsense. Not all units are created equal. Some just suck.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:

DO IT TO IT wrote:
Nothing is a "bad idea" if you like it, despite what the internet list group-think says.

Sorry, no, that's nonsense. Not all units are created equal. Some just suck.

And some units are Pyrovores.

Well it's only 4 days now until my LGS will have copies in stock, so if nothing else i can wait that long. What's 4 days compared to the 4 years of mediocre codex we've already endured?


There above lies my greatest fear - what if this book is no better, and god forbid, far worse, than what we're using now? I'll give the codex my standard "3 month" assessment, where i use it and only it for all my games for the next 3 months to see how I like it. But at first glance i'm seeing a lot of the same old same old with these rumors, aside from MC point drops (yet upgraded little bugs and standard medium bugs seem to be the same cost)....

For the Vanguard Infestation data slate:
http://natfka.blogspot.com/2014/01/tyranids-vanguard-infestation-dataslate.html

via Stickmonkey on Faeit 212
3+ genestealer broods (1 must include broodlord, only 1 broodlord per formation)
3+ lictors one of which can be deathleaper

Every man for himself
On the round this unit arrives enters play, every unit within 36" must use the lowest leadership value of the unit when taking leadership tests.

Secret Deployment
Every unit in this formation must start in reserve and use Lictor's chameleonic skin rule for deployment

I wonder if we'll get this excited again in 2018...

 pretre wrote:
For the Vanguard Infestation data slate:
http://natfka.blogspot.com/2014/01/tyranids-vanguard-infestation-dataslate.html

via Stickmonkey on Faeit 212
3+ genestealer broods (1 must include broodlord, only 1 broodlord per formation)
3+ lictors one of which can be deathleaper

Every man for himself
On the round this unit arrives enters play, every unit within 36" must use the lowest leadership value of the unit when taking leadership tests.

Secret Deployment
Every unit in this formation must start in reserve and use Lictor's chameleonic skin rule for deployment

If i'm not mistaken, that is IDENTICAL to the genestealer/lictor formation in the Apocalypse book.

So, if this is true, then Lictors will NOT be able to assault the turn they arrive from "chameleonic skin". Why? Because it would be utterly broken if not only they but every genestealer in your force could all assault with no penalty on one reserves roll.

Looks like nothing can save them now...I hope i'm wrong and they're awesome.

Edit to add: "Every Man For Themselves" could be a good rule in tandem with "The Horror" (assuming it's a Pinning test at a negative leadership modifier).

Would be hilarious if they could all assault though.

 pretre wrote:
For the Vanguard Infestation data slate:
http://natfka.blogspot.com/2014/01/tyranids-vanguard-infestation-dataslate.html

via Stickmonkey on Faeit 212
3+ genestealer broods (1 must include broodlord, only 1 broodlord per formation)
3+ lictors one of which can be deathleaper

Every man for himself
On the round this unit arrives enters play, every unit within 36" must use the lowest leadership value of the unit when taking leadership tests.

Secret Deployment
Every unit in this formation must start in reserve and use Lictor's chameleonic skin rule for deployment

This is exactly the same as the Apocalypse formation, can this be right?

Beaten to it :-)

Odd_Socks wrote:

 pretre wrote:
For the Vanguard Infestation data slate:
http://natfka.blogspot.com/2014/01/tyranids-vanguard-infestation-dataslate.html

via Stickmonkey on Faeit 212
3+ genestealer broods (1 must include broodlord, only 1 broodlord per formation)
3+ lictors one of which can be deathleaper

Every man for himself
On the round this unit arrives enters play, every unit within 36" must use the lowest leadership value of the unit when taking leadership tests.

Secret Deployment
Every unit in this formation must start in reserve and use Lictor's chameleonic skin rule for deployment

This is exactly the same as the Apocalypse formation, can this be right?

Beaten to it :-)

*checks Apoc book*

Nope.

 pretre wrote:
Would be hilarious if they could all assault though.

Not really. Faeit missed the other special rule:

Biological Dead End
No units in this formation may assault the turn they arrive/are revealed. They'll never make it into combat so you might as well just remove 'em as casualties. Thanks for buying the miniatures though. We appreciate that.

Although its weird that "every man for himself" would occur on the turn they arrive. Because the formation itself can't take advantage of it, seeing as how they are assault units but cannot assault that turn.

I guess you could combo it with something...

H.B.M.C. wrote:

DO IT TO IT wrote:
Nothing is a "bad idea" if you like it, despite what the internet list group-think says.

Sorry, no, that's nonsense. Not all units are created equal. Some just suck.

Not all units are created equal, but then they don't all serve the same function, or operate within the same army either. GW's job isn't to appeal to only one kind of gamer, and thus not all units will operate equally under the same conditions. Some are "cool" or "fluffy", while others are designed to deal with a very specific type of threat.

Yes, some units just suck, but we haven't played with any of the new Tyranid ones, under these new codex rules to make such an assessment. Attempting to do so just looks foolish. Especially when it's a glib, sweeping complaint about things that you (or anyone else) has no clue about yet.

I am not saying they will all be wonderful either; I'm just willing to concede that I won't know either way until I've played with them.

 brassangel wrote:
GW's job isn't to appeal to only one kind of gamer, and thus not all units will operate equally under the same conditions. Some are "cool" or "fluffy", while others are designed to deal with a very specific type of threat.

That's awesome dude. Good job!

Wasn't even what I was getting at.

I was simply stating a truth:

Some units suck. They just do. It doesn't matter what their "role" is, it doesn't matter what their fluff is. Some units are just terrible units that do not function in the role given to them or are outdone by something else in the army. This has nothing to do with styles of play or appearing to a certain type of gamer. Some units are just garbage.

MadmanMSU wrote:
Although its weird that "every man for himself" would occur on the turn they arrive. Because the formation itself can't take advantage of it, seeing as how they are assault units but cannot assault that turn.

I guess you could combo it with something...

I think the idea is that the sudden appearance of that many broods would allow any other leadership damaging effects to work better.

3-4 Broods of GS and a bunch of lictors pop up and then you bombard them with pinning weapons and leadership checks.

 pretre wrote:
3-4 Broods of GS and a bunch of lictors pop up and then you bombard them with pinning weapons and leadership checks.

And then the enemy bombards the 'Stealers and Lictors while they stand there looking stupid and wondering why they can't assault yet.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:

 pretre wrote:
3-4 Broods of GS and a bunch of lictors pop up and then you bombard them with pinning weapons and leadership checks.

And then the enemy bombards the 'Stealers and Lictors while they stand there looking stupid and wondering why they can't assault yet.

I didn't say it was a good idea. Just the idea.

so if everything has to deploy on turn 2

how come the nid player doesn't count as tabled at the end of turn 1?

 OrlandotheTechnicoloured wrote:
so if everything has to deploy on turn 2

how come the nid player doesn't count as tabled at the end of turn 1?

The rest of his army that's on the table...?

 pretre wrote:

 OrlandotheTechnicoloured wrote:
so if everything has to deploy on turn 2

how come the nid player doesn't count as tabled at the end of turn 1?

The rest of his army that's on the table...?

ah makes sense,

I was thinking that would be all of the force, but it's obviously not large enough, DOH!

These new "rumors' sound very much like an "mysterious" attention grab.

The only time people need to be mysterious is when they are
1 - a source in the know, and need to be vague as to not be fired.
2 - don't want to post exact costs so as to not violate board policies.

However, this guy says he "bought" the codex, which means its not issue 1, and well, the vagueness...is just bizzare.

note, I am not "personally attacking" this person, I am saying the information they present sounds more like spreading gossip or vague rumors for attention, than trying to share information from someone that has a book.

Maybe they think being cryptic is ...fun? At this late stage in the game, it is just ....goofy.

davethepak wrote:
These new "rumors' sound very much like an "mysterious" attention grab.

The only time people need to be mysterious is when they are
1 - a source in the know, and need to be vague as to not be fired.
2 - don't want to post exact costs so as to not violate board policies.

However, this guy says he "bought" the codex, which means its not issue 1, and well, the vagueness...is just bizzare.

He's posting on Warseer which is known for cracking down on people for being too specific. IIRC, they're the ones who keep that whole 'it's 5 storm bolters and a frag grenade in points' thing going.

 pretre wrote:

davethepak wrote:
These new "rumors' sound very much like an "mysterious" attention grab.

The only time people need to be mysterious is when they are
1 - a source in the know, and need to be vague as to not be fired.
2 - don't want to post exact costs so as to not violate board policies.

However, this guy says he "bought" the codex, which means its not issue 1, and well, the vagueness...is just bizzare.

He's posting on Warseer which is known for cracking down on people for being too specific. IIRC, they're the ones who keep that whole 'it's 5 storm bolters and a frag grenade in points' thing going.

Agreed.

But even that is specific other than "it will be bad" or "steel rain is no more'.

Just say "the AP is the same as a heavy bolter" or "the tyranid drop pod unit is no longer in the book".

Again, I am commenting on the quality of the information, not attacking the person.
If they do indeed have the book, hopefully they will start posting things in specific references.
(fie storm bolters + frag grenades IS specific).

Hopefully we will have good information in a few days.

 AlexHolker wrote:

Obsidorox wrote:
Its in the 5th ed. codex too. iirc before they charge into battle they lay their eggs. By the time the first wave dies, the second wave has hatched, layed its eggs, and about to assault again.

That is stupid. It is physically impossible for a hormagaunt to have enough biomass to replace itself and yet have anything left for the creature itself.

Perhaps the photosynthesises to absorb energy/ convert-to-matter sunlight. Or perhaps roots.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Solidcrash wrote:
In old codex, hormagaunt's have "without number" special rule... 5th editon remove that special rule, all I can wait for new codex to see if hormagaunt's gain any new /old special rule better than Without Number special rule..

Itd almost make hormagaunts worth taking If we had that rule.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

rigeld2 wrote:

 the shrouded lord wrote:
*clears throat*
excuse me but SINCE WHEN DO HORMAGAUNTS LAY EGGS?
My apologies, but I don't remember ever reading that.

5th edition codex, p38, last fluff paragraph

Thanks.

Actually, if Lictors were given something like the above then I could see them being useful even if they can't assault on the first turn.

Something like this?

Chameleonic Skin: (deploys as it does currently), Stealth, also has Shroud on the turn it arrives and any turn it remains stationary. Enemies can only fire Snap Shots at it on the turn it arrives.

Terrifying Stalker: Causes Terror, creates an 18" bubble of "must use the lowest leadership" and "enemy units move as if in difficult terrain" for enemy units on the turn it arrives.

Add to that a little more lethality in combat, and I think you'd have the makings of a real disruption unit that could paralyze an enemy force for a turn, allowing you to set up a really devastating attack.

"Cannot assault on the first turn" does not have to mean "completely useless".

Stores have their stocks now, and they're shipping this week. There's no reason a specific store couldn't have given the Codex out early.

Xyptc wrote:
Actually, if Lictors were given something like the above then I could see them being useful even if they can't assault on the first turn.

Something like this?

Chameleonic Skin: (deploys as it does currently), Stealth, also has Shroud on the turn it arrives and any turn it remains stationary. Enemies can only fire Snap Shots at it on the turn it arrives.

Terrifying Stalker: Causes Terror, creates an 18" bubble of "must use the lowest leadership" and "enemy units move as if in difficult terrain" for enemy units on the turn it arrives.

Add to that a little more lethality in combat, and I think you'd have the makings of a real disruption unit that could paralyze an enemy force for a turn, allowing you to set up a really devastating attack.

"Cannot assault on the first turn" does not have to mean "completely useless".

I've made lictors work for the past 3 codexs.. Fleshhooks are your friend.

rigeld2 wrote:

 pretre wrote:
And no more steel rain for tyranids.

Mother. fether.
I mean.. I knew it was happening, we all knew it was happening... but I was hoping.

Steel rain?
Gene stealers?
No more genestealers?!?

Mycetic spores!

My friend owns a store so if they get their copies soon I'm sure that I'll get one not long after so fingers crossed

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Mycetic spores!

Oh yeah, I derped.