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This has always bothered me in sci-fi stories. Shouldn't plasma be so hot as to burn through anything, pretty much? I mean, w40k gets it pretty correct w/ plasma weapons, but all to often I notice that even GW will use generic, scientific sounding phrases whenever they feel like it. For example, look up the section of fluff in the marine codex about the physical changes to a marine's anatomy. Or, for example, how in the Halo franchise plasma pistols are horrible, and the rifles are mediocre, requiring lots of shots to kill anything.

Does anyone ever notice any of these occurrences?

Ya well, that's why 40K is cool.

Plasma is just ionized gas.

Here's an interesting hard sci-fi take on plasma weapons: http://www.projectrho.com/rocket/rocket3x2.html#plasma

On a personal note I rather prefer the notion of the "plasma" in the plasma gun to be like the plasma discharge that happens when a bolt of lightening earths itself. In that sense then, a 'plasma' weapon strips its 'photonic' hydrogen fuel of electrons to force a stream of electrons moving between the target and its muzzle aperture.

Aiming is naturally somewhat tricky, and much of the weapon is designed to absorb and disperse these excess electrons safely. Of course, if you fiddle with the safeties, then the weapon can absorb more, and thus cause more damage to its targets.

So yeah, a gun shooting steam doesn't work, but an artificial lightening bolt can, so long as you have a way of safely dissipating all those electrons you just collected to create the plasma discharge.

Actually, my friends and I agreed that it probably shoots some kind of shells, filled with a tiny plasma warhead, that ionizes on impact. This way you avoid the inevitable "how does a blast of plasma fly through 75 yards of air and stay hot at the end?" question. Of course it cools almost immediately, but by the time that happens, the target is already completely fried (having, ya know, taken place in the cooling process).

I believe 40K Plasma uses some sort of Magnetic envelope tunnel thingy...

Now you see, this

KamikazeCanuck wrote:I believe 40K Plasma uses some sort of Magnetic envelope tunnel thingy...

this is the kind of technical language I understand

http://www.stardestroyer.net/Empire/Essays/PlasmaWeapons.html

Here's an interesting essay on the topic of plasma weapons. No idea if he's right or not, as I'm still in High School.

MekanobSamael wrote:Actually, my friends and I agreed that it probably shoots some kind of shells, filled with a tiny plasma warhead, that ionizes on impact. This way you avoid the inevitable "how does a blast of plasma fly through 75 yards of air and stay hot at the end?" question. Of course it cools almost immediately, but by the time that happens, the target is already completely fried (having, ya know, taken place in the cooling process).

Tests have been run on how much man sized objects like being part of the Plasma Cooling Process. Results thus far have been informative: they do not. -Glados

Well that just ruined plasma weapons for me. Fortunately 40k has the magnetic-envelope-tunnel-thingy

One thing is the distinction between temperature (molecular kinetic energy) and heat (actual thermal energy.)

Plasma is at very very high temperatures, but you need enough of it to do some damage. Point a plasma stream at a wall, and you're bombarding it with small amounts of material at insanely high temperatures, but it's usually so sparse that at most you get a light glazing on the surface.

So I guess that the plasma weapons in Halo just don't expel that much actual material when they fire.

Gearhead wrote:So I guess that the plasma weapons in Halo just don't expel that much actual material when they fire.

Of course, that's in the games; in the books, they burn through marines like there ain't no tomorrow.

the plasma guns in 40K actually shoot "plasma"(as in ionized gas particules)

just like lasguns don't actually fire lasers. Lasguns actually are extreamly low powered plasma weapons they fire a choherent beam of plasma particules much like what was described earlier.(explaining the low damage output of flashlights)




i have imagined the plasma weapons using Magnetic accelaration to hurl a "glob" of gas molicules that a stuck together because of a attraction brough on by the magnetic fields(hence why the gas doesn't obey the laws of expansion when released by the gun)

upon contact with non gaseous matter the magnetic attraction of the "glob" is broken resulting in a rapid outward expansion of the super heated and ionized gas. this is the "explosion" that a plasma weapon creates.

hand held types release such a small amount the burst can't damage much more then a singloe target, but a larger weapon will catch multiple targets when it is released.

So...

If Bolt Guns shoot bolts, and Plasma Guns shoot plasma, then Melta Guns shoot melta, right? I think Kroot Guns just got awesomer.

Nurglitch wrote:So...

If Bolt Guns shoot bolts, and Plasma Guns shoot plasma, then Melta Guns shoot melta, right? I think Kroot Guns just got awesomer.

We need Knarloc guns.

You could probably solve the dispersion and denisty through air issues by useing a projected magnetic tunnel. This seems to be the most logical explination for "magnetic envelope tunnel thingy".

As for it being more awsome in the fluff, well everything pretty much is. In the fluff if a dreadnought is destroyed the resulting reactor meltdown levels cities.

Necroman wrote:

Nurglitch wrote:So...

If Bolt Guns shoot bolts, and Plasma Guns shoot plasma, then Melta Guns shoot melta, right? I think Kroot Guns just got awesomer.

We need Knarloc guns.

its the same argument behind Corn oil and Baby oil.


what we really need is a Meta gun.

it shoots Meta gamers at the enemy.

No we need the TFG gun, it shoots TFGs. Win Win.

^ and girl scout cookies

I've always assumed that plasma weapons fire ball of plasma which is contained in the magnetic field which dissipates when it hits something solid,but that field can be disrupted if you have a magnet.

Star Trek,
Anti-Matter, Dilythium crystals, warp drive, greatest scientific sounding fictional "science" ever.

Okay
so if someone's Marines fires a Plasma gun at my magnetised unit, it cannot be destroyed?

YAY for little magnets.

Depends, if they're the same polarity, maybe. If they're the oppsite then it's got awesome accurcy. Then they could have a little switch to fix that. Blast swerves off, switch polarity and make them regret those magnets

We already have plasma tools, but the plasma disipates shortly after contact with air, creating a short, extremely hot flame
From my research, most 40k plasma guns bypass this by firing bolts of pure plasma that are drawn to its target via some sort of magnetic field. Some work by firing plasma flame inside a ball of heat-resistant material to keep it away from air while some fire streams of flame through tunnels of ionized air, which has been ionised by a laser. Also, while in the weapon, the gasses are not in plasma form, but when fired the gasses are transformed to prevent the gun melting, but this system often fails.
Sorry its so complicated, but I got most of the info from lexicanum and wikipedia, who aren't known for simple awnsers.

White phosphorus is essentially a type of plasma, I like to think of plasma guns as shooting gobs of white phosphorus which is actually made hotter by being in open air, so it would not be cooled by the wind/air. White phosphorus continues to burn as long as it is open to oxygen, the only way to put it out is smother it, which is also why it would tear through space marine armor, kind of hard to bury yourself in the dirt then get out of your armor in the middle of a battlefield...

Remember back in 2nd edition when we had cool things like Plasma grenades and MISSILES!!! And melta missiles....

It does seem to make more sense as a warhead rather than a projected blob of whatever through the tunnel that would have to be tighter than the asses of GW Corporates...

Oh, and thermite is what melts through armor/metal- WP melts through flesh (not metal so much and defeinitely not a ceramite matrix).

I was using WP as an example of plasma mate, which it is. I did not state it burns through metal, and it DOES burn through far more then flesh, it basically ignites anything that is ignitable, if it can catch fire, WP will ignite it, so on a space marine, maybe not their armor, but any bandoliers or combustible materials on the outside of their suits, and the heat could in theory get hot enough to ignite whatever rounds they have for their own guns to shoot. It is also cheap and easy to make.

Necroman wrote:

Gearhead wrote:So I guess that the plasma weapons in Halo just don't expel that much actual material when they fire.

Of course, that's in the games; in the books, they burn through marines like there ain't no tomorrow.

I guess plasma weapons in Halo are nerfed for game balance kind of like why we can't use Movie Marines to play 40k with. But yea, in the books, very deadly.

daedalus-templarius wrote:

Necroman wrote:

Gearhead wrote:So I guess that the plasma weapons in Halo just don't expel that much actual material when they fire.

Of course, that's in the games; in the books, they burn through marines like there ain't no tomorrow.

I guess plasma weapons in Halo are nerfed for game balance kind of like why we can't use Movie Marines to play 40k with. But yea, in the books, very deadly.

Does everyone have personal sheilds in the books though?

I imagine that if it fires a blob of plasma, it will be, for the most part, spherical.

The outside of the blob cools and hardens, until it becomes very much like a paintball.
When it hit a solid object, the shell splits, with the contents bursting out.

Thus why plasma cannon shots 'explode'

Just my 2p

S_P

Well firstly, there is both hot and cold plasma. Yes the hot plasma would pretty much melt anything you shot it at. But thats real worldy stuff explaining a fantasy game.

So in games and stuff, its just as strong as the people that make the game make it. I mean I could make up a game where people drink plasma to heal themselves, and the strongest gun in the game is a cottonball launcher. Dont get caught out in the open with that puppy on the table........seriously its a puppy with a cottonball launching gun on its back

See my point?