Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

Edit: Flamebait comment removed to maintain civility

--yakface

Pwnt!

Anyway, I want to thank GW for the FAQs. I disagree with some of their calls, but I prefer to take a clear ruling I disagree with to a rules ambiguity a billion times over.

Seriously. I do hope they put out the FAQ for the rulebook soon.

It is funny how much people love to hate GW!

I have always been a fan of GW games, since I started playing FB in 1997. Over the years, I became more of a grudging fan, disatisfied with the rules and constant price increases, and what seem liked careless game and figure design.

However, GW's recent moves have won me over, and I've gotten to be an enthusiastic fan instead of a grudging one.

5th ed. has largely fixed my complaints with 40k, the new models (Dark Elves, Vampires, even Space Marine Vets) are beautiful. The Baneblade is a fantastic kit, and their vehicle kits in general are getting better and better. Apocalypse is a ton of fun.

The release of the guard codex will be the final measure of GW coolness for me, either driving me into paroxysms of glee or returning me to my former state of grudging fan.

I really have to say a big thanks to Migs to show that there are still some happy people out there.
Something I've realised both here and on a few other forums is the amount of very vocal negativity that people have been throwing out there recently. Everything seems to be HORRIBLE

Every codex rumour, every model, every change in rules- there are huge number of posts (not necissarily people) in many places saying how rubbish everything is and how evil GW are.

But they are a very vocal minority.

There have been improvements- things are making a definate turn for the better in that quality is up, quanity is up, prices are actually down on some things- and most importantly the game is becoming more fun and I'd even hazard to say balanced.....

I have really liked alot of the releases over the last little while- heck even the CSM book that gets so much flak, I find to be quite good and a nice change from the book that required a week to write your army list by waiding through all the unused options....

Things are getting better- and it just makes me happy to see it so. Shame some people don't share that view and decide to yell it from the roof

They support the game well enough.. but not the veteran players

and try talking to any of their former employees to get a different spin on the company

I gamed with a lot of former and current GW employees and they like the company. They may not have liked retail sales, but they didn't say anything negative about GW.

Maybe your experience was different (i am assuming you refer to yourself) but that in no way means ALL their employees hate GW.

IMO WD hasn't been readable for a few years, but the 30th anniversary was where it ate .

No complaints about GW though. I remember their mail-order staff used to get in touch if you hadn't ordered anything in a while and offer you a free White Dwarf, but WD is so bad now that they probably stopped out of common decency.

Games Workshop has.....

Extremely nasty litigious reputation and has taken competitiors to court over trivial issues in order to bleed them dry. (Warzone)

They have what can best be described as retards running the games design studio.

They cannot get their prices right.

The company has a low operating profit despite its high prices and high turnover due to its monolithic inefficiency.

Too many old crusties in high position in the company who really should have been put out to pasture long ago.

Love to plagiarise, but scream about plagiarism and IP rights of their own.

I am not stranger to talking smack about GW.



However credit where credit is due......

GW has not upsticks and moved it manufacturing to China. Privateer Press and Wizkids can make cheap prepaints because they use capitalist/communist workers (read you get profits they get no rights) paid a pittance in the Far East to make them. I have no end of respect for GW for that.

When GW trolls mess up an order they put it right and then some. I always get a good kickback from the trolls.

GW staff are in general polite and loyal to the company, staff theft and betrayal is all but unheard of.

They pay their retail workers above the market rate for retail staff. This is still not a lot, but sighificantly more than they would get in a store elsewhere.

GW employs school leavers, they give teenage part time staff a go and dont discriminate against them. You love the hobby are 18 and want a job, GW will let you work part time, this gets young workers out of the unemployment trap. They also employ student workers.

They give their own staff a reasonably healthy staff discount, and decent training.

Their miniatures quality is damn good. The number of exceptions are few and far between amongst the huge ammount of stock they produce.

They dont farm that out to the Far East either.

They produce a well stocked hobby industry and give production weighting even to underused unit choices. Squats being the most notable exception.

There is no political correct namby-pambyism in their game background. The Imperium is not a syrupy sweet Star Trek Federation or Star Wars Galactic Republic.

Orlanth wrote:Games Workshop has.....

Extremely nasty litigious reputation and has taken competitiors to court over trivial issues in order to bleed them dry. (Warzone)

Can you cite your references? I cannot find the case either on Westlaw nor Lexis Nexis.

Personally i could not be happier with the huge big bugs box discount GW just released, good models at good prices... also the plastics are getting considerably better, specially 28mm man sized minis.

At the moment I'm quite happy with whats going on in GW. I even got a WD a thing i stoped buying years and years ago.

inquisitor_bob wrote:

Orlanth wrote:Games Workshop has.....

Extremely nasty litigious reputation and has taken competitiors to court over trivial issues in order to bleed them dry. (Warzone)

Can you cite your references? I cannot find the case either on Westlaw nor Lexis Nexis.

I think he's referring to the way that GW jealously guards its IP in all areas....including eBay, etc.

I can understand this. I also agree and disagree with the statement Inquisitor_bob made regarding plagiarism. I belive GW has ripped off almost every area of historic fanatasy and modern Sci-fi...shamelessly.

Necrons = Terminator
The whole Genestealers thang = Aliens
Horus Heresy = The Bible
The Emporer = The Bible, Bhuddism, Eastern Philosophy
Eldar = Tolkiens Elves
Orks = c'mon that aint new
Inquisition = Inquisition, Blade Runner

Now while this seems like a really bad thing, I do think its absolutely great the way that they have taken all of these ideas and built them into a coherant and viable whole.

This is going off topic, back to the GW love-fest!

It is nice to see that people have really stopped seeing GW as the "evil-corporation". Part of that is due to positive steps GW has taken: listening to the fan-base, reaching out through the web and specifically the various podcasts out there and discussion boards, and in general improvements in rules and the quality of the product. I have always been a fan of GW, pointing out the things I haven't liked (like the dismal FAQ schedule) but also defending them from the unsupported claims of wrong-doing just to sell us more models. I'm glad to see that I won't be in the minority on Dakka anymore.

Ozymandias, King of Kings

inquisitor_bob wrote:

Can you cite your references? I cannot find the case either on Westlaw nor Lexis Nexis.

Orlanth wrote:
There is no political correct namby-pambyism in their game background. The Imperium is not a syrupy sweet Star Trek Federation or Star Wars Galactic Republic.

Yes it is true that the Imperium is not a shiny happy place, quite the reverse. I admit that I am not that much into the fluff of 40k, my knowledge comes from the rulebook(s) and codexes. I have only read one novel (the Sisters of Battle one).

I find the Imperium to be too dark. It seems that it is all about war, genocide and "Look! One heretic on a planet. Quick wipe out the entire population!". The fluff feels too dark in my opinion. I realise that the Imperium is not a nice place but a good story requires some heroes as well. You need some light and hope as contrast to the darkness and despair.

I think PP does this well with both good and bad heroes among all factions. Ok, maybe Cryx is the exception. The world makes sense (as much as a Fantasy setting can of course).

Even Warzone and the Mutant Chronicles fluff had in a way a more realistic world (again given the setting). You had the big corporations scheming against eachother and also honest folks just trying to make a living.

Hellfury wrote:Because they love the game and want changes made to better the system?

Nah that cant be it.
All people who complain are simply cottonheaded ninny muggins who whine needlessly and have no merit to their complaints.

It isn't the complaints that puzzle me, but the level of drama involved. Every change, even if it's only rumoured, beckons the end of GW, the miniatures hobby, Western Civilisation and Western Spiral of the galaxy.

Even if the game really was about to be utterly destroyed, the level of drama is generally excessive. That the changes are often so minor... or are rumours that don't even pan most of the time... just makes the whole phenomenon quite bizarre.


Meanwhile GW chugs along doing what they've done for the longest time. Producing gorgeous miniatures and straight forward beer and pretzels games to use your miniatures in. Along the way they've brought more kids into miniatures than the rest of the market combined.

NaZ
They support the game well enough.. but not the veteran players

and try talking to any of their former employees to get a different spin on the company

As a former employee myself, the main problem is that veteran staff are treated in much the same way as veteran players.

By which I mean - "What? You're not equally as excited in everything as you were when you first started and expect us to do more for you?"

I have seen some of the best hobby staff the company ever had forced to leave because there are simply no prospects. The wages are shoddy and don't increase with time.
I asked about this once and was told that 'according to EU law, you can't pay people doing the same job different rates'. Really! You'd better tell that to teachers, nurses, council employees, etc, who get a year-on-year salary increase for doing the same job to represent their experience.

I understand that GW needs to get new people into the hobby, and therefore has to cater to that market. But aren't existing players just as worthy of consideration?
I understand they are a business and have to look after their overheads. But looking after your loyal staff is an investment. Experienced staff are much more likely to increase sales across the board, as well as making the stores better and making newer staff more capable. Isn't that worth a wage that you can actually live on? Rather than people being forced to leave so they can get jobs that actually pay the rent?

Good thread - a clear indication the direction is right, I think GW ought to know that aswell as when they are going the wrong way.

Good thread - a clear indication the direction is right, I think GW ought to know that aswell as when they are going the wrong way.

I'd agree Migs.

GW, however not perfect as they are, are certainly moving in the right direction.

WD is improving. They seem to be responding to feedback.

40k is improving - 4th to 5th. They seem to be responding to feedback.

Anyone see a connection?

I can't complain. I like where they're going.

sebster wrote:It isn't the complaints that puzzle me, but the level of drama involved. Every change, even if it's only rumoured, beckons the end of GW, the miniatures hobby, Western Civilisation and Western Spiral of the galaxy.

Please tell me the hyperbole above was intentional, otherwise you've made just about the most ironic statement I've seen in a while.

Talk about 'drama'...

BYE

w00t!

Orlanth wrote:However credit where credit is due......

{snip}
They pay their retail workers above the market rate for retail staff. This is still not a lot, but sighificantly more than they would get in a store elsewhere.

GW employs school leavers, they give teenage part time staff a go and dont discriminate against them. You love the hobby are 18 and want a job, GW will let you work part time, this gets young workers out of the unemployment trap. They also employ student workers.

They give their own staff a reasonably healthy staff discount, and decent training.

They also have very good benefits for thier staff, including health insurance, dental etc. 401k.. At least they did when I worked there.

I don't usually post much, but I had to comment on this thread. I'm one of the rare people who was a PP fanboy, but I've grown tired of WM and hordes and am coming back to 40k. 5th ed sounds like its fun and I am not alone in my group. So good on you GW and thanks!

I am glad to see a thread with minimal GW bashing. Im 16, and would like to get a job as one of their staff when I leave school, just as a Uni job. Has anyone else here worked for GW in the past and would like to tell their stories, good or bad?