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Maybe some small persistent warp storms like the Maelstrom would open across the Galaxy, potentially even becoming mobile like the Eldar Craftworlds, bringing ruin wherever they show up.

That would suck then, daemons would pour out from all these tears and everything would be destroyed.

INCOMING WALL OF TEXT:

What if they took the opprotunity to use M39999 as the break point to start a whole new game with a clean slate as far as rules go let there be 40k 6th ed.

But then make 41k or what ever you want to call it. Which can have more depth to it like WFB, but keep the space theme stuff. Remold armies, let them still use the 40k models but change things up like: The Emperor is back the primarchs are around again, and battling their deamon counterparts. The Emperor can have rules for Apoc much like their are rumored to make for the C'Tan. They have already got rules for Angaron, the other Primarchs can't be that hard. The Emperor is here after referred to as =E= or Emperor.

You could make a specific army for the Emperor that is like light side version of Chaos Daemons. Composed of all the countless billions that have fallen in the last 10K years. You can summon a Saint, The "dead" primarchs are "angelic" version of the daemon ones, more units like the Legion of the Damned," sisters, SMs, and GK's as a basic troop choice.

Schism factions that don't believe in the Emperor Reascendant, so you can still have regular marines, IG, or =I=. Perhaps they view it as some Hersey perpetuated by Chaos and truely believe they are in the End of All Time. Cue dark broody, paranoiac music.

The Eldar have all died off in the great cataclysm that ends the last millenium, but their death creates the Death God their prophecy foretold. Which then beats Slannesh like a bad puppy, and frees many of the "eaten" souls. Death God (TM) kick over papa Nurgle's cage that holds the eldar godess of fertility. She is so distraught at the Eldar Races passing that she strikes a deal with death god. She gets back enough souls to restart the race but promises they have to go to the death god when they die rather than being reborn. Keeping the death god in balance with Slannesh for the foreseeable future. So the Eldar are back in much the same manner but are a growing race again, not just sllllooooowwwwwlllyyy dying. Maybe this change in the Eldar can alter how they play to some extent? DE still exist attempting to Appease She who Thirsts?

Tau have both benefited and suffered. The constant threat of extinction from the Imperium is now lifted, but the =E= won't tolerate the Greater Good interfering with humanities rise. The Tau are kept on as Scientists and builders but they are treated as second class citizens. None too thrilled at this commander Broken Knife (?) the successor to Far Sight begins leading a guerrilla war to take back what is "rightfully" the Tau's territory.

Necrons emerge as one of the dominant forces to face the Imperium. The last great battle of the 41st millenium caused great upheaval, in many sense. The raging battle between the Eldar Death God and Slannesh warp regions of space horribly. One of these was the area that contains the Dyson Sphere that the outsider slept in. The warping of realspace rent great gashes in the sphere waking the Outsider from his eons of slumber. Night bringer and the Deceiver created an uneasy alliance to battle him, and progress their own plans. The outsider has torn huge chunks out of the local region he woke in.

The Tyrannids rapacious as ever have chewed further and further into the Imperium. With the core hive mind drawing ever closer to the galaxy attacks have become more effective and ever larger. If this threat is not dealt with soon it threatens to overwhelm whole segmentums.

Ghazgull finally rallies a Wagh great enough to obliterate all the defenses on Armageddon. And beings marching off to where ever he wants cuz who's gonna tell and 4000 pound ork where to sleep or fight? Maybe bump him up to Apoc stats, and create "The hand of Ghazgull" for regular games?

Chaos well I don't know what to do that isn't horribly horribly cliche. Break out of the Eye? pushed in and have it start to close? have them start surging out of alternate tears in realspace? As Slannesh is pushed back by the Eldar God of Death the other three Chaos gods are left to deal with =E= and the threat the C'Tan pose. They are able to grasp greater power with Slannesh so beaten, but will it be enough to repulse the revived =E=? I don't know?

Durandal is right it would just feel... bad to eliminate Humanity or chaos so it will proberly be... um... another hive fleet or the tau go to the 4th sphere expansion

Tau perfecting "Long Range Burst Jump Warp Engine" which allows them to greatly increase thier scope & influence in the empire..

Another great choas crusade is met by the emergence of a few more seemily untainted eldar craftworlds from the eye of terror.

Hive Fleet Siren from above the galatic plane.

MOAR necrons.

Mankind doesnt die out.

They could name the new game "Dark Millennium", since that's been in use on and off already.

Caleth wrote:

What if they took the opprotunity to use M39999 as the break point to start a whole new game with a clean slate as far as rules go let there be 40k 6th ed.

Because THIS just happened?

999.M41

Third invasion of Armageddon led by Ork Warlord Ghazghkull Mag Uruk Thraka. Inquisitor Apollyon detects taint of Chaos on Thracia. Ultramarines defeat Nightlords and traitor PDF units. Turning point in campaign is taking of bridge two-four. Magos Trantor puts forward theories for the workings of Necrontyr weapons. Inquisitor Apollyon reports on the excavation of Adeptus Mechanicus geno-lab on Incunabla by Explorator Marco Pteronus. Secrets regarding the Cursed Founding, five thousand years earlier, are revealed. Creed becomes Lord Castellan of Cadia after members of the Cadian High Command are murdered.

Sources: WD260; WD262; WD264; Codex: Necrons 3rd ed; WD283

Feel free to write the rules for HeroHammer 41K if that's the game you'd rather play, but fluff-wise we're already deep into that millenium.

I like to think that the Emperor is just as likely dead as he is alive. The God metaphor is strong with this one. The thousands of psykers sacrificed to him every day... well, actually psykers are just bloody dangerous. The High Lords of Terra... of course the Emperor tells them what to do. As if they'd just do whatever they wanted . The Golden Throne? The Big Grave-Stone.

Still, if you say it too loud you'll be branded traitor and chopped into paté.

Herohammer? I'm talking about a more complex version of the basic streamlined game that can make a little more sense in how game play represents fluff. Guardsmen and Tau running as fast as a Leman Russ tank or an Eldar? Terminators going down like chumps to bad luck rolls? Orks nobs having magic bikes, and doctors that can operate while driving at break neck speeds? I'm sure there are more.

I'm just talking about a reintroduction of some of the old rules that could allow for better balance and more sensible situations. As for the fluff, that's my interest. I might have pegged the wrong millennium.. since getting that numbering system straight makes my brain hurt. But the idea of Appoc having epic heroes in it, and Horrid Villains is the whole point isn't it? I also think the god metaphor is more of the shiny sliver of hope in the grim darkness.

What I was trying to portray was that even though hope had emerged a new it had a long hard slog in front of it.

Longtime Dakka visitor, but this thread made me finally join. Sweet post Ginric!

Here are my thoughts:

The Emperor Dies or Awakens: Personally, I don't see this ever, ever, ever happening. To many dustcovers and intro's would need to be changed by BL to ever have this happen. However, I think this would be a brave step by Games Workshop if they did.

Return of the "Purged Legions" II & XI: They were foreshadowed by Dan Abnett in False Gods and The Lightning Tower. Horus himself saw his fellow brother Primarch as it struggled in the incubation tank in the vaults under the Emperors Palace on Terra. Who knows if these Primarchs exist and if they do, how did they create their own "legion"? Perhaps they did recover from the scattering and flourished, after a fashion but were burned from all record. With the Heresy series allowing everyone and their mum to jump in the wayback machine, it's entirely possible to introduce them. I could see them coming into the fray.

I know, I know... Games Workshop asserts that these two "missing" legions are merely a story telling device to encourage gamers to create their own legions. To that I say "No. fething. Way." These are two First Founding legions that no one knows about and the possibilities are endless.

The Dragon Awakes: Mechanicum seemed to be one large nod towards the dormant C'tan god a stone's throw to Terra (anyone else get that feeling?). I wouldn't be surprised if he finally woke up, looked on Terra and decided to go take some revenge on the disabled Emperor who imprisoned him in the first place.

Sufficed to say that the Imperium would be thrown into an incredible schism and Mars would become the new Armaggeddon and Ecclesiarchy and Inquisitorial forces would rape that red rock for all it's worth. This to would be an incredible storyline as I could see the Mechanicum as a new entity in the galactic war for supremecy, creating allies among the Tau and Eldar, respectively.

The Eye Opens, Permanently: One of these days, Abbaddon will finally pull it off and destroy Cadia or at least eradicate the pylons that hold the Eye in check. No more mega-weapons, no more fail. Finally an established beach head in realspace, on Cadia. The capital would be called "Horusville".

The Necrons March: All the fluff thus far has pointed to the Necrons getting woken up here and there on various tomb-worlds but no large scale awakening from their millenia long slumber. The lore talks about how they were defeated once at great cost by the Eldar. It would be nice to see them truly rise back up... though I feel this would have to correspond with the return of The Dragon on Mars or The Outsider. One means the Mechanicum truly loses their gak, and the other means the Eldar realize that Vaul is really a toaster and experience religion fail.

I'd love for this to happen but Games Workshop really needs to revamp the mini's and the codex. Just saying.

Return of the Primarchs: The tale of Warhammer 40,000 has always been an "11th Hour" story, so as we've huddled in the idea that everything and everyone is one bad bottle of amesac away from universal destruction, it seems that this would be the time when the Primarchs finally return - or emerge.

You have the Traitor Legions who has most of their Primarchs still alive but essentially "bound" inside the Eye to their respective homeworld. Then you have the Primarchs like Russ who are on walkabout, or Guilliman who is in protective stasis, et cetera. I'd love to see Russ come back and lead his flying rodent gak legion on a Great Hunt, tracking down his fallen brothers.

The interesting thing about the Horus Heresy book series is that it opens a whole universe - literally - of possibilities. As the history of the 40,000 universe is explored, brought into detail and into the collective consciousness of we the fans, it is entirely possible they could use this as a precurser to further expand on the consequences of that time. I could see the Dark Angels secret heresy finally exposed and the legio goes on the run from the Inquisition and former battle brothers.

In summation: The II and XI Lost Legions return, The Dragon wakes up, Abbaddon finally takes Cadia, and Russ comes back to lead his sons on the largest pub crawl ever.

Not bad for your first post Zahaladeen, but destroy Cadia? That would never happen. That is GW best selling Imp Army. I do like some of your other theories.

GW needs to do something completely revolutionary for the next edition, or they risk going the way of Warzone or Vor. Or perhaps I need to get ahead of the trend and just start playing Warmachine and Flames or War and not look back.

warpcrafter wrote:GW needs to do something completely revolutionary for the next edition, or they risk going the way of Warzone or Vor.

You are joking right?

One of the resons GW has been around so long is because they don't do anything revolutionary every time the do a rulebook re-tool. Every ponce in a while they move things - it started essentually during the Heresy (Rogue Trader / Adeptus Mechanicus games). Moved forward - just a little in big story, had a fer story altering campaigns. Kill off a few characters, intriducer a few new races, shoehorned them into the storyline. But nothing big and revolutionary. Because it ain't broke. They make some dumb decisions from time to time but All and all keeping most of it the same is the key.

Believe me even the one off primarch scenarios from a few years back pet a fet of the High Lords of Workshop the wrong way. Don't ecpast anything super big to change.

Fluff power wise

Space marines (and co) will go down a peg - because that makes them more grimdark

Chaos will go down a peg - as they just don't seem to like them anymore. Despite the fact that the majority of the feel and fluff of the game revolves around them.

Necrons will go up two pegs because they're not actually that deep or interesting, but they are new

Tyrinids will go up a peg because kids like dinosaurs

Orks will go up a peg because they don't sell well unless pushed

Elder will go down a peg as thats more emo

Tau will go up a peg, because big guns are only cool if the army is win

Dark elder... we have dark elder?

New Army will come along and be several buckets of win!!!! Hurrah! Hooray! Who needs well thought out fluff if we can just write it in that they are win!

Kung Fu Jim wrote:Not bad for your first post Zahaladeen, but destroy Cadia? That would never happen. That is GW best selling Imp Army. I do like some of your other theories.

You're right. Maybe not destroy Cadia but at least create a forward base - make it contested.

Name goeshere, the Tyranids would go down a peg. Tyranids are the only army that has progressively gotten worse with every codex released for them.

I'd like to see planetfall follow the Sabbot wars. Imp Guard, Chaos...yes please.

Railguns wrote:Name goeshere, the Tyranids would go down a peg. Tyranids are the only army that has progressively gotten worse with every codex released for them.

Sorry I mean fluff wise, not rules. Fluff would reflect the Tyranids as probably threat no2 with Necs being 1, Orks being 3, chaos prob being 94 or something, after obesity and underage drinking

I cannot see Games Workshop ever making any significant advancements to the story line. They are not writing novels, they provide `flavour'. They may decide to tweak the flavour a little between editions, to fit whatever they want it to at the time, but there will never be any significant movement in it. If this game reaches the 10th edition, Humanity will be on the edge of destruction, Chaos will be attempting to conquer the galaxy but not quite getting enough of a foot hold, the Orks will be fighting on Armageddon, the Eldar will be but a heartbeat from extinction, a Tyranid hive fleet will be threatening the galaxy, and so on. Space Dwarves may indeed be back, but the addition of new races would be the biggest `advancement' I could see them making.

Caleth wrote:doctors that can operate while driving at break neck speeds?

If we are talking Painboyz, that seems pretty fluffy to me. It is an Ork: why operate normally when you could do it with more dakka, more bling and lots of roaring noise and smoke? Besides, if he believes he can do it, he can. The others you could easily justify changing, but this seems fine to me.

Mad Docs on bikes speeding up alongside the injured ork and slamming a syringe of squig-gleaned uppers into him, less fixing, more 'fixing'...

ginric99 wrote:there is a sense that Gamesworkshop may be about to shake up the 40K universe and actually advance the story in a drastic way.

Pfft! No.

It's been 99.M41 for 20 years now. It's never going to change. This isn't BattleTech where in 25 years the plotline has advanced 50 years.

BYE

Ever heard the expression, the more you know of your past the better you know your future. The conclusion to the heresy novels are bound to shake up the story. Legion is a good example of this.

H.B.M.C. wrote:Pfft! No.

It's been 99.M41 for 20 years now. It's never going to change. This isn't BattleTech where in 25 years the plotline has advanced 50 years.
BYE

As a former Battletech player I have to admit it was nice that the story moved forward. It gave reasons to how Mechs got varients, not just "Oh it existed for eons, but as a IG Commander you never knew of it until this very moment."

The problems that has popped up for me is that two objects cannot occupy the same space at the same time. So how would you(just examples) fit squats back in when they just died out to the nids, how would Abbadon go on another crusade, how does another war for armageddon happen when everything is shoved up to the edge of 999M41.

IMHO I think WH40K needs to drop the 40k and go with another name and get some forward movement just to get a little design space back. I personally think they've been writing themselves into a corner fluff-wise for a while now and need room to get out of the fluff they are stuck with.

Just a thought

UsdiThunder wrote:The problems that has popped up for me is that two objects cannot occupy the same space at the same time. So how would you(just examples) fit squats back in when they just died out to the nids, how would Abbadon go on another crusade, how does another war for armageddon happen when everything is shoved up to the edge of 999M41.

IMHO I think WH40K needs to drop the 40k and go with another name and get some forward movement just to get a little design space back. I personally think they've been writing themselves into a corner fluff-wise for a while now and need room to get out of the fluff they are stuck with.

Just a thought

If you haven't noticed since the eye of terror campaign we are now in the 42nd millennium. look, heres a timeline on lexicanum, with m42 on it.

Then why can't it move forward? If EOT is on M42 then what is all the hoopla of being 999M41, 11th hour, and all that Jazz. The BRB has it @ the precipice of the 41st century.

GW needs to unify and cannonize the fluff so that we as players have a clue of what's going on, but that would be like playtesting codexes, or common sense.

GW doesn't seem to mind jumping about in the time line to tell a story or set the stage for a campaign. Watson's "Inquisition War" occurred before squats became a Nid appetizer and the Eisenhorn series happened before Nids were even discovered. In my opinion, 40,000 is just a placeholder.

Also, the effects of the Immaterium make such time lines irrelevant as literally anything can pop out of the warp and say "Oh crap... what year is it?"

As for new storytelling on the horizon, I think there are some opportunities available though I share HBMC's doubt as to whether or not GW will actually take advantage of them.

However, 10 years ago I never would have guessed GW had it in them to make the Heresy series, yet here they are.

The potential is there. They just need some steel in their spine and actually go forth and create something new.

Bah stop looking towards terra for ideas. If GW need to do anything its advertise the lesser known races, If there was some way to make eldar "reborn" in a sense that they could return to the great war with the rising necrons then I would be very happy. New campaigns with battles between Eldar and necrons, and another campaign that closes the book on Hive fleet Kraken and the orks. This way we get a rare campaign focused on everything not imperium related. Am I the only one who would like that?

As the Tau grow and their tech and Allies take them deeper into the warp the Old ones plan will start to unveil as the warp starts to calm in the wake of their passing.

At that same time the Void Dragon is unleashed and begins a spearhead towards Terra. This Spearhead encounters another force moving towards the same target. In order to not be deprived of the prize the Necrons attack Hive Fleet Jormungandr, central core of the Hive mind.
The hive proves to be the perfect never ending food supply for the necrons but are so vicious that the battle goes into perpetual balance.

This balance occurs way to close to Terra for there to be any peace and effectively cuts Terra off from the Segmentums Tempestus to Ultima. The battle is constantly running into the Terran planetary defenses.

Seeing the chance and motivated by a calming of the warp Chaos chooses to strike out from the Eye of Terror. There power magnified by humanities constant evolution towards being a psychic race.

Having forseen such the Eldar commit all of their forces Except Iyanden and Altoic to help the humans stop the Slannesh led invasion. The Two craftworlds on the other side of the galaxy have the hands full trying to protec the hive worlds fro theTyranid splinter fleet remnants.

The Orks seeing these occurances as signs of the return of Gork and Mork launch a massive WAAAUUGGGHHH to claim as much of the galaxy as possible and thus brings them to Ork nirvahna, War everywhere.

The dark Eldar Start off by capitalizing on the chaos to raid. But, in order to Stave off Slannesh's waxing power they have to start waging all out war rather than raids to supply them with the souls necessary to ward them from the chaos god. This all out approach ends up revealing the location of Commorragh.

With th supply lines interrupted the IG and SM chapters are in a deperate battle in every corner of the galaxy. So they are fighting every one with the exception of the Eldar and Tau. While occasional conflict through the Inquisition or SM chapters dedicated to such still occur, tacit non-agression agreements are made.

In these Dark Hours new truths will be revealed, unheard of alliances formed, and momentous thing will occur to fulfill various prophesies.

The Tau who will already have allied with the Thexian Elite will supply non-emperor warp travel assistance, technology, and logistical support to the Imperium for larger uncontested fourth sphere expansion just as long as the worlds are not occupied by humans. This will be heralded as the greatest Tau victory for not having to resort to use of the Fire Caste.

Because the Tau's capacity to assist will be limited by the small size of their empire the Humans will be forced to turn to the Eldar who agree to help in exchange for assistance in defending the exodite worlds and fighting the Slanneshi invasion.

A critical new race or sub-race will appear and the Adeptus mechanicus will unlock the vaults of knowledge and bring forth the greatest Technological marvels that man ever created. They will also reveal that now free of the oppresive yoke of the bueracracy, they have had the understanding of tech all along and are able to repair almost all STC if provided enough power and supplies.

Russ will return with the fruit from the tree of life but cannot fight his way to the emperor. Then Cypher will appear and be shown as the Hero Primarch Lion'el Johnson. He will free his father by slaying him with a shot from his Bolter and the is where it will end. The emperor dies and the galaxy at war. Or does he? Is the shot a Death Stroke or an injection from the Tree of Life?

7th ed will be the return of the ki...oh wait Emperor.

Well, here's my take:

I think gw is definitely gearing up for something big in the 40k universe. Whenever they finish the Heresy series we will probably see a new series announced that will shake things up. The interest in the fluff that the Heresy has created is making gw a ton of money, and I think they did this on purpose to see if a new model of writing novels will work. That model being a large continuous series written by "top" writers for the bl, similar to what recently went down with the last 2 Star Wars series, which totaled over 30 books! With the financial success, and renewed interest generated by the Heresy novels gw now has a viable and profitable reason to continue expanding the fluff.

Also the Heresy is showing us new depth to characters like the primarchs, which were nothing but pictures in the codex's for the past 20+ years.

I actually got into the game by reading the books, and from reading every bl book I could get my hands on I have noticed that things in the 40k universe seem to be coalescing into a single point.

The ultramarines series, (by far gw favorite army) references the C'tan, the Tyrannids, and Chaos. And not in a generic, "hurr, let's go kill those aliens/heretics/mutants" way, but in a "this shh is serious, to be contiued" kind of way. Nightbringer woke up, new Hive fleet is approaching, and Abbaddon is collecting pure geneseed.

You have new references to the 13th company in the last SW novel, still fighting the good fight.

Blood Angels have been dealt a severe blow and are almost destroyed by chaos. Also many references are made in these books to the Word Bearers working under direct orders from Abbaddon, and that a major offensive is being prepared.

Titanicus introduced us to new unrest, and dogmatic infighting within the Mechanicum. References also made to a new offensive being undertaken by the Imperium, making use of SM, IG, and Titan legions.

I think we'll see the Mechanicum quickly succumb to the Void Dragon. The emp will die, but everything is still going according to his plan. He will ascend to Godhood in the form of the starchild. You will see some SM primarchs return, namely Russ, Guilliman and the other one who got lost in the webway (Corax?) The Inquisition will unite behind the Lords of Terra in opposition to the Starchild. Alpha Legion will be welcomed back into the fold as the Starchild's first legion in the new era. The Black legion will gain a foothold in the galaxy and begin a new campaign against pretty much everybody, but I belive 4 chaos gods themselves will begin a massive campaign against the Starchild, using their own legions. So there will be the Undivided legions, but also the cultists. Tau will be ignored for awhile, as will orks for meantime, and the Eldar/DE will begin to lose control of the webway to the new Starchild's Empire. Gradually the SM legions will come to the side of the Primarchs, and the Starchild.

It's just my thoughts on what they could do, it's by no means certain. But as you can see, with a little imagination there is still PLENTY of warfare to be had if they decide to do a major shakedown in the story.

Whilst I don't think anything as substantial as that will hapen (as it would change the whole set up of 40k), I do think we are going to see more references to things like the starchild prophecy in future black library novels. They still have paths very open to them which they can take to throw what we believe is the truth off course. I for one am anticipating something we really don't expect to happen when the heresy series gets around to the battle on terra.

Out of interest Lint, does Abdaddon actually feature in the ultramarine series?

Lint wrote:and the other one who got lost in the webway (Corax?)

kahn I think, it's one of the boring page filler primarchs anyway.

1. Starchild Prophecy: I can't say I cared much for the Starchild Prophecy or all that "sensei" rubbish. To my scarred mind, it smacked too much of George Lucas.

2. Abbaddon has not featured in any of the current Ultramarine novels.

3. Khan is currently somewhere in the Dark Eldar realm of Comoraggh where is most likely in gimp costume serving the filthy Xenos scum Lemon Drop martinis.