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Belphegor wrote:All wrong

The Necron Pariahs and Immortals are clear the most over-priced miniatures in the GW line.

Really, over 120 dollars for a unit made of old sculpts. Really?

They're plastics are reasonably priced, though. (just look how much a WWII model kit costs)

Try buying a full unit of Tyranid Gargoyles.

More than $340 for a Fast Attack choice that die to ANYTHING looking sternly at them.

I'm surprised no one has brought up the FW Bunker that's not actually for sale, but is still listed on the webpage with the texa$ price tag.

BFG kroot warsphere: $66.

Manchu wrote:
Being flippant can't save you from the facts . . .



10 models/$42.99



10 models/$30.00

Which Eldar can you more easily afford?

For one thing, Houseguard Riflemen are metal, whilst DA are plastics. Nice Cherry Picking. If you want to compare PP prices to GW prices, unit for unit, go for like materials, such as Exemplar Bastions(5 Plastic Models) for $44.99 vs Terminators(5 Plastic Models) for $50.

TheFirstBorn wrote:its 700 due to all of that stuff you get..

It's 748.50... because thats exactly what it costs to buy it all separately (assuming you use 2 Imperial Strongpoint kits, which are still available direct, rather than buying the Bastions/Defense Lines separately).

The Realm of Battle "bundles" don't offer a single dime of savings over buying the board itself and everything else separately.

Meganobs are expensive. About $10 - 12 each, so for a full unit of 10, you are spending up to $120 before tax.

And yes, I paid it (over 2 years).

The prices here in Japan are extortionately high. With the exchange rate, a battleforce box, or battalion box for that matter is $136 US, $143 CAD, 83GBP. The Games Day mini is $34 US before tax
Last month, when the rates were different it was a lot higher. It is cheaper to buy from the UK discount stores and have it shipped here. Waiting 6 weeks kind of blows, but $40 difference is a lot over time.

Empire Greatswords Price: £24.45 This box set contains 10 multi-part plastic Empire Greatswords

JohnHwangDD wrote:Under the latest WM2 rules, those Elves should be way less than DA - a Heavy Warjack is 6 to 10 pts under WM2, and a standard skirmish is 15 pts per side.

Those Riflemen come in at eight points for the ten of them.

Solorg wrote:Meganobs are expensive. About $10 - 12 each, so for a full unit of 10, you are spending up to $120 before tax.

And yes, I paid it (over 2 years).

But at least that unit has a big points cost - $120 for about 500 points? Much better than the aforementioned Tyranid gargoyles. Nicer models too.

Here I am defending GW prices. That's how I know I'm in too deep

It has to be the empire greatswords. I was shocked and stunned when i went to the FLGS to buy some of these and saw the price. I expected them to be around $50AU, but as much as i thought they looked great i couldnt get em. 10 plastic minis for $75AU... madness! I dont think there is any other comparable GW product that costs this much. I was totally blindsided by that price-tag. K-POW!!!

Baneblade. $90 for a plastic tank. ONE PLASTIC TANK!!!

Skaven slaves!

At $15 for two it get real expensive when they are 2 points each.

George Spiggott wrote:

JohnHwangDD wrote:Under the latest WM2 rules, those Elves should be way less than DA - a Heavy Warjack is 6 to 10 pts under WM2, and a standard skirmish is 15 pts per side.

Those Riflemen come in at eight points for the ten of them.

So then you're paying 40 bucks for about half an army.

Yes you may be paying more for figure for PP but at the same time you are getting a lot more of your army.

Terminators win, hands down.

FW Hierophant. Smallest of titans and still double the price of a larger model. And the Spear of Sicarius. Like seriously WTF?

@Boss 'eadbreaka. Well, only GK Termies really.

Boss 'eadbreaka wrote:Terminators win, hands down.

Not at all. You get 5, so that's like 200 points unupgraded.

For 44 dollars, you have 20 imperial Guardsman which is 100 points unupgraded.

George Spiggott wrote:

JohnHwangDD wrote:Under the latest WM2 rules, those Elves should be way less than DA - a Heavy Warjack is 6 to 10 pts under WM2, and a standard skirmish is 15 pts per side.

Those Riflemen come in at eight points for the ten of them.

Thanks.

FWIW, 10 DA are a minimum of 120 pts.

Boss 'eadbreaka wrote:Terminators win, hands down.

Ill also disagree. Yes they are pricey, but that one 5 man squad will kick the ever living piss out of pretty much anything. Ive had an opponent deepstrike them and just obliterate half an attack plan. Terminators will drop on the table and you instantly go from plan A to plan C.


The one that makes me choke is Ork bikers. 40 bucks for 3 bikers? No friggin thanks. Ill keep converting deffkoptas thank you lol

Bloodcrushers, Wraithguard, seekers of Slaanesh and Beasts of Slaanesh.

And Deff Dreads. Nasty.

Vladsimpaler wrote:

George Spiggott wrote:

JohnHwangDD wrote:Under the latest WM2 rules, those Elves should be way less than DA - a Heavy Warjack is 6 to 10 pts under WM2, and a standard skirmish is 15 pts per side.

Those Riflemen come in at eight points for the ten of them.

So then you're paying 40 bucks for about half an army.

Yes you may be paying more for figure for PP but at the same time you are getting a lot more of your army.

Except, you need to correct for WM being a much smaller game. 15 pts of WM is probably less than 500 pts of 40k?

The other thing is that, like 40k, some units are way expensive for points. If you look at an all Helljack list at 25 pts for Cryx, that's like a Caster ($12) & 5 Slayers (5x $28 = $140).

Now $28 for a GW Dread isn't bad, except that WM Jacks are smaller than Dreads -- they're like half the weight of an angry washing machine.

The thing is, Forgeworld stuff is expensive. Its that plain and simple. Most of their stuff is unique and as such there is no way to actually say it is over priced. If they are the only guys to make a Nid Biotitan, then $700 is just a lot of money. Now if someone else made a monster looking critter about the same size for only 500 bucks, then the 700 nid becomes over priced.

To which I say. Drop pods. $75 bucks for a dreadnaught specific drop pod where you can get the generic plastic one for $35.

The other thing that I think is stupidly overpriced is terminators. The model is barely bigger than a normal marine and yet they cost 3 times as much. Why?

About PP models being metal: this proves my point actually, which was that GW prices are more reasonable than PP's. GW is doing things to give a better value to their customers (no matter how hard the cynics whine), something PP has not had the ability/will to do yet (although they definitely want to move in that direction to some extent). Plus, a lot of GW's new plastic stuff more than rivals the detail of old metal stuff. This, as I've been told in other threads, is called "innovation." GW has been in the game, so to speak, for a while now and knows how to push the technology further than a relative newcomer like PP (25 years younger than GW). And before this goes totally tangential, I'm not attacking Warmachine. I'm saying that I find GW's prices more reasonable than PP's.

Jayden63 wrote:The other thing that I think is stupidly overpriced is terminators. The model is barely bigger than a normal marine and yet they cost 3 times as much. Why?

Because they sell less than 3 times as many?

I put in my bid for ogryn. I think they are up to $18 per model? That makes a cool 180 per squad. For the ONLY punchy thing the guard have. Hmm.....
The problem is, GW prices based on game value, as well as model composition. I think they've created such an arcane mix of priceing, they don't even know where they are, anymore. Also, for the record, the models for PP are priced at a more consistent level, and that is a little bit cheaper than GW. I personally think that for sculpting beauty and game value, they kick the pants off GW's prices. My current 500pt PoM Attrition list for the flashpoint cost me about $180. This consists of about 15-18 models. My current tournament list for my deathwing cost me about $650, give or take. This list consists of 38 infantry and 3 tanks. Therefore, if you look at the cost to model ratio, PP is at about 10 per, while GW is at about 15 per. (Rough averages) Even without the tanks, 40k's ratio is higher. Both of these lists are at the current standard "average" points value for competitive play. Now, I know that these ratios can be skewed a bit, based on the number of models included, etc.
However, when you look at different lists for PP, the cost ratio does not skew nearly as much as it can with the GW force. My money has more value in Warmachine, in my opinion. Also, to have a playable army, you will spend overall about 25% of what you need for a comparable tournament-ready GW force.

CATACLYSMUS wrote:I personally think that for sculpting beauty and game value, they kick the pants off GW's prices.

This is just where we disagree, especially the bolded portion.

Manchu wrote:About PP models being metal: this proves my point actually, which was that GW prices are more reasonable than PP's. GW is doing things to give a better value to their customers (no matter how hard the cynics whine), something PP has not had the ability/will to do yet (although they definitely want to move in that direction to some extent). Plus, a lot of GW's new plastic stuff more than rivals the detail of old metal stuff. This, as I've been told in other threads, is called "innovation." GW has been in the game, so to speak, for a while now and knows how to push the technology further than a relative newcomer like PP (25 years younger than GW). And before this goes totally tangential, I'm not attacking Warmachine. I'm saying that I find GW's prices more reasonable than PP's.

I must differ. As I said before, the difference is that GW is pricing their models based on game value, as well as model composition. This is why the plastic terminators cost the same as the pewter ones did a couple of years back. You also need to keep in mind that you must buy many more models in WH to play an average sized game. Otherwise, why would 5 plastic termies cost more than 10 plastic marines? or 12 fire warriors? or a damn predator tank? It ain't plastic we's a payin' fer!


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Manchu wrote:

CATACLYSMUS wrote:I personally think that for sculpting beauty and game value, they kick the pants off GW's prices.

This is just where we disagree, especially the bolded portion.

Subjective, I guess. I think that hubris and "big kid on the block" is what allows GW's prices to be what they are. I do see them trying to give good discount packages, but only at the upper end that many people would have trouble paying for in the first place.

Maybe so, I've only been passingly interested in PP's stuff recently. For example, I went down to my FLGS tonight. They've stopped carrying any GW except for 40k because GW "stabbed them in the back" (owner's words) by opening up a bunker 20 minutes away--which has been closed for a while now, btw. (Or maybe it's just because WHFB and LotR SBG/WotR don't sell nearly as well as 40k?) They have a huge collection of Warmachine/Hordes stuff in there right next to the 40k stuff. The PP stuff seems so so so much more expensive than GW's stuff at a glance. Maybe it's the smaller boxes, maybe its the (IMO) uglier more awkward looking sculpts, maybe it's the fact that PP products don't have nearly the depth of fluff but I just can't see spending what disposable income I have on that stuff rather than getting what I want for 40k. I've heard so many good things about PP in general and Warmachine in particular but honestly it seems so expensive. Even their ne Retribution "codex" sells for $35 compared to a $25 Eldar Codex. It's just not making intuitive sense to me.

It's probably that I have a GW-centric perspective.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
TBH, I'm also a little frustrated with PP because all their stuff goes out of print. And I cant even figure out what rules/books I might need to play . . . I find their website very confusing and frustrating.

Indeed, $35 for a god-damned paperback is a bit much. It's in full color and thicker than an average codex, but still, $35 for a paperback rulebook.

And the sculpts, too...GW has quite a few misses, but not on the same level as PP. I liked the art for Retribution, but I hate half the models. And the ones I do like still have those ridiculous fething codpieces, seriously, who the hell came up with that? Is it some kind of joke? Anyway, a lot of the models just don't look very good in my opinion.

The problem isn't with any individual model's price, it's with consumers not understanding that wargaming has become an obscenely expensive niche hobby across the board and no amount of whining will return us to the "glory days" on the 1980s.

Sidstyler wrote:And the sculpts, too...GW has quite a few misses, but not on the same level as PP. I liked the art for Retribution, but I hate half the models. And the ones I do like still have those ridiculous fething codpieces, seriously, who the hell came up with that? Is it some kind of joke? Anyway, a lot of the models just don't look very good in my opinion.

Completely irrelevant to a pricing discussion, as well.