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This might actually get me to play a MMO again. I hate those things because they suck your life away, but this sounds like it could be pretty bad ass.

I am very curious to see how the structure it.

I would want to be an Ork, fo sho! Just run around causing anarchy and shooting stuff.

this IP could run for several years

This little tidbit fills me with such confidence.

Several... as in more than two or three, but not much more.... as the dictionary defines it... sure doesn't equal a "life time"... unless your Paris Hiltons dog.

Reecius wrote:This might actually get me to play a MMO again. I hate those things because they suck your life away, but this sounds like it could be pretty bad ass.

I am very curious to see how the structure it.

I would want to be an Ork, fo sho! Just run around causing anarchy and shooting stuff.

well, they could structure it as a pve grindfest like WoW which means I would... wait for it... stay with WoW because I have 7 lvl 80 toons and 3 lvl 70+ toons on the server i play on.

or they could structure it as Battlefield 40K which means that I would... stay with WoW because my current options for internet do not allow for twitch based FPS shoot-em-ups.

Bottom line: I'll be in Azeroth if I'm not at work or at my local store working on models.

Honestly I was thinking this will be more along the lines that if lets say you started out as a Space Marine you would start out as a Trainee, then make Scout, Then make Assault Marine, then if you chose to continue on you could be a Tactical Marine, then a Devestator Marine and later a Terminator IF you wanted to but also take into account you might get to cross class somewhat from Assault marine to lets say if you waited a Vanguard Marine or an Assault terminator.

See where I am going with this??? Not many MMOs give you thins FFXI did to a degree but not quite like this.

Lets us take Tyranids now, you would start out as oh maybe a Ripper, you can be a shooting ripper that later progresses to a Termagant or a CC ripper that turns into a Hormagaunt. Next depending if you went shooting or CC will detirmine the type of Warrior you are. After that you could progress to greater heights! Maybe even an MC later on who knows!!!

There are TONS of Possibilities

I might stick to WoW. When the new expansion is released I'll be too busy leveling a Goblin to have time for another MMO.

That and FF13 is out this Spring and GT5 probably later summer, early fall I'll barely have time for WoW, let alone a 2nd MMO.

Excellent news, will be very interested in what they show.

Although at the moment I can't see anything making me leave WoW, but 2012 (if it doesn't slip) I should be in a position to afford two MMO's.

I am way too eager for this though, and unlike WaR. My other half doesn't mind if this one is heavy PvP, as she is quite convinced the shooty element and the 40K universe means it won't be an issue for her.

I've never played or seen a MMORPG that didn't bore me to tears. They all seem to combine the worst aspects of old-school tabletop RPGs with the lowest-common-denominator population of the internet.

Creator of MMORPG: "You have to kill 247 Mystic Warp Crab-Gibbon Beasts of Doom to get the ingredients for one potion. It'll take you 17 hours of 'You hit the Mystic Warp Crab-Gibbon Beast of Doom for 7 points of damage' to do that. Then you'll be ready to take on the 562 Death Stoat-Goblins. BTW STFU NOOB."

GM of RPG: "Well, let's just skip ahead to the bit where you've killed all the Warp Crab-Gibbon Beasts, and have the potion ingredients, because it'd be really dull to roll dice for 17 hours, and we know you could kill them easily. In fact, let's not play this really bad D&D spinoff any more -- there are some decent RPGs out there that don't even have Warp Crab-Gibbon Beasts in."

Instead of an MMORPG I think they should've made a game similar to MAG (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MAG_%28video_game%29) only with 40k units. 256 40k players shooting each other up sounds funner than another grind and raid MMO.

kadun wrote:Instead of an MMORPG I think they should've made a game similar to MAG (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MAG_%28video_game%29) only with 40k units. 256 40k players shooting each other up sounds funner than another grind and raid MMO.

I have a very strong feeling that this will happen. Talent trees are basically out of the question, I have tried to come up with situations for "WoW" style talent trees and I couldn't nail any down.

I think that if the game runs similar to MAG with maybe a bit more MMO style to it, it would be something I would play 100%.

Sounds good idea and i like WAR and WOW but the cost was annoy but i hope this will be ok.
personly i like the ideas of a player controls a squad then can team up with friends to make a combat patrol
and so on and so forth to you make an apoc army (40 players) this would be cool in my eyes
one thing its needs is a good friends/buddy system as most MMO's fail IMO on this points

so heres what the 2 fractions could be, they have 3/ armys

imperium - space marines(would be smurfs) IG (armaggeton(sorry on spelling)) grey knights (yeah i put them in) Witch hunters (cos they cool)
xeno - dark eldar (not sure about t) Tau(not sure if they have different teams but Farsights will do) orks (goffs ) eldar (iyanden)
so theres my 2 cent ......forget it if you want(sorry for spellings )

Howlingmoon wrote:
well, they could structure it as a pve grindfest like WoW which means I would... wait for it... stay with WoW because I have 7 lvl 80 toons and 3 lvl 70+ toons on the server i play on.

or they could structure it as Battlefield 40K which means that I would... stay with WoW because my current options for internet do not allow for twitch based FPS shoot-em-ups.

Bottom line: I'll be in Azeroth if I'm not at work or at my local store working on models.

I'll probably try it out, but +1 to this quote. It will have to be pretty special to make me give up WoW and all the time I have put into it.

Wait... made by the guys who made Darksiders?

Well that explains a lot...

H.B.M.C. wrote:Wait... made by the guys who made Darksiders?

Well that explains a lot...

Indeed.

I just hope they don't include anything like the fething spider boss from Darksiders in the 40k MMO.

Feth that fething spider boss.

Definately gonna try this out. The last mmorpg I played was D&Donline. I liked it a lot. I think a 40K mmorpg should be based on inquisitor/dark heresy. They could have xenos/demons etc. as NPC's. Imagine infiltrating an ork city, dark eldar pirate ship, eldar craft world, tyranid hive ship, necron dead world. Lots of possibilities and they are practically endless.

GG

aka_mythos wrote:I heard STO, has little or no PVP

Well it has been out for a whole 3 days, might give it some time. Not a lot of PvP in WoW 2 days after release either.

aka_mythos wrote:no fully supported factions beyond the federation

Hmm, what was the focus of the franchise?

ToS: Federation
Next Generation: Federation
DS9: Federation
Voyager: Federation
Enterprise: Federation

aka_mythos wrote:poorly implemented away missions

They aren't that bad, in fact they can be a hoot.

aka_mythos wrote: and minimal effort put in to on ship activities.

Because people will $15 a month for "Guard Duty, the simulation"

aka_mythos wrote:90% of Star Trek took place with the interactions of the crew on the ship as the focus and thats really missing.

You realize this is a game and not a TV show right? Who wants to pay a subscription just to talk to bots? That sounds incredibly unfun.

aka_mythos wrote:Its not Star Trek

Actually it is. Officially licensed and everything. Unless you own the rights to it, you don't get to make that determination. It may not be to your tastes, but that isn't the same thing now is it?

aka_mythos wrote:it is a space battle simulator

What is wrong with that? They do actually have space combat in Star Trek you know. Never saw Wrath of Khan? Or DS9? We all get to talk to people everyday in real life, we don't get to command starships.

aka_mythos wrote:In a Federation that has no economy, it has two.

Of course it has an economy of some sort. Why would other planets trade with them? It may not always be cash but there is something.

aka_mythos wrote:Exploration, the mission statement of the Federation is secondary.

For someone so concerned with narrative you don't seem to be paying attention to it. The Federation is at war, you don't get the same amount of free time when you are under attack as you do when you aren't. When the Borg were invading did Picard let them just fly to Earth because he didn't have time to defend the Federation because he had to go explore? The Klingons (Gorn, Orions, and Naussicans) are attacking, the Romulans are still pissed at both the Federation and the Klingons since their main system got wiped in a super nova. Mostly at the Klingons becuase they took advantage and grabbed some planets back.

aka_mythos wrote:At best the game is an incomplete game

No MMO has ever launched complete. If they did they would never be released.

How about when you can give an informed opinion, and not hearsay, you come back and say it sucked. You admitted to have never having played it so perhaps you shouldn't be so sure as to make blanket statements regarding something you have no experience with and just go by what "you heard".

It would be wonderfully ironic if they made it like EVE.

Warhammer online was a pretty good game imo, despite the fact that a good number of people were saying it's dying, i still liked it because of the background and basically just being warhammer, so i may get into this.

If anyone remembers Planetside maybe this could run combat based on that idea?

I remember Planetside, and every once in a while I think about a Planetside type game with 40K fluff. Then I cry a little bit, because it will never happen.

Game design is in a really depressing, derivative state right now. Look at a game like COD MW2. It's basically the same exact game as the previous five odd games in that series, just a minor addition of bells and whistles, and more toys for the trash talking prebusescents who make the interwebs so intolerable.

So, basically what we're going to get is WoW, but with a 40K skin on it.

For a 40k MMO, it needs to be asked what balance between conflict and non-conflict elements should exist. 40k is all about war. As a pure combat game what would it be able to bring that other games have not? On a first person setup, can it bring an active close combat control like Conan, or for shooting the FPS elements of the large team FPS games?

While it is a very rich background and it be great experiencing it as an agent of an Inquisitor, I think that approach would fail to take advantage of the scale and scope of the setting. For example the suspension of disbelief fails if you attempt to abstractly represent a war of millions of men with players as just inquisitorial allies.

Ahtman wrote:

aka_mythos wrote:At best the game is an incomplete game

No MMO has ever launched complete. If they did they would never be released.

How about when you can give an informed opinion, and not hearsay, you come back and say it sucked. You admitted to have never having played it so perhaps you shouldn't be so sure as to make blanket statements regarding something you have no experience with and just go by what "you heard".

You are missing the point of what I said and you are distorting it. I said MMO's are meant to be open ended, that they are designed to have more content added. I said this game is incomplete, because it claims to be a star trek game yet leaves out so many of the aspects of what star trek is about that it is not the essence of star trek, but a more extreme distillation.

I never said it sucked. I tried to avoid making a claim like that. I said it was missing a number of things, critical to me. That I feel they took a flawed approach to the games design that disappointed a lot of people who wanted the same things I had wanted.

I never said I never played it. I beta tested it, didn't like it. And has to ask a friend to find out how it turned out. How is it not an informed opinion? I played the beta. I watched my friend play the final release for a while. He told me what other aspects were like and I experienced a number of them. When you speak you sometime have to generalize instead of giving a life story. So when I say I heard... I mean I tried it, I wanted to experience in a video game certain aspects of Star Trek and when I couldn't, I had to ask is "all PVP like this?"... or "what about more for exploration?"...

Star Trek, was about exploring and utilizing diplomacy to resolve conflict and avoid combat. Did combat happen yes. Often yes. But not always, it was about finding the alternative to it. An all out war is just a poor excuse to ignore the first 2/3rds. Now I'm not saying the balance of these elements needed to be the same as the tv shows, just that they had to be present in a meaningful way.

Empchild wrote:Honestly i see this being more of a W.A.R type were PVP is the dominate thing. You form into alliances or clans or guilds what not and go to battlegrounds and fight. The only thing is Player vs. Player games are fun but don't bring in the long term mega buck and die out very fast. End game content is what gets the most out of any game and warhammer online failed heavily in this dept.

A PvP focus would be quite stupid. No casual player (and most people over 30) care much for it.

aka_mythos wrote:LOL, I don't know the difference between a game and a TV show, hur

I think that summaries your main problem, again. Games need gameplay. I know that sounds simple but apparently it is not a concept you are grasping. An MMO that is almost entirely talk is called Yahoo Instant Messenger, and it is free. This also forgets that there is a narrative about the conflict, but depending on when you played the beta (a lot was added near the end and after launch) you wouldn't have gotten almost any of it. Games have a different set of parameters to function than a pure narrative. You can do some really neat stuff with single player games that come close, like the upcoming Heavy Rain, but this isn't a single player, or even limited mutiplayer game, it is an MMO, and as such needs something for players to do consistently and with large groups. Going to run a 40 man raid on an embassy and everyone just try to talk the npc's to a better tomorrow? As for exploration, who is going pay to scan nebulae and asteroids for month? This isn't a fan fiction game, this is a game that needs to appeal to many people, not just delusional trekkies with myopic vision.

Not only that but you played an incomplete version then want me to take hearsay as evidence of an informed opinion? No, I don't think that will fly.

olympia wrote:A PvP focus would be quite stupid. No casual player (and most people over 30) care much for it.

I disagree. I typically don't care much for PvP but it was a lot of fun in WAR. Though to be fair it wasn't PvP, it was RvR. If you haven't ridden a boar down a hill with 30 other orcs all yelling WAAAGH you just haven't lived. Well, that isn't true, but it was a lot of fun.

Personaly. If they made dawn of war 2 into a MMO version of it, i think it would sell better than most mmo's i've seen/played, and believe me.. i've played alot.

Think about it.. control a few sqauds of your favorate unit types to smash the crap out of any foolish other player in your way ;p

Lysenis wrote:Honestly I was thinking this will be more along the lines that if lets say you started out as a Space Marine you would start out as a Trainee, then make Scout, Then make Assault Marine, then if you chose to continue on you could be a Tactical Marine, then a Devestator Marine and later a Terminator IF you wanted to but also take into account you might get to cross class somewhat from Assault marine to lets say if you waited a Vanguard Marine or an Assault terminator.

I think the current progression is Trainee -> Scout -> Devastator -> Assault -> Tactical -> Veteran -> Terminator, but yeah.

I think that what posters here have been saying about making most of the factions in the game squad-based instead of single character-based has a lot of merit, and would make the 40K MMO different enough from Warhammer Online and WoW. You're closer to your grand scale epic battles that 40k is known for, and you can balance the fluff of the factions easier as well.

By keeping Marine characters as strictly single character-based avatars, you limit their numbers (visually on the battlefield if not by actual number of players) and make them powerful enough. A player that is playing an ork avatar would have 5 to 6 orks under his control, a player playing as guard would have 6 or 7 guardsmen. I'd be far more interested in commanding a squad than a single character.

One question though is if you are playing as a more squad-based faction, is what happens when your character goes up in power and ability and level? Do you start off playing as 6 orks, then as you grow in ability that becomes 3 ork nobs, then eventually you get to play as a warboss or painboss or big mek? Or at the outset of character/squad creation do you get to decide if you want to play as an ork mob, a couple of Nobs, or as a warboss or painboss, and then that choice gets more powerful as you go along? Doing this would let there be different types of 'classes' like WoW's paladins and death knights and each unit type is good at different things, like the WoW classes are.

Your minions would gain access to stronger abilities and equipment. They level up just like you do. They might all start as just lowly Guardsmen but as you level up you can assign them different roles. You can make one a Medic, another a special weapons guy, ect ect.

Ahtman wrote:Your minions would gain access to stronger abilities and equipment. They level up just like you do. They might all start as just lowly Guardsmen but as you level up you can assign them different roles. You can make one a Medic, another a special weapons guy, ect ect.

As for that, that would probably create some serious balance issues. I wouldn't be surprised if it was mroe like DoWII ("hero" [squad leader] levels and he gets new equipment while the other squaddys get a slight boost to stats).

If done correctly and made balanced it would be awesome, I just don't want to see a "single ubber-gun". I mean can you imagine a squade of marines charging forward armed with nothing but [insert OP weapon here] and annihilating? And of course you can only be competitive if you use that weapon. That's my fear about that.

Superscope wrote:Personaly. If they made dawn of war 2 into a MMO version of it, i think it would sell better than most mmo's i've seen/played, and believe me.. i've played alot.

Think about it.. control a few sqauds of your favorate unit types to smash the crap out of any foolish other player in your way ;p

I agree a different approach then most MMO's is important for the longevity of the game. I would hypothesize that you might only control one squad and a vehicle, where the squad members can be given a little more variety of equipment, within the squad, relative to DOWII. The MMO would come in where you and your friends form an army and engage against enemies. It makes balancing between different factions easier.

As a combat oriented game, it needs to offer more. This would do that.

Ahtman wrote:I think that summaries your main problem, again. Games need gameplay.

No duh. Thats why if you look at what I say I never disqualify the combat element, just that in addition to it there should be more.

Ahtman wrote:
An MMO that is almost entirely talk is called Yahoo Instant Messenger, and it is free. This also forgets that there is a narrative about the conflict, but depending on when you played the beta (a lot was added near the end and after launch) you wouldn't have gotten almost any of it. Games have a different set of parameters to function than a pure narrative.

I'm not saying a game should be pure talk. I'm just saying it can include other elements beyond "killing your enemy" with other game play mechanics. Some designer would have to be creative to make it work. I was a fan of Star Wars Galaxy, even though it actually was incomplete and had gaping holes in it, it had a developed non-combat aspect to the game. I played day 1 beta to the post CU collapse.

Ahtman wrote:
Going to run a 40 man raid on an embassy and everyone just try to talk the npc's to a better tomorrow?

I enjoy those sorts of games. I enjoy big game versus team shooters. I enjoy other MMO's. I just believe when you say something is Star Trek it needs to have those other elements, even if only in a minor way, but they need to be there.

If there were a mission where by you could "negotiate" with a newly discovered planet to establish trade relations and as a result gained access to new technologies, you telling me no one would play it? If when a giant space entity creature pops out and decides he wants to use you as a toy, blasting him with phasers is not the best way to resolve it. Look at Star Trek IV, space creature comes destroying Star Fleet, and rather than figure out a way to kill it, they travel back in time and rescue a whale from extinction. That is Star Trek as much as Wrath of Khan. Both are at extremes, something like Star Trek IV probably strikes a better balance.

Ahtman wrote:
As for exploration, who is going pay to scan nebulae and asteroids for month? This isn't a fan fiction game, this is a game that needs to appeal to many people, not just delusional trekkies with myopic vision.

Have you played EVE? It balances many aspect of gameplay. If its guilty of anything, its being realistic to the point of needing you to be an accountant to play.

Wanting the STo game that exists, but with more of what I'm talking about is not short sighted by any measure. I don't really know where you're going with "fan fiction game"... I just want to see a certain spirit in the game that has been left out. Its 70% the game I wanted to see. As it stands STO is a pretty generic game that has the added veneer of Star Trek. A gold plated turd is still crap. And while STO isn't crap, its not "gold" either and thus open to criticism by the sort of people who are the target demographic. The only friends of mine who are enjoying it are non-trekies, at which point you have to ask did they have to call it Star Trek, to make this game?

Ahtman wrote:
Not only that but you played an incomplete version then want me to take hearsay as evidence of an informed opinion? No, I don't think that will fly.

I've played enough MMO's, 10, to be able to judge how its going to go, from my experience. I've played enough beta's to know how much of a difference it will make. I have experience with Cryptic and know that won't really do too much more anytime soon.

CrazyThang wrote:

Ahtman wrote:Your minions would gain access to stronger abilities and equipment. They level up just like you do. They might all start as just lowly Guardsmen but as you level up you can assign them different roles. You can make one a Medic, another a special weapons guy, ect ect.

As for that, that would probably create some serious balance issues. I wouldn't be surprised if it was mroe like DoWII ("hero" [squad leader] levels and he gets new equipment while the other squaddys get a slight boost to stats).

They do it in STO ok. Your Minions aren't on the same level as you, more of an extension of your will.

@aka_mythos: Your still on that? It is so yesterday. Move forward with a new day ahead of you.

Ah, I've never played that but the "extension of will" thing somehow sums it up perfectly