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Plus there has been a general undertone for a good while that in modern Britian even daring to raise Immigration issue means you are somehow bigotted.

Gorden effectively confirmed that with his comments, even if it isn't the case.

As someone who can't stand tha man, and who against all my previous beliefs have voted Con just to get Brown out, I lol'd quite heavily yesterday.

I think my fave headline today was the Sun.

'Gillian only popped out for a loaf. She came back with BROWN TOAST'

Love it.

Seems gak to me. I doubt this would be much of a scandal in the US. As someone already mentioned, we didn't need to forgive Obama for calling Kanye a jackass because that was one issue on which everyone could agree with the president. Similarly, Biden said passing HCR is a big fething deal. Well, it is a big fething deal. What isn't a big fething deal is saying so.

Albatross says that Brown's comments suggest a contempt for the voter. Well, let's apply that standard to Gillian Duffy. What do her comments suggest? IMO, her comments suggest contempt for immigrants. Not really a jump to see this lady as a bigot. I don't think Brown's remark shows contempt for voters so much as it does for bigots. Now, is Duffy really a bigot? We don't know. A better question is: can you be concerned about immigration and not be a bigot? Of course. I'm confident that Brown knows as much, too.

Ask yourself, Brits: do you really want politicians who say whatever gak comes to them on the spot? Really? I think you ought to reconsider your criticism of your rather polite, thoughtful politicians. And I think you'd better keep this in mind:

Are you implying Palin isn't our last, best hope for the future?

Exactly.

Meaning we're fethed.

@Manchu - I DID qualify my statement by admitting she probably was a little bigoted, to be fair...

Nick Clegg has said a LOT worse about the entire British Public.

Also, Sarah Palin looks insane. Seriously, look at her eyes.

Blank.

Oh, I think you raise a valid point, Alby, as usual. You always have to go beyond the "face" of someone's words to their implication. I just wanted to apply that lesson to poor, poor Gillian Duffy (won't someone think of Gillian Duffy?!) as well. Yeah, Brown is probably something of a calculating elitist. And yeah, Duffy is probably something of an ornery bigot. Nothing about this story is surprising in the slightest.

Gillian Duffy already has 'representation' - I bet a single is in the works!

I dunno man, I just would have respected Brown more if he'd have pulled her up on her comments there and then and just said 'hang on, Mrs Duffy - I think you're being unfair to all the hard-working migrants who come to the UK in search of a better life'.

Something like that. In any case, she didn't say anything that bad, really. I think he was more frustrated that the whole thing went rather badly, and was, as usual, blaming anyone and everyone but himself.

Manchu wrote:............Ask yourself, Brits: do you really want politicians who say whatever gak comes to them on the spot? Really? I think you ought to reconsider your criticism of your rather polite, thoughtful politicians. And I think you'd better keep this in mind:

I wouldn't mind it. If you can't be thoughtful on the spot and have to go back and refer to your prepared notes then you aren't good enough for the job. Our leaders should be exceptional individuals and not the chap with the best preperation and spin team behind them. If Brown couldn't handle a question about immigration after 13 years on over seeing or leading the country then he deserves everything and every critisism he is getting.

For those comparing this to the Obama/West situation then I see this a slightly different. Thecritism of Brown comes from the fact that he was happy to meet her, glad-handed her not really disagreeing with anything she said [assuming that it was a photo op with a Elderly Labour voter], stuck the boot in behind her back and then when caught out didn't stick by his guns and apologiesed imediately. As much spine as a jellyfish!

Excuse the expression but Obama called a spade a spade and was rightly commended on it.

If Brown can not deal with an old lady that is on his side then how the feth will he deal with the next terrorism plot, foriegn leaders etc.

Finally I've said it before and I'll say it again, Palin = Hawt!

To be fair, it's not even the fact he called her bigoted. I am sure no-one gives two gaks.

What this is about is that it shows that Brown is the two faces thug and bully he has been rumored to be for years.

Although he had no right to say that, the people who recorded it had no right to play it to the lady, or even publicly play it. Brown was having a private conversation, and he called a racist lady a bigot. She deserved much more for being racist.

Tim the Biovore wrote:Although he had no right to say that, the people who recorded it had no right to play it to the lady, or even publicly play it. Brown was having a private conversation, and he called a racist lady a bigot. She deserved much more for being racist.

How is what she said being racist? She questioned Gordon Brown on immigration policy - since when is it racist to do that? That has been part of the problem here in the UK for many years; to wit, that one cannot raise the issue of immigration without being roundly shouted down as a racist. Gordon Brown has further confirmed the stereotype.

Morathi's Darkest Sin wrote:Plus there has been a general undertone for a good while that in modern Britian even daring to raise Immigration issue means you are somehow bigotted.

Gorden effectively confirmed that with his comments, even if it isn't the case.

Yep next thing you know local police will be arresting illegal aliens...

Frazzled wrote:

Morathi's Darkest Sin wrote:Plus there has been a general undertone for a good while that in modern Britian even daring to raise Immigration issue means you are somehow bigotted.

Gorden effectively confirmed that with his comments, even if it isn't the case.

Yep next thing you know local police will be arresting illegal aliens...

GASP! How dare the police arrest people for doing illegal things! We must put a stop to this travesty at once!!!!!! To the Ragemobile!

As we say about Rodney the Shanker (the murderous wiener of Portwood Street):
Crazy ragey!!! Scary Bitey!!!

notprop wrote:

Manchu wrote:............Ask yourself, Brits: do you really want politicians who say whatever gak comes to them on the spot? Really? I think you ought to reconsider your criticism of your rather polite, thoughtful politicians. And I think you'd better keep this in mind:

I wouldn't mind it. If you can't be thoughtful on the spot and have to go back and refer to your prepared notes then you aren't good enough for the job. Our leaders should be exceptional individuals and not the chap with the best preperation and spin team behind them. If Brown couldn't handle a question about immigration after 13 years on over seeing or leading the country then he deserves everything and every critisism he is getting.

For those comparing this to the Obama/West situation then I see this a slightly different. Thecritism of Brown comes from the fact that he was happy to meet her, glad-handed her not really disagreeing with anything she said [assuming that it was a photo op with a Elderly Labour voter], stuck the boot in behind her back and then when caught out didn't stick by his guns and apologiesed imediately. As much spine as a jellyfish!

Excuse the expression but Obama called a spade a spade and was rightly commended on it.

If Brown can not deal with an old lady that is on his side then how the feth will he deal with the next terrorism plot, foriegn leaders etc.

Finally I've said it before and I'll say it again, Palin = Hawt!

I'd tap that.

IMO a president or other politician needs to always have a teleprompter/cue cards shouldn't be in office. Can't think for yourself without somebody writing speeches for you than GTFO.

I'm looking at you PresBO.

Frazzled wrote:
Yep next thing you know local police will be arresting illegal aliens...

Not in england. they dont
What no papers ?,
you must sign here once per week, ( local immigration centre) and no working.
we'll give you some money, and a place to live.

You are thinking of asylum seekers, not illegal immigrants.

Asylum seekers become illegal if they do not receive permission to stay, and don't vacate the country.

Kilkrazy wrote:You are thinking of asylum seekers, not illegal immigrants.

Asylum seekers become illegal if they do not receive permission to stay, and don't vacate the country.

Nope illegals aswell.

sneak in on truck, lose papers. keep low profile.

Manchu wrote:Seems gak to me. I doubt this would be much of a scandal in the US. As someone already mentioned, we didn't need to forgive Obama for calling Kanye a jackass because that was one issue on which everyone could agree with the president. Similarly, Biden said passing HCR is a big fething deal. Well, it is a big fething deal. What isn't a big fething deal is saying so.

Albatross says that Brown's comments suggest a contempt for the voter. Well, let's apply that standard to Gillian Duffy. What do her comments suggest? IMO, her comments suggest contempt for immigrants. Not really a jump to see this lady as a bigot. I don't think Brown's remark shows contempt for voters so much as it does for bigots. Now, is Duffy really a bigot? We don't know. A better question is: can you be concerned about immigration and not be a bigot? Of course. I'm confident that Brown knows as much, too.

Ask yourself, Brits: do you really want politicians who say whatever gak comes to them on the spot? Really? I think you ought to reconsider your criticism of your rather polite, thoughtful politicians. And I think you'd better keep this in mind:

You've completely missed the point. No one is calling it a "scandal" for one thing. And the reason it became an issue was because immigration is for some reason a taboo subject among our politicians at the moment and they are reluctant to talk about it. The PM labeling someone a bigot for bringing it up, that's the point here. Not 'Oh noes he called some poor lady a bigot' as you seem to have gathered.

Seems to me that one of the roots to the immigration problems we're suffering in the UK is that people can't talk about immigration without being labeled a bigot.

This woman was vocalizing what a lot of people are thinking. She may be a bigot, she may not, but she's legitimately concerned about a lack of jobs and an excess of unemployment.

This is going to hit Brown I think - one thing people have said in his favour is that his complete lack of charisma means that WYSIWYG. Maybe not eh Gordo?

The reason for that is that a lot of what people say about immigration actually is bigoted.

Take the claim that illegal immigrants are given social security benefits in the UK. This just isn't true. You can look up the facts on the relevant government web sites like this one.

http://www.adviceguide.org.uk/index/your_money/benefits/faq_index_benefits/faq_benefits_entitlement_if_coming_from_abroad.htm

Clearly we should not suppress a debate about immigration by wanton accusations of bigotry. Equally, we should not allow bigotry to flourish in ignorance of the facts.

Unlimited immigration into any country cannot be allowed. That is only logical. However, it is illogical for people to oppose all immigration. The people who do so are acting from xenophobia rather than from any thought out political-economic standpoint.

filbert wrote:

Tim the Biovore wrote:Although he had no right to say that, the people who recorded it had no right to play it to the lady, or even publicly play it. Brown was having a private conversation, and he called a racist lady a bigot. She deserved much more for being racist.

How is what she said being racist? She questioned Gordon Brown on immigration policy - since when is it racist to do that? That has been part of the problem here in the UK for many years; to wit, that one cannot raise the issue of immigration without being roundly shouted down as a racist. Gordon Brown has further confirmed the stereotype.

I'm sorry? Did you not know that she was telling him that foreiners shouldn't be allowed in the country, or something along those lines.

Reality check

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/election_2010/8636051.stm

Tim the Biovore wrote:

filbert wrote:

Tim the Biovore wrote:Although he had no right to say that, the people who recorded it had no right to play it to the lady, or even publicly play it. Brown was having a private conversation, and he called a racist lady a bigot. She deserved much more for being racist.

How is what she said being racist? She questioned Gordon Brown on immigration policy - since when is it racist to do that? That has been part of the problem here in the UK for many years; to wit, that one cannot raise the issue of immigration without being roundly shouted down as a racist. Gordon Brown has further confirmed the stereotype.

I'm sorry? Did you not know that she was telling him that foreiners shouldn't be allowed in the country, or something along those lines.

She said nothing of the sort - you can read the transcript here:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/election_2010/8649448.stm