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MeanGreenStompa wrote:I bought and enjoyed the 'black' album by metallica and still enjoy the occasional listen. I tried later stuff and loathed it. Coupled with Lars Ulrich's greedy bastard attitude towards music ripping, so diametrically opposed to my favourite, Trent Reznor, led me to hate metallica.

Oh and this stuff ain't my bag either.

Take two of these and see me in the morning:

NOW you're talking.

MeanGreenStompa wrote:I bought and enjoyed the 'black' album by metallica and still enjoy the occasional listen. I tried later stuff and loathed it. Coupled with Lars Ulrich's greedy bastard attitude towards music ripping, so diametrically opposed to my favourite, Trent Reznor, led me to hate metallica.

Oh and this stuff ain't my bag either.

Take two of these and see me in the morning:

So, it's okay to steal people's music because they somehow make too much money?

'Property is theft', remember?

Stormrider wrote:
So, it's okay to steal people's music because they somehow make too much money?

Yep. Steal from the rich and give to the poor (by paying for their music). IMO the whole industry is corrupt. Recordings should be free, bands should make their money touring and playing (T-shirt sales, anyone?).

MasterDRD wrote:Wow, this is the most horrible music-related thread ever. Hating on Avenged Sevenfold? Hating on METALLICA? Who are you people and when did you lose your humanity?

You know, eventually people will realise that Metallica aren't infallible. And Avenge Sevenfold are just a bunch of whiny emo douches who think they're "hard-core".

Albatross wrote:'Property is theft', remember?

No, property is property. Theft is abhorrent.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Ktulhut wrote:

Stormrider wrote:
So, it's okay to steal people's music because they somehow make too much money?

Yep. Steal from the rich and give to the poor (by paying for their music). IMO the whole industry is corrupt. Recordings should be free, bands should make their money touring and playing (T-shirt sales, anyone?).

MasterDRD wrote:Wow, this is the most horrible music-related thread ever. Hating on Avenged Sevenfold? Hating on METALLICA? Who are you people and when did you lose your humanity?

You know, eventually people will realise that Metallica aren't infallible. And Avenge Sevenfold are just a bunch of whiny emo douches who think they're "hard-core".

You have the right to think the music industry sucks, you don't have the right to steal. Theft is wrong, this is an issue without gray area to me, theft is rape of people's rights.

I think most would argue that digital redistribution has no inherent unit cost and the cost of server space and downloads is not placed on the record labels or distribution agencies. Thus theoretically since all that is being stolen is the idea of music many do not consider it theft.

You have the right to think the music industry sucks, you don't have the right to steal. Theft is wrong, this is an issue without gray area to me, theft is rape of people's rights.

We talking bill of rights here or humanistic rights? The majority of what most bands make is from concert sales (which can't be downloaded) and the majority of album or digital distribution sales go to the bloated holding companies behind them (Itunes for instance takes a significant cut for doing something that is essentially free for them to do). Legally no, outside of a few countries I do not have the right to steal (download music). However morally I consider myself somewhat immune to the criticisms and complaints of the record distribution industry which has helped to snuff out musical talent for decades and which at this point is an unnecessary middleman that only still exists due to contract law and their exceptional litigiousness.

I'm so glad this thread went from people talking about Avenged Sevenfold to bashing the band to now talking about pirating music.

ShumaGorath wrote:I think most would argue that digital redistribution has no inherent unit cost and the cost of server space and downloads is not placed on the record labels or distribution agencies. Thus theoretically since all that is being stolen is the idea of music many do not consider it theft.

You have the right to think the music industry sucks, you don't have the right to steal. Theft is wrong, this is an issue without gray area to me, theft is rape of people's rights.

We talking bill of rights here or humanistic rights? The majority of what most bands make is from concert sales (which can't be downloaded) and the majority of album or digital distribution sales go to the bloated holding companies behind them (Itunes for instance takes a significant cut for doing something that is essentially free for them to do). Legally no, outside of a few countries I do not have the right to steal (download music). However morally I consider myself somewhat immune to the criticisms and complaints of the record distribution industry which has helped to snuff out musical talent for decades and which at this point is an unnecessary middleman that only still exists due to contract law and their exceptional litigiousness.

This. Shuma has summed it up quite eloquently. It is my opinion that recorded music is simply advertising for the live act, and I refuse to pay for music that's been through the main-stream music industry because a) most of it is rubbish I don't want anyway, and b) I refuse to pay for advertising [see: not buying white dwarf or the citadel catalogues]. You can disagree with me untill the cows come home, but at the end of the day your only real arguments are "it's the law" and "I think it's wrong". I don't. End of story?

Ktulhut wrote:

ShumaGorath wrote:I think most would argue that digital redistribution has no inherent unit cost and the cost of server space and downloads is not placed on the record labels or distribution agencies. Thus theoretically since all that is being stolen is the idea of music many do not consider it theft.

You have the right to think the music industry sucks, you don't have the right to steal. Theft is wrong, this is an issue without gray area to me, theft is rape of people's rights.

We talking bill of rights here or humanistic rights? The majority of what most bands make is from concert sales (which can't be downloaded) and the majority of album or digital distribution sales go to the bloated holding companies behind them (Itunes for instance takes a significant cut for doing something that is essentially free for them to do). Legally no, outside of a few countries I do not have the right to steal (download music). However morally I consider myself somewhat immune to the criticisms and complaints of the record distribution industry which has helped to snuff out musical talent for decades and which at this point is an unnecessary middleman that only still exists due to contract law and their exceptional litigiousness.

This. Shuma has summed it up quite eloquently. It is my opinion that recorded music is simply advertising for the live act, and I refuse to pay for music that's been through the main-stream music industry because a) most of it is rubbish I don't want anyway, and b) I refuse to pay for advertising [see: not buying white dwarf or the citadel catalogues]. You can disagree with me untill the cows come home, but at the end of the day your only real arguments are "it's the law" and "I think it's wrong". I don't. End of story?

Buying a catalogue isn't really buying advertisement. It's a catalogue product that you have bought for comprehensive knowledge of an item line. It's a service that you've purchased. Getting a free catalogue however is advertising.

I think it's paying for advertising. I bought one once when I knew I wouldn't have internet access for a long time, but aside from that the GW website offers the same thing, plus the full collectors range, plus prices on their website absolutely free of charge.

I think it's paying for advertising.

How do you pay for advertisement? I bought some speakers, did I pay to have those speakers advertised to me? They have their name on them.

I bought one once when I knew I wouldn't have internet access for a long time, but aside from that the GW website offers the same thing, plus the full collectors range, plus prices on their website absolutely free of charge.

I think we have inherently different viewpoints on what constitutes being advertised too.

Golden Eyed Scout wrote:I'm so glad this thread went from people talking about Avenged Sevenfold to bashing the band to now talking about pirating music.

Yeah I know what you mean... I'm sorry, I know it's not your fault GES but this is officially the worst thread on Dakka.

MasterDRD wrote:

Golden Eyed Scout wrote:I'm so glad this thread went from people talking about Avenged Sevenfold to bashing the band to now talking about pirating music.

Yeah I know what you mean... I'm sorry, I know it's not your fault GES but this is officially the worst thread on Dakka.

I'm pretty sure I can find several worse then this.

Alright then, if it's so terrible I'll stop. And yes, I'm sure you can find many, many worse threads. Search "female space marine" or "chaos sisters of battle".

A bad thread for a terrible band.

ShumaGorath wrote:A bad thread for a terrible band.

If you don't like them, GTFO. Nobody made you look at this thread, nobody made you post in it. GTFO and let the fans talk.

Golden Eyed Scout wrote:

ShumaGorath wrote:A bad thread for a terrible band.

If you don't like them, GTFO. Nobody made you look at this thread, nobody made you post in it. GTFO and let the fans talk.

You weren't exactly having much of a discussion before I came along. "People that like the band like the album people that don't like the band don't like the album". You could have just made it a poll.

Golden Eyed Scout wrote:
If you don't like them, GTFO. Nobody made you look at this thread, nobody made you post in it. GTFO and let the fans talk.

Stormrider wrote:

Albatross wrote:'Property is theft', remember?

No, property is property. Theft is abhorrent.

Yeah, I was kidding. I thought that was obvious, sorry.


EDIT: Woah, woah, woah...What?

ShumaGorath wrote:However morally I consider myself somewhat immune to the criticisms and complaints of the record distribution industry which has helped to snuff out musical talent for decades

What are you talking about? Oh no, you're not one of these kids who thinks the recording industry is somehow 'evil' because it gives the people what they want, are you? From what I've seen on here, you seem to believe in a difference between 'commercial' and non-commercial' commercially recorded popular music. For decades, recording companies have given people opportunities to project their musical talent out into the world in ways they never would have been able to. Exactly how do they help to 'snuff out talent'? Please, explain it to me.

Now if you were talking about exploitation, 'payola', copyright theft, etc., then that might be a different discussion.

This is getting horribly off-topic so I'll start another thread.

Golden Eyed Scout wrote:I'm so glad this thread went from people talking about Avenged Sevenfold to bashing the band to now talking about pirating music.

THis is dakka!


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And for what it's worth, I'd rather see avenged sevenfold at the top of the billboard charts than any of that top 40 crap. They knocked Eminim outta the top spot, so good for them

Hmmm that was the angriest comment iv'e really seen GES put down. Two GTFOs in a single post?!

Must of touched a nerve

Just to cover my tracks, he totally has a point, this was never destined to be a thread about if you liked them or not, it was originally intended for people who have listened to the album to discuss what they liked about it, not to force your views onto other people.

All the best!

ghosty wrote:Hmmm that was the angriest comment iv'e really seen GES put down. Two GTFOs in a single post?!

Must of touched a nerve

Look at the first few comments I made and you'll realize that two GTFO's is incredibly tame compared to what i used to do.

Okay, I'm not trying to bash Avenged Sevenfold or any of their fans, but they suck some major elephant bollocks and if you like them you have no taste. But remember, I'm not hating on anyone here, just letting my opinion be known.

rubiksnoob wrote:Okay, I'm not trying to bash Avenged Sevenfold or any of their fans, but they suck some major elephant bollocks and if you like them you have no taste. But remember, I'm not hating on anyone here, just letting my opinion be known.

Back on topic, I'm going to the 1st tour date of the Uproar festival, and I get to see Avenged Sevenfold AND Disturbed live, one after the other! You know, those 2 bands everyone loves to hate on so they can be one of the 'cool kids'. It's going to be the best night ever.

Right. Ok...rubiksnoob... Fair comment, fair comment. Bit rude, might wanna watch out for that, lots of young kids on the site, and MODs are never happy about stuff like that.

I would ask what you listen to, to see if you have any taste, but you know, everyone has their opinions, so one persons favourite song, could be another ones Hanna Montanna. And we all know how bad she is.

MasterDRD wrote:
Back on topic, I'm going to the 1st tour date of the Uproar festival, and I get to see Avenged Sevenfold AND Disturbed live, one after the other! You know, those 2 bands everyone loves to hate on so they can be one of the 'cool kids'. It's going to be the best night ever.

Incorrect. I like to hate on disturbed because I spent 9 months living the floor above some crystal-methamphetamine users who would constantly blast disturbed, avenge sevenfold, etc, at all hours, which the landlord refused to do anything about. You'd hate it too if you had to listen to it coming through the floor for 9 months.

Also, I have a strong tendency towards loathing bands who's lyrics are about the unfairness of life and the pain that is deep, deep inside. IMO, they need to get over themselves. EVERYONE is like that at age 15. NO ONE should still be like that in their 20's or 30's.

Ktulhut wrote:Also, I have a strong tendency towards loathing bands who's lyrics are about the unfairness of life and the pain that is deep, deep inside. IMO, they need to get over themselves. EVERYONE is like that at age 15. NO ONE should still be like that in their 20's or 30's unless they're trying to get 15 year olds to buy their albums.

Fixed your sentence

I was tempted to add something about how yes, I know they're marketing to kiddies, but left it out. Really, that just makes them as despicable as anyone else in the industry, because they're IMO, encouraging said kiddies to revel in thier anguish rather than, y'know, getting on with life and growing up.