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Backfire wrote:Whoa, I thought Tau had some advantage here but didn't expect such a pwnage. In fairness it seems that your opponent was also outrolling you (OTOH, if he had won the initiative, it might have been even uglier...). I think that the initial plan was bad one: his vehicles were much less of a threat for you than the suits.

I must admit that he was rolling very well this game. His normally BS3 units were shooting more like marines and his broadsides hardly missed all game.

Actually, if he had won initiative, my tactics would have been totally different. I would have deployed to one flank (away from his markerlights), thus taking his other flank out of the battle. Then again, had he gone first, he might not have split up his forces like that. Hard to say.

As for my targeting priority, who knows what would have happened had I targeted his suits initially. He was making his saves like a madman. I spent 3 turns firing at them with my dreads and couldn't kill a single one (though I did get rid of their drones). He made something like 10 3+ saves in a row! On top of that, he would've had an extra railgun (his hammerhead) and 2 meltas from blocking piranhas to add to his offense had I not taken them out initially.

As for his pathfinders, I did spend 2 turns shooting at them but I just couldn't kill them off or break them. In the end, he still had 1 single pathfinder left.

Whaaaaaaat??? I didn't see that coming!!! Tau rolled very well indeed...Rapid fire Pulse Rifle FTW

jy2 wrote:

Backfire wrote:Whoa, I thought Tau had some advantage here but didn't expect such a pwnage. In fairness it seems that your opponent was also outrolling you (OTOH, if he had won the initiative, it might have been even uglier...). I think that the initial plan was bad one: his vehicles were much less of a threat for you than the suits.

I must admit that he was rolling very well this game. His normally BS3 units were shooting more like marines and his broadsides hardly missed all game.

Actually, if he had won initiative, my tactics would have been totally different. I would have deployed to one flank (away from his markerlights), thus taking his other flank out of the battle. Then again, had he gone first, he might not have split up his forces like that. Hard to say.

As for my targeting priority, who knows what would have happened had I targeted his suits initially. He was making his saves like a madman. I spent 3 turns firing at them with my dreads and couldn't kill a single one (though I did get rid of their drones). He made something like 10 3+ saves in a row! On top of that, he would've had an extra railgun (his hammerhead) and 2 meltas from blocking piranhas to add to his offense had I not taken them out initially.

Of course it would have been totally different game had he gone first so you can't say anything certain, but in general, Tau gunline wants to go first in this kind of missions, it is potentially huge advantage. Even half of his army could easily wreck half of your Rhinos in first turn. As for targeting priority, trying to kill the suits didn't work for you, but if opponent is rolling great, same might easily happen with Tau vehicles. I've had lots of games with opponents gnashing their teeths trying to shoot through Disruption pods...IMO, in this kind of list, role of Tau vehicles is primarily to look scary and hope that enemy wastes firepower on them. Railheads and Piranhas aren't actually THAT great for their points in anti-armour role.

I think that overall, your army was just too slow for this kind of match and match-up. You have no fast vehicles, no jump infantry, not even anything which can deep strike. Maybe replace Strike squad or one Purifier squad with Interceptors??

Any way, I have to commend you for writing these reports, even ones you lose. Most people tend only to post Battle reports where they win, and I am throuhgly bored reading reports which go like "...then Mephiston made 97 armour saves in the row and I proceeded to pwn them in assault"...

The Tau player did have some good rolls. The problem with playing against Tau anti-MEQ is that you have to go to them, not the other way around. All they have to do is stay and shoot.

What you should've done was take out the markerlights at the earliest opportunity, then you might've had a chance to get your GKs into assault. Otherwise, great report.

Congratulations to the Tau player. While there are certainly worse set ups, Tau vs GK isn't going to be an easy match- especially without plasma.

Backfire wrote:Whoa, I thought Tau had some advantage here but didn't expect such a pwnage. In fairness it seems that your opponent was also outrolling you (OTOH, if he had won the initiative, it might have been even uglier...). I think that the initial plan was bad one: his vehicles were much less of a threat for you than the suits. edit. You also probably should have killed the Pathfinders by Turn 2 at the earliest...

The amount of luck in this game was INSANE. I made all the morale checks that counted, and failed the ones I needed to. Also, markerlights surviving to the end was amazing, even having a single marker hit was devastating to his rhinos. On the other hand, the first shot from a ven-dred (I'm pretty sure against the Hammerhead) caused 4 glances and 3 got through cover. jy2 made his marine saves like a champ! I'm pretty sure at some point I rapid fired 12 firewarriors at BS5, and he still had a marine or two left in the squad. However, because jy2 had severely reduced his shooting, I was rolling all the dice, and they rolled hot! And contrary to popular belief, the railguns killed crowe and a dread. All the rhino and anti-infantry work was done by the Deathrains with TL missile pods. I'll talk about his initial plan in my analysis post.

jy2 wrote:
Next time we meet, it may be against my shooty nids!

Also, feel free to offer your analysis of the game. I will do my Post-game Analysis this time, only a little later.

I'm definitely up for a rematch! and I really need to test my new list against some nids!

I suppose I could send you my post-game analysis via PM, if you wanted it on the battle report, or if thats too much I can just post some quick thoughts here.

No need to disembark for knights at all - small Purifier units with 2 Psycannons use Rhinos' hatches perfectly. Still, as with many MSU transport units Tau are harsh opponent - especially for leafblower and such. They pack a lot of mobile S7 shots. They've got Railguns for either tougher targets or just to get job done should they need it. They've got one of arguably best supporting units in game in form of Pathfinders. And Kroot are actually cheap! Cleansing Flame is nuts versus them, but apart from this, with 3+ forest cover, usually few armies have means to deal with large kroot units. They can still smoke most mech builds in game, especially those basing on side AV10 or AV11 as front armour.
[EDIT]And flamers are just too cheap not to take instead of plasma, especially considering BS3.[/EDIT]

And GK have additional difficulty: for all their Force Weapon nastyness, special Rules, powerful close-combat psipowers and such they gain no survivability for increased cost. And they rarely can withstand a bullet trade with Tau, who are both resilient and shooty...

I polled Tau but was a bit afraid of my controvential opinion. I don't even play Tau and yet find them more than capable. I think that one of best tools versus Tau that GK posess is Shrouding and Terminators. And in case of shooting, Psybolt ammo.

Still it was somewhat strange to see all those high calibre autocannon shells bouncing off suits.

Ouch... mistakes definitely make a difference in games like this! Rhinos just aren't quick enough; thus why I love my stormravens T2 assaulting suits is just mean! Great rep as always JY

By the way...Pokemon cards? There goes the street cred!

Like I said in my first post, GK lack low ap weaponry to deal with this many suits(epecially broadsides). Despite good rolling by Tau player, Gk had alpha strike which took out a railgun and both piranhas and also had decent rolls. Definetly a shaming

Good screening with the kroots, and superb target prioritization. Even if the Tau player rolled decent, I doubt GK would of gotten any more than a draw. The match was just too one-sided. And I love the block attempt with the fish Now if the mission was capture and control, Tau might have some serious problems. But then again its a old and tier3 codex.

while I don't deny the incredible luck, I feel my strategy and target priority really won me the game. Also, I find opponents have trouble the first time against my Tau because it is a very different army than most.

SonsofVulkan wrote:Like I said in my first post, GK lack low ap weaponry to deal with this many suits(epecially broadsides). Despite good rolling by Tau player, Gk had alpha strike which took out a railgun and both piranhas and also had decent rolls. Definetly a shaming

Good screening with the kroots, and superb target prioritization. Even if the Tau player rolled decent, I doubt GK would of gotten any more than a draw. The match was just too one-sided. And I love the block attempt with the fish Now if the mission was capture and control, Tau might have some serious problems. But then again its a old and tier3 codex.

Thank you for understanding the strategy behind my army. If it were capture and control, it could have been more difficult. Then the vehicles would have been important to keep alive, but the Grey Knights still would have needed to throw everything behind their attack. I could not kill the ven-dreads in cover for my life! I spent 2 turns firing all the railguns at them and they stayed up. In capture and control, they would be a difficult obstacle to get through to contest the objective.

I'll write up some commentary for the analysis.

Actually for capture and control, that GK list has much more advantages against Tau. Instead of rushing in to assault Tau's gunline, all he needs to do is reach within 24" range to focus fire his psycannons at your firewarriors and kroots. At leadership 7, your troops will fled off the objectives sooner or later. After taking out most of Tau vehicles, the psyfledreads can ignore the suits and also shoot at the firewarriors/kroots. Not to mention Tau pulse rifles rapid fire at only 15", your list lack fire power to take out MEQ at 24"+. In the end it doesnt matter if GK lost all their purifiers, rhinos, and even dreads, as long as they have a squad holding their objective and Tau has none...

SonsofVulkan wrote:Actually for capture and control, that GK list has much more advantages against Tau. Instead of rushing in to assault Tau's gunline, all he needs to do is reach within 24" range to focus fire his psycannons at your firewarriors and kroots. At leadership 7, your troops will fled off the objectives sooner or later. After taking out most of Tau vehicles, the psyfledreads can ignore the suits and also shoot at the firewarriors/kroots. Not to mention Tau pulse rifles rapid fire at only 15", your list lack fire power to take out MEQ at 24"+. In the end it doesnt matter if GK lost all their purifiers, rhinos, and even dreads, as long as they have a squad holding their objective and Tau has none...

I totally agree, but I have yet to face a player who realizes he can sit and shoot Tau at midrange. Sorry, but just a couple corrections, the troops have ld 8, and all rapid fire is at 12", even pulse rifles.

Backfire wrote:By the way...Pokemon cards? There goes the street cred!

It should be understood that the store has a large bin of discarded pokemon cards lying around - it makes for a convenient "I need a template/marker" bin.

Very interesting report - I saw the game going on behind me, but I didn't pay attention to WHAT was going on. Well-played, Gus!

I was a bit concerned on the behalf of the Tau when I saw the deployment - splitting deployment like that can often be risky, particularly if there is anything LoS-blocking in the middle of the board. The result can sometimes be the effective neutralization of half the army for a turn or two, if your opponent can advance on one corner w/o engaging the second.

jy2, you have a bad habit of splitting your forces up when coming around an obstacle in the middle of the board.

From experience, I have & always will make the Pathfinders as my target priority #1. The markerlight effects are detrimental to the Tau army, especially the reduce-cover svs effect. Look at what they have done to your Rhinos..their smoke launchers were as of nothing..

Your Vindicare didn't do much. I must admit that I myself am not fond of this particular assassin.

I've always tried to include a distraction unit that'll operate behind enemy line. For my Orks I have Snikrot, BA with D-Pod Furiosos, BT with D-Pod Ven Dread. For GK, they have units such as Callidus Assassin that can appear anywhere you need her, or infiltrating Evessor Assassin to make a 1st-turn assault. These 2 assassins are much overlooked even by GK players, but I've found out 1st-hand that they are very effective if given the right target(s).

Even Modrak can be useful deepstriking with Termies with incinerator/psycannon. Anything that can hurt/distract your enemy while your Rhino-wave is racing forward & your Dreads giving covering fire would be very useful.

The other day, a friend of mine was using a cheap Xenos Inquisitor with Conversion Beamer joining a Techmarine sniping with OSR from a 3+ cover/ruin. What a pain in @$$ this tag-team was to his Blob-IG opponent. Against a gun-line Tau, maybe it'll work too.

Still, if you want to stick with your pure-bred Purifier list, good luck buddy!!

Wow, way to go tau! I figured with first turn, it'd be good night nurse, but Gus pulled it out! He is a great guy and a very good general.

Awesome report at always, jy2. We need to get a rematch in soon.

Yeah dropping the assassin for maybe a squad of intercepters would be good too.

Yeah forgot about the Shas'ui.

@jy2
Nice report.

Ai ya, Grey Knights got scorched. I am interested in seeing the rematch to see if this can be repeated or it was just a fluke. Seems Broadsides are well poised to shoot up many small unit rhino spam. Even with ranged AP2 its difficult to kill broadsides because of shield drones. Maybe I should take out my Tau for some games.

POST-GAME ANALYSIS:

Grey Knights: (by me, Jim, aka jy2)
Originally, I was planning on taking out vehicles. Now several have wondered why would I do that? Vehicles aren't really too much of a threat compared to his suits and broadsides, and we weren't playing a mission-based objective where having mobility is of paramount importance. There are 2 main reasons really. Firstly, they would be troublesome by blocking my knights. That could potentially waste me 1-2 turns down the road in trying to take them out, and against Tau, that is a luxury I couldn't afford. Secondly, they were easy kill points. My dreads excel at taking out these vehicles, even with cover. What they have a harder time doing, however, is taking out infantry with 3+ armor or in cover. It was simply a matter of "let the dreads do what they do best".

When Gus split up his forces, I saw a golden opportunity. Instead of fighting his whole army, I could go up against only half of it. While going after 1 flank wouldn't have totally prevented his other flank from engaging in the offense, what I was hoping it would do was to negate his pathfinders and a portion of his offense (his rapid-fire troops and plasmas from fireknives). If I was able to avoid them at least for at least a few turns, then I wouldn't have to waste my firepower on them.

Also, after shooting down his vehicles on Turn 1, I then changed my strategy from focus-firing to just trying to force morale. That was why I kept switching targets. Tau leadership is not exactly the best. Force enough LD tests on them and about 1 out of every 3 will break. I would kill enough guys to force morale and then switch to another target. Unfortunately for me, this plan backfired. It was as if Marneus Calgar himself was leading the Tau. Gus did not fail a single morale test from shooting that counted. The only one he failed actually worked to his benefit, preventing my knights from assaulting and allowing his kroots to live another turn (until I assaulted). In hindsight, this plan failed miserably, though during the game, it was a gamble I was willing to take. However, it wasn't so much my failure to execute as it was my opponent's ungodly morale checks.

What I feel was my biggest mistake, however, was in abandoning my primary plan on Turn 2. Instead of sticking to the plan and going after his left flank, for some strange reason, I decided to split off my army and go after both flanks. By doing so, I basically sealed my fate. Honestly, I don't know why I did that. Perhaps I did it just to see if I could do it, or perhaps I just had too much confidence in my army. Anyways, it is a hard lesson learned.

The next time we play, I'm just going to focus-fire on his units instead of trying to force morale. And I'm going to start off with his pathfinders next time. I was hoping to be avoid them initially...and then I just ignored my plan and moved towards them when I split my forces. Thus, I shot at them Turn 2, but not with all my dreads. I actually spent 2 turns firing at them and still couldn't take them out. Worse yet, I couldn't kill any of his suits until garbage time, even when I focused-fire on them. By that time, the game was already decided.

As for my vindicare, I infiltrated him near the center (in terrain) because that was the only place where I felt he would be able to get to both broadsides and still have cover. Gus deployed his broadsides near the 2 opposite corners. If I infiltrated into any other terrain, despite my 36" range, I'm not sure I could've actually got to his broadsides. Honestly, I didn't care if my vindicare died. I was actually using him as a distraction to hopefully absorb some of his AT. If his death meant that my rhinos could get closer, then it was a good death. I knew that he was in single-shot range of Tau rapid-fire guns, but I felt he had a decent change of surviving if only my opponent's troops didn't shoot like marines (instead of like the BS3 units that they were).

Overall, Gus played like a pro and really knew his army well. He beat a very competitive army (and codex) and he didn't even have to bring an anti-MEQ Tau build (with a lot of fireknives) to do so. I, on the other hand, took a gamble that didn't pay off and made a couple of mistakes. Combined with his rolling and the end result was a very decisive Tau victory. I think it's very clear that Tau can still compete.



Tau: (by Gus)
Upon seeing this Grey Knight army, I figured it would not be so different from any other rhino rush. From a Tau player's point of view, it doesn't matter how good a unit is in close combat, they still win against Tau. Grey Knights are excellent in close combat, which only ups their cost without increasing survivability. This creates an instant weakness against Tau. What I did fear was Dreadnoughts and Vindicare. Usually my suits and broadsides are safe with the help of drones and wound allocation, but not against the Vindicare. His dual-wound shot really scared me at first, because I was taking live or die, 4+ cover saves on my broadsides. The venerable dreads and even regular dreads would be a pain as well, but only because of their immense rate of fire. The ability to instant kill suits can be scary, but I've still got my 3+ or 2+ armor saves.

The strategy behind my army remained the same. Screen with kroot, piranhas, and drones (though I decided to save the drones, because of the kill point mission). Meanwhile, firewarriors provide anti-infantry at targets of opportunity, rail-guns to enemy vehicles, and the markerlights/battlesuits hit the primary targets (in this case, rhinos and purifiers).

the Knights deployed centrally, so I decided to try out a dual firebase formation. One firebase had better defensive terrain, so I kept the pathfinders, command team, and hammerhead on that side (where they would be safe from some of the dreads).

So far, exactly as planned.

What surprised me was:

The vindicare exposing himself by deploying in the middle of the board. He had line of fire to every model in my army practically, which was only worse for him. My firewarriors, who had no target until the rhinos were popped, now had a great shot at knocking down the assassin.

The dreadnoughts knocked out all my fighting vehicles. This was not too bad a decision, as it was utterly successful, but I had no need for piranhas this game. The loss of my hammerhead was disappointing, but it is the first model I drop when going down to 1850 pts. It is really in the army to be a pie-plater and fire magnet.

The rhinos were either going to rush one flank, the weaker one, or split to envelope both. He initially chose the weaker one, but then switched to split up. This lost him only a turn of movement, but it gave me some time to breath. I was going to evacuate the weak flank (that side had an operable devilfish, so only the kroot and perhaps broadsides would get caught). Instead, I trusted that both flanks could hold their own, and was successful.

The last surprise was how difficult dreadnoughts are to kill when in cover. I managed to kill 1 dread and immobilize another in the early game, but the railguns failed continually after that. I did not use railguns to pop rhinos, that was a job for the Deathrains. However, the dreadnoughts did not kill any of my key firepower units until it was too late.

What went according to plan:

Kill-points and pitched-battle. These conditions made it easier for my army. I already knew I had a good chance of killing rhinos and 5-6 man squads, so when the mission was exactly that, things got easier. An objectives based game would have been a challenge.

During the mid-game, I stopped the rhinos a couple each turn, and then turned to focus-fire on the nearest squads. When the second wave finally got too close, the kroot blocked them out. I rely on the Kroot to stop assault troops from reaching my firebase for a single round of combat, where I can then pummel the enemy with a good 'ole rapid fire or step back for some space.

I lost 4 kill points, which were all 4 screen units. Despite not taking a charge for the greater good, the piranhas absorbed a round of fire, and were not necessary in this particular game.

Ending thoughts: I felt good going into this battle, and am very happy with my army's performance and my strategy. I had a great time playing this battle, and hope to have a rematch sometime soon. (even if its against nids!) Thanks for reading!

-Gus

Good btrp jy2. Sorry to hear you lost. Solid game play on the Tau players part.

Dividing your forces wasn't a great idea. Tau have enough range and firepower to focus and neutralize any smaller force without having to worry much about movement. IMO, Terminators or your foot-slogging GK Strike squads with Psybolt Ammunition would have stand a better chance (just in like in our game). Tau works surprisingly well against small MSU style armies that don't pack a lot of AP3 or less. Also, Annihilation is one of the best missions for Tau in a mech vs mech match up.

Better luck next time!

I think the thing you missed here is early pressure.

One or two squads of jumpgreyknight, using their teleport and shooting the hell out of a unit, would focus his attention elsewhere, yes they would die but it would give your rhino's the crucial turn it needs to get to the other side and whoop their asses.

I would start considering a callidus assassin as well, she could have turned the battle here. Again diversion, so that your purifiers can advance.

Wow. Great performance by the Tau and Gus; really well played man.
And just when I thought I was beginning to vote for the winning team semi-regularly...

Great battle rep as always. We should get a game in sometime. I want to get a couple practice games in against a good Grey knight list. Not many out here haha.

Like the post game analysis! like to see whats goin on in the players heads

This is one of the few battle reports in which I was actually disappointed with your performance, and this would include your game against that fearsome nid army. I read the post game analysis and see that you noted all of your mistakes. Meaning the splitting of your forces and the odd sense of target prioritization. I would definitely say that if you hadn't deviated from your plan you could have done some serious hurt. Even with the first turn loss. I think the vindicare needs to go, he's just a bit of fat in a rather tight list. I always root for you man.

No disrespect to a competent Tau player. Hot dice will always turn a battle in your favor. Stat lines become irrelevant.

Good game to all, and Jy2 you still have the best battle reports on this site. Hands down.

Backfire wrote:
I think that overall, your army was just too slow for this kind of match and match-up. You have no fast vehicles, no jump infantry, not even anything which can deep strike. Maybe replace Strike squad or one Purifier squad with Interceptors??

Yeah, that is a major weakness of this army....lack of speed. I may well add interceptors and will definitely do so at 2500 (for 'Ard Boyz). I've also been considering adding a stormraven or teleporting dreadknight, but they're expensive and stick out like a sore thumb.

carbonpillow wrote:
What you should've done was take out the markerlights at the earliest opportunity, then you might've had a chance to get your GKs into assault. Otherwise, great report.

Yeah, I'll do that next time. By going after 1 flank, I was hoping I could avoid them after the first turn. But then I did a 180 and went after them. Next time I'll definitely make them a priority.

Gus Indo wrote:
The amount of luck in this game was INSANE. I made all the morale checks that counted, and failed the ones I needed to. Also, markerlights surviving to the end was amazing, even having a single marker hit was devastating to his rhinos. On the other hand, the first shot from a ven-dred (I'm pretty sure against the Hammerhead) caused 4 glances and 3 got through cover. jy2 made his marine saves like a champ! I'm pretty sure at some point I rapid fired 12 firewarriors at BS5, and he still had a marine or two left in the squad. However, because jy2 had severely reduced his shooting, I was rolling all the dice, and they rolled hot! And contrary to popular belief, the railguns killed crowe and a dread. All the rhino and anti-infantry work was done by the Deathrains with TL missile pods. I'll talk about his initial plan in my analysis post.

Your deathrains were amazing this game. They did a lot better than I thought. Every turn they took out at least 1 or 2 rhinos. If anything, I'd say they were probably the MVP's in this game (at least for your army).

the weird one wrote:No need to disembark for knights at all - small Purifier units with 2 Psycannons use Rhinos' hatches perfectly. Still, as with many MSU transport units Tau are harsh opponent - especially for leafblower and such. They pack a lot of mobile S7 shots. They've got Railguns for either tougher targets or just to get job done should they need it. They've got one of arguably best supporting units in game in form of Pathfinders. And Kroot are actually cheap! Cleansing Flame is nuts versus them, but apart from this, with 3+ forest cover, usually few armies have means to deal with large kroot units. They can still smoke most mech builds in game, especially those basing on side AV10 or AV11 as front armour.
[EDIT]And flamers are just too cheap not to take instead of plasma, especially considering BS3.[/EDIT]

And GK have additional difficulty: for all their Force Weapon nastyness, special Rules, powerful close-combat psipowers and such they gain no survivability for increased cost. And they rarely can withstand a bullet trade with Tau, who are both resilient and shooty...

I polled Tau but was a bit afraid of my controvential opinion. I don't even play Tau and yet find them more than capable. I think that one of best tools versus Tau that GK posess is Shrouding and Terminators. And in case of shooting, Psybolt ammo.

Still it was somewhat strange to see all those high calibre autocannon shells bouncing off suits.

Tau are a very synergistic army. Each and every unit needs to work in harmony with every other unit. If they can do that well, then they are a tough nut to crack.

The only real advantage GK has....is that they can actually outshoot Tau. Unfortunately, most MEQ players have been programmed to rush Tau as the best way to beat them. Perhaps in the future, I will try another strategy against them.

And it was also strange to see all those mini-rockets blow through my vehicles like a hot knife through butter.

Zid wrote:Ouch... mistakes definitely make a difference in games like this! Rhinos just aren't quick enough; thus why I love my stormravens T2 assaulting suits is just mean! Great rep as always JY

I'm slowly beginning to warm up to stormravens. With a GK librarian in there, they're getting 3+ shrouded flat-out cover. Now to design a list that complements them well....

Backfire wrote:By the way...Pokemon cards? There goes the street cred!

Weren't mine. They were just freebie leftovers at our LGS, and since we didn't have any craters with us....

Now can I have back my street cred?....

SonsofVulkan wrote:Like I said in my first post, GK lack low ap weaponry to deal with this many suits(epecially broadsides). Despite good rolling by Tau player, Gk had alpha strike which took out a railgun and both piranhas and also had decent rolls. Definetly a shaming

Good screening with the kroots, and superb target prioritization. Even if the Tau player rolled decent, I doubt GK would of gotten any more than a draw. The match was just too one-sided. And I love the block attempt with the fish Now if the mission was capture and control, Tau might have some serious problems. But then again its a old and tier3 codex.

The lack of low-AP weaponry is an inherent weakness of any non-Coteaz-henchmen GK build. Then again, Space Wolf long fang-spam also has that weakness but they still do well. While it is a weakness, it isn't game-breaking at all. Last game I faced 20 paladins with this same list and I was still able to do well against them.

No, what it boils down to is generalship (and the dice). Basically, Gus played well this game and I didn't. But you're right if this was an objectives-based mission.

Gus Indo wrote:while I don't deny the incredible luck, I feel my strategy and target priority really won me the game. Also, I find opponents have trouble the first time against my Tau because it is a very different army than most.

Thank you for understanding the strategy behind my army. If it were capture and control, it could have been more difficult. Then the vehicles would have been important to keep alive, but the Grey Knights still would have needed to throw everything behind their attack. I could not kill the ven-dreads in cover for my life! I spent 2 turns firing all the railguns at them and they stayed up. In capture and control, they would be a difficult obstacle to get through to contest the objective.

I'll write up some commentary for the analysis.

Thanks for the write-up. It's refreshing to have my opponent contribute his thoughts to the battle.

Next time you face my GK army, I might switch things up a little. Ever faced 6 psyfleman dreads? I guarantee it's going to hurt.

Janthkin wrote:
I was a bit concerned on the behalf of the Tau when I saw the deployment - splitting deployment like that can often be risky, particularly if there is anything LoS-blocking in the middle of the board. The result can sometimes be the effective neutralization of half the army for a turn or two, if your opponent can advance on one corner w/o engaging the second.

jy2, you have a bad habit of splitting your forces up when coming around an obstacle in the middle of the board.

I saw a golden opportunity there when he split his forces...but then failed to capitalize on it.

Yeah, yeah....I know. My mistakes will be immortalized forever from these reports, but that's fine as long as others can learn from it.

MarshallDin wrote:
Your Vindicare didn't do much. I must admit that I myself am not fond of this particular assassin.

I've always tried to include a distraction unit that'll operate behind enemy line. For my Orks I have Snikrot, BA with D-Pod Furiosos, BT with D-Pod Ven Dread. For GK, they have units such as Callidus Assassin that can appear anywhere you need her, or infiltrating Evessor Assassin to make a 1st-turn assault. These 2 assassins are much overlooked even by GK players, but I've found out 1st-hand that they are very effective if given the right target(s).

Each assassin has its use, but out of all of them, I believe that the vindicare has the greatest utility in an all-comer's list as well as fill a niche for heavy-armor busting. But that's not really fair considering I haven't tried out the other "new" assassins yet. I'll give them a workout in future games.

Even Modrak can be useful deepstriking with Termies with incinerator/psycannon. Anything that can hurt/distract your enemy while your Rhino-wave is racing forward & your Dreads giving covering fire would be very useful.

The other day, a friend of mine was using a cheap Xenos Inquisitor with Conversion Beamer joining a Techmarine sniping with OSR from a 3+ cover/ruin. What a pain in @$$ this tag-team was to his Blob-IG opponent. Against a gun-line Tau, maybe it'll work too.

Still, if you want to stick with your pure-bred Purifier list, good luck buddy!!

Actually, I like Mordrack and his Ghost Knights....but only in the right list. You kind of have to build a list around him. Just using that 400pt+ unit as a "distraction" is not a very efficient use for them unless they have backup.

I'm actually considering replacing the vindicare for a conversion beamer techmarine. I like the fact that he can boost terrain for a 3+ cover, but I wouldn't attache him to anything other than a troop choice for hunkering down on an objective. While the dual-beamer tag team seems cool, unfortunately it won't be a scoring unit.

Reecius wrote:Wow, way to go tau! I figured with first turn, it'd be good night nurse, but Gus pulled it out! He is a great guy and a very good general.

Awesome report at always, jy2. We need to get a rematch in soon.

How about next week if you're not busy?

SonsofVulkan wrote:Yeah dropping the assassin for maybe a squad of intercepters would be good too.

Yeah forgot about the Shas'ui.

That's something I could consider, though there's a conundrum there that needs to be answered. Do I need mobility more or the ability to take out land raiders and leman russes?

Avariel wrote:@jy2
Nice report.

Ai ya, Grey Knights got scorched. I am interested in seeing the rematch to see if this can be repeated or it was just a fluke. Seems Broadsides are well poised to shoot up many small unit rhino spam. Even with ranged AP2 its difficult to kill broadsides because of shield drones. Maybe I should take out my Tau for some games.

Ai ya is right. It won't happen again, I guarantee it. Burn me once, shame on you. Burn me twice, shame on me.

And my tactic against the broadsides is the same as my tactics against exorcists which is also the same as my tactics against long fangs....I just ignore them, at least initially. Hey, I did it against SabrX and Reecius.

Well, even when I was a newbie tau player 4 years ago, I knew that nomatter who is using them, a rhino is useless against tau, except for the fact that once it's dead you can use it as cover. You should have used landraiders (if the GKs can take them) or a stormraven. Deepstriking or infiltrating on tau works excellently, as genestealers and the like have put the hurt on me several times using this tactic. overall, once I saw those rhinos, I knew who would win.

BTW, great job on the tau paintjobs, and I envy whoever this 'gus' is

For the Greater Good! Peace Out!
+ =

killykavekommando wrote:Well, even when I was a newbie tau player 4 years ago, I knew that nomatter who is using them, a rhino is useless against tau, except for the fact that once it's dead you can use it as cover. You should have used landraiders (if the GKs can take them) or a stormraven. Deepstriking or infiltrating on tau works excellently, as genestealers and the like have put the hurt on me several times using this tactic. overall, once I saw those rhinos, I knew who would win.

BTW, great job on the tau paintjobs, and I envy whoever this 'gus' is

For the Greater Good! Peace Out!
+ =

The 'Gus' would be me. Thanks for the compliment! I also have the most problems with Genestealers and infiltrators as well, it's hard to deal with them as Tau when you need to move out to take objectives or handle the rest of the army. I really need to practice against nids.

Great report, jy2! Keep them coming.

I have a thread on fighting nids, you might want to check it out, even though now it's practically dead, Gus. May have some useful info.

Great battle report, though. I want you two to do a rematch, just to see how the new result is after the feedback has been heard.